I love Jon's ability to just sit there and listen. No need to interrupt every 30 seconds with something. It really speaks to his acting abilities, because his natural demeanor is a complete 180 of the characters he usually plays. And let's give it up for Bam Bam. He knew she needed some doggo love, and he just lied down right next to her to make her feel warm and welcomed.
Exactly m8. But I love the look of John Berenthal at minute 2:20, where Sarah is talking about the way she was humiliated. Oh Man...that's some PUNISHER look and mindset right there. 😅
yeah pretty much all I had seen of Jon before watching this was his role as Shane in TWD, and I just sort of saw him as this aggressive, testosterone-fuelled man. After watching this, I gained a lot of respect for him. I feel that he asked great questions and as you say was a great listener. He does seem testosterone-fuelled to me but I think he is well levelled, and down to earth which I respect so much. He is always who he is, and that is a quality that is so rare in society
I find it annoying when ppl overly say whatever words acknowledging they are listening but he shook his head and that seemed way more respectful in my opinion.
Please have more people on from walking dead. It’s so interesting to see what really went on behind the scenes. Steven Yuen, Norman Reedus, Irone Singleton, other OG’s from the beginning. Much love! (Beautiful interview btw)
I remember seeing 2-girls, 1-cup when this was new too back then... haven't really seen it since (it's horrible, who would keep watching it?). So I had to pull it up again because hell if I remember what the girls looked like. I think they were just fucking with Sarah in a non-mean way because she *DOESN'T* look like either girl. Far from it.
I love that she said that. I am like that and people just don't get it. I can't even imagine what that must have felt like, truly gross anyone would treat someone that way.
Literally, the way that Sarah carried herself in this interview really impressed me. She dealt with her trauma and understood that telling these stories could help people outside. She's right in what she said, and her definition of loyalty should honestly be the same for everyone. This episode is genuinely one of my favourites since finding it, so I hope I can get Patreon and watch the full thing soon
@@AlexB-pp7dc you have never been through that, so don’t act like you understand even slightly. She’s allowed to be upset and annoyed by stupid comments made by disgusting men 🤷♀️
Every time I see SWC speak or have read something she’s posted, she is always so thought provoking. I think so many times fans just see an actor or actress and see money, fame and comfort. People never stop to think that they could actually be experiencing the same things we do in everyday life and job. I hate that she had to deal with that and at the end of day, she carried the luggage for that. I am so thankful that she moved on and was able to go on working and loving life. I find Sarah to be inspirational in so many ways. Thanks for sharing this!
Just found out this podcast existed today and couldn’t agree with you more. Rarely do you see celebrities talk this openly about the business and it’s even more rare for them to be as good at expressing themselves as these 2.
This is the reason men don't want to include women in their group, anything could offend them or upset them. Those men made the mistake of considering her as a part of their group and forgot that she is a woman. "Men socialize by insulting each other but they really don't mean it. Women socialize by complimenting each other, they don't mean it either".
Jon is so humble and down to earth. The true nature of a star is within, it's not the glitz and glamour but how you know the true nature of your influence and connect with people. Jon is one of those few celebs that's absolutely based irl.
I’ve really enjoyed Sarah’s work since Prison Break. She has such a kind and down to earth demeanor about her that makes her feel very relatable. It makes me sad she had to deal with childish garbage while working on that set. It is shocking how the mob mentality manifests in people who would never act that way on their own.
One of the bravest confessions of a person I’ve ever heard. Bravo Sarah, you are a very strong woman for confronting that. Kudos as well to Jonny B for having your back.
@@Morrow45105 Usually people who get triggered by women speaking out are usually guilty of something sexist themselves and hate being called out for it, it's best to just keep to yourself, you're not as anonymous as you think, no one is.
@@thedarkapex5327 usually ppl who are honest have a hard time not calling bullshit when they see it. You should try it. Though I’m guessing you’re not capable of it…
@@thedarkapex5327 gta love the subtle threat you made though….uh oh the woke police are here!!! 👮♀️ RUN EVERYBODY RUN!! Keep your mouths shut or else they’ll cancel you!!
Such a brave interview by Sarah to call all this out, but also good to hear that Jon and Andrew are the kind of people who won't accept that on set, not that I could ever doubt that. You can see the frustration and quiet anger in Jon's face early on when Sarah's talking about it that he's just pissed he couldn't have been there to support her.
As a woman sometimes I listen to other women talk about these things and in my head I try and imagine how I would react in her specific situation. God knows all of us women have been in similar scenarios at varying degrees. What's a bummer is that there is a part of me that sometimes thinks "that's not a big deal." Which actually makes me even more upset. It's like being so conditioned that we just endure it all. I had a coworker sexually assault me and I told a female manager and she made me feel stupid by saying "Oh that's happened to me - it's not a big deal. It will be more of a hassle to do anything about it and it'll make working with him awkward." That was in 2012. As much as I take issue with social media - it has certainly helped correct a few of that managers points. Props to Jon for letting her speak and not interrupting her but actually listening and not trying to alter anything she's saying with his own commentary.
@@runningbear6391 no one is saying it doesn’t happen in other workplaces. Comparing situations is very toxic and given that they are both human beings they are absolutely allowed to talk about whatever they want on a podcast. However, you do have the choice not to listen. Have a nice day!
Jon is honestly a massive inspiration to me as a man, only more so now that I’ve discovered this podcast. Probably one of the first people who comes to my mind when I think of positive masculinity.
Wow I love how she described her definition of loyalty. “Medieval”. And how important it is to find people who “share my definition”. That’s something I’ve always had a hard time with as well, and now I’m almost 28 and it’s still a thing… it’s a very lonely place. Because for most people, loyalty is not nearly as strong to them as it is to me.
Myself and my best friend have been described as the “German shepherd”friend and we love it. It’s always saddened me that people like us are shunned for being intense. I’m happy to know there are others out there like us :) when we say we have your back damn straight we mean it 😂😂
yup definitely felt that definition of loyalty much like those of you who commented on this post do the same its crazy how many people do not have this view wich is actually what the fuckin word means but hey not everyone can be like us the words i speak would break a normal mans jaw lol as im sure you all speak the same language as i
It’s amazing how well of a listener Jon is. 90% of people would have butted in or interrupted the speaker multiple times. I truly appreciate people who do interviews, podcasts, etc and actually listen and let them speak
Okay this was just heartbreaking i love prison break and i looked up to that cast and it makes me so upset sarah couldnt feel safe on that set. It really shows even on sets were you think people should feel safe and valued and respected, stuff like this hapoend. Ive always really respected you jon and its amazing how safe sarah fel on twd cast it makes me so thankful that that was my favorite show growing up as a kid. Youre channel is amazing jon and i love seeing all these point of views. Keep up the good work jon your channel and videos are amazing!
You can tell by the way she talks about him that she trusts him a great deal, even though she may have been hurt many times by people like him. Massive respect to Berthnal for being a dangerous but safe man to be around.
@@psionicstorm3961 people like him is referring to the fact he's a man. the op was speaking on how even after being hurt by men she trusts Jon, showing he's a good person
I love the way she communicates and the words she uses. Very powerful conversation. You can see it in her eyes how much she means everything. Jon you got some of the realest friends man. And you’re a real one yourself. Much love. Big respect 🤘🏽
Her comparison of the "wolf pack" behavior is so spot on. It's like a group of guys cling to something collectively and can go from civilized to tapping into some national geographic, primal instinct, behavior in a split second and THAT'S when it gets dicey for a woman. It's not even human, even.
@@lolshtf8531 Yes and understood. Given that she brought this up solely in the context of men, I'm merely just confirming her observation. If she brought this up in the context of women, I would also confirm it, as well.
This episode really made me tear up, I hope we can all be this real in our interactions with the people we call friends and proclaim we are loyal to, as friends and confidants.
Got so much respect for this woman. Been a fan of her for years. Sorry you had to deal with that, love your bond with Jon a true friend. Respect to both xx
Anyone else get sad when they hear the outro music starting? I could listen all day long. Sarah is a wonderful guest (and more importantly person), fascinating to listen to her share her experiences on two of my fave shows. Another fantastic ep.
This has quickly become one of my favourite podcasts to listen to through out the day. No matter the guest or the circumstances, it ALWAYS has a positive message. Much love Jon, truly one of the realest ones.
Yep!! Happens all the time. They forget the moment they've said it, but you never forget the embarrassment over some guy at work reducing you to a 'thing' completely out of the blue.
