I broke $294 of endmills on a $275 part
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 21 ธ.ค. 2024
- You win some, and you lose some. In this case I ended up losing money on this part. A combination of fixturing difficulties and fragile tools did me in.
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More than learning how to do this part, you learned something way more important:
(not including regularly used inserted tooling)
If the job doesn't cover 2x the tooling cost+profit, then RUN.
Glad to have your videos back, great to follow your journey
Thanks! With the new business model there is a lot more for me to show and talk about, so more will be coming!
i‘ve dome some small heatsinks with bosses on the underside and ended up making a super glue fixture with pockets for the bosses. Also cutting the fins with a slitting saw worked great.
All the best & thanks for sharing the great and the not so great moments! For me watching the later are usually more valuable. Hope the next job is more boring for us and more valuable for you!! All the best.
Thanks! I'm glad you are enjoying!
Super glue probably would have worked here. Slitting saw unfortunately would not have, or not by itself anyway, as there were some features at the bottom of the fins. Nothing crazy but some radii and slopes you couldn't have gotten with a saw.
I've made some really thin parts like how you described. We made a small dovetail as a firat op and then cut all the fins then made an aluminum insert to clamp the part in the opposite direction that you described. Then we just cut the dovetail off.
One of the hardest and most important skills to master when starting off or your a 1 man operation is knowing what jobs not to take…and avoid @ all costs..I’ve been an applications engineer for 35 years now I’ve seen many a shop go under by taking on jobs that simply can’t be made unless you spend £100k on fixtures&tooling..it’s business and financial suicide..it’s hard when your a new and starting out to turn work away..but in some cases it makes much more sense to say no
That’s exactly it. Well said. As a one man shop doing welding this is a big part of the game. You need to identify not only the jobs to not take but the customers to not work for. 😂
years ago, a customer came to me with a part that i made months ago, and wanted me to do a revision update on, it required a form tool, and i used the form tool that i originally used on the job, tool broke because i put the part wrong way around. took two weeks to get the new tool, setup took 15mins and run time less than 30 seconds, and just 10 pieces.
so you can guess how much money was lost on that job :D
ooof, that's painful 🫠
Hi, at 00:30, when you indicate the center of the chuck, do the left and right point perfect, then front, then left right again to perfect, then front. your chuck will be perfect like that now ( the back will be correct if your 3 points are OK).
Keep the videos coming :)
That makes sense! Thanks!
My advice.
1/16” and sometimes 3/64” diameter tools are the smallest you can cut with and not have to babysit a machine.
We never go below 1/32 unless it’s for engraving. Anything smaller isn’t worth the time and effort.
Stick to jobs that use 3/64” and larger and you won’t have to worry as much about losing your ass in Harvey tools lol.
So my theory is to specialize in work that most people can't, or don't want to take on. My machine generally handles small tools really well, so I can (normally) be a lot more competitive on jobs that require them. That didn't work out on this one, but generally I get pretty high margins.
I'd disagree on this. With the right cutting parameters and a good toolholding setup with minimal runout, I comfortably cut with 0.3mm to 1mm endmills on a regular basis. They're very stable and predictable.
@@AlMg1SiCu I’m not saying it’s impossible. When taking on low volume jobs, you need some type of standardization for tooling. You can’t comfortable create tool paths you can rely on with tools that small without running them a few times to prove them out. It’s even harder to make money doing that when you only have to make 10-20 parts. So if you can choose the work you take on, limiting the tool size for process reliability seems to make sense. We make about 15,000-20,000 micro engraved parts a year. Once I adopted this method we saved a ton of time, money, and headache. The other solution, is to just charge more.
I would have rotated the part 90° and used a slitting saw.
There were some features on the walls of the outer two slots, and the floor of the middle slot, that I couldn't do with a slitting saw.
fins way too thin to do that
Canard.....stole my thunder. I, too, was going to suggest wire edm 😊
BTW, thanks for sharing your screw-up. All of us learn far more from our mistakes than we do from our successes.
Thanks for sharing your methods!
I would've done the base side first, then made some slugs/mating sacrificial piece to fill the voids between the fins as I progressed, similar to what you used wax for. But by making a slug, you are putting a "roof" over it, and gives you an option to run a clamp on, transferring the pressure down into the bottom of the fin base, and into the soft jaws.
Everything is a learning experience, so well done!
That probably would have worked! I bet there is a hundred ways I could have done this part, but I managed to find 4 methods that didn't work first 🤣
@@AudacityMicro absolutely! Never a wrong way, so long as it gets done. Good job buddy!
I just wasted $80 worth of carbon fiber reinforced PPS filament on one print because I had one value configured for the wrong material. It happens.
Oof 😔
@@AudacityMicro if you’re not screwing up, you’re not learning.
I've been a one man job shop for 17 years. The WORST days by far are the days you literally have to pay to be at work. I feel you, when you break a $200 endmill on a $150 part, hopefully those days are few and far between. Go home, drink some beer, lick your wounds and try to remember the jobs you made good money on.
Yup. Sometimes these things happen. Hopefully less frequently as I get better 🤣
Next machine purchase wire or sinker EDM??? I wish its such awesome technology.
