I have had several of these, and similar. At the time, 120 film was only numbered for eight exposures of 6x9. On the Super Ikomat B or Super Ikonta B, as above, the red glass on the back is meant to position the number one. After that, you were meant to set the numbers on top to one and then to use them to get eleven exposures. I have tried several of them with Kodak, Ilford and other films, and they all worked fine. On the Ikonta A, which gave 16 exposures of 645 dimensions, you should put the number 1 in the first red glass and then do the same in the second. Then continue in the same manner with the number two.
you can add a 2-3 inch piece of masking tape on the back of the paper to add some "extra" paper thickness. thiss will help keep the spacing from over ,apping.
I recommend that you try and find a copy of the manual. They are readily available on internet. You will find out what the two red dots on the lens mean and what the mirror image of f stops mean.
Thank you. Let me know how it goes. I recommend using the Holga400 film for testing your camera. At $5 a roll, it's one of the cheapest 120 films available.
@@joewannab1244 Just developed my first film, Ilford HP5 400 this time. Amazing how it just works and take sharp pictures after been sitting in a closet since the 1960s. I will check out the Holga film I can find it. 🙂👍
My mother's grandpa had one of these when he took pictures for the white house in the 40s and 50s and I was thinking about restoring it but now I definitely will because it's not in bad condition and the only thing it needs is a new bellows
I love a camera with a connection to history. Was your grandpa photographing the Whitehouse during WWII? Was he there for the Roosevelt admin? Truman? Eisenhower? I bet he had some interesting stories. You should definitely get his camera restored. I would love to see some of his work. Do you have any of his prints?
Thanks so much for making this informative video. I've been considering a folder for some time and your video has pushed me to finally pull the trigger.
I've got an early post-War 532/16 Super Ikonta B. I don't find the RF hard to use, but I've used rangefinder cameras, off and on, for more than half a century (first was a borrowed Yashica at summer camp, 1969). The difficulty you describe may be due to a deteriorated beam splitter (which combines the images from the prism housing and straight-through window in the RF). The 562/16 is heavy, the f/2.8 Tessar loses a lot of crispness when wide open (though it's very good stopped down past f/5.6), and I find it hard to hold steady at slow speeds (unlike my significantly larger Moskva 5 or my much smaller Welta Weltini 35mm folder). It does have a frame counter, so I don't have to use the red window except to start the counter, but because it was made to use the 6x9 numbers (because it's a pre-War design, and 120 film couldn't be counted on to have a 6x6 track before about 1940), it was originally built to give 11 frames instead of 12. I modified the stop cam to give a 12th frame, and as long as I start the film very carefully, it works great. Due to its weight, inability to use the full speed of the lens, and the care needed to start the counter to get 12 frames, the Super Ikonta has been generally replaced, for me, by my somewhat newer Mamiya Six folder. Better lens, unit focusing (via moving the film plane) instead of front element focused, and captive format masks to give either 12 or 16 frames, not to mention close to 1/3 lighter. Maybe someday I'll get one of the Mamiya Six versions with a counter, so I don't have to use the red window(s)...
Thanks for the comment. My Super Ikonta was my only medium format rangefinder for several years but I just picked up a Kodak Medalist that needs a little work before I can use it as a reliable shooter. Have you ever shot on of those? I hear good things about them. Joe
@@joewannab1244 I've never even handled a Medalist. The big drawback they have is that they're 620 -- and Kodak discontinued rolling film on 620 spools more than two decades ago. Unlike some 620 cameras (like my Reflex II) the Medalist is also reputed to have a tight enough supply chamber that you can't even feed from 120 trimmed to the backing paper (making it the same diameter as 620) because the extra length will cause binding -- and by the time you sand the flanges enough to fit, you're risking edge light leaks, and still have a spool that won't work for takeup. You're basically forced to respool your film to use a Medalist. From what I hear, however, if you're willing to do that, or spend another big chunk of change having it professionally converted, they're superb cameras. I might suggest, however, that a Crown Graphic is lighter, works with any 2x3 Graflok mount accessory (including RB67 and Mamiya 23 backs), and most of them have a nice Kalart rangefinder that can be fairly easily calibrated for any lens you choose to mount (and they do allow changing lens boards, hence mounted lenses). Can't quite double as a blunt weapon in case of emergency like the all-metal Medalist can, but they're a good bit cheaper, too.