@@robyndismon394 that's not true ...it also infers that people deareve to be mistreated. Some people don't have the luxury of giving permission .There's strong and there's weak people .and unfortunately some people become prey.
@@brendancronin3796 No Brendan. You couldn't BE more mistaken. My comment does NOT infer that some people deserve to be mistreated. So Plse take that off the table. Did Martin Luther king Jr. crumble each and every time people attempted to reduce him to a substandard human being? No he did not. I'm not saying that cruel words don't hurt or that they can't cause extreme levels of pain. Of course they do. I'm simply saying that neither I nor you have to wear a label some jack a$$ decides best describes us.
@@robyndismon394 I agree .I've never really taken shit from anybody and I've paid for it in injuries cos I'm not willing to be a victim...but sadly there are weak people that will always be vulnerable. If you say that's not what your infering then I've no reason to not accept that .
Man, I loved Prison break. I didn't enjoy the latest season as much as i did the seasons before, but that show is among my top 5 of all time. big up Sarah Wayne, Such a phenomenal actress along with Wentworth Miller, and Dominic Purcell.
I watched the first season of TWD almost ten years ago and didn't continue, so I wouldn't call myself a "fan" of the show by any means, but Sarah is absolutely mesmerizing to listen to. She and Jon both exude that quiet strength and perceptiveness about the world that gels incredibly well in this interview.
That was an incredible convo I wasn’t ready for this morning. Wow, y’all are just fucking beautiful people. She is a force and definitely HELPED me today. Thank you, both 🙏🏼
Thank you for sharing this clip. I think it really adds to a valuable discussion and men need to be open to listening to women talk about these experiences. It must be horrible not to feel you can speak up for fear of losing your livelihood.
It's not just women face these issues some men too it's not about gender men too experience fear What's that about 'men need to be open to listen ' no one is stopping women to say there experience men just usually ignore and walk past these experience but women often take them serious Not that behavior was acceptable or normal
I like the part she says about there being people to replace her, because she’s wrong in the right way, yes someone can replace you, but no one will be her. What she brings, her performance and personality can’t be copied, and I think it’s why TWD hit SO hard with them as stars, because they were in it, I don’t know many other people who would just be her character because she owned it.
OMG 60 seconds in and I am completely there. Joined the Air Force at 19, I was always a guy's girl, always down to party as hard or harder, outdrink many of my guy friends at parties where often I might be 1 of only a couple of girls. And by the grace of God and the solid constitution of these men, nothing untoward ever happened. To this day, I have been blessed with a combination of intuition and situational awareness, plus an understanding male behavior and the psychology of men, that has kept me safe. But nowadays, you will never again catch me in the isolated company of a group of men, ANY men, friends or not. I am keenly aware of their actions and responses and their inate ability to fall into a pack mentality at a moment's notice. I am also blessed to have never had children that won't have to do this much work just to survive in this society.
Man that Prison Break story was effed up, especially since she was the only female on the show. Glad that TWD was a good experience for Sarah and great to see that her and Jon are still friends.
Every woman understands perfectly what Sarah Wayne Callies is saying because every woman has experienced it in her life in one way or another. Thank you Jon Bernthal for giving her the opportunity to speak.
@@Luke-jx3mj I know. How terrible they were teasing her. This shows how out of touch celebrities are and also how women just really ran with, we are victims narrative.
8:46 look at that little facial movement Jon does. That's Shane right there. That's Frank Castle right there. He is so pissed that his friend had to experience this alone and he wasn't there to stand with her. Props to Sarah for sharing this story and allowing herself to be vulnerable. Jon makes her feel safe
I met Sarah in New Orleans at a convention way back. She was one of the kindest actresses I've met to date. I wanted to meet her for her role as Lori from the Walking Dead. My buddy wanted to meet her for her role as Sara from Prison Break. Keep up the great work! 🤘🤙
The only way to not fuck up punisher is a. Don't inject woke bullshit into it b.dont try to soften it up. Good or bad Frank Castle is a rough man doing rough shit to people c. Most important, keep John as Castle.
I am a 68 year old American man. I became aware of the Male Wolfe Pack Phenomena in Junior High School. They can turn another male, too. Many men are struggling right now. Especially white males. We grew up with the socialized expectation of Natural Success and Superiority. But those dynamics are not there like they once were. I feel this woman's pain and frustration. None of us are Objects. We are much more than our Physicality. Civility is the Key. Essential respect and curtioisy. Love and Kindness.
I've worked in a hospital setting for a decade, women do this same shit when they outnumber the men. Do you know how many period jokes and gross shit I've seen them do with blood they where cleaning up.
@@Disconn3ction usually guy talk is ball busting…so yes demeaning each other, making fun of each other etc. never was my style but it’s what many men do and it separates the men from the boys. If someone can take it, you know they’re not overly sensitive and don’t take it personal. If they can’t take it, you know to wear kid gloves around them.. I guarantee those guys she’s talking about were also saying things like “that’s your wife isn’t it”? To each other. They tried to treat her like one of the guys and that’s something you shouldn’t do because women are not men
When Sarah talked about people needing to start realizing what they've done to people made me instantly think about your Shia video! When people look inward and choose to become self-aware their healing journey finally begins. Thank you for your content!
First: Those guys were not her friends. They were creatures who smiled in her face and pretended to be her "friends"- as 80% of humans tend to do. She should have finished them all on the spot as opposed to let it eat away at her like that. Second: Actors are always deceptive but no more or less than your average sales person. Third, the sexual exploitation of women, children and sometimes males in the entertainment industry went ignored for almost a century. Now, it can be instantly documented and persecuted. Both of these celebrities are in a unique position to change the film industry and correct all that is wrong with it.
Overreaction. Her story sounded like a case of them treating her like one of the guys. They also prob busted each other’s balls by saying things like “that’s your wife isn’t it”? Etc. nothing in that story should’ve “fucked her up for a minute”. Sounds like she’s trying to pander to Hollywood by playing the woke cards so she can get some job opportunities
You are wrong. Men check each other. This is Masculine pecking order mannerism. If a group of men consider you part of them they will throw insults to check you. Insulting builds men by testing them to overcome this challenges unconsciously this check. Women/feminine are emotional based, prefer compliments. Their feelings get hurt. If men make fun of you they think you are part of the group and you are supposed to overcome this by being stoic and laughing along or check the person back with a comeback or fight it out with the disrespect to find your place in the pecking order. Women should understand this
@@eddyasuma3256 did you learn that from Andrew Tate??? Your incel rhetoric sounds familiar. Oh, and copying and pasting your drivel around the comments to anyone you don’t agree with is pathetic. Cope.
@@eddyasuma3256 Thank god some people get this and point it out. These dudes were probably just joking around with her but she took it as them purposely mocking her. They probably call each other names as well and don't take it personal, so they did the same to her which she misinterpreted as some kind of bullying. I have the same situation with my girlfriend sometimes, I'm joking around, being sarcastic to her which she gets 90% of the time and finds funny (the reason is probably that she was friends with a lot of guys in the past). But sometimes even she has phases where she'll take the jokes seriously and think I'm genuinely making fun of her, which isn't my intention. I find it ironic that so many women talk about wanting to be treated equally, yet when you treat them like "one of the boys", they act as if you're a piece of sh*t who "oppresses" them.
@@Robert_0112 If you don’t get the difference between banter and calling someone a whore *at work infront other colleagues and bosses* when she politely asks you to stop multiple times then that’s on you. If this wasn’t at work and they knocked it off when she said stop the first time I doubt it would have been a big deal. I wouldn’t care if a guy friend of mine made the joke she mentioned but if a work friend did in the office and wouldn’t stop it would become a different story. It’s also weird how you compare it to banter with men except this wasn’t banter you could apply to a man, it was specific remarks about her being a woman that were sexual and degrading. Like again, it would be a different story to be teased by a coworker and another one for them to be saying I’m a sexual object who eats shit and to be put down to that when I’m doing my job instead of ironically being treated like one of the guys like you said.
This is really an important thing to discuss. I appreciate Jon sitting there and listening. The over-sexualization of our culture and the lack of personal shame is really wreaking havoc on the way we relate to other people and the way we conduct ourselves(the recent VMA’s anyone?) Men are designed to be protectors. But the distortion of who we are, since the beginning of time, has turned men into predators. And if in this culture, real men are considered “toxic”, then who will be the protectors?
