I serviced a ton of turntables including the direct drive over the last three decades; but never seen the complexity of this type. VCR's were a pain as you pointed out, involving the photo semiconductors, usually I ordered replacement kits that also included resistors in some cases. "Good luck on this unit" and I agree with your analyses from what I have seen, "great video".
You are right, i've never seen such an unusual record deck like that. The platter motor type i didn't expect, well ahead of it's time. And track gap audio blanked to remove the noise. A smart design. By the time i knew the fisher brand, it was cheap crap, i would never touch that brand with a barge pole. The led emitters may not have there normal current flowing, i would break the 9.5v line and use an ammeter, you never know if it was a bad driver. I would be very supprised if all the leds were equally dead.
Looks nice!! The complexity may affect useful life, though. Unless it has a good record of reliability. Or you was proficient in repairs of these devices. Love the airplane sound.
Could you buy some super cheap remote controls, take the UV LED lights out and place them in there? Yes it would be a pain but could that possibly work?
Seems somewhat similar to the JVC L-F71, except for the drive mechanism of both the platter and the tonearm. They seem to use the same cartridge and on my JVC there's a pot that I can turn from the outside to set the liftoff height at which the sensor is able to track. I'm guessing all it does is send more power to the LED in the cartridge. Oddly enough the JVC just uses a regular rubber mat on the platter.
I have the exact same problem with my MT-6360 which I bought new in the early 80's as part of a 6-unit Fisher Studio-Standard sound system. Did you eventually resolve this or is my whole system destined for eBay?
LEDs don't put out much more light if overdriven. There is a part 2 where I did more testing to confirm my initial diagnosis where I did just that. Wait for it.
Hello. Love your channel. I have gotten a Sony SL-20 (red) from ebay. It would not take the tapes in so I followed your instructions for disassembling the um carriage and cleaning that switch that sends the signal that there is a tape in the machine. Unfortunately it suffers from something else as this did not fix the issue. Tapes are still not being taken in by the mechanism. I examined the inside and dis cover that those posts that pop up are fully extracted do not retract at all. I press eject but there is no movement on that ring. I suspect the belts underneath are loose or have simply turn to mush. Ther might be a more complex problem but I believe all I need is belts. Including the tooth belt on the top side. This just stays in place while the gears do move but the belt is too lose to be effective. Where can I find replacement belts for Sony betamax vcrs? Thank you and I appreciate you sharing your knowledge about these betamax vcrs.
If you have a stash of old VCR's try looking in them for optical sensors.. you may be able to "bodge" something together, or at least replace the LEDs if they are IR spectrum. I never throw away the IR sensors when I scrap a VCR or Laser printer... very handy for new projects. Cheers,
You've proven with the flash light that the phototransistors work, just replace the LEDs with modern high efficiency ones, that should be enough to trigger the phototransistors. Also reduce the 270Ohm resistor to increase LED brightness. None of those parts are special, you can replace both LEDs and phototransistors with generic parts, and as you have the variable resistors on the downstream transistors you can tune the circuit. Even the cartridge IR LED can probably be carefully replaced ith a bog standard TV remote LED.
Can you replace the LED itself or is it fused to the sensor? How about adding another LED maybe a white one beside the sensor? It seems it would work from any light source.
I don't think the color matters. It does have to be a sharp beam and it would need to fit in that base to keep the beam focused. The hard part is getting that board out to service it. Tone arm needs to be removed because it goes through the board.
@@12voltvids actually you can access the board in a few minutes by taking the reflective bracket and lower bracket off and be careful with the tonearm wires. There's enough slack on the wires to leave them connected and the tone arm in place. I'm trying to find the correct LEDs to fix mine. Any thoughts?
@@santacruztv9631 Nope. The guy that owned it had a 30.00 repair limit and the amount of work required would exceed that, so he took it and sold it for parts.
This device service reminded me of my work with the Sansui FR-D55. The problem was with the arm mechanism and electronics regulation (time constants of the flip-flops).
Well that's not going to happen as I don't have the table. These "high end" were not that high end. They were problematic from day 1. A real high end table is fully manual.
