Why Defensive Sucks, and a Guide to The Best Field Upgrades and Their Perks - Battlefield 4 (BF4)
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 16 ต.ค. 2024
- Let's talk about why the defensive field upgrade sucks, and what to use instead! A lot of people set and forget their field upgrade. Myself, the only time I really change them out is when I’m playing as an Engineer and I’m switching between blowing tanks up and blowing stuff up with tanks. Otherwise, I stick to very nearly the same field upgrades and perks all the time.
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The last Perk of combat medic is good for keeping a reparing engie alive.
Thanks for caring about us engineers ❤️ I'll happily repair a chopper all match if the pilot and gunners want to play the objective
Oh d
Outside of the horribe support upgrades, I'm actually a little disappointed by the anti-tank upgrade for not including sprint. Having that extra speed when you're trying to run around cover to dodge incoming vehicle fire would be HIGHLY useful as I've died MANY times because I was just a split second too slow rounding the corner on my cover.
They shouldn't have split the increase in maximum mines and deployment of mines into two sections and just left it as 1, and that would have left a slot open for sprint. Most ground vehicles run infra optics anyways and easily spot them. So I don't think it would be two OP being able to place all of your increased mine ammo at once.
Most of the time I run with m2 slams anyways as c4 without having to click to detonate anyway. So I'm only placing 3 at a time to begin with.
moonlitegram but that would cause some balancing issues
I don't think it would be that significant.
Ectos Insula id say engineers are already underpicked. plus, consoder how often you die to traps( slams or mines ). it probably wont do anything balance wise except make engineer more viable in the role it is intended to be viable in. right now the reason to go engineers is so you can rpg walls. i RARELY see a sapper engineer.
Take out ammo for indirect fire and your golden on support considering the mortar and xm25 are good gadgets
Darth you make some of the most high quality bf videos on youtube. Keep doing your thing man, you're going to develop a strong following soon enough.
Heal, Resupply and Repair unit perks can be very useful in classic mode. That being said, there should be a clear indication to other players you have them unlocked, so they would realize "Hey if I drive my LAV next to this tank, it'll repair me automatically". Also a slight range buff would have been a welcome addition, but I guess it's too late for that.
Any idea how fast the resupply, repair, and heal units work?
+Kuzidas 42 It appears to be slower than a torch.
Kuzidas 42 At a decent rate. However, the main issue is you don't really notice if you are repairing or healing someone next to your vehicle, unless you pay attention.
I like that revive transition. It was cool. It was like a natural transition in filming.
Indirect Fire used to be AMAZING for scout chopper pilots. Give your engineers unlimited rocket/stingers.
I am so thankful that I found this channel. You deserve wayyyyyy more subscribers.
14k subs doesn't make sense, should be 140k!
To be honest I pretty much run with offensive only. I tend to go on pretty long kill streaks, and don't want to have to get frustrated at team mates not dropping ammo.
+CauseOfDeath DICE should have allowed partial auto resupply next to support classes like in Hardline. Another failed opportunity.
+Elkybam Mehh while this is a very convenient feature it kind of discourages supports to drop that bag.
Why should i as support put my gun out of my hand and place myself in danger dropping ammo too often, when people can just get it by themselves. Sure it is only one mag or a single nade but better than nothing.
I just don't like the idea behind it. I would rather wish, DICE made callouts for ammo or meds a LOT more noticeable. Not some UI bs tho which clutters your screen. Simply soliders screaming out of the top of their lungs "Give me some fucking ammo" or "Needs Meds" is enough.
At least i like to think so.
I pretty much never use the non-class specific ones. I get so much more mileage playing with the tools of the specialist category I feel. The offensive one in particular feels utterly useless to me as I don't sprint a lot, don't throw grenades unless I'm grenadier, will always have a support for ammo, and don't really find myself taking fall damage.
Also, the reason so many supports might be using indirect fire is for their little bird play. Personally, I tend to just leave that one on because anytime I end up using a little bird I go to support for the ammo regeneration for my passengers. This lets them keep firing RPG's and I don't have to stop and keep putting ammo on top of it, which could cause the vehicle to get stolen by rando's spawning in it.
the resupply unit for the support class is very much utilized by scout pilots who run it to have their rep guys always topped up with rockets and bullets
Very solid and most importantly informative video. Definitely a ton of work put into this behind the scenes, and it shows :)
Wish they had like symbols on the vehicles if they had the tier 4 upgrades. Like for the medical unit upgrade have a Red Cross on the side of the vehicle so players could know to go there for extra Health same for repair and ammo have like a picture to identify the vehicles so people know they can get stuff there, also increase the range dramatically and maybe double the speed at which health and ammo are given from vehicles and make repair rates double for engineers outside the vehicle repairing it so it's not OP and you never need to repair
Signed, an aggressive bolt action sniper. It's so frustrating to make that close quarter hit and then do only 90 damage, makes you want to throw things out the window.
