Invincible Season 3 is going to have an OLIVER PROBLEM
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 9 ก.พ. 2025
- Invincible is one of my favorite shows on TV, and last year I had a ton of fun analyzing Mark and Nolan’s beautifully written, inversed but parallel arcs through the first 2 seasons. Still very proud of that as my first Invincible video! This year I decided it’s definitely time to start covering the show week by week, and WHAT a start to season 3 with the 3 episode premiere. Honestly there might even be TOO much stuff happening through the first 3 of the season, but there is so so much to talk about so let’s take off.
Edited by Cree- cree.place/ and Mykal Williams: www.instagram....
Music:
Johnny 2 Cellos Theme Music - Norman Marston
Johnny 2 Cellos Theme Remix- @BlackTyeChi
Video Used:
Invincible (2021-2025)
The Simpsons (1989-2025)
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To be fair the multypaul thing I completely agree with mark on, he just came in and fucked up the entire mission and then Kate comes in like he wasn’t about to kill Rex
let whole ass time travellers get away with THE FRIGGIN DECLARATION OF INDEPENDANCE like its 99% justified
Ya how does Kate revealing she’s alive at all absolve Paul of his attempted murder… of not even a murderer
@ wft was all of that btw? Does it tie to anything in particular? Does it get explained later on?
I've seen some Invincible videos, and that part doesn't a ring a bell.
@@ChrisYork-i9y that's not the point genius, it's that Mark is acting comparitively callous to how he usually is.
@@Ancor_Vantian don't ask questions about this part before you accidentally get spoiled.
Trust me
Multi-Paul is a criminal btw, so Mark taking him back to prison makes sense. Paul is an assassin
So? The point still stands, Mark's showing less empathy to characters so far, compared to how he's been previously portrayed as
@@andalilbitqueerblame the celicil talks we skip over
@@andalilbitqueerno the point doesn't stand because he deserves to be in jail.
@@andalilbitqueerYeah but Paul was in jail in season 1 he was in a cell. Then we see him again here out of it and know he was an assassin not just an assassin but to one to a criminal network.
@@hawkeyemihawkgettingmoneylord what? i don't think you even understand the point being made tbh; it's not about whether Paul deserved to be in jail, that really doesn't matter within the point. It's that Mark is reacting to Kate being alive and Paul's fury with callousness unusual for the character he's been shown to be previously, which to be fair, is a fine introduction to what's changed with him in the past 6 months.
Cecil said it best in season 1. "You only see things in black & white. Well, I like to keep things grey"
I do find it funny he says that to Damian Darkblood when 3x2 is titled "Deal with the Devil."
I work with kids around Oliver’s age irl, and they have done such a good job depicting the attitude kids really have. It is just egocentric black and white thinking. They have the capacity to see a nuanced view but it takes a lot for them to understand it. I don’t think Oliver was lying to his family, but he really is going to be a nuclear bomb with a hairpin trigger which somehow the graysons need to control. I wonder how this will all change when Nolan comes back.
as a comic reader, i don't remember oliver and omni-man really interacting much outside of his birth.
@@nicholas-dv1mgthey do but when Oliver is in his teens and as an adult not as a child that I remember
@@Jewel_Screaming_Chango8387 I guess they do kinda live in the same alien empire
Just wait till that kid has his first destructive, temper-tantrum.
kids have better neuroplasticity so it is easier for them to feel empathy and connect with other people
I think my favourite animation was how extra Cecil hitting the button to activate the sonic emitter was. That was anime as heck.
I feel like this was also one of those budget cutting tricks they mention back in season 2. Decrease movement in dramatic ways to save time on animation.
@@jordanloux3883 The comic went out of their way to make that joke and then had some of the most stunning 2-page spreads in American comics and a lot of them will be scenes this season. The last two eps are probably gonna have special attention.
@@BakaVHSThe multi-panel headbutt will be BRUTAL.
@BakaVHS if you know what's coming, you can definitely tell that they were pulling out all of the animation tricks in the book in the early season to splurge it in the back half.
I think Mark has this attitude of no redemption because he thinks that him wanting to forgive Nolan is wrong, and he is projecting that mindset onto everyone else by removing the possibility of redemption.
This. I was thinking exactly this.
It is wrong
This is a great take, and pretty adjacent to something I feel no one is acknowledging. Which is that Mark is still a young adult with a developing brain who's coping through serious traumatic events.
@@FinalDragoon63 oh definetly and especially after Cecil made him kill a shitload of borgs- which is a ptsd trigger after Nolan used marks body as a weapon. Trying to talk about redemption when *all* mark sees is his dads actions on his own hands makes him fucking sick
Everyone seems to ignore that cecil literally ignored donald when he told him about the screaming caves and quakes before this happened.
Yeah, sounds like the government stuck seeing things a certain way so long that they develop massive blindspots that an idiot would notice.
Watching the show it felt painfully obvious that doc seismic was touching the ground and making it happen when they showed the security camera footage.
he didnt ignore him, he just didnt know what to do with the info.
@@vaiparaocaralhovai-tefoder5621 to be fair, while that assumption would be correct, they had no information to suggest that he was even capable of doing that without his gauntlets. It's why he was able to get away with flagrant practicing in view full view of the security camera and have nobody think twice about what he was doing.
@@ravenbuff982 The problem with harvesting too much information is that you lose track of what information is important and which is not. A problem intelligence agencies have always grappled with, and, pre-AI and omni present electronic surveillance, they solved by focusing on which types of info they focused on. Yes, this did lead to the occasional miss (usually caused by ideology focusing on the wrong thing, see for example the time British Intelligence missed a German spy ring operating in Portsmouth dockyards in 1914 because they were to focused on spying on Suffragettes), but it meant they could generally focus and sift information received to reveal the patterns easily. These days, because of electronic snooping and AI data harvesting, it has never been easier to slip through the cracks because they are drowning in patterns and false positives, all of which must be followed up with the same scarce on the ground resources.
