METAS Speedmaster vs Discontinued Speedmaster - What you need to know
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 20 มิ.ย. 2021
- #exacttimeforlife #omegaspeedmaster #moonwatch
Is the METAS version worth the higher price? How sharp are the edges? Will the discontinued version appreciate in value? Are the bracelets interchangeable? Which one is the better purchase? Which one am I keeping? All these questions and more I cover in this comparison. A huge thank you to my AD Brent L Miller Jewelers for the hook up on this watch.
Reach out to Brad here-
Brad (c) 717-712-8954
brad@brentlmiller.com
Check out Kevin's channel 'Wrong Time Watch' here:
/ donjonarmory - บันเทิง
I recently learned that Omega changed the hash marks on the new dial to fix an error introduced after switching to higher frequency movements following the 321. You can now accurately measure time down to 1/6 of a second with the new hash marks. The original hash marks were meant for timing down to 1/5 of a second, but only the 321 beats at the right frequency for those hash marks. So technically the 861/1861/1863 all had incorrect hash marks in between each minute marker because of the higher frequency of those movements.
Does this make any difference in real life? The old second track is so much nicer to look at. Because its busier, the track looks like a solid band, which makes the dial more clear and legible. Also the dial color is a gorgeous grey. Old watch much nicer (for me anyway).
The 3861 is incredible with respect to accuracy, the dial is brilliant and gives depth, and the bracelet hands down murders my rolexes in comfort and aesthetics.
Thanks for the side-by-side Bruce, it was very well done. I was going to wait for the METAS hesalite but my AD friend offered the 1861 hesalite right before he ran out of stock late last year. For me the price was a winner with the 1861 where I got all the discounts. Love the watch and I’m happy with the older version.
It doesn’t have the palm fronds but picked up the new Speedy. Wonderful timepiece and sold off my old 1863.
Bruce: rinsing 1863 in the sink
Me: YOU ABSOLUTE MADLAD
Not even my watch but I nearly had a heart attack
Love how you kept your daughters interruption in the video, very heartwarming
Thanks a bunch for the shout out. I will enjoy this "famous" moonwarch for many years to come.
Aww that lil visitor part was so lovely .. god bliss her 🙏🏻
The new bracelet and clasp design is absolutely GORGEOUS
Thanks for sharing your perspectives. I own a 1861 (2019) Hesalite and that's the one I rather keep in my collection.
I have the same! 2019 was the 50th anniversary of the moon landing 👍
I saw the new one in person recently. While I know the watch is technically better, I prefer the dial of my 2019 watch too. The new stepped dial just isn't for me.
@@allanreardon Exactly. I even actually consider the step dial myself as a design flaw since it breaks the applied indices on two different levels.
Much prefer my 1861! More clear dial with the busier seconds hand. Nicer not to have step dial and dark grey instead of black... and cheaper. Older is much better
I love how you take all the measurements into depth, even with lug to lug and clasp width. It is awesome for people who have smaller wrist to consider these measurements. I tried this piece the other day and I have to say although I am not planning on getting one anytime soon, it is very friendly for small wrist guys. The new movement makes it feels so much smaller and less bulky.
This is the best Speedy review I've seen to date, well done mate! 👏
For me the Speedmaster is the ultimate iconic timepiece - will never have one, but very cool indeed.
Cheers 👍🏻👍🏻
Never say never..
@@drfuchz 🤞🏻👍🏻
The new speedy sapphire sandwich is the next piece I'm getting. Been tossing and turning over this and the new Tudor chrono. Love the new bracelet on the new speedy.
This was a banger Bruce, it's helped me to make the tough decision of swapping out my 1861 for the new 3861 and I can't wait, thanks!
Hi Bruce, I purchased the new metas speedmaster this weekend at an omega boutique. I commented that I really wanted the 1861 because of the larger box. My representative told me I could purchase the box, so with out a second thought I did. The rep told me that they rarely sold the larger box because people did not want to pay for it. To me it was a must. No regrets just pleased. Thank you for a great comparison review. I am looking forward to seeing exploring the rest of your channel.
