I was looking for Wuthering Heights videos and I've found your channel! I've now watched several videos of yours and I can say without any doubts that your channel is becoming one of my favourite here on TH-cam! 😊
Totally agree with your list, BUT! 1) Baron Harkonnen is a pretty cool villain, but definitely not charming and funny :) I myself would like to write a villain one day who has a tragic backstory, is shown doing some pretty horrible things, albein feeling conflicted about that, and in the end is devastated and pretty much mad. (He's going to be superhot, so all those silly teenage girls will swoon over him, hehehehe. 2) One example of subverting expectations was "The Binding", which is a YA novel I found extremely good and moving. I started listening to it because the cover suggested fantasy, and when it turned into dramatic gay romance, I was like "Wait, what?" - but in a thoroughly good way. [Also, this is one of a handful of YA novels I've read but I still feel self-conscious admitting I've done any XD]
You're so on point when it comes to creators trying to take established IPs and twist them to meet their ideas! It might not be all the time, and in some cases not even intentional. But in many instances you can tell the writer deliberately set out to change things to annoy the fans. Rian Johnson with The Last Jedi comes to mind, where he turned Luke from an optimistic, heroic character into a cynical, pessimistic hermit. And it didn't make any sense. Same with Rafe Judkins. Based on his comments on twitter, it feels like he's going out of his way to annoy WoT fans. They see an IP as a brand/product, which means the fans are the customers. Why insult and go to war with your customer base. It's a sure way to lose money. I also agree with your other points as well, especially the one on anti-heroes. They are definitely way too overdone. There are good examples, but the trope is over-saturated now. I for sure prefer protagonists like Harry Potter who are flawed, but fundamentally good at heart and heroic. They're not only just relatable, they are also more inspiring. Along with seeing characters that represent you, it's also important to see characters that are aspirational. Someone you can use as a template to improve yourself, aspire towards, and become better. Thanks for another great video! :)
Thanks for your insightful comments. Star Wars is definitely another good example and as for Judkins, I stopped caring about what he had to say on the Wheel of Time I heard him speak about it. There's nothing wrong of course with changing things and being creative, but when you just do it for shock value or to annoy, and when you don't consider the ramifications that making changes will have for a story (especially one as complicated as the Wheel of Time), you end up ruining the whole thing. Also, what you say about aspirational heroes is right. I think you might have given me the seed for a new video idea there, talking about the difference between aspirational and relatable heroes. So thanks! :)
Hand in hand with tropes is the need to be PC and cater to a sensitive audience. It's okay to be explicit as long as it ties in with the mood socially. I don't think Wuthering Heights would even be published nowadays, if it was, you would have to have Heathcliff undergo a big redemption, most likely drawn from Cathy junior who teaches him how to be a good person and takes him down a peg or two.
Interesting lecture on topics I hadn’t really given much thought to before, must be why I like Alexander Dumas so much as example of “Old big 1800s novel” with the sincerity work put into the characters. I am going to have to break down and do audiobook on “Babel” you have mentioned several times how you didn’t like it and find out for myself what it’s all about😜😀
Glad you found the stuff interesting. I think this is probably the last time I'll mention Babel haha. It's just that I rarely read novels that annoy me, so when I have to talk about negative topics, it's only a few books that can crop up! :P
Wondering about your thoughts on the connection between Jean Rhys “Wide Sargasso Sea” and Jane Eyre….. (I didn’t read Jane Eye but Wide Sargasso Sea makes me want to).
I have a suggestion of a good Fantasy series with an actual hero. Lord of a Shattered Land by Howard Andrew Jones, is the first book of the chronicles of Hanuvar. I was very pleasantly surprised.
I don’t know if u play video games but that whole bit about “redemption arcs” is literally why I don’t like Thor in GOW Ragnarök. Your told in the first game he is a ruthless, murdering, evil tyrant. But by the end of Ragnarök all is fine cos he’s acc a big softie and has a family and only murders entire races when he’s drunk. Why can’t writers just let villains be villains anymore? It drives me insane
I do sometimes, though I'm quite dated in terms of the ones I play! Still, appreciate the sentiment though; I think this trope is pretty endemic to the arts at the moment.
Wuthering heights has lead me to this channel, I’m glad to find people still read 😊.
