Sounds like a game of D&D. You got the DM that sets up universe and events, then you get the players that piece it all together and make the world worth something, haha
If you want to get poetic about it (pun not intended), one can imagine Idunn only gave Bragi the golden apple of immortality after he proved himself worthy of it, which he did by singing her a poem, and thats where they feel in love
To me Bragi's and Idun's marriage/love could easily represent spring time and new life. The land grows new fruits/food to provide life (golden apple), then birds and other animals mating calls fill the land (animal singing/poetry). Thow in some fertility and 😳... new life, new songs, cycle continues
I literally began watching this channel within the last week. He kept me informed on my recent trip to Florida. I stopped by a Vitamin Shoppe and before I left, the worker commented on my Mjolnir and how he is also a Heathen. We shared what drew our souls to the gods and I informed him of Wisdom of Odins lack of condemnation with the AFA. It is very rare that I meet a fellow Heathen and I have been on a brethren high since. I hope he remains well.
I dont think someone has to be actively denying the AFA to be against it. I don't have to be protesting dictators in foreign lands to declare how much I hate dictators.
@@WhoCares-wt7wi Normally I would agree, but Wisdom of Odin has a platform and us Heathens often find ourselves in the broom closet. Many stay silent because of the racist that openly spew hate in the name of the gods. I believe it beneficial for our people with a platform to disavow the hate.
I haven’t met any in person, I once saw a guy wearing a mjolnir I made a comment about how nice it was (using both mjolnir and Thor’s hammer as it’s name) and he looked at me with a blank look on his face and it became clear he didn’t have a clue what he was wearing
I actually made an offering to Bragi yesterday! I was auditioning for a play and I asked him to help make the words flow well and to give me courage in presenting my audition (which also had a poem in it.) By the end of the audition, I was being praised for my writing and my voice. Thank you, Bragi.
A skald taking the name Bragi in honour of the god of poetry would not be frowned upon, it would actually be seen as an act of devotion. (Being named Bragi by your parents and growing up to become a famous skald is not impossible, only improbable, and reflects no small amount of wishful thinking on the part of the parents.) While Bragi may be an unusual choice, there are plenty of examples of people taking the name Thor, or affixing it to their name (Thorbjörn, Thorleif, Thorgrim, etc) to show their devotion to Thor. Indeed, some of those names are still around to this day.
I would be curious to see a video about Thor. I feel like people think they "know" Thor, but so much pop culture has diluted the public consciousness that the masses don't actually know much about Thor aside from being a Norse god and he has a hammer named Mjölnir. For instance, Thor being a redhead instead of blonde, and while his hammer is his most famous possession, he also has a magic belt (Megingjörð) that doubles his strength even though he's already the strongest of the gods without it.
It seems to me, that poetry was of paramount importance before the written word. The rhythm and flow helping lessons to grow. The alliterative allusions aiding in the recall of long versus.
the question, naturally, is whether I should begin including Bragi among the deities I worship, which are coincidentally all currently associated with poetry in some way.
Having both heard and delivered spoken poetry in person, there is indeed a sacredness about it, especially when the poet herself is reading it and it’s about personal experiences, trials, etc. It takes courage and passion to not only display but perform one’s own artistry and lived experience in front of one’s community. A kind of duality of strength and vulnerability. Makes perfect sense that it would be valued among the Gods.
Given Bragi is someone I've been meaning to open reciprocity with but have been dragging my heels on, this video's given me some renewed inspiration in that direction. Much obliged, Ocean!
With the Havamal, Odin's wisdom is more along the lines of life advice and being generally wise--and clever. Perhaps the distinction here is life smarts vs. book smarts, so to speak, both of which are needed, depending on who one's opponents happen to be.
Ive often thought of reaching out to Bragi in a bit of an odd way. I DM a tabletop RPG game for my friends and odd as it sounds I feel like Bragi would be great to speak to and appreciate the level of linguistic performing and storytelling required for a DMing a tabletop RPG.
@@OceanKeltoi You are a monster who thrives on the suffering of your viewers. Keep up the good work. Even if I hate the puns I keep coming back. So obviously you are doing something right.
Ooh super excited!! As someone who struggles with public speaking, I would always look to him when I had presentation based finals in college. Same with composition courses too, he’s a great deity to turn to if you’re struggling from creativity block or writing burnout!
The few times I have worked with him in the past and that's been over 20 years ago is in The art of seduction, the right words to say works 😂 but then I thought poetry was for wooing women 🤣
@@ninetales6485 Now I'm so damn curious I'm going to drop what I'm doing and see if Anazon has that on ebook lol. Edit: Oh dear, my wallet hurt horribly just from seeing the price. ;(
0:00 - Just as I thought I’d heard the worst puns you could give, you pull this one. I am both disgusted and impressed. From one Pun Master to another, I salute you.
In my experience, both as a writer / poet, and from the words of other poets, writers of prose, and songwriters, it often seems that the stories and poems don't come *from* us, so much as *through* us. So maybe Bragi shows up as the official poet in so many mortal kings' courts is because he becomes newly embodied every time a particularly skilled Skald performs.
I saw warrior poet and my first thought was John Lovell from warrior poet society. Gotta love him for standing tall against the tyrannical government we have right now. If you haven’t seen him, go look him up. Very educational.
I have just looked at that website you mentioned, and it is written in a very poetic and very, very vague fashion. From reading the title text, it is completely unclear who these people are fighting for, in whose name, for what cause - and against whom. It is, however, quite clear that they engage in acts of violence, glorify and romanticize it through a borrowed philosophy, consider themselves to be wiser than the rest and claim to be on a self-styled "sacred" mission of protecting some people against the others, without specifying what the whole crusade is about. Since it is only quickly mentioned that Lovell himself was a christian missionary in the Far East and the violence he propagates is portrayed as some kind of noble art for samurai-like soldiers without actually openly stating what his principles and goals are, the entire site has a distinct aura of intentional vagueness and purposeful signalling that it is all about tribalism and serving a particular political agenda. Tyranny means different things to different people, and I doubt that Bragi had ever seen himself as a violent mercenary who suffers from a delusion of grandeur.
