I moved from a 3 door zf m140 to a og m2 6mt and I absolutely love it. I did have them both for a few weeks or so while I was waiting on the sale of the m140i and drove them back to back plenty of times. My 140 had birds b1 suspension, all the m3 control arms,rear subframe bushes and lsd full geo ect, and still couldn’t touch the stock m2 in regards to handling, steering response and the that direct feel from the rear end that gives so much more confidence to take corners at speed and drift. In the look’s department not once did I have anyone comment on the 140, even being 6years old the m2 still has people asking what it is and saying how good it looks or sounds. Since owing it I’ve had the litchfield AST suspension kit, and Stage 2+ and it’s quite simply perfect as it is and no plans to replace it any time soon.
Great vid Tim, thank you. I think the M140i is an incredible car, to even be compared to an M2. The M2CS/M2 is 3 times the price, so for what it is, the M140i is an absolute performance bargain.
Anyone looking at these as a comparison remember it’s 2700 quid just for the rotors on the m2 and need changing around 30k that’s not including the brake pads which is just over 100 quid for one ...
The M140i needs a lot of mods to be on the level of driver focus, handling and engagement like the M2, but the B58 engine does not, on the contrary, it is a better and stronger powerplant than the N55.
To me as i looked into getting m2 comp for using is as daily there is no point swapping from m140i .As a weekend toy and trackday weapon yes but with adding few bits to m140 like b12 pro kit and LSD i think there is no point taking into consideration that engine in m140i. I think it would be a step backwards but thats just my opinion. As a second car for weekends maybe..but then there are other options like porsche gt4 and thats just pure porn 😜
You need a shit load parts (lsd, bushings, arms, coils, brakes...) and after all you are still short of an ///M car for resell value. Is it worth it? Everyone has to decide by themselves.
@@margauxlowery4324 You need to sink well over 10k into an m140 to bring it anywhere near the m2 standards and you aint getting any of that money back out of it. The m2 is a no brainer. The only reason you would choose an m140 is either you cant afford to get an m2 or you need the practicality of a 4 doors and slightly better mpg. Handling, Looks and resale are all massively in favour of the m2.
@@strongerandwiser2023 wrong. LSD is in 2k range, suspension and brakes can't be 8k. M2 isn't that special, in fact many ///Ms are moded because they left factory with mediocre setup for the track.
This message is for Tim and all that replied to my post regarding do you need a diff for a m140i and anyone else that wants to respond....my question is does the m140i need a BMW factory fitted diff or a Birds Quaife diff ?...I'm hoping any responses will say a BMW diff because it's cheaper and will do the same job ...ps I bought my m140i built to order on a 19 plate with adaptive suspension 🤔
@@TimWilliamsHD I dont doubt the m2 is set up a lot better than the m140i, HOWEVER for all the mods you did on the m140i you didnt change the dampers did you? They are literally a big part holding back the road control and stability on the road, most people just do springs whereas its the dampers thats the issue and noone ever replaces them and then talks about bad handling.
Hi Tim. Nice content. As an ex racer I’ve been through a few performance cars, I’m just about to trade in my car for an OG M2. I actually had a m140 a few years ago, first thing I did was put Bilstein B14 coil overs on it. Epic engine no doubt and decent economy when not hooning. Struggled finding pads that worked without fading badly went through DS2500 etc, though I’m going to have same problem with M2. What did you use on yours ? Likely I’m going to wind up with Ohlins or BMW performance coilovers but I’ll see how it is first. I found the 140 a bit one dimensional when pushing hard, particularly steering feel and occasionally body control even with the Bilstein kit, though it can cover the ground very quickly always felt a bit removed from the action.
Great video Tim very good indeed...Just one question when you said you need the diff for the m140i...do you feel the diff is still needed on the m140i if you have adaptive suspension ? I feel the m140i with adaptive suspension in sports mode with the 8 speed zf sorts out the back end !
It depends strongly how hard you hoon the car. I suggest trying to push your M140i to the very limit in the appropriate environment, and then do the same in an M140i with LSD or an M2. That will be the answer to your question. An M140i, adaptive suspension or not doesn't have a very capable suspension to start with when you're pushing it, it's basically the same car like a 116i M sport with better brakes and beefy engine. It's okay when driving it as a daily within the speed limits with on occasional acceleration, but anything beyond that an LSD and better suspension will improve the M140i's handling and sharpness by a lot. It really depends on what you are used to and what sort of a driver you are 😊 Nonetheless the M140i is a great car with an accessible pricepoint and unlimited potential, just depends how far you want to take it ($$$) and if it isn't better to just go for an M2. Tim's comparison with the M2 is mostly how I would describe it too 👍 I do want to point out though that even a full stock M140i B58 is a little bit faster than a fully stock M2 N55 on a straight line to start with, even if on paper the M2 N55 has more power supposedly.
