That Psion was an emissary, like a a diplomat sent on a specialized mission. Crow basically sabotaged an important intelligence mission and alliance, throwing all that effort down the drain. A rogue battalion on recon is nothing compared to what Crow potentially destroyed.
@@JCHogg-ks3ec Killing a foreign power's emissary is one of the biggest war crimes you could possibly commit. I can understand how pissed Caiatl was at Crow for destroying their efforts in pretty much datamining information out of the captured Hive Guardians.
I can appreciate that they actually animated the characters expressing emotions while they speak. Too many games these days have characters just sitting still while talking about some huge emotional or dramatic moment lol
@@Bloodhurl67 Hey hey. We had our time to shine. In volunteering to kill the bastard that killed Cyade. The one time the Guardian ever spoke (at least what I remember. Been a while since I've played...a long while...).
His heart is in the right place. It does feel slightly wrong to be doing this to what are essentially another species of guardians. But then you remember what the hive once were. What they did. What they’re capable of. And suddenly you don’t have much sympathy for them even if they were chosen by the traveler
I like your opinion on this… but do bear in mind that all lightbearers lose their identities when they’re revived. These Lucent Hive can’t be held responsible for their pasts. However, they chose to fight against us as Lightbearers, (just like the Warlords of the Dark age chose to be tyrants instead of protectors) so hate them for that, instead…
Literally the only Hive we could remotely trust is Savathun, and that's only because she's seen the Witness, and much like Crow here, her plan to "seal the Traveler away" was good-natured, ensuring the Black Fleet could never destroy the Traveler and open the path to nothingness, an idea Savathun finds odd given that she wants to experience the world as it is now, rather than behold the universe at its end, where life and death mean nothing.
Unga bunga me mad cuz you kill robot man, but you not that man no more, but me still angry, me no have open mind for crow man. Me shoot and no understand.
I was so upset when this happened. Now looking back I feel like the last three seasons have pushed us into this. Now all I want is an army of Cabal at my back trained by Lord Saladin.
Crow: "You understand... Don't you?" _Remembers how I killed Uldren because I thought it was right_ _Remembers Crow has that memory now too_ Me: Aw shit... Yeah. I do.
I mean, we kinda were. Ahamkara or not uldren was kind of a prick. Crows cool though although killing the psion was a bit excessive. Personally I just imagine he would have broken the machine allowing it to connect to the guardians
@@forrestsytsma5861 I mean I think there’s a really good philosophical argument to be had about the ethics of punishing someone who’s world view was so warped and manipulated they couldn’t tell reality from fantasy. But my comment was more aimed at pointing out that Lord Saladin words might not have been Crow’s only inspiration for his impulsive actions. And that we are not incapable of such actions ourselves. _Motions to the Dreaming City_
He did what he had to because of the "Voice of Riven" or Ahamkara Riven, empty promise to bring back his sister. Little did anyone know, that everyone was played for fools. The Scorn, The Hive, The Awaken, anyone with a desperate wish.
Yeah I'm on Saladin, the hive are too far gone for mercy. Fallen and cabal how ever they can be allies but the Hive are nothing more than what we are but we have some morality
@@theheneral2318 I don't think so the cabal on our side has a blue armor color. There's red legion remnants, and Calus soldiers as well that are against us. It's like the fallen as we have some on our side but most are against us. That's how I interpret it
Lord Saladin always has the best quotes- "Mercy to an enemy cannot come at the cost of mercy for their victims." "Doing what you believe is right, doesn't absolve you from the consequences of those actions. Someone must always pay the price." -Saladin Forge
Cabal have been trying to recruit guardians for awhile now so yeah that doesn't surprise me. She probably has names picked out for all the guardians she wants just waiting lmao
3:10 I got goosebumps when I heard "Elegy" in the background of this cutscene. Makes me wonder, if it were any of the other Iron Lords in Saladin's position, would they have made the same choice?
I feel they would, but just like Lord Saladin I have no doubt several if not all of them would’ve been against the alliance to begin with. Thanks to Commander Zavala, the Young Wolf (at least by narrative), even Savathun (as Osiris), he eventually came to view the whole thing differently. Had the Iron Lords still been around, I’m sure they’d all need some convincing since we all know they’re men and women of action, not words…
Doing some literal skulduggery to the Hive is *peanuts* compared the truly horrific shit the Hive has done to not only Guardians, but every other "interesting" race they've come across. At best, this is an eye for an eye. Although in the case of the Hive, I'd say they still owe one.
That's what I'm saying the darkness is going to be to powerful for us to fight alone, so we will let Dady Amru revive savathun and, we will all fight the witness together. Or the traveler will dip out and, we will be the only one left with the light since we are tied to the shard in the edz and not the traveler. Either way can wait for lightfalls
Yeah still not really Spoilers The lucent hive mostly just do what they want or what feels right. That does include some helping us like Luzaku or the knight/acolyte in the excision mission. We do have a couple lucent hive allies but majority of them are still hostile just because
Its actually kind of hilarious how the Darkness turned Guardians against each other because of our own entitlement to the light. You're either POWERED BY Light ( *NOT* the other way around) and respect its power and its philosophy or you can succumb to your own selfish *NEEDS* and Join the Darkness or you can be mortal. Mere food for the darkness to consume.
