GR Research B24 AC Cable Review: Does it Make an Audible Difference?
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 3 ต.ค. 2024
- Review, listening tests and measurements of the GR Research AC Audio Cable. Sound clips are provided for comparison.
Text Review: www.audioscien...
Kind credit to band Radical Face Missing Film album for free license for non-commercial use. Please see: • Radical Face - Horizon...
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Amir the way you are cleaning up the dirt in this industry, is absolutely admirable! A lot of people get away from this hobby after realizing how much they have wasted on garbage products. So videos like this will go a long way to “lift the veil” and “make the blacks inkier” 🥂
How about headphones ?
I couldn't agree more...
Yet Amir has a hinend system himself
@@Coneman3Apparently it’s okay to waste money as long as you know you’re wasting money, or something.
That GR Research cable is just another shining example of a costly solution to a non-existent problem.👍
And another one? FLAC v MQA side by side comparison: th-cam.com/video/Cl5ULnX4viU/w-d-xo.html
@Analog Looney 👍
Well said. Now, let's tackle the uber "high-end" nonsense.
@@bubblehead5394 👍 I’ve not yet worked out what constitutes ‘high end’ let alone ‘ultra high end’? 🍻
Even with a VERY powerful amplifier like 3600Watt output power its debatable if it will make such a difference, may be for power output. Because lower resistance means less voltage drop, keep in mind that short bass pulses can draw pretty big currents from the mains, but not on the average hifi listening level using 2x 100 watt or may be 2x 300watt......
But i must say the looks of the power cord are nice.... But not worth my 500 dollars.......
I appreciate that you always look for safety certification on these kinds of products, and honestly the lack of it should tell you everything you need to know. Do NOT use non-certified mains cabling long term; period. There is zero reason to take on that risk (unlikely though it may be), and for a manufacturer to ask that of their customers is horribly irresponsible.
That being said, I really like Danny and have learned so much about speaker and crossover design from his videos. I feel like he's just dug himself into a strange hole with this cable stuff; where he's still happy to show off graphs and data for drivers and crossover circuits, carefully talking through all the logic and testing, while simultaneously pushing the benefits of power cables and the like via his subjective experiences alone. Music is of course a mix of both things by very nature, but it's odd to hear a man of such technical knowledge lean so hard into things he cannot test or verify.
As you say and have said before, cables costing more than a few bucks should be seen primarily as audio jewelry. By all means spend as much as you like, but make sure that most of that extra money is going towards quality parts, thoughtful design and safety certification, and not just comically thick wire and pretty sheathing.
There are plenty of smart people who are also immoral. In fact, in modern business I've found the two go hand in hand just as often as not.
Synergistic Research folks, what are you waiting for? Ship your $7000 AC cables to Amir.
As electronic development eingineer, musician and one who love accurate sound I love your work. Thanks a lot for your vision, art of thinking, scientific way to see the things and be free to ask and proof yourself and others.
Best regards from Germany ;-)
That's very kind of you Sebastian. Great to see such multi-talented people watching my videos.
ein-gi-neer of ein-jinuity
@@AudioScienceReview this is not science (hypothesis based systematic experimentation based on a viable hypothesis)….
…this is maths!
Maths is a language
Science establishes the cause of a natural phenomenon by way of the scientific method with independent and dependent variables and constant variables (controls)
“Umpteen measurements” …. “You just did measurements” “I’m not going to do any *measurements* I’m just going to listen”. Maths isn’t science.
Prove, not proof.
@@thomasmleahy6218 ;-)
This has quickly become my favorite youtube channel
Thanks Amir, I needed a good laugh today!
HA HA!
Jokes on you
@@Coneman3 Sorry, but it just felt good to laugh along with Amir, and anyone who can clearly cut through that kind of bullshit.
@@greg1030 ”man has such a predilection for systems and abstract deductions that he is ready to distort the truth intentionally, he is ready to ignore the evidence of his senses only to justify his logic.” Dostoevsky
All these cables are so rigid that they put enormous strain on the sockets on your equipment, which is highly likely to cause damage!
Definitely.
Anime actually make their power inlet connections loose on their amplifiers.
Maybe they had a heads up from GR !
It would be great if they rip out the sockets of all those believers. Because then the believers would see the tiny cables behind the socket. And maybe then they would ask themselves: What is the advantage of 1m thick cable after many meters of thin cable?
Yup!
Good quality sockets that are well fasten with screws are now problem
Riddle me this.. So Danny uses measurements to pick apart other speaker manufacturers and designers speakers and then offers you (usually quite expensive I might add) kits to "fix these speakers". He provides before and after measurements to provide evidence that his kit works and results in audible improvement of said speakers. So measurements = good. Science = good. (Oh, but you can't use EQ to fix some of these issues either, you must buy his expensive kits).
But when it comes to speaker cables, power cables, and things like tube connectors, Danny claims you cannot use measurements to hear any audible differences. So measurements = bad. Science = bad. Do I have it right?