The real men will mind their business and their place until society balances itself out. We are dealing with the backlash of decades of selfish, corrupt dynamics in business, relationships and other aspects. Once the pendulum is centered, we can get back to a natural, sustainable outlook. But until then, extremes on both sides will clash and the best way to avoid paying for someone else’s debt is to avoid the conflict altogether.
We are in a phase of intellectual and emotional evolution that has really taken off in the last few thousand years. Rather than being stuck with the coding of who we are since the beginning of time, the coding of who we are is evolving as it must to prevent us from becoming self limiting (which can lead to extinction). 'Real men'' is a misnomer, just as 'normal' is. There are an infinite noumber of ways we can behave and act to each other but if we want to continue growing intellectually we have to adapt and learn from eachother, including looking back and remembering the disappointing and embarrassing behaviours that were considered 'no big deal'' for so long before. We may never reach equilibrium but our superpower is that we are all born with the desire to improve.
This is the reason men don't want to include women in their group, anything could offend them or upset them. Those men made the mistake of considering her as a part of their group and forgot that she is a woman. "Men socialize by insulting each other but they really don't mean it. Women socialize by complimenting each other, they don't mean it either".
@@jimmoriarty4530 Bullshit Jimmy They all knew calling a women a shit eating whore was not acceptable and they did it anyway, not because “that’s how men communicate” but because they are bullies and cowards. There’s lines (even with men) they knew that they were crossing…..they didn’t care…..and I would argue they didn’t care cause she’s a women and what’s she gonna do? So who gives a shit right!? but it’s her fault right cause she’s so emotional right!? YOU are the PROBLEM
I was behind Jon and his dad, in the line at Starbucks, at Northstar village, in Tahoe a few years back. I didn't say anything and neither did anyone else. The thing that struck me, and I'm sure everyone else was just how intimidating he was in neutral. I'm a strong dude who coaches sports and spends 5 days per week in the gym but this guy was straight up scary without trying. Fast forward to the next day; I see him in line waiting for the chair lift and he was clearly having a great time and he was smiling the whole time. I had to look at him multiple times to be sure I was looking at the same man I had seen the previous day. I have no point to this story, other than the fact that Jon Bernthal is a scary ass dude who you don't wanna fuck with but he can be instantly disarming when he feels at ease. I know his back story from the time he was a kid, fighting, getting in trouble and I think his vibe in day to day interactions reflects that. People either won't to glom on or they want to pick a fight with a Hollywood tough guy and it's clear from the 3 minutes I was behind him in line and he's uneaese, that he just wanted to be left alone...and everyone there left him alone.
Something I haven’t seen anyone talk about was Sarah’s line “men desire masculinity and rather than build that up from the inside, they wear characteristics on the outside.” So good. Many of us men haven’t built inward credibility but have instead faked it till we made it. Always starts a spiral downward too because it isn’t real and holds no weight under pressure
I like her definition of loyalty as medieval, a chivalric code. We tend to view qualities like honour, truthfulness, faith, allegiance, commitment, as projections of strength that are martial in character. Jon adds that it isn't about words, but action. These notions haven't changed much since the 12th century - a little less feudal obviously but the song remains the same. An ideal warrior. The truth of what we want of others is simpler in essence than the terms we choose to communicate it, but when we are discussing our experience of it's absence it is as though we bear scars of battle, grievous wounds that seem to have placed us in mortal peril - "I thought you had my back...but you didn't".
Man that's just so outrageous what happened to Sarah on Prison Break - I'm only speculating she's referring to Wentworth with regards to being able to stop it, if so I am very surprised at him given his own struggles. Regardless, it's no excuse. Who the fuck acts like that and treats women like this? Shameful behaviour...
These are the stories that NEED to be told, not just from Hollywood. Sarah's story is honest and to the point. I didn't sense any bullshit there. We as men get caught up in our bullshit and often overlook the collateral damage. It is not in a man's nature to consider the feelings of others. That being said, a man should be raised to show respect to a woman when she is nearby. God bestowed many gifts apon women, except for the physical ability to protect themselves. That is our job as men, is to provide the protection and the safety. Men and Women are two sides of the same coin. We complete each other. Together we are valuable, we are strong.
@@Morrow45105 I'll agree that, in modern culture, in many cases, once someone claims victumhood they like to have it both ways. At that point the argument is lost along with any righteous progress it could have secured.
From @0:01to @4:22 , Callies was absolutely not subtle about who was that "friend" who betrayed her. "He, as an actor, had the most influence in this room" , "we were close to each other" , "some people enters this business because _maybe_ they don't have the courage to do what they really want [...] no that this business is easy, it is not [...] but moreso partocularly men, they have all of these *expectations of masculinity* to uphold--" Obviously, it was Wenworth Miller. He was the lead star and actor who made this show's prestige shines out, even one of the co-producers for a while. He suffered of being a closeted qu*er for a major part of his adult life and there have a platonic chemistry between you two that could be sensed within your characters (which may explains why some critics never shipped their couple as they found the relationship way too friendly) and obviously, either you had a g%y radar or he confessed/hinted this aspect of his life to you at some point. He wanted to fit in the pack, so he doubled down on the bullying instead to tell them to stop. Sound about a typical workplace environment. Ugh.
I don't think he joined in. I think he was the one person who didn't and she maybe expected him to stick up for her. Which given everything he was dealing with maybe makes sense why he didn't. I believe from the whole conversation it must have been someone present in season 4 and Season 5 because she says then we come back 7 yrs later and she brought it up with one of the people. Noone in s4 was In s5 except Dominic. A couple of them in s4 were never in scenes with Sarah or were killed off or didn't reappear in s5. He's the only one. (Robert knepper is the other one but he wasn't in any of the table scenes with sarah)
You could've praised her intelligence or the strength she's showing towards her trauma, but ofcourse, you comment on her looks. You're part of the problem
Thank you for your vulnerability & truth, Sarah! These interviews matter. The truth matters. Thank you Jon as a man to give Sarah, a woman to have this platform with you at her side. To allow her to feel safe. That matters. Thank you for asking good questions & providing a safe space to open up. Unfortunately, as a fellow woman, I can relate. It is time for radical change. Thank you to all men & all women who stand in solidarity for the greater good. Love from 🇨🇦
Hey Jon! Just came across this for the first time and your conversation with Sarah was eye opening. I'll have to go back and check out your other videos. I hope you talk about Punisher sometime and working with Charlie Cox, etc. Hope to see you play the role again! You're the best!
Listen Mr. Bernthal authentic podcasts is an art form unto itself. Listening, and allowing the person you are hosting, the time and space to tell their story is done by those who are uniquely interested in them. You bring that to the table sir. Thank you for bringing Real Ones to us all. God bless.
The situations she is describing are so omnipresent in society due to a lack of balance in power between people. These can be physical, organizational, influential, etc. The moment you start feeling unsafe is the moment where you don't feel you have the authority to assert yourself and say no. The feeling of being pressured into doing things or undergoing things you don't feel comfortable with.
Jon is a warrior in every way. I'm glad she has him for a friend. Also, we need to change the world to have more men like him to assure women are safe.
To me this truly shows to me that actors have to play two different characters in anything they are in. One to play the tv character and another to play an actor who is totally agreeable, passive and calm despite the trauma they have been caused behind the scenes.😞
I seriously enjoyed this interview, though saddened and angry to hear about the harassment.... In the US Navy, there were many times I was the only female on watch (shift work, two floors underground) and what they did, what they said, coming close to 30 years later and I still carry some of that junk! But for them, the males, it was just another day. A quote I've found helpful the past several years (and am working on implementing in my life) is: "What you allow will continue." Think about that for a little while. What does that mean for your life? I like how Sarah is practicing the above quote, by walking away when the studio isn't willing to pay her "dollar for dollar." For every person who starts doing that, it's that much more strength to ending the "will continue." Just my two cents, which isn't worth much. 😏
There are a lot of miscommunication when it comes to "toxic masculinity" but this is one is 100 The wolf pack mentality is real Individually these guys were her friends but when grouped up they became something else
Yep. I've known men who were the sweetest when we were having private discussions, but when part of a group of men, they turned into dangerous, trying to impress each other with women being the targets.