Had the same problem with the SHARP OPTONICA RP114 vertical turntable both sides A/B turntable the led on both head unit had go weak they play but will not find the groves in the record I have 3 sharp optonica That are fully working
Sure it could, but I don't think you understand how LEDs operate. Increasing the current isn't going to make them brighter. When the semi conductor that emits the photons you see breaks down internally, and photon production is reduced, increasing the current will only increase heat, and make it break down even more. Try it, power up an LED and increase the current and watch what happens. The light level will diminish and will not return.
@@12voltvids I think we both understand that :) It was just as a test, the LEDs will tolerate higher current, but the lifespan will be greatly reduced. Manufacturers give such data for higher drive current under pulse excitation, as an example
I bet the cartage will cost a bit as it has a built in LED , thats if they still make em . Some cartridges & belts are no longer done , ARISTON is one Deck that is discontinued .
@@Hi-Tech-Ray Fisher Electronics was a United States company specialising in the field of hi-fi electronics. The company and the name was bought by Japanese electronics conglomerate Sanyo in 1975. Source Wikipedia, spelling mistakes and all.
i never seen one like that..it has a heck of alot of electronics in it tedious searching a real headache to find the problem when they breakdown ..when sanyo fisher corps got together you know quality went way down !
What do you say to owners to get stuff for free? That you need it for parts? I'm not good at this. They always get suspicious for no reason or something I guess. No matter how clearly I explain that the thing is beyond repair.
They throw away good working items away these days like TVs & VCRs becouse of the silly commercial marketing tells them to . Tons of them have been SKIPPED in the UK . Regrets come after that move .
@@12voltvids - I wouldn't call it "linear", since it's not moving in a straight line, all it does is spinning. It just happens that the stator doesn't fully surround the rotor, but it's just like any synchro motor from VCR's for example, and other things, turntables too.
That would be BMW. Lots of headaches. Had one, never again. I drive one of the most technically advanced cars ever built now and in 8 years have had no problems whatsoever.
I serviced a ton of turntables including the direct drive over the last three decades; but never seen the complexity of this type. VCR's were a pain as you pointed out, involving the photo semiconductors, usually I ordered replacement kits that also included resistors in some cases. "Good luck on this unit" and I agree with your analyses from what I have seen, "great video".
You are right, i've never seen such an unusual record deck like that.
The platter motor type i didn't expect, well ahead of it's time.
And track gap audio blanked to remove the noise.
A smart design.
By the time i knew the fisher brand, it was cheap crap, i would never touch that brand with a barge pole.
The led emitters may not have there normal current flowing, i would break the 9.5v line and use an ammeter, you never know if it was a bad driver.
I would be very supprised if all the leds were equally dead.
I really like this turntable, it's a very unique design and that alone makes it Interesting. Thanks for the video Dave.
wow a blast from my past I had a fisher stereo boom box as they called them back in the day it was pretty good quality if I remember right
Cool turntable! Nice drive system.
If that turntable has been abandoned it be cool to se a follow up video to see if you could get it to work!
Looks nice!! The complexity may affect useful life, though. Unless it has a good record of reliability. Or you was proficient in repairs of these devices. Love the airplane sound.
Could you buy some super cheap remote controls, take the UV LED lights out and place them in there? Yes it would be a pain but could that possibly work?
Seems somewhat similar to the JVC L-F71, except for the drive mechanism of both the platter and the tonearm. They seem to use the same cartridge and on my JVC there's a pot that I can turn from the outside to set the liftoff height at which the sensor is able to track. I'm guessing all it does is send more power to the LED in the cartridge. Oddly enough the JVC just uses a regular rubber mat on the platter.
I have the exact same problem with my MT-6360 which I bought new in the early 80's as part of a 6-unit Fisher Studio-Standard sound system. Did you eventually resolve this or is my whole system destined for eBay?
is your sustem the 8500 with the BA 6000 amp? I have that system and it's vintage awesome! My turn table still works great!
@@jewllake I'd like to know also.
Could you have lowered the value of the 270 ohm dropping resistor to try to drive the LEDs harder to get a little more life out of them?