+Shivan3333 I saw a decent aggressive bolt-action stream the other day. The streamer followed every shot by switching to the G18 secondary, no matter if the target died or not. Just have to assume everybody's going to make it and prepare to finish them off.
+darthveda Yep, only way to handle it, useless when encountering multiple targets though. Let us hope bf5 will have better mechanics.
As an old BF1942 > BF3 player who is relatively new to BF4, this is easily one of the more mature, thoughtful and non-hysterical info videos out there. Thanks for presenting the information in an easy to digest fashion.
Its good for most of the rush maps if you are attacking. With all the pew pew pew from 10 miles away it usually makes the difference when running from cover to cover on your advance.
My perks on the classes are:
MEDIC: Offensive perk
ROCKETGUY: Anti-tank or Meccanic
SUPPORT: the one that gives you 2 ammo boxes, I like to be able to place two ammo bags, exepecialy when I play locker or metro
RECON: Sniper perk or Spec.Ops
I run Combat Medic when playing with my squad and were up against a decent team and we actualy decide to stick together or with a team that needs the revives, Offensive when Im in a superior team and the extra ammo is nice for the killstreaks or I dont stick with my team as much.
Anti-Tank/Mechanic with same reasons for both as you, there really is no other choice for engineer.
Perimeter Defence the few times I play support, Indirect fire when I play a Scout Heli and expect to have people on me repairing and shooting.
Spec Ops on recon, always.
As always excellent video.
I never run the defensive upgrade, anti tank, parameter defense, spec ops and offensive are the way to go.
Actually, running as an indirect fire support in a scout heli is the main use of that perk. you can constantly reload the rockets of the engineers that fly with you. Obviously less useful than before, but that's why I run with that when I fly with a group.
I think you have me in the "dumb" pie section of the pie chart....lol..I'll be reviewing all of this tonight. Great video. This along with Level's re-reviews of the weapons has been really helpful.
When you sit on two ammo bags it recharges c4 two at a time that's why I run it
this sounds awesome, ill try it. But it still remains situational really unless youre really good with sneaking around putting c4 on any tank you see. idk
Keep in mind that crouching also makes TUGs and motion sensors useless, while shadow/spec ops makes it so you can walk aswell, but while trying to sneak youd want to crouch anyways because walking still makes noise, so shadow is pretty much useless, but spec ops is still fine because its other perks.
Sometimes when defensive perk is very useful to stay alive longer in conquest large
I'm lvl 140 and I use Offensive on Assault, Mechanic on Engineer, Defensive on Support (Recently started using offensive) and Defensive on Recon, so that I don't get one shot killed in CQB by aggressive Recons. Sometimes I switch it up but it almost doesn't matter. A good player can do well using anything the game has to provide.( I am not a good player though) ;)
Indirect fire is pretty useful if you are a scout helicopter pilot or transport pilot since you can resupply teammates in the vehicle so engineers can spam rockets, but that has taken a hit since you cant use lock on weapons in the scout and transport anymore.
i actually took notes here. thank you for this video. you're quite pedagogical
Emanuel Löwstedt lmfao and you're quite pretentious
3:26 That transition tho'
great video!
TBH i have no idea what field upgrade im using with the engineer.
did you ever posted a video about helicopters, or maybe a tutorial for people that never played BF about the spawn screen?
Combat Medic, Mechanic, Indirect Fire, and Spec Ops would be for team play, obviously. Grenadier, Anti-Tank, Perimeter Defense and Sniper are purely situational, but can be effective if used properly, especially on modes like Rush and Conquest where single or even groups can give people trouble overall.
Perimeter Defense is perfect with a shotgun and equipment related to the correlating perks, especially on Operation Locker, I can kill about 3 to 4 times my death ratio while also disrupting individual flankers and giving grenade launcher people a difficult time in the center flag using that Trophy System thing so my team won't die as much. However, Assault, Defense and Ghost are mostly for solo stuff in my opinion since it only benefits you, seems fine if your team isn't interested staying together.
