This seems to have been popular 😂 I get that it's annoying, but if people are going to make YT videos long term, they do need to be paid for it. It is a shame that so many videos start the same way though, and a shame that there isn't more diversity in who is offering sponsorship.
I get it, but from a youtuber's perspective, I can assure you that nobody WANTS to put a sponsored ad break in the middle of their video you've carefully crafted to tell a specific story. If you knew how little money we make especially since youtube revamped the monetization system to push shorts vs how much it costs to make even simple content like this video (A7s3 ($3500), Sigma Art lens ($1000?) , quality mic ($?), studio lights ($?) artlist subscription ($150), computer, monitor, data storage, etc. It's impossible to make ends meet...ESPECIALLY if you aren't willing to follow the monkey brain hacking trends the algorithm requires to get views.
As soon as I see a video start with “sponsored by Squarespace” I immediately click off it and refuse to watch their content. Content creators will learn the hard way.
As a graphic and web designer I get irritated by the Squarespace ads, because 1.) It is an AWFUL platform 2.) All of their sites look the same 3.) WordPress is eon's better 4.) Squarspace devalues the market for designers with actual talent 5.) It's a proprietary platform and if you ever want to leave you can't port your data to any other platform 6.) Their market share is miniscule. WordPress is literally 63% of the internet. It's why I won't watch Jared Polin. It literally disgusts me.
I have a separate full-time job, so TH-cam, for me, is a way to express myself creatively. It can be frustrating not getting the views, etc, but I'd rather not fall down the clickbait trap with 'news headline' titles and thumbnails or top tip videos. Consequently, my channel has remained small, but I'd much rather upload videos that I am personally happy with than be constantly chasing views and subscribers.
That's a great way to be. Overall, I'm happy with the stuff I've put out as late but the one video that was made 'because I needed to get a video out' and wasn't exactly what I wanted to do ended up being the one that did the best!! Still, it wasn't done just to get views, I still stand by the message and if it helps people I can't ask for more than that. It's definitely a tricky balance to maintain though.
Well said. I actually prefer watching content made by photographers who show a passion for their work and are not pushing for subscribers and trying to follow trends.
Interestingly, at the end of your video, it suggested 2 videos with the type of click-bait thumbnails that you talk about. I stopped watching TH-cam Photography videos because I found most were all the same content again and again. It's a great place for a beginner, and I guess this is why these videos prove popular. But there isn't alot out there for people who understand camera settings, understand editing, are happy with their camera and lenses, and are just looking for inspiration or want to see what their favourite photographers are up to. Not every video has to be a tutorial
I’m retiring as a photographer after forty years. I’m thinking of using TH-cam to put something back into an environment that’s given me such a fantastic life. So I’m not trying to monetise, and I’m not going to copy either, just help people who want to see how other photographers work and maybe move ahead, either as an enthusiast or a pro. So this is quite interesting. Thanks! Very sensible stuff well delivered. Subscribed.
Those of us who were pre TH-cam were more reliant on a magazines and they went the same way in that every 12 months or so they would repeat a topic - the difference being of course that they would hit a new audience whereas TH-cam videos stick around. Photography is mainly sole traders who are talking from their own experiences rather than a formal education in the subject and when they start to run out of things to say they then repeat what they have heard from others rather than experienced themselves and immediately the content is diluted . The more successful are the ones who visit new countries and who suddenly have new stories to tell but not everyone can do that and inevitably their more interesting content starts to run out and they need to reinvent themselves
I started digital photography 16 years ago and magazines were the main source of information for many years in my digital photography journey. The information from Out Doors photographer and other mags was well written by professional people in the field. The problem with You Tube is that every person that thinks they know photography has a channel, their are many good people on this medium but you also have many that I refer to as The Joe Bidens of you tube. They think that they know everything but much of what they promote is poppycock. I have been blessed to be able to photograph a wide variety of subjects including event photography, and I took the same approach,before I got involved in event I photographed everything of interest at all times of day under different conditions, in photographing events I worked by myself and covered Memorial day events, weddings, baptisms birthdays, retirement parties and family photo shoots. I have put together over 16 years cameras that cover full frame, APSC and micro 4/3 from Panasonic, Pentax, Olympus, Fujifilm, Nikon and one Sony A7 ii. I have 6 full frame cameras, 9 APSC and 4 micro 4/3. I have Native glass from the above plus Sigma, Viltrox, Voightlander and Tokina in zoom and prime lenses. I print much of my work and have sold prints that were both framed and unframed. I had no plans to get involved in event photography but by sharing my work and love of photography people started asking me to photograph events starting with the Memorial day events where I worked. After photographing this event for a few years I knew that I wanted to include event photography as it pushed me in ways that other forms of photography did not. I guess you have to be able to put yourself into position that will allow you to succeed and grow in some thing that you are passionate about.
TH-cam's algorithm screwed my channel after 5 years steady growth. I was getting 5k - 6k views a day until I uploaded a mix that started with a song that had Spanish lyrics. TH-cam then assumed all my viewers where Spanish speaking. As a result my English speaking views fell away to almost nothing, while maintaining viewers from Spain and Latin America. Therein lies a warning about straying from your core content.
It is tiring making one video every week, no wonder it gets repetitive and wearing. When the pandemic began I started to make a weekly video and managed about 18 weeks before it got to be like a chore and one I wasn't being paid for. There were a few bird feeder videos and when It got to "breakfast with my dogs", I gave up. Since then I only put out a video when I feel like it. I think the big boys and girls will benefit from a quality over quantity approach. I really don't need another 5 Ways to drop your Camera, or 7 Things to put on Bread (apart from Butter.)
As a subscriber to several photography channels, about a year ago I felt that I was reaching some sort of saturation: I knew alot and had practiced and developed alot. It then became a question of: what next? And to what extent am I getting something out of some channels. Of course, everyone's trajectory and journey are not the same so I suppose some reached this state before me and others may be new to photography in which case there is a wealth of material to dip into. But to be sure, I think something happened during 2023-ish for both content creators and viewers. And this then started to be talked about during 2024.
This video really hit the nail on the head!!! I thought it was just me and my TH-cam home page but its all the same! You click one video to learn something and the next day you come back on youtube and the algorithm has sent you 50 other videos all the same! After a while of scrolling past it all you just get so fed up you leave the app. It really does need to change. Finding it harder and harder to find stuff thats really interesting and different, but the problem isn't that this content isn't out there its that the app isn't pushing it as hard. But yeah great video! keep up the good work!
Great video. I really agree with you. In addition to this the amount of ads on TH-cam alone is going to push more and more people away from watching videos on this platform. Makes it boarder line unwatchable for me.
I use it enough to pay for premium, so thankfully don’t see this. Everything seems to be shifting towards more ads though, look at what Amazon prime did recently.
Very well put, Rick. Also, I’m so pleased you didn’t end the video by covering up the lens with your hand or throwing up a peace sign and saying “peace”.
Creators have evolved. New camera comes out First vid: praise it before it releases Second vid: criticise it Third vid “why I was wrong about it. Fourth vid “I’m buying it” Fifth vid “why I’m selling it” Repeat
Photographer here, Ive gravitated to TH-cam for more of a Vlog approach to work on story telling, of gear used, how I got the shot, how I plan the shots etc. Love meeting new like minded people in the lifestyle of documenting life as we see it, ( photography, videography). Good outtake on the future of photographers on TH-cam I hope we stand a chance against the overlord.
You hit the nail on the head... to the point that this is the first of your videos that I've ever seen and what you had to say convinced me to subscribe to see more of your content and future storytelling.
Couldn't agree more with this sentiment. Not only as a consumer but as a creator. I've chatted with some friends about the direction of TH-cam and more specifically photography TH-cam and that we are sensing a shift (a new era on the platform). I'm more interested in vulnerable content, with less of the showy transitions and "hype" characters larger creators in the past have played. Not that there's anything wrong with putting on a "show" and coming off excitable and positive it can feel good and engaging. However, I'm finding myself craving a rawness that TH-cam once had in its early years while being just a bit less amateur. People that want to make meaningful content or even find ways of continuing the "clickable" content but while giving it some character at the least. Looking forward to browsing the rest of your videos 💪
This is the first time I've found your channel and you're right. I used to watch as much photography content as possible but slowly I have dropped channel after channel until now there are only six I look forward to. They rarely do gear/how to but instead offer quality involving content. I don't mind relevant sponsors; everyone has to make a living. Looking forward to seeing where you go with this.
I would love to know what those six are! I find that if I watch something that I searched for it’s so much better than whatever the algorithm gives me these days.