Now don't get me wrong, I know nothing about either 😅. But used sinkers don't seem to be that expensive. And at least mechanically they are simpler than mills.
@@AudacityMicro they are very dependent on maintenance… filters, fluid, etc. Buttttt they can do some crazy things.
I would do the bottom first hold it by the .02 (like you did the 2nd time) and flip-step down the top side, finishing the fins as you go down. Maybe even add a little draft to walls so tool is not rubbing.
I had a relieved tool, so no rubbing. But finishing as I went down would definitely help. I don't think I said it, but I didn't do that the first time, I did do that the second time. I think if I had to do this again I would have done it as a one Op, and used a slitting saw to tab off the finished part.
Man not sure that will work but give it a try. If the fins are about .10 thick they might catch in the saw blade teeth coming out of the cut. Maybe just break thru and pull out. Can't wait to see what you do.@@AudacityMicro
Looks like you bid on a part that needs a EDM
It definitely would have made it easier 😅. I'm definitely considering a sinker for my next machine purchase.
Rotate your indicator so the face is horizontal, facing up. No mirror needed.
I need to invest in a better indicator mount so I can do that. Maybe I'll make one as a quick shop project.
is it a Xometry job to pay you $275 for one part?
I've had xometry jobs range between $200ish and $1200 for a single part. Though a more average job on xometry for me would be more like $1000 for three parts.
What is causing that runout on your tools? Even accujunk (accupro) brand collets/holder have garenteed of TIR of .0003. Found your channel couple weeks ago love to see small self made shops. I work at a giant shop with about 60-70 machinists.
So after this video I did a little investigation, because I was confused too. Turns out there was a chip smooshed into the spindle taper. I do clean the taper pretty frequently, but this one was pretty well stuck, I had to use a piece brass to get it off. I suspect it's been there the whole time I've owned the machine.
@@AudacityMicro does your machine blow air through the taper between tool
Changes ? If not that would help a lot
you should buy some Chinese endmills for pcbs they are super cheap and i have had great luck with them
I use the PCB drill all the time, those are great! never tried the endmills
I'm pretty good with numbers. My opinion... that is not ideal
I"m pretty good with philosophy. That's a cost effective education...
Thought this was bam margera in the thumbnail.
Maybe it is 🤔
I believe you would want to machine a negative of it
I did consider that, but that would have required slots that were .010" across, and 3/8" deep.
Oh man.
😅
this is only meant to be constructive feedback, but I personally find it really hard to get interested/invested into the videos when that I cant see what you are making. I know things had to change for you to keep the channel going in terms of moving to the job shop format, but hopefully you can get some jobs where we can see the final product.
I very much agree with that. I would love to be able to show some more details. My goal for this year is to diversify so that Xometry isn't such a huge percentage of my income. That'll let me show more parts, and be a little safer for my shop in case xometry goes downhill.
For the first time in 7 years, TH-cam is actually paying out a little bit of money for me. It's not exactly life changing money, but it's enough where I can afford to spend a day or two a month making projects specifically for TH-cam. So if nothing else, I'll have some of those projects coming down the line. I need to get better at filming inside the machine too.
Fwiw I’m way more interested in the process than the trinket being made. The recent videos have been my favorites in a long time.
@@poetac15 i am also interested in the process, but i also like seeing the end result to get a better understanding of why certain setups or fixtures were needed. i love the deep dive super detailed long form content, but for some reason being prevented from seeing the parts themselves and having to film around them makes it harder for me to get as invested.
@@AudacityMicroim glad youtube is starting to pay out, i definitely cant imagine the stress level trying to make youtube full time work financially.
my Nomad desktop machine is purely used for making things for me, but i love learning/watching large machines and how machinists that use them solve different problems.
i wish you all the best, ill always be a fan no matter what you do and ill keep watching.
i broke 2 tools, only to scrap a part twice and then i just quit for the day 😂😂 somtimes its just not the right day
and its only 40€ in aluminium and 12€ for the endmills, but i am a student , so no income aside from summer jobs and i now have to order stock and endmills, since i dont have spares 😢
but thats just the machining Lifestyle
sometimes it's best to just walk away 😂. Half the time you figure out your problem with a little distance anyway.
Indicater skill need upgrade.
I have many skills that need an upgrade 😅
Dems the breaks...
You said frog pod incorrectly. please don’t let it happen again
I did, and I am ashamed 😞
You shouldn’t take on any more work you can’t share. You have people here willing to help but we can’t without seeing the part. Being a 10 year machinist who started in a garage, I understand what you’re going through, but some of your methods are way too time consuming for the work you’re doing.
Only take on work you can share lol. We can help.
I have a good support network of friends that I can ask for help. It definitely makes my videos worse to not be able to show the part, but best case scenario, I make about $20 for a video like this one. I'm not going to sacrifice my main income stream to help one that is literally just a hobby.
I am definitely slow, I'm lucky that I can afford to be slow, since my total overhead for running this shop is basically zero and I generally only take high margin work. As I get better at machining, and get some better equipment in here I'm sure I'll speed up a little over time.
What's you Instagram buddy
I'm Audacity Micro on Instagram now. (formerly Design The Everything).