You have it completely right. He is a vegetarian which has steak for dinner on weekends. :)
@@AudioScienceReview when is this banter back and forth going to stop? Don't you see how damaging the divisiveness is to people who may be curious about the hobby? You and Danny should both be ashamed of how you act online bashing each other and encouraging your followers to echo your mantras. Calling each other flat-earthers in order to socially elevate your status and point of authority is disgraceful.
@@dan.nathan Uhh…. Danny publicly apologized for partaking in Amir’s nonsense. Go look up the video. It’s Amir and can’t let it go. He’s been stroking the flame for awhile and I don’t blame Danny for feeling compelled to fire back in the past.
But I agree. The insults need to stop. Everyone is entitled to believe and buy what they want.
@@ace_king Correct answer. The only person who need to be happy with the purchase is the purchaser, whatever the motivation.
@@KeithHeinrich The emperor loved his new clothes.......
This is why Amir is the only guy left that I watch, people like Guttenburg, Robinson and Jay’s motivation is profit. Amir, I feel is doing it for the greater good.
Robinson @ PF? Total sellout, any prompted, recommended product is always a lot more money (+ snake oil)
@@thomasmleahy6218 Totally, he’s on my black list, him and Guttenburg and a few others. I hate fake news.
He put his money on those equipment and software and kindly share the result with us. What a great person.
I just had the pleasure to discover Amir, this is now my only trusted reviewer online!...Thank you Amir!
@@philbarone4603 All those reviewers you mentioned and way more,their channels are so polished,they remind me of that really shiny apple that looks so good,until you bight into it,not crisp,just soft,and it leaves a terrible taste in your mouth.
This thing with power cables reminds me of a very well known audio reviewer, whose name I will not utter, that was reviewing the Technics SL-1200G turntable. The turntable comes with a very thick AC power cable to power the motor. The reviewer criticized the power cable and installed a cable priced hundreds of dollars and then proceeded to mention how the bass became fuller and thightrr, the mids more liquid and the highs better defined. Now, what he did not explained is how a cable powering the turntable motor, which is not connected in any way to the cartridge system and arm, has such an impressive impact on the sound coming from the cartridge, the phono cables and the arm.
Auditory hallucinations
The recommended "200 hours of burn in time for these to sound their best" also likely results in people missing their 30 day return window. Pretty smart marketing :)
@Douglas Blake True, you could just run some a device for 200 continous hours, but my thought was the burn in period would mostly occur when people are using the device during normal watching/listening. I have a day job and kids a wife and a dog so 200 hours for me of listening to music can often be a lot more than 30 days.
@Douglas Blake First of all I agree I think burn in is BS. As Floyd Toole states burn is more about your ears adjusting then it is the speakers (or in this case power cord). I was approaching this as I don't leave my source devices on when I am not using them. I power everything down. So the power cord, I would assume, would be drawing no power from my power strip to the device (let's say CD/Blu-Ray player in this case.
When I was a young man I worked for an alarm company, and I had a service call at UL labs in the Chicago area. I got to walk through the labs and see how they tested equipment. They are no joke. They test all kinds of equipment to make sure you, as the consumer don’t get hurt or killed when using equipment that is put on the marketplace. Even if you are stupid enough to try using it in a way that it wasn’t designed. So when buying things like this you should always look for something like a UL approved label. It may save you, your equipment or your house in the event of an accident or even just normal circumstances. Amir knows what he’s talking about and it’s a shame people out there try to squeeze every single penny of profit out of you with no care about safety, just money for them.
Everyone knows that unicorn dust is fragile and evaporates before you can measure it.
I'm super impressed you have the patience to sit down and do detailed testing on these overpriced scams.
I simply wouldn't have the patience.
Great work on helping clean up an industry and saving people money they simply do not need to spend.
Power cords have always been my favorite subject of ridicule in audio. The current is being transmitted through miles of cheapest copper wire the contractor could find, passing multiple transformers and getting paracitic load from millions of lamps and devices but fear not, that last 3 feet of cable magically make everything better! Now an AC-DC-AC UPS I could believe could actually do something... A cord? No way.
So people forget the hundreds of meters of "bad" copper wires in the walls of the house and believe that adding a 2m extension will fix something?
This is why you need to buy a “power conditioner” for the lowly price of $10,000 to plug this fat ass cable into ;-)
You should probably cut the power plug end off and connect it directly to the breaker box. That would bypass all the non audiophile wiring in your walls.
Screened mains leads diminish EM interaction between it and low level/speaker wiring when in close proximity to each other at the back of your rack. Thus the validity of "the last mile matters" argument. Whether it's audible is another matter.
I appreciate your very thorough and detailed analysis when verifying the claims of others professed "Not cheesey" audio products. I can get more details in my audio by cupping my ears with my hands than these gimmicky mods.
How can anyone take what you say seriously when you don't even know when to use than instead of then?
@@carlosoliveira-rc2xt Thank you for being my spell checker. Now everyone can take me more seriously.
Almost $100 spent in the service of music community just in one review, much appreciated Amir. I love the shirt!
It was $350. You mean you think he returned it?
@@johnsmith1474 100 after return
The logic of the bigger cable on source devices and smaller cables on amps is quite easy to determine. You likely have many more source devices than amplifiers, and the bigger cables sell for more… well you can see where this is going…
Man, that is good logic! Didn't think of that.