I just caught this video this morning, and before I had even got to it's halfway point, I called my wife in to watch too. My wife is a content creator on this platform who creates handmade knitwear, for which I handle the filmography. Interestingly, pretty much everything you have been explaining we have been thinking over the last few months. In short, the same thing must be happening for all types of content creator on TH-cam. Like you, she tries not to be the same as her contemporaries, concentrating on what she feels are more valuable areas of her craft. The result is far fewer visits and likes than other channels, who seem to attract voyeurs and narcisists as the content centres more around creators lifestyle rather than what their channel purports to be, just to get clicks. We guessed a while back that TH-cam shorts were nothing but click bate and refuse to spend time on them. My wife is not monetised, it is a hobby as she works full time, but even so, we'd rather create content that helps others and who find it of interest rather than it being like the Truman show. Thank you for bringing this subject up.
I disagree. Music is sitting right where it should be. It may be that you don't like the music, then it could sound too loud to you. It's about average for videos. Be safe.
No worries mate . It's actually my problem. I've never been good at ignoring distractions . The music was dividing/competing for my attention. But that's my problem. My apologies. It's your channel. Do your thing.
2:57 it doesn’t show us what we want to see, it shows us what it wants to show us… I’ve done specific searches (for ‘bass sax’ for example) & it won’t bring up things I know exist & want to see, almost like they’re hiding it… even loads the page with things that have nothing to do with the search terms, feels broken.
Very instructive! Very inspiring! Someone said that your background music was too loud. NOPE!! It began like most music backgrounds: softly. Then it grew as the video progressed. To have your comments underscored by a very long crescendo added significantly to your message. Bravo! Take note folks: New features in videos are what Mr. Bebbington strongly hints at! Music is a good place to start. Of course, I'm biased (I'm a musician and photographer), but there are so many other parameters to explore! Thank you, Mr. Bebbington!
I've only recently started watching You Tube as I try to reinvigorate my interest in photography. but even with my limited experience with the channel I totally understand and agree with everything that you say.
Thanks Rick, you put into words what I've been feeling for a long time. I'm guilty of having tried to please the algorithm, and (I almost want to say unfortunately) two of my videos got a lot of views that way. The problem is that they are not at all what I enjoy making. I love my photography vlogs and people seem to like them too. But they barely get any impressions. I'm at a point where I want to just treat it as a hobby, as a way to document my photography, even if it's hard to stop caring about the views.
Man, it’s so hard. Especially know when the views are possible. Just keep enjoying it, the feeling of having views but hating it will never match the fulfilment of creating what’s real to you 👍🏻
Great video. I hope the platform wises up. It's taking what it does better than any platform and replacing it with a bad copycat of what other platforms are doing. It doesn't make sense and it only hurts their product long term.
When I look at the ideos that YT recommends to me; the ones I watch predominantly come from the high-quality channels that I actually subscribe to. These are the folks who understand the concepts of good story telling, with a bit of entertainment and education; and a little snippet or two of their own unique personality, wit and wisdom. The massive mistake that YT is making in its malgorithm is to recommend "shorts" that don't relate to the subjects or the channels that I subscribe to. The vast majority of the shorts that YT shows me are from channels that I have already disliked or on subjects that I have already disliked or multiple copies of similar videos. For me, the overwhelming impression of YT shorts is that they are mainly junk. It isn't currently worth my time trawling through the shorts feed to find the 1-in-a-1000 shorts video that is worth a watch. The full-size screen videos are very different though. The creator has generally made a lot of effort to create a video that is high quality; and works well on a big screen. I don't mind an advert or two (as the creator needs to make their channel pay it way). If photography creators continue to create interesting high-quality content I will still like and subscribe and interact with them. You are right that if video creators lose their original focus and become little more than a channel that is always chasing the algorithm; it won't do them or us or YT any good in the end.
Thank you, Rick, for your clear explanation of what is going on of late. I have enjoyed your work, particularly your collaborations with Nigel and other photographers. As someone who started photography back in the days of film, I don't need a lot of help on choosing a camera or such. I'm pretty set in my ways. I got into looking at various creators during the pandemic and have stuck around to watch them. Do I subscribe to folks that tell me how to change a spark plug? No, but I'm glad they're available on this platform should I have a question. I never cease to be amazed at all the stuff that is available even though I watch almost none of it.
The videos that have taken off for me were the ones where I focused on "how valuable will this be for the intended audience?" vs "how many views will this get?". Also, some of the most well received videos aren't always story driven - theres a time and place for all video formats depending on the audience.
Trouble is if YT is someones main source of income then they are going to chase the algorithm, in fact they have to. So our feeds a full of short attention span sub 10 minute videos you also only have to look at how much YT is pushing shorts. I've never watched a short and have absolutely no interest but YT continues to push them in my feed. I am glad I got out the Landscape vlogging game many years ago, back in 2017 my channel started to grow and I felt the pressure to make a video every week and I did for a while but I quickly realised it wasn't for me.
Fair play for getting out, it’s hard!! I’ve seen quite a few longer videos pushed to me of late… I guess if they’re engaging they keep viewers on the platform?
As long we don't do a 7 top tips video I'm happy. Finding the balance between doing what you love and reaching the widest audience you can is key. Pleasing the algorithm has been the norm since Google first took over the interwebs. Change is essential though as creators should evolve and mix things up. I am however looking forward to the emergence of a new platform.
Thanks Gavin. Nail on the head, it's about the balance. It's a tough one though as it's all too easy to go either way. I look forward to seeing how you embrace the change 👍🏻
I’m not sure what company has the resources to process, store, and distribute video to billions of people and still turn a profit other than the big boys. The new player will have to do something pretty radical.
Rick, As a creator just getting started, your words resonated with me loud and clear. I, too, aspire to delve into a more story-based platform where I can showcase not only my photography but also the wealth of life experiences that serve as the creative foundation for my content. I believe that by sharing my unique perspective in an enjoyable, informative, and valuable manner, I can connect with viewers on a deeper level. However, like you, I have concerns about the impact of TH-cam and Instagram algorithms on content quality. If these algorithms continue to prioritize quantity over quality, it may be challenging to fully realize the potential of my creative vision. Thank you for speaking out on this issue. Your message has inspired me to continue pushing for a more authentic and meaningful content creation experience. I hope that those in charge of the algorithms will take note and consider the voices of creators like us. Best Art 😊
I agree with you Rick, what I think most people watch TH-cam videos for is the photos, most of us are very experienced photographer's not newbies and know the basic already, it's not hard, it really isn't. What makes me want to quit as a landscape photographer at times is the size of the crowds and TH-cam isn't helping.
Oh god yes. To the point where I’m not sure I’ve much interest in ever going to some places again as I’m terrified of turning up to see a row of tripods. Nothing worse 😂
I've slowed down on watching photography videos for the very reason you said, they're all the same. Creater goes to somewhere I can't go, something amazing happens, and they get a photo. At least that can be somewhat inspiring. Or, they do something kinda ridiculous for clicks that doesn't help me get better or get inspired. You can only watch the same basic video so many times. Then YT offers up 10 more videos just like the last one in my feed. It gets hard to separate the wheat from the chaff and my time is valuable.
It could be argued that every video you watch guides the algorithm. That wouldn’t be true however. I find that I’m forced by those algorithms to watch the same content over and over because I once viewed a few. I would much prefer to be introduced to new content by unfamiliar creators. Discovering new, fresh content is crushed by algorithms!
I have been a TH-cam junkie for nearly five years. In the last six months I find I am spending most of my time on Twitter. Good content should win out in the end. Your video makes a lot of good points.
Thanks for the explanation ... I have been wondering just 'why' there are so many things being 'shoved' in my face of late .. I have to hunt for what I've subscribed to these days ... amongst all the chaff. I hate that the feeds l follow are seemingly endangered these days - quality content is just that .. In photography you reach a break even point .. you've got the basics down and muscle memory for your gear is sorted - I've ceased to follow solely to learn - now it's a shared experience with folks that I'd genuiunely like to share a coffee with (and the odd argument too probably ) apart from explaning the newest version of something or the latest bit of kit, keeping with the same formula for your channel shouldn't be a sin when your only reward is a tick.
All very well said!! Its something I've tried to do a lot with my own Channel since starting - I've fallen into the trap of following what has worked, in an attempt to grow quickly. But for the most part, I'm doing what I want to produce, and be different if possible... Its potentially resulting in smaller / slower growth, but so be it
Well done 👍🏻 I know what you mean, there are topics I could approach that would result in faster growth too but I just don't want to. I perhaps didn't used to, but the first thing I now ask myself is 'do I want to make this video', if the answer isn't a yes, it doesn't get made.
100% agree the "solve all your problems by watching this five minute video" videos are not what will keep people around. A good story about getting to some goal and how it might change your approach to the next one is way more captivating (long winded way of repeating your thesis that good story telling will win out over click-bait)
I like your analysis, but to add my 2-cents, story telling is key. Whether its bringing us on a trip or telling us how to use or do a technique (photography, wood working etc. it doesn't matter). As a part of that story telling is good video technique and audio. I feel a little sorry for those that need to pump out videos each week to make their money, I'd much rather see one once a month that is worth my 20 minutes. Unfortunately, unless a new platform comes into being with a new algorithm, we are stuck with YT. For you, and us, do what you like/love and let the algorithm work it out. PS don't leave the day job...yet.