Hi Joe -thanks for the review. I recently picked up a 530/16, also 1936. It's no speed demon in setting up a photo but wow, the results are really nice. If I'm shooting landscapes I've been taking this rather than grab a 35mm. I've been using Ektar 100 and Ilford FP4 and also did not have issues with overlapping. I'll look for the Holga, thanks for the tip. One thing you may have mentioned that I missed is that the larger format than a 35 really helps in making enlargements stay crisp and clean with a lot less enhancement work needed.
Jon, Thanks. I am glad you're enjoying the Zeiss Ikon. It sounds like you've got a nice specimen. I've just gotten into color film development so I'm going to try some Ektar 100 in my 530/16. Lately, I've been shooting color on an old speed graphic with a 120 roll back lately. I need to drag out the Super Ikonta and shoot some color through it. I have too many cameras and too little free time! LOL
@@joewannab1244 The Ektar is pretty hot in saturation even in this old model. The greens and blues really pop, particularly with wetland shoots. Tried a few of people, way too much without some work. Photography can become an expensive hobby in retirement.
The one I have is similar but isn't quite the same, maybe a few years apart from yours or maybe mine's different for the European market. I tried to use it yesterday but the shutter button won't depress. The little chrome arm at the front below the lens can be used to fire the shutter but its very awkward especially on mine (since the mounting arms hold the whole pop out assembly from above and below rather than the sides). Can anyone help?
What a beautiful camera! I have just got a Super Ikonta 531, the smaller brother of your camera, released in 1937. It is a 645, but it has 2 windows in the 6x9 row, so it works well, so I don't think the standard was different other than not having 645 numbers. They probably thought that since the winding is automatic, noone would use the window. Anyways, mine has a 75\3.5 Tessar, and it is a front element focusing lens, something that is nowadays considered an inferior design to whole lens focusing. I was just wondering if the top of the line model was front element focusing as well. Can you check it for me please?
I had to take my camera out of the case to check as I truly had no idea about the focusing mechanism. It looks like my specimen also uses a front focusing element. My lens is the 8cm F2.8 Tessar. I had not read about a difference in focusing mechanisms in these Super Ikonta cameras from that era. I would love to hear more.
There may be others, but the only 120 folder I’m aware of from that era that had unit focusing was the Voigtländer Bessa RF. The rest all used front cell focusing. While unit focusing may be technically superior, I have vintage cameras of each variety and as long as you have a good lens on it, and are shooting at f8 or smaller, you probably won’t see a difference. I haven’t been able to, anyway.
Why would the thickness of the paper backing influence the frame count if you are using the numbers in the red window to advance the film? Is there also a mechanical frame counter on the body?
Good question. I'm sure others can answer better than I but my experience is the numbers in the red window are not useful with this advance system except to set the first frame. Once I set the advance counter to "1," the advance system is automatic making it impossible to alter the spacing between frames.This system is highly calibrated to use older film stocks available in the 1930's which apparently was a different thickness than film available today. If you watch other videos about these cameras, you will notice that this is a common problem. I, however, do not experience this problem which I mentioned in the video. If I use the red window to set up my first frame, my shots end up being spaced properly. I've shot about 10 rolls through this camera and have not had any spacing problems.
