Myth Vs. Reality: Gun Notches
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 15 ก.ค. 2022
- Myth Vs. Reality: Notched Guns
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The guy who owned my gun last must have been a real killer! There are notches all up and down the grip. It makes a nice diamond pattern and hard to drop. Also I bought it new so it must have had one heck of a proofing process.
Yes. I think you may want to take another look at them notches. I have a feeling they may not be what you think they are. In fact. Just try and get a grip on the situation.🤨
Wow.
I saw an old bed headboard that must have belonged to a cowboy...
@@bar-1studios That was no cowboy, that was Belle Starr!!! (paraphrased old Time Life Books Commercial)!!!
@@bar-1studios 😆😆😆
You showing the Treasure of Sierra Madre reminds me of an event. I’m a nurse and two years older then dirt. I work with a lot of twenty somethings. About a year ago we were Turing a patient who was sedated and on a ventilator. We use a wedge shaped pillow to keep the patient on his side. Often we have to use regular pillows. Regular pillows was all we had in this room. The nurse on the other side as we were turning asked for a wedge to stick underneath him. To which I answered in my best Hollywood Mexican, wedges,wedges, we don’t need no stinking wedges!’
None of the young nurses were history nerds or Bogart fans. They just looked at me blankly
HAAHAHHA! It works on so many levels, Jeffrey!
Humor is wasted on the current generation.
The myth is so prevalent I'm surprised that we haven't heard a countermyth proposing something like, "that cutting notches into an untextured pistol grip would wick away palm sweat giving a cowboy a steadier hold, and the practice went away with the introduction with rubber grips".
LOL! Well, that's good!
Sadly I've handled more than a few prewar Colts with gutta percha (rubber) that also had this abomination, but that theory will have to wait. Three decades after reading it, I'm still trying to wrap my head around Louis L'Amour saying fringe was practical ("to shed rain"?).
@@ahhamartinFringe is actually practical. It creates more surface area for water to evaporate once you're out of the rain.
@@ahhamartin it is. Santee mentioned that a couple times
Little known fact. Chuck Norris grandfather had so many notches on his rifle it eventually became the worlds first pistol.
HAHAHA!
Speaking of notches, I know a guy who’s in his late 80s and dad owned a single action that was given to him in Nebraska by a friend of his who had a relative that was some kind of outlaw (not a famous one, unfortunately I forget the name). And he said the pistol had notches on it and the rumor was that it was the number of men this outlaw had killed. Interestingly enough it had either been slicked up to much or had been used to much to the point where the sear didn’t catch on the hammer. Unfortunately the gun is long gone and he doesn’t have any pictures. One of his first memories is cleaning this gun when he was 3 or 4 (probably around 1939-1940)
Wow!! Wish it could be found.
“Fast is fine, but accuracy is final”
- Wyatt Earp
He knew!
My grandpa's pistol that I now own, is an Iver Johnson and cycle works sealed 8 octagon barrel target model with a very intentional notch cut with a hacksaw. He told me himself that he had been in every state that trains go. He boxed golden glove while traveling on the rails. Not a guy that you would want to prick with at all! I had the utmost respect for my amazing grandpa!!!!!
By the way I am not Lois, I am her husband.
That's pretty cool!
👍🏻
I don’t have a gun with notches but I was given a old knife with buck horn handles that has 5 notches on it, unfortunately the old man I got it from passed not too long after he gifted it to me.
Carry on
@@aaronburratwood.6957 the old man I got it from served in the Korean War and the Vietnam war he spent a lot of his military life being stationed out in Asia but when I met him he was dying and was going to be put in hospice care so I came over every day to clean up his house and pack up his belongings and as a gift for helping he gave the knife and a bunch of others. Another cool one is a Tiffany silver pocket knife dated 1886.
Cool.
Oh boy, you put feathers on a T rex, I don't know if you're ready for what comes when that can of worms gets opened.
HAHAHA! Well, it's a feather headband, so I think it's ok.
The notches were probably more of an intimidation tactic so other gun slingers wouldn't try their luck.
🤠
I could picture a soldier could notch battles survived. A cowboy could mark trail drives, etc. or reenactment actors, number of seasons performed.
Sure.
