Now we know why GRRM takes so long to finish a book.there is layer upon layer of mythical and astronomical symbology in every single chapter. Woven seamlessly with the foreshadowing, Genius.The Grey King and The Long Nights Watch made me a fanatic of The Church of Starry Wisdom. It is now CANNON.
what i wonder is, has he ended up putting too large of a burden on himself with how much he's woven throughout the books? like, dude struggled with the "mereenese knot" and he has to end the entire book series somehow now lol
Just found your channel after your live video with ideas of ice and fire, but recognized your name from a forum of ice and fire. Thanks for making these into videos, much respect for the amount of work you put into your theories.
This is my stuff bro! The old mythos of Europa & all people's... Adding it to ASOIAF...I've been doing that myself this whole time & boom...here's someone who mashes both together like my insane brain does! Valar dohæris...!
I love your work, so much research and details... But I have a question, maybe you have already addressed it, but why would the seastone chair and others of the same description would be actual "stone" ? The only thing that tells me it couldn't be an actual meteor is the fact that Asshai is entirely made of it.... and supposedly the largest city ever built.That means a HUGE piece of moon. I have heard a theory in which the oily black stone is "the opposite of the weirwood", meaning the black-barked trees from which the leaves are taken for the shade-of-the-evening. Might be that this wood too turn to stone after thousand of years ? Since there is a possible entire forest of it south of Asshai, it tickles my imagination ! Thank you in advance for your enlightened opinion, I found so very little about those trees that seem to appear like "the weirwood of Essos".. even wondered what would result if the red leaves were used instead of those famous ink-blue ones.
What if the fact that so many people see the comet, ascribe meaning to it, and attribute it's symbolism to their own individual lives is GRRM illustrating his own conception of astrology/astronomy? The comet itself doesn't have power over people's lives, but the fact that they observe it as such a significant, personal event makes it powerful in that sense? Kind of a "mass human consciousness creates myth and meaning to our experiences, and we in turn create a reality of history and society out of that" idea ?
I believe moon blood is called that because a woman's cycle spans the same time as a moon cycle. it doesn't get triggered by it, that would be weird and all women would have their period at the same time.
Back at the library, paying my omen to the algorithm. 🦑 those crafty little krakens... 🤔 idk why I feel like this has something to do with the Wall, and possibly the Black Gate itself. 🌊⛈🌊
Well, the tentacles of the Cracken or a symbolic parallel to the roots of a tree, that’s spelled out a couple times. So think about that, and what the implications could be. The weirwoods are like “sea monsters” or maybe the Others
Im being 100% serious and would love an answer; At any point have we confirmed all the solar/lunar symbolism with GRRM or is this just speculative fan fic? It tells an enjoyable story but seems to be more LML's story at this point then GRRM's?
First time going through this compendium! Super excited about it. Very interesting comparisons between naga and weirwoods, definitely going to look for this in my re-reads. Wish i would have listened before i made my drowned god/dess piece :).
We gonna talk about how in Kabbalistic lore the two sea creatures are Leviathan and Behemoth, and Behemoth is gelded specifically to keep the pair from mating because their union will will "undo" creation? How about that the same lore brings in a THIRD dragon, tanin'iver, or "the blind dragon", who joins the pair and facilitates their union as some form of sexual intermediary? Yes, that makes them a three headed sea dragon. (This triad also inspires the alchemical symbol Baphomet but I havent worked out how that's relevant here yet) How about that the same lore identifies Leviathan as another name for Lilith, literally a "Night's Queen" avatar, which also brings in all sort of "moon blood" associations? Obviously Lilith is a gloss for various Middle Eastern, North African and European ophidian goddesses and all the sea dragon, sea monsterr, and tentacle monster (from Tiamat to Medusa to Lovecraft) imagery. But taking it further, and circling back to Baphomet and alchemy, this all ties into Tantric ideas about Kundalini or "serpent power", which is the very foundation of western alchemy. In legend, after beheading the Gorgon Medusa Perceus flies to Media where he performs a Soma ritual using a kapala made from Medusa's skull. Soma, or Amrita, is the "nectar of the Gods" and the "philosophers stone" of Alchemy. This substance has heavy associations with the Moon. But it should be noted, Perceus drinks his Soma out of a kapala, a ritual bowl made from the cranial vault of a human (or in this case a weird serpent monster) skull. The cranial vault happens to be the location where, after rising through the body, the Kundalini or serpent energy "explodes." Once harnessed, these substances, and this energy, is said to enlighten and grant immortality. So all this imagery ultimately leads to conquering death. Hmmm...
