Rewatching this talk for probably the 3rd time. There's so much gold here. We employed this strategy in a basic way to our early access updates in Subnautica and it helped us grow so much and our players loved it! Looking forward to going much further with these ideas.
1:56 One Day İf you read my comment : ) 200 K Players Peak Heavy Second Make Great Class Again Update. ! +1 Heavy Second Update. ! +1 Biggest Major Update. ! +1
"Bad communication is worse than none" The whole diretide mess was 100% due to no communication, players just wanted to know if there would be an event, either way.
You're both wrong, Valve DID say on a tweet that there was going to be no diretide that year, the problem was they didn't say it was because of a bigger update. It isn't all Valve's fault though, the player base raged like a bunch of spoiled children simply because Valve said they weren't working on diretide. An absolutely rotten community.
***** pretty sure the tweet you're talking about was by CyborgMatt who isn't an official valve employee and he didn't tweet such until after the community's meltdown was well under way
Valve, on behalf of all TF2 players around the world; please please please increase the funding for their development team, and give them like 1000000x more team members (or double their team..). The game has a LOT of potential, we just need a big team with adequate funding so they can make it happen!!
Watch Uncle Dane's new video. It's mym part 5. I don't think doubling their team will do any good if the team doesn't care for tf2. They need to hand tf2 off to Bad Robot (PASS TIME GAMEMODE) or Hidden Path Entertainment (the company who made csgo matchmaking). OR hire the people who are behind community updates, basically, people who play/care/know what tf2 needs.
Nice how they completely avoid the point that gamers are vicious, negative fundamentalists that will find a reason to hate you in anything you post, unless you hit the right note in which case they will worship you.
You think gamers are bad? Cute. I bet you've never dealt with fangirls of One Direction. Wait.. that post is from two years ago...ha! It's easy for anyone to hate (than to love), but I think only fanboys/girls of a series and "hardcore" gamers could be described as "fundamentalist". The rest are just shitposting trolls taking you for a ride since you respond to them.
1:56 One Day İf you read my comment : ) 200 K Players Peak Heavy Second Make Great Class Again Update. ! +1 Heavy Second Update. ! +1 Biggest Major Update. ! +1
It truly feels like every single person involved in Team Fortress 2 in any way was an absolute genius in their respective specialty. What a masterpiece of a game from top to bottom, from gameplay to marketing.
I may be the only guy in the comments that actually agree on Valve's communication philosophy. Whatever everyone else say, they haven't put incredible results like these guys made with that little resources they had.
This all sounds very well thought out, but please realise how insanely frustrating it is as a paying customer to experience bugs and glitches that has been in a product for months or even years, without having any word from the developers wether it's being looked into or not. It'd be a huge help to even get a confirmation from Valve that they're even aware of some of the issues. You guys have the worst customer interaction out of pretty much any big company out there.
"We listen to people when they think we are not there." Yes... because getting your information from forums full of trolls is a great idea and ignoring people who talk to you face to face is a greater idea. Just ask blizzard how that worked out? Players are greatly enjoying warlords of draenor. It's like what every core WoW player desired as an expansion, just look at the subscriber numbers soaring into the next galaxy.
thanks Robin, rather than work passionately for a game you created, you exploited it as a guinea pig for larger IP, to discover "economics" and the free-to-plau=y model, effectively abandoning the game you created. Real proud.
Actually it's people like you who stirred this shit up. They NEVER SAID IT WAS GOING TO BE AN ANNUAL EVENT. The word "annual" on their Diretide page was referring to what happens annually LORE-WISE. Reading is hard it seems.
1:56 One Day İf you read my comment : ) 200 K Players Peak Heavy Second Make Great Class Again Update. ! +1 Heavy Second Update. ! +1 Biggest Major Update. ! +1
You shouldn't trust everything you see on the internet. Dane didn't reserch and messed up. Check thr comments and the reddit post to see how much he missed.
So is riccochet 2 going to be a "game service"? Is that why there's so much hesitation? Valve doesn't know how to make hl3 a game service which Gabe may have eluded to in the two nerdist podcasts he did.