The support perk level 1 and 2 are actually situational. Let's say in locker. Place two ammo bags for teammate at the grinder area to give ammo and get points and you will flank the enemy and have more ammo yourself
How I roll it:
Assault: Combat Medic ONLY
Engi: mechanic or anti-tank
Support: offensive or perimeter defense for claymore trolling or inference fire when XM25/mortar trolling
Recon: offensive
Never realized how good spec ops is. Definitely gonna give that a try soon.
Sniper, I never touched since I never use a sniper except for with a 4x on a 338-recon and even then I quickly regret it and pick up an assault rifle again.
Also, sometimes I use defensive on locker just for the easy flak bonus, because explosive spam gonna be... Explosive, or something.
do flood zone for your next Battleplan and keep up the amazing work
I use def on support only when playing mid to long range when setting up a killzone. IME helps especially when your bipoded and stationary.
Indirect fire was very popular when stingers were available on the side seat of scout helo since the pilot provided ammo for gunners
I feel like the defensive perk is now too op. Now every time I use phantom bow, I just can't get those one shot kills. It's unfair that you get the armor upgrade first. I feel like a lot of players are using it now and it's just awfully insane.
when you're in a heli and have two good players with rpg's repairing you, indirect fire's resupply unit ensures infinite ammo for them and in my experience, that is priceless. when i'm repairing in a helo, i have a semi-auto shotgun with frags and my smaw, and i can do damage, repair, and still get some kills while keeping us in the air. in my opinion, it's indirect fire is the best choice that a pilot can make... but unless you're playing with friends, 90% of heli pilots are just idiots that either use the helo as a taxi or just dudes, that don't want to get too far from the base to hide, instead of, you know, playing the game.
great video as always
Pretty Niche, but I utilize the Support's Indirect Fire perk to keep my passengers supplied while I'm operating transport helicopters and scout helicopters.
Awesome video man keep up the good work ❤️
+TH-cam Magician Thanks :)
I use offensive or medic for assault, repairs for engineer, either defensive or suppressive for support, and shadow for recon. I only use dmrs for recon tho.
Edit: it’s perimeter defense for support. Just looked it up
I have been doing it wrong for so long :( ....thanks for the advice!
Darth you seem like rhe guy who would absouluty LOVE Metro 24/7.
i always run Offensive perk for the faster running unless I'm driving/ gunning in armor then I run Mechanics upgrade.
how to balance the class that gives ammo? GIVE HIM THE ABILITY TO GIVE AND HAND OUT EVEN MORE AMMO!!! HE IS A WALKING AMMO BAG!
I use the Shadow upgrade. It helps keep you off the map
I run defensive on support for the bit of damage reduction, and the ability to lay down tones of cover while its harder for them to flush me out with explosives
shadow is literally the best for support. you get sprint in the second tier - the only useful thing in offensive - and quicker unspot in the first. I'm not saying it's good, but the best of them all nonetheless.
this is why i went back to bf3.
I'm one of those supports running Indirect Fire. Why? Because XM25 DART for life. Lately I've been running this thing as my primary lol. And why having ammo as one of the upgrades is good? Because you don't have to spend time waiting for resupply. Throw some of those rounds to your teammates and keep running. Almost never use my own boxes (except when need darts).
I always run stealth on support, for I use shotguns.
I always run sniper on recon, for that unlimited breath.
I always run anti-tank on engineer, for I love my slams
I always run grenadier on assault, for I love my nades
I just want to point out that you DO have a map on hardcore. Yes it shows enemy positions (with the TUGS and MAV). The only difference is that it is not a minimap. Just bind it to a very easy reach key (I use my 7th mouse button) to open and close it real fast when needed.
Nate Sturm haha 90% of players do not have the intellect to process anything besides ATTACK!!! Die. Respawn. ATTACK!!!! Die. Respawn.
Great info and well presented.
Veda,
I think this is your best vid yet. Definitely my favorite of all yours.
Very detailed and very accurate far as the difference between top level
players and average players.
Far as the defensive perk goes, I hate it. Why? Between it, and full
chokes...it has rendered slugs completely useless. You said it best that
it's basically a perk for you get salty because you get killed up close
by a sniper or someone running slugs. Without this perk, I feel like
all the weapons and attachments are balanced. Sure I got a little salty
on CQDOM in BF3 when I got quick scoped but it usually was by someone
with like 100ss with that rifle or shotty. Main reason indirect fire is
used is for all those scout repair scrubs lol. When you get a chance I
would like to give you a couple ideas to maybe talk about that "nobody"
ever talks about in the game.