@@DavidLightbringer but only if you accept the given timeline, right? But not if you subscribe to the idea that the Night's King isn't the 13th Lord Commander of the Night’s Watch. If you question one of two aspects in order to creator the timeline heresy shouldn’t more thing be up in the air to shuffle around or conflate?
Just need to point out that menses is referred to as moonblood because there's roughly the space of a full cycle of the moon between cycles of menses. Average of 28 days for menses and 29.5 days in the lunar cycle. The phase of the moon has nothing to do with it, nor does it bring it on.
Oh yes, absolutely - what I was trying to say is that it has been thought that the moon affects a women's monthly cycle. Martin likes to play on old wives' tales and folkloric superstition, I have found. I wasn't trying to spread pseudoscience, ha ha. Thanks for the clarification in case anyone was confused.
Lucifer means Lightbringer periods are obvs super important ;). I don't often encounter someone even more afflicted with logorrhea/prolixity than I am, it's impressive! :D. You'd probably even be able to answer my burning question :P
Well, you just taught me a couple of new words, but they don't seem very complimentary. I definitely try to use as few words as possible, but it's just not possible to explain and demonstrate the poetic symbolism of Martin's writing in concise manner. It's tangled and esoteric by nature. I'd like to think I have improved as I have gone along. If you've made it this far, it must not be too bad. ;) This episode in particular was a bit of a turning point, and led to a whole new series of ideas and discoveries re: the weirwoods and Yggdrasil / Odin symbolism. Burning question, which would be..?
Lucifer means Lightbringer I guess it depends on who you talk to as to whether they'd be complimentary. I personally enjoy long, detailed...almost pedantic...blogs and videos. Other people think 15 min is an eternity lol. But no, it was good natured teasing. I enjoy your content and since you seem to have a background as a folklorist(?) you have the foundation to build the theories on, instead of looking at only textual hints, if that makes sense. Since I am typically in the position of never getting quite enough...well...these are great. You may enjoy the lore behind the Dark Souls/Bloodborne video game series. It's pretty neat how it was done through an interactive medium. For your content, there may be redundancy that could be cleaned up, but that would be on a per blog or video basis, because each one has to be at least somewhat consumable as it's own entity. But that's not a criticism, and may be a matter of personal taste. Do you have a messenger or chat program that's a bit more convenient for an old lady like myself to nerd ASoIaF with you? Lol
I just happened to bump into this because of a Game Thrones search. I must say I am confused because of my ignorance about the subject and I am ignorant on Theology as well. What is this? Is it a religion? A Theological discipline? A fable or an imaginary religion?
It's a podcast analyzing the use of symbolism and mythology in A Song of Ice and Fire, the books behind game of thrones. Check out the video pinned at the top of the front page of the channel here for a basic summary if that sounds interesting. :)
i recommend an lp by a band called jasper the lp is called liberation it has 3 songs called lberation all with great orchestration part 2 would fit GOT posts it also has a great version of baby please dont go.just a suggestion i like the guitar player on some of your posts his got some great skills great post peace..
I love all these things you point out in the text, but sometimes, I wonder what the point you're trying to make is. I sincerely enjoy it and I am sure you make conclusions but maybe they get lost in everything? I just kind of wonder what the macro meaning is sometimes of all this stuff you are mining.