@@gaiagreen2690 I’m honestly not trying to be disrespectful in any shape or form. That being said that was a lot to read for someone who hasn’t done much research on the guy. I’ve been watching him for years and every video he puts out you learn more about what his goals are. He might be a Christian and that has never bothered me being a Heathen because I’m not judging anyone on something like religion. If we start judging others on religion then we are no better than the ones who judge us and we have all been judged in what way or another. You can’t just look at his site and read a few things and think you know what he is all about. That’s like you going to the book store and the first book you see is something that you disagree with on a personal level and instead of looking at another book you leave and decide the whole store is wrong. Even though if you looked farther in there may be books that you love. I personally don’t see what’s wrong with him, he fights for our rights to have this type of free conversation on the web or in public (which is being attacked as we speak), he fights for the 2nd amendment which allows me to protect my children from anyone that wishes us harm as well as my property (Havamal stanza 38 - Never go even a single step without a weapon at your side; you never know when you might find yourself in need of a spear.), he fights for our right to (I don’t know if you live in the us but I’m speaking as though you do) practice our different faiths. I do believe you missed a lot of his teachings just by glancing at a site. He also isn’t pro violence, he’s actually against it but is also a realist who thinks you should know how to defend yourself in the terrible situation that you may be in. A few people hate on him because he is a Christian but I’ve never hated anyone for something like that, if you can hate someone solely on their religion I believe you stand a high chance of also being a racist ( speaking generally and not about you because I don’t know anything about you). What do I know, I’m just some silly Heathen who wants his freedoms for himself and his family on his homestead. Living off the land like our ancestors did. As I said no hostilities from me, I hope you have a nice one. Skal
@@thelonelygypsy8479 How very intriguing - did you just intentionally completely misrepresent what I said in my comment? Because I never said that I rejected him on the basis of his religion, which he is fanatical enough about to try to shove it on the people of other faiths abroad, but that he was glorifying violence while staying vague about whose money he is taking and who he is raising his weapons for - and against. I have also openly stated that I read only the title site and that to me it seemed as if it was created to misrepresent and veil his true political stances. But there is a very loud and very obvious whistle there, if we combine what he DID mention - a former soldier, a former missionary, a believer in violence, a lover of weapons and a propagator of armed conflicts. Someone who dresses up killing and being hired to kill those who think differently as something noble, romantic and who tries to make it acceptable by randomly quoting bits and pieces of foreign philosophies as it suits him, to justify his violence and make it sound noble, instead of it being a murder. One doesn't need to be a mental health expert whose everyday job is communication like me, to connect the dots and recognize that these people raise their arms not to protect everyone's freedom but the norms and values based on a dogma and privileges that THEY hold sacred. Nor does one need to read every single book one picks up to understand what it's topic and it's philosophy are. It was a nice try to insert a bit of propaganda and try to project (non-related) "racism" onto me, but I am not an ex-soldier who spent years trying to force his oppressive religion on those who do not want it and who now lives of selling an idea of killing for money, while creating macho fairytales of murdering those who reject one's dogma being what ahh, only rare, brave and manly warriors do. One CAN see what a book is ABOUT by reading an introduction (that is why it is there, to explain what is inside) and decide if one is interested, and this introduction was so purposefully vague, while simultaneously dropping a nugget here and there, to signal exactly what and who it is for. And it is NOT freedom for everyone. Since you chose to ignore the points I made very clearly and went to project their intolerance on me, let me be clear: a christian fanatic with a history of wanting to convert people who now preaches about "killing for freedom" and how noble it is definitely does not stand for peace, tolerance and equal rights and freedom for all - on the contrary. You mixed up lots of ideas and equated freedom to own a weapon and use it with the freedom of speech, and you repeatedly mention your current "tyrannical government" - these are all typical right wing equasions and propaganda, and everyone outside of that bubble sees the contradictions, lies and projections. To end this completely misrepresented "murder for fredom" and "they are coming for us" conversation, let me point out that we live in a civilized society where wearing a gun does not make you an ancient warrior. Killing people on a whim for a minor offence does not make you a heathen hero, it makes you a criminal. Romanticizing violence to feel like a real man and condoning intolerance is not a civilized way to live. In this society everyone has the right to live and be safe, and to have a proper trial should they transgress the law, instead of having their heads chopped off by a delusional macho on an ancient legend trip. There was MUCH more to heathen way of life and their spirituality than strutting around with a sword, killing whomever one wanted and feeling brave like a son of Odin. And I do not need to read pages of yet another bogus spiritual Rambo to know how right wing propaganda works, what and whose "freedoms" they want to kill for, what projection, distraction and manipulation are, what kind of activities fanatical missionaries do in remote regions and what horrid crimes mercenaries are payed to commit - and how they are always murdering and glorifying violence to "protect their sacred freedom, culture, way of life etc. from those bad, bad others." That is where your racism lives and thrives. There are many ways to live your spiritual path, but glorifying senseless violence into some bogus fairytale for machos to soothe your emotional deficits is not a good one. And one doesn't answer critique by avoiding the genuine topic and inventing stuff no one said instead.
@@gaiagreen2690 I’m not going to lie a read maybe 3/4 of your comment. You have fun with all your thoughts of whatever you were talking about. As I said not trying to be rude but I’ve spent my time dealing with illogical people like you. Have a good one P.s. watch less tv, it does wonders for the mind. Skal
@@thelonelygypsy8479 I understand, believe me. It is often unbearable for people to face the dismantling of their system of illusions, and they often project the exact opposite on the arguments they cannot refute, to be able to deal with the exposure. (So a logical analysis suddenly becomes an "illogical person.") Also, thanks for your kind "advice," but I must disappoint you, my friend - I don't have much time to watch tv, because I mostly read, write and publish on various topics of psychology, and I work as a mental health professional. However, if inventing nonsense about those you cannot contradict makes you feel important, then by all means do it. Oh, and if one has sound arguments, one doesn't need to be rude.
I prayed and offered to Bragi the night before I had the interview for my current job. I interview(and honestly verbally communicate in general) horribly and felt drawn to Bragi in the days leading up to the interview. I stutter, especially when I’m nervous or anxious, I have a tendency to think faster than I can talk, and my thoughts often come out in verbal form not really resembling what I wanted them to be. As I walked into what is now my place of employment I felt I sense of peace and wisdom within myself and, for once, I wasn’t a nervous wreck about a job interview. I don’t think I stuttered once during that interview and I didn’t have to pause to remember my pre-thought out answers to common job interview questions. As someone who enjoys writing, I feel inclined to work with Bragi more. I think I could learn a lot from him.