I like these videos. I'm dabbling in leather work. Decided to make a "real old west" holster for my 1851 Navy Colt .32 cal. The real holsters were not very exciting like the Hollywood movie 'quick draw' variety. Many were just Union Army holsters with the flap cut off. Others were Slim Jim type. A lot of them were simply a belt that also held your pants up.
Oh, and spinning your iron; easy way to become a eunich.
a 32 navy ?????? I want one.. is it 32 acp or 32 H&R ???
LOL
LOL!
I'm eventually gonna make a 32 acp 1858. Well more like 32 long but yeah
Great video, Santee!
My friend and I were recently down in Natchez, and we put away our badges while we ate some nachos! Then we sent our beers down the hatches, and back in our rooms we secured the latches. The next day, we baked some bread in batches.
I could go on!
-Desert Rat Rick
Wow.....that was good.
He is a poet, and didn't even know it!
🔥💨 this dude is SMOKIN
@@thatonechilldude3836 Thank You!
@@ArizonaGhostriders Huh? For what??
0:25 - 0:30 : this reaction after the "notches" bit was the funniest thing I've seen in a while!! 😂
Thank you!
@@ArizonaGhostriders Comedic gold!! Lol
@@aarphi1984 Much appreciated!
Frick!
I'd kill for some nachos right now!
@@jonjacobjingleheimerschmid3798 LOL!
Always think gun notches look sick but it would be funny in a big battle someone is just holding out a knife putting a notch every few seconds
Until he runs out of grip!
I’ve put a notch in the stock of my 1853 Enfield for every big anniversary event I’ve attended for Civil War reenacting.
That's cool!
@@ArizonaGhostriders Appreciate it! And by the way, I’m unsure if y’all have done a video on this before, but I was thinking it might be cool to go over some of the experiences or prime and veterans of the Federal and Confederate armies post-war migrating west. Kind of like Josey Wales! Lol
I was glad to see you cover this. I myself have come across a few statements in old publications. And it always seemed to ME that it was mainly an expression as well. “He’s got two notches” just being a euphemistic way of saying “he’s killed two people” but not referring to their literal, physical gun.
Great episode, as always, Pard!
Thank you!
Santee, I don't know how you, and your friends are able to find so many movie and tv pics, videos, plus photos, to correlate with your storyline, but you do it better than anyone I can think of. *We learn and get so entertained at the same time.
👏🤠🌞👏
Thanks. I sometimes have to search, but most times I have a memory of the movie and scene.
Perhaps our most renowned western writer, Louis lamour, did extensive research on everything he wrote. He referred to notching as “ a tin horn’ s trick”. Which would tie in with your great video. Thanks & keep up the good work!
Good point!
Nice stare @ intro!! I found it VERY amusing. My g-grpa obtained a bona-fide Colt "Peace-Maker" during an actual "don't bring a gun to a knife fight" card game in 1912. Brought it home, and tossed it into a closet. It was brought out quite often as a conversation piece. I was allowed to hold it several times, but saw no notches, just regular gutta-percha grips. It was stolen in 1984 by a weasel neighbor, who sold it to ?? But the neighbor, after getting drunk from the liquor he bought w/$$, actually bragged about stealing/selling it. Then he died few years later from liver failure. Crime don't really pay, but neither does it compensate.
Great story. Sorry it was sold off...
Enjoyable. I'm inclined to believe that "notches" was used more as a metaphor in most cases.
Yup, in most cases.
If I remember correctly Bat Masterson, in his later years sold his prized personal firearm, notch included, to a would be collector that begged him for it. Maybe that lead credence to the “practice”. Then again he would go to the pawn shops and buy another SAA or something of that vintage, cut notches in it and sell it as his authentic personal firearm to the next sucker that came along…
That practice is attributed to other Old West celebrities and their families as well.
I was given an old Albion pistol from 1943, I think. It had "notches" on the barrel, but may have been poor attempts to shorten the barrel with a saw blade.
Ouch. I wonder why they couldn't finish the job?
I had a old new service in 45 colt. It had 2 notches. It was owned by a Ga. Road guard in the early 1900s.
And the man was known to have killed at least 2 trying to run.
My ggrandfather 12ga had a bunch of notches in it. But they were from bear killed with it.
Interesting!
