The Promised Neverland - An Incomplete Masterpiece
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 5 มิ.ย. 2024
- The Promised Neverland tries to be a lot of different things at once. Many were disappointed in the direction it took, and yet there is so much value in this story both in spite of and because of its deep-seated flaws. In this full analysis of the manga I hope to both appreciate its highest highs, and understand its lowest lows.
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Reconstructed #5
Voicelines by
@Afterthoughts as Isabella
@kikikrazed as Emma
@HeavyEyed as Sonju
@KaiAfterKai as Grand Duke Leuvis
@wizawhat as Kaiu Shirai
All of them are awesome creators that I highly recommend checking out!
Further reading on Sister Krone's depiction:
floatingintobliss.wordpress.c...
butwhythopodcast.com/2021/02/...
hopefully the next video is coming soon now that i have some wind in my sails
00:00 - Intro
02:16 - Part 1: Escape
25:43 - Part 2: Vegan Demons
32:23 - Part 3: Goldy Pond
46:53 - Part 4: Timeskip
53:47 - Part 5: Norman vs Emma (and God)
1:05:26 - Part 6: How it Goes Down
1:19:43 - Part 7: It Couldn't
1:25:10 - Outro
The Promised Neverland Video Essay
The Promised Neverland Analysis
The Promised Neverland Retrospective
#thepromisedneverland
#videoessay
#analysis - ภาพยนตร์และแอนิเมชัน
So what did you think of my interpretation of The Promised Neverland? Did you see it from a totally different angle? Even with how very long this video ended up being there's still a ton of stuff from the story that didn't make it into script, and likely a lot of it could change my analysis significantly, so I'm super interested in hearing what other fans of the series have to say. If you enjoyed this essay and want to help make more creations like this one possible, please consider donating to my Patreon (www.patreon.com/skyehoppers) My long-term goal for the patreon is to build a community around discussing and analyzing media in a more freeform and accessible way than you would find in an English classroom. Anyway! Here are some discussion suggestions for stuff that didn't quite make it into my script!
1. What does the character of Ayshe represent to the story? She is a super cool character, but only features in a few chapters. What do you think they were going for there? Do you think she could have benefitted from a more slowly-paced second half?
2. Why does Emma go out of her way to tell Sonju she wouldn't mind being eaten by him? Does that not go against a lot of the other themes of the work? Doesn't Emma's idealism revolve around the idea that no one should die unless absolutely necessary?
3. As I describe, religiosity is clearly viewed as a pretty important aspect of society within the series. However, it's only the demons that are religious and not the humans at all. Was this only to avoid having to pick a real-life religion for the kids? Or is there a deeper message in that discrepancy?
4. What do you think about the depiction of The One (the unpronounceable demon entity)? Does it represent anything in particular? Is it anything more than just a plot device? Why exactly was Emma the only one able to access it in the end?
5. One thing that kind of gets dropped as the series progresses are the varied names different groups of humans give the demons. Yugo and Lucas call them man-eaters and the Goldy Pond kids just call them monsters. However, by the end of the series they are just exclusively called demons, even among themselves. Does this naming convention mean anything to you? Does it perhaps reflect or foreshadow Norman's ideology and character arc that he was the one to name them that in the first place?
6. This is kind of a big one, and I initially wanted to definitely include it in the video but it felt like it would take too much time to explore. Do you think there is an implicit endorsement of eugenics within the series? There is so much value placed on intelligence throughout the story, and it can be inferred that the only reason our main characters are such supergeniuses is because the demons have been breeding people specifically for intelligence for centuries. Do you think that implies that eugenics might be a good idea for society? Or is there a counterargument to that built into the story as well (I can think of some stuff that may point that way)? In the end, does the story do enough to avoid that kind of pro-eugenics reading?
And that's all I can think of for now!
What did you think about the anime if you watched it?
I am in awe of your work. I am currently on mobile and have not finished this video but once I do I will be back to attempt to answer your ideological questions.
On second thought I’m definitely going to have to re-read the manga for this one. I’ll be back though, I can assure you that much.