I love this religion. The unanswered questions and mysteriousness about it allows one to worship and view it as they'd like. It's unlike most religions
Bragis description reminds me of the celtic bards which where also tasked with recalling the history of the clan and they where also said to have magic powers do to their poetry
Future video suggestion, what are some viewpoints on worshipping gods/goddesses from different pantheons? Like I'm mainly norse gods oriented, but I have a posidon statue in my fish tank, a small statue dedicated to Athena and a pendent on my walking staff dedicated to Nyx.
I swear ocean has touched on this somewhere. I'll either find the video I'm thinking of or find out he has not. Nevertheless, I can send you to a video from Aliakai in which she touches on syncretism and multi-traditionalism (funnily enough, mentioning Ocean in the process). th-cam.com/video/xsE0Rt4kZ-M/w-d-xo.html About the first half is focused on reconstruction and eclecticism, if you want to skip to syncretism - but the whole video is good. I'll update you if I find the Ocean video I was looking for. However, I'm going to bed right now so maybe you'll have an answer before I find it.
One video he's mentioned the concept in is Eclectic Paganism vs Reconstructionism(...): th-cam.com/video/p9edwMiYsX4/w-d-xo.html However, it isn't really the point of the discussion. The some could be said when it's brought up in 10 Kinds of Theism, where Syncretism is mentioned in the context of taking it all the way to the extreme - Omnism. th-cam.com/video/KCvGNXIp0bM/w-d-xo.html There might be more, but I haven't found them. Still, a video specifically on this would be great.
@Ocean Keltoi, you like Wardruna? Have you commented on them somewhere? More people should hear them, not just album songs, but also the performances such as with Aurora & Fagottkor, and the Viking Suite for the TV series gala, those two are IMO the most powerful performances in general ever.
Here's a thought, in regard to Lokasenna...perhaps Iðunn is another name for Gerður, and Bragi another for Freyr, and the brother in question is the enigmatic Beli (the bellower, roarer etc). Skírnirmál says that the brother is dead before Freyr marries Gerður, while Gylfaginning says that Beli is killed with an antler because Freyr had given his sword away...ergo...after the wedding.
i named my son Bragi, your very right it is hard to find infomation on him and i kind of enjoy that fact, i hail you for your efforts and making this video, buttons have ben clicked and i look forward to watching many of your other videos. skál
Any thoughts on the runes on his tongue having an association with improvisation? Were it not for Lokasenna I'd expect that to be handy in a flyting. Just a shot in the dark, I can't think of any reason for or against off the top of my head.
I’ve always found the idea of Bragi the man-turned-god quite compelling; in the past I think I confused Bragi with Snorri, in that I believed Bragi the man had been killed for political reasons (probably not an uncommon fate for skalds who got a little too spicy for the jarls) and THAT’S the reasons the Gods allowed him to become one of them* - I don’t believe this anymore, mainly because I’ve looked into the actual history but I would like to think Bragi is still the type of guy who is not afraid to riff on Odin during his poetry sessions. Speaking of, Snorri in the Edda says that Bragi is Odin’s son. But the Edda says a lot of things (shove her!). If you want to get literalist about it, and reconcile the possible existence of Bragi Boddason you could say he was the half-god son of Odin then “went back home” when he died; and that why he was such a great poet. But that’s just not how I see things working in “the real world” with regards to the Gods (even when I was Christian, I felt very skeptical of things like that). Although its still a cool concept if you want to engage with it, its just not my praxis. *And thinking it about it now, after learning from Ocean and other similar vloggers about cultural baggage of Christianity, I wonder if I had been proyecting the concept of martydom on him - although theres also some greek god stories about the olympians turning people they liked into stars after they died so who knows
Ocean: "I don't mean to Bragi, but a bald head is never shaggy..." ( Pagan phone rings ) Bragi: "Could you not?" (pagan phone click) Ocean adds editing to Bragi's portfolio.
Historically. One of Odins names referenced within Neil Prices - The Viking Way. is in fact Bragi which means Chieftain. Which re-enforces the Leadership attestation you reference in this Video, and further adds to the question if Bragi is indeed just another side of Odin.
Ocean how would you explain jormungander today we know there isnt a badass snake wrapped around the world but i just want to know how you understand that?
Some freaky coincidence: my mom got sick, i need to pray to Eir and here you make a video of her. Im struggling financially should bring an offer to Njorthr, you male a video of him. I need to improve my singing to get the main role in a play, so i should pray to Bragi, you make a video about him. So, whos next?
Good Sir, a wee bit off topic…but do you have any thoughts on author Galina Krasskova? I am finding an incredible amount of conflicting information about her. Also, offering has been made to the bell! Looking forward to this next video!
I got into a bit of a tiff with her over her defending her husband wearing a nazi symbol because of his UPG. It's become a bit of a running joke in some communities that Nazi symbols are bad... unless of course Dionysus gave you permission to wear them. =sigh= I haven't read a whole lot of her texts though. But that was my personal experience there. I've heard mixed reviews on her research.
@@OceanKeltoi yikes! Thank you very much for that info. Definitely not a great experience. Sorry you had to go through that 😔 I was perusing some of her Goodreads list from 2020, and it seems she had an issue with an anti-racist children’s book (I am a bookseller, very familiar with this beautiful little book she was behaving like a jerk about)…so…that’s a blazing red flag for me also.
@@antonia.westcoast Which book? And what was her criticism? I'd be interested in taking a look. I support anti-racism, but sometimes it can come coupled with poor research. I don't, however, have much trust in Galina's judgement on the matter.
@@OceanKeltoi it’s called “Anti-Racist Baby” by Ibram X. Kendi. It’s a boardbook meant for very young folks, on the same ‘reading’ level as the Very Hungry Caterpillar, etc. Not a huge amount of writing, but thoughtful, kind imagery and words. Her criticism was that it was poorly written and illustrated, and “…good on the author for taking advantage of the current crazy political climate.”
@@antonia.westcoast okay, I tried giving Galina the benefit of the doubt, but that just sounds bad faith as hell. I just looked it up and the illustration isn't anything to complain about. Seems to me like she was looking for excuses to whine about a good message.
Yo, I’ve been a heathen for about5 years now (I’m 23) Will it ever stop feeling weird to talk about my faith? Does coming to the faith from an atheist background give it an extra layer of taboo or do ex-christians feel what I’m saying? Love from perhaps the only heathen in Ontario.