I was looking for Wuthering Heights videos and I've found your channel! I've now watched several videos of yours and I can say without any doubts that your channel is becoming one of my favourite here on TH-cam! 😊
Thank you, I'm glad you enjoy the videos! :)
Totally agree with your list, BUT! 1) Baron Harkonnen is a pretty cool villain, but definitely not charming and funny :) I myself would like to write a villain one day who has a tragic backstory, is shown doing some pretty horrible things, albein feeling conflicted about that, and in the end is devastated and pretty much mad. (He's going to be superhot, so all those silly teenage girls will swoon over him, hehehehe. 2) One example of subverting expectations was "The Binding", which is a YA novel I found extremely good and moving. I started listening to it because the cover suggested fantasy, and when it turned into dramatic gay romance, I was like "Wait, what?" - but in a thoroughly good way. [Also, this is one of a handful of YA novels I've read but I still feel self-conscious admitting I've done any XD]
You're so on point when it comes to creators trying to take established IPs and twist them to meet their ideas! It might not be all the time, and in some cases not even intentional. But in many instances you can tell the writer deliberately set out to change things to annoy the fans. Rian Johnson with The Last Jedi comes to mind, where he turned Luke from an optimistic, heroic character into a cynical, pessimistic hermit. And it didn't make any sense. Same with Rafe Judkins. Based on his comments on twitter, it feels like he's going out of his way to annoy WoT fans. They see an IP as a brand/product, which means the fans are the customers. Why insult and go to war with your customer base. It's a sure way to lose money.
I also agree with your other points as well, especially the one on anti-heroes. They are definitely way too overdone. There are good examples, but the trope is over-saturated now. I for sure prefer protagonists like Harry Potter who are flawed, but fundamentally good at heart and heroic. They're not only just relatable, they are also more inspiring. Along with seeing characters that represent you, it's also important to see characters that are aspirational. Someone you can use as a template to improve yourself, aspire towards, and become better.
Thanks for another great video! :)
Thanks for your insightful comments. Star Wars is definitely another good example and as for Judkins, I stopped caring about what he had to say on the Wheel of Time I heard him speak about it. There's nothing wrong of course with changing things and being creative, but when you just do it for shock value or to annoy, and when you don't consider the ramifications that making changes will have for a story (especially one as complicated as the Wheel of Time), you end up ruining the whole thing. Also, what you say about aspirational heroes is right. I think you might have given me the seed for a new video idea there, talking about the difference between aspirational and relatable heroes. So thanks! :)
@@JoshuaJClarkeKelsall Oh awesome! I’m glad, looking forward to your later videos! :)
I am fed up with novels where the writers use them to moan about difficulties in their own lives.
Not a bad one! Sometimes it's best to keep your inner demons to yourself.
Hand in hand with tropes is the need to be PC and cater to a sensitive audience. It's okay to be explicit as long as it ties in with the mood socially. I don't think Wuthering Heights would even be published nowadays, if it was, you would have to have Heathcliff undergo a big redemption, most likely drawn from Cathy junior who teaches him how to be a good person and takes him down a peg or two.
I think the modern interpretation of Wuthering Heights in terms of modern psychological notions and abuse attests to your point.
Interesting lecture on topics I hadn’t really given much thought to before, must be why I like Alexander Dumas so much as example of “Old big 1800s novel” with the sincerity work put into the characters.
I am going to have to break down and do audiobook on “Babel” you have mentioned several times how you didn’t like it and find out for myself what it’s all about😜😀
Glad you found the stuff interesting. I think this is probably the last time I'll mention Babel haha. It's just that I rarely read novels that annoy me, so when I have to talk about negative topics, it's only a few books that can crop up! :P
Wondering about your thoughts on the connection between Jean Rhys “Wide Sargasso Sea” and Jane Eyre….. (I didn’t read Jane Eye but Wide Sargasso Sea makes me want to).
I'm the other way round; I've read Jane Eyre but not Wide Sargasso, so I'm afraid I can't comment! :P
@@JoshuaJClarkeKelsall it’s a short one only about 120 pages. Jane Eyre is next in my roster.
I have a suggestion of a good Fantasy series with an actual hero. Lord of a Shattered Land by Howard Andrew Jones, is the first book of the chronicles of Hanuvar. I was very pleasantly surprised.
I'll take a peep!
I don’t know if u play video games but that whole bit about “redemption arcs” is literally why I don’t like Thor in GOW Ragnarök. Your told in the first game he is a ruthless, murdering, evil tyrant. But by the end of Ragnarök all is fine cos he’s acc a big softie and has a family and only murders entire races when he’s drunk. Why can’t writers just let villains be villains anymore? It drives me insane
I do sometimes, though I'm quite dated in terms of the ones I play! Still, appreciate the sentiment though; I think this trope is pretty endemic to the arts at the moment.
@@JoshuaJClarkeKelsall it certainly is “endemic to the arts at the moment”. This trope is everywhere, and I’m sick to death of it! 😂