@@lavinder11 dangerous? And y’all wonder why no one takes you seriously… Btw just recently a group of young women terrorized and violently assaulted a group of old women over the span of weeks…that kind of dangerous? Mob mentality doesn’t have a gender no matter how much you want it to
Nah, they were still her friends. Just because they made a joke that was out of left field and unintentionally made her feel uncomfortable isn’t a betrayal of friendship. Its a small misunderstanding between friends. She’s portraying it as a much worse thing then it really was. It’s understandable that she felt awkward and disgusted by the joke, but if that dumb joke means a break in loyalty to her, then that’s just pathetic. The only thing that would be outright bad is if they didn’t stop after she asked them too.
@@johnjoseph6874 I mean that is fair, but I'm only hearing her side and she is presenting it as a much more mean spirited encounter then a joke not landing
Loved season 2, was always my favorite. The dialogue is amazing. Most hate it because they wanted more zombies, I wanted more drama and dialogues. I remember all the hatred for Callies character on twd forums, think that was unfair. I enjoyed her lines, her presence, show changed after her death.
SWC and JB are two, real people, and two bad-asses that if SHTF you would want to roll with. Hopefully they will both continue to get great roles and have long careers. On a side note...SWC kills it in Letterkenny! 😅
i relate to this so much, ive had that same situation happen where the group of guys you thought were your friends just start making fun of you and you literally cant do anything. if you say stop they will do it more and if you simply get up and walk away, they call you sensitive.
Welcome to the world of men. Men are assholes with very thick skin and they joke around like men. Trust me, they treat other men far worse. This was a crybaby moment for Sarah. She should’ve just called then assholes and moved on. Nothing in that story was alarming at all. Everyone is so sensitive anymore. Try working on a construction site and see how much the guys get ragged on…shes trying to play the woke cards and it’s pathetic
You are wrong. Men check each other. This is Masculine pecking order mannerism. If a group of men consider you part of them they will throw insults to check you. Insulting builds men by testing them to overcome this challenges unconsciously this check. Women/feminine are emotional based, prefer compliments. Their feelings get hurt. If men make fun of you they think you are part of the group and you are supposed to overcome this by being stoic and laughing along or check the person back with a comeback or fight it out with the disrespect to find your place in the pecking order. Women should understand this
@@eddyasuma3256 who’s wrong? Sounds like you said pretty much the same thing as me. It’s also pretty common when men and women are friends for men to tease their women friends(treating them like one of the guys) which sounds like what this was.. Obviously women are different and should be sheltered from this kind of stuff but we used to do that and they called us sexist and demanded they be treated as equals…so now they’re treated as equals and their feelings get hurt at the lightest jokes. These same ppl also argue that men and women are not at all different and that woman are not emotional lol we need to go back to what nature taught us…women and men are different and women need to re-learn this and stop trying to blur the lines between men and women. For Sarah to try and relate this joke to sexual harassment is utterly ridiculous and nothing more than trying to bandwagon off outrage culture
Sad to see so many men in the comments who still don't get it. Funny the lot of you following and liking Bernthal when he would slap the shit out of you if given the chance. Bernthal is an example of a real man, where you can be masculine but still a good person, they aren't mutually exclusive like many on either sides of the political and cultural spectrum claim. Shout out to Sarah, a real one.
Thanks Jon and thank you Sarah for this. The culture is and has changed so much outside of Hollywood. It's hard still for some of us to imagine what it must be like inside, Hollywood. This is an important convo that we need to keep talking about... This brought me back to the scene Jon did in Wind River....so harsh...heart wrenching scene. Such a good movie, especially the ending. Peace and blessings. 🙏
Yeah I knew he was in the closet at the time but she said that she looked at one guy who she considered to be a good friend and he didn't do anything. So I just wondered who that was.. I thought maybe Wentworth because he was in the closet at that point and may have been afraid of drawing too much attention but dang that's sad. I loved both of these shows. In all honesty, I have not finished the walking dead though. After they killed Shane off It kind of fell off for me.
Wow I’m definitely subbed because of the pit just chillen on the couch! Love that natural an chill unlike every other podcast 4 or five people talking over each other this is what I want raw good content
Man! She hit the nail on the head with men acting like men but deep down they aren’t at all! But Hollywood is the reason for this as well, we believe we can instantly be a man or women if we copycat the image/words used in a movie.
I was a HUGE fan of PRISON BREAK when it started but the more I saw, the worse it got. I didn't like how the producers disregarded her input, treated her pregnancy as an insult & was just flippant about letting her go. Now to hear some coworkers compared her to a fetish porn star & thought she would take that as a compliment just reaffirms how clueless and misguided a LOT of men are. Glad she's telling her story.
I love Jon's ability to just sit there and listen. No need to interrupt every 30 seconds with something. It really speaks to his acting abilities, because his natural demeanor is a complete 180 of the characters he usually plays.
And let's give it up for Bam Bam. He knew she needed some doggo love, and he just lied down right next to her to make her feel warm and welcomed.
Wish I could triple like this 👍👍👍
That's how real ones talk, by listening.
@@ohandsixteenmedia9751 i got you bro!
Exactly m8.
But I love the look of John Berenthal at minute 2:20, where Sarah is talking about the way she was humiliated. Oh Man...that's some PUNISHER look and mindset right there. 😅
yeah pretty much all I had seen of Jon before watching this was his role as Shane in TWD, and I just sort of saw him as this aggressive, testosterone-fuelled man. After watching this, I gained a lot of respect for him. I feel that he asked great questions and as you say was a great listener. He does seem testosterone-fuelled to me but I think he is well levelled, and down to earth which I respect so much. He is always who he is, and that is a quality that is so rare in society
It's encouraging to hear that guys like John Berenthal and Andrew Lincoln exist in Hollywood
you all are always talking about the most privileged people on the planet. SHUT UP
jon bernthal is a marilyn manson supporter
Miss Andrew Lincoln and his American English/Patois Accent.
@@nighthawkviper6791 špššššššššš pp
Agreed. I’ve heard nothing but good things about Andy’s character.
Jon is sooooo amazing at actually letting the guests talk and not overly inserting himself
I find it annoying when ppl overly say whatever words acknowledging they are listening but he shook his head and that seemed way more respectful in my opinion.
That's how Rogan used to be. Now I'm like, "Why did you even have a guest on the show?"
Please have more people on from walking dead. It’s so interesting to see what really went on behind the scenes. Steven Yuen, Norman Reedus, Irone Singleton, other OG’s from the beginning. Much love! (Beautiful interview btw)
Also Michael Rooker he would be a great one too I got to meet him twice he’s an awesome guy!
@@HaydenJ323 mary poppins yall🙏🔥
Andrew Lincoln should do this
I remember seeing 2-girls, 1-cup when this was new too back then... haven't really seen it since (it's horrible, who would keep watching it?). So I had to pull it up again because hell if I remember what the girls looked like. I think they were just fucking with Sarah in a non-mean way because she *DOESN'T* look like either girl. Far from it.
@@VanessaHolguin Nice one Van.
"My definition of loyalty is medieval."
I can relate to that line more than any I've ever heard on a podcast.
Same here💯
What does it mean ? I’m French and I try to figure it out what it really means ?
Lancelot is...not the character to use in that analogy, but the point is well taken.
@@toxxylou5508 That loyalty and honor mean as much to us as they did to the knights in the medieval era.
I love that she said that. I am like that and people just don't get it. I can't even imagine what that must have felt like, truly gross anyone would treat someone that way.
Literally, the way that Sarah carried herself in this interview really impressed me. She dealt with her trauma and understood that telling these stories could help people outside. She's right in what she said, and her definition of loyalty should honestly be the same for everyone. This episode is genuinely one of my favourites since finding it, so I hope I can get Patreon and watch the full thing soon
you all are always talking about the most privileged people on the planet. SHUT UP
Literally?
@@alexbaum2204 Literally
All she did is wine. She sucks
@@AlexB-pp7dc you have never been through that, so don’t act like you understand even slightly. She’s allowed to be upset and annoyed by stupid comments made by disgusting men 🤷♀️
Every time I see SWC speak or have read something she’s posted, she is always so thought provoking.
I think so many times fans just see an actor or actress and see money, fame and comfort. People never stop to think that they could actually be experiencing the same things we do in everyday life and job.
I hate that she had to deal with that and at the end of day, she carried the luggage for that.
I am so thankful that she moved on and was able to go on working and loving life. I find Sarah to be inspirational in so many ways.
Thanks for sharing this!