Honestly in order to really tackle this, I'd need to go into the whole Ragnarok legend, so that should be a video I make in the future going into all of that. Hugely complex legend with a lot of discussions around it.
I think its more than reasonable to presume that there are multiple Gods that have similar associations, just as there are many Gods of war within the Norse pantheon.
@@OceanKeltoi that's the hardest thing for new pagans to grok. Outside of a very few deities there isn't really such a thing as a "god of". Gods like people have specific interests but they are more than a single interest or personality trait.
Ocean, I was watching you in a debate on TH-cam earlier in which you expressed the belief that the Gods are non material in nature. Is it possible that the Gods are material in nature? My own hypothesis of Faith is that the Gods are made up of the tinniest possible particles and I have coined the phrase 'spirit particles'. Particles perhaps so small that they could pass between the atoms of a concrete wall like an atom could pass between two exoplanets in outerspace. I don't know how these particles would have to be configured or co-aligned in order to support consciousness along with the incredible power of a God, or how many such particles make up a particular God as opposed to a Valkyrie or a Jotun, but it is this hypothesis of faith that allows me to be both a materialist and a polytheist. I have no way of proving or disproving this hypothesis of course, but it makes sense to me because it is what is precedented in the natural world (I would say multiverse). Everything is made up of minute particles.. My reasons for believing in the Gods, coincidentally, also involve what is precedented. There is plurality, therefore there is a multiverse, therefore there will be beings so powerful and so much more advanced than ourselves that we would not be mistaken if we were to call them Gods. There will be lots of them.
Something not yet measurable by science, and there's a chance it may never be. Atoms contain a shit-ton of empty space, so there might be something analogously similar in that space we can't detect. Possibly something that vibrates and moves like electrons, but with a frequency we can't easily discern? The difference between a mundane space and a sacred space comes to mind for me, or how a sensitive person might pick up on a non-physical presence. Or how a cleansed item feels different from one that hasn't been, and you can feel the change in a cleansed item after handling it if you haven't cleansed yourself in some way first.
@@JariDawnchild My thinking is more to do with what is within the 'sacred space' and the term 'spirit particles' essentially encapsulates my hypothesis here. Yet I have other related hypotheses. Do we not also have spirit particles in the manner of our Gods? What happens upon bodily death? Do these particles hold their form when they peel away from the corpse in the form of a ghost and is this, perhaps, what our images of the Goddess Hel truly indicate at: a beautiful spirit peeling away from a decomposed or decomposing corpse? Does cremation quicken this process? Do our children and grandchildren inherit aspects of our spirit, just like they might inherit our eye colour and hair colour? This is how I personally make sense of some key concepts within our faith. Helheim, as far as I'm concerned, is here on this plain. Here is where we remain as spiritual entities and as ghosts until we inhabit another hamr; another lik, or move on to Asgardr.
it seems like poetry would have been very important to the Germanic tribes to tell and retell stories especially the myths that and legends they had even before writing them down became an idea.
Remember poets were the news givers and propagandists , and entertainment back in the day.They were part of the ancient media.I often wonder if Odin being a God of poetry was more to do with the propaganda or as we call it psychological operations. Imagine being a warrior about to battle and hearing or remembering a poem about the deadliness of your foes king or army etc.In these days we are literally saturated in information from media , back then the sources would have been very few. Poets would have been treated as mentioned above like a living radio .
The professional poets where part of the hird. To live on others production of food meant you had to be part of the hird, professional warriors. Those poets where warriors, other poets are not known.
@@OceanKeltoi What are the Apollo-Idunn parallels? I personally draw parallels between Freyr and Apollo. I would like to hear those Apollo-Idunn parallels though. :)
So basically, Odin's the guy for creative inspiration, and Bragi's the guy for actually cobbling it into something cohesive
Sounds like a game of D&D. You got the DM that sets up universe and events, then you get the players that piece it all together and make the world worth something, haha
I imagine that whenever Bragi encounters a problem, the first thing he does is make a prose and cons list
i groaned loudly
The possibility of bragi as originally human would make his marriage to Iđunn, the source of immortality, make a lot of sense to me.
Thats certainly an interesting possibility
If you want to get poetic about it (pun not intended), one can imagine Idunn only gave Bragi the golden apple of immortality after he proved himself worthy of it, which he did by singing her a poem, and thats where they feel in love
To me Bragi's and Idun's marriage/love could easily represent spring time and new life. The land grows new fruits/food to provide life (golden apple), then birds and other animals mating calls fill the land (animal singing/poetry). Thow in some fertility and 😳... new life, new songs, cycle continues
I don't mean to Bragi, but I have an extensive collection of overused puns.
I literally began watching this channel within the last week. He kept me informed on my recent trip to Florida. I stopped by a Vitamin Shoppe and before I left, the worker commented on my Mjolnir and how he is also a Heathen. We shared what drew our souls to the gods and I informed him of Wisdom of Odins lack of condemnation with the AFA. It is very rare that I meet a fellow Heathen and I have been on a brethren high since. I hope he remains well.
I dont think someone has to be actively denying the AFA to be against it. I don't have to be protesting dictators in foreign lands to declare how much I hate dictators.
@@WhoCares-wt7wi Normally I would agree, but Wisdom of Odin has a platform and us Heathens often find ourselves in the broom closet. Many stay silent because of the racist that openly spew hate in the name of the gods. I believe it beneficial for our people with a platform to disavow the hate.
I haven’t met any in person, I once saw a guy wearing a mjolnir I made a comment about how nice it was (using both mjolnir and Thor’s hammer as it’s name) and he looked at me with a blank look on his face and it became clear he didn’t have a clue what he was wearing
As a writer and lover of music and poetry I particularly love this video. I clearly need to learn more about Bragi
Unfortunately this is... about it. Though, learning through practice is definitely a thing.
I actually made an offering to Bragi yesterday! I was auditioning for a play and I asked him to help make the words flow well and to give me courage in presenting my audition (which also had a poem in it.) By the end of the audition, I was being praised for my writing and my voice. Thank you, Bragi.
"skalding hot!" I nearly spit out my tea! lol
So much "why not both" energy here
Bragi, born a God with Odin as his father? Mortal poet made a God to serve in Odin’s court? Just Odin himself?
¿Poe que no los tres?
Honestly, I love the idea that "warrior poet" is something that exists or may once have existed. A shame that modernity has no place for it.