DispatchAsyncEvent backlog, failed to dispatch all this frame. DispatchAsyncEvent backlog, failed to dispatch all this frame. DispatchAsyncEvent backlog, failed to dispatch all this frame. DispatchAsyncEvent backlog, failed to dispatch all this frame. Looking for a bug to maybe just maybe look into? This here might just be what you're looking for.
customers don't change the product. we beta test it these days. devs go one way with it and do not listen to the community there is no communication. You will see some super rare games where a dev will chat in the forums but that is so rare its almost none existent. then you have games where devs only look at what pros do and make changes for/from pros. this is where everything goes wrong. not taking a whole from the community not just from one side. then you see all these mods after the game comes out and surprisingly runs slighter better than before. then you have half baked games that no one understands why it even got out. then you got half baked games with half the content and more dlc that should of just been included in the game. if you guys have not seen what they did with Killer instinct. oh my. xboxone has kill instinct, game is out i go buy it. thinking hmmm i should at least have a story mode and all the basic characters. noooooooooope half the character roster, ai gets to use them. dah hell is that shit. then you dont even get any of the story modes. all dlc!!!!! wtf seriously. just bad for anyone who buys consoles these days.
1:56 One Day İf you read my comment : ) 200 K Players Peak Heavy Second Make Great Class Again Update. ! +1 Heavy Second Update. ! +1 Biggest Major Update. ! +1
What valve should be doing: Community: "Hey there's an issue with this" Volvo: "We can't fix this shit because *[reasons]*" Community: "Ok thanks" ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- What volvo does instead: Community: "Hey there is an issue here" Community: "Yo volvo u there" Community: "Ok they're dead and don't care about the game" Volvo: "Here's a revolver and some skins" Community: "Did you even test this, you can oneshot people in the stomach" Community: "Hello volvo u there?" Volvo: "We fixed a bunch of issues" Community: "Ok that's cool but why didn't you say earlier that it was being looked into or something"
I really want to watch this video, I'm fascinated by the subject, but this guy cannot stop saying "um". It's impossible to focus on what he's saying. Guess I'll try again another day.
Rewatching this talk for probably the 3rd time. There's so much gold here.
We employed this strategy in a basic way to our early access updates in Subnautica and it helped us grow so much and our players loved it! Looking forward to going much further with these ideas.
Subnautica was great, played since early access!
I've heard a lot about Subanutica, is it any good?
Just came here following your mention of this video on Designer Notes podcast with Soren. Thanks for the tip off Charlie! Excellent!
Brilliant. Hoping I get to use some gems of knowledge from this talk some day myself.
1) Valve
2) Communication
Pick one.
+mAGNUS wAKER Only 2) - episode 1
Valve nowadays probably has insane communication with bug patches being released within hours for games like dota and csgo
+carl powelson "within hours" LOL
Ammy Have you actually played Dota lately? Bug gets reported on Reddit, hits frontpage, next day it gets patched.
+carl powelson CSGO gets an update maybe once a month..maybe.
Thanks Uncle Dane for the link.
yes thank you Uncle Dane
yee
1:56 One Day İf you read my comment : ) 200 K Players Peak Heavy Second Make Great Class Again Update. ! +1 Heavy Second Update. ! +1 Biggest Major Update. ! +1
As a dev who is just now learning the whole marketing and PR side of things, this video is incredibly valuable. Thanks Valve!
No, this is very bad advice.
@@SpaghettiToaster lol angry nerd
"Bad communication is worse than none" The whole diretide mess was 100% due to no communication, players just wanted to know if there would be an event, either way.
if they had just said "no diretide this year because there is a different update coming soon" everything would have been avoided
You're both wrong, Valve DID say on a tweet that there was going to be no diretide that year, the problem was they didn't say it was because of a bigger update. It isn't all Valve's fault though, the player base raged like a bunch of spoiled children simply because Valve said they weren't working on diretide. An absolutely rotten community.
*****
pretty sure the tweet you're talking about was by CyborgMatt who isn't an official valve employee and he didn't tweet such until after the community's meltdown was well under way
Peter Vescro Ah you're right, it was by Cyborgmatt, my apologies, though I'm pretty sure that tweet was what kickstarted the community's meltdown.
Valve, on behalf of all TF2 players around the world; please please please increase the funding for their development team, and give them like 1000000x more team members (or double their team..).
The game has a LOT of potential, we just need a big team with adequate funding so they can make it happen!!
yep
Watch Uncle Dane's new video. It's mym part 5. I don't think doubling their team will do any good if the team doesn't care for tf2. They need to hand tf2 off to Bad Robot (PASS TIME GAMEMODE) or Hidden Path Entertainment (the company who made csgo matchmaking). OR hire the people who are behind community updates, basically, people who play/care/know what tf2 needs.
hahaha
Yea
Sorry for laughing at you. Sorry for laughing at you.