And soon they can launch an even thicker cable for the power amp and get additional business out of that as an upgrade. And then you need special cable lifters also on your power cables of course.
@@ThinkingBetter
GR Research is all about "upgrades that take your system to the next level "
Another aspect is that they can project as if there's science/method behind it and they're trying to reduce your expenses. Genius marketing .
@@giriprasadkotte9876 But next level can be of imaginary improvement. This power cable used for a source device is a complete scam and with zero credibility. If GR research want to be respected, promoting such power cable for a source device is absolutely not helping. It’s incompetent if the aim is to sell it as an audio fidelity upgrade for anything other than a heavy power amp where the lower resistance could have a chance of doing something good.
Oh man! This is going to TRIGGER the _flat earthers_ and NASA fanboys at GR Research!
Thanks again AMIR for another great informative educational video debunking snake oil gears.
Dear, Amir
Thank you very much for this review. You have saved your fellow audiophiles from wasting tens-of-thousands of dollars of curiosity purchases they will later regret.
Haha, won't matter. Once you have the bug it doesn't matter what the "Experts" say! If anything, this video will just drive more viewers to the cable and some will undoubtably buy it, because, just in case it DOES do something. LOL
@@drewpknutz1410 Unfortunately, some of us have to learn it the hard way.
CABLES
I want to believe
I'm gonna buy one. I actually listen to music so it might help. And I could have told everybody that listening to two different recoding of nothing would result in nothing learned. Why not listen to music on your audio gear then tell us their is or isn't a difference. I'm not gonna go home and listen to null test. Then don't exagerate the trial expense. I can have it shipped for $25 and return it for $18 = $43. It makes Amir sound like he is just the leader or a crazed hate Danny mob. Some of us are actually looking for real answers and looking for realworld experience. Angry attacks from either side don't help us that are still looking for answers. Oh, and buying it for "jewelry" affect sounds like a cop out. Makes me think someone heard a difference and just cant admit it now because the followers will turn you. Audioholics said okay to spend the money for jewelry affect also and that is why I stopped watching audioholics, now Amir is pulling the same BS.
@@fhester44 The fun of being an audiophile is trying out new gears. It could be amps, sources, speakers, and cables. Just trying new things, experimenting to see if there’s a difference. Watching reviewers on TH-cam reviewing gears is another source of entertainment. But I gotta say, Amir is RIGHT about the power cable. The GR-Research cable is not going to make a difference. It’s a good thing there’s a trial period, so that you can return them if you don’t like them. If it works for you, great. If it doesn’t, try other cables. Experiment with them. That’s the fun of being an audiophile. Good luck
My close friend of many years loves this stuff and recently joined the world of measurements. I don't let him live down his purchases as I will point and laugh
THANK YOU! I've had so many arguments about this it makes my head spin. Being a retired electrician the first time I saw these claims about power cables I called BS.
This cable clearly will sound better. Try whipping it against a large gong, and then do the same test with the generic cable. The sheer weight of the former will create deeper resonances.
This is why Tibetan monks swear by audio grade cables (well, they would swear, but vow of silence and all that)
:)
Here here as to the safety warning! How do the makers and sellers sleep at night selling power cables without basic safety certification? That alone should be a warning about the ethics and honesty of the people trying to flog them. If a brand or company sells such things, I’m never going to buy anything from them out of principle. That they can legally get away is frustrating , as
a moment of reason and a speck of understanding of physics is all that is needed to realize audiophile power cords are bunk. Thanks Amir for going above and beyond again, and spending $ on this to save others from wasting theirs.
I am with you all the way. They carry so much risk that could put them out of business overnight if something goes wrong.
custom cables. i make my own cables sometimes. its alright given the no nonsense huge ends
@@AudioScienceReview Hello folks. GR cables reports are coming in from other reviewers. It's so mind blowing as the reviewer was blown away just the the Maxell tape poster ad.
Thanks to Danny for calling out all reviewers.
Ride Easy
Same goes for all the super ultra mega audiophile USB cables that aren't certified, although it's a functional issue, not a safety one and your life or your house isn't at stake
I once tried to ask for specs from Audioquest for their cables and some knowledge about their certification; are they rated and what their basic specs are... Apparently those are "trade secrets". This was the answer i got when presenting them a scenario where i was the installer for high profile client, so not even the promise of cash was enough... How would i be able to install anything with good conscience without ratings and without knowing specs... If there is any evidence one needs to judge these cable makers, it is the lack of information that is provided for free by any credible seller. When you have to sign an install that it is safe, built to the code and by the book.. how can you use unknown cabling. Every company you work with is going to make it VERY easy for professionals to find information, they will give it to you gladly as that means sales. Audioquest didn't do that even after asking for it.
The t-shirt is the absolute chef's kiss on this review.
I think all power cables are more about design or fashion than performance, this test proves that, there really is a lot of work in the high end and Mr. Amir has done an excellent job of demonstrating the true myths.