I have had several of these, and similar. At the time, 120 film was only numbered for eight exposures of 6x9. On the Super Ikomat B or Super Ikonta B, as above, the red glass on the back is meant to position the number one. After that, you were meant to set the numbers on top to one and then to use them to get eleven exposures. I have tried several of them with Kodak, Ilford and other films, and they all worked fine. On the Ikonta A, which gave 16 exposures of 645 dimensions, you should put the number 1 in the first red glass and then do the same in the second. Then continue in the same manner with the number two.
you can add a 2-3 inch piece of masking tape on the back of the paper to add some "extra" paper thickness. thiss will help keep the spacing from over ,apping.
I recommend that you try and find a copy of the manual. They are readily available on internet. You will find out what the two red dots on the lens mean and what the mirror image of f stops mean.
Loading is not easy with Kodak ektar,...but is avery good camera. Thanks so much!
Great review. I got a 531/2 from my grandfather and I'm really excited to use it now.
Thank you. Let me know how it goes. I recommend using the Holga400 film for testing your camera. At $5 a roll, it's one of the cheapest 120 films available.
@@joewannab1244 Just developed my first film, Ilford HP5 400 this time. Amazing how it just works and take sharp pictures after been sitting in a closet since the 1960s. I will check out the Holga film I can find it. 🙂👍
My mother's grandpa had one of these when he took pictures for the white house in the 40s and 50s and I was thinking about restoring it but now I definitely will because it's not in bad condition and the only thing it needs is a new bellows
I love a camera with a connection to history. Was your grandpa photographing the Whitehouse during WWII? Was he there for the Roosevelt admin? Truman? Eisenhower? I bet he had some interesting stories. You should definitely get his camera restored. I would love to see some of his work. Do you have any of his prints?
Thanks so much for making this informative video. I've been considering a folder for some time and your video has pushed me to finally pull the trigger.
I am glad you found the video useful. Did you get a folder? What did you end up with?
I've got an early post-War 532/16 Super Ikonta B. I don't find the RF hard to use, but I've used rangefinder cameras, off and on, for more than half a century (first was a borrowed Yashica at summer camp, 1969). The difficulty you describe may be due to a deteriorated beam splitter (which combines the images from the prism housing and straight-through window in the RF). The 562/16 is heavy, the f/2.8 Tessar loses a lot of crispness when wide open (though it's very good stopped down past f/5.6), and I find it hard to hold steady at slow speeds (unlike my significantly larger Moskva 5 or my much smaller Welta Weltini 35mm folder). It does have a frame counter, so I don't have to use the red window except to start the counter, but because it was made to use the 6x9 numbers (because it's a pre-War design, and 120 film couldn't be counted on to have a 6x6 track before about 1940), it was originally built to give 11 frames instead of 12. I modified the stop cam to give a 12th frame, and as long as I start the film very carefully, it works great.
Due to its weight, inability to use the full speed of the lens, and the care needed to start the counter to get 12 frames, the Super Ikonta has been generally replaced, for me, by my somewhat newer Mamiya Six folder. Better lens, unit focusing (via moving the film plane) instead of front element focused, and captive format masks to give either 12 or 16 frames, not to mention close to 1/3 lighter. Maybe someday I'll get one of the Mamiya Six versions with a counter, so I don't have to use the red window(s)...
Thanks for the comment. My Super Ikonta was my only medium format rangefinder for several years but I just picked up a Kodak Medalist that needs a little work before I can use it as a reliable shooter. Have you ever shot on of those? I hear good things about them. Joe
@@joewannab1244 I've never even handled a Medalist. The big drawback they have is that they're 620 -- and Kodak discontinued rolling film on 620 spools more than two decades ago. Unlike some 620 cameras (like my Reflex II) the Medalist is also reputed to have a tight enough supply chamber that you can't even feed from 120 trimmed to the backing paper (making it the same diameter as 620) because the extra length will cause binding -- and by the time you sand the flanges enough to fit, you're risking edge light leaks, and still have a spool that won't work for takeup.
You're basically forced to respool your film to use a Medalist. From what I hear, however, if you're willing to do that, or spend another big chunk of change having it professionally converted, they're superb cameras.
