Nintendo NERFED Bagging in Wave 6... | Mario Kart 8 Deluxe
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 21 ก.ย. 2024
- Bagging got nerfed in Wave 6! Is it still viable? Is it a good strategy? How does it compare to frontrunning?
How to get Better at Mario Kart: • FULL Beginner Guide | ...
The final wave of the booster course pass just released, with new tracks, new shortcuts, and new characters. This is my first time using Funky Kong, Diddy Kong, Pauline, and Peachette online in worldwides. Playing on the courses Tour Rome Avanti, GCN DK Mountain, Wii Daisy Circuit, Piranha Plant Cove, Tour Madrid Drive, 3DS Rosalina's Ice World, SNES Bowser's Castle 3, and Wii Rainbow Road.
Bagging: waiting near last place for good items (bullet bill, shock/lightning, star, golden mushroom, mushrooms) and using them to make a comeback. This lets you get to 10 coins and stay away from attack items, and you can potentially dodge the shock or do item smuggling.
I dont even play this game but your commentary and the fact you are clearly having a grand old time playing this game is just so refreshing and wholesome. Love your videos :)
Same i never ever had a switch in the 1st place i just randomly fell on a video and kept watching since
@@CyberSKAMSame lmao
I have a switch and this guy helped me SO MICH
Much*
i play mkwii because i dont have a switch
If you ever mention bagging around shortcat you will enter a 5 minute unskippable cutscene where shortcat lectures you about literally every single intricacy about bagging
Some people in the comments say bagging is superior they think its cheating but actually frontrunning on ceese land bagging is better because on some tracks its just a more viable strategy okay the shock right here is a bullet extension acceleration is not the best stat it is mini turbo and speed okay your speed is for comeback on frontrunning okay lets do some baggi
@@MelTheMannHonestly I think if your a new player you could try bagging alot more often to get comebacks this will help your anger issues and your wallet cause you know you'll break your switch and the realization hits oh no
@@MelTheMannI’m supposing english isn’t your main language?
Speaking of bagging, you know a shock is coming when you have a Bullet Bill behind a golden mushroom.
Really?
@Kakkemans It's a joke. You're forced to use the Golden Mushroom until it runs out, it doesn't protect you, and the shock will delete your bullet bill.
The joke being that it always comes at the worst time for you.
I feel this
You know it's terrible when you click the bill but someone shocked 0.1 nanoseconds before you clicked it
Technically true, because it's a pretty good sign that the round is out of bills which means the next bill will be a shock.
On one hand, yeah, bagging requires knowing how far back you can get away with being and how to take shortcuts and time shit, and the comebacks are nice. On the other, it really is hard to resist being all, “Come on! It’s a RACE! A RACE! Have you ever heard of ‘em?!”
It's more than just a race, it's a death race! 😂
That aside, bagging and frontrunning are just names, in the end the point is you gotta trade off placement for item rolls sometimes. Well, I agree it looks better if people are actually moving though, good that now bagging is nerfed in a way that discourages just waiting. 😆
Yeah that's why I am in favor of nerfing bagging. I only ever argue against people who claim something about the luck/skill involved in bagging, because that is objective. If you dislike bagging because you just don't like it, that's completely fair!
Yo, don’t curse.
@@nixgamingchannel2708it’s the internet
@@nixgamingchannel2708the curse word doesn’t make sense so it’s probably a mistarñke
12:25 might be the most insane trick ive ever seen 😂 you literally kicked in to a pool shot and knocked them both off the map
😂
I'm more of a fan of this new bagging strategy than sitting on one item set all day. Also, congrats on hitting 200k❤
Thank you!! Yeah i think nintendo didn't really try to nerf bagging much, they just tried to stop people from having a party at the first item set instead of driving forward
@ShroomlessShortcat, at 3:31, InHughman was me. I played against you in this video.