I’ve been thinking about this show constantly since Thursday
Seriously ❤
same, ive rewatched the episodes a few times already because they are so good
Im so ready for more bro
I’ve been constantly thinking about this show since season 2 ended
Funny because I asked the show and it has been thinking about you as well
Paul definitely deserved to go to prison though. His actions did result in the declaration of Independence being stolen and nearly killed someone for no reason.
It wasn't reasonable to say rex had a hand in kates "Death".
Imagine someone you cared about dying, just for their brother to not only blame you for the death, but actually try to kill you. That person should go to jail, right away.
A lot of marks attitudes towards some scenarios are twisted, but defending Paul's scenario is crazy.
I agree with you entirely my point wasn’t that he didn’t deserve it, it was the way in which Mark handled it and how that differs from what we could have expected from him prior to this season. I didn’t defend what Paul did lol
Rex: "You almost killed me for nothing!"
Paul: "I've killed for less"
bro, what's less than nothing?! 😅😭
@@EuphyDperhaps killing someone you wanted to spare?
@@frimi8593 he wasn't planning to 😅
@@EuphyD that was an answer to your question
My thing is the villains haven't been reformed but reprogrammed which is extremely disturbing. Its one thing to genuinely reform someone or even direct them to contribute to society as payment for their crimes. But with how Cecil talks they literally messed with their heads.
That's up to speculation
While I totally agree it's possible C brain washed them into obedience. That would be completely in character. There's no evidence that's what he did. The flashback shows Cecil going through his own reform program. So it seems the organization has non brain-washing methods. The doctor making the reanimen (?) also doesn't seem to be brain washed.
I mean the guy who was turning college students into cyborgs was fucked. You think in a world with heroes people would kill to be a cyborg hero. We also know it works with corpses so like he could've done that but Sinclair didn't. He might as well be reprogrammed cause his brain wasn't working right. Darkwing is meh, I don't see besides the fact he putting justice into his own hands, but we know most heroes work with the government so eh.
Yuh
Reprogramming is definitely a scarier word than rehabilitation. Sounds a bit MKUltra.
I loved Cecil when he says to Mark he is a hypocrite and that he's waltzing off to help his mass-murdering father
This effects Mark way more deeply than you think. If you haven't read the books yet you're in for a treat!
Mark isn't seeing the bigger picture he is the only one who could stand his ground against vultrimites and his kid brother is at a impressionable age with a photographic memory and sees humans as lesser creatures and as pests when he gets older he only cares about Debbie and mark and nolan and didn't connect with anyone till he joined the coalition of planets. He knows he is different but wants to make mark proud but he sees him as a hypocrite who goes back and forth between rehabilitation and killing.
About the seismic battle, last season, omni man's books hinted that monsters that live in high gravity and pressure are uniquely strong against viltrumites. With these creatures living deep in the earth, it makes sense that mark, while gaining strength, still hasnt been proven stronger than elite full grown viltrumites and would struggle against the type of creature that has any measure of an advantage against his kind.
It wasn’t a complaint about the logic about why they were stronger than Mark! It was about the structuring of the episode in touting how much stronger Mark is now but then not really showing it when it counts. Chekov’s strength lol
Oliver is 100% lying through his teeth. How many times did he promise to listen to Mark and Debbie in these 3 episodes? A ton. And he didn't listen once. He's telling people what they want to hear to get them off his back.
They're just humans after all to him .. Oliver is 0% human
He’s also a 1 year old with the body and mind of a 10 year old and powers of a Demi god.
He’s growing rapidly and is definitely a viltrimite first. Doesn’t have the same growth experience as mark unfortunately.
Absolutely. I'm surprised more people aren't picking up on it. The way he straight faced claimed he killed the twins by accident. He also hid his powers until Mark promised to train him too. He's turning into a little manipulator.
@@austinharris3139 I don’t think he has a single human friend in his own “age range.” All he has is family and teachers because they literally haven’t had the time to figure out how to hide that he’s purple. Experiencing more human society and making friends, like Mark (and Superman) did would certainly go a long way in building his empathy and connection with Earth. I think his only knowledge of society comes from TV, TH-cam, and the news. Terrible for ANY child’s development, let alone one growing at his rate.
You cannot tell me you're mad at mark for reacting the way he did with multipaul's bullshit.
He had serval werid takes.
hes basically superman and ripped dudes spine out when he could have just pushed everyone he went overboard
@@hawkeyemihawkgettingmoneylord fr
@@raythepersonHe didn't go overboard. He gave the guy a chance to stop and he wouldn't listen.
@@raytheperson The guy with infinite spines. The member of organized crime, who doesn't let constantly dieing, deter him from organized crime. . . .
Bruh, stop giving him undeserved sympathy.
I like how donald kinda seems like hes older than cecil, when he introduces himself he is literally the exact same and its probably cause hes mostly robot by this point, and the “ill be your right hand” seems like hes been working there longer than cecil as well
The show has always had a power scaling problem, but the Seismic confrontation really made me feel like "shoot, just throw those bugs at the viltrumites"
Yes , but also no. As viltrumites get stronger through stress, majority of them are much stronger than mark with the age and experience they’ve accrued
If you remember back in Season 2, Nolan had Mark go through his books to look for hints on how to defeat the Viltrumites, and one of the books details an "Extremely dense planet" with extreme gravity, and the creatures on that planet, Rognarrs were so incredibly strong in order to survive and move on the planet, that they posed a very real threat to even Viltrumites.
