Dune: A Game of Conquest and Diplomacy: The Esoteric Review
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 17 ต.ค. 2024
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I add a twist by “zooming in” on battles to play tabletop miniatures battles using 3d printed models. Works for “close” battles and prolongs the game into a campaign-style approach. Cheers!
What a cool idea! That would certainly add a whole new level of drama to the fights. Nice one.
Thank you for this really kind (and highly informative) review. It's very gratifying to hear when your design objectives were met. I hope everyone enjoys. Maybe some more diplomacy will materialize in an expansion.
Thank you for creating such a great game Jack! We played again last night; it's rapidly becoming the ‘just one more game’ game of every game night. :)
@@EsotericOrderGamers Wow, so great to hear. It was pretty epic for me to get to work with the original designers of Dune on this. Looking forward to the next Dune movie to see what we might add to this game.
Thank you for making a great game Jack. Just one question, why did you make Duncan Idaho strength only 3 which is less than both the normal Sardukar and Sardukar Captain when in the movie/books he trounces them?
Are you actively working on an expansion right now?
@@TheOldMan-75 noodling things at the moment. Gotta wait to find out who all is in the next movie, then work with that.
It's true that there is not much diplomacy in the 2 player game. When there are 3 or 4 players in the game you will usually see players form temporary alliances, announce actions needed to prevent possible wins, and plenty of advice given (sometimes appreciated, sometimes ignored, and sometimes revealing hidden motives).
Hello Bill and thanks for such a classic. You're right, and I perhaps should have stressed more that kind of thing can happen in any game really, so diplomacy is not completely gone. It's just that it was such a focus of the original, it does feel like a big departure point in this version, as there's no rules mentioning it or framing it as there were in the original - though in this particular case it's a good thing, in my opinion! I look forward to enjoy this game with everything player count for a long time to come!
@@EsotericOrderGamers You're welcome, Peter. We're having a lot of fun right now designing new games and reviving old games too. A dream for my 30s and 40s came true in my 70s. Peter Olotka, Jack Kittredge and I are designing board games again with help now from Greg Olotka and Jack Reda.
@@billeberle7951 That is absolutely wonderful news - I very much look forward to playing, reviewing, and making rules summaries for them! 👍
Best review I've seen so far. The weight of your decisions and potential depth of strategy is impressive despite the short runtime. The lack of diplomacy is such a breath of fresh air despite being a big fan of Classic Dune.
The game really is refreshing - so much impact in such a short play time!
Dune Light. I'm intrigued. But the Harkonen traitor benefit is even more dangerous with fewer players one would think.
Thank you for the excellent review! This looks really good. I have the classic Dune but getting 6 together is difficult these days and there were lots of mechanics around bidding which are not everyone's cup of tea. I appreciate some cool aspects of the old one (like the BG getting a win because she guessed the winner and the turn... leads to lots of "plans within plans" like why is she helping the Harks - guess I better attack them - wait, what is she wants me to win on turn 4 and this is meant to goad me into moving early, etc.) but it seems like what we have here is something that can realistically see the table more often, and be effective when it does. There's definitely room in my collection for both versions!
I agree, there is!
I've won twice as Bene in the original game by predicting the winner and the winner turn and it is the best feeling ever.
Enjoyed this game a lot, great fun, and fab review capturing the main benefits. We played as a group of 3 as fans of the book and movie.
As new players to board-gaming, we took a little while and a few goes to get it really working. We now know all the market cards and what the different advantages there are for each faction and this has made the gameplay even more fun.
Would be interesting to see how using miniatures and zooming into the battles would look (as suggested in another comment). And also interesting to find out about expansion pacts etc.
👌
Welcome to the wonderful world of boardgaming!
People over on BGG have pointed out that the bottom portion of the board is very dark, to the point that necessary details like spice blows and area borders are obscured. Did you find the darkness of the map an issue during play?
Nope, that hasn't been a problem at all.