@@Shortcat321having double item is the root of bagging problem, in single item scenario bagging almost non existent
When I saw everyone over-reacting over the bagging nerf I though I was the one going insane. It was pretty oubvious that they were nerfing stopping at item boxes, not bagging as a whole. Like, just go slowly and stay in the back instead of stopping/going backwards lol
Shortcat is biased towards bagging because he is Canadian and they drink milk out of bags
Congrats on 200k Shortcat!!! I really really love your videos, and you’re what inspired me to finally give making videos a try too! 😊 so thank you!
1:44 We may not have gotten an official yellowbrick and Shortcat collab but seeing him in shortcat’s lobby is good enough for me!
The two best mario kart TH-camrs
So what they nerfed was not bagging, but item chaining by stopping.
Yes,but the reason we say”they nerfed bagging”is because stopping for items was an essential part of old bagging,but now it is a bad idea
they banned item chaining by stopping, which has the effect of nerfing "bagging"
Bagging also includes staying behind on purpose to get better items without chaining.
What gave bagging a bad look was when no one was moving forward at first item set and nintendo removed exactly that. They know how to balance their game it seems...
I kinda found another bullet extension. On N64 Choco Mountain, use your Bullet right after the last item set. I found this on accident. (Totally not with the help of custom items, i would never!😅)
I forgor to add. This can be used for 150cc and 200cc, but use the bullet on 200cc in between the first and the second rock-falling section.
Great tip! You can actually do it earlier on 150cc (i forgot exactly how much earlier, but it's near the 2 boulders) since the extension zone is MASSIVE. Basically there is a huge area before and after the last item set where using the bullet will still give you the full extension
@@Shortcat321 I know. But when I'm using the Bullet near the rocks it won't stop before the first item set, while if you use your Bullet right after the last item set, it will go all the way until the straight path into the tunnel.
There's also 2 i found accidentaly, on dolphin shoals and sky garden. For dolphin shoals use it at the finish line and it will go for 12 seconds, really good. And for sky garden, use it at the first item box set, it's not that good, but at least it goes longer than a normal bullet
Love the amount of long form videos we’re getting from this update
I think the only bad thing about this change is getting used to not using all three triple mushrooms into item boxes you just used since you'll probably end up pulling a green or something in its place.
I do find it interesting that this bagging nerf decreases the average number of shocks per race on the notorious bagging tracks cuz less good items get cycled.
that point about frontrunning on cheeseland is brilliant! getting first off a frontrun on cheeseland is just as lucky as getting a first off bagging on (for example) waluigi pinball, but understanding that nuance requires experience that noobs just don't have yet. very well said shortcat.
200k subscribers 🎉
I started watching you at around 30 - 40k subs, and now you have 200k! I love your videos, your commentary is awesome and your tutorials are awesome!
DK mountain has so few mushroom spots you have to use the mushroom whenever there is a large turn or a straight. Which might make it good but not in a regular sense because you are always going to be either be doing shortcuts or boosting. There is 0 down time if you use this method
i like this change tbh. im a frontrunner at heart and hate the idea of bagging (it is a race after all). old bagging just felt lame, im trying my hardest, using ideal racing lines, etc., and someone can beat me because they camped the first item spawn for 30 seconds to get a bullet and a shock? doesnt feel right. now, bagging feels less like cheese and more like a valid strategy. instead of just rolling for OP items, you stick to the back of the pack as sort of a gamble that you'll be able to hit the right shortcuts with the items you get to make a comeback, while dodging items along the way.
“Whoops i got heated there” that was like the most chill way of being heated only something shortcat could do.
The nerf to baggin is more noticeable when you start reversing immediately at the start of a race until you hit item boxes.
I used to do that when playing with family, so I noticed the change right away with the update.
And I never did this for bagging itself, I actually never knew or thought about it being a thing.
I just did it for an extra challenge when playing locally with friends or family since we always played with CPU difficulty on Easy or Normal.
I remember when i first tried bagging, i SUCKED and was very fixed on running, but ur vids helped me find out HOW to bag. Thx Shortcat, love ur vids!!!!