DaKingInDaNorf I agree to an extent, but I think that almost all of the explanations & interpretations that LML presents (time after time) are done in such a way that the listener gets the lesson engraved in their memory. He uses the phrase 'chapter review' quite a lot, and there's definitely a reason behind it.
If George is seriously trying to portray Bloodstone/Lightbringer/Jon as some kind of evil Jesus/western Christianity who's killed our mother goddess/Dany/Nyssa Nyssa/Eastern mysticism, he's actually one damn fearless and angry ex-catholic 😂
If the war between opposites is the source of suffering in the ASoIaF-world then I think either character trying to kill/defeat the other will lead to more suffering. The key is for both aspects to be peacefully united, separate but also part of a whole. This sounds more like Eastern mysticism than Western but it also means that the Western aspect can not be wholly discounted. It is not an enemy to be destroyed, it is an opposite to be embraced.
2 people I listen to talk about very diffrent contexts, bit they both end up talking about myths, archetyps and babylionian god marduk (spelling?): LmL analysing asoiaf and... Jordan f'ing peterson talking about the lessons to be pulled from religion (his biblical lectures) those 2 have absolutely nothing in commen, yet they both end up analyzing ancient middle eastern mytholygie.
I really listened to this almost to the end, to the last part, where you said you would feed your claims with "evidence". first off, i must say your repeated use of the word "evidence" is very loose. you have gathered hints that fit your narrative, but you cannot prove these theories, probably not even when the series is finished. now to be more specific. let's talk about your example of tyrion's arm representing the arm of dorne being hammered. I could probably find a dozen other pieces of text, where something is hammering down on something and could draw conclusion totally different from yours, because i cherry picked examples. you have to realise how many thousands of words GRRM has written - there are bound to be similarities in language. even someone es eloquent as him can't find new parallels everytime. I am not saying that aren't certain signs and hints like the winter rose to be name just a very obvious one, but i find it rather peculiar, how you draw conclusions. i just recently wateched a video on youtube, where George himself said that he couldn't even remember everything he had written about the Free Cities prior to AWOIAF. He doesn't remember everything and he is not going to include Gods in the books. And if he admittedly can't remember eye colours from time to time, than i doubt things like that are always bound to have a special meaning. same with the living flames. these pictures arya described are not new at all. describing flames as something living is something very common. and you also have to ask; why would George choose these scenes? I get that very important scenes in the series are heavy with symbols, but you cannot expect george to put this "evidence" in random scenes. it would be way to much work and planning. he has to tell the story, the "present" story first that already is a huge deal. but nevertheless, i appreciate how deep you dove into these things and i am not saying everything you presented here is wrong or absurd. I also admire your love for lyrical interpretation and reading between the lines. something that i think George really is encouraging us to do.
![เจ็บที่ยังฮัก - ม่อน วรวิทย์ [ Official Mv ] จอนนี่มิวสิค](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/KALIGSRSjFs/mqdefault.jpg)
I can barely follow this because I'm old and my kids never stop yelling, but holy geez is it interesting. Amazing work.
O
K
Gotta say, moon blooding sometimes (most times) does feel like a cataclysmic death
Notifications is the Truth i don't even watch TV no more lol
Now we know why GRRM takes so long to finish a book.there is layer upon layer of mythical and astronomical symbology in every single chapter. Woven seamlessly with the foreshadowing, Genius.The Grey King and The Long Nights Watch made me a fanatic of The Church of Starry Wisdom. It is now CANNON.
what i wonder is, has he ended up putting too large of a burden on himself with how much he's woven throughout the books? like, dude struggled with the "mereenese knot" and he has to end the entire book series somehow now lol
Just found your channel after your live video with ideas of ice and fire, but recognized your name from a forum of ice and fire. Thanks for making these into videos, much respect for the amount of work you put into your theories.