Recently acquired the new 3861. As my first Omega and just by looking at the previous iteration, there is no comparison. The bracelet on the new one is amazing looking. It feels and looks excellent on my small 6.5" wrist. I was prepared to sell it before I got it but I am keeping it for life. That said the clasp is fairly sharp to others who may get rubbed by it during various human-on-human activities.
The updates have put the new Speedmaster on my list.
I went in an Omega shop that had the 1861 and 3861 in hesalite and alternated them over and over for like 30'. I just could not decide because in the end these are two extremely similar watches. I ended up going for the 1861 because it felt more "solid", for a lack of a better word. It is true that the 3861 bracelet is more comfortable and flexible but this flexibility comes at the cost of some faint feeling of flimsiness.
Excellent review Bruce. You answered several questions as to which model would be best for me. I'd love to own both. I have a 1985 145.022 cal 861 and adore it. The 1861 will probably be my choice for now. The newer META in a few years maybe. Thanks again Bruce.
Both versions have their pro's and con's. But personally I do love the old one just a bit more. It feels more 'moody' if this makes sense. The new one is just too clinical for me and even I do appreciate the tapering bracelet of the new one I love the look of the old one more. Overall, I think the old Speedy version is kinda more 'refined'. But in the end I think you can't go wrong with any of these! Thanks for showing, Bruce! All the best from Germany, Daniel
moody and refined are quite juxtaposed...
Fantastic comparison review Bruce!
Very balanced view, extremely well conveyed. Had my new Speedy for a few weeks now and can honestly say it’s not sliced my skin, it’s extremely comfortable to wear. The whole sharpe edge thing was never really a thing!
well for you it was never really a thing. but there have been really lots of reports and also I felt it myself at the AD, that the edges are sharper! Not as sharp to cut, BUT it was sharper and I at least could feel it. so each to his own. just because you never experienced it doesnt mean it's not true at all! experience ain't the same as opinion.
@@SirMopy I just tried on a new 3861 sapphire sandwich and did not notice sharp edges at all. It fit very comfortably so I guess it is really just a matter of personal perception.
Great review of both Bruce!
Well balanced review. Definitely each model has its pros and cons. As an owner of an 1861, I wouldn't mind owning the new model, but the price tag is not the same anymore. Bought mine new in 2018 around 3.5k. I'm curious to see if in the near future we'll find the new model discounted as much as the 1861 or if Omega will stop flooding the market.
When I first wanted one they were £865. I still haven’t decided whether I want sapphire or hesalite
Seeing that run under the tap kinda scared me 😱 Great review 👍
Great side by side! I recently tried on the new Speedy sapphire on leather for the first time, and clinical or not, I was blown away by the movement finishing. I could’ve stared at it for hours.
The Box and the price increase was enough for me to keep chasing the 1861 Hesalite which I just added to my collection ^-^
Hey Bruce .Ordered my 1861 just before UK Lockdown in March 2020. Picked it up in July 2020 due to obvious delays.Happy to have picked up the 1861 before all the rumours about the new model came true.
I have never been a fan of the Speedmaster bracelet so ordered mine with the black leather strap which looks amazing , no sharp edges to think about on a leather !! Just recently I have swapped the black leather for a brown distressed COLAREB Firenze. This combo now looks stunning.The watch looks vintage, unique, and just a bit different to the factory issues. My point is this ,a Speedmaster can be made to feel and look how you want it too. Buy one , ditch the bracelet and make it your own... then it feels special. I love my Speedy. Its a watch for all occasions and a watch for wearing and enjoying.I like the way I feel about my watch and the average Joe in the street has no idea of this watches heritage.
As regards accuracy, mine runs around +5-8 secs a day which in my world is fine. I will keep my1861 . No intention of upgrade thank you.
Check out Speedmaster101 for some fine brown and black leather examples.
I'm hoping to get a speedy in the next two years and also prefer them on straps. Check out Bulang and sons...I just bought the black Speedy racing strap, ready for the watch one day. It is pricey but absolutely amazing. I think it's worth spending double the price of a standard strap.