I was originally annoyed that we weren't present during this scene. But now that I think about it, that was probably a good thing. I know I wouldn't have let Caiatl take a step towards Crow before unleashing my super. Dont get me wrong I love her character. But no one touches Crow while the YW is around. Good job Zavala and your newly found backbone. Saladin thank you for reminding me how much I love and respect you. Proud to be an Iron Lord
I mean same here, Crow isy Guardians best buddy. Someone has to fill the void Cayde left behind. In my eyes Crow's decision was justified, but Saladin also makes a very good point. Remember the saying, the road to hell is paved with good intentions. Also, technically we "own" Crow since Spider let us take him. So, from that perspective Caiatl would be messing with the merchandise lol.
@@Theaveragegamer_12 absolutely. I mean no one will ever replace cayde but we need someone to care about like him. We got our revenge. Uldren Sov is dead. Crow is a new light that deserves a chance, especially after what he's been through since his awakening. I still find it strange to think, I was one of the few that saw his revival and joked about killing him over and over again. But when we met crow, it was clear he didnt deserve that.
Same imho. Caiatl would have found herself tethered to my Shadowshot, impaled on a thousand solar blades, beaten and electrified by Arc Staff…..then stabbed with Silence and Squall.
Caiatl has no idea who she just put on her war counsel. She's only heard stories, now she will understand just how true they are. Saladin is about to become a Primus lmaooooo
I'm not surprised so many people giving Crow crap for this. I don't disagree with what Crow did. I understand to a point why hive are being used like this. That's how it starts though. A little bit of this, a bit of that. And by the time you're done, you've become the enemy. A lot of people really don't get why there are agreed rules in wars. Even though the very concept itself is a joke.
I know right, they actually forget thats how " The Thorn " became to be , first , using your enemy guns against them and when You realize , You already became something else.
Just saying these hive were intentionally stealing light from other guardians, so they were not showing mercy. Plus it’s savathun, you need to find a advantage even if it’s not always the right path
The Lucent Hive were literally harvesting light from guardians and I doubt they were quick about it. You can find their corpses scattered about certain battlegrounds so forgive me if I’m not broken up about what we did. Regardless we needed the intel from them and what we did was extremely effective at doing that. Pretty much everyone agreed with Crows perspective that it felt wrong even the Psion he kills did. Crow jeopardized an alliance and risked war with the Cabal again because he couldn’t grasp the Hive didn’t deserve his mercy when it risked others. Honestly Saladin joining Caiatl’s war council magically making her forget what Crow had done is such bad writing. The Psion was a personal old friend of hers and she just forgets that as soon as Saladin offers to join her.
The lore tab for when Crow shut it down is brutally violent and detailed. It basically scrambled the Psion's brain. And Crow could actually feel the Psion suffering as it happened, calling out for help; for it to stop. I do feel bad for the hive that were part of the experiment, but I also think the way the Psion went out was tragic and painful. Funny how Crow has since pretty much reverted back into Uldren's old ways. [Spoilers] The death of a certain character is definitely gonna mess him up.
@@GHefly445spoiler but go down Amanda she sacrificed herself to save some prisoners it was heartbreaking especially when Zavala grieved her death he was kneeling next to her coffin crying
What i think is gonna happen is that we recruit our old enemies to fight the witness, Hive, cabal, fallen, and vex. And we fight the taken, scorn and maybe eramis and the witness. As we already know the light has given old enemies our light, such as crow and hive, but the fallen used to have the light so they wish they could earn it back.
Well, that's what happens when you're uploaded with an entire lifetime's worth of memories from your previous identity. Imagine the guilt on his shoulders. Imagine a Guardian that was a serial killer in their past life suddenly got those memories back, you bet they're gonna get depressed and try to be overly good.
Your consciousness can't get the better over you in war. There is a council for a reason, they know more about what's going on than you, you cannot overwrite it because you beleive it to be morally right, especially because you feel "me too". Crow not getting any form of real punishment is wack. He put lots of guardians lives in danger for the sake of "not all hive" and at the cost of a Innocent friendly unit, and his guilt. Crow better get his shit together.
Doing shit like that makes us no better then the hive which is Crows point. Yeah today it's just us ripping the mind and sense of self from the hive. But what about tomorrow when it's something else? When does it stop? When are we considered the bad guys for such horrific actions? How many necessary evils before it's just evil? It's important to set a principle less you become the very monsters you hoped to destroy. Let's also not ignore the fact the Hive are victims just as much as anyone else, maybe even more so.
With all do respect they’re in a time of war but there are still rules of war. Torturing prisoners is one of them. You don’t torture or experiment on prisoners of war. You either detain them for negotiation to send them back, kill them, or permanently incarcerate them. And that’s according to the Geneva convention. This is a game yes but what he did was MORALLY right. No matter what the hive has done to assume that all hive is the same is inherently wrong. And the lightbearers have proven that they’re not the same as regular hive either with the ability to communicate and understand. To torture them for fighting a war for their people is how you instill a deep seated hatred. Killing is a natural and accept occurrence in war torture isn’t.