Nice how they completely avoid the point that gamers are vicious, negative fundamentalists that will find a reason to hate you in anything you post, unless you hit the right note in which case they will worship you.
+GewoonDaan Changed a gun's stats in a Call of Duty game? Enjoy having your Twitter drown in death threats!
You think gamers are bad? Cute. I bet you've never dealt with fangirls of One Direction.
Wait.. that post is from two years ago...ha!
It's easy for anyone to hate (than to love), but I think only fanboys/girls of a series and "hardcore" gamers could be described as "fundamentalist".
The rest are just shitposting trolls taking you for a ride since you respond to them.
I thought that the microphone was a giant mole for a second.
+Innos MOLEY MOLEY MOLEY MOLEY MOLEY MOLEY
+tylerboy565 lmfao if you know where this is from, you're now consider old
GraffyV fuck
+GraffyV but I know that and I'm only 17 ;-;
a lmfoa im only 20. and I feel old
I bet the guys who got the sales boost after their communication were the Tripewire Team. Also TWO years of hinting the Mann vs Machine o.O
Hey Robin, I'll trade you the Valve Rocket Launcher for a sun on a stick
...and he never responded
1:56 One Day İf you read my comment : ) 200 K Players Peak Heavy Second Make Great Class Again Update. ! +1 Heavy Second Update. ! +1 Biggest Major Update. ! +1
It truly feels like every single person involved in Team Fortress 2 in any way was an absolute genius in their respective specialty. What a masterpiece of a game from top to bottom, from gameplay to marketing.
How tf2 is successful: Not communication. Instead don't do anything and have community devs do all of the good work for you.
Valve also has other work to do, so its not rly a big issue to let community to do that stuff
It kinda reminds how Linux works
I may be the only guy in the comments that actually agree on Valve's communication philosophy. Whatever everyone else say, they haven't put incredible results like these guys made with that little resources they had.
This all sounds very well thought out, but please realise how insanely frustrating it is as a paying customer to experience bugs and glitches that has been in a product for months or even years, without having any word from the developers wether it's being looked into or not. It'd be a huge help to even get a confirmation from Valve that they're even aware of some of the issues. You guys have the worst customer interaction out of pretty much any big company out there.
This is so sad to read knowing it was 6 years ago considering how things are now
8 years ago you were dumb and today you still are a dumbo
Thank you Tyler
We have been jebaited
And because I seem to be the most prolific consumer of this video...now we're looking at doing this on Moonbreaker as well.
all these Steam Dev Days talks are so awesome :D
"We listen to people when they think we are not there."
Yes... because getting your information from forums full of trolls is a great idea and ignoring people who talk to you face to face is a greater idea.
Just ask blizzard how that worked out? Players are greatly enjoying warlords of draenor. It's like what every core WoW player desired as an expansion, just look at the subscriber numbers soaring into the next galaxy.
thanks Robin, rather than work passionately for a game you created, you exploited it as a guinea pig for larger IP, to discover "economics" and the free-to-plau=y model, effectively abandoning the game you created.
Real proud.
This would apply if Valve communicated, period.
Yeah I don't think he should use the word "communicate," seeing as what he's trying to say is they don't speak, but they listen to the community.
Diretide was definitely a communication failure. If it hadn't been pitched as an annual thing in 2012, nobody would have asked for it in 2013
Actually it's people like you who stirred this shit up. They NEVER SAID IT WAS GOING TO BE AN ANNUAL EVENT. The word "annual" on their Diretide page was referring to what happens annually LORE-WISE. Reading is hard it seems.
35:40 so like the Bison 'bug' fix that you even mentioned as a hint on your load screens?
Ankle dane is a real gud sentry main
1:56 One Day İf you read my comment : ) 200 K Players Peak Heavy Second Make Great Class Again Update. ! +1 Heavy Second Update. ! +1 Biggest Major Update. ! +1
lol 1-2 month major updates......if only
Imagine
At around 37 minutes, Robin pretty much confirms Half-Life 3 with his comment of not publicly talking about a 5 year project they're making.
And now we know it because of the Final hours of Half Life: Alyx. What a time to be alive!
robin walker : TF2 Director
(Game as service)
NO UPDATE IN FUCKING 3 YEARS
rip old valve
Give the development to Hidden Path. Now.
Did uncle Dane send you here?
Maybe....Yes.
And you know that Hidden Path did a terrible job with CS:GO and Valve had to fix what they fucked up?
