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Have you ever considered taking 1 of your alt-history takes into a farther future. Like this Europe vs the scattered powers of the world in WW2 era fight like you alluded to at the end?
The Austrians giving up Dalmatia isn’t the most outrageous of ideas, somewhat counterintuitively. The largest part of the Austrian navy was actually on the Danube. The one thing I think Monsieur Z could have changed was the Austrians taking Wallachia and Moldavia in order to solidify their control of this River.
While that definitely seems like a reasonable direction for Austria, there's a good chance that Romania is never part of the Great War directly, as the third Balkan war (aka the Balkan theatre) was largely caused by Bulgarias entry, and the following support by Greece and the entente troops in Greece. If either Bulgaria doesn't enter, or more likely, Greece is too much under pressure due to Central Power control in the Eastern Mediterranean to allow entente troops or to join the war, Austrian control over the danube would have to be a different, post-war conflict. And honestly speaking, I don't see the Habsburgs being able to focus their attention to any external issues post-war due to both old and newly conquered South Slavs, as well as rising resistance in the northern slavic lands (Bohemia, Moravia, Silesia, Galicia, Slovakia, and Ruthenia)
Austria would probably need some time to recuperate, but without it, the Austrians would lose all way to project power. They would need to move quickly and decisively all while keeping the empire together (probably under Karl and his reformation plan) to not become a German puppet. It’s also good to remember the Pan-slavism is pretty hard to maintain when Russia is dead and there is not pan-Slavic state existing. Austro-Slavism might have been able to fully engulf the pan-Slavic movement.
@@riceyboi5606 While pan-slavism might not be as popular, there's no reason to think that regional Slav movements would stop, the movements for Czechia and Slovakia were around during the war, and the hundreds of thousands of Slavic legionnaires in entente countries wouldn't just give up.
Do a video "What if Italy fought for Austria?" This is because of the Rome Protocols and how Mussolini actually was warry about Hitler before joining the Axis.
@@MonsieurDean Dude good commercial regardless. I wish you do a video about Balkan league going into ww1 together. No second Balkan war happening included. I guess ww1 will finish in 2 years. Damn we shouldve beheaded he Saxo Coburg and other German kings in the Balkans. Romania had issues with king being on German side while nation needs were against the alliance and Greece to had troubles. Havent explored enough into subject. Our Saxo Coburg made the 1st catastrophe of our new state.
Good video, slight issue with Austria. At the eve of the Great War, it had the fastest growing economy of Europe, was industrialising (Moravia being an industrial heartland), and separatist sentiments were lower than they had been for decades. Even in Hungary, there were some in leadership positions realising that weakening the empire meant weakening their own foothold. The break up of the empire after the end of the war was as much the Entente, as it was the losing of fate in the Habsburg monarchy, which failed to provide security and food. But on the eve of the war, things weren't as bad as was considered in hindsight.
I think Austria-Hungary becoming landlocked is a bit too much, but Italy staying in the CP almost assures the Ententes defeat. It was really close in OTL.
Yeah i think they would have been screwed over like in our timeline. Germany woulldnt humiliate Austria Hungary like that. With such a failure AH would collapse.
Just because Italy is on a different side doesn’t mean it would’ve done better during the war. Hell the Italians couldn’t breakthrough the barely defenses isonzo river. Thinking the Italians would’ve done better on the better equipped and trained French army in the mountains is a laughable thought especially considering that they failed in their invasion of France during ww2 even after the fall of Paris. This video literally has no basis on reality.
“The volatile politics of Italy acquired additional complications at the end of the fifteenth century. Charles VIII had died in the spring of 1498, Old treaties were exhumed and new theatres penned, their ultimate effect being to cut Italy to bits.” ― Kate Simon,
the italy map you use time and again is wrong for the period as it contains austrian lands (southtyrol and trentino mainly) this is especially weird at 4:45 when you show all three maps
I think Italy could have been persuaded to join for considerably less Austrian land, and that Austria wouldn't have been willing to give up their entire coastline, although they might have been willing to give up the Italian enclaves on the Adriatic and South Tyrol. Frankly, even if they promised these lands, the Austrians would have more than likely attempted to renege in the event of victory, especially a victory that saw Italy claiming territory from France. I also think Italy would have very little chance of getting Egypt or Algeria in a peace settlement, and would be hard pressed to defend such gains, though Tunisia and Corsica are almost definite, and parts of the French border regions are quite likely as well. France likely keeps Algeria, and Egypt will probably be granted independence as a puppet of Germany or Italy, though one of them would likely seize the Suez directly, possibly in partnership with the Ottomans. Austria breaking up after a not so devastating war ending in their victory is also unlikely. Victory would bind them together for at least a while, and unity would serve as a critical counterbalance that likely would benefit the entire triple alliance, Germany included, by lending the alliance a veneer of legitimacy and community rather than appearing to be a beligerent German project. Besides, many Protestant Germans were worried about the dangers of integrating Catholic Austrians into a Germany with a very large Catholic minority, which with the Austrian additions would likely become a majority.
Yeah italy would have joined the Central powers if Austria agreed to cede the Isonzo Valley, Trentino and Trieste port. Austria only wanted to cede Trentino because Trieste was their biggest naval base
What's funny is that a Central Powers victory in WW1 may have ensured a much better 20th century than in our timeline since that would have prevented WW2 and the rise of the USSR, unless of course there was some facist uprising in France instead in this timeline.