Just found out this podcast existed today and couldn’t agree with you more. Rarely do you see celebrities talk this openly about the business and it’s even more rare for them to be as good at expressing themselves as these 2.
This is the reason men don't want to include women in their group, anything could offend them or upset them. Those men made the mistake of considering her as a part of their group and forgot that she is a woman. "Men socialize by insulting each other but they really don't mean it. Women socialize by complimenting each other, they don't mean it either".
Jon is so humble and down to earth. The true nature of a star is within, it's not the glitz and glamour but how you know the true nature of your influence and connect with people. Jon is one of those few celebs that's absolutely based irl.
I’ve really enjoyed Sarah’s work since Prison Break. She has such a kind and down to earth demeanor about her that makes her feel very relatable. It makes me sad she had to deal with childish garbage while working on that set.
It is shocking how the mob mentality manifests in people who would never act that way on their own.
One of the bravest confessions of a person I’ve ever heard. Bravo Sarah, you are a very strong woman for confronting that. Kudos as well to Jonny B for having your back.
Bahahahaha
you all are always talking about the most privileged people on the planet. SHUT UP
@@Morrow45105 Usually people who get triggered by women speaking out are usually guilty of something sexist themselves and hate being called out for it, it's best to just keep to yourself, you're not as anonymous as you think, no one is.
@@thedarkapex5327 usually ppl who are honest have a hard time not calling bullshit when they see it. You should try it. Though I’m guessing you’re not capable of it…
@@thedarkapex5327 gta love the subtle threat you made though….uh oh the woke police are here!!! 👮♀️ RUN EVERYBODY RUN!! Keep your mouths shut or else they’ll cancel you!!
Such a brave interview by Sarah to call all this out, but also good to hear that Jon and Andrew are the kind of people who won't accept that on set, not that I could ever doubt that. You can see the frustration and quiet anger in Jon's face early on when Sarah's talking about it that he's just pissed he couldn't have been there to support her.
As a woman sometimes I listen to other women talk about these things and in my head I try and imagine how I would react in her specific situation. God knows all of us women have been in similar scenarios at varying degrees. What's a bummer is that there is a part of me that sometimes thinks "that's not a big deal." Which actually makes me even more upset. It's like being so conditioned that we just endure it all.
I had a coworker sexually assault me and I told a female manager and she made me feel stupid by saying "Oh that's happened to me - it's not a big deal. It will be more of a hassle to do anything about it and it'll make working with him awkward." That was in 2012. As much as I take issue with social media - it has certainly helped correct a few of that managers points.
Props to Jon for letting her speak and not interrupting her but actually listening and not trying to alter anything she's saying with his own commentary.
you all are always talking about the most privileged people on the planet. SHUT UP
@@runningbear6391 ok Boomer
@@runningbear6391 no one is saying it doesn’t happen in other workplaces. Comparing situations is very toxic and given that they are both human beings they are absolutely allowed to talk about whatever they want on a podcast. However, you do have the choice not to listen. Have a nice day!
@@runningbear6391 your ignorance and lack of compassion is astounding. good luck being you
@@runningbear6391 Newsflash: you're part of the problem. Some empathy would do you good.
Jon is honestly a massive inspiration to me as a man, only more so now that I’ve discovered this podcast. Probably one of the first people who comes to my mind when I think of positive masculinity.
There’s many more than him. But in terms of main stream media he’s one of the few. Absolute gem of a man.
Facts
Totally agree, Jon's cool AF.....solid, stand-up, old-school. 💙
I love these two together they’re so mature, well articulate and intelligent
Wow I love how she described her definition of loyalty. “Medieval”. And how important it is to find people who “share my definition”.
That’s something I’ve always had a hard time with as well, and now I’m almost 28 and it’s still a thing… it’s a very lonely place. Because for most people, loyalty is not nearly as strong to them as it is to me.
Same
Myself and my best friend have been described as the “German shepherd”friend and we love it. It’s always saddened me that people like us are shunned for being intense. I’m happy to know there are others out there like us :) when we say we have your back damn straight we mean it 😂😂
Same except I'm 37
Me too. Absolutely
yup definitely felt that definition of loyalty much like those of you who commented on this post do the same its crazy how many people do not have this view wich is actually what the fuckin word means but hey not everyone can be like us the words i speak would break a normal mans jaw lol as im sure you all speak the same language as i
It’s amazing how well of a listener Jon is. 90% of people would have butted in or interrupted the speaker multiple times. I truly appreciate people who do interviews, podcasts, etc and actually listen and let them speak
Okay this was just heartbreaking i love prison break and i looked up to that cast and it makes me so upset sarah couldnt feel safe on that set. It really shows even on sets were you think people should feel safe and valued and respected, stuff like this hapoend. Ive always really respected you jon and its amazing how safe sarah fel on twd cast it makes me so thankful that that was my favorite show growing up as a kid. Youre channel is amazing jon and i love seeing all these point of views. Keep up the good work jon your channel and videos are amazing!
You can tell by the way she talks about him that she trusts him a great deal, even though she may have been hurt many times by people like him. Massive respect to Berthnal for being a dangerous but safe man to be around.
"people like him" what does that mean? Jon is awesome.
@@psionicstorm3961 people like him is referring to the fact he's a man. the op was speaking on how even after being hurt by men she trusts Jon, showing he's a good person
@@Cinnamongirl4life real men respect women and treat the accordingly. My mama raised me to respect women.
@@NinjaZX6Rider W mama
Know how to be a monster
Don’t be one
I love the way she communicates and the words she uses. Very powerful conversation. You can see it in her eyes how much she means everything. Jon you got some of the realest friends man. And you’re a real one yourself. Much love. Big respect 🤘🏽
Her comparison of the "wolf pack" behavior is so spot on. It's like a group of guys cling to something collectively and can go from civilized to tapping into some national geographic, primal instinct, behavior in a split second and THAT'S when it gets dicey for a woman. It's not even human, even.
@@lolshtf8531 Yes and understood. Given that she brought this up solely in the context of men, I'm merely just confirming her observation. If she brought this up in the context of women, I would also confirm it, as well.
@@lolshtf8531 look at high school girls.. They're super cut throat..
@@lolshtf8531 Primal for whom precisely? And under what circumstances? I have yet experience this in any way.
@N S wow ...that's a heavy comment
Yeah down with men.
Jon is definitely one of my favourite people in Hollywood, Dude is soo talented , kind , chill and honest..He’s a rare breed in Hollywood.
This episode really made me tear up, I hope we can all be this real in our interactions with the people we call friends and proclaim we are loyal to, as friends and confidants.
That Wolfpack thing she was talking about is disturbingly accurate. I've seen shit like that happen before.
Got so much respect for this woman. Been a fan of her for years. Sorry you had to deal with that, love your bond with Jon a true friend. Respect to both xx
Anyone else get sad when they hear the outro music starting? I could listen all day long. Sarah is a wonderful guest (and more importantly person), fascinating to listen to her share her experiences on two of my fave shows. Another fantastic ep.
This has quickly become one of my favourite podcasts to listen to through out the day. No matter the guest or the circumstances, it ALWAYS has a positive message. Much love Jon, truly one of the realest ones.
Ugh the part where one moment is so significant to you but isn't even a thought to them....that hits home
Yep!! Happens all the time. They forget the moment they've said it, but you never forget the embarrassment over some guy at work reducing you to a 'thing' completely out of the blue.
@@chrishellize No one can reduce you to anything without your permission.
@@robyndismon394 that's not true ...it also infers that people deareve to be mistreated. Some people don't have the luxury of giving permission .There's strong and there's weak people .and unfortunately some people become prey.
@@brendancronin3796 No Brendan. You couldn't BE more mistaken. My comment does NOT infer that some people deserve to be mistreated. So Plse take that off the table.
Did Martin Luther king Jr. crumble each and every time people attempted to reduce him to a substandard human being? No he did not.
I'm not saying that cruel words don't hurt or that they can't cause extreme levels of pain. Of course they do. I'm simply saying that neither I nor you have to wear a label some jack a$$ decides best describes us.
@@robyndismon394 I agree .I've never really taken shit from anybody and I've paid for it in injuries cos I'm not willing to be a victim...but sadly there are weak people that will always be vulnerable. If you say that's not what your infering then I've no reason to not accept that .
As a woman, this video was so powerful to me. Thank you.