“Gloom, Despair,and Agony on me” - Hee Haw
Yes
“Hell-e-o? Hell-e-o? Hell-e-o!”- Hee Haw
I moved to Arizona in the last couple of years - one of many stops - and bought some dirt out near Johnny Ringo's grave, with plans to make a Veterans Recreational Area for the mission side, and on the personal side?... I'd like to set up a little Johnny Ringo museum, give some hay rides to tourists and whatnot. I taught classes for many years, so I think it'd be fun.
It's so awesome to drive along the old trails and think, "Maybe Johnny, or Wyatt, or Doc, rode along *this very trail* (Old Ghost Town Trail, or Middle March, or one of my favorites - the Gleeson Road) and maybe, they looked at some rock, or some little tree that is now big, and had the same kinds of thoughts I had. I don't know - I guess that's a part of what "Living History" means to me.
Hopefully, I get to meet some of you folks out there as I get more active in the region.
Stay safe out there!
Hope to meet you too! Best of luck!
If I notched my grips every time I shot up the Marshal, I'd finally end up having to get new ones. LoL. I think I'll try to find some temporary notch appliqués, kinda like temporary tattoos or temporary press on nails because after all I'm just shooting blanks. HA!
HAHA!
Like those fake bullet hole stickers people put on cars?
Films and dime novels enhanced some of these facts. That's a great way to put it.
yep!
Enjoyed it a lot folks. Spend a lot of effort keeping scratches off my guns 🔫 Really good one folks 🤠👍
Thanks!
I've always hesitated calling notches "kill marks" as some people do for the simple fact that it seems a pretty easy way for some shady people to get a little more money out of a firearm. The closest I've ever come to believing the notches are the ones on the revolutionary war militia musket we have for the simple facts of...
.A it's a miltia musket (little to no punishment for defacing government property.)
.B I actually know that the musket was in some serious battles due to the long paper trail it has behind it.
Even then I'm still not completely sold on them.
I've seen too many gun show carnies who will say anything to a potential buyer or unfortunately do anything to a piece of history for an extra buck.
Edit: I just finished the video and looks like we pretty much have come to the same conclusion lol
HAHA! Yes. I guess we know of two "for sure" incidents where they notched as trophies; Patton and Pistol Pete.
The rest were probably something else.
@@ArizonaGhostriders yessir
Agree 100%.. Being my SAA from 1882 has 2 notches. But i do have court paperwork showing it was used in a defensive shooting killing 2. I was told the reason he notched the gun was the family of the killed. harassed and threatened him. He did it as a statement. And this was in the 1920s
Also, "notches" on the butt of say, a rifle, could just be normal wear and tear as the back end of the weapon bangs and bounces off rocks, trees and the occasional enemy during bayonet combat.
@@bar-1studios Or just someone seeing how sharp their knife was after finishing sharpening it.
At first I thought this was going to be about safety notches in the back of a revolver cylinder.
HAHA!
I have a 32 20 police special revolver. It was my wifes great uncle's, who shot two men breaking into his house in the 1920s and he had put two notches on the handle. The gun has an old styled cross web holster. So apparently it did happen. Thanks.
It did!
Louis L'Amour once wrote in one of his books that the old timers told him that only tin horns notched their guns. Don't remember which book thow. Now let's hitch up our drawers and walk like the Duke pilgrims !!!!
Don't let General Patton hear ya! LOL!
@@ArizonaGhostriders🙀 If ol' George Patton were around today he'd probably be invading old folks homes in his personalized 3rd army armored wheel chair. 😺
Confederate Sniper, Capt. Jack Hinson from Tennessee was originally neutral during the War, but became a Confederate Sniper when the Yankees murdered two of his sons and hung their heads on the gate post. Neither of the sons were in the military. He swore vengeance and eventually killed the Yankee Sgt and Lt that was involved. He had a Sniper rifle built to his specifications and went to war against the Yankees. He is credited with over 100 to possibly 130 Yankees killed by his gun. He had a metal punch that he would punch the top of his barrel with, leaving a small ring indentation on the barrel. His rifle still exists with his scoreboard on the barrel. Capt. Hinson fought alone and was hunted extensively by the Yankees, but they never caught him. He also scouted for General Forrest as well. He is one of my heroes.
What an incredible soldier.
I don’t know why but Santee not saying roll film and just stared cracked me up😆
LOL!