So, it was hinted at that something that would survive such extreme conditions like the mantle of the earth, would be enough to threaten a viltrumite.
this, the bugs are under a lot more pressure because and gravity because they are closer to the core of the earth, that’s why they are a lot more tougher.
And since they are tougher, they also need offensive properties to hunt the other tough bugs, or dig through the earth (which is also more dense than surface dirt)
I hadn't thought of that. Makes sense.
The pace is honestly how the comics were. Unless you want the show to be 150 episodes, this is kinda the pace it has to go
why would we not want it to be 150 episodes? it was so much better that we saw the actual guardian fight instead of just the before and after, something we only got late into the comic.
Brother have u ever heard of the walking dead? That shit been going on for 100 years they already gonna milk the shit outta this cow dont u worry @@nicholas-dv1mg
@@nicholas-dv1mgBecause Amazon refuses to let shows have more than 8 episodes, and at 150 episodes we wouldn’t finish the series for something like 20 years.
The pacing is a little fast, but 8-10 seasons should work just fine to tell and improve the story.
@@nicholas-dv1mgas an anime fan who’s grown up watching stories that long, we don’t need it.
In comic, the pacing is dragging too much, especially in early seasons. It is perfect the same author is writing the show to fix that pacing issue
I didn't consider the Guardians split an age thing until you brought it up! Kate staying makes so much more sense. Monster Girl chalked it off as her being engaged to the Immortal, but I think it might be the reverse. Kate said herself that all the lives of her clones combined make her about the same age as him, so her idea of Cecil being right in the long run just shows WHY Kate and Immortal work together. Whew, you just made my fears of Kate's agency and personality disappear, thank you!
Bruh what personality?
She’s a plot device.
She’s a terrible character.
“I almost died too”
Nah you aren’t even a superhero. You’re a superhoe
Ngl, i don't think combining the lives of the clones means much, all of them are still the same person and we don't even get a hint that she Just leaves clones around the world to do stuff independently and gain more life experience, not only that, but i don't even know if their memories transfer to her
@@nicholassgobero I think they do since it mentions that they have a telepathic connection.
I think the person that has died and felt death thousands of times can deal with the age gap.
She sure doesn't act like it IMO. Sure, everyone was mad at Rex, but no one gave Kate any crap even though it SHOULD have been more shocking coming from her. Then not even two seconds into meeting the Immortal she is already banging him? She's moving too fast like a teenager with daddy issues, which explains why she has the hots for him. Then my dude Immortal is leveling up his blacksmithing making her a ring trying to turn a ho into a housewife.
The thing is though Oliver isnt entirely wrong in what he said. As a kid he shouldnt be killing people, but to show mercy to people who are only going to keep harming others with no remourse wont hlep things either. Mark tried to show Mercy to the Viltriumite woman he fought on Thraxan and it got him a knife through the gut. The whole "no killing" rule becones real felixible when it wants to.
I think it's more of the heart less attitude when the mauler stop being an active threat
It isn't when he wants to, it's generally when he himself or someone he loves is in immediate danger. There are plenty of justifications or excuses for killing some specific people; Viltrumites express that they want to kill and conquer to make a better safer world for others, or to "save lives." If you justify some preventative murder then automatically you can justify practically any amount of preventative murder. That's why superheroes draw that line of no murder. Why should Invincible get a pass to be judge and executioner and Viltrumites don't?
@raviolithedesigner3736 I never said Viltrumites entirely shouldn't, or to more exact that their philosophy isn't entirely wrong. The problem with the Viltrumites is the laying waste to the totality of a civilization that doesn't agree with them or bend to their power. But as we saw last season with Mark's conversation with Anissa, she explains that human civilization won't last the next two centuries without preventative measures for the most powerful people that strip resources and cause harm. And she isn't wrong in that belief. Just as Oliver isn't wrong here, the Maulers if captured would have gone on to cause more crime and damage and worst of all directly harm and take the lives of more people. They feel no remorse for their actions nor will they change. They can either be utilized like what Cecil did with Sinclair or they need to go. This is why Cecil's philosophy rings true. We can be the "good guys" or the guys that save the world, but you can't be both.
To give you a question should Batman kill the Joker knowing that he is going to never change, break out again, and harm more people?
no hes not like he said it's not precious to everyone
It's a lot more nuanced than that, since you also create extremism by being overzealous in that pursuit; which is infinite future enemies and violence, especially as you go round and round dealing with it via murder.
I didn't know the budget was decreased. That's crazy. It's like "well we know people are gonna come for it anyways so who cares."
The end episodes of season 3 will be fire I hope they are saving budget for those episodes
I love the dynamic between Cecil and Mark. It's a bit weird to see Mark have ths stance after his own actions and his reconciliation with Omniman, but Cecil does point out his hypocrisy. I think Mark's hard line stance against working with criminals is his way of making it up to himself that he took out Angstrom. It's also great having a moral dilemma where neither side feels completely right or completely wrong.
I would like to point out that one of the lessons Mark is trying to instill into Oliver is that, life is precious and you should not kill anyone. The issue is that he’s also completely against the rehabilitation of the criminals he refuses to kill. I guess his ideal is for them to rot away in prison for the rest of their lives? Which feels problematic on both a moral and economic level.
I am pretty sure Mark's reaction has nothing to do with intellectual ideals and more to do with him just not liking the particular people in question. Sinclair in particular hurt people Mark personally knows. Its an entirely emotional reaction that he is trying to pretend is based on some intellectual ideal that prohibits the idea of rehabilitation or using evil people as a resource for good. Seriously, did any part of how he was acting look like the actions of someone acting on their brain rather then acting on emotion?