The beauty of power cables is that they don't even have to work. It's enough that they look expensive. So people who really have money to spend can get the placebo improvement out of it and it looks cool in the system. Tests have shown that people consider the sound out of an expensive looking cable or amplifier superior to the cheap looking one, even though they were played the same exact track using the same cable/amp on both tests :)
I’m getting rid of my fancy power cables because I don’t like the fat bulky size. From time to time, I like to move gear around and the fat cables feel annoying
You might not be a scientist, but your videos are a lesson in the art of scientific skepticism. Thanks for doing what you do! 🔥
I'm looking forward to seeing Danny's rebuttal of this review.
I'm not
Remember when power cords didn't look like garden hoses?
Amir, I loved the new method of playing the nullification sample. It would be really cool to have a quick demonstration of two tracks that would reveal a variance so the skeptics could hear the test produce results. That way you prove it both ways, when there is something to hear and when there is nothing to hear. Great work! Do you have a way for us to help you financially? I would like to help with the expenses. This is a very worthwhile channel.
Ah, good suggestion. I should have done that. Maybe i do a dedicated video to null testing. And yes, I do have a patreon account of you are not an ASR forum member: www.patreon.com/audiosciencereview
The truth will always set you free and save your hard earn money from being stollen by these snake charming company’s out there .We need more of these videos great video 👍👍
No Amir you don't understand, the sliding jacket makes the plug seal perfectly with the outlet and protect it from noise, this results in much wider imaging and silky highs
oh my, your jesting Yes?
Throw a sheet of norez behind the socket for an enhanced effect.
@@andrewclough660 absolutely not!!!
You're delusional.
Maybe seals it from dust😂
One manufacturer has cleverly exploited audiophile ideas about power cables to save a few bucks. I bought a Kinki Studio amp recently which ships without a power cable at all, stating that they know audiophiles will want to use their own fancy cables rather than a bundled "el cheapo" ( their words ) cable. It raised a smile with me when I read it.
Ha! That's like Porsche saying we will no longer be providing your 911 GT3 with tires because we know you will just buy better ones anyway. That will be $150K please.
@@splfordayz9050 Indeed. And much like a Porsche the amp is a thing of beauty. Audio bling at its shiniest.
Happily, like most folks in this hobby, I have a massive Box o' Cables under the bed.
Next up it won't come with a power supply because real audiophiles use their own. Or binding posts, etc ;p
@@jimfarrell4635 So you bought new cables for the bling, I take it?
Thank you for the facts... I have always thought along these lines, having worked for an electrical design-built firm for 34 years.
GR Research page claims this cable needs 200 hours of burn in time to sound its best. Wow .... burn in time on an AC cable is quite the claim. This claim alone is enough to for me to put my wallet back into my pocket.
Wow, only 200 hrs, that is certainly a lot faster than the 800 hrs mentioned somewhere else in this thread. With an AB test of 200 hrs each, that's doable.
As there is so safety certification 200 hrs of burn in might result in a burn down.
Burn-in is an awesome excuse to make people think their music sounds better sufficiently long after they've wasted their money. After 200 hours, you'll have gone through the stages of grief and will decide that your music indeed sounds $350 better than it did all those weeks ago when you were scammed by an audiophool company. If only I had no scruples so that I could sell people arm-thick power cables and still sleep at night like GR Research undoubtedly does.
It also means manufacturers underdesign intentionally with the expectation that burn in will improve things...
Ya gotta believe 🥺
That thing is thicker than the main power cable coming into my house from the transformer.
True dat. :)
Thanks for not kow-towing to the pedlar and his magic cart from Texas. Unlike some other TH-camrs.
I appreciate your work. I come from the camp that doesn't believe these 3rd party power cords or high-end speaker cable with battery operated thingamajigs on them make any difference at all. Your videos, along with Audiohalics videos, show that. My experience with Danny at GR-Research is that he seems to like objective measurements when it suits him, i.e., when selling his speaker crossover upgrades, but thinks we're all "flat-earthers" if we ask to see the objective measurements that support his claims for his cables. In one of his videos, he actually says that those of us who don't believe him about his power cables, well ... we're just hurting the hobby! Whatever. I've had another experience with Danny at GR-Research when it came to buying a speaker kit, in my case, I thought it was pretty shady ... suffice to say, the best thing to do is steer clear of people like that and the claims they make. I'm sure all of these Tech companies would like to know, if they only used better cables like those he sells, their products would be soooooo much better. IMO, steer clear.
Well said. Danny is so obvious in his motivations there that I am amazed people don't see through it and become skeptical.
Danny and Paul from BS Audio are like politicians of the audio world
Items like this exist to pad margins and generate easy revenue. They don't cost a lot to make and the amount of labor required is trivial. Money is better spent elsewhere.
ahhhh Perfect timing as always :) Anothet great learning opportunity :) appreciated Amir big boss :) mucho luv !!
I use Pangea power cables, I guess they really are just audio jewelry, LOL. Nice review as always.
They are actually one of the more reasonable choices in aftermarket power cables. Thick gauge and not too expensive.
". . . the logic of subjective audio does not compute with me . . . "
I'm in.