🎶 and The Notches on his pistol numbered 1 & 19 more🎶
Yep
Thanks for another Saturday of excellent giggles with my coffee. Fully expected some mention of Breakfast Tacos, but maybe we should leave that for some other time?
Thank you! Tacos!!!!
Excellent video once again Santee! I have no Natchez, Nachos, badges or notches on any of my pistolas! I'd like to keep it that way!
HAHAH!
Your opening was one of the most "cheezie"/funny yet! ESPECIALLY when you were just staring at the camera!!!
Thank you!
History is full of controversies! And that makes all so interesting! Thanks amigo .
You're welcome.
I’ll add my 2 cents, my buddy has a Colt 1903 in 32 auto that has 4 notches evenly spaced cut into the frame back strap up by the slide.
We know that the idea of notches being cut into firearms was in popular culture in the 30s/40s because Major Winters writes about carving 7 notches into the stock of his M1 during the war.
I posit that perhaps it was something that became popular in the 1920s as rising Hollywood established western tropes that were reinforced by real life gangsters which would encourage Hollywood again. Just a thought
Good points!
Loved the video. I am 45 when I was 12 and started hunting my grandpa had a left-handed 30-30 with a bunch of notches on the edge of the foregrip I asked why his response was the left is buck and the right is doe. Now keep in mind he died at 89yr when I was 14. You video is the only other time I have heard of notching a firearm.
It was popular in western movies.
Yessir! A notch for every kill! God bless buddy..and those who’ve passed on! Take care, stay safe! 🙏🎚🇲🇾🇲🇾🇲🇾
Thank you!
I have a 1860 Army Richard's conversion that has 12 notches. The story I received when I purchased the handgun the story was that it was carried by a sheriff in West Texas. Colt tells me that most conversions were sent to the Tex Mex border.
Well, there's no way to verify it, but that is a really cool story.
Thanks for the entertaining video and the information. I was not aware of the notches on the coup stick. The bison in Sweden were not that surprising though. Germany has some farms with bison too.
Thanks for watching
I have a family heirloom with two notches on it a colt single action from my great relative who was a card dealer
ITS AWSOME and appearently worth quite a lot according to my local pawnshop although I’ll never ever ever sell it
Oh also the notches are vertical on the bottem of the grip unlike the Hollywood clip where it’s horizontal
Awesome! NEVER sell it.
I used to own a 1860s Colt 44 revolver that had Xs cut into the frame's leading strap IE: just behind the trigger. I always assumed it had been done to give better grip drawing the pistol. I know absolutely nothing about it's history and I sold it in 2006.
It could have been a supersition, or to mark the gun so the owner could identify it.
My great grandfather lived in Comanche County, Texas. He was a hired gun during the range wars and he had a Colt SAA with 7 notches on it. Wish I had kept track of that pistol over the years.
Me too! Maybe one day it will turn up.
My grandmother told me that my great great uncle Tom who rode with bloody Bill Anderson and Quantrill kept track of the Kansas Redlegs he killed on his pistols grips.
Sure would be great to see that gun for the provenance!
I wish I had the gun but he was killed holding off Yankee calvary while his brothers escaped . My aunt found the Graves of the four other brothers but we don't know what the Yankees did with Tom's body. My aunt did a lot of research on the 5 brothers.
I believe that most "Old West" legends and myths originated in Hollywood. Script writers take some wild liberties with stories.
Well, the legends many times are loosely based on real events.
Love subjects like this when the answer isn't cut and dry. Great video. And the Hee Haw reference was a nice touch!
Thank you!
My great grandfather used to notch his 1898 Winchester 1894....but the notches were for male deer he took.
I read that more and more in the comments. Pretty neat!
@@ArizonaGhostriders Love the channel. Can't help but wonder how many antique guns were "notched" in this way, left the family and now everyone assumes its "body count"
My Colt has a #5 dice pattern on the butt end of the grip. Great to see the "Pistol Pete" Frank Eaton video.
Cool!
Thanks for doing this one Santee. I've always been skeptical of pistoleros notching guns since it could change the balance of the gun in the hand. Also, my wife got a good laugh out of the Bison in Sweden!
Finally, someone laughed at that!
Patton’s two notches were two of Pancho Villa’s men, not a man and a horse.