Thanks Nick! It's a lot of work but it has a momentum of its own that drives me forward. Solving puzzles is just the best thing ever :)
I'm wondering if Qhorin's name sounds like "corn" for a reason. Jon is the Corn King so maybe this is another way George is reminding us of that.
Ooh I've never heard anyone point that out, but it makes sense when you read Qhorin's story about losing his fingers. Nice!
This is my stuff bro! The old mythos of Europa & all people's... Adding it to ASOIAF...I've been doing that myself this whole time & boom...here's someone who mashes both together like my insane brain does!
Valar dohæris...!
Obsessed with how the female sea monster wrecking havoc on the land theme is present. Sounds like the ancient Sumerian Tiamat idea.
Interestingly, vikings would make their dwellings from their upturned ships too. It definitely fits.
I mean, if a thing is worth doing, it’s worth doing right... I’m glad I came just for that crucial metal jam at the beginning.
Ah back when I had permission to use Animals as Leaders... that ended when they’d witched record labels unfortunately
He's not the Messiah, he's a very naughty boy!
I love your work, so much research and details... But I have a question, maybe you have already addressed it, but why would the seastone chair and others of the same description would be actual "stone" ? The only thing that tells me it couldn't be an actual meteor is the fact that Asshai is entirely made of it.... and supposedly the largest city ever built.That means a HUGE piece of moon. I have heard a theory in which the oily black stone is "the opposite of the weirwood", meaning the black-barked trees from which the leaves are taken for the shade-of-the-evening.
Might be that this wood too turn to stone after thousand of years ? Since there is a possible entire forest of it south of Asshai, it tickles my imagination !
Thank you in advance for your enlightened opinion, I found so very little about those trees that seem to appear like "the weirwood of Essos".. even wondered what would result if the red leaves were used instead of those famous ink-blue ones.
Yeah I like the idea that oily black stone is something like ancient fossilized/petrified (?) Wierwood
Hey man. Watched u on Robert's livestream!! Can't WAIT to get into your videos!!
What if the fact that so many people see the comet, ascribe meaning to it, and attribute it's symbolism to their own individual lives is GRRM illustrating his own conception of astrology/astronomy? The comet itself doesn't have power over people's lives, but the fact that they observe it as such a significant, personal event makes it powerful in that sense? Kind of a "mass human consciousness creates myth and meaning to our experiences, and we in turn create a reality of history and society out of that" idea ?
YESSA
yaaaaay I can finally come back to this playlist!!
I believe moon blood is called that because a woman's cycle spans the same time as a moon cycle. it doesn't get triggered by it, that would be weird and all women would have their period at the same time.
right you are. tho there are people who think we all get it at the full moon 🤷🏻♀️
So amazing! Loving every second even though I'm sure I don't understand even 40% of it all. \,,/
Back at the library, paying my omen to the algorithm. 🦑 those crafty little krakens... 🤔 idk why I feel like this has something to do with the Wall, and possibly the Black Gate itself. 🌊⛈🌊
Well, the tentacles of the Cracken or a symbolic parallel to the roots of a tree, that’s spelled out a couple times. So think about that, and what the implications could be. The weirwoods are like “sea monsters” or maybe the Others
Im being 100% serious and would love an answer; At any point have we confirmed all the solar/lunar symbolism with GRRM or is this just speculative fan fic? It tells an enjoyable story but seems to be more LML's story at this point then GRRM's?
See the video where George answers LML's question on a panel
First time going through this compendium! Super excited about it. Very interesting comparisons between naga and weirwoods, definitely going to look for this in my re-reads. Wish i would have listened before i made my drowned god/dess piece :).
