The only difference i noticed putting 38 DGAS on my 2.0 pinto back in the day with Kent FR32 cam stage 2 Burton head & small bore 4 2 1 manifold. Was it drank like Oliver Reed! Lol That 38 dgas was bought new re-jetted & set up on rolling road. The 32/36 was standard & used. But was better on fuel & quicker over the 1/4 mile!
I like the explanation on that and I've ran both and the drive ability or there reaction to throttle input is completely different at least in my rig the 32 36 is a great carb better on mpgs a little but also when running on the primary 32 it's kinda sluggish and it not having a great transition to the secondary 36 has kinda dead spot were it has to catch up every one I've ran or seen has the same problem but when it does catch up they scream the 38 is more sensitive to throttle input under a good load can be sluggish of the bottom after about 1500 and when the cam profile kicks in everythings there but if u stab it from idle best I can explain is like a 2 stoke or turbo it takes a second and then it's madness I prefer the 38 but that's just me hope this helps some one if nothing else
I've been using a 32/36 on an L28, in a 430 Datsun 280C. Sips gas. Power on demand. Only problem was hesitation, but that was due to running small idle jets. Engine will rev quickly to around 6k, on a high speed run I got 230kph. Never had any problems with my carb. Towed another 280C up hills, carried well over 1500lbs with ease. First and second, I'd burn tyres. Everyone said, that's for a 4cyl, I'm using the wrong carb. Use a 38/38. Use side drafts. They were wrong. The 32/36 is an amazing carb that performs. Thanks for the video information!
But, but, the DGAS is a larger carburettor..... Oddly enough, that´s just about the exact same results we saw some 10 years ago. I´m glad someone else proved it, because the DGAS people are hard to convince
throttle size on the 38 is bigger, but the throttle spindles are thicker offsetting the bigger throttles, a mere 1mm increase of one choke diameter also means the bigger carb wont flow a load more air, in any case the manifold is a bigger restriction than the carb
I've tried both the progressive 32/36 and non-progressive 38/38 on my 3.3L modified head cylinder Ford 200/c4 auto. From my test drives, the 38/38 was the far better choice. Much later, I opened up the 32/36 and learned that the jetting was for a 4-cylinder. From Penguin's tests, I'll assume that if properly jetted, the 32/36 and 38/38 will be very similar in performance on my setup. 32 to 36 and 36 to 38 - on the butterflies - isn't much of a difference...
I play with similar sized engines here in Aus. the holden 202 cui. 3.3l also. I've ran many different carbies here, from single barrel strombergs, to 350 holleys. All have been well tuned. The weber 38 beats them hands down and jetted right, is very fun to drive and quite awesome. First one I had tested I'd had a very well tuned holley on the engine first then went to the weber 38. Was phenonemally different and has been superb. It's not one of the most common conversions I do.
Spent hours and hours on a rolling road in the early 90s doing this very test with a 32/36 and 38 completely re jetting both carbs. 32/36 gave overall a better drive and fuel consumption compared to the 38.
Great stuff, Thank You! I do also think, that 32/36 is better overall, but I still like more that 38 dgas on my Anglia with 2.0 Pinto. It gives more throttle response.
There you see, 38/38 is only good for bigger V6 engines. For smaller inline-4, 32/36 any day! I had many of these Ford engines/cars and tuned lots of them. Pintos and V6's as well :)
Great content again! Thanks! I was just thinking to upgrade my EFI 2.0 and asking you for advice. Aaaand you are going to make a mini series of this upgrade! I am happy thanks.
Great info Graham. Before I went to side drafts I ran a 32/36 for years and loved it, despite everyone telling me to fit a 38DGAS. Glad I did. I imagine the progressive opening of the 32/36 also helps cruise and driveability so in reality the 38DGAS is almost a backwards step?
do you think the manifold is the biggest restrictor, i guess you would have to test a optimal manifold for each carbs to see if there is a difference, but the difference will properly still be very small, if any.
I would think the intake manifold the reason for the lack of any difference in HP between the two carbs. Do you ever work with the Ford Cologne V6 engines? I would think that on a 2.8L you would see some increase in HP with the 38 DGAS.
yo tengo un motor 22r y si no me equivoco el carburador original es un 32/38 progresivo y lo cambie por un webber 38/38 y lo que he podido notar es que se se pierde un poco de potencia a rpm bien bajas pero lo que si puedo decir es que se comporta mejor que el original en altura a 3500 mts sobre el nivel del mar donde escasea el oxigeno.
In my dyno experience, comparable oil temperature is critical in producing consistent results between runs assuming coolant and room temps are the same.