Yep. I actually never said definitively that the notches were for a man and a horse. Just the historical documents I read mentioned the horse. I thought that was funny, since horses were killed constantly in battle, but they made mention of the horse in both.
Also some ladies of the evening were known to have notches on their bed posts. My guess is to signify clients who made a lasting impression.
LOL! Yes.
Always like your vids and I think I will throw my two cents in on this. When I was a kid, many moons ago, there was an old man who had an original Sharps rifle and it had 7 notches in it. We only assumed they were buffalo or hunting trophies but it was marked with notches from decades prior . I grew up 45 miles from Dodge City Kansas and while we have no idea the origins of the marks, the rifle had been in that area since at least 1900 and we know the notches predated the Hollywood movie craze of the 50s. Keep pumping out the good vids!
Thank you and love the extra info!
I seen a gun with notches, so the shooter knew where his hand was by feel.
That's possible!
I know my 30-30 Model 94 has notches in the bottom of the stock. I also know that each notch is one deer that it dropped
Nice!
"Nacho" style to notch your grips.
LOL!
Excellent Santee! Always informative and delightful. The beginning of this one was very humorous!
Thanks so much!
a great video 👍
@@VirtualFeats Thank you!
I honestly thought the notches were to add some friction to your hand when drawing so one would be less likely to have it slip from your hand. Things to make one ponder over some tasty nachos,
Possible.
Got an 1851 Navy at auction years ago has six notches on it for some reason. Damn things in great condition
Oh boy! That's terrific! If you can find my email address in the TH-cam channel area, please send me a photo. I would love to see it.
@@ArizonaGhostriders passed it on to my son a couple years ago , I will ask him to send you a pic.
The gentleman who had owned it had a collection that was unbelievable . Never thought I'd have an 1851 in hand. 🇺🇸🤠
@@ammantophori Pretty amazing, I'd say. If that gun could talk...
Facts verses fiction. Always a great subject. Thanks Santee.
You're welcome.
3:38 Ah the Merwin Hulbert, how I love thee
Classic
I own a Colt SAA from 1877 with with 3 notches in the right grip. Wish i knew the things it has seen.
Wow!! It has a story to tell...!
Thanks again Santee & Co.
Any time!
Notch the AGR logo up one helping the Duke then hanging with some boys ...ah what Hollywood hath bestowed on us. Nice vid to help clarify...As per usual well done!! Good work AGR team.
Much appreciated!
I have a 1916 Colt SAA with 4 notches. The funny thing is they are on the inside of the grip panel and not visible unless removed. If you think about it it would make more sense not to advertise your kills to the world. But we will never know what they mean.
Could have been a reminder of the military engagements that person was in.
@@ArizonaGhostriders Possibly. It is lettered to Prescott, Arizona. It may have made its way to the border during the Mexican Expedition.
Thank you Santee , and Cheers from California !
You are welcome, Olin!
I have an old Spanish Mauser FR8 with notches carved in the stock. They are deliberate but it’s hard to imagine Spain killing anyone, and with bolt actions, after the 50’s? Not likely.
Yeah, would be interesting to find out the story there.
Gotta love myth vs reality.... Thanks for clearing this up!!!
You're welcome.
The best part about Saturday morning is seeing what kind of video you're going to show us. Another great one thank you so much. 😉
You're welcome.
I carved a notch into my ruger. The reason being is because the gun killed the rattlesnakes that bit my dog
Good reason!
Good morning Santee,
Another excellent video and entertainment to boot… Thanks for all the effort you put into these videos
You're welcome.
When I saw and heard the two dead guys "singing" "Doom Despair and Agony on Me", I simultaneously thought "OMG!" but was LOL! 🤣 I used to watch "Hee Haw" many decades ago. As for notches on guns - I wouldn't believe for a second that anyone would ruin the workmanship on a well-made rifle or gun.
Thank you!
That stare after the nachos! :)
LOL!
Great video as always Santee. We laughed quite a bit here. Keep up the amazing work you do Amigo :)
Glad you enjoyed it
Santee , Love your videos ! I look forward to seeing 👀 them every week !!!
Keep up the great work 👍
Much appreciated!