I would say that’s more classism.
@@kirbycommon7570 s1 amazing s2 trash
man knowing nothing about tpn this video was a trip. The story is like "the meat industry is unethical, capitalism will kill us all, and we need to forge a new future driven my recognition of the value of human life," and I was like "yes please go on" and then it was like "and thats why we need a theocratic monarchy" and I was like "wait what"
What did this story have to do with capitalism?
@@micahcoleman2760 be fr
Overconsumption bro
@@RiverFowler overconsumption
@@micahcoleman2760 did you not watch the whole thing lol?
Ray being sidelined was one of my biggest gripes with the series as I first read it. It felt like there were stretches of chapters were he just didn't say anything. Not in a metaphorical sense - he just didn't have any fucking dialogue for like 15 chapters at a time.
I do feel like he was supposed to die, probably when he tried to self immolate. It's hard to say what happened, but he was never truly a force in the story beyond that point, and it only got worse for him. A completely undeniable Ray death in or around Goldy Pond could have done a lot for the series:
- It would've challenged Emma in a way that Yugo's death didn't, especially if it was just flat out her fault.
- Having him out of the way would've cleared space for a focused conflict between Norman and Emma, if the series didn't want to have the web of conflict from the first arc.
- When Norman came back, it'd have been even more bittersweet knowing that Ray never found out that he lived, and they could never reunite. Plus, seeing Ray's very dead corpse would've softened the blow to stakes that Norman's return had.
In fact, if I remember correctly, the initial script was for Ray to die at Grace Field. Furthermore, Gilda would become a mother or a sister.
Yea. Could have used more Ray. Emma is cool but if got played out fast having to hear her constant naive ideals that always somehow worked out. And the few times it didn’t she got over them pretty quickly
I think what could’ve been an interesting idea was the 3 and the general family having a bit of a falling out with Emma, Norman, and Ray being the center of this.
Norman wants to destroy and kill off the demons, Emma wants a solution where genocide wasn’t involved while also saving the humans, Ray however just wants to leave and never look back at this world along with his family, Ray knew they were just children and thinks going up against a full fledged government of demons was suicidal, he and some of the children just want to leave the demon world forever and have normal lives.
And of course the three have a big argument with no one able to compromise or change their minds. This leads to the family’s separation with kids going with either Norman, Emma, or Ray. From then on the family’s go on there ways by themselves. After some time perhaps Ray has his regrets and eventually changes his mind , perhaps finding something in his journey to leave the demon world, similar things could happen with Emma and Norman until eventually the 3 groups get together again after they all went on there individually journey’s, reuniting the family once more as there experiences change there perspectives. I think doing this would’ve given Ray more to do and more of a purpose in the story rather then just turning him into Emma’s yesman.
He was supposed to die after the first arc
But his popularity saved him
There too many characters added to series after the Goldy pond arc. We barely learned anything about Emma and Ray’s siblings. It made sense that he’d agree with Emma because she proved him wrong before. But he should more realistically like how Norman was in the first arc instead being coming Emma’s follower.
Norman being the final villian was so obviously there, but I felt like they rushed to the current ending. Norman was displayed as the stubborn humanist who wished to kill all the demons even seeing Mujica and Sonju as villainous. Of course both Sonju and Mujica are not completely good or bad, but the complex grey nature of the series was made black and white in order to swiftly end the story.
He wasn’t the villain tho
@@xedsity I know, but they set him up so well to BE the villian.
@@theredcomet844But he wasn’t? If anything he’s an amazing protagonist who fend of demons
Norman aint no SIMP!
Norman is a real one
I think a key element of Goldy Pond that irked me when i read it was that unlike with Grace Field there was no build up just jumping immediately into the action. Imagine if Emma and Ray had to survive several hunts slowly building up resources, knowledge, and support all while dodging death. Ray could be opposed to letting people in but willing to accept his newfound trust in Emma's ideals. Imagine if a key player died forcing them to reconsider. Every hunt they wait more kids die but the more time they have to set up. But instead the plan was there when they arrived, the special guns were already made, and the allies already formed into a tight nit group.