Really? that's not what uncle dane said. I'm gonna have this clarified...
You shouldn't trust everything you see on the internet. Dane didn't reserch and messed up. Check thr comments and the reddit post to see how much he missed.
at first i thought why is this guys mic cushion so high on his cheek..realized its not a mic cushion lol :(
+Jose Aguirre It is though, you can see it's stem behind it.
+Will Sankey hey screw you haha my work computer wifi is shit i had to use 240p lol
Yeah the TF2 team need to start actually following this philosophy because the Beta is gone and SPUF is ignored.
Woah woah wait... When YOU made Counterstrike classic? Jussayin
26:54 unintended communication AKA leaks
There's a MOLE at Team Fortress!
So is riccochet 2 going to be a "game service"? Is that why there's so much hesitation? Valve doesn't know how to make hl3 a game service which Gabe may have eluded to in the two nerdist podcasts he did.
Roses are red,
Voilets are blu,
I'm here cuz of Dane,
And you are too
how did you know my big brother told me to look at this video....
Jessica is that you? you said wed me at fridays whyd you stand me up
DispatchAsyncEvent backlog, failed to dispatch all this frame.
DispatchAsyncEvent backlog, failed to dispatch all this frame.
DispatchAsyncEvent backlog, failed to dispatch all this frame.
DispatchAsyncEvent backlog, failed to dispatch all this frame.
Looking for a bug to maybe just maybe look into?
This here might just be what you're looking for.
customers don't change the product. we beta test it these days. devs go one way with it and do not listen to the community
there is no communication. You will see some super rare games where a dev will chat in the forums but that is so rare its almost none existent. then you have games where devs only look at what pros do and make changes for/from pros. this is where everything goes wrong. not taking a whole from the community not just from one side. then you see all these mods after the game comes out and surprisingly runs slighter better than before. then you have half baked games that no one understands why it even got out. then you got half baked games with half the content and more dlc that should of just been included in the game. if you guys have not seen what they did with Killer instinct. oh my. xboxone has kill instinct, game is out i go buy it. thinking hmmm i should at least have a story mode and all the basic characters. noooooooooope half the character roster, ai gets to use them. dah hell is that shit. then you dont even get any of the story modes.
all dlc!!!!! wtf seriously. just bad for anyone who buys consoles these days.
Came from 3kliksphilip
Valve are fucking geniuses.
some real science here
This announcement has aged poorly.
1:56 One Day İf you read my comment : ) 200 K Players Peak Heavy Second Make Great Class Again Update. ! +1 Heavy Second Update. ! +1 Biggest Major Update. ! +1
Everyone here is from uncel dan da verry gud engie man's video xD
OPTIMIZE THE GOD DAMN TF2
BRING US BACK THE OLD TF2
THE MEAT VS MATCH (MEET YOUR MATCH) RUINED EVERYTHING
WHERES MY HEAVY UPDATE!?
15:50 meanwhile dota patches are too huge to digest
Here 4 views after 3kliksphillip mentioned it in his latest video.
:)
What valve should be doing: Community: "Hey there's an issue with this"
Volvo: "We can't fix this shit because *[reasons]*"
Community: "Ok thanks"
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
What volvo does instead: Community: "Hey there is an issue here"
Community: "Yo volvo u there"
Community: "Ok they're dead and don't care about the game"
Volvo: "Here's a revolver and some skins"
Community: "Did you even test this, you can oneshot people in the stomach"
Community: "Hello volvo u there?"
Volvo: "We fixed a bunch of issues"
Community: "Ok that's cool but why didn't you say earlier that it was being looked into or something"
gives us more TF2 weapons Robin you dum-dum!
gum-gum
No, TF2 does not need new weapons, it needs all of the bugs fixed, first.
I really want to watch this video, I'm fascinated by the subject, but this guy cannot stop saying "um". It's impossible to focus on what he's saying. Guess I'll try again another day.
*34:25 in 6 months. *
>0 marketing expenditure
I sometimes hate valve
40:19 = lies
Valve help TF2 plz
K?
K.
HOW2EARN MONEY = ADD NEW HATS AND NEW HATS AND NEW HATS AND FU** THE FPS
also add items or reskins that reference other games
Hat describing contest........
OPERATION?? SOURCE 2??????
External communication part is bullshit, it wouldn't be if you actually TALKED ON ANYTHING.
Yay ... here's to free speech!!!
SO bad actually