Great vid as always santee, but have you read about sam hildebrand he was a guerilla fighting during the civil war and later became a outlaw. he mentions gun notching for every person he killed killing so many people he had to notch multiple guns.
Interesting.
My six-shooter has a notch. Okay, really, I dropped it a I dented the walnut grip. It looks cool, and some people believe it.
Mine too!! Only it was a hit on a rocky surface when getting "Killed"
Either way it looks good.
Your humor keeps getting better all the time. Funny opening, great video.
Glad you like them!
see you on down the trail pards --LT
Thank You!
Good video pard. I appreciate what you do to keep the spirit of the cowboy alive.
Thank you!
My first thought was that some of those notches could have been added for a better grip on the otherwise smooth handle. Obviously not all of them, the ones on the butt wouldn't do much good, but some of them... possibly.
Deinfitely possible.
In "The Good, the Bad and the Ugly", at the final shoot out scene, the top strap of Angel Eyes's Remington, notes a number of notches, clumped in groups of 5. (High resolution TV helps see this.)
As far as 'x's' and other marks scratched on guns, it was not unusual in times past for cop or detective arriving at crime scene, or disarming a suspect, to scratch a mark on the gun when assuming evidentiary custody of the firearm. ( A sharp ear can catch line in many of the old Perry Mason TV shows, when detective testifying, confirming that was his mark on gun found at crime scene.)
Years ago, at auction, was a rifle for sale, with letter from original owner, a 'gentleman hunter', (as opposed to someone hunting to feed himself or family or a market hunter, who would harvest game and sell meat to butcher shops or others), who diaried his late 19th century hunts in a journal and mentioned how he'd mark stock to commemerate the season's hunt. Just an isolated example.
Interesting!
Needed this today. Thank you
You're welcome.
A good friend of mine inherited an original 1873 winchester as a family heirloom the story goes the 20 notches along the left side of the rifle were for game he took with it (deer etc.) the 5 notches on the right were apparently horse thieves shot, not sure how the story holds up but its a fun one to listen to.
Nice!
That Family Feud bit cracked me up. Well done on the video as always!
Much appreciated!
Great video, but now I'm hungry for nachos...
lol
There’s a legend that Bat Masterson was being pestered to sell his gun to a fan. Not willing to part with a tool he was used to using, Bat bought a new revolver and carved 22 notches in the handle. When the fan asked if they represented people he’d killed, Bat replied that he wasn’t counting Mexicans or Indians. The fan walked away happy with his purchase.
Makes you wonder just how many genuine firearms which belonged to famous gunfighters there really are out there.
@@bigblue6917 Technically that gun would be "genuine". After all, Bat did own it, for all of five minutes.
@@bigblue6917 Not nearly as many as there claims to be. Such as with holy relics it was said that there was enough shards and nails from the 'true cross' one could build the Noah's Ark from them all. I'd imagine there's enough 'authentic' gunslinger guns to arm everyone in Wyoming.
Interesting.
I loved your intro so much im eating a plate of nachos. Good Job Santee!
Glad you liked it!!
You really carved out a great story on this one. It was top notch
LOL! thanks.
I don't know if its just me, but that intro had me cackling to myself like a crazy person. You have the perfect sense of humor
Much appreciated!
I always look forward to your Saturday morning video drops.
Now I want Nachos for dinner….
I was thinking nachos for breakfast 😊
LOL!
Interesting! Thank you! I have a model 1892 Winchester rifle (38WCF) that was built in the first year of production. Bought it in the early seventies from an old farmer in Quebec. He didn't know what the thirteen notches on the wrist represented, nor did he remember any of the rifle's history. The Cody Museum couldn't offer much help, either. Oh, well. I'll have to take it to a CAS match someday! Stay well!
You too!
Now I know why my ex girlfriends headboard had so many notches in it
Yeah....that's a thing too.
Speaking of notches on the grips. Wood had a tendency to become dry unless one used an oil or furniture type polish to keep the wood in good shape. Notching would be unnecessary abuse and colts were expensive. About $2000 in today's money.
I agree!!!
Another great episode on a subject I've always wondered about!
Glad to hear it!
Good evening Santee, such are the myths and exciting unknowns.
Definitely sounds plausible but then that's the beauty of it. Never really knowing..
Have an incredible week ahead mate much love
Could be. Hope all is well Izeak!