@@EsotericOrderGamers Well that's good to hear! I haven't cancelled my pre-order, but a bunch of other geeks have :( I'll certainly sleeve the cards though
Great review, you’ve convinced me to add this to my wish list!
Eeeeexcellent! Tell GF9 I sent you! :)
I would assume the diplomacy would happen if you had 3 or 4 players. Hard to do with 2. But it probably wouldn't amount to much past "hey! He's in the lead, gang up on him." Game looks great.
Yes - there are no rules in the game for diplomacy and negotiation (unlike in the original Dune), so if you bring any of that to the game it's the same that you'd bring to any multiplayer game.
Just like the player aides that you make for games, this was an excellent overview of Dune laid out comprehensively, yet succinctly. Thanks.
On the graphic design part, i have to sadly agree. As a graphic designer myself, i wonder if the community could alter the excellent Ilya Baronovsky work he did on Dune before GF9 used his work for their own publication of the game. His work was always the gold standard, and maybe it could see double duty for this version of Dune as well. Hmmmm..... "plans within plans.... i was never here and we never had this discussion..."
Boardgamers are an industrious lot! Thanks for the kind words. :)
Shame they used actual photos instead of hand drawn art. They did such a good job with the original Dune game reprint expected more with this...
I'm not really a big fan of movie stills in a game either, but it may have also been part of the licensing deal. Or they just wanted to capitalise on the movie as much as possible, which is fair enough.
IMO this artwork is absolutely hideous. I like the last Gale Force 9 reprint artwork. Though Rex is one of the most beautiful games ever made.
Great review. Will be getting this so I can play it with my less hardcore gamer friends. Gotta show them the magic of Dune.
Excellent!
I am excited for this, the adjustments will make this a win for my group.
Hope you enjoy it as much as I do!
I'm so excited to play this. Great history overview of the game!
Cheers Derek!
You just sold a copy :) Great review thanks!
You're welcome mate, cheers. Enjoy!
Great review! I guess I'm going to have to get this now. I have the AH original, but sadly it has lost a few tokens over the years.
While you're getting this one, you could always replace your old one with the new GF9 version Steve!
@@EsotericOrderGamers Confession time -- I do have the GF9 version (and expansion), and Rex.
@@SteveHill3D Right, grab this right now. :)
Great review! Is the map the same size as the one from the original game?
I don't know ... does it matter? I believe it's slightly different so you can't use it as a substitute.
Do you have an affiliate link to purchase the game?
No I don't, but I appreciate you asking. Just tell Gale Force Nine I sent you! :)
Are there still sandworms in this version of the board game? Wouldn't be Dune without them
Yes, there's a sandworm Spice card.
We hope for expansions! The the designers has as much fun playtesting it as you had playing in the real world.
It's such a perfect little gem I worry that expansions would spoil the balance - but it would be nice to see a couple more factions ...
That sounds pretty cool, I'll gonna check it out.
Played again last night, fantastic game!
If my problem with the 6-player Dune game is length and the necessity of finding five other players, and if this game pretty much gets rid of the diplomacy part, why should I play this instead of Dune: Imperium? What about it is better?
Well, they're totally different game experiences. :) Dune: Imperium focuses on deck-building and worker placement, Dune: AGoCaD is more more about area majority and combat. Apart from the theme, they're just different games and I'm very happy to have both.
Sounds like a great beer & pretzels game Peter.
You'll forget your beer and the pretzels will remain untouched at about turn 3 ... :)
Still, visually, the 2019 version is a much better-looking game.
Do we know when this will be released?
Should be very soon, last I heard.
The games are on the water, and nearly at destination, we've experienced (along with most of the world) really frustrating shipping delays, we're keeping everything crossed we don't fare too badly in port congestion and freight forwarding. It's virtually impossible to pin point a release date in the current climate, but rest assured we're as keen to get it to your table as you are!
@@GaleForceNineGames Thanks! How cool is that, GF9 answering queries in the comments section - nice one!!