That would just be re-treading the first arc
@@Kaynadian1337 No you could still show growth and a change in mind set. Before they were trying everything to escape but now they are trying to overcome. Plus the first arc is what is good about the show having more would not be a bad thing. No one complains when Goku finds someone stronger than him trains and then beats them even though it happens every arc.
i'm seriously impressed by all the hard work that went into making this. thank you for having me!
The Promised Neverland is a series that means so much to me, but while I didn’t necessarily mind that the ending was so optimistic, it felt very unearned. Having someone put words to why that was is significant. Thank you for this video.
"An Incomplete Masterpiece" is the perfect description for TPN, if certain issues were addressed it would have been so much better. The main issue being plot conveniences.
I can't believe how throughly engaging this hour and a half long video essay on a manga I've never read nor ever plan to is PHENOMINAL work, can't wait to see what you get into next!
Just started the video but am continually impressed by how captivating your intros are. I have never started one of your videos and not watched it the whole way through.
Wow, thank you!
Chicken Run's anime adaptation got weird
Lmao, perfect comment
In an interview with the authors in 2018 (At that time the manga had only 10 volumes published in Japan), Kaiu Shirai mentioned that his editor recommended him not to make a very long story. Because of this, Shirai had planned for the series to last between 20 or 30 volumes. He also mentions that, when he wanted to submit his series to the Shonen Jump, he sent a "basic script" of about 300 pages that covered until the escape from Grace Field House. What is interesting to me, however, is the phrase "basic script", implying that he also had a much more elaborate script with most of the story (if not all of it). Taking into account the words expressed in the interview, and the possible existence of a complete script of the series, I think it is quite obvious that the story of "The Promised Neverland", was going to be much longer than it ended up being.
Another thing I wanted to mention, was how much the story had changed from the original idea. In another interview with the authors on the occasion of the anime's release (which was later published in an illustration booklet called simply "Escape"), Shirai revealed that the story changed radically during the creation of the manga. Originally, there was no secret room from Isabella, Ray was going to die and sister Krone survived. And later, when Emma returned to Grace Field some time later, she discovered that Krone had become the new Mother and Gilda was the new Sister. And most surprising of all. William Minerva did not exist.
By the way, here is the 2018 interview:
blog.francetvinfo.fr/popup/2018/08/21/on-a-tout-fait-pour-que-la-serie-soit-un-succes-et-on-a-reussi-entretien-avec-les-auteurs-du-manga-the-promised-neverland.html
And here is the interview from the illustration book:
yakusokunoneverland.fandom.com/wiki/Interviews#Volume_13_Special_Edition_Q&A
Thanks for sharing these interviews.
Clearly the story could have been longer (30 volumes ~ 270 chapters instead of 180) but I think there are compelling arguments against the existence of a complete script : (
In the french interview, "script de base" means "the original script we submitted to the shonen jump" not just "minimal script". Kaiu Shirai also said the ideal case was to keep the story short although he had no obligation from the editor yet : "Dans l’idéal, j’aimerais, en accord avec mon éditeur, que l’histoire ne se prolonge pas trop."
However it's possible that the shonen jump editors made him rush his script later on.
@@jeremyb1346 This kind of stuff really pisses me off, just knowing that we could of gotten an even better and engaging story than what we did just because some CORPORATE ASSHOLES WANTED TO RUSH EVERYTHING!!!
Gilda being the new sister wouldve been so cool
I just watched your Analysis of B/W and wanted to see what else you have. Good stuff, I really like it! You're editing is gorgeous and precise, your Audio crystal clear and the argument is wonderfully structured and easy to follow. Gonna tune in more often, for sure!
Yo same
Aw thanks so much :)
Same
Great video! Though I feel like I've got to mention what I feel like the series has also lost: its edge, partially. Especially when it comes to both the characters of Emma and Ray. It's no question that Emma genuinely loved her family, though the face she makes right after Ray asks her "You haven't really given up, have you?" was almost, well... "serial killer like", for a lack of a better word. Led me to believe that she'd be willing to do pretty much anything to keep her family safe, even if it meant killing... but nope, aside from some wild demons she never really goes for it, as far as I recall. And Ray in general seems to have become pretty much a background character.