Caital demanding a life for a life for the Psion goes to show how rad she is. Cabal or Psion your life is valued under her watch. Psion guards watching we’re probably like “Damn, your my empress alright.”
Looks like Saladin is going to have new wolves but bigger wolves that is, imagine Cabal with green iron banner colors and armor that also have pet wolves with them too, that would be cool to see
"you understand, don't you?" my guy, like Saladin, I'd be cracking these open like they were eggs and I'm trying to make a cake. Break open, empty the ammo and engrams out, throw out the shell, repeat.
damn. we lost a war hero at the cost of a emo with the identity crisis and having a major hate by guardian community. can't we replace the Hunter Dare with Efrideet or something?
Ain't she retired or something? As for Saladin's "departure", the alliance is much stronger for it. Caiatl gets to see just how effective Salad man is, and, we get some extremely well trained Cabal on our side.
Spoiler alert of D2 Theory ending: all the alien races we face in the past will be our allies in a near future in other to fight a great evil, The witness!!!
(Spoilers) I can see this. I mean we have a hive ghost as our ally, so I can see some of the hive light bearers turning away from the rest of the hive seeing as how the darkness brainwashed savathun and changed her memories to get her to fight the traveler and humanity instead of helping each ither fight the darkness. And I fully believe we will end up fighting renegade guardians who strayed to far into the darkness as well.
@@nicholasprutzman9915 I would kill to have the opportunity to grant one of these factions our light. I just wanna play as an Eliksni Guardian. Very badly.
Forgetting who you are. Why you do what you do. That's how you fall to the darkness. The light is the path of sacrifice. Giving your all protect what matters. To be selfish and forget your morality to win is how you collapse from the inside. Just this shows exactly how world's break. All it takes is panic and desperation. A desire to survive and win so strong you cross lines. Line that break you down from within. Before you know it you've gone so far you'll find yourself alone and bitter with nobody but the darkness to comfort you. The hive may have a chance for redemption. But we won't know if we cross so many lines it can never happen.
Honestly, if it weren't for Crow's actions here the alliance between Caiatl and the Vanguard would be shaky at best. Saladin is our best connection to the war room which makes strategizing even easier. And from what we've seen over the seasons we've only grown closer with our Cabal allies. Heck, there's even a Cabal version of Iron Banner, so many more badass Cabal to assist in the battlefield. Did I agree with Crow at first? Obviously not, but looking at the bigger picture and where we're at now, we benefitted from this.
Saladin has a pretty good gig now. Gets to beat the shit out of Cabal warriors and be praised and promoted for it. As far as I'm aware, he's gone from mere Bracus to Valus. Soon enough he'll be Dominus Forge.
Because of this shit I don't trust Crow anymore. One day he'll wake up and have another great idea. This little incident almost put the City at war with the Cabal Empire again, just after having struck such a fragile alliance.
Considering you and ethos comment just recently you prob haven’t played the latest story yet crow is indeed getting darker and reverting back to his ways as uldren sob which I honestly don’t blame him since the witness forces killed one of our beloved members one person that crow was just reconciling with and the closest he was to
I have a lot of things going on in my life that make me a lot like crow, and I side with him on this. Psychological warfare is unacceptable, even against the hive. If we torture our prisoners for what they did to us, we are nk better than them. Sure, what Crow did was a hasty decision, but his heart was in the right place. That matters more than mistakes, and we should remember that he did what he believed was right, even if he probably shouldn't have.
Lucent Hive haven't even actually done anything bad to us that we didn't thwart. They're losing their appetite and need for carnage and murder to sate their worms, and their leader's one big ploy (to keep The Traveler safe, mind you) was foiled. Sava2n was misguided, enigmatic, kinda stupid and edgy, but she's no longer the Savathun we know
Yeah I'm gonna have to disagree, given that the hive are an omnicidal race bent on proving their "superiority" by eating civilizations. Torturing a few hive, who already don't abide by any "rules of war" that everyone keeps going on about, so that the entire rest of the universe can survive is definitely worth it
@@APennyForYourThoughts835 If we torture people because they only exist to kill, there is nothing stopping us from doing the same thing to people who don't. And other people might compare us to those we torture and see us as no better than them.
Yeah forgive me if I don’t feel sympathy for the Hive. Especially the Lucent Hive who were harvesting light from guardians. Crow put his morals before anyone else and jeopardized not only himself but the entire last city risking the alliance.
Still waiting on Bungie to let titan's get a bitchin cape like Saladin, just the one. I'd transmog that onto every piece of armor I own. I want it so bad.
Dammit crow… thanks a lot for losing us a better character but the moment caital does something to him… i’m bathing each and every cabal in a baptism of inferno. And she will be the last.
![Destiny 2: Season of Dawn - All Saint 14 Cutscenes & Quest Dialogue [Complete]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/GVUgbfMq548/mqdefault.jpg)
![Destiny 2: Season of Dawn - All Saint 14 Cutscenes & Quest Dialogue [Complete]](/img/tr.png)
Crow: *fucks up by killing the psion*
Us who slaughtered an entire Cabal battalion just to borrow their cannon: yea like.... what the fuck Crow?!