Man, I loved Prison break. I didn't enjoy the latest season as much as i did the seasons before, but that show is among my top 5 of all time. big up Sarah Wayne, Such a phenomenal actress along with Wentworth Miller, and Dominic Purcell.
I love his sit downs! Jon is so real, loving and a badass! So great to see who he is and why he’s so respected in the BIZ
I watched the first season of TWD almost ten years ago and didn't continue, so I wouldn't call myself a "fan" of the show by any means, but Sarah is absolutely mesmerizing to listen to. She and Jon both exude that quiet strength and perceptiveness about the world that gels incredibly well in this interview.
u should at least come back and watch season 2 jon bernthals acting is amazing as well as sarah waynes
That was an incredible convo I wasn’t ready for this morning. Wow, y’all are just fucking beautiful people. She is a force and definitely HELPED me today. Thank you, both 🙏🏼
Thank you for sharing this clip. I think it really adds to a valuable discussion and men need to be open to listening to women talk about these experiences. It must be horrible not to feel you can speak up for fear of losing your livelihood.
It's not just women face these issues some men too it's not about gender men too experience fear
What's that about 'men need to be open to listen ' no one is stopping women to say there experience men just usually ignore and walk past these experience but women often take them serious
Not that behavior was acceptable or normal
When she said her idea of loyalty is medieval I seriously felt that. Having developed that same understanding.
I like the part she says about there being people to replace her, because she’s wrong in the right way, yes someone can replace you, but no one will be her. What she brings, her performance and personality can’t be copied, and I think it’s why TWD hit SO hard with them as stars, because they were in it, I don’t know many other people who would just be her character because she owned it.
OMG 60 seconds in and I am completely there. Joined the Air Force at 19, I was always a guy's girl, always down to party as hard or harder, outdrink many of my guy friends at parties where often I might be 1 of only a couple of girls. And by the grace of God and the solid constitution of these men, nothing untoward ever happened. To this day, I have been blessed with a combination of intuition and situational awareness, plus an understanding male behavior and the psychology of men, that has kept me safe. But nowadays, you will never again catch me in the isolated company of a group of men, ANY men, friends or not. I am keenly aware of their actions and responses and their inate ability to fall into a pack mentality at a moment's notice. I am also blessed to have never had children that won't have to do this much work just to survive in this society.
Man that Prison Break story was effed up, especially since she was the only female on the show. Glad that TWD was a good experience for Sarah and great to see that her and Jon are still friends.
Every woman understands perfectly what Sarah Wayne Callies is saying because every woman has experienced it in her life in one way or another. Thank you Jon Bernthal for giving her the opportunity to speak.
It’s called ball busting…welcome to the world of men. Trust me, they take it easy on women.
Experienced banter?
@@Luke-jx3mj Maybe!
@@Luke-jx3mj I know. How terrible they were teasing her. This shows how out of touch celebrities are and also how women just really ran with, we are victims narrative.
Didn't realize most women look like 2girls1cup actresses
8:46 look at that little facial movement Jon does. That's Shane right there. That's Frank Castle right there. He is so pissed that his friend had to experience this alone and he wasn't there to stand with her. Props to Sarah for sharing this story and allowing herself to be vulnerable. Jon makes her feel safe
You know afterwards he was asking “give me their names?”
This was an incredibly good interview. Didn’t even know you had a channel Jon! So much respect 💯
Wow. What a deep, strong, courageous, thought provoking human Sarah is. Appreciate her so much more. Wow.
I met Sarah in New Orleans at a convention way back. She was one of the kindest actresses I've met to date. I wanted to meet her for her role as Lori from the Walking Dead. My buddy wanted to meet her for her role as Sara from Prison Break. Keep up the great work! 🤘🤙
Such an important conversation to have, Thank both of you for being you!
She has a lot of amazing talking points that had my gears turning. Thank you for this.
Jon’s that one friend who will hunt you down for hurting his love ones. The man’s a beast and I hope we see him as punisher again
The only way to not fuck up punisher is a. Don't inject woke bullshit into it b.dont try to soften it up. Good or bad Frank Castle is a rough man doing rough shit to people c. Most important, keep John as Castle.
I’d leave this lady with my children for an infinite amount of time. What a wonderful woman and role model for young ladies.
I am a 68 year old American man. I became aware of the Male Wolfe Pack Phenomena in Junior High School. They can turn another male, too. Many men are struggling right now. Especially white males. We grew up with the socialized expectation of Natural Success and Superiority. But those dynamics are not there like they once were. I feel this woman's pain and frustration. None of us are Objects. We are much more than our Physicality. Civility is the Key. Essential respect and curtioisy. Love and Kindness.
such an amazing conversation, and it starts with us being willing to talk about it. thank you SWC for sharing your story.
Sad to see so many dudes in the comments missing the point here.
A lot of women will relate to this. Thanks for sharing Sarah
I've worked in a hospital setting for a decade, women do this same shit when they outnumber the men. Do you know how many period jokes and gross shit I've seen them do with blood they where cleaning up.
Men treat men far worse. Stop being crybabies
We can go back to the times where men shelter women from guy talk…but when we did that y’all called us sexist and that we should treat you equally….
@@Morrow45105 What is 'guy talk' for you? Conversations that demean women?
@@Disconn3ction usually guy talk is ball busting…so yes demeaning each other, making fun of each other etc. never was my style but it’s what many men do and it separates the men from the boys. If someone can take it, you know they’re not overly sensitive and don’t take it personal. If they can’t take it, you know to wear kid gloves around them..
I guarantee those guys she’s talking about were also saying things like “that’s your wife isn’t it”? To each other. They tried to treat her like one of the guys and that’s something you shouldn’t do because women are not men
When Sarah talked about people needing to start realizing what they've done to people made me instantly think about your Shia video! When people look inward and choose to become self-aware their healing journey finally begins. Thank you for your content!
First: Those guys were not her friends. They were creatures who smiled in her face and pretended to be her "friends"- as 80% of humans tend to do. She should have finished them all on the spot as opposed to let it eat away at her like that.
Second: Actors are always deceptive but no more or less than your average sales person.
Third, the sexual exploitation of women, children and sometimes males in the entertainment industry went ignored for almost a century. Now, it can be instantly documented and persecuted. Both of these celebrities are in a unique position to change the film industry and correct all that is wrong with it.
Overreaction. Her story sounded like a case of them treating her like one of the guys. They also prob busted each other’s balls by saying things like “that’s your wife isn’t it”? Etc. nothing in that story should’ve “fucked her up for a minute”. Sounds like she’s trying to pander to Hollywood by playing the woke cards so she can get some job opportunities
You are wrong. Men check each other. This is Masculine pecking order mannerism. If a group of men consider you part of them they will throw insults to check you. Insulting builds men by testing them to overcome this challenges unconsciously this check. Women/feminine are emotional based, prefer compliments. Their feelings get hurt. If men make fun of you they think you are part of the group and you are supposed to overcome this by being stoic and laughing along or check the person back with a comeback or fight it out with the disrespect to find your place in the pecking order. Women should understand this
@@eddyasuma3256 did you learn that from Andrew Tate??? Your incel rhetoric sounds familiar. Oh, and copying and pasting your drivel around the comments to anyone you don’t agree with is pathetic. Cope.
@@eddyasuma3256 Thank god some people get this and point it out. These dudes were probably just joking around with her but she took it as them purposely mocking her. They probably call each other names as well and don't take it personal, so they did the same to her which she misinterpreted as some kind of bullying. I have the same situation with my girlfriend sometimes, I'm joking around, being sarcastic to her which she gets 90% of the time and finds funny (the reason is probably that she was friends with a lot of guys in the past). But sometimes even she has phases where she'll take the jokes seriously and think I'm genuinely making fun of her, which isn't my intention. I find it ironic that so many women talk about wanting to be treated equally, yet when you treat them like "one of the boys", they act as if you're a piece of sh*t who "oppresses" them.
@@Robert_0112 If you don’t get the difference between banter and calling someone a whore *at work infront other colleagues and bosses* when she politely asks you to stop multiple times then that’s on you. If this wasn’t at work and they knocked it off when she said stop the first time I doubt it would have been a big deal. I wouldn’t care if a guy friend of mine made the joke she mentioned but if a work friend did in the office and wouldn’t stop it would become a different story.