I've been making photography story telling type videos for 3 years now. My viewer count has started to rise very slightly in the last month but it's been very slow. I do completely agree that there needs to be a change in youtube towards more quality story telling videos. We can only enjoy so many quick tip videos and stuff. I've always wanted to try to stay true to my story telling style but my growth is just too slow so I'm having to implement more tips into my videos. And i do agree that shorts had a major impact on youtube. Thanks for making this video. I enjoyed hearing that I'm not the only one
Thanks Will. I think if we can combine the storytelling with something else for the viewer then that’s the key, whether it be tips, inspiration or something else. Keep going though, one day you’ll be glad you did 👍🏻
Garbage in -garbage out, the algo in a nutshell. It/they simply reflect the deterioration in attention and, IMHO, intellect. The rising falling star Gemini was a beautiful and elegant example of the problem.
I'm only a consumer of photography related content, and I follow several channels. Just found yours, and your words make sense to me, hence I subscribed :)
A great analysis of where the tube is right now Rick. I think you’re right quality hopefully will win over quantity and you’re definitely in the former category, I particularly like story telling along the lines of what Morten Hilmer does and I’m not a birder! But his videos are so worth watching as he films it so well together with a story and he doesn’t produce content weekly 👍. I thought your filming in Luskentyre was exceptional and the quality was there. Good luck building your channel 👍
Thank you!! I agree with you about Morten, but likewise I’m not as interested in the subject matter. I’m just going to keep doing what feels right to me and see where it leads ☺️
You're so right! I'm just a hobby photographer. I noticed what you say. Everyone is coping others and TH-cam suggest to me videos with same content but different creators. It's so boring. It's like watching the same movie but with different characters.
Every problem is an opportunity. In the case of TH-cam I feel there needs to be a story but some stories may be new and some will be retold and creators need to understand the persona of their audience: education, entertainment, travelogue, gear, composition, etc. if it was easy everybody would do it!
I think the stepping back of a few of the big guys is more to do with margin being earned more profitably (work smart, not hard) outside of the weekly grind than it is to do with the algorithm, but I do agree that the production line is currently overwhelmed with cloned output, and that has the perception of being rewarding to newer creators. I discovered your channel today, from this video, in all honesty I would have scrolled straight past the others with the ‘insert generic content’ title you were honest enough to mention. Most photography videos are going to be in some sense ‘informative’ but if all they are is ‘informative’ and about the same topic I only need to see one, and that leads to all those creators fighting for the same slice of the pie. Ultimately that curve will flatten. Great video. Thoughtful observation.
Couldn't agree more with your comments. Certainly noticed changes over the past 6 months how it works. Sometimes do a search for something like 'how to fix x' and before you know it the feed is filled with that content for days.
I agree and I do have hope. If not I'd just give up on making videos. We're a channel similar in size to yours. After reaching burnout more than once, we decided to only make the videos we love making. We're always trying to improve our filming, photography, and editing skills. It's disheartening when we feel like the algorithm can swing at any moment no matter how good a video we post. I will continue to believe that good storytelling, beautiful photography, and footage will eventually win out. I also think small creators may benefit from collaborations - sharing new faces with our smaller audiences.
Thanks, realised I’ve replied to a few of your comments now and appreciate the time you’ve taken to comment 🙏🏻 I’ll be sure to check out your channel. Sounds like we’ve had similar experiences with burning out on making content we don’t love…. Hopefully for the last time given what you say you do now!! I’m the same, I’m much clearer on what I do and do not want to create now and it feels a lot more exciting for it 👍🏻
I've never posted a video to TH-cam. Unless I retire, and am bored out of my mind, I probably won't. I'm thankful for those that post their videos. It seems like a huge grind, and an invasion of your privacy as well. Not that anyone has a private life anymore.
What we need is good tutorials about how to watch TH-cam. This is much more important than another thousand videos about how to be successful on TH-cam. This videos should explain how to bookmark channels you want to see more often, how to tell TH-cam to not recommend a channel you don't want to see, how to search content, how to work around the algorithm and make TH-cam a better place for you.
I don’t know whether you realised it but the music you were listening to before you shot your video was still playing throughout the video and someone must’ve turned it up toward the end! Also, there was an obvious plant in the background although I don’t think anyone noticed as it was out of focus Aargh, now I’m going to be shown nothing but bookshelf videos now
Creators are their own worse enemy. They simply run out of interesting ideas and resort to copy catting others. A few years ago a kid made a video about an old pro Canon video camera he had bought and got a lot of views, I remember watching it, within days the 'big names' had stomped all over him with similar videos about old video cameras that perfectly shows they have run out of steam, the difference is though that they get megga view numbers and make a lot of money and I dare say the kid only made a fraction. Any different angle tech videos are jumped on by the big channels. There are so many people trying to make money from YT that the algorithm will eventually destroy YT. The best bet is have a job, create on YT as a hobby and if your lucky you may make enough to create full time but its extremely unlikely!
Excellent analysis. I hadn’t thought about it this way, but I’ve absolutely blindly fallen into The Cycle as you describe it. As a very small TH-camr, I’ve also seen my click bait videos do really well compared to novel experience content. Talking head here’s what you should do videos do so much better. Anyways, appreciate your thinking on this.
You're right, Rick. I´m getting fed up with of You Tube because, although I´m interested in educational phootograpy videos - among other topics - most of the time I find people just trying to sell me stuff. I have to admit that I have been follish enough to follow some TH-camrs' recommendations and have ended up hughly disappointed.
Hey Rick, watching through this video I got curious and scrolled through your videos since the beginning. To my surprise so many unique perspectives have been captured in your videos and it's funny to see only the typical titles getting views. I totally understand your point of maintaining story telling on this platform. I feel following the algorithm will only take you so far, but if you are indeed a great storyteller, you can create your own space and identity to the extent where algorithms change for you. Happy shooting and I just subsribed. I'm thinking to start my own channel in the near future and will reach out for mentorship as I really align with your thought process. Thanks P.S. That background music ramping with your comments in the end and ramping down as you conclude. 🔥
Thanks Anish. I’m glad my back-catalogue largely reflects my viewpoints now, just trying to do things my own way I guess!! I appreciate your words anyway 🙏🏻 yeah, give me a shout 👍🏻👍🏻
Too many ads are getting to the point where content becomes unusable, IMO. From short single ads viewers could watch or skip to double ads only one of which can be skipped, to ad pairs that cannot be skipped. Too many ads thinly presented as “reviews” (or “sponsorships”) or “paid content” headings. Hucksters and pitchmen galore.
The learning curve on both sides of the camera will vary as tech changes industry and society. Most people will LEARN to self regulate their contribution / creation / viewership. When you no longer enjoy, you'll move on.
Very interesting topic and well thought out video pal ! I think YT are going to loose watch time due to the amount of and long time of adverts before during and after each video It’s almost become like watching ITV at this stage! With regards to content I believe you can have a great story to tell however it’s the newspaper headline that grabs the attention and in the YT world that needs to also be a clickable thumbnail which as you know can be harder than making the actual video :-)
Thanks mate. I’ve got premium so don’t notice the ads, but others have said similar… You’re right. Maybe all this boils down to the fact that I don’t like making thumbnails?!
Another great, thought provoking video. I think you may be doing a disservice to many viewers. I, like many who watch photography channels completely ignore the click bait titles. I do find however that many of the channels who pump out content every week can become a bit stale. Where I used to look forward to a channel, the overriding thought now is, what’s it about this week? Perhaps this is the creators fault as they rely on Squarespace, MPB, etc. for income. The exception to this in my opinion is Henry Turner where his output is as much about the location as it is about photography. This keeps it fresh and has me looking forward to his weekly content. The algorithms also mostly work for me. I have been looking for a filter system over the last week and I suddenly found my TH-cam flooded with filter content. I chose a few to watch and have now made a decision. I may be wrong here but I’m just a guy who loves going out with my camera and wants to pick up a few tips along the way.
Thanks Alan. Perhaps I am - I guess it's hard to consider everybody's unique experience when I only have my own experience together with specific anecdotal evidence. Ignoring the videos you mention is probably the best bet, but it's a shame that the high quality videos may miss out on being seen because so many videos related to what you searched for were shown to you. Once someone searches for something, they often get an answer and that should be the end of it - having the algorithm show them similar videos for the next few weeks I think is part of the issue.
YT has been dying a slow painful death for good reason. There are other platforms out there where people are allowed to speak without being muzzled by the powers that should not be.
I'm personally looking forward to having the time to TH-cam again. I think a lot of people don't realise just how time consuming it is, I would estimate it takes at least a full day's work just to create a 10 minute video. Probably longer when including research or anything else. I'm looking forward to it because there is so much to say on this platform that no one is saying. Photography education here has become very generic and you are totally right about the algorithms but the beneficiary of any platform improvements will be those already doing something different.