Wait a minute, I just remebered Nintendo removes videos for copyright infringement. I'm impressed that your videos haven't been taken down yet.
9:53 He is playing versus StarVtuber❤❤❤(for the ones who dont know is a very famous spanish speaking vtuber)
What if you do the stopping and reversing way before the item set so that by the time you reach the item set, you’re not technically stopped or reversed, you’re just going while being behind so you’ll get good items?🤔
Yeah, that's called being bad at a video game.
Yeah, there seems to be a set distance the game counts as stopping at an item set, for example at cheese land you reverse and hang around the finish line instead of going straight to the item boxes.
You wait for someone to front run then you can grab two boxes
This is essentially the form bagging is going to have to take on after the update. The major nerf comes from the fact that you can’t sit on item boxes which used to allow you to roll up to 4+ powerful items in a single set and have a greater chance of pulling invincibility items or shocks. It’s just a matter of lowering the density of good items that a bagger can roll in a race
@@TheTundraTerrorYep
Maybe Peachette has a smaller hurtbox than the other characters with those stats? Or maybe it's because she's a dlc character who is still top tier?
*hitbox 😂😂😂
@@SweetMelaninnhurtbox is for incoming damage hitbox is for damage dealing.
@answering248 Oh, never heard of that before. I honestly just thought they mistyped. Thanks for educating me
I wish every youtube comment thread was this polite
@@Shortcat321 one thread at a time :)
Your commentary gives a lot of life to the gameplay. It's clear that you enjoy this game way too much, just like the rest of us.
On that note, a suggestion for a "playing with max (stat)" video: Traction. Baby Peach/Baby Daisy with Tanuki Kart, Monster Tyres and either Flower or Cloud Glider is honesty kind of great on tracks like Neo Bowser City and GBA Ice Land. You could even swap in GLA Tyres for the best combined Handling/Traction spread in the game.
Here's an idea to nerf bagging, just make all the items disappear once you passed them (it disappears for you and not the others behind the item boxes) and then bring them back next lap
Congrats at 200k subs shortcat u deserve it!
This is a really good video, thank you for doing this.
I think your stance on bagging has been pretty clear from your videos, so I assume people got the wrong idea from your shorts. I was anti-bagging at the start too, but after actually trying it out as you suggested, I've realized that it's so essential for making comebacks, or just securing an early lead.
I'm still not sure how effective this nerf will turn out to be, but it's a good change nonetheless. Looking forward to the future of this game!
I've always hated the "why not just drive the race" argument people make. it's people who don't understand the game telling other people that they are wrong for enjoying something differently "you're not allowed to have fun how you want to, you need to have fun how i want to!"
This doesn't make sense because this applies the other way too, saying bagging should remain superior to racing is telling other players they should bag instead of racing in the racing game. Dumb take.
@@Chicky_Lumps My take is that people should be allowed to have fun how they want. You're strawmanning so hard it's insane.
@@Jar_Jar_Twinks Okay but then how is your comment relevant to nerfing bagging? That doesn't prevent you from doing it anymore than you front running before this, it just won't be as good.
@@Chicky_Lumps because when bagging was nerfed a super common response to people being upset about the nerf was "just drive the race normally"
i was just saying i don't like that stance. you don't gotta be so combative dude.
My favorite part has to be how he stays in an item set and spams triple mushroom only to get a green shell or a banana but he still keeps the commentary going
I think a chart showing every track, and where it falls on the bagging/frontrunning spectrum would be super cool
Shortcat is the only Mario Kart TH-camr I watch and I’ve been playing for a long time, keep up the good work 🎉
As someone who has been waiting for an update like this for a long time, I can really appreciate the fact that despite the nerf, bagging is still a viable strategy. I much prefer it in this state.
i was just looking for a competitive mk8d guide but now i’m obsessed with watching shortcat videos lol. i only really keep up with competitive smash ultimate but it’s very fascinating to watch a pro mario kart player and learning more about the meta and strategies. love the commentary on these videos, keep it up
I actually think bagging is in a pretty decent spot right now. Think of how many times you're in 1st and see a blue shell then slam on the brakes to let 2nd place pass. That's the essence of bagging. Getting hit from 3rd to 5th place and saying, "Screw this," and intentionally dropping to 9th is a perfectly valid strategy to me.