The way they always lead to the title card with dialogue still gets me
every. single. time.
Except for season 2 ep 4
I don't think Oliver was lying about loving Debbie and I think he was shocked about what he said, but I still feel like he was lying about everything else.
The first thing he said after that was that the Maulers didn't have loved ones as a defense of his actions. I don't think he's learned his lesson at all and is just trying to sweep it under the rug to avoid them being mad at him.
I haven't seen a single person say that he's lying about loving Debbie. So, I feel like you're misunderstanding what people are saying about Oliver.
4:27 bro he was trying to kill a man for something there was no evidence of him doing, I don't care who he is he's going to prison
I never said he didn’t deserve to go to prison lol
No, but the issue is this: you imply that season 1 Mark wouldn't make the same choice that season 3 Mark is making, assuming that "power scaling" has anything to do with character choices...or at least is more important than anything else, without taking into so consideration that they're NOT the same character at this point in the show.
You're making a great argument for those that do not understand the difference between "character assassination" and "character growth..."
@@Johnny2CellosBUT the way you are explaining this incident is as if it’s wrong for Mark to be thinking/acting this way.
Y’all, I cannot even with this. Nowhere did I say that it’s a BAD thing that Mark is acting this way from a story perspective. Nowhere did I say anything Mark did was WRONG. I said his demeanor feels OUT OF CHARACTER from the Mark of previous seasons! Because it INTENTIONALLY is written to be! That is his trajectory this year, that’s the point! It’s obviously a huge part of his character journey. I’m analyzing the story and y’all are acting like I’m crucifying the character for his decision making, it’s very weird! I love Mark!
@ also just wanna say, my disagreement with your breakdown made me stop watching your video when I didn't hear my chamber being echoed. (I had 3-5ish minutes left)
But responding and engaging the way you did, ready for criticism while also defending how you feel and what you intended with your scripted words...
I'm definitely going back to rewatch the whole vid.
You've earned my respect. Which in the day and age of TH-cam 2025, means you've earned my watchtime and engagement.
TH-cam Algorithm Gods be praised regardless 😂😂
Even if rehabilitated criminals aren't used by Cecil, rehabilitation is still preferable to putting them in prison solely for revenge. Revenge isn't a moral goal, improving lives is
Hes alienating heroes to accommodate hiring villians, its rather messed up
Strength is relative. He's stronger than he was. We didn't even know these things existed, and kaijus are tough already. Seismic said these ones are extra tough because of the pressures they developed in.
Also, WILD argument comparing Mark to two serial killers because he caught a body.
It’s not about the logic, they of course made a point to justify it. I think structurally story wise it doesn’t really fit to show him fail so spectacularly after making that point to explain his newfound strength
I say its not that wild considering that Invincible apprently always seem to become the objective villain in the other timelines Angstrom has lived. Any death he caused is a foreshadowing. And reading the comics, not much has changed now that we are in the blue suit era.
ill also be that guy and say Invincible killed duplikate's brother several times and she stated that every one of their 'clones' are the original, no constructs or poofed illusions. One thing to smack them around till their in tractions but hes going through them like toilet paper, like Omniman went through civilains beating the breaks off of his son.
@@Johnny2Cellos It also doesn't matter how strong he is, it was him getting distracted when Eve got taken out that lead to him getting poisoned. Shows that he's still learning to balance his personal feelings and focus on a job at the same time, he's only 19 so he's not gonna be perfect.
@@HeilRay And Duplikates brother is a murdering assassin who was in the middle of trying to murder Rex for no reason other than he was angry and Rex survived when he thought she did not. While yes he was killing the copies and there likely is no original anymore they were in self-defence and as paul said it was kill or be killed, Invincible could not restrain all the Pauls, rescue Rex before Paul killed him and hold back his power from killing Rex in the process all at once. He had to choose what to do and kill the disposable Pauls was the correct one.
I just remembered that he's voiced by Gus from Sweet Tooth. That just makes his tranquil fury all the more disturbing.
Who
@@murderman8578Oliver aka Kid Omni-Man
@@murderman8578Gus from Sweet Tooth
@murderman8578 Oliver
wdym?
Invincible has a few passive reflections of modern comics as a whole. The "non-permanent" deaths is one of them - every main character has 11 layers of plot armor but will be ripped to literal pieces often.
A lot of people had an issue with everything you said around 5:20 but I do NOT feel the same.
1. Doc Seismic uses sound waves which is Mark's weakness. Of course he's getting his ass whooped. It felt like foreshadowing for the coming scene with the earpiece. Especially when Doc grabs Mark's head and blasts him in melee range with his vibration/sound blast.
2. Everyone REALLY hates that the bugs posed a threat to Mark, BUT the show already told us back in Season 1 that Omni Man nearly lost VS the Kaiju "Hail Mary". Which is why Cecil put it on ice and used it during the finale to stop Omni Man. So it's been established that Kaiju on Earth can rival Omni Man's power, and Mark is no Omni Man, so him losing to an army of Kaiju sized centipedes didn't seem weird to me at all.
It’s not about the “logic” of Mark struggling within the lore it’s more I have an issue with the structure of the story. Starting the episode focusing on how much more powerful he is and then at the end showing him struggle so immensely felt off to me.
@@Johnny2Cellos Honestly It could've been fixed if Cecil just said that the bugs are incredibly strong or smth, bc they live in the Earth's core.