Totally agree. The time it takes to make these things is nuts, I know TH-camrs that work 60+ hour weeks! (Not me might I add!). Hope you can get back into it again soon 👍🏻
I think if you are just doing it for fun, then it likely is something you do in your free time. These videos take so long to make (and massively impact your photography if you’re making a video at the same time) so it’s likely that you’ll just give up on yt tying to make videos and concentrate more on the joy of photography.
That's a great reflection of yours. I don't think the algorithm is programmed randomly. Nor do I think it is with a humanistic intention behind it, nor with a concern for improving the content offered on the platform, maybe one day it was like that, at the beginning. Perhaps today it is more a complex tool of mass formation and alienation, to redirect the most unwary and unsuspecting public to corset them in a meaningless world, without purpose, without sophisticated stimuli or aspirations. Or maybe it's just to see how much we all put up with it. Everyone knows who pays them the most for the information they host or reject. Everyone knows that the good guys lost.
There is a lot of truth to your analysis. I switch off several times due to poorly done videos, many use too much time promoting themselves individually and are not showing enough of their work. If you enjoy watching a video and you click on the "like", chances are there will be very similar themes popping up on TH-cam next time. It gets repetative, not to mention boring. A well presented, well documented video that is enjoyable to watch is becoming scarcer. I hope it improves for the better.
Well said, Rick. I applaud people who put themselves out there. There will always be a need for good story telling. But, if I see another "What's in my bag" video come across my feed, I think I'll hurl! There is too much "sameness" among photogs with this type of content. But like I said... a good story will grab me every time.
The problem with "The Algorithm" is it based statistical analysis of viewing habits of users but it doesn't understand the users. It only "knows" what each use has watched but not why, Also, many don't watch videos on all their interests, I don't. Searches have the same problem, what is the context of the search is not always apparent.
I'm a consumer and not a creator. Personally, I would rather wait and view quality over quantity. These days I stop so many videos part way through after I realise its more of the same old stuff.
The algorithm uses what we like and watch to show us more of the same thing, which means its output is fed as its input. That causes what it shows to be more and more narrow. Add to that, that making videos about gear is easy and gets likes. Making videos about photography as an art is more difficult, and fewer people are interested. Videos where people show how they create art are a bit difficult to find. Joe McNally's Pointe Shoe Mysteries is an example, but that is an exception.
Well just saying, you popped up in my feed today…:p Honestly I think what the future currency of TH-cam is going to be is ‘authenticity’…real creators, real stories, real adventures, real set backs and successes. That’s what I see anyway. 😎📸
Same here😂 Unfortunately I see less and less of channels that I follow and more and more of channels that I don’t. I don’t mind seeing new content, but I first and foremost want to see the channels and people I’m interested in. TH-cam is becoming more and more like TikTok or Instagram which are both really shallow mediums that I actually really hate. In the past, TH-cam was a breeze of fresh air compared to those. So, the change in algorithm on TH-cam makes me really worried… 😧
Even Netflix here in Canada has several thumbnails for the same movies. If you passover a movie, generally they will recommend the same movie and you don't recognize the graphic as it's now different. There is definitely going on in Netflix too. But I agree, I am starting to tired of TH-cam trying to shove things my way.
Great video, Rick, and the 1st one of yours I was able to see. I admittedly don't spend much time on this platform for all the reasons you suggest - it rarely seems like the content that is pushed my way is stuff I can get into as an established professional photographer. I want to see more in-depth discussion on more nuanced topics. I don't necessarily care about the latest camera from Sony, although I do enjoy a good gear review when its something I'm looking to buy. I have been publishing my weekly podcast here for over a year with almost zero growth. With views in the 100-200 range each week... it's very long-form content and I admit I don't spend time on the thumbnails and click-bait titles although a tad of that is on the way... but I do think this is a huge problem. If quality content isn't being shown because the thumbnail isn't cringey, that seems to be a huge issue, IMO.
Good video. What I will say, though is that TH-cam is the second biggest search engine in the world and they have to cater to that. It’s not our platform, so I don’t think there’s much we can do about it. They can do as they please with it, but hopefully they will take our feedback on board
I agree with you. I hate TH-cam's algorithm. There's only a few types of videos I watch on a regular basis. Photography is one of them. I use YT for do it yourself projects sometimes. Maybe I need to change a part in my car. I might find the answer in the first video. I don't need YT to start slamming me with the same type video every time I get on here. I spend half my time on here clicking on the 3 dots to hit don't recommend on videos I don't want to see in my feed. If you accidently click on a video you get stuck with that type of video in your feed. If you click on don't recommend it only stops videos from the person who posted it. I wish we could see a list of what YT thinks we want to see and remove things from it.
My favourite button on YT is the 'new to me button' (home page at the top, scroll far right), because you are totally correct in your video, I get swamped with the 'same' videos every time I log in, and yeah, I am a bit sick of them. Its repetitive, its boring, and I am fed up of seeing the same thing offered day in, day out, because I happened to watch one video that caught my interest on a particular day. I LOVE variety, I have a multitude of interests, and I love good storytelling. I hate terrestial tv these days due to the monotonus drive towards reality TV (thats fake and highly edited to cause controversy) and I love the realism of YT content. yet its strangling itself. Totally hope this gets a review sometime soon, or, like terestial TV I will wander off I am sure.
Spot on Rick. I'm a viewer not a creator, but I'm getting bored with all the same old same old from everybody all at the same time.Thanks YT Algorithm. As a human being I have a natural curiosity and am quite capable of earching for what I want/need and don't need anyone (Algorithm based) to tell me what I do/don't want to watch.I appreciate the hard work that content creators put in, but can I be the judge of what I see and when?
Yt can also feed to the wrong viewers. I have a video that shot up to 83k views on release. The retention rate of 27% has ensured it got few views after that. 3 years later and has reached 85 k views!
I started my channel during a shitty time in my existence I needed a distraction anyway TH-cam content creation has become something I enjoy doing on a regular basis I never thought about making money from it but here I am 7 years later earning money I mean fair enough it averages 25 nz dollars a week which isn’t exactly life changing but hey baby steps. Good luck to every creator out there earning a quid any way ya can personally I hate ads on my channel but what other option is there to try to put diesel in the van.
It’s true, if you’re willing to put the time and effort in, why shouldn’t you be entitled to get a little something back? Hope you’re in a batter place now 👍🏻
I’d be delighted to never see a squarespace ad again.
This seems to have been popular 😂
I get that it's annoying, but if people are going to make YT videos long term, they do need to be paid for it. It is a shame that so many videos start the same way though, and a shame that there isn't more diversity in who is offering sponsorship.
Couldn’t agree more, and the videos that just compare shit with other shit, features features feature more more more, enough.
I get it, but from a youtuber's perspective, I can assure you that nobody WANTS to put a sponsored ad break in the middle of their video you've carefully crafted to tell a specific story.
If you knew how little money we make especially since youtube revamped the monetization system to push shorts vs how much it costs to make even simple content like this video (A7s3 ($3500), Sigma Art lens ($1000?) , quality mic ($?), studio lights ($?) artlist subscription ($150), computer, monitor, data storage, etc.
It's impossible to make ends meet...ESPECIALLY if you aren't willing to follow the monkey brain hacking trends the algorithm requires to get views.
As soon as I see a video start with “sponsored by Squarespace” I immediately click off it and refuse to watch their content. Content creators will learn the hard way.
As a graphic and web designer I get irritated by the Squarespace ads, because 1.) It is an AWFUL platform 2.) All of their sites look the same 3.) WordPress is eon's better 4.) Squarspace devalues the market for designers with actual talent 5.) It's a proprietary platform and if you ever want to leave you can't port your data to any other platform 6.) Their market share is miniscule. WordPress is literally 63% of the internet.
It's why I won't watch Jared Polin. It literally disgusts me.
I have a separate full-time job, so TH-cam, for me, is a way to express myself creatively. It can be frustrating not getting the views, etc, but I'd rather not fall down the clickbait trap with 'news headline' titles and thumbnails or top tip videos. Consequently, my channel has remained small, but I'd much rather upload videos that I am personally happy with than be constantly chasing views and subscribers.
That's a great way to be. Overall, I'm happy with the stuff I've put out as late but the one video that was made 'because I needed to get a video out' and wasn't exactly what I wanted to do ended up being the one that did the best!! Still, it wasn't done just to get views, I still stand by the message and if it helps people I can't ask for more than that. It's definitely a tricky balance to maintain though.
I feel the same way, I'm retired, create videos for a hobby, not monotized and hate adds. Just like to share my art and travel stuff.😊
Well said. I actually prefer watching content made by photographers who show a passion for their work and are not pushing for subscribers and trying to follow trends.
Interestingly, at the end of your video, it suggested 2 videos with the type of click-bait thumbnails that you talk about.