What I hated was everyone stopping to cycle items until they got bullets, and it seems like that's exactly the aspect that's been nerfed.
I think ideally the game would be designed such that bagging isn't viable. There shouldn't be "bagging" tracks and "frontrunning" tracks. The incentive should always be to get in the lead.
My favorite way to play the game is running but I would hate if they did that. I really enjoy that there is diversity. Most tracks are runner friendly or 50/50 too, there are very few tracks where bagging is the clear best strat
These videos have become an unexpected source of comfort for me
Someone suggested to me on my last comment to play on regionals to have more variety of players with my low 1300 rank. What I learned is strategy and execution matters a lot.
For example, I got destroyed on lap 1 in Cheese Land, then got good itens on lap 2, but saved a star and 3 mushrooms for lap 3. I got first because I did all the cheese land shortcut and beat 30k players
With my first position at the start of the next race, I decided to front run. I got third because the 30k players are more skilled to make better lines and take more riskier shortcut. Even being on a good bagging track, the best option to me was maintaining my 3rd place.
Concluding, what happens to make front running and bagging important is how annoying the middle pack is. I know some players who hate mario kart 8 because "it's too item based" , but I think what they really wanted to say is that being in the middle pack is the worst feeling ever, and I agree with that.
Mario kart 7 and 8 and 8DX(after playing 10 hours, I think 8DX wave 4 onwards is very different from 8 vanilla) are the only games I played online. However, I remember that the middle pack in 7 isn't very annoying, maybe because having less player in a match.
200k! Congrats shortcat. I just recently started watching your stuff I’m really enjoying the live commentary!
i love ur videos shortcat i like how you speak nonstop even during races and dont get distracted... mk8d god....
So couple questions here on bagging I feel like the video didn't cover. Not sure if you felt it was worth it or not or if it's just too technically complicated but here goes:
1) What happens if you get hit in font of an item box you didn't slow down for. Do you still get hit with the nerf? What about if you get nailed on top of the item boxes and grab 2 while in the middle of a recovery?
2) Does bagging still work as it used to if you hit a different or 2 different item boxes after you slow down and speed burst through the item set? Do the odds get better if you aim for different boxes after you have slowed down or reversed if you hit different boxes? Or it is just the same odds all around?
3) Do these new nerfs only work for lower place values? Or could you abuse this new system in first place to potentially bag to avoid a coin?
I love both of your channels. The way you explain things is just so helpful and something that nobody else does.
Even if the bagging is nerfed you just have to plan your bagging location better to avoid running into the trigger for the worst item pull. So all this update solves is those problem tracks where everyone is competing for last place right as the race starts which is an awful experience.
I like how the tone of his voice never changed and he finished with
*sigh* got heated there
😂😂😂 love the content
I been watching your channel since wave 5 and I decided to use my siblings switch to play online and I got to 2130 vr in a few days!
I understand that it’s a viable strategy and requires skill, but bagging outside of teamed modes (where it’s extremely optimal and how you play teams) has always rubbed me the wrong way. It’s a race. Race! I’m personally all for Nintendo taking real action against bagging
Likely the patch just takes into account how long you've been accelerating before you touched the item block, just don't accelerate at all at the start of the map and then speed into a block instead of waiting for it to spawn at the block.
... Just tested it and it works.
I would have thought it just saves from which item set the last item you got was from and when you get another from the same item set it gimps the item selection.
i never really hear anyone talk about mario kart so in depth. it's kinda off-putting, but in a cool way.