I am concerned that AC cables can be taken to market without safety certification. In Australia, it is illegal to manufacture, sell or use AC equipment (cables, power outlets, etc) that have not been certified under AS/NZS 3820 (similar to America's UL). I would suggest that if a GR Research AC power cable failed and caused a fire then GR Research would be legally liable for any losses or damages caused as a result of that failure. I am surprised that GR Research's insurance underwriters would allow an non-certified AC power cable to enter the marketplace.
Indeed there are strong laws outside US which these companies violate left and right. I managed development for a hardware company and we would not send a pencil to EU without CE certification. Don't know how these companies are so laxed about it.
It is as if they are not concerned about their customers…
The planets where not in the correct alignment. Maybe you need a full moon when you use them?
They should put this in the manual.
Thanks Amir, informative and fascinating as ever. I’m convinced that most of the “improvements” audiophiles hear from interconnects and power cables are actually caused by the cleaning action of disconnecting and reconnecting cables as they remove oxidisation from the coupling. I was advised by a manufacturer to unplug and re plug my system every quarter to prevent the build up of any oxidisation.
The argument of using the heavier cable on the CD player not the amp is a rehash of the “source” argument I think. This said that you put all your budget into the source as you can’t add in anything downstream of the source. The working example that used to be quoted was a $2,000 vinyl deck playing through a car radio amplifier and using speakers which were driver units taped into empty shoe boxes.
Interesting hypothesis. This would probably be relatively easy to put to the test.
I use gold jewellery cleaning solution followed by isopropanol and De-oxit G5 when finishing servicing/repair of Hi-Fi equipment, sometimes resorting to 2k grade sandpaper in worst cases. Whether it makes an audible difference is naturally debatable, but it certainly makes a visible one.
Waiting for Danny's video claiming that all this testing is "theory"
Would be interesting indeed to see what the next level argument is, seeing how we listened to music while he did not in his video! :)
It is a frequent rhetorical device to dress up anti-science or anti reason with science sounding terms or vocab, using them incorrectly often, such as using the word “theory” as a term of disparagement. As in : “evolution is only a theory”. Such patterns of mystification indicates the writer/speaker is simply doing some magical thinking at best, or cynical lying to you.
If any one says “it’s just a theory” to me i retort with the words of The Dude (big Lebowski): “well, like that’s just your opinion, Man” ie: I am calling bs on your bs
Consistently the best audio reviews. I’m really glad you take the time to do these Amir, we need more people like you who can apply common sense and logic to these products. This one in particular appears to be a very bad faith produce.
Pls, purchase speaker cables, power cables and other cables from real companies, and not from some fella deep down in the woods in Texas, that goes on with his videos and talk all other REAL manufactures down, think about that for a second! Thank you again Audio Science Review for the science and the truth!
Thanks. I have tested a number of branded cables from Nordost to Audioquest. So far, none make a difference but I will keep testing.
@@AudioScienceReview great point: a name brand alone assures nothing in terms of safety certification (or proper design) in the audio power cable snake oil market.
What kind if cable is included with a $50,000 spectrum analyzer? That is the one I want.
Ha this is exactly the point Gene/Audioholics made in his power cable video. That the most expensive equipment comes with standard UL/properly certified power cables. Nothing special, the $5-10 ones that are mass produced. To me, it's far more important that my cable has been UL certified than some fancy thick cable sleeve.
Dissonantly, a generic one.
I'm listening to your videos weekly very good always.
Keep on exposing those shysters and charlatans, great work
Thanks for your reviews. Some people will continue to rely on faith to guide their audio purchases but I am also firmly in the camp of science....
After the review of the GR Research upgrade kit for the Klipsch RP-600M, I thought Danny was finally making some progress. He's going to start to feel picked on.
In a recent video he claimed that if a reviewer can tell the difference between cables, he is starting to be qualified to test his speakers. So I figured I test his cable and here we are.
@@AudioScienceReview Next step is common source resistors output/negative feedback track on lifters above the PCB with Zobel network suspended in mid-air on unbleached cotton strings. Get ready.
I'm glad jay said he is taking Danny up on his offer and going out there I'm very interested in what he will have to say. Said he noticed an immediate difference from using the power cable (against an unknown upgrade power cable, so not conclusive, will be following up against a blue jean cable). I'm interested to see Danny's reply to this review as well, I think his rebuttals were sound in the last review.
@Jeremy are you kidding. Cables dont make a difference. You are hereby notified that you are now under review for considerstion of having your torch, pitchfork and angry mob card revoked. While under review, you are forbidden to attend the next Danny Roasting. Signed by: The Burn Danny At The Stake Society.
Now, I am going to listen to listen to my expensive cables while we consider your fortune. But we only bought ours for aesthetic purposes. T.B.D.A.T.S.S.
Id put power cords up against Romex, because thats whats feeding that fancy power cord.
Well the point is they say it can filter out what the Romex does not so you offer no logic. That said the claims are illogical on their face.
I bought some expensive power cord cable and some hi-end audio cables and power surge protection and a voltage regulator but I cannot hear any difference of my audio coming out from my speakers. It's all about money when it comes to hi-end expensive cables. The reason I bought is for the looks only. I am surprised that using a cheaper cable is almost the same as using the expensive cables. I cannot hear the difference at all.