Being an animal rights activist and a vegan and therefore unavoidably perceiving TPN mainly through that lense, hearing you say the words "we are talking about the meat industry" and putting the emphasis on it that it deserves felt incredibly cathartic.
Spending most of your time in either like-minded activist circles or with people who oppose and sometimes outright hate you and getting bogged down in so many details, you sometimes start to lose track of what it is you're really fighting for in the end. I don't know why exactly...maybe it is because I have gotten so used to animals and the way we treat them being ignored in even leftist discourse and especially media analysis...but hearing it from you, hearing about this topic that occupies my thoughts every single day of the year from someone I don't know, from someone who I would never associate it with, made me feel extremely emotional and hopeful and I want to thank you for that. Motivation to keep on fighting come to me from many odd and unexpected sources, and this video certainly was one of them.
Hi! I'm glad that could resonate with you. The animal rights metaphor has always been a core part of the series to me, and it's surprising how many people have made whole videos about TPN without mentioning it at all. While it's a bit disappointing that that theme is less important as the story goes on, there are a good few people, myself included, that felt it changed their minds about just how humane the "humane" sectors of the meat industry are. So clearly we aren't the only ones who saw it that way!
Idk if it's ignored in leftist discourse, but rather most leftist discourse tends to not talk about individual consumption because they're about collectively changing society.
At first I was relieved this was split up into parts so I could take breaks and watch it throughout the day, but it ended up being so interesting and compelling that I watched the whole thing for 2 hours straight (including pausing to read) instead.
Actually decided to bounce on watching the show -- back when it was at peak popularity -- since bleak stories tend to mess with me a bit more than I'm comfortable with. So I was really interested seeing this pop up having enjoyed the last video you made so much! (Definitely some irony in that take I had, hearing how the story actually played out after the first arc's reception.) Even as someone with absolutely no horse in the race when it came to the series, this video perfectly got across why it was so beloved and then so conflicting and mixed among people I knew... but I really love how the video didn't seem to cast absolutely everything towards the latter half in a universally negative light. (While also not pulling punches where it really didn't earn some character beats.) Omitting information about the author until the end really helped to tie that discussion off too, whereas most videos have me used to getting that info earlier on, good eye to the structure on that one. Keep up the great work!
This editing is master class the transitions and way you incorporate the manga panels
38:21 I think I might have an answer for that.
So, the agreement between Julius Ratri and Ivelk (yes, the old king has a name, check it out) was to stop hunting each other, but the actual Promise with the god was to separte the worlds if the demons offered him the best meat and if the Ratri Family became the gatekeepers.
This is all seen in chapter 142*, the god never mention anything about the hunting, so that part was only an agreement between humans and demons, while the actual promise was only about separating the worlds
About Ayshe, she is a rally interesting character, showing Norman's bad actions, and she would have been just SO PERFECT as the reason for Norman to change and stop the genocide, I mean, sure, listen to your sister who you haven´t seen in the last two years, BUT PLEASE LISTEN TO THE GIRL YOU YOU MADE ORPHAN. It would have been interesting that if Ayshe got the opportunity to kill Norman, she would have hurt him, and so he learns, it would have been, at least, more interesting, with Lambda's against Ayshe, Emma and Ray without either of them specifically , being the mediators, and only Don and Gilda being completely on Ayshe's side (well, no, but they would have supported her more than the rest), she would have functioned as a force for change together with Emma, too bad it was wasted, and the best thing they gave us was a scene of Norman saying something to him in demonic language (something we don't even know, COME ON, THAT´S NOT HOW YOU DEAL WITH A CHILDREN'S SUFFERING)
Now, talking about the one, I like to think about him the same way I think about The Truth from Fullmetal Alchemist. They are both identities in their own world that represent sacrifice, and how you can't wish for everything, but with one difference, The Truth DOES limits what the person wants (he took Al's body and Ed's leg, but never really revived their mother, just some kind of Zombie?) The brothers' sacrifice didn't mean anything in the end, meanwhile in tpn, Him (that´s how is called in the anime) does fulfills emma's wish, does not limit wishes as far as we know.