I love bagging in all his ways, every part is beautiful
baggers are the same type of people to not put the shopping carts back where they belong
Go to @Jperm
He’s the same guy
From my own testings and findings: If you stop before the first item set on most bagging tracks and let the distance to players grow for 5-8sec. try to grab two different item boxes and don't back into them! Hover around 12-9th place chaining your items till the middle of lap two on most bagging tracks (so far for me bagging has worked out best on mario circuit 3, royal raceway, yohsi valley and sky garden I uploaded a short vid on my channel earlier I just stitched raw clips together and got amazing luck to say the least!) (my avarage lobby vr is usually anywhere from 8-11k)
Edit: CONGRATULATIONS FOR 200K! Amazing to see you smash these milestones man! Just keep em videos coming! 😁
Old bagging was definitly game breaker and made the race not fun at all, new patch makes bagging viable while still having to race normally and play smart placement essentially making it harder than before but not worse
Best Bagging Tracks (my opinion)
1. Cheese Land
2. Dry Dry Desert
3. Mario Circuit 3
4. Riverside Park
5. GBA Mario Circuit
6. Yoshi's Circuit
7. Snow Land
8. Sunset Wilds
9. Kalmari Desert
10. Mario Kart Stadium
From the wave six patch notes:
"Made it so that you can’t acquire strong items when taking an Item Box by stopping or driving in reverse, or taking an Item Box that is in same location multiple times during a race"
So basically, you CAN still chain your items, you just have have to grab your items, and do a full 360 loop through the item sets (without stopping), rather than reversing, and you then you have to grab another box you haven't touched yet to chain. This is harder than it was before, and it's not practical in most situations, but it is possible, i tested it out and it worked
Thank you for posting this during my lunch break at school, it honestly really makes my day. Congrats on 200k🎉!
Shortcat, You should try this combo: Morton on the Varmint Bike with Roller Wheels and Cloud Parachute. It's surprisingly good and pretty fun to play with.
people criticise bagging because "the point of a race is to go as fast as possible," but i dont think that way. the point of a race is to get to the finish line before everyone else while still abiding the rules. if going slower for a period of time is advantageous to that goal and if going fast all the time is disadvantageous in some scenarios, then bagging is a totally valid strategy.
So for the boomerang throws at 13:58... you threw it once to get rid of a red shell behind you, and then you threw it a second time at the end of the race.
But it never returned.
And that has happened to me. Twice. I have no idea why it happens and I can't replicate it, because of this I'm certain it's a new bug.
got superhorned so it was gone
7:52 Peachette is adorable so I can see her becoming a fan favorite plus her being the most viable character based on her stats. Also Congrats on 200K!
I made an appearance on race 1😁
Yoooooo the GOAT
Mariokart but you play as a noob , that means : no thinking about your items just use them, not doing hard stuff like DK summit gap cut or mushroom gorge gap jump and most important don’t play with a good combo just play the one that looks the best
Edit: Congrats for 200K 🎉
honestly i love front running its just so much more fun to me
also pauline being upside down on the minimap at 25:30 is funny
Probably because that's how the game is meant to be played.
Good, this game is fun but there's just too many try hards that forget this is a kid's game
Best combo (IMO at 5000) is peachette - mr Scooty, roller, paper glider
Peachette is def going to be top pick, she just feels so smooth. Insane handeling with really good top speed and very quick accel off the starting line
Nerfing bagging was a really good decision while annoying its also a very good and balanced changed overall
Shortcat: "I don't know how to play Piranha Plant Cove.
Also Shortcat: *Gets 2nd*
honestly nintendo nerfing bagging in wave 6 is just giving me an excuse to get better at frontrunning
The only time i really start by bagging is when i know i need a mushroom for a shortcut right at the beginning of a map, especially on snow land and we all know why
Video Idea? Maybe now that every single track is out you could make a tier list ranking every track.
Nintendo couid soft nerf bagging by adding more mid tier defense items like the mega mushroom (It makes you invincible to all but stars and bullets, while lightning only wears off the effect). They could also make triple bananas stack behind you like in 64 instead of rotating to ensure a defense from the rear.