I stopped watching TH-cam Photography videos because I found most were all the same content again and again. It's a great place for a beginner, and I guess this is why these videos prove popular. But there isn't alot out there for people who understand camera settings, understand editing, are happy with their camera and lenses, and are just looking for inspiration or want to see what their favourite photographers are up to. Not every video has to be a tutorial
Of course it did 😂 I think that's partly it, and maybe the profiling within niches needs to be improved.
Make whatever you want. Watch whatever you want. Don’t blame TH-cam , the decision is yours. Just don’t rely on TH-cam to put food on your table.
I’m retiring as a photographer after forty years. I’m thinking of using TH-cam to put something back into an environment that’s given me such a fantastic life. So I’m not trying to monetise, and I’m not going to copy either, just help people who want to see how other photographers work and maybe move ahead, either as an enthusiast or a pro. So this is quite interesting. Thanks! Very sensible stuff well delivered. Subscribed.
Those of us who were pre TH-cam were more reliant on a magazines and they went the same way in that every 12 months or so they would repeat a topic - the difference being of course that they would hit a new audience whereas TH-cam videos stick around. Photography is mainly sole traders who are talking from their own experiences rather than a formal education in the subject and when they start to run out of things to say they then repeat what they have heard from others rather than experienced themselves and immediately the content is diluted . The more successful are the ones who visit new countries and who suddenly have new stories to tell but not everyone can do that and inevitably their more interesting content starts to run out and they need to reinvent themselves
I started digital photography 16 years ago and magazines were the main source of information for many years in my digital photography journey. The information from Out Doors photographer and other mags was well written by professional people in the field. The problem with You Tube is that every person that thinks they know photography has a channel, their are many good people on this medium but you also have many that I refer to as The Joe Bidens of you tube. They think that they know everything but much of what they promote is poppycock. I have been blessed to be able to photograph a wide variety of subjects including event photography, and I took the same approach,before I got involved
in event I photographed everything of interest at all times of day under different conditions, in photographing events I worked by myself and covered Memorial day events, weddings, baptisms birthdays, retirement parties and family photo
shoots. I have put together over 16 years cameras that cover full frame, APSC and micro 4/3 from Panasonic, Pentax, Olympus, Fujifilm, Nikon and one Sony A7
ii. I have 6 full frame cameras, 9 APSC and 4 micro 4/3. I have Native glass from the above plus Sigma, Viltrox, Voightlander and Tokina in zoom and prime lenses. I print much of my work and have sold prints that were both framed and unframed. I had no plans to get involved in event photography but by sharing my work and love of photography people started asking me to photograph events starting with the Memorial day events where I worked. After photographing this event for a few years I knew that I wanted to include event photography as it pushed me in ways that other forms of photography did not. I guess you have to be able to put yourself into position that will allow you to succeed and grow in some thing that you are passionate about.
TH-cam's algorithm screwed my channel after 5 years steady growth. I was getting 5k - 6k views a day until I uploaded a mix that started with a song that had Spanish lyrics. TH-cam then assumed all my viewers where Spanish speaking. As a result my English speaking views fell away to almost nothing, while maintaining viewers from Spain and Latin America. Therein lies a warning about straying from your core content.
It is tiring making one video every week, no wonder it gets repetitive and wearing. When the pandemic began I started to make a weekly video and managed about 18 weeks before it got to be like a chore and one I wasn't being paid for. There were a few bird feeder videos and when It got to "breakfast with my dogs", I gave up. Since then I only put out a video when I feel like it. I think the big boys and girls will benefit from a quality over quantity approach. I really don't need another 5 Ways to drop your Camera, or 7 Things to put on Bread (apart from Butter.)
Absolutely, getting one out a week that is semi decent is a full time job. I’m definitely interested in ‘7 things to put on bread’ 😆
I think you should take those last two titles and run with them…😂
As a subscriber to several photography channels, about a year ago I felt that I was reaching some sort of saturation: I knew alot and had practiced and developed alot. It then became a question of: what next? And to what extent am I getting something out of some channels. Of course, everyone's trajectory and journey are not the same so I suppose some reached this state before me and others may be new to photography in which case there is a wealth of material to dip into. But to be sure, I think something happened during 2023-ish for both content creators and viewers. And this then started to be talked about during 2024.
This video really hit the nail on the head!!! I thought it was just me and my TH-cam home page but its all the same! You click one video to learn something and the next day you come back on youtube and the algorithm has sent you 50 other videos all the same! After a while of scrolling past it all you just get so fed up you leave the app. It really does need to change. Finding it harder and harder to find stuff thats really interesting and different, but the problem isn't that this content isn't out there its that the app isn't pushing it as hard. But yeah great video! keep up the good work!
Great video. I really agree with you. In addition to this the amount of ads on TH-cam alone is going to push more and more people away from watching videos on this platform. Makes it boarder line unwatchable for me.
I use it enough to pay for premium, so thankfully don’t see this. Everything seems to be shifting towards more ads though, look at what Amazon prime did recently.
Very well put, Rick. Also, I’m so pleased you didn’t end the video by covering up the lens with your hand or throwing up a peace sign and saying “peace”.
I’ve done that in the past (the former!) 😬 a phase that maybe we all go through 😂
Creators have evolved.
New camera comes out
First vid: praise it before it releases
Second vid: criticise it
Third vid “why I was wrong about it.
Fourth vid “I’m buying it”
Fifth vid “why I’m selling it”
Repeat
So true 😂
Photographer here, Ive gravitated to TH-cam for more of a Vlog approach to work on story telling, of gear used, how I got the shot, how I plan the shots etc. Love meeting new like minded people in the lifestyle of documenting life as we see it, ( photography, videography). Good outtake on the future of photographers on TH-cam I hope we stand a chance against the overlord.
Thanks, and I totally agree. Getting the unique insights of different people should be what it's about 👍🏻
I thirst for new creators with small channels that are authentic.
You hit the nail on the head... to the point that this is the first of your videos that I've ever seen and what you had to say convinced me to subscribe to see more of your content and future storytelling.
Thanks David, that’s the algorithm doing it’s job I guess 🤦🏻♂️😂
Couldn't agree more with this sentiment. Not only as a consumer but as a creator. I've chatted with some friends about the direction of TH-cam and more specifically photography TH-cam and that we are sensing a shift (a new era on the platform). I'm more interested in vulnerable content, with less of the showy transitions and "hype" characters larger creators in the past have played. Not that there's anything wrong with putting on a "show" and coming off excitable and positive it can feel good and engaging. However, I'm finding myself craving a rawness that TH-cam once had in its early years while being just a bit less amateur. People that want to make meaningful content or even find ways of continuing the "clickable" content but while giving it some character at the least. Looking forward to browsing the rest of your videos 💪
Thanks man. I think you’ve described what I’m after too, both as a creator and a consumer. Going to keep this in mind, appreciate it 👍🏻
This is the first time I've found your channel and you're right. I used to watch as much photography content as possible but slowly I have dropped channel after channel until now there are only six I look forward to. They rarely do gear/how to but instead offer quality involving content. I don't mind relevant sponsors; everyone has to make a living. Looking forward to seeing where you go with this.
Thanks Geoff, so am I!!
I would love to know what those six are! I find that if I watch something that I searched for it’s so much better than whatever the algorithm gives me these days.
I just caught this video this morning, and before I had even got to it's halfway point, I called my wife in to watch too. My wife is a content creator on this platform who creates handmade knitwear, for which I handle the filmography. Interestingly, pretty much everything you have been explaining we have been thinking over the last few months. In short, the same thing must be happening for all types of content creator on TH-cam. Like you, she tries not to be the same as her contemporaries, concentrating on what she feels are more valuable areas of her craft. The result is far fewer visits and likes than other channels, who seem to attract voyeurs and narcisists as the content centres more around creators lifestyle rather than what their channel purports to be, just to get clicks. We guessed a while back that TH-cam shorts were nothing but click bate and refuse to spend time on them. My wife is not monetised, it is a hobby as she works full time, but even so, we'd rather create content that helps others and who find it of interest rather than it being like the Truman show. Thank you for bringing this subject up.
Interesting that you've seen similar elsewhere - was worried for a second I was imagining it when scripting the video!
you are right. Shorts irritate
Good subject.
If I may , background music too loud . Very distracting .
I disagree. Music is sitting right where it should be. It may be that you don't like the music, then it could sound too loud to you. It's about average for videos. Be safe.
It is loud, a bit annoying
No worries mate . It's actually my problem. I've never been good at ignoring distractions . The music was dividing/competing for my attention. But that's my problem. My apologies.
It's your channel. Do your thing.
2:57 it doesn’t show us what we want to see, it shows us what it wants to show us… I’ve done specific searches (for ‘bass sax’ for example) & it won’t bring up things I know exist & want to see, almost like they’re hiding it… even loads the page with things that have nothing to do with the search terms, feels broken.