I might suggest, however, that a Crown Graphic is lighter, works with any 2x3 Graflok mount accessory (including RB67 and Mamiya 23 backs), and most of them have a nice Kalart rangefinder that can be fairly easily calibrated for any lens you choose to mount (and they do allow changing lens boards, hence mounted lenses). Can't quite double as a blunt weapon in case of emergency like the all-metal Medalist can, but they're a good bit cheaper, too.
Hi Joe -thanks for the review. I recently picked up a 530/16, also 1936. It's no speed demon in setting up a photo but wow, the results are really nice. If I'm shooting landscapes I've been taking this rather than grab a 35mm. I've been using Ektar 100 and Ilford FP4 and also did not have issues with overlapping. I'll look for the Holga, thanks for the tip. One thing you may have mentioned that I missed is that the larger format than a 35 really helps in making enlargements stay crisp and clean with a lot less enhancement work needed.
Jon,
Thanks. I am glad you're enjoying the Zeiss Ikon. It sounds like you've got a nice specimen. I've just gotten into color film development so I'm going to try some Ektar 100 in my 530/16. Lately, I've been shooting color on an old speed graphic with a 120 roll back lately. I need to drag out the Super Ikonta and shoot some color through it. I have too many cameras and too little free time! LOL
@@joewannab1244 The Ektar is pretty hot in saturation even in this old model. The greens and blues really pop, particularly with wetland shoots. Tried a few of people, way too much without some work. Photography can become an expensive hobby in retirement.
Love it.
My shutter is cocked still won't take picture, also tried it by pushing the little lever, it clicks but the counter ring does not move!
The one I have is similar but isn't quite the same, maybe a few years apart from yours or maybe mine's different for the European market. I tried to use it yesterday but the shutter button won't depress. The little chrome arm at the front below the lens can be used to fire the shutter but its very awkward especially on mine (since the mounting arms hold the whole pop out assembly from above and below rather than the sides). Can anyone help?
What a beautiful camera! I have just got a Super Ikonta 531, the smaller brother of your camera, released in 1937. It is a 645, but it has 2 windows in the 6x9 row, so it works well, so I don't think the standard was different other than not having 645 numbers. They probably thought that since the winding is automatic, noone would use the window.
Anyways, mine has a 75\3.5 Tessar, and it is a front element focusing lens, something that is nowadays considered an inferior design to whole lens focusing.
I was just wondering if the top of the line model was front element focusing as well. Can you check it for me please?
I had to take my camera out of the case to check as I truly had no idea about the focusing mechanism. It looks like my specimen also uses a front focusing element. My lens is the 8cm F2.8 Tessar. I had not read about a difference in focusing mechanisms in these Super Ikonta cameras from that era. I would love to hear more.
There may be others, but the only 120 folder I’m aware of from that era that had unit focusing was the Voigtländer Bessa RF. The rest all used front cell focusing. While unit focusing may be technically superior, I have vintage cameras of each variety and as long as you have a good lens on it, and are shooting at f8 or smaller, you probably won’t see a difference. I haven’t been able to, anyway.
Why would the thickness of the paper backing influence the frame count if you are using the numbers in the red window to advance the film?
Is there also a mechanical frame counter on the body?
Good question. I'm sure others can answer better than I but my experience is the numbers in the red window are not useful with this advance system except to set the first frame. Once I set the advance counter to "1," the advance system is automatic making it impossible to alter the spacing between frames.This system is highly calibrated to use older film stocks available in the 1930's which apparently was a different thickness than film available today. If you watch other videos about these cameras, you will notice that this is a common problem. I, however, do not experience this problem which I mentioned in the video. If I use the red window to set up my first frame, my shots end up being spaced properly. I've shot about 10 rolls through this camera and have not had any spacing problems.
its 11 frames.
Hallo, diese Kamera enthält ein leather bag, eine Gegenlichtblende und Farbfilter.