Mark did nothing wrong with Multi-Paul. Dude was openly admitting to attempted murder
I didn’t say he was “wrong” I said the way he dealt with it was out of character and that was intentional given his trajectory this season
@@Johnny2Cellosdid you expect Mark to get him coffee and talk over his feelings?
I agree, the look of genuine tiredness from mark feels so earned and genuine. So by episode 2 of season 3 it really feels earned his realction and it really hurts as a fan and you understand. Really amazing wring, it’s fr amazing.
I think it was a little on the nose when Mark said, “Ezra Miller should be in jail! I mean, SINCLAIR should be in jail!”
Lolllll
I think Mark telling Rick about Sinclair, was totally selfish. Like wanting to hear what he wants to hear from someone who "would get it". Rick was tortured by Sinclair and maybe he would have been better off not knowing that his monster is set free. Like he needs to have a clean conscious, even if it burdens others. Like Mark telling Eve about future Eve, and wanting to get together. It was about Mark feeling better.
I do love this season so far, and Mark has been through alot and that stuff with Oliver not feeling empathy for murdering the Maullers is a lot to deal with. It's almost like Mark shutting down and trying to take control of things is having an impact on his brother.
Yeah, I really don't get how so many people are siding with Mark here when the show is throwing up so many flags about him actually being kind of an asshole who (despite his love of humanity) really doesn't understand some things like just how damned terrifying he is from a non-powered human's perspective and why someone like Cecil would jump straight to security measures the moment Mark showed the slightest sign of aggression (even if it was only on the level of 'walking towards a person who clearly doesn't feel comfortable having you in their physical space' that would just be obnoxious and rude if Mark was a regular human). Because if Mark wanted to Cecil could be killed in a damn instant and there would be nothing he could do about it without preparations that have to be deployed before Mark actually throws hands to be helpful and he is literally gambling his life if he decides not to set them up in the hopes Mark will cool down rather then continue to escalate.
And yeah, going and telling them that was a dick move. He wanted to find someone else who hated Sinclair that would validate his stance on the matter and didn't care that getting that validation is probably going to give his friends nightmares of that guy coming back for them to do more experiments on them now that they think he is just walking around free rather then the more likely reality of being locked up somewhere that happens to have a lab for him to do work for Cecil in.
Nope, Oliver is just like that.
coming from the perspective of a comic reader, I actually really like where Oliver's character goes in the later part of the story especially
Cecil needs to Invest more in Other Heroes.
why
He does though, most of the Guardians almost died fighting that lion dude, and Rex got absolutely totaled last season. Not to mention Immortal was decapitated straight up season one. Donald was rebuilt and he's not even a hero. G.U.N keeps whoever they think is good period and will invest in keeping them alive even after they die
@@rayshawnwilliams5673
Ever heard of that too many eggs in one basket saying?
@@DylanJo123 huh no
@@DylanJo123 what does it mean
The 'villain' opener in Episode 3 is the best successor of the Up opener I've ever seen, it's magnificent. I couldn't look away, even for a moment, it was so intense without ever saying a word.
Oliver is my favorite character! Kirkman really wrote him as a complex character with a ton of layers. Oliver always sees things in black and white. He’s very inflexible as he grows.
See, I get your point about the end of episode one. But I see it this way. The reason why Mark and Eve were struggling wasn't because of physical strength but rather a strength in numbers. Both had to contend with Seismic and all the underground creatures alone. Additionally, Mark was trying to do too much at once. Looking after Eve, fighting the monsters, trying to go after Seismic and trying to free the other heroes. It was never meant to be smth he won.
I would say Mark never took a life in a none self defense situation. His family was kidnapped and damage was done. With that being said I think darkwing could be redeemed. (The other guy was crazy)
I don't know how many seasons they're shooting for, but having read all of the comics, they're going through multiple arcs in one season. I like how faithful it is to the comics even though that means I know exactly what's going to happen next. Can't wait to see some of my favorite characters and arcs as the show goes on!
10 confirmed seasons
@@tankedwarthog6424TEN?! fucking beautiful mate.
"we can be the good guys, or we can be the guys that save the world, we can't be both" Sounds like such a "The road to hell is paved with good intentions" and "the ends justify the means" mix of a sentence. I think Cecil realizes he is going to make mistakes and do things that are morally questionable, and that he will pay for it in time, but that someone has to do it.
Regarding the crime duo who couldn't afford rent, bruh they have super powers how are they not able to monetize that. Especially heat powers.
I refuse, refuse the goofiness.
Maybe their criminal records stopped them from good high paying jobs.
Fake out deaths? Quick pacing? Okay-ish animation quality? This is the Invincible I know 🙏
Yeah strong start to the season so far
The crazy thing about the pacing is that the comic rushed through this stuff even faster. This show is one of the best direct adaptations I've ever seen because it fleshes these stories out a ton and brings in stuff from side stories flawlessly.
I mean the whole entirety of invincible is being told in 8 seasons. And were barely a little over 1/4. So thats why it seems paced really quickly
Yeah that’s why I said they should do longer seasons!
I quite literally _just_ finished watching the third of the first available three. [Invinci]Boy, is this gonna' be good.
It sure is amazing how fast Mark flipped his tune on murderers needing to be sent to jail instead of being offered a slap on the wrist and rehabilitation if they help Cecil save lives when it is his brother that murdered a person who had surrendered in cold blood.
I think you need to consider that Oliver is still a child lol, I get where you're coming from about the hypocrisy of Mark but it is different when a child does it who doesn't clearly have a good grasp on morality yet compared to someone with intention
It is not the same tho,oliver is a very young boy who has a more power than someone his age should have,but Sinclair is a fucking freak and darkwing is an adult that chose to kill people
Pretty sure there’s a big difference between a child killing a mass-murderer, and grown men kidnapping and murdering dozens of innocent people.