Another thing I think could go really well would be a purely defense item for mid spots, to protect you from any direction for a short time, like a dome shield around you that doesn't do anything else (Boos should remain a low % item). It would be like a star without the speed, handling, and attack powers. And again, Lightning would only break it immediately.
I still wished that R.O.B. made it to Wave 6, I loved using it on DS
you claim that bagging is fair, and yet I need a scapegoat for why I lose. checkmate, shortcat
Congrats on 200k subscribers! ❤❤
I think bagging doesnt really work well after the patch, but i think it's still fully possible to play in the back and capitalising with a comeback
2:05
"funky kong has a boomerang" 😄
"f**king kong has a boomerang" 💀
You know that Funky Kong has a blue peach parasol while Pauline doesn’t have a red one.
I never understood why bagging was so hated.
If we assume in a room where everyone has perfect skill, the people in the middle should never move up and down spots while the people in losing and first will be able to keep their spots because everyone in the middle would be too busy fighting each other.
It's because it rewards a player for not playing the game.
Short cat defends bagging for 27 minutes and 2 seconds
I think the difference with bagging now is that you actually have to DRIVE FORWARDS. You can intentionally drive slower and stay in the back of the pack but you can’t just sit at the boxes and rely on items to catch you up
is also for nerfing the search of shock when you´re playing wars
Congrats on 200k subs! You completely deserve it!
The problem with bagging is it creates a prisoners dilemma. If bagging is the optimal strategy, the best play is for everyone to sit at the box and not move
Congratulations on 200k!!! 🎉🎉🎉 Rooting for your channel's growth!! 📈 Always looking forward to your videos ❤
At this point, a video for how to be a pro bagger is coming soon isn't it 😂 though that'd probably come after a tracks guide compilation 😆
My strategy for bagging on cheeseland is just driving on off roads and collecting coins. Each item set will guarentee at max 2 strong items even if you stop at single item box sets. Falling off the map is generally a dumb way to bag items as you can manipulate the distance between you and other players to gain a higher chance to get desired items, and you have multiple item sets to do so. Once you get the item you need to make a comeback, you just drive as fast as possible to catch up the pack.
I have never played a single mario or nintendo game in my life but i love these videos. Keep up the bagging👍👍
It blows my mind seeing this dude go from like 30k TO 200k LIKE BRO BIG CONGRATS 🎉
20:45 „I am so high right now thanks to the mushroom“
Shortcat, 2023
Yooooo is that yellowbrik at 1:43😂😂 unsuspected collab
I didn’t get MK8 when it came out since I had other stuff to do, and then MK8D seemed like old news at the time… Now I’m just holding out for MK9 and trying not to convince myself to buy a 9 year old game, just a couple years before the next one comes out…
And your videos make that REALLY hard.
Bagging is a tactical retreat
The boomerang probably got destroyed before it returned preventing you from using it again (it has happend to me and ive seen it happen to others where a person blocked a boomerang with a boomerang of their own that still had throws left and they destroyed each other)
Just got one of your "Can I win after waiting X seconds" videos recommended. Might need to retry that challenge now that bagging has been nerfed
Thank god they nerfed bagging before i had to learn how to do it
This dude doesn't miss, every video is so good
I've started getting WAY more bombs when front running and that's been way more fun tbh but when you're in like third place you have to deal with the mob and that's terrifying😭
I love the fact the he is using different characters and karts to show that you can still win no matter the combination.
9:59 Don't wanna exagerrate things but shortcat seems kinda angry that he is thought of as the "bagging guy" and some ppl critique him saying that bagging takes no skill. This can be assumed because he repeatedly has mentioned in his videos that bagging takes skill (which is true) and supports his opinion with facts. But i gotta say, noone is the "bagging guy". The strategy is used when necessary by shortcat as he has mentioned is an other video that he generally prefers frontrunning over bagging for better results.