@@zdx197 I see your point but most people don't go on the track which makes an m140i with a diff or M2 surplus to requirements on normal roads unless you're a hooligan that doesn't care about your licence 🙄...I don't think the M2 is worth the extra money to a m140i unless you're a purist..In saying that tho the new M2 is coming out next year and if it looks as good as the photos it's an absolute gem !...which means the current M2 will bottom out making them more affordable ☺️
The diff is definitely needed even if your not a hooligan. You feel it’s benefits every drive. The extra grip feels nice which in turn makes the car feel even better. I’ve now moved to the M2 and it takes it to another level but the 140 was a special car.
@@giftorreid8876 you don't need to take your M140i out on the track or drive it like an absolute tit to gain benefits from an LSD. i.e. driving semi-sporty on a damp surface (and when I see these UK youtubers, it is always raining lol) within the speed limits accelerating will push the car straight to where you point it (basically the car being more safe having proper feedback and predictability), you are just way faster on the limit with the open diff (the car "searching" for traction, not knowing whether your left or right wheel is going to spin), especially with the B58 having such a torquey mid-range. And this is just one quick example. Anyways, we could talk about this for days but some things are just better to put to the test in real life. If you're happy as it is, then there is no need to justify it for yourself.
B58 is a way better engine in every way , n55 is a closed deck which makes it fragile with lots of mechanical parts that’s tend to fail, water pump charge pipe etc, b58 much more solid and is a closed deck that can take way more power , b58 also has a diesel bottom end block that makes it extremely resistant. So no .. I wouldn’t go for the m2. You made a huge mistake buddy
![[LIVE] : ONE ลุมพินี 89 | คู่เอก "ยอดไอคิว vs คิริลล์"](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/Z3vYkHJ_5Ig/mqdefault.jpg)
I moved from a 3 door zf m140 to a og m2 6mt and I absolutely love it.
I did have them both for a few weeks or so while I was waiting on the sale of the m140i and drove them back to back plenty of times.
My 140 had birds b1 suspension, all the m3 control arms,rear subframe bushes and lsd full geo ect, and still couldn’t touch the stock m2 in regards to handling, steering response and the that direct feel from the rear end that gives so much more confidence to take corners at speed and drift.
In the look’s department not once did I have anyone comment on the 140, even being 6years old the m2 still has people asking what it is and saying how good it looks or sounds.
Since owing it I’ve had the litchfield AST suspension kit, and Stage 2+ and it’s quite simply perfect as it is and no plans to replace it any time soon.
Ah sounds the same as how I felt dude!
Great vid Tim, thank you.
I think the M140i is an incredible car, to even be compared to an M2.
The M2CS/M2 is 3 times the price, so for what it is, the M140i is an absolute performance bargain.
Stock m2 exhaust sound is so much better than stock m140i..
Facts :)
The M140i has a very loose rear end, not from the lack of a diff (also a separate issue) but from the suspension and bushes.
Loads to do in an mlite to get to m car level but that’s the fun part!
@@TimWilliamsHD I am not looking to make mine like an M (too harsh for daily) but the loose wobbly rear end is terrible.
@@keithw4920 you tried power flex bushes? About 140 quid all in all and works great
Totally agree with you Tim. After recently moving from m135i to M2. Not the best daily compared to mlites but amazing car for these B roads blasts!
exactly right mate! have you done any coding yet? CS Flash is a game changer! Hit up defined coding for some bits!
Top vid
Gotta give a shout out the the m135i lci. The n55 in that sounds a lot better then the b58 in the m140i
Definitely!
Thank you! Cheers!
Please like and sub for more!
i love that your exhaust tips are also burned dark like mine 😂 mine where chrome in the beginning
Anyone looking at these as a comparison remember it’s 2700 quid just for the rotors on the m2 and need changing around 30k that’s not including the brake pads which is just over 100 quid for one ...
Now this is what we all wanted to see, what’s your preference? I feel like the B58 needs a fair amount of mods to be on the same level...