Very instructive! Very inspiring! Someone said that your background music was too loud. NOPE!! It began like most music backgrounds: softly. Then it grew as the video progressed. To have your comments underscored by a very long crescendo added significantly to your message. Bravo! Take note folks: New features in videos are what Mr. Bebbington strongly hints at! Music is a good place to start. Of course, I'm biased (I'm a musician and photographer), but there are so many other parameters to explore! Thank you, Mr. Bebbington!
I thought it was fine too, thanks for backing me up!!
I've only recently started watching You Tube as I try to reinvigorate my interest in photography. but even with my limited experience with the channel I totally understand and agree with everything that you say.
Thanks Rick, you put into words what I've been feeling for a long time. I'm guilty of having tried to please the algorithm, and (I almost want to say unfortunately) two of my videos got a lot of views that way. The problem is that they are not at all what I enjoy making. I love my photography vlogs and people seem to like them too. But they barely get any impressions. I'm at a point where I want to just treat it as a hobby, as a way to document my photography, even if it's hard to stop caring about the views.
Man, it’s so hard. Especially know when the views are possible. Just keep enjoying it, the feeling of having views but hating it will never match the fulfilment of creating what’s real to you 👍🏻
Great video. I hope the platform wises up. It's taking what it does better than any platform and replacing it with a bad copycat of what other platforms are doing. It doesn't make sense and it only hurts their product long term.
Thank you
When I look at the ideos that YT recommends to me; the ones I watch predominantly come from the high-quality channels that I actually subscribe to. These are the folks who understand the concepts of good story telling, with a bit of entertainment and education; and a little snippet or two of their own unique personality, wit and wisdom. The massive mistake that YT is making in its malgorithm is to recommend "shorts" that don't relate to the subjects or the channels that I subscribe to. The vast majority of the shorts that YT shows me are from channels that I have already disliked or on subjects that I have already disliked or multiple copies of similar videos. For me, the overwhelming impression of YT shorts is that they are mainly junk. It isn't currently worth my time trawling through the shorts feed to find the 1-in-a-1000 shorts video that is worth a watch. The full-size screen videos are very different though. The creator has generally made a lot of effort to create a video that is high quality; and works well on a big screen. I don't mind an advert or two (as the creator needs to make their channel pay it way). If photography creators continue to create interesting high-quality content I will still like and subscribe and interact with them. You are right that if video creators lose their original focus and become little more than a channel that is always chasing the algorithm; it won't do them or us or YT any good in the end.
Just do what you really love and it feels right, don't worry about anything else.
I block the shorts every I think 3 months, the moment I see a short pop up I block them again. If I wanted that crap I'd use TikTok.
Thank you, Rick, for your clear explanation of what is going on of late. I have enjoyed your work, particularly your collaborations with Nigel and other photographers. As someone who started photography back in the days of film, I don't need a lot of help on choosing a camera or such. I'm pretty set in my ways. I got into looking at various creators during the pandemic and have stuck around to watch them. Do I subscribe to folks that tell me how to change a spark plug? No, but I'm glad they're available on this platform should I have a question. I never cease to be amazed at all the stuff that is available even though I watch almost none of it.
The videos that have taken off for me were the ones where I focused on "how valuable will this be for the intended audience?" vs "how many views will this get?". Also, some of the most well received videos aren't always story driven - theres a time and place for all video formats depending on the audience.
That's what I'm trying to think about more - I love that Philosophy. Thanks for your insight @MitchLally
Trouble is if YT is someones main source of income then they are going to chase the algorithm, in fact they have to. So our feeds a full of short attention span sub 10 minute videos you also only have to look at how much YT is pushing shorts. I've never watched a short and have absolutely no interest but YT continues to push them in my feed.
I am glad I got out the Landscape vlogging game many years ago, back in 2017 my channel started to grow and I felt the pressure to make a video every week and I did for a while but I quickly realised it wasn't for me.
Fair play for getting out, it’s hard!!
I’ve seen quite a few longer videos pushed to me of late… I guess if they’re engaging they keep viewers on the platform?
As long we don't do a 7 top tips video I'm happy. Finding the balance between doing what you love and reaching the widest audience you can is key. Pleasing the algorithm has been the norm since Google first took over the interwebs. Change is essential though as creators should evolve and mix things up. I am however looking forward to the emergence of a new platform.
Thanks Gavin. Nail on the head, it's about the balance. It's a tough one though as it's all too easy to go either way. I look forward to seeing how you embrace the change 👍🏻
I’m not sure what company has the resources to process, store, and distribute video to billions of people and still turn a profit other than the big boys. The new player will have to do something pretty radical.
Rick,
As a creator just getting started, your words resonated with me loud and clear.
I, too, aspire to delve into a more story-based platform where I can showcase not only my photography but also the wealth of life experiences that serve as the creative foundation for my content. I believe that by sharing my unique perspective in an enjoyable, informative, and valuable manner, I can connect with viewers on a deeper level.
However, like you, I have concerns about the impact of TH-cam and Instagram algorithms on content quality. If these algorithms continue to prioritize quantity over quality, it may be challenging to fully realize the potential of my creative vision.
Thank you for speaking out on this issue. Your message has inspired me to continue pushing for a more authentic and meaningful content creation experience. I hope that those in charge of the algorithms will take note and consider the voices of creators like us.
Best Art 😊
Thanks for your words, I’m glad it’s had a positive impact on you. Good luck with it all!!
I agree with you Rick, what I think most people watch TH-cam videos for is the photos, most of us are very experienced photographer's not newbies and know the basic already, it's not hard, it really isn't. What makes me want to quit as a landscape photographer at times is the size of the crowds and TH-cam isn't helping.
Oh god yes. To the point where I’m not sure I’ve much interest in ever going to some places again as I’m terrified of turning up to see a row of tripods. Nothing worse 😂
@@RickBebbington Since when did are outdoors national treasures turn into f#cking Walt Disney World.
I've slowed down on watching photography videos for the very reason you said, they're all the same. Creater goes to somewhere I can't go, something amazing happens, and they get a photo. At least that can be somewhat inspiring. Or, they do something kinda ridiculous for clicks that doesn't help me get better or get inspired. You can only watch the same basic video so many times. Then YT offers up 10 more videos just like the last one in my feed. It gets hard to separate the wheat from the chaff and my time is valuable.
I want to have input to the algorithm about what I’m in the mood for.
It could be argued that every video you watch guides the algorithm. That wouldn’t be true however. I find that I’m forced by those algorithms to watch the same content over and over because I once viewed a few. I would much prefer to be introduced to new content by unfamiliar creators. Discovering new, fresh content is crushed by algorithms!
Thanks for being a real human being!
Thanks!!
I have been a TH-cam junkie for nearly five years. In the last six months I find I am spending most of my time on Twitter. Good content should win out in the end. Your video makes a lot of good points.
Thanks. I’ve actually left twitter this year as I’ve found it to be a total shitshow 😂
Thanks for the explanation ... I have been wondering just 'why' there are so many things being 'shoved' in my face of late .. I have to hunt for what I've subscribed to these days ... amongst all the chaff.
I hate that the feeds l follow are seemingly endangered these days - quality content is just that .. In photography you reach a break even point .. you've got the basics down and muscle memory for your gear is sorted - I've ceased to follow solely to learn - now it's a shared experience with folks that I'd genuiunely like to share a coffee with (and the odd argument too probably ) apart from explaning the newest version of something or the latest bit of kit, keeping with the same formula for your channel shouldn't be a sin when your only reward is a tick.
All very well said!!
Its something I've tried to do a lot with my own Channel since starting - I've fallen into the trap of following what has worked, in an attempt to grow quickly. But for the most part, I'm doing what I want to produce, and be different if possible... Its potentially resulting in smaller / slower growth, but so be it
Well done 👍🏻 I know what you mean, there are topics I could approach that would result in faster growth too but I just don't want to. I perhaps didn't used to, but the first thing I now ask myself is 'do I want to make this video', if the answer isn't a yes, it doesn't get made.
Really pleased to see how you channel has blown up Rick - congrats!
Thanks Mike!!!
100% agree the "solve all your problems by watching this five minute video" videos are not what will keep people around. A good story about getting to some goal and how it might change your approach to the next one is way more captivating (long winded way of repeating your thesis that good story telling will win out over click-bait)
I like your analysis, but to add my 2-cents, story telling is key. Whether its bringing us on a trip or telling us how to use or do a technique (photography, wood working etc. it doesn't matter). As a part of that story telling is good video technique and audio. I feel a little sorry for those that need to pump out videos each week to make their money, I'd much rather see one once a month that is worth my 20 minutes. Unfortunately, unless a new platform comes into being with a new algorithm, we are stuck with YT. For you, and us, do what you like/love and let the algorithm work it out. PS don't leave the day job...yet.
I've been making photography story telling type videos for 3 years now. My viewer count has started to rise very slightly in the last month but it's been very slow.