LEDs don't put out much more light if overdriven. There is a part 2 where I did more testing to confirm my initial diagnosis where I did just that. Wait for it.
This is a rather clever beastie for a Fisher.
EXCELLENT. STAY WITH IT. AWESOME TURNTABLE.
Its a cool unit. Hopefully it will be abandoned.
Just seen you have an updated video. Will watch it with great interest
Hello. Love your channel. I have gotten a Sony SL-20 (red) from ebay. It would not take the tapes in so I followed your instructions for disassembling the um carriage and cleaning that switch that sends the signal that there is a tape in the machine. Unfortunately it suffers from something else as this did not fix the issue. Tapes are still not being taken in by the mechanism. I examined the inside and dis cover that those posts that pop up are fully extracted do not retract at all. I press eject but there is no movement on that ring. I suspect the belts underneath are loose or have simply turn to mush. Ther might be a more complex problem but I believe all I need is belts. Including the tooth belt on the top side. This just stays in place while the gears do move but the belt is too lose to be effective. Where can I find replacement belts for Sony betamax vcrs? Thank you and I appreciate you sharing your knowledge about these betamax vcrs.
If you have a stash of old VCR's try looking in them for optical sensors.. you may be able to "bodge" something together, or at least replace the LEDs if they are IR spectrum. I never throw away the IR sensors when I scrap a VCR or Laser printer... very handy for new projects.
Cheers,
You've proven with the flash light that the phototransistors work, just replace the LEDs with modern high efficiency ones, that should be enough to trigger the phototransistors. Also reduce the 270Ohm resistor to increase LED brightness. None of those parts are special, you can replace both LEDs and phototransistors with generic parts, and as you have the variable resistors on the downstream transistors you can tune the circuit. Even the cartridge IR LED can probably be carefully replaced ith a bog standard TV remote LED.
Muito bom ver um vídeo, de um técnico falando em inglês e uma bancada de serviço bagunçada 😬 pensava que todos eram arrumadinhas.
Can you replace the LED itself or is it fused to the sensor? How about adding another LED maybe a white one beside the sensor? It seems it would work from any light source.
I don't think the color matters. It does have to be a sharp beam and it would need to fit in that base to keep the beam focused. The hard part is getting that board out to service it. Tone arm needs to be removed because it goes through the board.
@@12voltvids actually you can access the board in a few minutes by taking the reflective bracket and lower bracket off and be careful with the tonearm wires. There's enough slack on the wires to leave them connected and the tone arm in place. I'm trying to find the correct LEDs to fix mine. Any thoughts?
@@santacruztv9631
Nope. The guy that owned it had a 30.00 repair limit and the amount of work required would exceed that, so he took it and sold it for parts.
That must be one quiet drive system on that turntable. Really cool!
Except it isn't
You can hear it rotating.
My copy of the Fisher MT-6360 is dead quiet while running.
That is a pretty Advanced record player there!
I bet this thing is enjoyable to work on.
Thanks Dave. I am curious to see the outcome. J K
This device service reminded me of my work with the Sansui FR-D55. The problem was with the arm mechanism and electronics regulation (time constants of the flip-flops).
That direct drive system looks like it was very advanced back in those days...
Would like to see this project completed. It would save a lot of high end 80s turntables with sensors.
Well that's not going to happen as I don't have the table. These "high end" were not that high end. They were problematic from day 1. A real high end table is fully manual.
Nice one! Definitely worth repairing!
Had the same problem with the SHARP OPTONICA RP114 vertical turntable both sides A/B turntable the led on both head unit had go weak they play but will not find the groves in the record I have 3 sharp optonica That are fully working
I only have a Fisher RS-1022 such a MT-6360 would look sooo great on it's side.
Could the IR LED in the tone arm be driven separately, and the current in the "position" LEDs increased, to see if it reads the arm position then?
Sure it could, but I don't think you understand how LEDs operate. Increasing the current isn't going to make them brighter. When the semi conductor that emits the photons you see breaks down internally, and photon production is reduced, increasing the current will only increase heat, and make it break down even more. Try it, power up an LED and increase the current and watch what happens. The light level will diminish and will not return.