Edit: WARNING: COMIC SPOILERS IN THE COMMENT BELOW THIS ONE
@@kittenwizard4703"oopsie, just killed people who surrendered and wanted to release a virus that would eradicated humanity later on in the saga, my bad, i'm still a child bro i dont know whats right or wrong so yall should forgive me" (even though oliver grows faster than humans do and is already able to comprehend his mother's words because they depart from earth, what an insane comment to defend murderers)
@@kittenwizard4703 I mean, I knew murder was bad when I was a kid.
Granted the Seismic fight does more or less show that Mark isn't the only one who is improving with even the villains upping their game.
As someone who read the comics, and knew the thing with the Maulers was coming, I'm excited to see how you'll react to later developments with Oliver and how the show runners will change things up.
Rex has been one of my favorite characters for the last season and a half. He’s really gone from being annoying to entertaining in a way that I feel is very believable for a cocky teenage guy who is probably stronger than like 90% of the population, and while he’s still very immature I feel like it’s less in a dickhead way and more in an overly excitable way.
Rex is an asshole that is or has been tempered by his own realized limitations. It literally took him getting shot in the head to appreciate what he already has in life and what he is capable of.
seriously, dude its 'Traumatized hero kid 101', hes mainlining the rule book because he doesn't trust himself or his instincts to make the right call anymore, and he growing exponentially stronger but still losing to an old man and his pet bugs because his subconscious is is throttling his power. eventually someone will figure out that hes unconsciously pulling his punches. things will happen, he will fail to resolve or just ignore the problem until the epic big battle wear hell get his ass kicked, reach some kind of inner peace, and than kick the absolute shit out of the bad guy.
like every super hero has this exact arc at some point.
also 7:35 - "one often meets their destiny on the road they took to avoid it." - Jean de la Fontaine / Master Oogway
Pretty much. No spoilers, but he’ll get that moment at the end of the season. He’s already as strong as Anissa or his dad, they said as much at the very beginning of the season.
Episode 2 had pretty good animation with mark vs Cecil and the future twins fighting mark and Rex. Seems they save the animation for the fights
I heavily disagree with the multi-paul thing.
Mark was trying to reason but Had to get violent when he noticed Rex was getting beaten to death. This is ultimately why he brought him to jail because he nearly killed Rex for literally nothing. I believe it would be a bit contradictory to marks current moral standing to go "yeah we will give him some slack since he was just mad at rex for no real good reason"
I totally understand Cecil having contingency plans for every superhero. But, activating those said plans over a disagreement is not only bad, but very stupid. That's not how you win the loyalty of an OP being. Besides, with that move, he even ruined his entire contingency plan for Mark. C'mon, Cecil, what are you doing? You calling people arrogant and stupid but you were the biggest arrogant in that episode for thinking you could humble Mark by almost killing him for no real reason.
You activate a contingency plan when the target actually becomes a real threat to the globe
Ngl what Kate did should of been more frowned upon, the fact that she just gets to come back acting like she faked her death therefore letting Rex’s brains be blown out, just because she needed some time alone with immortal is shitty
I felt like Mark was mostly justified until he went and spoke to Cecil, like he's more angry about the rehabilitation and not the "severe physical reprogramming" used to do it, which sounds like torture, Mark doesn't even bring it up he just keeps whinging about the only sliver lining in what Cecil is doing, Mark should have been more interested in *how" Cecil is turning bad guys into good guys so easily
I love that people are making these breakdowns as if it’s a fully original IP and not based on a 22 year old comic book.
i’ve been looking for weekly coverage and one of my favorite channels covering it is perfect
Rex Splode has become the most reasonable character on the show, and as immature as The Immortal is, I'm shocked he was ever Lincoln.
I wonder if he defaults to angry old guy every time he comes back from dying, or if he is always that and he on occasion locks tf in gets real fancy and frees the slaves?
The point of the Seizmic fight was to subtly point out key weaknesses of Mark that they will come back to later on (heat weakens Viltrumites and stalls their healing factor, and the seismic vibrational soundwaves mess with Viltrumites ability to fight and fly)
This episode's introduction is perfect given the moral conflict from the first two episodes. The "bad" guys are capable of change but still committing crimes; Cecil would see potential to reform or control them, but Mark just sees bad guys that need to be stopped.
Mark “killed” someone and decided to cling to being a hardliner with his morals because he’s afraid of himself and who he would become without them. It’s grasping for a feeling of control that he already lost.
@ So true
I LOVE this because it's analyzing and theoryzing without the comics so I can just listen without having to worry about actual spoilers
In the comic he doesn't get bitten by that creature when saving everybody, he kills it and then faints from exhaustion. I wish they would implemented that in the show imo.
I absolutely adore how Invincible leans into the grey nature of morality. It poses insanely tough questions and rarely gives simple answers, if any answers at all. The show’s far more realistic for it and I love that.
I'm a fan of the pacing so far. Narratively, but also from a production standpoint. There is a lot of content in the 144 issues of the comics, and I'm kind of worried the show will be canceled before it gets to finish the whole story.
Kill or be Killed.
The way Heroes are doing is so Contradictory.
Is that a No More Heroes reference?
@alexhero64 Never played it. But it seems to be right.
It's so nice seeing a non spoiled invincible fan who hasn't read the comics. Genuinely can't wait to go through your videos week to week. And honestly, I think the animation thing is that the name an effort will be put into the massive last two episodes. I'm hoping I'm right about this, and I'm not spoiling anything, but genuinely it will get freaking crazy
I’m just so glad they show how his healing process is super accelerating with the hole in his chest
I'm glad you agree. The implanted ear piece was really the only overstep, and even that can be justified even if it wasn't very moral.