In our defence, those Cabal weren't allies with us yet. To Caiatl, those Cabal died an honourable death in combat against the Guardian.
@@4_xk idk man, she was pretty pissed about it
That Psion was an emissary, like a a diplomat sent on a specialized mission. Crow basically sabotaged an important intelligence mission and alliance, throwing all that effort down the drain. A rogue battalion on recon is nothing compared to what Crow potentially destroyed.
@@JCHogg-ks3ec Killing a foreign power's emissary is one of the biggest war crimes you could possibly commit. I can understand how pissed Caiatl was at Crow for destroying their efforts in pretty much datamining information out of the captured Hive Guardians.
True but she did admit that that battalion jumped the gun.
I can appreciate that they actually animated the characters expressing emotions while they speak. Too many games these days have characters just sitting still while talking about some huge emotional or dramatic moment lol
Meanwhile with our guardian and ghost staying completely silent
*cough* ghost recon breakpoint *cough*
@@Bloodhurl67 Hey hey. We had our time to shine. In volunteering to kill the bastard that killed Cyade. The one time the Guardian ever spoke (at least what I remember. Been a while since I've played...a long while...).
@@Qardo The Guardian’s actually been pretty vocal these past expansions. Beyond Light, Witch Queen and Lightfall we’ve been talking during cutscenes.
Can we talk ab how Zavala was ready to square up?? That shit had me hype
Zavala ready to take flight
Revvin up that knee
He's a Titan. A calm one but still a Titan.
His heart is in the right place. It does feel slightly wrong to be doing this to what are essentially another species of guardians. But then you remember what the hive once were. What they did. What they’re capable of. And suddenly you don’t have much sympathy for them even if they were chosen by the traveler
I like your opinion on this… but do bear in mind that all lightbearers lose their identities when they’re revived. These Lucent Hive can’t be held responsible for their pasts. However, they chose to fight against us as Lightbearers, (just like the Warlords of the Dark age chose to be tyrants instead of protectors) so hate them for that, instead…
Literally the only Hive we could remotely trust is Savathun, and that's only because she's seen the Witness, and much like Crow here, her plan to "seal the Traveler away" was good-natured, ensuring the Black Fleet could never destroy the Traveler and open the path to nothingness, an idea Savathun finds odd given that she wants to experience the world as it is now, rather than behold the universe at its end, where life and death mean nothing.
It's import that you yourself doesn't become a monster in order to fight monsters.
Unga bunga me mad cuz you kill robot man, but you not that man no more, but me still angry, me no have open mind for crow man. Me shoot and no understand.
What about finch?
I was so upset when this happened. Now looking back I feel like the last three seasons have pushed us into this. Now all I want is an army of Cabal at my back trained by Lord Saladin.
“You understand, don’t you?”
“Lmao wonder what loot I can scavenge from that dead scion. Thanks crow!”
@@thatoneguy487 Imagine they just drop a random Skyburner's.
@@thatoneguy487 "git gud" parting gift from the psion. 😎
Crow: "You understand... Don't you?"
_Remembers how I killed Uldren because I thought it was right_
_Remembers Crow has that memory now too_
Me: Aw shit... Yeah. I do.
I mean, we kinda were. Ahamkara or not uldren was kind of a prick. Crows cool though although killing the psion was a bit excessive. Personally I just imagine he would have broken the machine allowing it to connect to the guardians
@@forrestsytsma5861 I mean I think there’s a really good philosophical argument to be had about the ethics of punishing someone who’s world view was so warped and manipulated they couldn’t tell reality from fantasy. But my comment was more aimed at pointing out that Lord Saladin words might not have been Crow’s only inspiration for his impulsive actions.
And that we are not incapable of such actions ourselves. _Motions to the Dreaming City_
He did what he had to because of the "Voice of Riven" or Ahamkara Riven, empty promise to bring back his sister.
Little did anyone know, that everyone was played for fools. The Scorn, The Hive, The Awaken, anyone with a desperate wish.
Reading the lore, yes Crow, i do understand. He totally didn't mean to kill the Psion, in fact he considered themselves friends i believe.
@@forrestsytsma5861 you need to read his report as to what happened. It's in lore
Think I am with Saladin on this one. Side note - I can see him becoming a Primus now, leading his own legion of warriors twice his size. Lol.
He doesn't need to be a primus he's an lord of iron
@@RakanGamer12 Primus Forge is a badass name though.
He went from bracus forge to valus forge very quickly who knows maybe he'll be primus forge in no time
Along with his personal legion, The Iron War Beasts
“Don’t fear a lion that leads sheep, but fear a sheep that leads lions”. In Valus Forge’s case, it’s an old wolf, an alpha leading war beasts.
Even after all these years of quitting Destiny, Lord Saladin once again proves why I will ALWAYS stand as an Iron Wolf.
I second that
I third that.
Fourth.