I think the Soviets might’ve still existed. Imperial Germany frequently collaborated with the Bolsheviks even after the treaty Brest Litovsk. I can’t imagine them reinvading Russia after almost dying in ww1, just to save the whites who hate the Germans just as much.
Fascists in france are impossible,but a socialist revolution is very likely,actualy after abondoning its focus on begining a "what if whites won the Russian CW" Kaiserreich became a mod focused in "What if Germany won WW1 and France got fucked by a socialist uprising"
@@Hollows1997 ok here is a better one: what if the austrians never promoted conrad at all, say his incompetance was discovered in a war game some years before the war, and instead had an actual competant military leader, further what if said leader recognised the brilliance of the motorgeschutze presented to them in 1911.
Eh honestly, if Conrad recognized the issues within the Austro-Hungarian army and planned accordingly then he’d be fine. The man was regarded as on of the best strategies of the war just at the head of a inferior army.
There is one other major reason Italy joined the Entente: it was economically dependent on Great Britain and Russia. Most importantly, Italy was a net importer of Russian wheat and British coal. While of course such issues could be ignored, much like they did in WW2, hoping for a quick war, it would greatly impact Italy's ability to contest South France, North Africa and the Eastern Mediterranean. While German coal could fuel Italy's ship, even if less efficiently, the Triple Alliance might have to alter its plans and strike at the Ukranian breadbasket to feed Italy.
Italy had not problem for what regarded food, but for energy, coal and oil, yes. Though Ottoman Empire controlled the richest field and with Italy attacking France France would have capitulated, due to losing in the Marna battle, making things easier
I like this video a lot especially on the military strategy. I think Austria gave up a bit much in this video, and I dont think Italy would gain any land west of Tunisia in Africa, and Germany took too big a chunk of France, but other than that I think it was great
@@matthiuskoenig3378 The issue is that Germany fully intended on carving up Belgium as well. Seems strange given Belgium isn't much of a threat, but that was part of the September Program.
@@toxicatgaming4880 That might've been one plan, but the September Program involved partitioning Belgium, taking the French coast, and threatening Britain themselves.
Peace is A lie,There is only passion,Through passion I gain Strength,Through strength,I gain power,Through power I gain Victory,Through victory my chains are broken the force shall free me.
interesting but I think this only works if Lugi Cadorna dies before the war starts, otherwise you'd just end up with Battles 1 thru 12 of the Magdalena Pass instead of Isonzo! 😂😂
A while back I read a really long alt history essay about this topic, went mostly similar to this but remember the author portraying Cadorna as every bit the dumbass he was in reality.
Most interesting subject for alt history in a very long time. Think the north sea would be a more active conflict zone. dont believe Austria Hungary would quit after the war or give up its coastline
Monsieur Z, habe you heard about how the Dogger Bank Incident almost caused a war but especially France did everything to prevent said war, either having to fight britain which would put themself at risk of a british-german invasion or losing Russia as an allie to Germany? I think that would make for an amazing alt.hist. scenario
Great video, however, I doubt that Italy would be given the Austrian land in the Medditerannian as well as Egypt. Egypt would most likely be given to the Ottomans but Italy would still have taken the French colonies. I honestly doubt that the Ottomans would win without any real results as well as Austria giving their land that easily.
Short answer from an Italian: Italy has never been a central empire, but if it had been it would have received more territories and perhaps it would not have created such a great hatred towards the allies, even if they had lost, and so perhaps World War II would never have happened
Wasn't expecting the DeAndre ad face reveal, but it was pretty funny to see, especially after seeing the lad irl not too long ago. Pretty cool vid tho.
I can see Italy getting south Tyrol, but anything else from Austria??? Austria would lose their vital shipyards in Istria, the Austrian navy at the time was very formidable and giving up their most important naval bases is stupid, it's much more likely they give up only south Tyrol and instead press for more french lands
If Italy entered the war in the German side, and taking into account the Pact of Cartagena, probably France and UK would have pressured Spain to join them to halt Italian advance in the Alps and counter Italian navy in the Mediterranean. It'd be interesting to see how this front acts.
@@ApexCalibre well, according to the Pact of Cartagena, Spain should go to war if the status quo in the Western Mediterranean is threatened, so if France and UK urged Spain to join the war, Spain was obliged to. Joining the Central Powers would have reported a lot of land gains without any doubt. But taking into account that the vast majority of the Spanish commerce was with France and the UK, joining the Central Powers would have been suicidal for Spain.
@@inigoizuzquiza3677 I entertain the idea of Spain just not joining. A fan of La que se avecina series here. Bruno in series says they missed two world wars they would probadly miss the third.
@@ApexCalibre I mean in alternate history everything is possible. But what I found extremely unlikely is not Spain allying with Italy, that could have happened under other circumstances. What I find very unlikely is Spain allying Italy against France and UK. First, it'd be a war in three fronts: France, Portugal and Gibraltar. Spain's army was no way prepared for that. Second, UK and France navies would obliterate the Spanish navy. Third, the Spanish economy would collapse, as Spain's trade was overwhelmingly with France and UK. Because of geography, Spain was obliged to join the Allies, joining the Central Powers would have been a very bad idea from any perspective.