Have I got good news for you! See: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/War_poet
Seek modern warrior-poets and you'll find them
A skald taking the name Bragi in honour of the god of poetry would not be frowned upon, it would actually be seen as an act of devotion. (Being named Bragi by your parents and growing up to become a famous skald is not impossible, only improbable, and reflects no small amount of wishful thinking on the part of the parents.) While Bragi may be an unusual choice, there are plenty of examples of people taking the name Thor, or affixing it to their name (Thorbjörn, Thorleif, Thorgrim, etc) to show their devotion to Thor. Indeed, some of those names are still around to this day.
I would be curious to see a video about Thor. I feel like people think they "know" Thor, but so much pop culture has diluted the public consciousness that the masses don't actually know much about Thor aside from being a Norse god and he has a hammer named Mjölnir.
For instance, Thor being a redhead instead of blonde, and while his hammer is his most famous possession, he also has a magic belt (Megingjörð) that doubles his strength even though he's already the strongest of the gods without it.
It seems to me, that poetry was of paramount importance before the written word. The rhythm and flow helping lessons to grow. The alliterative allusions aiding in the recall of long versus.
I feel like I'm going to refer back to this one many times.
Bragi said to me "I was once Odin but Odin was never me." Kind of poetic.
the question, naturally, is whether I should begin including Bragi among the deities I worship, which are coincidentally all currently associated with poetry in some way.
Having both heard and delivered spoken poetry in person, there is indeed a sacredness about it, especially when the poet herself is reading it and it’s about personal experiences, trials, etc. It takes courage and passion to not only display but perform one’s own artistry and lived experience in front of one’s community. A kind of duality of strength and vulnerability. Makes perfect sense that it would be valued among the Gods.
"Complicated diplomatic situations". Nice reference my dude.
Given Bragi is someone I've been meaning to open reciprocity with but have been dragging my heels on, this video's given me some renewed inspiration in that direction. Much obliged, Ocean!
With the Havamal, Odin's wisdom is more along the lines of life advice and being generally wise--and clever. Perhaps the distinction here is life smarts vs. book smarts, so to speak, both of which are needed, depending on who one's opponents happen to be.
Ive often thought of reaching out to Bragi in a bit of an odd way. I DM a tabletop RPG game for my friends and odd as it sounds I feel like Bragi would be great to speak to and appreciate the level of linguistic performing and storytelling required for a DMing a tabletop RPG.
That pun made my blood run cold.
Excellent
@@OceanKeltoi You are a monster who thrives on the suffering of your viewers. Keep up the good work. Even if I hate the puns I keep coming back. So obviously you are doing something right.
@@thegingersheep You would miss the puns if he were to stop.
Ooh super excited!! As someone who struggles with public speaking, I would always look to him when I had presentation based finals in college. Same with composition courses too, he’s a great deity to turn to if you’re struggling from creativity block or writing burnout!
Well my Friday night has been made now. Ready to see this one.
Well I include Bragi in my Hearth Cult, I have not worked with him enough to say anything about him except the obvious.
Hail Bragi!
I’m glad
The few times I have worked with him in the past and that's been over 20 years ago is in The art of seduction, the right words to say works 😂 but then I thought poetry was for wooing women 🤣
But then I also include Lucifer and Lilith in my Hearth Cult too.😈 Read the Galdrbok and you'll understand why 😉
@@ninetales6485 Now I'm so damn curious I'm going to drop what I'm doing and see if Anazon has that on ebook lol.
Edit: Oh dear, my wallet hurt horribly just from seeing the price. ;(
@@JariDawnchild yeah it figures, the copy I have is from the late 90s.
0:00 - Just as I thought I’d heard the worst puns you could give, you pull this one. I am both disgusted and impressed.
From one Pun Master to another, I salute you.
In my experience, both as a writer / poet, and from the words of other poets, writers of prose, and songwriters, it often seems that the stories and poems don't come *from* us, so much as *through* us. So maybe Bragi shows up as the official poet in so many mortal kings' courts is because he becomes newly embodied every time a particularly skilled Skald performs.
odin might be great at poetry but we now who gets the Bragi-ing rights
😊😊😊😊
Thanks!
Every time you post a new article I end up having something to do which prevents me from being able to watch it live! 😞 Keep up the good work though!
So bragi is the keeper of the past and iduun is the purveyor of the future. I love the couple's dynamic more every time I hear something new.
I saw warrior poet and my first thought was John Lovell from warrior poet society. Gotta love him for standing tall against the tyrannical government we have right now. If you haven’t seen him, go look him up. Very educational.
I have just looked at that website you mentioned, and it is written in a very poetic and very, very vague fashion. From reading the title text, it is completely unclear who these people are fighting for, in whose name, for what cause - and against whom. It is, however, quite clear that they engage in acts of violence, glorify and romanticize it through a borrowed philosophy, consider themselves to be wiser than the rest and claim to be on a self-styled "sacred" mission of protecting some people against the others, without specifying what the whole crusade is about. Since it is only quickly mentioned that Lovell himself was a christian missionary in the Far East and the violence he propagates is portrayed as some kind of noble art for samurai-like soldiers without actually openly stating what his principles and goals are, the entire site has a distinct aura of intentional vagueness and purposeful signalling that it is all about tribalism and serving a particular political agenda. Tyranny means different things to different people, and I doubt that Bragi had ever seen himself as a violent mercenary who suffers from a delusion of grandeur.