Fifth 🤝🏼
Nah fuck him I was playing iron banner and he called me a warlock. I’m a hunter
Yeah I'm on Saladin, the hive are too far gone for mercy. Fallen and cabal how ever they can be allies but the Hive are nothing more than what we are but we have some morality
I wonder though idlf sabathun will show up again as a strained alliance as her ghost did get away
@@joekupec7893 Maybe we let her get resurrected so we can get information on the witness. After all, she did help the traveller push it back.
are all cabal now on our side? if yes they need to change some of the public events and open world ads
@@theheneral2318 I don't think so the cabal on our side has a blue armor color. There's red legion remnants, and Calus soldiers as well that are against us. It's like the fallen as we have some on our side but most are against us. That's how I interpret it
@@joekupec7893 i see thx
Lmao you shaking your head when he said "you understand?"
Lord Saladin always has the best quotes-
"Mercy to an enemy cannot come at the cost of mercy for their victims."
"Doing what you believe is right, doesn't absolve you from the consequences of those actions. Someone must always pay the price."
-Saladin Forge
He is just an extremely wise character that has gone through it all. If you ever watched avatar the last airbender he is very much like uncle iroh
Imagine if she said: *Your life is now forfeit, you will serve as my concubine*
That spot is already reserved for commander Zuzu
I don't think his ghost can revive him after one night
@@thecinnamonguy5127 *Your light fades away*
Guardian down
Pops up
@@thecinnamonguy5127 can't or wont ? XD
Caitle already had a badass name ready for him, she's been thinking about recruiting him lol
Cabal have been trying to recruit guardians for awhile now so yeah that doesn't surprise me. She probably has names picked out for all the guardians she wants just waiting lmao
I'm imagining Caitl just having a random name generator on standby, just like Zavala has a random operation name generator for strike missions.
She didn't give him a name. She gave him a title
@@Stinger20638 operation... Baby dog
@@thestormcall3r861 funny we will see operation baby dog part 2 when lightfall released
3:10 I got goosebumps when I heard "Elegy" in the background of this cutscene. Makes me wonder, if it were any of the other Iron Lords in Saladin's position, would they have made the same choice?
I feel they would, but just like Lord Saladin I have no doubt several if not all of them would’ve been against the alliance to begin with. Thanks to Commander Zavala, the Young Wolf (at least by narrative), even Savathun (as Osiris), he eventually came to view the whole thing differently. Had the Iron Lords still been around, I’m sure they’d all need some convincing since we all know they’re men and women of action, not words…
I am surprised he did. Saladin is the mist racist of the old warlords. That he would offer himself to the Cabal is surprising.
you can tell zavala was pissed
If Saladin leads a Cabal army.. it should be called the Iron Legion !
Somebody get this guy on the writing team , before this idea goes to waste.
Eh he already has a Name for His Legion the iron War beast's But Iron Legion is still good
The Crow: Zavala, you can't...
Zavala: Not. A word.
Uff, that is a strong repeat
Agreed
I mean after he pulled that stunt he better shut the hell up for a long time. Only Saladin's wisdom avoided a political catastrophe.
Hating our enemy is one thing. But losing sight of who we are is more
Doing some literal skulduggery to the Hive is *peanuts* compared the truly horrific shit the Hive has done to not only Guardians, but every other "interesting" race they've come across.
At best, this is an eye for an eye. Although in the case of the Hive, I'd say they still owe one.
To destroy evil, sometimes you have to USE evil....
That's stupid. Kill everything that opposes you or fall under their boot
Nah. FUCK the hive
Everyone shaking their head gonna be real confused when we team up with Hive Guardians later.
That's what I'm saying the darkness is going to be to powerful for us to fight alone, so we will let Dady Amru revive savathun and, we will all fight the witness together. Or the traveler will dip out and, we will be the only one left with the light since we are tied to the shard in the edz and not the traveler. Either way can wait for lightfalls
I'm so glad I'm not the only who's realized it.
nah
Yeah still not really
Spoilers
The lucent hive mostly just do what they want or what feels right. That does include some helping us like Luzaku or the knight/acolyte in the excision mission. We do have a couple lucent hive allies but majority of them are still hostile just because
I want a strike where Saladin is the main guy who gives us objectives now.
Its actually kind of hilarious how the Darkness turned Guardians against each other because of our own entitlement to the light. You're either POWERED BY Light ( *NOT* the other way around) and respect its power and its philosophy or you can succumb to your own selfish *NEEDS* and Join the Darkness or you can be mortal. Mere food for the darkness to consume.
Poor crow. He has such a bleeding heart
LMAO "You understa" NOPE
Ayo Zavala was ready to throw hands yall see him charging that arc energy
He was about to jump and punch caital in the back of the head
Though misguided and distraught, Crow sought to be honorable.
I have high hopes for him as a member of the Vanguard.
Welp this aged well
I was originally annoyed that we weren't present during this scene. But now that I think about it, that was probably a good thing. I know I wouldn't have let Caiatl take a step towards Crow before unleashing my super. Dont get me wrong I love her character. But no one touches Crow while the YW is around. Good job Zavala and your newly found backbone. Saladin thank you for reminding me how much I love and respect you. Proud to be an Iron Lord
I mean same here, Crow isy Guardians best buddy. Someone has to fill the void Cayde left behind. In my eyes Crow's decision was justified, but Saladin also makes a very good point. Remember the saying, the road to hell is paved with good intentions.
Also, technically we "own" Crow since Spider let us take him. So, from that perspective Caiatl would be messing with the merchandise lol.