Before I actually watch this video, I want to share my Personal opinion. Personally I believe if italy Was in the central Powers from the start of the war, france would fall within the first year. You see, the Germans almost took Paris in 1914 before they were stopped but if italy Was attacking in the South aswell it would take alot of pressure off of the German troops meaning Paris wouldve most likely fallen in 1914. Btw, italy was never in the central Powers, they were in the "triple alliance" wich was a defensive pact between Germany Austria-Hungary and italy. Now ill go and actually watch the video
People should keep in mind that the pact made between Italy and Austria-Hungary before WW1 was defensive. But since the austrohungarian empire started the war, Italy was not obbligated to fight with it: and also a good portion of the italians considered Austria-Hungary the natural enemy of Italy.
coming from a friend since before 50k subs, some more pop in the thumbnails would help exponentially. I appreciate the maps, but the algorithm doesn't. great content though, I loved this, and all other videos
This needs a sequel to examine the possibilities of Germany encountering Japan as it expands influence into China. Alternate WWII? Germany, Italy, and whatever remains of the Ottomans against Japan and the former Entente (essentially British Empire and what’s left of France, angry over its humiliation). Not sure if/how US might be involved.
The question of Romania in this scenario is interesting. As some commentators point out, the Danube is key. An elaboration over this would be interesting.
i think Italy would've just got niece, savoy, upper savoy, corsica, istria, trento, and some minor concessions in dalmatia (maybe zara and ragusa) and in Africa they would've taken tunisia, djibouti and british somaliland, maybe egypt nd algeria as proctetorates.
@@ApexCalibre yeah what Italy could've gotten out wasn't a slouch, I forgot to mention the expansion of the libian colony, just take modern day Libya and stretch it down to Cameroon, a sort of transaharian corridor.
@@hichamblidi1111 In this scenario it does call into question if Italy could have held onto these new bounties until today. If the US didn’t enter WW1 than they wouldn’t be near as influential to push for de-colonization. Maybe Italy would have stayed neutral in ww2?
I think it may have been possible, but its probably too optimistic to say that Italy could have exerted much influence in Spain, Portugal, Turkey, and southern France. The thing is, the Italian government was kind of ineffectual, and even if they gained enough territory to build a new Mediterranean empire, I kind of doubt they would have been savvy enough to exert influence in so many neighboring lands.
@@tsarbeaver2351 maybe not the colonies, they would have probably been lost the same way Portugal or Spain lost them in the 70's. But it would have likely kept the city of Zara in Dalmatia and the Greek islands of Rodi
what if italy lost the second italo-ethiopian war what if rome conquered scotland and ireland what if reinhard heydrich survived what if Edward viii married grand duchess olga what if the ottomans converted to christianity
This is how history SHOULD have played out. Italy's dispute with France over Tunisia, the reason for Italy joining the Triple Alliance to begin with, had been 'put to bed' by 1914 and there was a non-aggression pact between the two countries. Also, Britain saw that Italian politicians were open to bribery and did just that - bribed them - and it worked! It can be argued that Austria should have offered the Trentino and Trieste to Italy, but this would have been a pretty huge concession, and anyway, the Italian government also wanted the German speaking South Tyrol area, and there is no way that this would have been given up by Austria. Had the war broken out 12-15 years earlier Italy would probably have remained loyal, but by 1914 Italian politicians were becoming cocky and demanding more and more.
I don't know if the ottomans joined the war or not but I'm sure they would have been granted control over Egypt, and Austria Hungary giving up it's sea access as well as annexing Serbia in it's entirety bringing in more slavs would feel like a suicidal move on the empires part.
That's a quarter of a million veterans from 3 wars rdy then and there when things settle down. With support from millions and maybe Bulgaria wont be happy Macedonia being in A&H hands it could turn into a nightmare without outside powers included. Serbia in our timeline got a lot of dead soldiers. Maybe in this 1 they get less and struggle doesnt last as long. Whole coast to Italy I still couldnt understand the logic of that. Just dropping any opportunities for colonies outside of Europe wow. Without free sea access commerce be hampered for no reason.
Cool video, I could see Italy rebuilding the Roman Empire, annexing Greece and Hispania and southern France. If the Ottoman Empire falls, the new Roman Empire could take back the east as well. I see the Germanic empire and Roman empires being equals with each other, though Italy would have greater riches having control of the Mediterranean. Britain would have an alliance with Canada, America, Australia, and New Zealand, but they would probably not only loose their African holdings, but perhaps India as well to Italy. Japan would probably start to attack asia as they did in our timeline, and perhaps the German empire would clash with them If they really cared about holdings in Asia. This would put the Japanese with odds against the ame4icans if they threaten their holdings as well.
Austria giving up triest isn't far fetched, however I think they would haven never given up south tirol due to its austrian pop majority and historical importance (thats like giving up salzburg or styria), rather they would have also handed over dalmatia which the italians wanted too.
I think you assumed Austria would make far too many concessions to Italy. They would have never given Trieste to Italy, not to mention the whole adriatic coast
It seems Italy by the end just declare itself Rome reborn. As they would again be holding most of the territories and in a good position going into the next century on.
Not gonna lie Mr. Z you’re a good looking dude. An the face reveal actually caught me off guard because at first I didn’t see the text about you saying face reveal.
Great video, I believe that Spain would probably join in aswell as Italy is apart of the war. Cause the agreement between Spain, Britain and France was that Spain would support France in the Mediterranean in a Naval war against the combined Italian-Austrian fleets.