P.s. I have the blue Firenze strap too which I used on my old 1861 Speedy. I had to sell that watch a few years ago, and so I'll likely end up with the new hesalite 3861 this time around. I much prefer to swap many straps, instead of wearing a heavy steel bracelet. It's much more fun and more comfy too
Your watch stands are SOLID!! Nice content.
Love your videos friend. Always good info and enthusiasm.
The moonwatch is an icon and there is no doubt about this, but in the past my thought was that I didn't want to spend such amount of money for a non accurate watch. Now we finally have the movement that this icon deserves: a Metas certified jewel. For me the moonwatch to buy is the new one.
Non accurate? The 1861 is plenty accurate. Sure it’s not METAS, but still holds up better than most watches out there.
@@James-zy4nc for sure, but from a thousands dollar watch I expect a very good accuracy, that's my point. Anyway the 1861 moonwatch is a great watch too, but I would probably spend my money on the last one.
@@andreaiacolina in addition to the flawed “accuracy” issue (after all they used it on space missions): as opposed to the 1863 the new one has never been to the Moon.
@@bjoernaltmann you are absolutely right. But in the end the new movement has a better technology because it's more modern and the accuracy is better. I don't wanna say that the old moonwatch was a bad watch, but the new one is a step ahead in my opinion.
@@bjoernaltmann The 1863 hasn't been to the moon either, but that doesn't mean it's a bad movement.
Great comparison review. I give you 2 thumbs up! 👍👍
Thank you for the very helpful review for a first time Speedmaster buyer who is looking at the Hesalite versions. The Pros and Cons are so clear and yet both seem like such good options it's making a hard decision as my local Omega Boutique has both in stock.
Go try both side to side, alternating. You might feel a preference.
I think over time we'll all really appreciate what Omega is doing with edging. Their watches are feeling more and more built for longevity. I like it.
Great video, but I'm still dying to see your full length Santos review!
You get a thumbs up for being a great dad!
Great review as always.
Hi Bruce, I have the Lego pirates ship behind you :)) I bought it back in 1991 when I was 10. So nostalgic.
Had the opportunity to try on both 1861 & 3861 (hesalite) both on bracelet today at my AD. I fully expected to want the 3861, however, it had a delicate feel and looked to shinny, didn't have that rugged feeling I expect from a tool watch. Pulled the trigger on the 1861 for a crazy good deal... (in the neighborhood of 48% off MSRP) Yea, do the math.... deal of the century in my opinion, more than pleased with my purchase.
There are quite a few comments here (including mine) that go along the same lines. Maybe the 3861 feels more sophisticated, but it feels also more delicate. I bought the 1861 too.
Nice video
I just bought a new SM300m and I gotta say the edges are very sharp. Amazingly sharp. It’s gotta be a new omega thing.
In fact, a guy I know had his wrist bone skin injured by it and had to have the AD “soften” the edges. It seemed to have fixed the issue.
There’s no question whatsoever my SM300m edges are sharper than any watch I’ve ever had in my life. And that’s A LOT of watches. Will it cut? I know a guy it did. There you go. Take that for whatever that’s worth.
The 1861 dial is more of a smooth matte dark grey in direct sunlight. The 3861 is more black and textured. However under normal lighting conditions they look very similar. You can only notice the difference up close. Some of the 1861 dials are starting to discolor, getting patina. Some 1861’s dial colors are slightly changing into a purple brownish tone. In the future the 1861 dials will change and age like older 70’s references. Obviously the more you wear it outside in direct sunlight. Speedy owners might see some changes.
I see what you mean about the movement finish quality. I’ve got the 1861 currently running at 2.3 secs a day fast so I’m happy to stick with this….
Many thanks Bruce for a great comparison of these two fine versions of the Speedy. I don't have a Speedy (yet) but I have been asking myself exactly the same question, which version would be right for me and I've come to the similar conclusion as you but ultimately I think I should try them side by side. if possible. The big downside is if I decide to go for the 1863 is that I need to wait a bit longer for that Santos medium. Time to ponder what to do.