The M140i needs a lot of mods to be on the level of driver focus, handling and engagement like the M2, but the B58 engine does not, on the contrary, it is a better and stronger powerplant than the N55.
m2 for everything but engine haha!
@@zdx197 definitely agree with this, also the look and feel of an M2
M140i pulls a lot harder than an M2 I think
Not that much in it to be honest M2 370 stock with 500nm overboost vs m140 350 stock with 500nm
Interesting review of the 2.
thanks mate!
Fair comparison from a fellow M2 owner 😎
To me as i looked into getting m2 comp for using is as daily there is no point swapping from m140i .As a weekend toy and trackday weapon yes but with adding few bits to m140 like b12 pro kit and LSD i think there is no point taking into consideration that engine in m140i. I think it would be a step backwards but thats just my opinion. As a second car for weekends maybe..but then there are other options like porsche gt4 and thats just pure porn 😜
You need a shit load parts (lsd, bushings, arms, coils, brakes...) and after all you are still short of an ///M car for resell value. Is it worth it? Everyone has to decide by themselves.
@@margauxlowery4324 You need to sink well over 10k into an m140 to bring it anywhere near the m2 standards and you aint getting any of that money back out of it. The m2 is a no brainer. The only reason you would choose an m140 is either you cant afford to get an m2 or you need the practicality of a 4 doors and slightly better mpg. Handling, Looks and resale are all massively in favour of the m2.
@@strongerandwiser2023 wrong. LSD is in 2k range, suspension and brakes can't be 8k. M2 isn't that special, in fact many ///Ms are moded because they left factory with mediocre setup for the track.
Great comparison. Will be nice to collaborate one day. M2 vs BMW Sports+ Hybrid
Very nice Video, so would you recommend to switch from an m140i to an m2 as a Upgrade?
Doesn't worth the extra money, bro!
Really enjoyed this !
Thanks for watching mate!
"National speed limit, you know how it is". YES MATE ! LOVE IT :)
Looool
Excellent content again. Tim you are awesome.
❤140i manual gearbox 3 door lsd mperf
This message is for Tim and all that replied to my post regarding do you need a diff for a m140i and anyone else that wants to respond....my question is does the m140i need a BMW factory fitted diff or a Birds Quaife diff ?...I'm hoping any responses will say a BMW diff because it's cheaper and will do the same job ...ps I bought my m140i built to order on a 19 plate with adaptive suspension 🤔
Either diff is great and tbh unless you track it you won’t notice the difference 😆
@@TimWilliamsHD 🧢👍🏾
Smashed it as always
Cheers mate!
going from a b58 to an n55 is not an upgrade.
M140i with N55 whould be so Fucking awesome 👏🏻
I’m the opposite bro, b58 in an m2 would be 😍
@@TimWilliamsHD nah s55 is the better engine out of all midrange inline 6
I’d still go b58 due to sound
M140i with N55 exists and is called M135i
@@nikolal.4502 I know…. But a M140i with the N55 from the M2
Where can you find a pair of white canards like the ones on the M140?
They’re wrapped mate
Tim, so m140i with LSD or M2... Considering prices?
M2 deffo! Body control is different level!
@@TimWilliamsHD I dont doubt the m2 is set up a lot better than the m140i, HOWEVER for all the mods you did on the m140i you didnt change the dampers did you? They are literally a big part holding back the road control and stability on the road, most people just do springs whereas its the dampers thats the issue and noone ever replaces them and then talks about bad handling.
@@amacke4736 Everyone on youtube just does springs then complains about the handling, noone ever changes the bloody dampers, the worst bit! 😂
Hi Tim. Nice content. As an ex racer I’ve been through a few performance cars, I’m just about to trade in my car for an OG M2. I actually had a m140 a few years ago, first thing I did was put Bilstein B14 coil overs on it. Epic engine no doubt and decent economy when not hooning. Struggled finding pads that worked without fading badly went through DS2500 etc, though I’m going to have same problem with M2. What did you use on yours ?
Likely I’m going to wind up with Ohlins or BMW performance coilovers but I’ll see how it is first.
I found the 140 a bit one dimensional when pushing hard, particularly steering feel and occasionally body control even with the Bilstein kit, though it can cover the ground very quickly always felt a bit removed from the action.
I used EBC blue stuff day to day and RPX on track bud…Williams performance can sort out a package deal for ya!