We gonna talk about how in Kabbalistic lore the two sea creatures are Leviathan and Behemoth, and Behemoth is gelded specifically to keep the pair from mating because their union will will "undo" creation? How about that the same lore brings in a THIRD dragon, tanin'iver, or "the blind dragon", who joins the pair and facilitates their union as some form of sexual intermediary? Yes, that makes them a three headed sea dragon. (This triad also inspires the alchemical symbol Baphomet but I havent worked out how that's relevant here yet) How about that the same lore identifies Leviathan as another name for Lilith, literally a "Night's Queen" avatar, which also brings in all sort of "moon blood" associations? Obviously Lilith is a gloss for various Middle Eastern, North African and European ophidian goddesses and all the sea dragon, sea monsterr, and tentacle monster (from Tiamat to Medusa to Lovecraft) imagery. But taking it further, and circling back to Baphomet and alchemy, this all ties into Tantric ideas about Kundalini or "serpent power", which is the very foundation of western alchemy. In legend, after beheading the Gorgon Medusa Perceus flies to Media where he performs a Soma ritual using a kapala made from Medusa's skull. Soma, or Amrita, is the "nectar of the Gods" and the "philosophers stone" of Alchemy. This substance has heavy associations with the Moon. But it should be noted, Perceus drinks his Soma out of a kapala, a ritual bowl made from the cranial vault of a human (or in this case a weird serpent monster) skull. The cranial vault happens to be the location where, after rising through the body, the Kundalini or serpent energy "explodes." Once harnessed, these substances, and this energy, is said to enlighten and grant immortality. So all this imagery ultimately leads to conquering death. Hmmm...
I’m with you
LML you have great take on Ice and Fire. I wish you would Histiry of Westeros on an actual video of yours not just a pod cast.
Thoughts on the Grey King actually being Brandon the Shipwright after he sailed away from the North?
Brandon the Shipwright is a metaphor and not old enough to be Grey King. this is long night stuff
@@DavidLightbringer but only if you accept the given timeline, right? But not if you subscribe to the idea that the Night's King isn't the 13th Lord Commander of the Night’s Watch. If you question one of two aspects in order to creator the timeline heresy shouldn’t more thing be up in the air to shuffle around or conflate?
Just need to point out that menses is referred to as moonblood because there's roughly the space of a full cycle of the moon between cycles of menses. Average of 28 days for menses and 29.5 days in the lunar cycle. The phase of the moon has nothing to do with it, nor does it bring it on.
Oh yes, absolutely - what I was trying to say is that it has been thought that the moon affects a women's monthly cycle. Martin likes to play on old wives' tales and folkloric superstition, I have found. I wasn't trying to spread pseudoscience, ha ha. Thanks for the clarification in case anyone was confused.
Lucifer means Lightbringer periods are obvs super important ;). I don't often encounter someone even more afflicted with logorrhea/prolixity than I am, it's impressive! :D. You'd probably even be able to answer my burning question :P
Well, you just taught me a couple of new words, but they don't seem very complimentary. I definitely try to use as few words as possible, but it's just not possible to explain and demonstrate the poetic symbolism of Martin's writing in concise manner. It's tangled and esoteric by nature. I'd like to think I have improved as I have gone along. If you've made it this far, it must not be too bad. ;) This episode in particular was a bit of a turning point, and led to a whole new series of ideas and discoveries re: the weirwoods and Yggdrasil / Odin symbolism.
Burning question, which would be..?
Lucifer means Lightbringer I guess it depends on who you talk to as to whether they'd be complimentary. I personally enjoy long, detailed...almost pedantic...blogs and videos. Other people think 15 min is an eternity lol. But no, it was good natured teasing. I enjoy your content and since you seem to have a background as a folklorist(?) you have the foundation to build the theories on, instead of looking at only textual hints, if that makes sense. Since I am typically in the position of never getting quite enough...well...these are great. You may enjoy the lore behind the Dark Souls/Bloodborne video game series. It's pretty neat how it was done through an interactive medium.
For your content, there may be redundancy that could be cleaned up, but that would be on a per blog or video basis, because each one has to be at least somewhat consumable as it's own entity. But that's not a criticism, and may be a matter of personal taste.
Do you have a messenger or chat program that's a bit more convenient for an old lady like myself to nerd ASoIaF with you? Lol
yeah, message me on twitter @thedragonLML
I just happened to bump into this because of a Game Thrones search.