I fully agree that essentially all the perks for Support exclusively suck ass, but at the very least both trees have one very handy perk that for me at least gives more incentive than Defensive or Offensive; Indirect Fire's last perk is great for vehicle drivers, since you can resupply your gunner while rolling around. Have him carry a Stinger or RPG (especially in scout choppers) and he/they will literally have infinite ammo.
Perimeter Defense is essentially useless... with the exception of 3 claymores out at once. It's insane how many claymore kills you'll get with that on... well, any map with infantry at all, basically being handy (if not critically useful) in all maps. Of course the more infantry focused maps make it actually quite handy and powerful as an early warning system as much as area denial.
I hate that it effects the bolt action rifles. A 338 round doesn't get stopped by armor that close up
very helpful, thank you
Maybe you could do some hardcore gameplay like a raw meat or something.
My ones for classes
Assault-offensive
Engineer-mechanic for using vehicles, offensive for lockers/metro
Support-indirect fire for using the scout ammo trick when having reps
Recon-spec ops (dont care for the class)
Hey darth can you do a top 5 favorite guns video thanks man.
This overwhelming usage of the defensive upgrade is likely do to it being the default upgrade path, and people might not notice what they are using or that it exists at all. Back when the game reset your loadouts all the time it was even worse, as the upgrades were probably overlooked when trying to setup in game. I definitely think it is effective at reducing the one shot potential of buckshot, or at least I like to blame my bad aim on it =]
I get sooo frustrated when I noscope someone like one meter away from me and he has 5 health! Please remove defensive from next bf game
But defensive isn't that bad, only the first stage. Which can be situationally good, the rest I think are pretty fair to have. I only run defensive in Support.
But Indirect fire is a good perk because with two ammo boxes you can reload C4 and Airburst shots or claymore twice as fast.
That's the reason I run with indirect fire, also with it you don't need to wait for the cool down between dropping ammo
Dice pleeeease, u earned my like sir keep it up :)
Thanks :)
I'm just hoping that there isn't a single "perk," attachment, w/e that modifies damage in ANY way in the next BF game.
+Metal_Slug-0390 They need to stop making those. No more magnum ammo, no more defensive perks. And certainly not the armored insert from Hardline. Seriously... 50% damage reduction to chest shots... madness!
+darthveda Tbh Magnum Ammo was fine in BFBC2 because it there wasn't so much going, too many weapons, too many vehicles and too much negatives at the start of its launch.
If they are honestly going to do Defense spec, Mag ammo, pls DICE no rush launches thanks.
After 98 levels, I am just now finding out what these are lol
bruh
Nice Job changed one of mine
Does the combat medic level 4 work on hardcore mode ?
heres what i use:
assault: combat medic
engineer: offensive
support: offensive
recon: sniper
extra mags is for all players not everyone is going to run support in your squad
can you do a showdown video for the AR160 and CZ-805
+Graphic Or MG4 and M249
+MrTampon M249, straight upgrade. Easier to control, better side-to-side recoil, it's better :)
+OnlyNeedJuan Gaming
The horizontal isn't better but rather different, it's better because it has less vertical which is always a plus.
Dat Guy It's better, however. It's not a matter of preference, it's a matter of how likely it is to stay on target, as you cannot "compensate" for vertical recoil (you just can't), which is simply better on guns that have recoil that is equal on both sides.
OnlyNeedJuan Gaming
1. I really can't see how bouncing to the left is better than to the right, looks like it doesn't really do much.
2. yes we can compensate for vertical (about 90% - 99% depending on your muscle memory with the weapon).
I will assume you meant Horizontal. Then yes I know how gun mechanics work in this game, it is physically impossible for anyone to control horizontal.
We could compensate a little for the guns with bounces to different directions but not much.
3. The only reason to pick the M249 now at this point is because it has better iron sights and less Vertical which is a plus since it means less management on those recoil values.
And maybe because you're a hardcore M249 fan and like it more than the MG4 because... you're American I guess :P
The support upgrades make sense. It’s for your squad.
You don't need to run ammo bag as support, though it's weird it appears twice in the specialist tracks.
+Blech I say It's pretty much assumed.
+darthveda Since the benefits of an ammo pack quickly fall off the more of them there are, I think there are situations where you wouldn't take one.