Thanks again for saving us from wasting money on poor quality accessories. For what it's worth, I have bought several pieces of equipment based on ASR reviews, presumably based entirely on testing, without hearing them prior to purchase. In other words, I trusted the testing and the verdict of ASR and they have ALL provided exceptional performance and I have been more than satisfied. Hope to see some reviews soon that aren't GR Research. 😊
You really needed this video/test review to tell you these snake oil products are worthless? Anything from GR Research is a waste of money. If you buy anything from Danny you are a fool.
Great reviewing technique! There are some variables I noted that were not mentioned. One is the user's RFI/EMI environment. Presumably, there might be a difference in performance between well-shielded and poorly-shielded cables (depending on the power supplies used in the test). That said, ferrite rings are cheap and easily installed on ordinary power cables. Also, at least in my house, it is difficult to adequately separate the power cables from the interconnects, another potential source of interference. Keep up the good work!
It's the first time I see a cable that needs its foreskin pulled back before inserting in the outlet. It has to be good.
🤣
I usually buy cables that have been circumcised....
@@splfordayz9050 those have the lowest impedance.
Great review from now, very easy to understand.
I have 5 Oyaide made in Japan power cables and I never AB test them to generic cables. I just like how they look. 😄
If ur house burns down and the accessor finds an uncertified cable kiss ur insurance goodbye.
This was sadly funny! Good 1/1M difference between frequency and propensity interpretation of probability. Also glad to see you as a fellow BandCamp supporter! Thanks for spending $100 for literally nothing.
Thanks Amir!...I trust your reviews, we need more like you!
Thanks for the tip on Radical Face. Those are fun tracks! I feel sorry for the GR research dude and his customers. As Nero Wolfe would say, "Flummery!" (I 'highly' recommend the Maury Chaykin series) Merci bien, Amir!
Amir would love Tycho.
He prob already does.
Nero Wolfe was indeed the total bomb! 👍
Feel like dissecting a $400 cable? I'm curious how they managed to terminate all of those strands at the connectors.
I am thinking about returning it given how terrible it is to use. Otherwise, I would have been happy to open it as I am curious like you are.
@@AudioScienceReview That would be a lot of money wasted to just satisfy curiousity. :)
Better yet, suggest GR research submit the cable to UL for certification so they pay for someone to figure out if it is terminated properly. I have a hunch that over time and with flexing there may be serious and potentially dangerous failures at the connection to the pins…
should do a gofoundme so Amir get $400 to slice it
How they manage to get all the strands?
Wouldn't likely a problem... typical cord caps have ample sized lugs that open up nicely.
Strip, twist, cut to length, insert and tighten.
Here in the UK, most domestic Hi-Fi products have 3amp fuses fitted within the plug.
Thick high current cable is simply unnecessary for these applications and pointless given the fuse rating.
The other valid criticism of these cable claims is of course that the wiring behind the wall socket is an extension connected in series.
In parallel rather, for constant voltage to be exact, but I do get your point. One way of looking at it is that you are using a screened mains lead to diminish EM interaction between it and nearby speaker and low level wiring, hence "the last mile" matters argument. Debatable, but there you go.
I bought one of the 24s last summer. They do stay in the wall well. I like that personally. Hate the ones that constantly come loose. Mine worked well.
That’s good ! What does it do better than a $10 cable.
@@r423sdex Mostly stays in the wall better.
awesome video
There are so many products for the audiophile customers focusing on the power delivery, interconnect, speaker cables etc. along the signal path. Often they are looking for the tree and missing the forest. In my book, there are two sets of interconnects - signals and power. You can spend hundreds (or thousands) on the cables between your source and the amp, but did you look inside the amp? Yes, the wires inside are only a few inches long, but will it affect your signal? Why spend $400 for a pair of 3 feet cable when the wires inside the amp are skinny wires that costs no more than 5 cents?
On the power side, the GR Research cable is over $400 dollars, and that's about 4 feet long? What about the wire from your service panel to your wall? That's easily 50 feet long. At the service panel, it shares the circuit with all sorts of electrical equipment (AC, microwave, etc.) and what about that? Besides, the power supply side do not affect the quality of the sound directly. Any noise "bleed" into the signal side through power delivery and ground. A better designed power circuit and good capacitors will have a bigger impact that the $400 cable.
May be I should design a battery based system - the AC line just feed into the big battery with low internal impedance. May be even switch off the AC supply when it is feeding the audio equipment. Heck, I can even take out the transformer, capacitor, and a whole bunch of other stuff. I can sell it at $20K a set, being the "purest" power supply system. Anyone interested?
Golden ears also have no idea just how thin or cheap the wires are from the driver binding posts to the voice coil, lol.
The noise floor is only half of the reason people get cables like this. The other reason is for instantaneous power flow requirements to a high current amplifier. Listening tests need to be performed to see if this makes an audible difference in the way the music sounds, not just the noise floor. But he tells others to do that. Makes me wonder if he doesn’t have ears refined enough to hear a difference should there be one. Some people are more sensitive than others.
Another GREAT review, Amir; more overpriced audio"pile" cables debunked by an expert. Keep the videos coming; people need to know they are being sold false or hollow myths...