What is Spain going to support France with in a naval war in the Mediterranean? By the outbreak of the war, it had one modern battleship (although one more would be commissioned in 1915), one armored cruiser & a handful of light cruisers and destroyers, mostly older. Britain actually could hold on to Egypt, although it would need the Commonwealth navies (especially Australia's, which was only slightly larger than Spain's although it had more modern ships). Plus the modern ships of the Japanese navy and some older ones, more help than what Japan actually did send to the Mediterranean. That really wasn't Japan's fault as it sent light cruisers and destroyers which were needed for ASW.. Japan probably could keep things under control in China with a few obsolete ships plus the U.S. Navy's policing the Pacific while Japan was helping out its British allies. Spain might actually do better to support the Central Powers, as they could give it more. The Central Powers could make Spain a colonial power again mostly at the expense of France. Spain probably would have to endure a invasion from Portugal executed with British help so it would have some success, but Britain would have to send most of its resources to France to prop it up. In the end, France would surrender thus damning the Entente. Britain and Portugal would have to give up their gains in Spain, probably mostly in Asturias, as the two would try to stop Spain from crossing the Pyrenees.
What if Italy had adopted the cult of Makima, Revy, Cutie Honey, Marin Kitagawa, Trixie Tang, Judy Neutron, Marge Simpson, Wendy Corduroy, Lois Griffin, Sailor Moon and Maddie Fenton instead of Abrahamic shit?
The chad Mr Z leading his legions to victory Whatifaltist questioning himself at every turn with a beard he should not have Edit thanks for the like Mr Z but had to edit
This video took a bit longer to produce as we were experimenting with some new animation styles, but hopefully it will have been worth the wait. Let us know if you have any suggestions. 👍
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Worth it. Maybe you could try this for your political videos as well? No pressure. Peace ✌🏻
I wanna see a P2 with the teaser you left at the end
Dude you’re fucking handsome😎; no homosexual ofc, are you a New Yorker lol?
Have you ever considered taking 1 of your alt-history takes into a farther future. Like this Europe vs the scattered powers of the world in WW2 era fight like you alluded to at the end?
I have some suggestions but I will save them for later 🤔🤔🤔
The Austrians giving up Dalmatia isn’t the most outrageous of ideas, somewhat counterintuitively. The largest part of the Austrian navy was actually on the Danube. The one thing I think Monsieur Z could have changed was the Austrians taking Wallachia and Moldavia in order to solidify their control of this River.
What do you mean? The 4 dreadnoughts were in the Adriatic.
While that definitely seems like a reasonable direction for Austria, there's a good chance that Romania is never part of the Great War directly, as the third Balkan war (aka the Balkan theatre) was largely caused by Bulgarias entry, and the following support by Greece and the entente troops in Greece. If either Bulgaria doesn't enter, or more likely, Greece is too much under pressure due to Central Power control in the Eastern Mediterranean to allow entente troops or to join the war, Austrian control over the danube would have to be a different, post-war conflict. And honestly speaking, I don't see the Habsburgs being able to focus their attention to any external issues post-war due to both old and newly conquered South Slavs, as well as rising resistance in the northern slavic lands (Bohemia, Moravia, Silesia, Galicia, Slovakia, and Ruthenia)
Austria would probably need some time to recuperate, but without it, the Austrians would lose all way to project power. They would need to move quickly and decisively all while keeping the empire together (probably under Karl and his reformation plan) to not become a German puppet. It’s also good to remember the Pan-slavism is pretty hard to maintain when Russia is dead and there is not pan-Slavic state existing. Austro-Slavism might have been able to fully engulf the pan-Slavic movement.
@@riceyboi5606 While pan-slavism might not be as popular, there's no reason to think that regional Slav movements would stop, the movements for Czechia and Slovakia were around during the war, and the hundreds of thousands of Slavic legionnaires in entente countries wouldn't just give up.
You don’t think those would have been absolutely slaughtered by Germany after the war is over?
Do a video "What if Italy fought for Austria?" This is because of the Rome Protocols and how Mussolini actually was warry about Hitler before joining the Axis.
Stay tuned!
@@MonsieurDean Dude good commercial regardless. I wish you do a video about Balkan league going into ww1 together. No second Balkan war happening included. I guess ww1 will finish in 2 years. Damn we shouldve beheaded he Saxo Coburg and other German kings in the Balkans. Romania had issues with king being on German side while nation needs were against the alliance and Greece to had troubles. Havent explored enough into subject. Our Saxo Coburg made the 1st catastrophe of our new state.
@@MonsieurDean also the Stresa Front would coalize all of Europe against Nazi Germany early
Mr. Z doing alternate history videos again? IMPOSSIBLE!
Good video, slight issue with Austria. At the eve of the Great War, it had the fastest growing economy of Europe, was industrialising (Moravia being an industrial heartland), and separatist sentiments were lower than they had been for decades. Even in Hungary, there were some in leadership positions realising that weakening the empire meant weakening their own foothold. The break up of the empire after the end of the war was as much the Entente, as it was the losing of fate in the Habsburg monarchy, which failed to provide security and food. But on the eve of the war, things weren't as bad as was considered in hindsight.
Congrats, You Get The Worlds Most Subtle Face Reveal Award
I'll treasure it always!
@@MonsieurDean chad
*insert witty comment about the American Virtue summit
@@MonsieurDean youre hot by the way. usually people with a nice voice are ugly, but you broke the stereotype…. no homo.
@@MonsieurDean Dude, you're really handsome.
I think Austria-Hungary becoming landlocked is a bit too much, but Italy staying in the CP almost assures the Ententes defeat. It was really close in OTL.