@@Theaveragegamer_12 absolutely. I mean no one will ever replace cayde but we need someone to care about like him. We got our revenge. Uldren Sov is dead. Crow is a new light that deserves a chance, especially after what he's been through since his awakening.
I still find it strange to think, I was one of the few that saw his revival and joked about killing him over and over again. But when we met crow, it was clear he didnt deserve that.
Same imho.
Caiatl would have found herself tethered to my Shadowshot, impaled on a thousand solar blades, beaten and electrified by Arc Staff…..then stabbed with Silence and Squall.
I would’ve let her, he killed an emissary and ally while he couldn’t fight back. I like Crow but that can’t go unpunished.
@@unionblue21You make it sound like he intentionally killed the Psion in cold blood when all he was trying to do was stop the machine…
To think, if Caiatl killed Crow here, we would be powerless to stop the Final Shape from coming to pass…
She would have to destroy his ghost
"I understand. "
*A light shines down upon me*
"Because I believe your the next Speaker! Yes! A perfect fit!"
Still not going to happen.
Caital was 2 steps away from getting Thundercrashed
Caiatl has no idea who she just put on her war counsel. She's only heard stories, now she will understand just how true they are. Saladin is about to become a Primus lmaooooo
I'm not surprised so many people giving Crow crap for this. I don't disagree with what Crow did.
I understand to a point why hive are being used like this.
That's how it starts though. A little bit of this, a bit of that. And by the time you're done, you've become the enemy.
A lot of people really don't get why there are agreed rules in wars. Even though the very concept itself is a joke.
I completely disagree because you're a freakin butthole - said Crow.
I think you are right on that. I don’t think the vanguard should get comfortable at torturing prisoners for experiments even if they are the hive.
I know right, they actually forget thats how " The Thorn " became to be , first , using your enemy guns against them and when You realize , You already became something else.
Just saying these hive were intentionally stealing light from other guardians, so they were not showing mercy. Plus it’s savathun, you need to find a advantage even if it’s not always the right path
The Lucent Hive were literally harvesting light from guardians and I doubt they were quick about it. You can find their corpses scattered about certain battlegrounds so forgive me if I’m not broken up about what we did. Regardless we needed the intel from them and what we did was extremely effective at doing that. Pretty much everyone agreed with Crows perspective that it felt wrong even the Psion he kills did. Crow jeopardized an alliance and risked war with the Cabal again because he couldn’t grasp the Hive didn’t deserve his mercy when it risked others. Honestly Saladin joining Caiatl’s war council magically making her forget what Crow had done is such bad writing. The Psion was a personal old friend of hers and she just forgets that as soon as Saladin offers to join her.
Reading some of these comments... A lot of you guardians would have been a lot more at home during the dark times as risen warlords...
What I wouldn’t give to have been amongst the Iron Lords of that time!
most of the people in this comment section would absolutely be warlords if given a chance holy shit
Zavala was ready to Thundercrash lol 😂😂😂
The lore tab for when Crow shut it down is brutally violent and detailed. It basically scrambled the Psion's brain. And Crow could actually feel the Psion suffering as it happened, calling out for help; for it to stop.
I do feel bad for the hive that were part of the experiment, but I also think the way the Psion went out was tragic and painful. Funny how Crow has since pretty much reverted back into Uldren's old ways. [Spoilers] The death of a certain character is definitely gonna mess him up.
Who is this character that died?
@@GHefly445spoiler but go down
Amanda she sacrificed herself to save some prisoners it was heartbreaking especially when Zavala grieved her death he was kneeling next to her coffin crying
lmao furry
also yeah i remember being sad and shocked after reading that tab. was soooo mad at crow
I can’t wait to see Saladin decked out in a full Cabal war suit
He would be the guy to wield 2 Kabal severus cleavers.
Crow: "You understand... Don't you?"
Guardian: *viciously shakes his head*
What i think is gonna happen is that we recruit our old enemies to fight the witness,
Hive, cabal, fallen, and vex. And we fight the taken, scorn and maybe eramis and the witness. As we already know the light has given old enemies our light, such as crow and hive, but the fallen used to have the light so they wish they could earn it back.
Krill, Cabal, Vex, Eliksni. Mystical Arts, Military Strength, Mechanical Arsenal, Masterful Plunderers
@@Zynet_Eseled ya already know
Nah they gonna ressurect cayde as a bad guy and he's gonna be right under the witness with unlimited darkness gun.
The fallen didn't have the Light, they only got more food and wealth via the Traveler's power to boost technology and terraform barren planets
@@Di_616 thats using it not like guardian use
Maybe Crow should have asked the psion how to turn the machine off properly.
Murder is built into this man's subconscience. 😂
Well, that's what happens when you're uploaded with an entire lifetime's worth of memories from your previous identity. Imagine the guilt on his shoulders. Imagine a Guardian that was a serial killer in their past life suddenly got those memories back, you bet they're gonna get depressed and try to be overly good.