@@gaiagreen2690 I’m honestly not trying to be disrespectful in any shape or form. That being said that was a lot to read for someone who hasn’t done much research on the guy. I’ve been watching him for years and every video he puts out you learn more about what his goals are. He might be a Christian and that has never bothered me being a Heathen because I’m not judging anyone on something like religion. If we start judging others on religion then we are no better than the ones who judge us and we have all been judged in what way or another. You can’t just look at his site and read a few things and think you know what he is all about. That’s like you going to the book store and the first book you see is something that you disagree with on a personal level and instead of looking at another book you leave and decide the whole store is wrong. Even though if you looked farther in there may be books that you love. I personally don’t see what’s wrong with him, he fights for our rights to have this type of free conversation on the web or in public (which is being attacked as we speak), he fights for the 2nd amendment which allows me to protect my children from anyone that wishes us harm as well as my property (Havamal stanza 38 - Never go even a single step without a weapon at your side; you never know when you might find yourself in need of a spear.), he fights for our right to (I don’t know if you live in the us but I’m speaking as though you do) practice our different faiths. I do believe you missed a lot of his teachings just by glancing at a site. He also isn’t pro violence, he’s actually against it but is also a realist who thinks you should know how to defend yourself in the terrible situation that you may be in. A few people hate on him because he is a Christian but I’ve never hated anyone for something like that, if you can hate someone solely on their religion I believe you stand a high chance of also being a racist ( speaking generally and not about you because I don’t know anything about you). What do I know, I’m just some silly Heathen who wants his freedoms for himself and his family on his homestead. Living off the land like our ancestors did. As I said no hostilities from me, I hope you have a nice one. Skal
@@thelonelygypsy8479 How very intriguing - did you just intentionally completely misrepresent what I said in my comment? Because I never said that I rejected him on the basis of his religion, which he is fanatical enough about to try to shove it on the people of other faiths abroad, but that he was glorifying violence while staying vague about whose money he is taking and who he is raising his weapons for - and against. I have also openly stated that I read only the title site and that to me it seemed as if it was created to misrepresent and veil his true political stances. But there is a very loud and very obvious whistle there, if we combine what he DID mention - a former soldier, a former missionary, a believer in violence, a lover of weapons and a propagator of armed conflicts. Someone who dresses up killing and being hired to kill those who think differently as something noble, romantic and who tries to make it acceptable by randomly quoting bits and pieces of foreign philosophies as it suits him, to justify his violence and make it sound noble, instead of it being a murder. One doesn't need to be a mental health expert whose everyday job is communication like me, to connect the dots and recognize that these people raise their arms not to protect everyone's freedom but the norms and values based on a dogma and privileges that THEY hold sacred. Nor does one need to read every single book one picks up to understand what it's topic and it's philosophy are. It was a nice try to insert a bit of propaganda and try to project (non-related) "racism" onto me, but I am not an ex-soldier who spent years trying to force his oppressive religion on those who do not want it and who now lives of selling an idea of killing for money, while creating macho fairytales of murdering those who reject one's dogma being what ahh, only rare, brave and manly warriors do. One CAN see what a book is ABOUT by reading an introduction (that is why it is there, to explain what is inside) and decide if one is interested, and this introduction was so purposefully vague, while simultaneously dropping a nugget here and there, to signal exactly what and who it is for. And it is NOT freedom for everyone. Since you chose to ignore the points I made very clearly and went to project their intolerance on me, let me be clear: a christian fanatic with a history of wanting to convert people who now preaches about "killing for freedom" and how noble it is definitely does not stand for peace, tolerance and equal rights and freedom for all - on the contrary. You mixed up lots of ideas and equated freedom to own a weapon and use it with the freedom of speech, and you repeatedly mention your current "tyrannical government" - these are all typical right wing equasions and propaganda, and everyone outside of that bubble sees the contradictions, lies and projections. To end this completely misrepresented "murder for fredom" and "they are coming for us" conversation, let me point out that we live in a civilized society where wearing a gun does not make you an ancient warrior. Killing people on a whim for a minor offence does not make you a heathen hero, it makes you a criminal. Romanticizing violence to feel like a real man and condoning intolerance is not a civilized way to live. In this society everyone has the right to live and be safe, and to have a proper trial should they transgress the law, instead of having their heads chopped off by a delusional macho on an ancient legend trip. There was MUCH more to heathen way of life and their spirituality than strutting around with a sword, killing whomever one wanted and feeling brave like a son of Odin. And I do not need to read pages of yet another bogus spiritual Rambo to know how right wing propaganda works, what and whose "freedoms" they want to kill for, what projection, distraction and manipulation are, what kind of activities fanatical missionaries do in remote regions and what horrid crimes mercenaries are payed to commit - and how they are always murdering and glorifying violence to "protect their sacred freedom, culture, way of life etc. from those bad, bad others." That is where your racism lives and thrives. There are many ways to live your spiritual path, but glorifying senseless violence into some bogus fairytale for machos to soothe your emotional deficits is not a good one. And one doesn't answer critique by avoiding the genuine topic and inventing stuff no one said instead.
@@gaiagreen2690 I’m not going to lie a read maybe 3/4 of your comment. You have fun with all your thoughts of whatever you were talking about. As I said not trying to be rude but I’ve spent my time dealing with illogical people like you. Have a good one
P.s. watch less tv, it does wonders for the mind. Skal
@@thelonelygypsy8479 I understand, believe me. It is often unbearable for people to face the dismantling of their system of illusions, and they often project the exact opposite on the arguments they cannot refute, to be able to deal with the exposure. (So a logical analysis suddenly becomes an "illogical person.") Also, thanks for your kind "advice," but I must disappoint you, my friend - I don't have much time to watch tv, because I mostly read, write and publish on various topics of psychology, and I work as a mental health professional. However, if inventing nonsense about those you cannot contradict makes you feel important, then by all means do it. Oh, and if one has sound arguments, one doesn't need to be rude.
I prayed and offered to Bragi the night before I had the interview for my current job. I interview(and honestly verbally communicate in general) horribly and felt drawn to Bragi in the days leading up to the interview. I stutter, especially when I’m nervous or anxious, I have a tendency to think faster than I can talk, and my thoughts often come out in verbal form not really resembling what I wanted them to be. As I walked into what is now my place of employment I felt I sense of peace and wisdom within myself and, for once, I wasn’t a nervous wreck about a job interview. I don’t think I stuttered once during that interview and I didn’t have to pause to remember my pre-thought out answers to common job interview questions. As someone who enjoys writing, I feel inclined to work with Bragi more. I think I could learn a lot from him.
Pun game on point
I’ve been hoping for this one!! Can’t wait!
I love this religion. The unanswered questions and mysteriousness about it allows one to worship and view it as they'd like. It's unlike most religions
Fuck yeah Brage! The god of rock stars and artists!
6:07 - Egil showing that a good editor can be a real life saver!
I'm never ready for the puns... But I like it
As a TH-camr or just creative in general, I always feel a connection to Bragi. Nice video man, love your channel and your puns haha
Bragis description reminds me of the celtic bards which where also tasked with recalling the history of the clan and they where also said to have magic powers do to their poetry
Future video suggestion, what are some viewpoints on worshipping gods/goddesses from different pantheons? Like I'm mainly norse gods oriented, but I have a posidon statue in my fish tank, a small statue dedicated to Athena and a pendent on my walking staff dedicated to Nyx.
I swear ocean has touched on this somewhere. I'll either find the video I'm thinking of or find out he has not.