No one mentions that with co axial escapement you can consistently let chrono run without any excess friction to movement which is s big improvement over it’s predecessor
The diminution of the friction in the co-axial escapement allows longer periods between servicing for the escapement itself but has no (almost 0) impact on the power reserve regarding the chonograph being engaged or not.
I am so glad I grabbed an 1861 in 2019
Awesome review!
Does the old bracelet fit the new 3861? I just purchased a new 2021 but prefer the older thicker bracelet. I'm thinking of ordering a bracelet from the 1861 to put on my new 3861. Just would like to know for sure before I order . Great video!
I like them both. IMHO Hesalite is the way to go!
1861 has more space history as it was used for decades in space by NASA and by Roskosmos.
1861 Big Box is my favorite (modern) model!
Many thanks. Will stick with my Heuer.
Fantastic comparison Bruce . Indeed the old movement looks more pleasing and warm . Love the way it looks . Surprised to see so much difference in that area . I prefer the longer lugs on the older version as well . The new model looks short and fat in comparison. I need more water resist and a ceramic bezel wouldn’t hurt ... maybe one day.
I really like the bracelet and taper on the newer version.
welp. got a sapphire sandwich i bought new in 2019 and i'm not gonna change it. agree about the movement finishing - I had a small piece of lint removed from the movement at the Omega service and they did say it got in there because the movement is finished manually
Oh and the 1863 goes +10 seconds out of the box. It's not COSC, but they do rate it for -1 to +10 s a day. They regulate it intentionally towards the upper limit because it has a habit of settling in after a few months to dead on. Same thing happened to mine, I can wear it for a month and never have to set it, just wind it. You can kinda hack it putting back pressure on the crown (which Omega say it's fine to do) so i wouldn't get the accuracy benefit.
Great review, lovely fella.
Enjoy your content.
Hi, great video ! What year is the older one ? And would you say there is a difference between the two sapphire glasses ? I heard from an Omega salesman that the new ones were different.. thanks !
I have the 30th anniversary limited edition 1861. I think I’m good since mine is now considered vintage according to Omega’s website. 861/1861 will now been elevated to classic status and it’s $value will increase over time now that its long long run has ended. :)
Bruce, What are the watch stands you have them on? Great video.
Hi Bruce
Is there any possibility that the new 3861 will bring back the big box with all the extras?
I love my 1863 coz i could change the strap without the extra spending
Thanks
Great comparison!. I just bought the older (but brand new) version with the giant kit included. I thought it was worth getting the last Real Moonwatch, for what it's worth. What I'd really like is the original 321 Pre-moon (actual moon watch). But alas, I don't have $12,000-$20,000 for that watch.
Good choice. We’re you able to get any discount?
@@James-zy4nc I bought a 2 month old Speedmaster that was basically new in box. I paid $4,000 for mine. It's the version with the hesalite crystal and solid caseback.
Always liked the Speedmaster Moonwatch Professional but never enough to actually by it..think the old model was just to bulky and I didnt like the brasslet so it never whent in my collection. But the new 3861 just felt 100% for me (I have 17,5cm wrist) so I bought the Saffire version. Fantastic watch !
I went with the 3861 bracelet on my 1861. I like the new one and the updates but not sure it's worth the money for the upgrade, yet anyway. Great video!
Please don’t do it. FrankenWatch is rubbish
The Omega (disclaimer: in my opinion) has more charm to it. I think it’s the different edges and technical details. You could have the watch for a year and still find new lines in it and it grows on you more and more.
For legibility the speedy wins for me. This is thanks to the dial design and hands. I also find the chrono easier to read, but both are difficult at certain times of the day and the hands are covering the subdials.
I should say now that I’m a fan of both brands and own both brands watches.
The white dial on my Daytona is one of the most highly desired models and don’t get wrong, it’s a work of art and it’s a better fit for me and is extremely comfortable. The new speedy dial can look big on my wrist and that’s the only downside for me. It feels great though and it has a nice weight and feel to it. If you have a larger wrist I’d recommend you try the speedy and Daytona if it’s possible. The strap taper on the omega might be too much for some people.