I do completely agree that there needs to be a change in youtube towards more quality story telling videos. We can only enjoy so many quick tip videos and stuff. I've always wanted to try to stay true to my story telling style but my growth is just too slow so I'm having to implement more tips into my videos. And i do agree that shorts had a major impact on youtube. Thanks for making this video. I enjoyed hearing that I'm not the only one
Thanks Will. I think if we can combine the storytelling with something else for the viewer then that’s the key, whether it be tips, inspiration or something else. Keep going though, one day you’ll be glad you did 👍🏻
Garbage in -garbage out, the algo in a nutshell. It/they simply reflect the deterioration in attention and, IMHO, intellect. The rising falling star Gemini was a beautiful and elegant example of the problem.
I'm only a consumer of photography related content, and I follow several channels. Just found yours, and your words make sense to me, hence I subscribed :)
Thanks!!
A great analysis of where the tube is right now Rick. I think you’re right quality hopefully will win over quantity and you’re definitely in the former category, I particularly like story telling along the lines of what Morten Hilmer does and I’m not a birder! But his videos are so worth watching as he films it so well together with a story and he doesn’t produce content weekly 👍. I thought your filming in Luskentyre was exceptional and the quality was there. Good luck building your channel 👍
Thank you!! I agree with you about Morten, but likewise I’m not as interested in the subject matter. I’m just going to keep doing what feels right to me and see where it leads ☺️
You're so right! I'm just a hobby photographer. I noticed what you say. Everyone is coping others and TH-cam suggest to me videos with same content but different creators. It's so boring. It's like watching the same movie but with different characters.
Every problem is an opportunity. In the case of TH-cam I feel there needs to be a story but some stories may be new and some will be retold and creators need to understand the persona of their audience: education, entertainment, travelogue, gear, composition, etc. if it was easy everybody would do it!
Outstanding perspective. Hope you are right. More humanity, less algorithm.
I hope so too, thanks
I think the stepping back of a few of the big guys is more to do with margin being earned more profitably (work smart, not hard) outside of the weekly grind than it is to do with the algorithm, but I do agree that the production line is currently overwhelmed with cloned output, and that has the perception of being rewarding to newer creators.
I discovered your channel today, from this video, in all honesty I would have scrolled straight past the others with the ‘insert generic content’ title you were honest enough to mention. Most photography videos are going to be in some sense ‘informative’ but if all they are is ‘informative’ and about the same topic I only need to see one, and that leads to all those creators fighting for the same slice of the pie. Ultimately that curve will flatten.
Great video. Thoughtful observation.
Thanks, appreciate it!
Couldn't agree more with your comments. Certainly noticed changes over the past 6 months how it works. Sometimes do a search for something like 'how to fix x' and before you know it the feed is filled with that content for days.
Annoying isn't it. Especially when the initial search probably provided you with the answer you were after...
The easiest way to revamp the algorithm is to ASK THE PEOPLE, as you said just like Netflix & also Spotify ie. pick 5 videos you like etc etc
I agree and I do have hope. If not I'd just give up on making videos.
We're a channel similar in size to yours. After reaching burnout more than once, we decided to only make the videos we love making. We're always trying to improve our filming, photography, and editing skills. It's disheartening when we feel like the algorithm can swing at any moment no matter how good a video we post.
I will continue to believe that good storytelling, beautiful photography, and footage will eventually win out. I also think small creators may benefit from collaborations - sharing new faces with our smaller audiences.
Thanks, realised I’ve replied to a few of your comments now and appreciate the time you’ve taken to comment 🙏🏻 I’ll be sure to check out your channel. Sounds like we’ve had similar experiences with burning out on making content we don’t love…. Hopefully for the last time given what you say you do now!! I’m the same, I’m much clearer on what I do and do not want to create now and it feels a lot more exciting for it 👍🏻
Very, very insightful. I am just a viewer, not a creator, but I see exactly what you describe. Tnx a million!
Glad it was helpful!
I've never posted a video to TH-cam. Unless I retire, and am bored out of my mind, I probably won't. I'm thankful for those that post their videos. It seems like a huge grind, and an invasion of your privacy as well. Not that anyone has a private life anymore.
What we need is good tutorials about how to watch TH-cam. This is much more important than another thousand videos about how to be successful on TH-cam.
This videos should explain how to bookmark channels you want to see more often, how to tell TH-cam to not recommend a channel you don't want to see, how to search content, how to work around the algorithm and make TH-cam a better place for you.
Good idea!!
I don’t know whether you realised it but the music you were listening to before you shot your video was still playing throughout the video and someone must’ve turned it up toward the end! Also, there was an obvious plant in the background although I don’t think anyone noticed as it was out of focus
Aargh, now I’m going to be shown nothing but bookshelf videos now
😂
Nightmare, didn't notice the plant 😬
Thank you . I have absolutely recognized what you described as a viewer. Thanks for sharing.
You are so welcome, thanks
Creators are their own worse enemy. They simply run out of interesting ideas and resort to copy catting others.
A few years ago a kid made a video about an old pro Canon video camera he had bought and got a lot of views, I remember watching it, within days the 'big names' had stomped all over him with similar videos about old video cameras that perfectly shows they have run out of steam, the difference is though that they get megga view numbers and make a lot of money and I dare say the kid only made a fraction.
Any different angle tech videos are jumped on by the big channels. There are so many people trying to make money from YT that the algorithm will eventually destroy YT.
The best bet is have a job, create on YT as a hobby and if your lucky you may make enough to create full time but its extremely unlikely!
Spot on totally agree.
Excellent analysis. I hadn’t thought about it this way, but I’ve absolutely blindly fallen into The Cycle as you describe it. As a very small TH-camr, I’ve also seen my click bait videos do really well compared to novel experience content. Talking head here’s what you should do videos do so much better. Anyways, appreciate your thinking on this.
Thanks, appreciate it. The irony of this video just being a talking head video is not lost on me…. You’re spot on with that point though.
@@RickBebbingtonit’s meta. Just have to carry on doing what we’re doing. In the words of Good Will Hunting, “at least I’ll be original…”
Well said - I follow people who I provide quality, such as yourself - so much of the feed is so similar, you just need to ignore it and find the best
You're right, Rick. I´m getting fed up with of You Tube because, although I´m interested in educational phootograpy videos - among other topics - most of the time I find people just trying to sell me stuff. I have to admit that I have been follish enough to follow some TH-camrs' recommendations and have ended up hughly disappointed.
Great content will win out. So agree with that my friend!!
Absolutely 🙌🏻
Hey Rick, watching through this video I got curious and scrolled through your videos since the beginning. To my surprise so many unique perspectives have been captured in your videos and it's funny to see only the typical titles getting views. I totally understand your point of maintaining story telling on this platform. I feel following the algorithm will only take you so far, but if you are indeed a great storyteller, you can create your own space and identity to the extent where algorithms change for you. Happy shooting and I just subsribed. I'm thinking to start my own channel in the near future and will reach out for mentorship as I really align with your thought process. Thanks
P.S. That background music ramping with your comments in the end and ramping down as you conclude. 🔥
Thanks Anish. I’m glad my back-catalogue largely reflects my viewpoints now, just trying to do things my own way I guess!! I appreciate your words anyway 🙏🏻 yeah, give me a shout 👍🏻👍🏻
Well said , really enjoyed your Antarctic video as well
People just need to go back to creating what they like, film the things they love and show us what they’re passionate about.
That really, together with offering something for the viewer, whether that be teaching, inspiration or triggering an emotion (hopefully positively!)
Too many ads are getting to the point where content becomes unusable, IMO. From short single ads viewers could watch or skip to double ads only one of which can be skipped, to ad pairs that cannot be skipped. Too many ads thinly presented as “reviews” (or “sponsorships”) or “paid content” headings. Hucksters and pitchmen galore.
The learning curve on both sides of the camera will vary as tech changes industry and society. Most people will LEARN to self regulate their contribution / creation / viewership. When you no longer enjoy, you'll move on.
Perfect explanation thank you
Im look forward to seeing this change.
Very interesting topic and well thought out video pal !
I think YT are going to loose watch time due to the amount of and long time of adverts before during and after each video
It’s almost become like watching ITV at this stage!
With regards to content I believe you can have a great story to tell however it’s the newspaper headline that grabs the attention and in the YT world that needs to also be a clickable thumbnail which as you know can be harder than making the actual video :-)
Thanks mate. I’ve got premium so don’t notice the ads, but others have said similar…
You’re right. Maybe all this boils down to the fact that I don’t like making thumbnails?!
Another great, thought provoking video. I think you may be doing a disservice to many viewers. I, like many who watch photography channels completely ignore the click bait titles. I do find however that many of the channels who pump out content every week can become a bit stale. Where I used to look forward to a channel, the overriding thought now is, what’s it about this week? Perhaps this is the creators fault as they rely on Squarespace, MPB, etc. for income. The exception to this in my opinion is Henry Turner where his output is as much about the location as it is about photography. This keeps it fresh and has me looking forward to his weekly content. The algorithms also mostly work for me. I have been looking for a filter system over the last week and I suddenly found my TH-cam flooded with filter content. I chose a few to watch and have now made a decision. I may be wrong here but I’m just a guy who loves going out with my camera and wants to pick up a few tips along the way.