Super excited about this. It's always a tough task wrangling 6 players for Dune. 2-4 is much more manageable
Just be prepared, it's a very different beast! :)
You can play classic Dune with 3, just give each player 2 of the 6 factions.
A review that I needed to see and the best one out there. T
Thankyou Ross, nice of you to say so!
While I think your review is fantastic, diplomacy has always been my thing, so if this game as you said doesnt have much of it I will see what the old edition can offer
If you want a long game, best played with 6 players, with alliances, treachery and auctions, the old Dune will be more up your street, certainly.
@@EsotericOrderGamers i have looked up reviews of it and yeah, its pretty much my style, the problem is that this dune also seems interesting, so I cant really decide
Aghhh you gave me Diplomacy flashbacks! 😁
Sorry about that. I still wake up screaming!
Especially if you were Austria / Hungary
Me too. All good ones. Hehehe.
Great review. I agree with the design comments, and inferior quality components. My copy had two sheets of woefully misaligned counters that mess with my OCD and make the game look awful. GF9 say they've had no complaints...
Disappointing considering how long I've waited and how much it cost.
Yeah, I must admit my counters weren't perfectly centred either. Nothing to affect gameplay, and slight misalignment is a built-in risk of printing (you always have to allow 3mm wiggle room when setting up art) but I had the same thing in Tyrants of the Underdark and the perfectionist in me noticed! :)
@@EsotericOrderGamers Yes, the problem is entirely aesthetic, and in no way affects game play, just my visual enjoyment of it.
This is definitely a problem that GF9 should have picked up in production. The troop symbols on my counters are so far off that they are clipped on one edge and the numbers on the spice counters are low and right.
Mercifully, the battle wheel sheets were okay. It's only the two faction sheets that were affected. My cards were also very flimsy like yours and the game board ink was chipped at the cut right out of the box.
Did you notice that the insert space for the assembled battle wheels isn't deep enough for one, let alone both?
Yes, I had all those issues, and I'll be replacing the insert with my own foam core solution as I mentioned. Perhaps I should have pointed them out by they're not game changers and I enjoy the game so much they didn't seem worth focussing on. But I'll do my best to make friendly suggestions to GF9 about little production issues like these! :)
Diplomacy is wonderfull! You only lose 1-6 friends per session....
HA! Yeah, I never played it again. :)
Nice review but theres too much cutting
Sorry mate one day when I have actually have a budget and weeks to script, film and edit maybe you'll find my FREE content more to your liking.
@@EsotericOrderGamers Don't get me wrong, I really appreciate your work, especially game rules, that is why I support you. I think it would be just more natural if you say what you think without editing your final speech so much like: sentence - cut - halfsentence - cut and so on. I think it's not a matter of budget and script, in a matter of fact creators with low budget don't edit their videos almost at all. It's just a suggestion not a complaint.
Sorry if you misunderstood me I'm not a native speaker
@@marciojavi3219 Quick cuts during speeches are incredibly common in videos like this. It's the difference between trying to get a video done in a reasonable time, and spending ages going back and redoing every single speech where I make a speaking error. I'm not reading a script, so errors are inevitable. I'm sure you wouldn't enjoy it if I left in all the errors, it would be ridiculous - personally the last thing I want to hear is someone rambling on for ages with all the errors left in. Again, it's a free video, so perfection is not feasible. By the way Marcio, are you one of my Patreon supporters?
@@EsotericOrderGamersThanks for explanation. I'm ok with some errors, nobody is perfect ;) I'm not using patreon, I support you occasionally through your website. Thanks again for great rule summaries!
@@marciojavi3219 Thanks for the understanding! I can't see you in my record of donors - are you under a different name? I do very much appreciate any support.
Played it. Too much luck involved.
Well, that's it then. Everyone throw their copies away! Back to chess. 🤣
Terrible game. Pure luck.
Well, I don't agree with either of those points, but everyone is entitled to their opinion.