Nevertheless, I can send you to a video from Aliakai in which she touches on syncretism and multi-traditionalism (funnily enough, mentioning Ocean in the process).
th-cam.com/video/xsE0Rt4kZ-M/w-d-xo.html
About the first half is focused on reconstruction and eclecticism, if you want to skip to syncretism - but the whole video is good.
I'll update you if I find the Ocean video I was looking for. However, I'm going to bed right now so maybe you'll have an answer before I find it.
One video he's mentioned the concept in is Eclectic Paganism vs Reconstructionism(...): th-cam.com/video/p9edwMiYsX4/w-d-xo.html
However, it isn't really the point of the discussion. The some could be said when it's brought up in 10 Kinds of Theism, where Syncretism is mentioned in the context of taking it all the way to the extreme - Omnism.
th-cam.com/video/KCvGNXIp0bM/w-d-xo.html
There might be more, but I haven't found them. Still, a video specifically on this would be great.
Great information ☺️
You get a thumps up just for that opening joke.
@Ocean Keltoi, you like Wardruna? Have you commented on them somewhere? More people should hear them, not just album songs, but also the performances such as with Aurora & Fagottkor, and the Viking Suite for the TV series gala, those two are IMO the most powerful performances in general ever.
Einar and Bragi are probably bros
Thank you for this vid !
Looking forward to this one!
I literally love his videos
I just saw you posted ,i pushed that button so fast 😁
Here's a thought, in regard to Lokasenna...perhaps Iðunn is another name for Gerður, and Bragi another for Freyr, and the brother in question is the enigmatic Beli (the bellower, roarer etc). Skírnirmál says that the brother is dead before Freyr marries Gerður, while Gylfaginning says that Beli is killed with an antler because Freyr had given his sword away...ergo...after the wedding.
praying to Bragi to assist in my homebrew worldbuilding and the performance of DMing.
i named my son Bragi, your very right it is hard to find infomation on him and i kind of enjoy that fact, i hail you for your efforts and making this video, buttons have ben clicked and i look forward to watching many of your other videos.
skál
Any thoughts on the runes on his tongue having an association with improvisation? Were it not for Lokasenna I'd expect that to be handy in a flyting. Just a shot in the dark, I can't think of any reason for or against off the top of my head.
I really want to work with Bragi my practice is music so working with the warrior poet Bragi makes the most sense.
So basically he is a dnd bard
Bardi
You are sooo great thank you for all i learned from you 👍.Greetings from Germany
Someone needs to build this Guy a Tempel to teach us all.
I would fly from Germany to this Guy right now Just to hear his wisdom for 5 minutes
I’ve always found the idea of Bragi the man-turned-god quite compelling; in the past I think I confused Bragi with Snorri, in that I believed Bragi the man had been killed for political reasons (probably not an uncommon fate for skalds who got a little too spicy for the jarls) and THAT’S the reasons the Gods allowed him to become one of them* - I don’t believe this anymore, mainly because I’ve looked into the actual history but I would like to think Bragi is still the type of guy who is not afraid to riff on Odin during his poetry sessions.
Speaking of, Snorri in the Edda says that Bragi is Odin’s son. But the Edda says a lot of things (shove her!). If you want to get literalist about it, and reconcile the possible existence of Bragi Boddason you could say he was the half-god son of Odin then “went back home” when he died; and that why he was such a great poet. But that’s just not how I see things working in “the real world” with regards to the Gods (even when I was Christian, I felt very skeptical of things like that). Although its still a cool concept if you want to engage with it, its just not my praxis.
*And thinking it about it now, after learning from Ocean and other similar vloggers about cultural baggage of Christianity, I wonder if I had been proyecting the concept of martydom on him - although theres also some greek god stories about the olympians turning people they liked into stars after they died so who knows
Ocean: "I don't mean to Bragi, but a bald head is never shaggy..." ( Pagan phone rings ) Bragi: "Could you not?" (pagan phone click) Ocean adds editing to Bragi's portfolio.
Perhaps Odin stole the mead of poetry from Bragi and that's how he became the head deity.
The dark fire will not avail you, Flame of Idunn! Go back to the shadow!
yo nice bro!!!
Historically. One of Odins names referenced within Neil Prices - The Viking Way. is in fact Bragi which means Chieftain. Which re-enforces the Leadership attestation you reference in this Video, and further adds to the question if Bragi is indeed just another side of Odin.
i'd love a video on thiazi (spelling) and skadi
and aegir
I have a vid on Aegir and Ran. One of my favorite projects.
@@OceanKeltoi cool, ill check that out some time
pretty sure Bragi was originally just Óðinn but reanalyzed into a new god
Ocean, bringing the level 10 dad jokes. lol
Might ya do some hellenism break downs, stories, distinctions, tributes or even debunking...Greco-roman...perhaps? 🥺🥺🥺🥺
Ocean how would you explain jormungander today we know there isnt a badass snake wrapped around the world but i just want to know how you understand that?
Could you do a video on Ullr
I'd be curious why he was chosen to rule in Odin's absence.
What characteristics does he possess?
Some freaky coincidence: my mom got sick, i need to pray to Eir and here you make a video of her. Im struggling financially should bring an offer to Njorthr, you male a video of him. I need to improve my singing to get the main role in a play, so i should pray to Bragi, you make a video about him. So, whos next?
Good Sir, a wee bit off topic…but do you have any thoughts on author Galina Krasskova? I am finding an incredible amount of conflicting information about her. Also, offering has been made to the bell! Looking forward to this next video!
I got into a bit of a tiff with her over her defending her husband wearing a nazi symbol because of his UPG. It's become a bit of a running joke in some communities that Nazi symbols are bad... unless of course Dionysus gave you permission to wear them.
=sigh=
I haven't read a whole lot of her texts though. But that was my personal experience there. I've heard mixed reviews on her research.
@@OceanKeltoi yikes! Thank you very much for that info. Definitely not a great experience. Sorry you had to go through that 😔
I was perusing some of her Goodreads list from 2020, and it seems she had an issue with an anti-racist children’s book (I am a bookseller, very familiar with this beautiful little book she was behaving like a jerk about)…so…that’s a blazing red flag for me also.
@@antonia.westcoast Which book? And what was her criticism? I'd be interested in taking a look. I support anti-racism, but sometimes it can come coupled with poor research. I don't, however, have much trust in Galina's judgement on the matter.