@@12voltvids I think we both understand that :) It was just as a test, the LEDs will tolerate higher current, but the lifespan will be greatly reduced. Manufacturers give such data for higher drive current under pulse excitation, as an example
@@greengrayradio1394
Watch part 2.
Interesting turntable.
Maybe the problem is more simple, the reflective surface could be dirt and not reflecting light.
Already cleaned it made no difference.
here's a thought you might of missed , the lighting in your shop/ if you are useing Flouresent light it will have an effect on infra detection.
Led lighting mostly
@@12voltvids I love your patience in teaching what you are doing. You do such a Awsome job, - keep up the great work...you are a great teacher..
what a great machine.
It's like a CD player expect that it's for vinyl records and l think that that's pretty cool!!!
I bet the cartage will cost a bit as it has a built in LED , thats if they still make em .
Some cartridges & belts are no longer done , ARISTON is one Deck that is discontinued .
Highly unlikely it is available.
@@12voltvids Thats the catch .
I guess you'd never change the cart on that table. And what if they stopped making a stylus for it...
@12voltvids when did Sanyo and fisher merged?
Late 70s Fisher was bought by sanyo.
12voltvids hmmm I was under the impression it was early to mid 80s. I heard confusing answers of that.
@@Hi-Tech-Ray
Fisher Electronics was a United States company specialising in the field of hi-fi electronics. The company and the name was bought by Japanese electronics conglomerate Sanyo in 1975.
Source Wikipedia, spelling mistakes and all.
Can anyone tell me where i can find a replacement cartridge for this model ? Thank you in advance
Google is your friend. You can try some vintage HiFi shops but really Google the model and see what pops up.
Try cleaning the reflective surfaces on that movable arm. Maybe they are dirty and dispersing the light
Already did that too.
Very cool. Looks over engineered, but when working I bet it’s cool.
i never seen one like that..it has a heck of alot of electronics in it tedious searching a real headache to find the problem when they breakdown ..when sanyo fisher corps got together you know quality went way down !
yes need one
Also try cleaning the LEDs
First thing I tried.
@@12voltvids Excellent!! Love the channel,, Excellent work!
high technology for 79 too much wow!
What do you say to owners to get stuff for free? That you need it for parts?
I'm not good at this. They always get suspicious for no reason or something I guess. No matter how clearly I explain that the thing is beyond repair.
They throw away good working items away these days like TVs & VCRs becouse of the silly commercial marketing tells them to .
Tons of them have been SKIPPED in the UK .
Regrets come after that move .
He will likely want it back so he can sell it to someone else.
I get the same thing they want money for a parts wrecker. I say be my guest take it away
Hell, they might as well throw in an AM/FM tuner... 😏
🤦🏼♂️ Such a simple turntable motor mechanism. Too bad it has basically NO torque.
That's what is called a linear motor.
@@12voltvids - I wouldn't call it "linear", since it's not moving in a straight line, all it does is spinning. It just happens that the stator doesn't fully surround the rotor, but it's just like any synchro motor from VCR's for example, and other things, turntables too.
@@750kv8 well actually it is. The 3 coils are in a line not placed around the rotor.
It did play to begin with .
Manual yes. It starts turning as soon as power applied though. Not supposed to turn till arm is moved.
I see / well did you fix it ? Thanks for reply !
@@waynepollard6879
Nope, owner of it has not responded to messages I have left so it sits awaiting instructions.
just wondering / thanks for reply
Just replace the LEDs, 1970's LEDs (40 yrs old) were very early generation and don't have the life-span of today's LEDs.
Easier said than done. Owner has not given me approval to do it, and I am not doing it for free.
Fisher gadgets are produced in Hong Kong. Crap quality especially components.
Fisher of this era was produced by Sanyo in Japan and some were very good quality.
They are now far better than this CRAP they all make today !
Everything is
SANYO have a good sound for a start .
Audio only no video.
??????
Over engineered electronics just like in modern cars cause nothing but headaches.
That would be BMW. Lots of headaches. Had one, never again. I drive one of the most technically advanced cars ever built now and in 8 years have had no problems whatsoever.