Yeah, I was expecting a twist where Italy got screwed out of those lands like they did in our own timeline.
i think they would not give entire coastline but a large amount of it , because they are the weakest
Yeah i think they would have been screwed over like in our timeline. Germany woulldnt humiliate Austria Hungary like that. With such a failure AH would collapse.
Man, I love the cp.
It is good to see Italy actually doing good in wwars
Literally no way to have finished the video and comment this
“Wwars”
@@KonoHarpDa I have an extension to give me faster playback speed ;)
Just because Italy is on a different side doesn’t mean it would’ve done better during the war. Hell the Italians couldn’t breakthrough the barely defenses isonzo river. Thinking the Italians would’ve done better on the better equipped and trained French army in the mountains is a laughable thought especially considering that they failed in their invasion of France during ww2 even after the fall of Paris. This video literally has no basis on reality.
@@rafadachapa2445 that's what happen when you send young farmer whitout any preparation
“The volatile politics of Italy acquired additional complications at the end of the fifteenth century. Charles VIII had died in the spring of 1498, Old treaties were exhumed and new theatres penned, their ultimate effect being to cut Italy to bits.”
― Kate Simon,
So the title should basically be “What If Italy Stayed Based?”
Pretty sure Italy stayed based in our timeline
No that woulda been if the Germans won ww2
@@Steve_the_Radroach italys based on a Germany won ww2 timeline. Hail Duce
@@Steve_the_Radroach Italy hasn't been based for like 2000 years
@@Planeman516 That's super cringe
I dig that the face reveal came as a result of a sponsorship... Arch capitalist, Monsieur. Respect the hustle. Lol
And he looks great
@@andrewdduvall1 In all his blurred glory.
the italy map you use time and again is wrong for the period as it contains austrian lands (southtyrol and trentino mainly) this is especially weird at 4:45 when you show all three maps
I think Italy could have been persuaded to join for considerably less Austrian land, and that Austria wouldn't have been willing to give up their entire coastline, although they might have been willing to give up the Italian enclaves on the Adriatic and South Tyrol. Frankly, even if they promised these lands, the Austrians would have more than likely attempted to renege in the event of victory, especially a victory that saw Italy claiming territory from France. I also think Italy would have very little chance of getting Egypt or Algeria in a peace settlement, and would be hard pressed to defend such gains, though Tunisia and Corsica are almost definite, and parts of the French border regions are quite likely as well. France likely keeps Algeria, and Egypt will probably be granted independence as a puppet of Germany or Italy, though one of them would likely seize the Suez directly, possibly in partnership with the Ottomans.
Austria breaking up after a not so devastating war ending in their victory is also unlikely. Victory would bind them together for at least a while, and unity would serve as a critical counterbalance that likely would benefit the entire triple alliance, Germany included, by lending the alliance a veneer of legitimacy and community rather than appearing to be a beligerent German project. Besides, many Protestant Germans were worried about the dangers of integrating Catholic Austrians into a Germany with a very large Catholic minority, which with the Austrian additions would likely become a majority.
Yeah italy would have joined the Central powers if Austria agreed to cede the Isonzo Valley, Trentino and Trieste port. Austria only wanted to cede Trentino because Trieste was their biggest naval base
What's funny is that a Central Powers victory in WW1 may have ensured a much better 20th century than in our timeline since that would have prevented WW2 and the rise of the USSR, unless of course there was some facist uprising in France instead in this timeline.
Segregation would probably never end in the United States
@@thorpeaaron1110 I can live with that. That our current cursed timeline won't happen is more important.
@@thorpeaaron1110 I’m sure it would eventually be struck down, but it would likely be later than IOTL
I think the Soviets might’ve still existed. Imperial Germany frequently collaborated with the Bolsheviks even after the treaty Brest Litovsk. I can’t imagine them reinvading Russia after almost dying in ww1, just to save the whites who hate the Germans just as much.
Fascists in france are impossible,but a socialist revolution is very likely,actualy after abondoning its focus on begining a "what if whites won the Russian CW" Kaiserreich became a mod focused in "What if Germany won WW1 and France got fucked by a socialist uprising"
In the words of Squidward "Oh no, he's hot."
Literally Reddit right now.
"What if Italy..." basically resolves to me not being scared shitless of finding hundred year old war remains when I go for a climb.
That river was totally worth 700000 men
What if Conrad Von Hötzendorf was an actual military genius who led Austria-Hungary to victory?
I know this is alternate history, but c'mon... we have got to keep it real in some ways.
@@Hollows1997 ok here is a better one: what if the austrians never promoted conrad at all, say his incompetance was discovered in a war game some years before the war, and instead had an actual competant military leader, further what if said leader recognised the brilliance of the motorgeschutze presented to them in 1911.
@@Hollows1997 lol, more realistic than Luigi Cadorna not launching another offensive on the Isonzo river
@@indianajones4321 Italian Government: Luigi, can you launch an offensive on the Isonzo River?
Luigi Cardona: Dodici
Eh honestly, if Conrad recognized the issues within the Austro-Hungarian army and planned accordingly then he’d be fine. The man was regarded as on of the best strategies of the war just at the head of a inferior army.
There is one other major reason Italy joined the Entente: it was economically dependent on Great Britain and Russia. Most importantly, Italy was a net importer of Russian wheat and British coal. While of course such issues could be ignored, much like they did in WW2, hoping for a quick war, it would greatly impact Italy's ability to contest South France, North Africa and the Eastern Mediterranean. While German coal could fuel Italy's ship, even if less efficiently, the Triple Alliance might have to alter its plans and strike at the Ukranian breadbasket to feed Italy.