It’s also weird how you compare it to banter with men except this wasn’t banter you could apply to a man, it was specific remarks about her being a woman that were sexual and degrading. Like again, it would be a different story to be teased by a coworker and another one for them to be saying I’m a sexual object who eats shit and to be put down to that when I’m doing my job instead of ironically being treated like one of the guys like you said.
Keep these interviews coming Jon, It sucks what Sarah went through on the set of prison break.
Love that he lets guests speak, so many big name podcasters talk over their guest
This is really an important thing to discuss. I appreciate Jon sitting there and listening.
The over-sexualization of our culture and the lack of personal shame is really wreaking havoc on the way we relate to other people and the way we conduct ourselves(the recent VMA’s anyone?)
Men are designed to be protectors. But the distortion of who we are, since the beginning of time, has turned men into predators. And if in this culture, real men are considered “toxic”, then who will be the protectors?
The real men will mind their business and their place until society balances itself out. We are dealing with the backlash of decades of selfish, corrupt dynamics in business, relationships and other aspects. Once the pendulum is centered, we can get back to a natural, sustainable outlook. But until then, extremes on both sides will clash and the best way to avoid paying for someone else’s debt is to avoid the conflict altogether.
We are in a phase of intellectual and emotional evolution that has really taken off in the last few thousand years. Rather than being stuck with the coding of who we are since the beginning of time, the coding of who we are is evolving as it must to prevent us from becoming self limiting (which can lead to extinction). 'Real men'' is a misnomer, just as 'normal' is. There are an infinite noumber of ways we can behave and act to each other but if we want to continue growing intellectually we have to adapt and learn from eachother, including looking back and remembering the disappointing and embarrassing behaviours that were considered 'no big deal'' for so long before. We may never reach equilibrium but our superpower is that we are all born with the desire to improve.
Woman over sexualise themselves. Blame them
This is the reason men don't want to include women in their group, anything could offend them or upset them. Those men made the mistake of considering her as a part of their group and forgot that she is a woman. "Men socialize by insulting each other but they really don't mean it. Women socialize by complimenting each other, they don't mean it either".
@@jimmoriarty4530
Bullshit Jimmy
They all knew calling a women a shit eating whore was not acceptable and they did it anyway, not because “that’s how men communicate” but because they are bullies and cowards. There’s lines (even with men) they knew that they were crossing…..they didn’t care…..and I would argue they didn’t care cause she’s a women and what’s she gonna do? So who gives a shit right!?
but it’s her fault right cause she’s so emotional right!?
YOU are the PROBLEM
I remember so many people hated Lori, but I loved her so much. ;-;
Same
I was behind Jon and his dad, in the line at Starbucks, at Northstar village, in Tahoe a few years back. I didn't say anything and neither did anyone else. The thing that struck me, and I'm sure everyone else was just how intimidating he was in neutral. I'm a strong dude who coaches sports and spends 5 days per week in the gym but this guy was straight up scary without trying. Fast forward to the next day; I see him in line waiting for the chair lift and he was clearly having a great time and he was smiling the whole time. I had to look at him multiple times to be sure I was looking at the same man I had seen the previous day. I have no point to this story, other than the fact that Jon Bernthal is a scary ass dude who you don't wanna fuck with but he can be instantly disarming when he feels at ease. I know his back story from the time he was a kid, fighting, getting in trouble and I think his vibe in day to day interactions reflects that. People either won't to glom on or they want to pick a fight with a Hollywood tough guy and it's clear from the 3 minutes I was behind him in line and he's uneaese, that he just wanted to be left alone...and everyone there left him alone.
"My kids don't deserve less just because I happen to be a woman".
THIS RIGHT HERE
Relax
You live in Iran or something? Jesus
@@myname7186 sure but fights will happen wherever it can happen. It's not like fighting this one thing ignores everything else.
she was shit in the show glad when they got rid of her
Slow down and take a midol
Something I haven’t seen anyone talk about was Sarah’s line “men desire masculinity and rather than build that up from the inside, they wear characteristics on the outside.”
So good. Many of us men haven’t built inward credibility but have instead faked it till we made it. Always starts a spiral downward too because it isn’t real and holds no weight under pressure
I’m a woman and I really appreciate your vulnerability in admitting that. Looking inward is the start for all of us
This woman is beyond intelligent and such a beautiful soul
I like her definition of loyalty as medieval, a chivalric code. We tend to view qualities like honour, truthfulness, faith, allegiance, commitment, as projections of strength that are martial in character. Jon adds that it isn't about words, but action. These notions haven't changed much since the 12th century - a little less feudal obviously but the song remains the same. An ideal warrior. The truth of what we want of others is simpler in essence than the terms we choose to communicate it, but when we are discussing our experience of it's absence it is as though we bear scars of battle, grievous wounds that seem to have placed us in mortal peril - "I thought you had my back...but you didn't".
Lancelot was a bad example though lol.
Man that's just so outrageous what happened to Sarah on Prison Break - I'm only speculating she's referring to Wentworth with regards to being able to stop it, if so I am very surprised at him given his own struggles.
Regardless, it's no excuse. Who the fuck acts like that and treats women like this?
Shameful behaviour...
This episode was an absolutely incredible learning experience and I think both of you for sharing🤙🏻
These are the stories that NEED to be told, not just from Hollywood. Sarah's story is honest and to the point. I didn't sense any bullshit there. We as men get caught up in our bullshit and often overlook the collateral damage. It is not in a man's nature to consider the feelings of others. That being said, a man should be raised to show respect to a woman when she is nearby. God bestowed many gifts apon women, except for the physical ability to protect themselves. That is our job as men, is to provide the protection and the safety. Men and Women are two sides of the same coin. We complete each other. Together we are valuable, we are strong.
When we did that and sheltered women from guy talk and guy things, women called us sexist and that we should treat them equally…which is it?!
@@Morrow45105 I'll agree that, in modern culture, in many cases, once someone claims victumhood they like to have it both ways. At that point the argument is lost along with any righteous progress it could have secured.
From @0:01to @4:22 , Callies was absolutely not subtle about who was that "friend" who betrayed her.
"He, as an actor, had the most influence in this room" , "we were close to each other" , "some people enters this business because _maybe_ they don't have the courage to do what they really want [...] no that this business is easy, it is not [...] but moreso partocularly men, they have all of these *expectations of masculinity* to uphold--"
Obviously, it was Wenworth Miller. He was the lead star and actor who made this show's prestige shines out, even one of the co-producers for a while. He suffered of being a closeted qu*er for a major part of his adult life and there have a platonic chemistry between you two that could be sensed within your characters (which may explains why some critics never shipped their couple as they found the relationship way too friendly) and obviously, either you had a g%y radar or he confessed/hinted this aspect of his life to you at some point.
He wanted to fit in the pack, so he doubled down on the bullying instead to tell them to stop. Sound about a typical workplace environment. Ugh.
I don't think he joined in. I think he was the one person who didn't and she maybe expected him to stick up for her. Which given everything he was dealing with maybe makes sense why he didn't. I believe from the whole conversation it must have been someone present in season 4 and Season 5 because she says then we come back 7 yrs later and she brought it up with one of the people. Noone in s4 was In s5 except Dominic. A couple of them in s4 were never in scenes with Sarah or were killed off or didn't reappear in s5. He's the only one. (Robert knepper is the other one but he wasn't in any of the table scenes with sarah)
She’s still so beautiful. She don’t look like she’s aged a day.
You could've praised her intelligence or the strength she's showing towards her trauma, but ofcourse, you comment on her looks. You're part of the problem
@@joyanna9433 bruh relax keyboard warrior
@@joyanna9433 Mad nobody's ever called you that?
She has aged
@@joyanna9433 nah you're the problem what's wrong with complementing someone's look
Unreal. Jon’s and SWC’s capacity to work in Hollywood and have such mature conversations about the industry he works in incredible.
Thank you for your vulnerability & truth, Sarah! These interviews matter. The truth matters. Thank you Jon as a man to give Sarah, a woman to have this platform with you at her side. To allow her to feel safe. That matters. Thank you for asking good questions & providing a safe space to open up.
Unfortunately, as a fellow woman, I can relate. It is time for radical change. Thank you to all men & all women who stand in solidarity for the greater good.
Love from 🇨🇦
After this interview, i feel in love with this woman and her strength. stay strong, Sarah.
Hey Jon! Just came across this for the first time and your conversation with Sarah was eye opening. I'll have to go back and check out your other videos. I hope you talk about Punisher sometime and working with Charlie Cox, etc. Hope to see you play the role again! You're the best!