I've seen too many reactions that are agreeing with Mark
The discourse around these 3 episodes have been interesting to witness
Why they didn’t rob the bank at night is beyond me.
something that i think makes the conversation abour rehabilitation more complex is that darkwing, the freeing fists, and presumably da sinclair do not feel like theyve been voluntarily and naturally reintroduced into society based on the language that cecil uses (saying they've been "reprogrammed") and rather that they have been reconditioned to follow orders from the gda which does not make them good again. its more like their murderous tendencies and such have been changed in order for them to benefit the gda.
But if they are helping society and stopped murdering innocent people, does it matter of they are "good" or not?
I get what you mean about how fast things are moving but this is the pace of the comics and it should be known that this series will be like 10 years long. Also if you like the moral dilemma seen in these episodes well it’s going to last like 7 more seasons
so excited to see you cover these week to week
GREAT SHOW! Thanks For this! Can't wait For more
I wonder what would have happened if Cecil told Mark his backstory instead of it being a meta thing for us
Season 3’s Animation is Better than Season 2’s. Oh and Another thing, If you want a New Season of Invincible Every 10 Months or So you’re gonna have to accept the Mediocre Animation Quality. Sure Amazon should hire Extra Animators and hire that P*rno Teaser production Company but why would they? They’re doing just Fine without spending The extra Dough. As long as they Make the Animation more Stylised and bring in Minor Improvements here & there I’m fine with it.
I don’t need a new season every 10 months I’d rather it have better animation lol
@ Yeah Well, Not everyone feels the Same 🤷 I’ve been so Content Starved I’d rather take it! Besides, When Amazon inevitably Starts Using AI to animate this Show we should have that Top Tier Quality you want
lol you’re doing a bit right?
@@Johnny2Cellos Which part?
That AI is going to create “top tier quality” animation 😂😂😂
Oh man get ready for the rest. Episode 6 and forward is going to be crazy
the relationship between mark and eve is only one episode, in the next episodes I believe it will be explored further
11:45-12:09 ,, the exact reason why he SEEMS to be getting beaten in many situations,, HE IS HOLDING BACK. We see on multiple occasions how truly dangerous is and/or can be if unchecked.
im been dying for this season to come with the invincible and atom eve romance
If you didn't read the comics, which the show pretty closely follows, then I can only say "let the story play out", trust me bro, it's going to get better and better. The Comic is a rare case of running for 144 issues, without reboots or flashpoints or any other interruptions of that sort. The show is at around issue 30-40ish, so most of the character arcs have only started, except for some minor characters, who are reaching the climax of theirs, like Rex. Even Eve's parents get some character development in the last third of the comic.
Didn't even know that it's out. Thanks for the notice
My only complaint with this season is that they dropped three out of the eight episodes in the first week!
I wish the weekly discussion around this season could last longer 😭
OHHHHH I am so happy you are doing reviews on this week to week, welcome to the Invincible train better late than never
I have been enjoying Season 3 so far. Can't wait to see what the show does next.
Oliver, unfortunately, is essentially worst-case scenario when raising a child. Rapid growth + hard to control. A major problem is that he's barely 1 but physically and mentally 10, but he has NOT had 10 years of life experience. He hasn't been socialized yet as they have yet to figure out a way to introduce him to wider society. Think about it. He's only really been exposed to his brother, his mother, and his tutor; he has no friends his own age. His only exposure to wider society probably comes from TV, comics, the news, and the internet, an absolutely GHASTLY combination for even a normal child. He's probably watched tons of old videos of his dad doing hero work, but is only aware in passing that he did something bad and hurt a lot of people. I severely doubt he's seen much footage of the devastation his dad caused and he can't totally comprehend the gravity of what he did. This all mixes together into a dangerous cocktail that fuels the black-and-white thinking that a child already has naturally to the point where he's severely lacking empathy. The outside world is just like a comic book to him and without the grounding of having lived in and around people for many years like Mark had growing up, his ability to understand human morality or society is severely limited.
I think Mark is also projecting a little onto Cecil. He all but admitted to Oliver that he deep down wants people to forgive his dad and for him to come back, but also sees how unacceptable that would be to a lot of people. He saw first hand the "good" that his dad did on Thraxis and grappled with the conflict of his evident change in mentality and knowing of his past sins. I think he knows he's a hypocrite at some level, and to deal with this cognitive dissonance, he doubles down on his zero-tolerance morality against killers. He doesn't WANT to want his dad back, but he does, and foists that anti-reform position onto everyone else.
I agree with Cecil that it's far better to use villains for good when possible rather than having them rot in a cell, but his way of dealing with Mark was terribly botched. He is someone who seeks control more than true understanding and thus tried more to manipulate and coerce Mark rather than properly communicate. He only kept escalating things with Mark and kept giving him cagey answers that would not help Mark calm down. It was incredibly dumb to use the implant trump card and think Mark would let that thing remain in his head or continue to work with him. It's understandable that he didn't fully trust Mark after what happened with Nolan, but it led Cecil to treat Mark more like a dog that needed correcting than a person needing a dialogue which ironically only drove Mark away. To be honest, the implant was a bad idea and a horrible breach of privacy and trust; what he should have done was equip every single reaniman with the ability to put out that frequency. Honestly, if Cecil HASN'T developed some mass-produced weapon able to put out that sound, despite knowing of the coming invasion, and the implant was the only thing that came of it, I will view that as a massive oversight on the writers' part.