Italy had not problem for what regarded food, but for energy, coal and oil, yes. Though Ottoman Empire controlled the richest field and with Italy attacking France France would have capitulated, due to losing in the Marna battle, making things easier
With the manpower freed up by their Italian burgers being secure and the entente less able to support Russia, that becomes a real possibility.
I definitely would not have thought Mounsieur Z is looking so fine. Love the quality video and the face reveal! Keep up the good work!!
You are indeed a fitting physical representation of the eternal New Yorker.
Definitely, he has that 20th century New Yorker look (50-90s).
I'll take that as a compliment.
Bro looks like a sleek Italian
@@MonsieurDean damn bruh he roasted and complimented you with a single sentence.
I like this video a lot especially on the military strategy. I think Austria gave up a bit much in this video, and I dont think Italy would gain any land west of Tunisia in Africa, and Germany took too big a chunk of France, but other than that I think it was great
yeah i think a belgium puppet would take that land instead.
@@matthiuskoenig3378 The issue is that Germany fully intended on carving up Belgium as well. Seems strange given Belgium isn't much of a threat, but that was part of the September Program.
@@MonsieurDean Wasn't Germany's goal to annex the Ardennes and give the Belgians the channel port so as to threaten Britian?
@@toxicatgaming4880 That might've been one plan, but the September Program involved partitioning Belgium, taking the French coast, and threatening Britain themselves.
@@MonsieurDean That was probably moreso intended as an occupation plan, not an actual plan for territorial gain.
Peace is A lie,There is only passion,Through passion I gain Strength,Through strength,I gain power,Through power I gain Victory,Through victory my chains are broken the force shall free me.
Monsiuer lookin like a gigachad especially with those aviators (I myself am a fellow enjoyer of them) no homo tho
These videos only get better keep up the good work 👍
That face reveal was awesome. I was not expecting that. Your voice sound really cool and your face goes great with it.
I'm shocked how well the face matches the voice. Looking good king!
Thanks, pal!
Another great video brother, keep them coming!
interesting but I think this only works if Lugi Cadorna dies before the war starts, otherwise you'd just end up with Battles 1 thru 12 of the Magdalena Pass instead of Isonzo! 😂😂
A while back I read a really long alt history essay about this topic, went mostly similar to this but remember the author portraying Cadorna as every bit the dumbass he was in reality.
It's great to see your face my friend iv been a subscriber for a long time ....MOT
I love the editing on this video.
Most interesting subject for alt history in a very long time. Think the north sea would be a more active conflict zone. dont believe Austria Hungary would quit after the war or give up its coastline
Out of all the History TH-camrs who’s faces have been reviled
Z is definitely the best looking.
Thanks, pally.
Monsieur Z, habe you heard about how the Dogger Bank Incident almost caused a war but especially France did everything to prevent said war, either having to fight britain which would put themself at risk of a british-german invasion or losing Russia as an allie to Germany?
I think that would make for an amazing alt.hist. scenario
Great video, however, I doubt that Italy would be given the Austrian land in the Medditerannian as well as Egypt. Egypt would most likely be given to the Ottomans but Italy would still have taken the French colonies. I honestly doubt that the Ottomans would win without any real results as well as Austria giving their land that easily.
Short answer from an Italian: Italy has never been a central empire, but if it had been it would have received more territories and perhaps it would not have created such a great hatred towards the allies, even if they had lost, and so perhaps World War II would never have happened
And I love the old fashion desk behind you. Very cool
Thanks!
Medic Screaming: VHAT IZ HAPPENING got me, Same with the medic loss quote
Wasn't expecting the DeAndre ad face reveal, but it was pretty funny to see, especially after seeing the lad irl not too long ago. Pretty cool vid tho.
Very glad to see an alt history video again
What if Richard III Won the battle of Bosworth ?
What if Edward V lived longer ?
Official Face Reveal, Nice. 👍
I can see Italy getting south Tyrol, but anything else from Austria??? Austria would lose their vital shipyards in Istria, the Austrian navy at the time was very formidable and giving up their most important naval bases is stupid, it's much more likely they give up only south Tyrol and instead press for more french lands
If Italy entered the war in the German side, and taking into account the Pact of Cartagena, probably France and UK would have pressured Spain to join them to halt Italian advance in the Alps and counter Italian navy in the Mediterranean. It'd be interesting to see how this front acts.
I don't see how they would have pressured Spain though, if anything that could have made Spain join the Central Powers
@@ApexCalibre well, according to the Pact of Cartagena, Spain should go to war if the status quo in the Western Mediterranean is threatened, so if France and UK urged Spain to join the war, Spain was obliged to. Joining the Central Powers would have reported a lot of land gains without any doubt. But taking into account that the vast majority of the Spanish commerce was with France and the UK, joining the Central Powers would have been suicidal for Spain.
@@inigoizuzquiza3677 I entertain the idea of Spain just not joining. A fan of La que se avecina series here. Bruno in series says they missed two world wars they would probadly miss the third.
@@inigoizuzquiza3677 Would they still if Italy and Spain divided up France among themselves you think?