You also won’t need a rotating watch box for the speedy as its manual wear. It’s nice to wind it up and makes you get really close and attached to it.
luv that you keep it real with the family vibes. #dadlife Family above all
Hey Bruce great video as always. I wanted your advice regarding the Water resistance of the old speedy i saw in the video you were washing the new one under the tap can one do that with the older model aswell considering it has 50m WR?
Yeah that was the 1863. I don't mind washing it under the tap from time to time. But I get a pressure and seal check every 2 years. If I was going swimming I would take a diver
I’ve got the 1863 and love every few about it. The new one looks great and specs are very tempting. Probably just going to grab the new bracelet for mine if it’s fits.
The new bracelet does fit like a charm! Ordered it for my 1863 a week ago and looking forward to it! 😎
@@driesdebrabandere How much?
@@i1p2p3o4c5a6m7p9o9 I was quoted €700, so I gues that would be around $800 or so.
@@driesdebrabandere Did you go to your local omega dealer to order it? Thinking about pulling the trigger soon! :) congrats on your purchase!
@@xC4Rbonx I did contact my AD, they were happy to order it for me. Seems Omega is pretty easy on supplying their new bracelets!
In photos and video the dial and overall the new moonwatch appears better , however I’ve had both and for some reason I like the older watch better. The lugs are not as prominent so the watch appears thinner on wrist, the dial is not grainy or a deep black like the new one. The old one has a grayish black dial which I personally prefer. So the only solution is to get both.
Really agree with you. I bought the older. Better dial (the outer seconds track is busier which makes it look like a solid band, and makes the dial more legible), I love the look of the overall lug design, tried and tested movement, and I paid half the price of the new one... no question for me. The old one is a better choice
I’m happy to do away with the big box but Omega should have retain all the goodies eg nato strap, loupe, tools etc.
I hurried so I got the "old" one, which I think is better than the new version in almost every way. I will never "upgrade". I love my Moonwatch.
Just bought the 2021 sapphire version. I really wanted the old one because of the big box but its like finding a needle in a haystack now, especially because i wanted it brand new. That being said i managed to get them to throw in the nato nasa velcro strap for free with the new one.
Completely agree with you on all aspects between the two, except for the box. I am so glad they dropped the old box. I wash my hands too many times to wear anything other than the bracelet, especially these COVID days. Does anyone actually use the loupe and paperweight? Even then, why such a huge box?
Agree JacobX the old box takes up so much damn space in my cupboard it is annoying. I’ve seen a thread or two about converting the giant box to a 8 or 12 slot watch box. Apparently there are drop in inserts
Thanks fot for this excellent vid!
The 1861 is extremely accurate, or simply mine is .
I love my 1863. Bought it in January of 2020 brand new from an AD for $4500 after some serious haggling. I love it and have no intention of upgrading, but damn, the new bracelet is absolutely perfect. It's the only thing that really makes me want the new one.
The new bracelet fits the previous model as well, so you can upgrade the bracelet if you wish.
I bought my Moonwatch new in 2010. Mine came in a crappy fake leather box that peels and leaves red residue on everything it touches. Same for the warranty card holder disintegrating and bonding itself to the owners manual inside the box.
Well presented..👍 you pays your money you make your choice..🤔
Perfectly put, there is no wrong answer on choosing either or. Both are the moon watch at the end of the day. Great video
Got my new 3861 sapphire sandwich speedy this February. Sharp edges indeed.
Bought the 1861 once again! Definitely not selling again. For several reasons it's just the better choice
@6.10. It is true that out of the box the 1861/1863 run about +10 but with a bit of patience you can get much better. I self regulated mine down to +5 per week. It gains a second or two on wrist but overnight loses a second.
Love the new Speedmaster… such of beautiful upgrade ✌🏻✌🏻
Bruce how did you find the fit of the 1863 bracelet? As there’s hardly any micro adjust on it
Nice review, Bruce thank you. Iconic watch, looks awesome on other people. Just not me.