Not having safety certifications is awful. People die in house fires all the time, utterly insane to spend money on snake oil that could kill you. (Yes, that’s a small chance, but it happens, and it begins with skipping safety)
IDK what is more entertaining: your honest and fact-based review, or future BS response from NO Research. Get some popcorn folks, it's going to be funny. Oh, and Amir, have you used cable lifters? :)
I was just thinking that if the cables are so awesome, why do they need to be raised off of the floor. Is higher better ?
@@Powerpickle68 They need to be higher, to make you think that Danny is giving away something for free. Cos he isn't in it for money :)
one thing to remember is just because the UL lettering is on the chord, does not mean it has been checked out .The Chinese made stuff have been caught in deceptions before ! UL meant something many years ago !
But Amir you didn’t use the cable risers, you need those for this to work and hear the difference 😂. Btw love the t-shirt.
Cable risers was the moment I thought it's April 1'. I mean c'mon, that's over the top even for Danny
But only Tinker Toy cable risers.
have you ever done a null test to prove there is a difference in whatever device? I would like to see that.
Nice shirt Amir, love your ability to engage in internet drama with such elegance and finesse.
GR Research is too busy dissing others to bother about looking to their own designs and quality...good job Amir
It makes no sense. So you buy an amp that is engineered to basically remove as much interference as possible. Yet you still believe it's not really capable of that and so you need to add a "clean" cable to the whole thing? Like what's the point buying an expensive top of the line amp if it's still so bad that there is an audible difference unless you buy a magic power cord. Just a bunch of woo woo nonsense if you ask me.
GR Research, this is NASA, we want to purchase your entire inventory of Bxx series of AC Audio Cables. Do they come in colors?
Love it! Thanks for being “truth”. I have a new nickname for you. DD (Danny Destroyer). Thanks for exposing the fraud.
I think Danny really believes in this stuff.
A question came up. Have you ever tested car audio equipment? Car audio systems use extremely thick cords between the 12 volt car battery and the amp. Some appear as thick as my thumb! I wonder if that gauge wire is even needed for a high-power amp of say 1000 watts RMS, or if you can use thinner wire connected to the battery.
Great job Amir. I watched the whole video and it’s obvious these expensive cables offer no audible improvement. But it’s rather scary how unsafe they are. I would at least expect UL certification on such an expensive power cord!
@Jeremy Well it’s a good thing you can find tons of UL certified and or UL listed power cables from Amazon, Monoprice, Walmart, etc from companies like Furman, Trip Lite, etc. Most of them are also RoHS and CSA certified. Most under $20 and as proven in Amir’s and Gene’s testing they are safe and provide the same audible results ass $100-40K power cables. GR Research and some of these other companies certainly open themselves up to liability if there is a fire and their cables prove to be problematic. Even if their cable may or may not not have caused the fire but it’s in the chain..
@Jeremy Half of what you wrote makes zero sense. Look if you want to take a perfectly good and UL certified cable and replace it with one that, on the surface, appears lesss safe and uncertified, go for it.
As for Amir’s test you clearly didn’t watch the video or just don’t understand the test. As many of us have suspected all along, Amir’s test proved conclusively that power cables don’t carry audio signals or enough interference to have any audible difference on sound quality. Your power switching supply is where filtration happens, not the cable.
The null test was the real validation though. It’s the smoking gun. There is zero difference in audible output between the cheap certified cable, and expensive GR cable. Zero. None. Nada. I work way too hard for my money to buy really expensive power cables that don’t do anything to improve the sound. If you or Danny have some other scientific way to refute Amir’s test and prove his power cables magically improve audio signals and output by all means make a video and let’s see your proof.
@Jeremy Huh? Null testing is a very proven methodology. You clearly don’t understand his tests or you would know the GR power cable resulted in zero audible difference than the inexpensive cable. I don’t know what to tell you. Do you honestly believe a power cable can change frequency response, distortion levels, sound dispersion, SPL output, and impedance from a source device?
Ask yourself. In a magic fairy world where these power cables could do that then wouldn’t the high end source device, processor, and amp companies be selling you these magical cables directly as an upgrade for a lot more money? When your spending $20-50K+ on an amp, a $400-2000 power cable is nothing. So why don’t they do that?
@Jeremy Well then please explain how you test for audible differences in power cables and I will be happy to test it myself, and I’m sure Amir and others would be happy to oblige you. Have you ever heard of Dr Toole? Maybe read his book? Maybe you can explain how he is doing it all wrong along with the NRC. I’m all ears (no pun intended) please enlighten us on the proper way to measure and test sound.
@Jeremy no one cares for your babble
When you measure it, the snakeoil crawls out and the magic is gone.
Intersting test Amir! While I like how Danny tests speakers with measurements and improves them, I don't believe in audiophile ac cables and burn in time for cables, it just doesn't make sense as an electronics engineer. If the information isn't there then the speaker drivers can't turn them in pressure waves and you can't hear it, as your wave difference has shown. Unless you've got a 6th sense hearing that is 😉 All joking aside, the experience of listening is key, if someone wants to believe ac cables make a difference then that all that counts (if it can be done safely) it's their choice.
I Totally agree with that.