@@ApexCalibre I mean in alternate history everything is possible. But what I found extremely unlikely is not Spain allying with Italy, that could have happened under other circumstances. What I find very unlikely is Spain allying Italy against France and UK. First, it'd be a war in three fronts: France, Portugal and Gibraltar. Spain's army was no way prepared for that. Second, UK and France navies would obliterate the Spanish navy. Third, the Spanish economy would collapse, as Spain's trade was overwhelmingly with France and UK. Because of geography, Spain was obliged to join the Allies, joining the Central Powers would have been a very bad idea from any perspective.
5:12 I’d that neffex in the back? Love it
I'll tell you what Mr. Z, I'm less upset over the face reveal than I am over you being a fucking 10. Lol
Good for you sir. Awesome video as always.
Thanks, pal! 😂
Before I actually watch this video, I want to share my Personal opinion.
Personally I believe if italy Was in the central Powers from the start of the war, france would fall within the first year. You see, the Germans almost took Paris in 1914 before they were stopped but if italy Was attacking in the South aswell it would take alot of pressure off of the German troops meaning Paris wouldve most likely fallen in 1914. Btw, italy was never in the central Powers, they were in the "triple alliance" wich was a defensive pact between Germany Austria-Hungary and italy. Now ill go and actually watch the video
Oh I just love the use of the Medic voicelines. Always a good laught.
People should keep in mind that the pact made between Italy and Austria-Hungary before WW1 was defensive. But since the austrohungarian empire started the war, Italy was not obbligated to fight with it: and also a good portion of the italians considered Austria-Hungary the natural enemy of Italy.
Exactly: the pact was defensive and Austria was clearly the aggressor.
@@alessandrocerioli2151 as simple as that
There was some nationalist sentiment against France as well just not as sharp
Nice video with NEFFEX in the background xD
Finally, the great Peninsula isn’t a laughing stock. Thanks for the vid
Damn you look good man. Keep it up
Thanks, pal!
@@MonsieurDean welcome bro
what if France 🇫🇷 was carved up into smaller states
coming from a friend since before 50k subs, some more pop in the thumbnails would help exponentially. I appreciate the maps, but the algorithm doesn't. great content though, I loved this, and all other videos
That moment when a sponsor forces you to do a face reveal, but all jokes aside, you look pretty close to what I imagined.
This needs a sequel to examine the possibilities of Germany encountering Japan as it expands influence into China.
Alternate WWII? Germany, Italy, and whatever remains of the Ottomans against Japan and the former Entente (essentially British Empire and what’s left of France, angry over its humiliation). Not sure if/how US might be involved.
This would be a great world. I kinda wish for continuation. Some follow up video, of alt-history.
Z is zet, btw. No matter where you from.
The question of Romania in this scenario is interesting. As some commentators point out, the Danube is key. An elaboration over this would be interesting.
Great video.
i think Italy would've just got niece, savoy, upper savoy, corsica, istria, trento, and some minor concessions in dalmatia (maybe zara and ragusa) and in Africa they would've taken tunisia, djibouti and british somaliland, maybe egypt nd algeria as proctetorates.
A sort of Roman Empire "Lite" lol
@@ApexCalibre yeah what Italy could've gotten out wasn't a slouch, I forgot to mention the expansion of the libian colony, just take modern day Libya and stretch it down to Cameroon, a sort of transaharian corridor.
@@hichamblidi1111 Italy probably would have gotten its wish of reviving the Latin name for the Mediterranean “Mare Nostrum”
@@ApexCalibre yeah, probably we would have had
@@hichamblidi1111 In this scenario it does call into question if Italy could have held onto these new bounties until today. If the US didn’t enter WW1 than they wouldn’t be near as influential to push for de-colonization. Maybe Italy would have stayed neutral in ww2?
I need a part 2 to this. WW2 would be so interesting in this timeline.
2:00 Based Mr. Z!
I think it may have been possible, but its probably too optimistic to say that Italy could have exerted much influence in Spain, Portugal, Turkey, and southern France. The thing is, the Italian government was kind of ineffectual, and even if they gained enough territory to build a new Mediterranean empire, I kind of doubt they would have been savvy enough to exert influence in so many neighboring lands.
How did I know Mr. Z was such a stud?
Populists are always so handsome
Monsieur Z has the sexiest face on TH-cam. Also could you do What if Hawaii was never annexed?
Thanks, pal! 🤣
@@MonsieurDean your welcome
Already saw your face from watching your speech you gave not long ago. It was a nice speech.
Was NOT expecting a face reveal. A surprise to be sure but a welcome one!
Are we going to see you more, or is this just a one time thing (excluding that talk you gave)?
Not sure. Maybe I'll put it to a poll, but I like my alternate history videos to be animated, not just narrated over face-cam.
It's nice to put a face to a voice
My man actually looks like a Chad. Honestly wasn’t expecting that.
Thanks, bro!
You with those sunglasses look like the most italian man alive
*VIDEO SUGGESTION:*
What if Italy had joined The Allies (from the beginning) in World War II?
I thought of it once. Italy would keep colonies till the 1991
@@tsarbeaver2351 maybe not the colonies, they would have probably been lost the same way Portugal or Spain lost them in the 70's. But it would have likely kept the city of Zara in Dalmatia and the Greek islands of Rodi
what if italy lost the second italo-ethiopian war
what if rome conquered scotland and ireland
what if reinhard heydrich survived
what if Edward viii married grand duchess olga
what if the ottomans converted to christianity
If Italy loose Ethiopian war Mussolini would be ousted from power, and Italy would be again covered in fighting of black shirts vs socialists...