Thanks Alan. Perhaps I am - I guess it's hard to consider everybody's unique experience when I only have my own experience together with specific anecdotal evidence. Ignoring the videos you mention is probably the best bet, but it's a shame that the high quality videos may miss out on being seen because so many videos related to what you searched for were shown to you. Once someone searches for something, they often get an answer and that should be the end of it - having the algorithm show them similar videos for the next few weeks I think is part of the issue.
Spot on.
For 2024 I made a commitment to post weekly photography videos on my TH-cam channel which I hadn't been doing before.
YT has been dying a slow painful death for good reason. There are other platforms out there where people are allowed to speak without being muzzled by the powers that should not be.
I don't really see that but I guess I don't watch much content that would be potentially deemed 'controverisal'
I'm personally looking forward to having the time to TH-cam again. I think a lot of people don't realise just how time consuming it is, I would estimate it takes at least a full day's work just to create a 10 minute video. Probably longer when including research or anything else. I'm looking forward to it because there is so much to say on this platform that no one is saying. Photography education here has become very generic and you are totally right about the algorithms but the beneficiary of any platform improvements will be those already doing something different.
Totally agree. The time it takes to make these things is nuts, I know TH-camrs that work 60+ hour weeks! (Not me might I add!). Hope you can get back into it again soon 👍🏻
I notice most are business ie photographers who are selling photos etc not many just for the fun of it?
I think if you are just doing it for fun, then it likely is something you do in your free time. These videos take so long to make (and massively impact your photography if you’re making a video at the same time) so it’s likely that you’ll just give up on yt tying to make videos and concentrate more on the joy of photography.
That's a great reflection of yours.
I don't think the algorithm is programmed randomly. Nor do I think it is with a humanistic intention behind it, nor with a concern for improving the content offered on the platform, maybe one day it was like that, at the beginning. Perhaps today it is more a complex tool of mass formation and alienation, to redirect the most unwary and unsuspecting public to corset them in a meaningless world, without purpose, without sophisticated stimuli or aspirations. Or maybe it's just to see how much we all put up with it. Everyone knows who pays them the most for the information they host or reject. Everyone knows that the good guys lost.
There is a lot of truth to your analysis. I switch off several times due to poorly done videos, many use too much time promoting themselves individually and are not showing enough of their work. If you enjoy watching a video and you click on the "like", chances are there will be very similar themes popping up on TH-cam next time. It gets repetative, not to mention boring. A well presented, well documented video that is enjoyable to watch is becoming scarcer. I hope it improves for the better.
Some very salient points in here, mate.
Thanks 👍🏻
Well said, Rick. I applaud people who put themselves out there. There will always be a need for good story telling. But, if I see another "What's in my bag" video come across my feed, I think I'll hurl! There is too much "sameness" among photogs with this type of content. But like I said... a good story will grab me every time.
Thanks, much appreciated! *crosses ‘what’s in my bag’ video off the list 😂😂
The problem with "The Algorithm" is it based statistical analysis of viewing habits of users but it doesn't understand the users. It only "knows" what each use has watched but not why, Also, many don't watch videos on all their interests, I don't. Searches have the same problem, what is the context of the search is not always apparent.
I'm a consumer and not a creator. Personally, I would rather wait and view quality over quantity. These days I stop so many videos part way through after I realise its more of the same old stuff.
The algorithm uses what we like and watch to show us more of the same thing, which means its output is fed as its input. That causes what it shows to be more and more narrow.
Add to that, that making videos about gear is easy and gets likes. Making videos about photography as an art is more difficult, and fewer people are interested. Videos where people show how they create art are a bit difficult to find. Joe McNally's Pointe Shoe Mysteries is an example, but that is an exception.
Well just saying, you popped up in my feed today…:p
Honestly I think what the future currency of TH-cam is going to be is ‘authenticity’…real creators, real stories, real adventures, real set backs and successes. That’s what I see anyway. 😎📸
Same here😂
Unfortunately I see less and less of channels that I follow and more and more of channels that I don’t. I don’t mind seeing new content, but I first and foremost want to see the channels and people I’m interested in. TH-cam is becoming more and more like TikTok or Instagram which are both really shallow mediums that I actually really hate. In the past, TH-cam was a breeze of fresh air compared to those. So, the change in algorithm on TH-cam makes me really worried… 😧
@@KijkEenVogel honestly I just use my home page as my ‘for you’ page on TT and my subscription page as my ‘friends’ page…
Haha, sorry 😂😂 I hope so…
Timely and well said!
All good points, but as a slightly hearing impaired person I find the background noise/ music a huge distraction.
Cheers, feedback appreciated 👍🏻
Even Netflix here in Canada has several thumbnails for the same movies. If you passover a movie, generally they will recommend the same movie and you don't recognize the graphic as it's now different. There is definitely going on in Netflix too. But I agree, I am starting to tired of TH-cam trying to shove things my way.
Great video, Rick, and the 1st one of yours I was able to see. I admittedly don't spend much time on this platform for all the reasons you suggest - it rarely seems like the content that is pushed my way is stuff I can get into as an established professional photographer. I want to see more in-depth discussion on more nuanced topics. I don't necessarily care about the latest camera from Sony, although I do enjoy a good gear review when its something I'm looking to buy. I have been publishing my weekly podcast here for over a year with almost zero growth. With views in the 100-200 range each week... it's very long-form content and I admit I don't spend time on the thumbnails and click-bait titles although a tad of that is on the way... but I do think this is a huge problem. If quality content isn't being shown because the thumbnail isn't cringey, that seems to be a huge issue, IMO.
Good video. What I will say, though is that TH-cam is the second biggest search engine in the world and they have to cater to that.
It’s not our platform, so I don’t think there’s much we can do about it.
They can do as they please with it, but hopefully they will take our feedback on board
So true Rick, you are so right
Thank you :)
Good video. Note the background music became distracting about ten minutes into the video.
Think I missed a volume key frame…
Not to be overly critical, I just wanted you to know
Not all trends are good ones. Trends on TH-cam tend to be favor of the month. I tend to say take them with a very hefty grain of salt.
What would you want to see more of?
"New to you" and "not interested" works wonders.
I agree with you. I hate TH-cam's algorithm. There's only a few types of videos I watch on a regular basis. Photography is one of them. I use YT for do it yourself projects sometimes. Maybe I need to change a part in my car. I might find the answer in the first video. I don't need YT to start slamming me with the same type video every time I get on here. I spend half my time on here clicking on the 3 dots to hit don't recommend on videos I don't want to see in my feed. If you accidently click on a video you get stuck with that type of video in your feed. If you click on don't recommend it only stops videos from the person who posted it. I wish we could see a list of what YT thinks we want to see and remove things from it.
That would be good actually, good idea!
Really well said!
My favourite button on YT is the 'new to me button' (home page at the top, scroll far right), because you are totally correct in your video, I get swamped with the 'same' videos every time I log in, and yeah, I am a bit sick of them. Its repetitive, its boring, and I am fed up of seeing the same thing offered day in, day out, because I happened to watch one video that caught my interest on a particular day. I LOVE variety, I have a multitude of interests, and I love good storytelling. I hate terrestial tv these days due to the monotonus drive towards reality TV (thats fake and highly edited to cause controversy) and I love the realism of YT content. yet its strangling itself. Totally hope this gets a review sometime soon, or, like terestial TV I will wander off I am sure.
Thanks Sandy. Weirdly, I'm not even sure I've noticed that button. Going to go and find it now!
@@RickBebbington that'll be because you have to scroll to see it...
Spot on Rick. I'm a viewer not a creator, but I'm getting bored with all the same old same old from everybody all at the same time.Thanks YT Algorithm. As a human being I have a natural curiosity and am quite capable of earching for what I want/need and don't need anyone (Algorithm based) to tell me what I do/don't want to watch.I appreciate the hard work that content creators put in, but can I be the judge of what I see and when?
Thanks Mark, appreciate it.
Yt can also feed to the wrong viewers. I have a video that shot up to 83k views on release. The retention rate of 27% has ensured it got few views after that. 3 years later and has reached 85 k views!
I started my channel during a shitty time in my existence I needed a distraction anyway TH-cam content creation has become something I enjoy doing on a regular basis I never thought about making money from it but here I am 7 years later earning money I mean fair enough it averages 25 nz dollars a week which isn’t exactly life changing but hey baby steps. Good luck to every creator out there earning a quid any way ya can personally I hate ads on my channel but what other option is there to try to put diesel in the van.
It’s true, if you’re willing to put the time and effort in, why shouldn’t you be entitled to get a little something back? Hope you’re in a batter place now 👍🏻
@@RickBebbington agreed mate I’m happy with a few quid each month it’s not much but one day who knows.