Thick power cables work like prayers. Imaginary things make some people happy.
The weird thing is, many audiophiles obsess about having great power supplies and massive filtering, but then somehow think they need a special power cord as it’s not enough , they clearly don’t actually know what all that is for, dc conversion , 94db of nulling on 16bit is very impressive , I guess they will argue the magic it’s lost in the ad conversion lol
Excellent point. Manufacturers of high-end audio product speak at length to the quality of their implementations. But supposedly they still need the help from a thick power cord.
The only difference a cable can do is short your system out and burn your home 🤷♂️. Never made sense to me to just change an AC cable and would change the sound 🤦🏽♂️
Use the stock cables,
Period. There is little to no difference in using audio jewelry, and if there is, it’s not significant enough to justify the price .
My system has many different devices that I have used over the years and is constantly changing. I have had some marginal problems with hum and noise that appears to be cable related. Keeping the signal cables , particularly the turntable signal cables, a fair distance from power cables helps a bit. The only issue I ever had regarding power cables was current sag when driving multiple high power amps simultaneously. Simple math. But, consider the physical logistics of a rack system trying to use those fat ass cables. Ludacris is the word that comes to mind. That being said, I love high quality stuff, and even grossly over designed stuff. But the connector issue would enrage me to an unhealthy degree had I purchased the GR 24's. I have a guy who makes very nice quality hand made cables, any style or any length I want and even with shipping, none are more than $60.00. I like reinforced connectors and braided internals where applicable with copper or gold plated contacts. I'm old enough to have had to deal with corrosion issues and this effectively eliminates that. Thanks for another great video. Is there a chance you might try to have a few positive testing videos for a while to offset the depressing reality of much of what the audiophile community has to wade through? Thanks for all your efforts.
If current sag was an issue it was likely due to total demand on the circuit, or a power conditioner . Or just as likely the limited of power supply (transformers, rectifiers and filter caps in a linear power supply, or an undersized/wattage switching supply) within the amp itself. not the power cord assuming it was reasonably short and 14awg (which is rated for 15amps - typical household circuit - at 120v typically). Even 16awh should be fine for all but the most inefficient amps. No matter how tick the power cord, it can’t pull out more than your home breaker panel and wiring will supply).
If you are having problems with noise and hum that's a grounding problem. The wiring in your house may need to be upgraded.
@@cityoflights3808 Bang on, street level HV electricity supply mains transformer's output impedance is orders of magnitude smaller, than that of ones employed in consumer electronics. Driven hard, the latter's secondaries will sag by up to 10, 15% before there's a measurable drop on the primaries.
In flames the comments will be. Keep up the good work. Please do not let the haters (suppliers) get to you
Why not test the well reviewed css criton with and without their upgraded crossover? Many reviewers have tested both and have noticed a difference. Danny seems to be the poster boy of upgraded parts and he's taking the brunt of everybody who dont believe in them, when there are many others who agree with him and offer the same.
I have contacted them and they are kind enough to send them to me for testing.
@@AudioScienceReview Nice, very excited to see the review on that. Could you please look into getting a diysg helix to review? Its a diy speaker that used to sit in between the encores and criton price wise, but now is cheaper than the upgraded encores due to price hikes, plus it has the impressive reported bass output as the critons. Diysg (do it yourself sound group) has a cult following like gr research and css audio and to finally get a reviewer to have had experience with all 3 would be amazing. The helix hasn't received a review from a mainstream reviewer so that would be majorly beneficial. Plus you can build a MTM version for an economical price. I would hope it slots in-between the encores and critons quality wise, just wonder how close to the critons it is.
And another one bites the dust! Keep up the good work Amir. I hope somebody loans you one of the Nordost cables that cost thousands of dollars. I’d like to see your conclusions on that product.
I recently tested a Nordost BNC cable that cost $1,800. I will see if I can do a video on it.
It will be the same as this one, so there would be little point in wasting his time.
Well done Amir. Snake oil should only be used for cooking.
again great review! Nice music.
Every time I buy a piece of music equipment it comes included with a free heavy duty power cable. I never would have thought I'd have to spend hundreds of dollars to make it more difficult to plug something in
And less safe. Most of these expensive audiophile power cables are not UL certified. That's a huge red flag.
You must mean audio equipment, yes?
@@thomasmleahy6218 I buy Home theater gear, studio recording gear, and gear such as instruments, amps, etc etc. So nor just audio equipment. Are you asking because you are pro jumbo power cables?
High end power cords are no better than the wiring in your walls and coming from the electrical distribution transformer in your neighborhood. Thanks, Amir.
I've loved functional descriptions (as opposed to the strict mathematics) of electrical components since I was a boy over 50 years ago and still do. Amir's presentations materially improve my daily enjoyment of my humble hifi and 10,000+ album collection, by rounding out my understanding of how it all works and dispelling voodoo (not that I'm inclined to voodoo). Nice work on the presentation style, it's airtight. If you do this without multiple takes, you are good.
As a journeyman electrician these cables always make me laugh hahahaha.
Yeah, but the snake skin on the outside makes the snake oil inside seem more believable. The placebo effect is real. The sound improvements people hear from such cables are not so real.