This entire video was worth it for 5:36 alone
Happy to see a face reveal! You look exactly like I thought you would
This is how history SHOULD have played out. Italy's dispute with France over Tunisia, the reason for Italy joining the Triple Alliance to begin with, had been 'put to bed' by 1914 and there was a non-aggression pact between the two countries. Also, Britain saw that Italian politicians were open to bribery and did just that - bribed them - and it worked! It can be argued that Austria should have offered the Trentino and Trieste to Italy, but this would have been a pretty huge concession, and anyway, the Italian government also wanted the German speaking South Tyrol area, and there is no way that this would have been given up by Austria. Had the war broken out 12-15 years earlier Italy would probably have remained loyal, but by 1914 Italian politicians were becoming cocky and demanding more and more.
I don't know if the ottomans joined the war or not but I'm sure they would have been granted control over Egypt, and Austria Hungary giving up it's sea access as well as annexing Serbia in it's entirety bringing in more slavs would feel like a suicidal move on the empires part.
That's a quarter of a million veterans from 3 wars rdy then and there when things settle down. With support from millions and maybe Bulgaria wont be happy Macedonia being in A&H hands it could turn into a nightmare without outside powers included. Serbia in our timeline got a lot of dead soldiers. Maybe in this 1 they get less and struggle doesnt last as long. Whole coast to Italy I still couldnt understand the logic of that. Just dropping any opportunities for colonies outside of Europe wow. Without free sea access commerce be hampered for no reason.
Big man big man! This man is dripping all over the place!
Holly crap your a lot younger then I thought but looking good with your assume voice
Awesome room man! Also, look nice today
Thanks, pal! You should see some of my posters. Pretty much all of them are scenic locations around New York State.
Cool video, I could see Italy rebuilding the Roman Empire, annexing Greece and Hispania and southern France. If the Ottoman Empire falls, the new Roman Empire could take back the east as well. I see the Germanic empire and Roman empires being equals with each other, though Italy would have greater riches having control of the Mediterranean. Britain would have an alliance with Canada, America, Australia, and New Zealand, but they would probably not only loose their African holdings, but perhaps India as well to Italy.
Japan would probably start to attack asia as they did in our timeline, and perhaps the German empire would clash with them If they really cared about holdings in Asia. This would put the Japanese with odds against the ame4icans if they threaten their holdings as well.
I have a what if, what if WWI was an alliance between the UK Russia and Germany because their leaders were all related
That is not how I expected you to look, not a bad thing though!
Idk if you are the right channel to ask this but can you do a video next on what if the golf stream didn’t exist
Good video, too!
this is one of my favorite channles
Much appreciated, pal!
lookin cool in those sunglasses man.
Can't wait for the sequel!
Austria giving up triest isn't far fetched, however I think they would haven never given up south tirol due to its austrian pop majority and historical importance (thats like giving up salzburg or styria), rather they would have also handed over dalmatia which the italians wanted too.
bro, you look awesome with those sunglasses
Map typo: much of Serbia would also go to Bulgaria
“an ecomonic union dominated by germany” 🤨🇪🇺
I think you assumed Austria would make far too many concessions to Italy. They would have never given Trieste to Italy, not to mention the whole adriatic coast
It seems Italy by the end just declare itself Rome reborn. As they would again be holding most of the territories and in a good position going into the next century on.
Not gonna lie Mr. Z you’re a good looking dude. An the face reveal actually caught me off guard because at first I didn’t see the text about you saying face reveal.
Great video, I believe that Spain would probably join in aswell as Italy is apart of the war. Cause the agreement between Spain, Britain and France was that Spain would support France in the Mediterranean in a Naval war against the combined Italian-Austrian fleets.
What is Spain going to support France with in a naval war in the Mediterranean? By the outbreak of the war, it had one modern battleship (although one more would be commissioned in 1915), one armored cruiser & a handful of light cruisers and destroyers, mostly older.
Britain actually could hold on to Egypt, although it would need the Commonwealth navies (especially Australia's, which was only slightly larger than Spain's although it had more modern ships). Plus the modern ships of the Japanese navy and some older ones, more help than what Japan actually did send to the Mediterranean. That really wasn't Japan's fault as it sent light cruisers and destroyers which were needed for ASW.. Japan probably could keep things under control in China with a few obsolete ships plus the U.S. Navy's policing the Pacific while Japan was helping out its British allies.
Spain might actually do better to support the Central Powers, as they could give it more. The Central Powers could make Spain a colonial power again mostly at the expense of France. Spain probably would have to endure a invasion from Portugal executed with British help so it would have some success, but Britain would have to send most of its resources to France to prop it up. In the end, France would surrender thus damning the Entente. Britain and Portugal would have to give up their gains in Spain, probably mostly in Asturias, as the two would try to stop Spain from crossing the Pyrenees.
What if Italy had adopted the cult of Makima, Revy, Cutie Honey, Marin Kitagawa, Trixie Tang, Judy Neutron, Marge Simpson, Wendy Corduroy, Lois Griffin, Sailor Moon and Maddie Fenton instead of Abrahamic shit?
The chad Mr Z leading his legions to victory
Whatifaltist questioning himself at every turn with a beard he should not have
Edit thanks for the like Mr Z but had to edit
Your like has been restored!
@@MonsieurDean thank you kind sir
Rather handsome for a history nerd. It really is our time gentlemen
As expected, you look beautiful. Like every rightwinger
im watching this with my gf and she now thinks im only the second most attractive history nerd thank you Monsieur
Bruh. 🤣