BTW kid is just the cutest ever.
I really feel the 1861 is a better choice. After trying both several times I bought the hesalite. It's perfect
I initially bought the 3861 sapphire and it didn’t feel nice. Quite feminine and showy. I sold it almost immediately and was lucky enough to have just bought a brand new 1861 hessalite from my AD. I absolutely love it, it’s so much more of a watch than the 3861.
@@harrywright5793 sold mine! That's the watch hobby for you. My top 3 wish list at the moment is: Oyster Perpetual 36 (Black), Tudor Black Bay 54 and another Omega ( not sure which one I just know I need an Omega in my life)
I think with the clasp upgrade, I would actually prefer the rigidity of the old bracelet. New one looks a touch dainty for the head/case of the watch. But I hate the old clasp, must be upgraded
Take comfort knowing that watches were good enough for all your needs about 70 years ago. I'm sure the clasp is fine.
@@ams914 it's called progress and relativity.
I’m wearing my 1861 right now and I’m 💯 satisfied. No need to spend thousands more for the updated version. Plus mines is the OG version without the sapphire
Totally 💯 in the same position you are , love ❤️ my 1861
Tried to get an 1836 from my AD two weeks back, wouldn't offer me a penny off full retail. Having visited the shop several times and had the money in my account to buy there and then. 🤷🏻♂️
I really don't know which one to get. But whatever I end up with it will be hesalite, and I'll wear it on a black racing Bulang and Sons strap 🖤🖤🖤
I recently upgraded to the 3861 and still have the 1861. Will probably sell the latter. My 3861 has the new adjustable clasp.👏🇦🇺
I would keep that 1861... prefer it to the new watch. But it's personal taste isn't it
What are the watch stands? Looks nice.
That new bracelet is something else...
Is the finishing on the hesalite and sapphire versions of the new speedmaster the same?
I’d reserved a 3861 and went to pick it up. Tried it on again and just didn’t feel the love for it the first time I tried it on. I wanted the metal bracelet and the newer one just felt too feminine and dainty for me. I knew I’d regret buying it. Spent nearly two hours in the shop and left with an 1861 and over £1000 in my pocket.
As a 1861 owner, .. You made a great choice.
@@TheWayofGrace89 Thanks and after 24 hours of wearing it I know I made the right decision.
Same here. The 1861 just felt more solid, but without feeling bulky, even on my rather thin wrists.
@@louisjolliet3369 And 4 months in I have no regrets with my purchase.
Did the same as you the new one felt like a girls watch
Many go for the new one because it’s hard to find the old one nowadays.
3861 movement is no doubt more technical and accurate but the moonwatch non coaxial whereas 1861 or 861 will always be the classical one of course after the benchmark 321, things I like about the new one: The improved accuracy and longer maintenance free intervals of the 3861 movement, the shortened lug to lug distance, the new bracelet which resembles a bit the legendary 1450 from the 70s (although I hate the striped clasp) and the more accentuated sub dials.
I just went in to try on the 3861 and the one major thing I disliked was the bracelet. It's so dainty and the clasp feels so famine. Why did they make is so tapered?
Just an info you don't know (yet) : my 1861 hesalite just came back from service and they swapped the 2 biggest hands to the new ones (3861 has bended hands like pre-moon models).
Is it the standard way of doing the service (upgrade) or was it a mistake, I don't know, future may tell, but it gives the 1861 an additional vintage touch, some more warmth as you call it.
Kinda like it and consider it as a visual upgrade :)
I’ve read that they use to do that, they upgrade everything they can when they see it has any problem or imperfection
I definitely feel that Speedy is best on straps. Watch Gecko, Bulang and sons , colareb.. much more fun and comfortable than bracelets... can't wait to get the hesalite Speedy some day
I ditched my last Speedmaster it’s accuracy was so poor. I’ll get this model though.
Missed opportunities; Keep the old box, Ceramic Bezel on the Sapphire model, and on the fly clasp adjustment. The 8361 is a superior performing watch with great all around improvements.
But does the old bracelet fit on the new watch?