Fantastic informative video as always Graham, I remember your video on the new big racing Pinto engine where you compared 40 dcoe's with big chokes fitted and then did similar size chokes fitted to 45 dcoe's and got more power due to the shape of the expansion being better on the bigger carbs a bit like a well designed power station cooling tower. Have you ever done any tests on that big engine using the big chokes as in the 45 dcoe's but using 48 dco/sp carbs so as you would get even better expansion from the choke size to the outside world , just a thought, love to se the results if you have done this test. Regards Dave. 😀
With higher lift cam will the 32/36 Weber idle without any problems or you need the 38? Does the 38 need a rejet on a 2l application? Just need confirmation I purchased a head a cam with more duration and lift the seller and the cam manufacturer said the 36 idle will be rough it needs a 38 if I don't have sidedrafts.can you advise please
I did find the 38dgas was more predictable on the exit of a turn with no sudden burst of power from a secondary barrel opening spinning up a lightly loaded inside rear wheel 👍
interesting, most people report it the other way round, the 32/36 being more progressive as it gradually opens the secondary, where as the 38 opens both throttles together.
if you could in next video on carburation, you may try and see if sidedraft or downdraft , dcoe or idf make a diffrence, because of the idf with its ca. 90 degree bend Air is "lazy" dont like bends so much, so might be seen by testing. Compare 40 dcoe and 40 idf carbs
@@PenguinMotors so that would say, this 90 degree angle bend does more harm to performance, is it? Group 1 Ford Escort mk2 had 2 x 44 idf on it as far i know of
hey bud ive got smog waterchoke 32/36 from aussie 2.0 can i just delete the smog stuff and rejet and what jets would you recomend with mild street cam cheers
Amigo I build me a CRX base mostly from junk yard parts stock d15b2 block original block I put a y8 head gasket and po8-3 head mild bore better spring and retainers and a 272 Delta cam regrind header 2 in free flow exhaust system homemade and I put a lighter flywheel and gd clutch kit .I used the original d15b2 16 valves obdo distributor with adjustments and I put a fuel pump close to the gas tank and ran to gas hoses one for the fuel go in and one return and I put a 32/36 Weber Chinese Weber carb and Holly crap I build me a race car mostly with hardly nothing poor man revenue really she is peppy like hell probably 10.1 to 11.1 compression around I say .She pull real nice run beautiful and sound like a old Ford muscle car people ask me if I have a V8 on her special on gas stations or the lights stop sings but I really play with the timing and carb tune a bit to have it where I want it and I did took her there with the old school style sound plus I all motor no VTEC crap eliminate the VTEC I wend all motor CCR born in the byouooooo voodoo child CRX Honda run beautiful on highway cities and back roads she looks tuff and sounds tuff and I love the 32/36 Weber carb i really do plus they are cheap from china jjjjj plus i regulate her gas around 3 and half pound to four to get my gas power and distributor timing right my like plus i used better spark plugs from other years that came stock with little more compression in the hondas d series engine and bingo ccr born in the byouooooo gd video and for timing gun I take her to a up the hill to I find the spot where she really pull gd old school style 😊😊
@PenguinMotors they surprisingly will on an F2 engine so clearly have the flow. That's on a radical cam so not a road friendly combination granted. So little point using much else...as in the dgas...on a fast road type spec around 145-150 ish...twin carbs aside with their better distribution, but more cost involved. Good to see the proof on the dyno though.
![BOWKYLION - วิงวอน (ex-change) [Official MV]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/cLdnZWDaO-w/mqdefault.jpg)
The only difference i noticed putting 38 DGAS on my 2.0 pinto back in the day with Kent FR32 cam stage 2 Burton head & small bore 4 2 1 manifold. Was it drank like Oliver Reed! Lol That 38 dgas was bought new re-jetted & set up on rolling road. The 32/36 was standard & used. But was better on fuel & quicker over the 1/4 mile!
I like the explanation on that and I've ran both and the drive ability or there reaction to throttle input is completely different at least in my rig the 32 36 is a great carb better on mpgs a little but also when running on the primary 32 it's kinda sluggish and it not having a great transition to the secondary 36 has kinda dead spot were it has to catch up every one I've ran or seen has the same problem but when it does catch up they scream the 38 is more sensitive to throttle input under a good load can be sluggish of the bottom after about 1500 and when the cam profile kicks in everythings there but if u stab it from idle best I can explain is like a 2 stoke or turbo it takes a second and then it's madness I prefer the 38 but that's just me hope this helps some one if nothing else
I've been using a 32/36 on an L28, in a 430 Datsun 280C. Sips gas. Power on demand. Only problem was hesitation, but that was due to running small idle jets. Engine will rev quickly to around 6k, on a high speed run I got 230kph. Never had any problems with my carb. Towed another 280C up hills, carried well over 1500lbs with ease. First and second, I'd burn tyres. Everyone said, that's for a 4cyl, I'm using the wrong carb. Use a 38/38. Use side drafts. They were wrong. The 32/36 is an amazing carb that performs. Thanks for the video information!