I must say I am confused because of my ignorance about the subject and I am ignorant on Theology as well.
What is this? Is it a religion? A Theological discipline? A fable or an imaginary religion?
It's a podcast analyzing the use of symbolism and mythology in A Song of Ice and Fire, the books behind game of thrones. Check out the video pinned at the top of the front page of the channel here for a basic summary if that sounds interesting. :)
Could dragons be the gods of everywhere basically? the old gods, the god who came from the heavens etc?
i recommend an lp by a band called jasper the lp is called liberation it has 3 songs called lberation all with great orchestration part 2 would fit GOT posts it also has a great version of baby please dont go.just a suggestion i like the guitar player on some of your posts his got some great skills great post peace..
💜💜💜💜💜❤🔥❤🔥❤🔥❤🔥❤🔥
I love all these things you point out in the text, but sometimes, I wonder what the point you're trying to make is. I sincerely enjoy it and I am sure you make conclusions but maybe they get lost in everything? I just kind of wonder what the macro meaning is sometimes of all this stuff you are mining.
DaKingInDaNorf
I agree to an extent, but I think that almost all of the explanations & interpretations that LML presents (time after time) are done in such a way that the listener gets the lesson engraved in their memory. He uses the phrase 'chapter review' quite a lot, and there's definitely a reason behind it.
If George is seriously trying to portray Bloodstone/Lightbringer/Jon as some kind of evil Jesus/western Christianity who's killed our mother goddess/Dany/Nyssa Nyssa/Eastern mysticism, he's actually one damn fearless and angry ex-catholic 😂
If the war between opposites is the source of suffering in the ASoIaF-world then I think either character trying to kill/defeat the other will lead to more suffering. The key is for both aspects to be peacefully united, separate but also part of a whole. This sounds more like Eastern mysticism than Western but it also means that the Western aspect can not be wholly discounted. It is not an enemy to be destroyed, it is an opposite to be embraced.
8:39
2 people I listen to talk about very diffrent contexts, bit they both end up talking about myths, archetyps and babylionian god marduk (spelling?):
LmL analysing asoiaf
and...
Jordan f'ing peterson talking about the lessons to be pulled from religion (his biblical lectures)
those 2 have absolutely nothing in commen, yet they both end up analyzing ancient middle eastern mytholygie.
MHWdJ This is called perennialism and it's nothing new.
I really listened to this almost to the end, to the last part, where you said you would feed your claims with "evidence". first off, i must say your repeated use of the word "evidence" is very loose. you have gathered hints that fit your narrative, but you cannot prove these theories, probably not even when the series is finished.
now to be more specific. let's talk about your example of tyrion's arm representing the arm of dorne being hammered. I could probably find a dozen other pieces of text, where something is hammering down on something and could draw conclusion totally different from yours, because i cherry picked examples. you have to realise how many thousands of words GRRM has written - there are bound to be similarities in language. even someone es eloquent as him can't find new parallels everytime. I am not saying that aren't certain signs and hints like the winter rose to be name just a very obvious one, but i find it rather peculiar, how you draw conclusions.
i just recently wateched a video on youtube, where George himself said that he couldn't even remember everything he had written about the Free Cities prior to AWOIAF. He doesn't remember everything and he is not going to include Gods in the books. And if he admittedly can't remember eye colours from time to time, than i doubt things like that are always bound to have a special meaning. same with the living flames. these pictures arya described are not new at all. describing flames as something living is something very common.
and you also have to ask; why would George choose these scenes? I get that very important scenes in the series are heavy with symbols, but you cannot expect george to put this "evidence" in random scenes. it would be way to much work and planning. he has to tell the story, the "present" story first that already is a huge deal.
but nevertheless, i appreciate how deep you dove into these things and i am not saying everything you presented here is wrong or absurd. I also admire your love for lyrical interpretation and reading between the lines. something that i think George really is encouraging us to do.