Your consciousness can't get the better over you in war. There is a council for a reason, they know more about what's going on than you, you cannot overwrite it because you beleive it to be morally right, especially because you feel "me too". Crow not getting any form of real punishment is wack. He put lots of guardians lives in danger for the sake of "not all hive" and at the cost of a Innocent friendly unit, and his guilt. Crow better get his shit together.
Doing shit like that makes us no better then the hive which is Crows point. Yeah today it's just us ripping the mind and sense of self from the hive. But what about tomorrow when it's something else? When does it stop? When are we considered the bad guys for such horrific actions? How many necessary evils before it's just evil? It's important to set a principle less you become the very monsters you hoped to destroy. Let's also not ignore the fact the Hive are victims just as much as anyone else, maybe even more so.
With all do respect they’re in a time of war but there are still rules of war. Torturing prisoners is one of them. You don’t torture or experiment on prisoners of war. You either detain them for negotiation to send them back, kill them, or permanently incarcerate them. And that’s according to the Geneva convention. This is a game yes but what he did was MORALLY right. No matter what the hive has done to assume that all hive is the same is inherently wrong. And the lightbearers have proven that they’re not the same as regular hive either with the ability to communicate and understand. To torture them for fighting a war for their people is how you instill a deep seated hatred. Killing is a natural and accept occurrence in war torture isn’t.
@@acecun6202Except what Crow did is also a war crime. He killed an unarmed emissary.
2:16 This cutscene is great. Love Caiatl.
i can't believe saladin left his axe and crest behind..
Yeah he should uhh...give it to me.
@@draysmusicalshtposts6340 DIBS.. nah soz too late :D
It was a gift
"What the Vanguard was doing here wasn't right-"
"IT'S NOT YOUR PLACE TO JUDGE!"
Damn, that made me laugh
We get a cool black character and now he a slave we can’t have shit in this game 😭
We still have ikora
Slave? He's on the council kicking ass like always
@@Youcancallmeishmaell real
Lmaoo💀
😭
Crow needs to hear of what the hive did to eris' fireteam
Caital demanding a life for a life for the Psion goes to show how rad she is. Cabal or Psion your life is valued under her watch. Psion guards watching we’re probably like “Damn, your my empress alright.”
Bracus Forge sounds pretty cool ngl
Caital got one hell of a deal. The life of 1 psion for the servitude of an iron lord? Gawdayum
Well, to be fair that Psion was one of her close personal friends and a key figure in her retaining Psion loyalties to her cause.
Looks like Saladin is going to have new wolves but bigger wolves that is, imagine Cabal with green iron banner colors and armor that also have pet wolves with them too, that would be cool to see
"you understand, don't you?"
my guy, like Saladin, I'd be cracking these open like they were eggs and I'm trying to make a cake. Break open, empty the ammo and engrams out, throw out the shell, repeat.
Saladin is like Destiny's Batman
Hey this is new to me! I quit year 2 of D2 and am catching up on lore.
When he say u understand don't you his head move and say nop I don't sorry
damn. we lost a war hero at the cost of a emo with the identity crisis and having a major hate by guardian community. can't we replace the Hunter Dare with Efrideet or something?
Ain't she retired or something? As for Saladin's "departure", the alliance is much stronger for it. Caiatl gets to see just how effective Salad man is, and, we get some extremely well trained Cabal on our side.
@@Theaveragegamer_12 •~• human trained cabal is worse than cabal trained cabal.
Saladin, forever my favorite
Spoiler alert of D2 Theory ending: all the alien races we face in the past will be our allies in a near future in other to fight a great evil, The witness!!!
(Spoilers)
I can see this. I mean we have a hive ghost as our ally, so I can see some of the hive light bearers turning away from the rest of the hive seeing as how the darkness brainwashed savathun and changed her memories to get her to fight the traveler and humanity instead of helping each ither fight the darkness. And I fully believe we will end up fighting renegade guardians who strayed to far into the darkness as well.
@@nicholasprutzman9915 I would kill to have the opportunity to grant one of these factions our light. I just wanna play as an Eliksni Guardian. Very badly.
Now we just need the vex
i mean, you were sorta right. sorta
Forgetting who you are. Why you do what you do. That's how you fall to the darkness.
The light is the path of sacrifice. Giving your all protect what matters.
To be selfish and forget your morality to win is how you collapse from the inside. Just this shows exactly how world's break. All it takes is panic and desperation. A desire to survive and win so strong you cross lines. Line that break you down from within. Before you know it you've gone so far you'll find yourself alone and bitter with nobody but the darkness to comfort you.
The hive may have a chance for redemption. But we won't know if we cross so many lines it can never happen.
I think this seasons story was the most tense. It really felt like it was 100% here and nothing was done without reason.
I love how you also shook your character like I did when crow tried too tell me I understood.
Honestly, if it weren't for Crow's actions here the alliance between Caiatl and the Vanguard would be shaky at best. Saladin is our best connection to the war room which makes strategizing even easier. And from what we've seen over the seasons we've only grown closer with our Cabal allies. Heck, there's even a Cabal version of Iron Banner, so many more badass Cabal to assist in the battlefield.
Did I agree with Crow at first? Obviously not, but looking at the bigger picture and where we're at now, we benefitted from this.
I'm more pissed that Lord Saladin left his Axe and medallion for Crow.