The 32/36 will give better drivability and cruise too. Great video Graham, keep them coming 👍
But, but, the DGAS is a larger carburettor..... Oddly enough, that´s just about the exact same results we saw some 10 years ago. I´m glad someone else proved it, because the DGAS people are hard to convince
throttle size on the 38 is bigger, but the throttle spindles are thicker offsetting the bigger throttles, a mere 1mm increase of one choke diameter also means the bigger carb wont flow a load more air, in any case the manifold is a bigger restriction than the carb
@@PenguinMotors Yes. IIRC the venturies are not that much larger in total either. But the massive throttle spindles are a huuge restriction.
Thanks for all the work and information you are sharing with us.
I've tried both the progressive 32/36 and non-progressive 38/38 on my 3.3L modified head cylinder Ford 200/c4 auto. From my test drives, the 38/38 was the far better choice. Much later, I opened up the 32/36 and learned that the jetting was for a 4-cylinder. From Penguin's tests, I'll assume that if properly jetted, the 32/36 and 38/38 will be very similar in performance on my setup. 32 to 36 and 36 to 38 - on the butterflies - isn't much of a difference...
I play with similar sized engines here in Aus. the holden 202 cui. 3.3l also. I've ran many different carbies here, from single barrel strombergs, to 350 holleys. All have been well tuned. The weber 38 beats them hands down and jetted right, is very fun to drive and quite awesome. First one I had tested I'd had a very well tuned holley on the engine first then went to the weber 38. Was phenonemally different and has been superb. It's not one of the most common conversions I do.
Spent hours and hours on a rolling road in the early 90s doing this very test with a 32/36 and 38 completely re jetting both carbs. 32/36 gave overall a better drive and fuel consumption compared to the 38.
38 ends up using bigger mains, bigger mains to achieve same power can only result in worse fuel consumption
Great stuff, Thank You! I do also think, that 32/36 is better overall, but I still like more that 38 dgas on my Anglia with 2.0 Pinto. It gives more throttle response.
thats because the linkage opens the throttles faster
There you see, 38/38 is only good for bigger V6 engines. For smaller inline-4, 32/36 any day! I had many of these Ford engines/cars and tuned lots of them. Pintos and V6's as well :)
I've had RS2000,s with both of those carburetors and I actually preferred the 32/36, if just for the noise of the second choke opening up.
Great content again! Thanks! I was just thinking to upgrade my EFI 2.0 and asking you for advice. Aaaand you are going to make a mini series of this upgrade! I am happy thanks.
Great info Graham. Before I went to side drafts I ran a 32/36 for years and loved it, despite everyone telling me to fit a 38DGAS. Glad I did. I imagine the progressive opening of the 32/36 also helps cruise and driveability so in reality the 38DGAS is almost a backwards step?
Pierburg v6 carb that came on the Sierras is the uprated v6 engine.
do you think the manifold is the biggest restrictor, i guess you would have to test a optimal manifold for each carbs to see if there is a difference, but the difference will properly still be very small, if any.
Thats a great comparison...would love to know some jetting info but maybe thats the real secret sauce 😂 setting my 32/36 up on an l20b
I would think the intake manifold the reason for the lack of any difference in HP between the two carbs. Do you ever work with the Ford Cologne V6 engines?
I would think that on a 2.8L you would see some increase in HP with the 38 DGAS.
i have had Cologne V6 engines apart, but never done any tuning work on them
yo tengo un motor 22r y si no me equivoco el carburador original es un 32/38 progresivo y lo cambie por un webber 38/38 y lo que he podido notar es que se se pierde un poco de potencia a rpm bien bajas pero lo que si puedo decir es que se comporta mejor que el original en altura a 3500 mts sobre el nivel del mar donde escasea el oxigeno.
If the 38 works better at 3500 meters then you didnt have the 32/36 jetted correctly
@@PenguinMotors nunca tuve el webber 32/36 yo tenia el original del carro que es assin 32/38
Great video Graham... Myth busted 👍
In my dyno experience, comparable oil temperature is critical in producing consistent results between runs assuming coolant and room temps are the same.
Agreed, but that’s why I monitor oil temp
Fantastic informative video as always Graham, I remember your video on the new big racing Pinto engine where you compared 40 dcoe's with big chokes fitted and then did similar size chokes fitted to 45 dcoe's and got more power due to the shape of the expansion being better on the bigger carbs a bit like a well designed power station cooling tower. Have you ever done any tests on that big engine using the big chokes as in the 45 dcoe's but using 48 dco/sp carbs so as you would get even better expansion from the choke size to the outside world , just a thought, love to se the results if you have done this test.