@@OceanKeltoi it’s called “Anti-Racist Baby” by Ibram X. Kendi. It’s a boardbook meant for very young folks, on the same ‘reading’ level as the Very Hungry Caterpillar, etc. Not a huge amount of writing, but thoughtful, kind imagery and words.
Her criticism was that it was poorly written and illustrated, and “…good on the author for taking advantage of the current crazy political climate.”
@@antonia.westcoast okay, I tried giving Galina the benefit of the doubt, but that just sounds bad faith as hell. I just looked it up and the illustration isn't anything to complain about. Seems to me like she was looking for excuses to whine about a good message.
Yo, I’ve been a heathen for about5 years now (I’m 23) Will it ever stop feeling weird to talk about my faith? Does coming to the faith from an atheist background give it an extra layer of taboo or do ex-christians feel what I’m saying? Love from perhaps the only heathen in Ontario.
Train hard, train smart.
I have a question. I know you kinda answered this but are the gods immortal or just live vastly longer than humans? Considering Ragnarok
Honestly in order to really tackle this, I'd need to go into the whole Ragnarok legend, so that should be a video I make in the future going into all of that. Hugely complex legend with a lot of discussions around it.
I wonder if Bragi is actually Saga. Given what we know it's not beyond the realm to believe that many female gods were recoded.
I think its more than reasonable to presume that there are multiple Gods that have similar associations, just as there are many Gods of war within the Norse pantheon.
@@OceanKeltoi that's the hardest thing for new pagans to grok. Outside of a very few deities there isn't really such a thing as a "god of". Gods like people have specific interests but they are more than a single interest or personality trait.
Ocean, I was watching you in a debate on TH-cam earlier in which you expressed the belief that the Gods are non material in nature.
Is it possible that the Gods are material in nature?
My own hypothesis of Faith is that the Gods are made up of the tinniest possible particles and I have coined the phrase 'spirit particles'. Particles perhaps so small that they could pass between the atoms of a concrete wall like an atom could pass between two exoplanets in outerspace.
I don't know how these particles would have to be configured or co-aligned in order to support consciousness along with the incredible power of a God, or how many such particles make up a particular God as opposed to a Valkyrie or a Jotun, but it is this hypothesis of faith that allows me to be both a materialist and a polytheist.
I have no way of proving or disproving this hypothesis of course, but it makes sense to me because it is what is precedented in the natural world (I would say multiverse).
Everything is made up of minute particles..
My reasons for believing in the Gods, coincidentally, also involve what is precedented. There is plurality, therefore there is a multiverse, therefore there will be beings so powerful and so much more advanced than ourselves that we would not be mistaken if we were to call them Gods.
There will be lots of them.
The gods are more like intangible aspects of nature. I think of them in a similar way to the natural forces
If spirit particles exist as is my hypothesis then to all intents and purposes they are intangible, and yet both natural and physical.
Something not yet measurable by science, and there's a chance it may never be. Atoms contain a shit-ton of empty space, so there might be something analogously similar in that space we can't detect. Possibly something that vibrates and moves like electrons, but with a frequency we can't easily discern? The difference between a mundane space and a sacred space comes to mind for me, or how a sensitive person might pick up on a non-physical presence. Or how a cleansed item feels different from one that hasn't been, and you can feel the change in a cleansed item after handling it if you haven't cleansed yourself in some way first.
@@JariDawnchild My thinking is more to do with what is within the 'sacred space' and the term 'spirit particles' essentially encapsulates my hypothesis here.
Yet I have other related hypotheses.
Do we not also have spirit particles in the manner of our Gods?
What happens upon bodily death?
Do these particles hold their form when they peel away from the corpse in the form of a ghost and is this, perhaps, what our images of the Goddess Hel truly indicate at: a beautiful spirit peeling away from a decomposed or decomposing corpse?
Does cremation quicken this process?
Do our children and grandchildren inherit aspects of our spirit, just like they might inherit our eye colour and hair colour?
This is how I personally make sense of some key concepts within our faith. Helheim, as far as I'm concerned, is here on this plain. Here is where we remain as spiritual entities and as ghosts until we inhabit another hamr; another lik, or move on to Asgardr.
it seems like poetry would have been very important to the Germanic tribes to tell and retell stories especially the myths that and legends they had even before writing them down became an idea.
Arth bear, Athro teacher, Kalavela. Boom.
Remember poets were the news givers and propagandists , and entertainment back in the day.They were part of the ancient media.I often wonder if Odin being a God of poetry was more to do with the propaganda or as we call it psychological operations. Imagine being a warrior about to battle and hearing or remembering a poem about the deadliness of your foes king or army etc.In these days we are literally saturated in information from media , back then the sources would have been very few. Poets would have been treated as mentioned above like a living radio .
And what about the idea that bragi is just another name for baldur and idunn is Just another name for nana?
0:06 bro u did nottt😂💀💀
🖖
Every day i laugh my ass off thinking someday you're gonna turn on that cam and upload a video of nordic runes tattooed on your head
Does Rune magic as mentioned in this video work? Hopefully it isn't a loaded question, but can anyone account for it's efficacy?
The professional poets where part of the hird. To live on others production of food meant you had to be part of the hird, professional warriors. Those poets where warriors, other poets are not known.
Did anyone else notice that Odin is Dionysian and Bragi is Apolloian, or is that just me?
Bragi and Apollo certainly bear similarities. I personally also draw parallels between Apollo and Idunn.
@@OceanKeltoi What are the Apollo-Idunn parallels? I personally draw parallels between Freyr and Apollo. I would like to hear those Apollo-Idunn parallels though. :)
Wait but who is fr that old photo of odin
Who or what is a skald? The pen is mightier than the sword
That pun... be glad there's no such thing as a barded shillelagh. ;)
Fool me not with your words poet - the Almighty Johnsons
What if Bragi is one of Odins human forms?
If he is a god of literature and spoken history , then would he also be a god of language as well ?
5:16 hostile negotiations.
Is there a god named vali?
Would it be at all fair to call a Norse Pagan who engages in rap battles flighty (flyt-y)?
SCOLDING HOT AHAHAHAHAHA I SLAP MY KNEE TO THAT AHAHAHA
Would it be appropriate to call you Goði,, Ocean?
Skalding hot 😂😂
Heil og sæl
I wonder how many times you have to read/say your jokes before you can finally keep a straight face upon delivery... or do you just fix it in post?