You are literally the most murder happy person in the galaxy your guardian definitely dosen't understand
Saladin has a pretty good gig now. Gets to beat the shit out of Cabal warriors and be praised and promoted for it. As far as I'm aware, he's gone from mere Bracus to Valus. Soon enough he'll be Dominus Forge.
Saladin is the closest thing we have to master chief in destiny
Not even close. Master chief would have thrown down saint 14 is way more master chief than saladman
@@giraffesushi8112 not talking about a fight talking about how he acts
Because of this shit I don't trust Crow anymore. One day he'll wake up and have another great idea. This little incident almost put the City at war with the Cabal Empire again, just after having struck such a fragile alliance.
Considering you and ethos comment just recently you prob haven’t played the latest story yet crow is indeed getting darker and reverting back to his ways as uldren sob which I honestly don’t blame him since the witness forces killed one of our beloved members one person that crow was just reconciling with and the closest he was to
The nodding no 😭
You understand don’t you. Guardian nodding no 💀
Even from a game, we still learn life lessons. Saladin, you are one wise old wolf
The shaking of no! lol
I have a lot of things going on in my life that make me a lot like crow, and I side with him on this.
Psychological warfare is unacceptable, even against the hive. If we torture our prisoners for what they did to us, we are nk better than them.
Sure, what Crow did was a hasty decision, but his heart was in the right place.
That matters more than mistakes, and we should remember that he did what he believed was right, even if he probably shouldn't have.
Lucent Hive haven't even actually done anything bad to us that we didn't thwart. They're losing their appetite and need for carnage and murder to sate their worms, and their leader's one big ploy (to keep The Traveler safe, mind you) was foiled.
Sava2n was misguided, enigmatic, kinda stupid and edgy, but she's no longer the Savathun we know
@@SeanCrosser Exactly
Yeah I'm gonna have to disagree, given that the hive are an omnicidal race bent on proving their "superiority" by eating civilizations. Torturing a few hive, who already don't abide by any "rules of war" that everyone keeps going on about, so that the entire rest of the universe can survive is definitely worth it
@@APennyForYourThoughts835 If we torture people because they only exist to kill, there is nothing stopping us from doing the same thing to people who don't.
And other people might compare us to those we torture and see us as no better than them.
Yeah forgive me if I don’t feel sympathy for the Hive. Especially the Lucent Hive who were harvesting light from guardians. Crow put his morals before anyone else and jeopardized not only himself but the entire last city risking the alliance.
Saladin being the only Titan to wear a cloak is fucking awesome.
Coming back to it, you kind of think if lord salad had this plan for a while, and if it was to give humanity a side by side view with the Cabal.
Us when he says "You... understand...? don't you?"
And we just shake our head no🤣
It made me laugh🤣😂
My mom is going to kill me😭
The fuckin music in this game is so good
Me and about 99 percent of destiny leaving a genocidal amount of numbers: honestly yeah I get it
I don't hear from Saladin nearly enough but I was today years old when I realized he was voiced by the same guy as Reaper from Overwatch.
2:58 Woohoo Hail Mary! 🥳🤠🤠 Thunder Crash!
Still waiting on Bungie to let titan's get a bitchin cape like Saladin, just the one. I'd transmog that onto every piece of armor I own. I want it so bad.
Love this coming full circle with crow being able to wield the Iron banner axe
Bracus Forge...I am not gonna lie, that's kind of a cool name.
To be able to lead your own army of cabal. I would do the same thing.
The drama during this season was MMMMMMM
Looking back and knowing about arc 3.0 zavala was about to thunderclap those cheeks
The last time I was furious with crow was when he killed cayde. Like, this dude is just built on the foundation of stupidity.
And you sound like your built on a foundation of bias. Also it wasn’t Crow that killed Cayde.
To be fair that was uldren so that was more uldren being a total asshole than stupid
You know I never liked real-time scripted “cutscenes” just feels kinda weird to be holding a gun while peeps argue without noticing your presence
I freaking love this game!!! I love being a hunter
Love that Zavala was ready to throw hands
“You understand, don’t you?” *shaking his head nooope*
@4:45 me asking my mom why she made me vacuum the room on my day off
Man I loved the idea of all the destiny 2 factions iron wolf being one of them.
apparently I am not a homie.
Dammit crow… thanks a lot for losing us a better character but the moment caital does something to him… i’m bathing each and every cabal in a baptism of inferno. And she will be the last.
you dont play much these day do ya lmao
@@FolfahYeah…something tells me that they haven’t played the game in a long time XD
I love 1:30 when he just shakes his head
What would Crow do without Saladin to save his ass?
Wow saladin is such a badass
1:28 I literally said “nope” outloud and he started shaking his head, it was so funny
>Is here after Savathun and the Lucent Hive fought alongside us to merc the Witness.
So yeah, I’m starting to think Crow had a point here.
We kill gods for fun why would we be afraid of some random cabal leader?
The light can only do so much against an orbital bombardment
@@Three3Phase I mean we did survive one during the red war. And besides our ghost would survive (probably) and we'd be ok
Ngl I was really hoping saladman was going to at least smack the shit out of crow. I was disappointed and my play session was ruined