Regards
Dave. 😀
With higher lift cam will the 32/36 Weber idle without any problems or you need the 38? Does the 38 need a rejet on a 2l application? Just need confirmation I purchased a head a cam with more duration and lift the seller and the cam manufacturer said the 36 idle will be rough it needs a 38 if I don't have sidedrafts.can you advise please
You don't need a 38 for anything, idle, mid range or top end. 32/36 or twin carburettors
@@richardjackson5380 thank you so much for your reply and advice much appreciated god bless 🙏
I did find the 38dgas was more predictable on the exit of a turn with no sudden burst of power from a secondary barrel opening spinning up a lightly loaded inside rear wheel 👍
interesting, most people report it the other way round, the 32/36 being more progressive as it gradually opens the secondary, where as the 38 opens both throttles together.
@@PenguinMotors yes but I thought the difference was both are open from the from the very start 👍
Good data thanks. How about a single side draft comparison - please :)
will do one at some point, ive got a manifold, just no time
Good stuff. Thanks for posting. Cheers
Dude can you please do a 36DCD 7 CARB VIDEO
To what degree, do you think, it will change if a flowed cylinderhead with big valves is installed?
it should add a few bhp in the midrange and probably 10 or so at higher rpm
What about DCOE's?? ;)
if you could in next video on carburation, you may try and see if sidedraft or downdraft , dcoe or idf make a diffrence, because of the idf with its ca. 90 degree bend
Air is "lazy" dont like bends so much, so might be seen by testing. Compare 40 dcoe and 40 idf carbs
I did do an IDF DCOE comparison 40dcoe made more torque and almost as much power as 44 IDF
@@PenguinMotors so that would say, this 90 degree angle bend does more harm to performance, is it? Group 1 Ford Escort mk2 had 2 x 44 idf on it as far i know of
Whats a rough ignition timing to use with this cam and 32/36. My idle timing wants to be around 16 degrees? Other wise its flat
around 30 degrees @ 3500 rpm. if it wants as much as 16 degrees idle you probably have a faulty advance mechanism in the distributor
hey bud ive got smog waterchoke 32/36 from aussie 2.0 can i just delete the smog stuff and rejet and what jets would you recomend with mild street cam cheers
Sorry don’t know anything about Aussie smog stuff so can’t advise you
Like the methodology
Didn't Vullcan use 40FFi5?
probably on a v6 capri engine but i doubt it on a pinto unless unless there was a really specific reason to do so.
I had a 500 holly back in the day
Amigo I build me a CRX base mostly from junk yard parts stock d15b2 block original block I put a y8 head gasket and po8-3 head mild bore better spring and retainers and a 272 Delta cam regrind header 2 in free flow exhaust system homemade and I put a lighter flywheel and gd clutch kit .I used the original d15b2 16 valves obdo distributor with adjustments and I put a fuel pump close to the gas tank and ran to gas hoses one for the fuel go in and one return and I put a 32/36 Weber Chinese Weber carb and Holly crap I build me a race car mostly with hardly nothing poor man revenue really she is peppy like hell probably 10.1 to 11.1 compression around I say .She pull real nice run beautiful and sound like a old Ford muscle car people ask me if I have a V8 on her special on gas stations or the lights stop sings but I really play with the timing and carb tune a bit to have it where I want it and I did took her there with the old school style sound plus I all motor no VTEC crap eliminate the VTEC I wend all motor CCR born in the byouooooo voodoo child CRX Honda run beautiful on highway cities and back roads she looks tuff and sounds tuff and I love the 32/36 Weber carb i really do plus they are cheap from china jjjjj plus i regulate her gas around 3 and half pound to four to get my gas power and distributor timing right my like plus i used better spark plugs from other years that came stock with little more compression in the hondas d series engine and bingo ccr born in the byouooooo gd video and for timing gun I take her to a up the hill to I find the spot where she really pull gd old school style 😊😊
once again, thankyou
Always was a myth, and with a 32/36 capable of feeding 165hp there's no point until the engine spec needs twin carbs.
165bhp would be a big ask from a 32/36, twin carbs will give more power and torque than a 32/36 at any engine spec
@PenguinMotors they surprisingly will on an F2 engine so clearly have the flow. That's on a radical cam so not a road friendly combination granted. So little point using much else...as in the dgas...on a fast road type spec around 145-150 ish...twin carbs aside with their better distribution, but more cost involved.
Good to see the proof on the dyno though.