Imagine the B58 with M3/4 internals
That’s the dream 😆
Well done Tim! Nice vid. You gotta get that diffuser sorted though mate, get Jack on the case for goodness sake!!
Deffo! Dealing with one bit at a time!
Great video Tim very good indeed...Just one question when you said you need the diff for the m140i...do you feel the diff is still needed on the m140i if you have adaptive suspension ? I feel the m140i with adaptive suspension in sports mode with the 8 speed zf sorts out the back end !
Deffo.
It depends strongly how hard you hoon the car. I suggest trying to push your M140i to the very limit in the appropriate environment, and then do the same in an M140i with LSD or an M2. That will be the answer to your question.
An M140i, adaptive suspension or not doesn't have a very capable suspension to start with when you're pushing it, it's basically the same car like a 116i M sport with better brakes and beefy engine. It's okay when driving it as a daily within the speed limits with on occasional acceleration, but anything beyond that an LSD and better suspension will improve the M140i's handling and sharpness by a lot.
It really depends on what you are used to and what sort of a driver you are 😊
Nonetheless the M140i is a great car with an accessible pricepoint and unlimited potential, just depends how far you want to take it ($$$) and if it isn't better to just go for an M2. Tim's comparison with the M2 is mostly how I would describe it too 👍 I do want to point out though that even a full stock M140i B58 is a little bit faster than a fully stock M2 N55 on a straight line to start with, even if on paper the M2 N55 has more power supposedly.
@@zdx197 I see your point but most people don't go on the track which makes an m140i with a diff or M2 surplus to requirements on normal roads unless you're a hooligan that doesn't care about your licence 🙄...I don't think the M2 is worth the extra money to a m140i unless you're a purist..In saying that tho the new M2 is coming out next year and if it looks as good as the photos it's an absolute gem !...which means the current M2 will bottom out making them more affordable ☺️
The diff is definitely needed even if your not a hooligan. You feel it’s benefits every drive. The extra grip feels nice which in turn makes the car feel even better. I’ve now moved to the M2 and it takes it to another level but the 140 was a special car.
@@giftorreid8876 you don't need to take your M140i out on the track or drive it like an absolute tit to gain benefits from an LSD. i.e. driving semi-sporty on a damp surface (and when I see these UK youtubers, it is always raining lol) within the speed limits accelerating will push the car straight to where you point it (basically the car being more safe having proper feedback and predictability), you are just way faster on the limit with the open diff (the car "searching" for traction, not knowing whether your left or right wheel is going to spin), especially with the B58 having such a torquey mid-range. And this is just one quick example.
Anyways, we could talk about this for days but some things are just better to put to the test in real life. If you're happy as it is, then there is no need to justify it for yourself.
what type of exhaust system for late 2018 m140i would pass mot and legal
m2 definitely takes it for handling/overall feel,but the 140/240 takes it for power/performance.Nice lil review bruh.Now i gotta wait another week smh
No doubt bro!
m140i looks like such a cool car to own. Sadly not in US.
Great daily!
@TimWilliamsHD is it b58?
Where can I get a white engine cover like that
The price difference add be picking the m140i
Value for money came out as a draw...not sure about that
70mph where do you get that from a single A road are 60 mph I believe
Hear me out.... m140i with m2 front bumper 😮
M2 if you are old, m140 if your young.
Thats not a upgrade, the M140i is available with xdrive, and delivers a lot of more torque.. the handling of the whole car is quite different also.
Not in uk mate
You can do a import:) The M140i will destroy the M2
The M2 will still hold more value and out style the 140i even 10 years from now.@@mathiaswestbye6425
M140i, Power > handling 👀😂
Don’t you start again 😂 thought we had you on board
Once I pull the finger out and get some handling things done then I’m sure I will agree!! But, until that day... ITS POWER FTW 🙄😂😂
M140i Is better
M2 rear is ugly compared to 140i
That rear looks like a gti so no thank you
B58 is a way better engine in every way , n55 is a closed deck which makes it fragile with lots of mechanical parts that’s tend to fail, water pump charge pipe etc, b58 much more solid and is a closed deck that can take way more power , b58 also has a diesel bottom end block that makes it extremely resistant. So no .. I wouldn’t go for the m2. You made a huge mistake buddy
m2 n55 is much stronger then regular n55,so m2 hand down better then m140i
Please educate yourself on the n55 in the m2.