The silliest thing in all of this was that ANYONE trusted a G-man like Cecil enough to be surprised that he would do something like this. It should implicitly come with the territory that if you are a super working with the government, they will have contingencies to take you down, and that's a GOOD thing. Cecil is not anyone's "friend." He cannot and can never be one. He is at best viewed as a boss and should be trusted to provide information and assistance. I think the others are wrong in saying that he throws people away if they are not useful as he has not been shown to callously throw away lives and seems willing to at least set people up if they become incapacitated. If I was a super working for him, I'd view it as a dereliction of duty if he didn't concoct some way to take me out if I turned coat.
The Viltramite mentality squashed the bug side.
Bro this season is actually so peak it’s crazy
I like Immortal's reaction to the Declaration being stolen since he was Lincoln.
i really don't get this "bad animation" comment. it seems even more drastic to say that it gets worse with each season. the animation doesn't distract me from what's going on. i can only find flaws when i stop and look, just small moments here and there that videos like this point out. is it the characters fighting animation that's the problem, cause that's where i find the most issues, even, though again, i still enjoy the fight scenes. sure it could use a bit sprucing up, but i'm fine with things are right now. when the characters aren't fighting, just talking, moving, it looks like any other cartoon.
If ya watch season 1 and 3 back to back you’d notice. There are still great sequences that are very dynamic but there’s a lot of corner cutting. And “it looks like every other cartoon” doesn’t really make sense when most cartoons look so different haha
@@Johnny2Cellos i mean it has the same frame rate as most cartoons do. look, i'm just going off of what i see, agree to disagree.
I really want to see how the villains have been "reformed." Reform through Cecil's organization sounds like it's probably just brainwashing
Great narration and breakdown for the first 3 episodes for season 3. As you know comic books and TV are two separate mediums. I like that this is fast paced because when it’s not, it’s like Attack on Titan I’ll let you discover that for yourself if you don’t know.
Neither thraxians nor viltrumites are known for their humanity. In fact, it's their lack of humanity that helps identify them.
I have been so happy with this new season. Had chills the whole time ❤
Season 3's off to a crazy strong start. You're right that the pace is pretty breakneck, I hope that they make sure to slow things down here and there.
The gray morality is awesome, it's cool seeing people debate about it online and neither being obviously right or wrong haha.
I can't handle slow invincible. It never works as a change of pace, it's just boring filler waiting for "things" to happen. Because this show sucks at slowing down and exploring specific character dynamics in depth
@@goldfishgallant nah
@@goldfishgallant You might think that the writers didn't do a great job at a slower pace but I don't think that should mean that they give up on it. If you have a story that's constantly moving on to the next conflict, the next fight scene, then it just becomes "things happening" instead of characters you've been made to care about going through meaningful challenges. I'm not too worried about that happening to Invincible but stories need breathing room.
mhmmm dont kill if you don't have to but be prepared to basically
@@raviolithedesigner3736 I agree but yeah I just personally think that Invincible is terrible at staying engaging between conflicts and I don't feel enough of the conflicts bleed into these between spaces.
Like the characters are talking about the conflicts as they happen and say how they feel. But the dialogue doesn't really give me the sense that the characters are REALLY IMPACTED by the conflicts. It just feels so low energy.
It's mind boggling too because the conflicts themselves bring so much emotion and energy to them.
On the note of Oliver lying about his intent to kill to 'not get in trouble' I think it's more so that he doesn't want to be wrong about his actions, than to get in trouble. I think obviously the way he acts (like a kid) but also as a super powered alien, he very much understands that doing something bad doesn't necessary mean that he's in trouble. He's not half human like Mark. He didn't grow up half human thinking he's as fragile as everyone else. He didn't have that moment where he tried to save an old lady only to get her more injured due to not knowing how to control his powers that he doesn't even understand the strength of. Oliver is growing very fast without those moments and getting away with A LOT honestly..(flying inside, tricking Mark into a promise while knowing he has his promise so he gets an automatic yes, running off to help Mark multiple times.) He at least understands that if here were to try to show some sort of remorse or say the right things that it'll take the heat off. He was rewarded with getting a suit because they can't help but be more lenient than stern because they're so in awe of having a superpower. It's kinda annoying because it feels like Mark and Debbie are creating their own monster just by how little repercussions he gets. But on the flip side it all doesn't matter. Even Mark STILL gets his ass beat and the few times Oliver was smacked around he said it barely hurt so why would he listen to them? I have a feeling its gonna be Mark vs Oliver at some point or Oliver joins whichever Viltrimite comes by only to get his ass actually beat by them instead. Either way he isn't learning until its too late. I have a feeling he's a learning stepping stone ( I haven't read the comics myself so I genuinely am just guessing I hope that's okay DX)
lol this is what i get for commenting before I finish the episode, I think Levi using Oliver would be brilliant. He probably sees Mark's variant self in him and how he can manipulate that to not fuck up earth. I still kinda hope there is a good version of Levi out there cause I think he'd be such a cool character to have on the good side, I'm in denial that the fusion actually got all of him to fuse into one😭
they used all the animation budget on cecil's torching and im not complaining
20:26 hmm idk look at his expression, it goes from very serious almost like he was about to say no and then he quickly snaps back into a smile, he even changes his voice like he did when he killed the maulers, something else we have to take into account with Oliver is that not only is he not human but he's also half viltrumite and if mark often snaps into his viltrumite side a child like Oliver would naturally have less control over it than mark does, especially when you take into account something that Debbie says, mark spent seventeen years as basically a normal human learning to live and love his parents, Oliver has been with Debbie for all of three months, maybe not enough for his human side to outweigh his viltrumite side
Also we know viltrumites aren't exactly model citizens so I think it's his genetics showing through