I've sunk 400+hrs into BF4 and I still run Defensive most of the time in all my classes. Only my Engineer ever sees some modicum of rotation with the other perks. In practice, my anecdotal observation leads me to believe that the ability to soak up that one extra bullet really comes in in handy and I win fire fights more often than I do when I don't use Defensive. I also find Cover and Flak to be very handy. That said, as much as I use it, I really hate that it's included in the game. It definitely feels like the go-to perk for most players and as such, it sniper rifles can't kill at close range for that clutch kill, neither can the pump shotgun slugs. Buck in pumps can also be pretty useless given how unreliable shotguns are in BF4 so the pellets that do land are made weaker. Defensive even makes 3 shots from the SKS survivable at range.
Just asking, why are you using medpacks instead of bags?
+Violent Spikes Medpacks heal through suppression, heal on the move, and are easier to toss to teammates who otherwise run away from my attempts to keep them alive. DPS is always trying to run away from the healer...
Makes sense, I'll use them now.
I run shadow simply cause i always run suppressors
Now that I've come back to BF4... it seems a lot more necessary.
I think a big part of the reason that so many high level assault players run the offensive perk is not because they realize how useless the defensive perk is but that because by the time you reach 130-140, you are generally good enough at staying alive that the default amount of ammunition (5 mags including 1 in the gun I think?) becomes a hinderance when you are staying alive long enough to kill 10-20 opponents without dying.
Really quality video, I saw some of your stuff a long time ago and it's nice to see that you're still putting out quality content, you deserve more subs :)
Where do you see stats of how many people use what upgrades
+Safsal I pulled up 100 players in BF4stats.com, went to their Battlelog, and recorded the loadouts in a spreadsheet.
you can give your thoughts of the bf5 trailer for a future video
+Nathan Grimard I'll put up a video tomorrow evening, most likely. Early Saturday at the latest.
well armor in real life
is VERY usefull :c
+X MAN Yes but in real life there are also other factors that this game doesn't use: weight, heat, reduced maneuverability.
OFFENSIVE IS USELESS TO I USE IT FOR MORE AMMO BUT IT DOES NOT GIVE ME MORE AMMO I JUST GET 124 instead of 217
Abdallah AMD you know you must unlock that perk. right?
Very good video Darth but I still use the Defensive perk and for me it work fantastic. Can't say how many time he save me from explosives like Claymores, nades,etc.and dying from one shot bolt sniper rifles,so don't say it's useful.I respect your opinion but not everyone think the same, sorry.
thank you now people would stop using and my bow would be usable once more
sar on pearl market?
I think I had some leftover footage from testing the hipfire on that beastie.
Also I do what I want.
th-cam.com/video/z0-KZS1dDyw/w-d-xo.html
I don't think there is a good upgrade for the Support kit, atleast not when running MGs and no Claymores (fuck claymores). The sprint only increases your speed, which directly increases the spread you have while on the move, which only makes your weapon worse, generally.
Even with an ergo grip, I think the disadvantage of sprint on MGs (why it even is a disadvantage boggles my mind) with the lack of anything useful in that perk makes it a no-brainer avoid. Except, that there isn't an alternative to it in any other kit.
I'd actually recommend the Defensive upgrade simply because it gives you that extra health-regen, which gives you more self-sustainability (which is ironic, since it requires teamwork to get there). The support kit is a mess.
+OnlyNeedJuan Gaming Yeah when I was putting this together I noticed just how messed up the support tracks are.
yep.. give a guy that has infinite ammo.. an extra magazine.. game feature of a decade
What kind of sight is that what gun?
Matt Hew what gun are you referring too?
to be honest supports gets outgunned by literally EVERYTHING ELSE so defensive comes very handy. I blame dice for how an m60 gets outgunned by a shitty pistol aka g18.
support guy and his m249 but you're supposed to use the m249...
support guy and his m249 carbines are non existent at range. If I dont have the utility of an engineer then I might aswell play assault and destroy people while also being actually usefull to team. ammo is pretty much useless except when you are in metro or locker.
He sounds like the uncle in superhero movie lol
Leslie Nielsen was one of the greatest comedy actors of all time. An honor.
Yes I am not even joking though you sound almost identical what the heck XD
More like the rock
Imagined The Rock was talking ...can't un-hear
Still, whenever you're using Defensive and you survive with 7 or less % health, that's Defensive saving your ass. (you would have been dead without it.)
Offensive=rush b
Offensive almost always
srsly i need "|SKIP TO CONCLUSION-SHOW RESULTS|" button in my youtube toggles...all that talking...
Offensive obviously.
I do not like shotguns.
grenadier ftw
Staff-Shell? Thinking about unsubscribing..
+Sagenhaft Haha, I was on Silk Road on the previous map and forgot to change my loadout. I ended up going canister later in that match :)
there is no excuse for staff-shell :(