Listen Mr. Bernthal authentic podcasts is an art form unto itself. Listening, and allowing the person you are hosting, the time and space to tell their story is done by those who are uniquely interested in them. You bring that to the table sir. Thank you for bringing Real Ones to us all. God bless.
I have always thought Jon was just an amazing person and actor. So happy I found his pod!
The situations she is describing are so omnipresent in society due to a lack of balance in power between people. These can be physical, organizational, influential, etc.
The moment you start feeling unsafe is the moment where you don't feel you have the authority to assert yourself and say no. The feeling of being pressured into doing things or undergoing things you don't feel comfortable with.
Jon's face with that porn story, he was pissed, and he would have done something. Not necessarily just said something but actually done something.
Her courage to talk
About the incident on prison break was so relatable. Jon, wow you are a top class interviewer, co worker and actor.
Thanks Sarah for sharing and thanks Jon for ur beautiful podcast
Jon is a warrior in every way. I'm glad she has him for a friend. Also, we need to change the world to have more men like him to assure women are safe.
To me this truly shows to me that actors have to play two different characters in anything they are in. One to play the tv character and another to play an actor who is totally agreeable, passive and calm despite the trauma they have been caused behind the scenes.😞
I seriously enjoyed this interview, though saddened and angry to hear about the harassment....
In the US Navy, there were many times I was the only female on watch (shift work, two floors underground) and what they did, what they said, coming close to 30 years later and I still carry some of that junk! But for them, the males, it was just another day.
A quote I've found helpful the past several years (and am working on implementing in my life) is: "What you allow will continue." Think about that for a little while. What does that mean for your life?
I like how Sarah is practicing the above quote, by walking away when the studio isn't willing to pay her "dollar for dollar." For every person who starts doing that, it's that much more strength to ending the "will continue."
Just my two cents, which isn't worth much. 😏
bam bam doing his job love that he is apart of this and love that jon is such a positive force in the industry
There are a lot of miscommunication when it comes to "toxic masculinity" but this is one is 100
The wolf pack mentality is real
Individually these guys were her friends but when grouped up they became something else
Yeah it’s called busting balls…and this is why women should be kept out of it. They can’t handle it.
Yep. I've known men who were the sweetest when we were having private discussions, but when part of a group of men, they turned into dangerous, trying to impress each other with women being the targets.
@@lavinder11 dangerous? And y’all wonder why no one takes you seriously…
Btw just recently a group of young women terrorized and violently assaulted a group of old women over the span of weeks…that kind of dangerous? Mob mentality doesn’t have a gender no matter how much you want it to
Nah, they were still her friends. Just because they made a joke that was out of left field and unintentionally made her feel uncomfortable isn’t a betrayal of friendship. Its a small misunderstanding between friends. She’s portraying it as a much worse thing then it really was. It’s understandable that she felt awkward and disgusted by the joke, but if that dumb joke means a break in loyalty to her, then that’s just pathetic. The only thing that would be outright bad is if they didn’t stop after she asked them too.
@@johnjoseph6874 I mean that is fair, but I'm only hearing her side and she is presenting it as a much more mean spirited encounter then a joke not landing
I have a new level of respect for a lot of these actors, like Sarah and Jon, and others.
you all are always talking about the most privileged people on the planet. SHUT UP
Loved season 2, was always my favorite. The dialogue is amazing. Most hate it because they wanted more zombies, I wanted more drama and dialogues. I remember all the hatred for Callies character on twd forums, think that was unfair. I enjoyed her lines, her presence, show changed after her death.
Hello
I just stumbled across this channel.
First listening to Sean Penn & then Shia Leboef.
This is amazing
Thank you
Great seeing these conversations and Sarah needs to be in more things. Missed seeing her onscreen.
Great interview. Never thought I’d hear Sarah talk about 2 girls one cup. Also what she said about group mentality. No different than grade school bs
SWC and JB are two, real people, and two bad-asses that if SHTF you would want to roll with. Hopefully they will both continue to get great roles and have long careers. On a side note...SWC kills it in Letterkenny! 😅
i relate to this so much, ive had that same situation happen where the group of guys you thought were your friends just start making fun of you and you literally cant do anything. if you say stop they will do it more and if you simply get up and walk away, they call you sensitive.
Welcome to the world of men. Men are assholes with very thick skin and they joke around like men. Trust me, they treat other men far worse. This was a crybaby moment for Sarah. She should’ve just called then assholes and moved on. Nothing in that story was alarming at all. Everyone is so sensitive anymore. Try working on a construction site and see how much the guys get ragged on…shes trying to play the woke cards and it’s pathetic
You are wrong. Men check each other. This is Masculine pecking order mannerism. If a group of men consider you part of them they will throw insults to check you. Insulting builds men by testing them to overcome this challenges unconsciously this check. Women/feminine are emotional based, prefer compliments. Their feelings get hurt. If men make fun of you they think you are part of the group and you are supposed to overcome this by being stoic and laughing along or check the person back with a comeback or fight it out with the disrespect to find your place in the pecking order. Women should understand this
@@eddyasuma3256 who’s wrong? Sounds like you said pretty much the same thing as me. It’s also pretty common when men and women are friends for men to tease their women friends(treating them like one of the guys) which sounds like what this was.. Obviously women are different and should be sheltered from this kind of stuff but we used to do that and they called us sexist and demanded they be treated as equals…so now they’re treated as equals and their feelings get hurt at the lightest jokes. These same ppl also argue that men and women are not at all different and that woman are not emotional lol we need to go back to what nature taught us…women and men are different and women need to re-learn this and stop trying to blur the lines between men and women. For Sarah to try and relate this joke to sexual harassment is utterly ridiculous and nothing more than trying to bandwagon off outrage culture
@@eddyasuma3256 vicious sexual harassment isn't normal pecking order ish and if it is y'all are even more broken than I thought
@@AvaNightingale yeah he isn't talking about sexual harassment.
Sad to see so many men in the comments who still don't get it. Funny the lot of you following and liking Bernthal when he would slap the shit out of you if given the chance. Bernthal is an example of a real man, where you can be masculine but still a good person, they aren't mutually exclusive like many on either sides of the political and cultural spectrum claim. Shout out to Sarah, a real one.
I'm so glad she told this story. Thank you. Jon's face when she described that read-through table says it all.
Thanks Jon and thank you Sarah for this. The culture is and has changed so much outside of Hollywood. It's hard still for some of us to imagine what it must be like inside, Hollywood. This is an important convo that we need to keep talking about... This brought me back to the scene Jon did in Wind River....so harsh...heart wrenching scene.
Such a good movie, especially the ending. Peace and blessings. 🙏
th-cam.com/video/W7V9Fsll5qM/w-d-xo.html
Is there a full video of this? I have never listened to Sarah, but I'm so damn interested in what she has to say now.
Loved this episode!
She definitely got a tear for me, please tell me this friend wasn't Wentworth Miller...
Probably was. Either way he was in the room for sure.
Yeah I knew he was in the closet at the time but she said that she looked at one guy who she considered to be a good friend and he didn't do anything.
So I just wondered who that was..
I thought maybe Wentworth because he was in the closet at that point and may have been afraid of drawing too much attention but dang that's sad.
I loved both of these shows.
In all honesty, I have not finished the walking dead though. After they killed Shane off It kind of fell off for me.
Wow I’m definitely subbed because of the pit just chillen on the couch! Love that natural an chill unlike every other podcast 4 or five people talking over each other this is what I want raw good content
Man! She hit the nail on the head with men acting like men but deep down they aren’t at all! But Hollywood is the reason for this as well, we believe we can instantly be a man or women if we copycat the image/words used in a movie.
I was a HUGE fan of PRISON BREAK when it started but the more I saw, the worse it got. I didn't like how the producers disregarded her input, treated her pregnancy as an insult & was just flippant about letting her go. Now to hear some coworkers compared her to a fetish porn star & thought she would take that as a compliment just reaffirms how clueless and misguided a LOT of men are. Glad she's telling her story.
I wonder who it is
Holy shit this episode did not start off how I’d envisioned. Just stumbled onto this channel. These are solid interviews.
This was really eye opening and powerful, especially for women.
Wow this girl has my whole soul attentioned towards her she’s memorizing and so raw. Don’t fuck with Sarah y’all!
I can't wait to listen to the full on interview 👌🏿