Now, if you want me to be honest, is just the author's way to say "Emma did sacrifice, you can´t get everything, this story is actually sad and defenatly not convinient!" but she will reunite with her family and act like nothing happend (yeah, she doesn't remember anything, but she is happy with her family, is what she always wanted) one is cruel and teaches an actual valuable and belivable lesson, while the other one works as an explanation for the main conflict, and as a convenient "obstacle" which at the same time is the solution.
Sorry the comment is long, but these are my thoughts, also, sorry if something is not understandable, I'm still learning english.
*Pd: Sorry, I got the chapter wrong, the chapter where the promised is showed is chapter 142, already corrected.
Thanks for your perspective! And don't worry it was perfectly understandable. That's a really good idea for how they could've used Ayshe better! It's such a cool concept for a character that advances the depth of the world so much, but not allowing her to interact with the plot in canon kinda ruined that. And nice comparison to The Truth! That's really fitting and I hadn't considered that. Somehow I feel the Truth just meshes with the rest of FMA's world better than Him, but it's been a while and I'd have to rewatch to see if I still have that opinion.
Criminally under-rated, if wish one of these videos get pushed out onto the algorithm. Videos with hours of work shouldn’t go unnoticed
I havent heard the Bastion game soundtrack music in ages
Let's gooo so excited to watch this in full, congrats on finally getting it out
I think this is excellent, thank you for the video!
I do think that, through the first few arcs, though, I have a different reading than yours. I don't actually think the story means to represent the meat industry literally, but rather as a class conflict.
I'm not generally the sort of person who takes up class based readings in everything, but I actually see a lot here. The humans being raised are underclasses, whose sacrifice and stunted lives grease the wheels and pave the way for the elite to live in a society of their design that privileges them. This even makes sense with the cultivation of the educated kids from the best farms - every society needs smart or skilled workers specially equipped for certain jobs. In the end, though, a real world college educated bureaucrat is still just a cog in the machine. They are the middle class, as it were. The industrial farms are the true lower class. They are the most numerous, and lead the lives with the fewest comforts. They are just a cheap resource for the real elite.
Then you get the different varieties of demon motivations. You have the ones who are content to just reap the labor set up by society (eating from the farms), the ones who pretend they are competing on a level playing field with those under them (Goldy Pond), and the ones who truly do seem to want to prove their superiority in a more or less level fight (the ones trying to set up a real hunt). In the end, humans are still the underclass literally fueling demon/elite society.
Norman, then, is kinda an "eat the rich" type trying to actually eliminate the upper class through revolution, while others seek to rebalance the scale.
There is plenty of this that doesn't make a ton of sense (I don't get the wild demons or "you are what you eat" elements), but I don't know that a vegan reading is much more clear to me.
Anyway, sorry if this reads like a collegiate Marxist or something. Like I said, I usually don't see class everywhere, but it is what I got here.
Ah dang, I shouldn't have written this at the 1 hour mark when you were asking your rhetorical questions! Now I'm the dummy who didn't let you finish your point, lol.
Anyway, great video!
Probably the best video on TPN on youtube as a whole. Listening to you talking about the story was really captivating. I was glued to the screen when you got to the Goldy Pond arc. I haven't read a single Chapter and only seen the first episode of the Anime. Sad to see/hear, that the story didn't get a satisfying ending. Maybe I will read or watch the first arc and stop after that (as is suggested by some).
Thank you for this video.
This video deserves more views.
i absolutely adore your channel--i havent even played, seen, or read most of your topics, but your essays are so compelling and i went and watched all your videos anyway. you have such valuable and unique insight with excellent delivery. thanks for sharing with the world! : ) i hope your channel blows up, you really deserve it!
Aww thank you so much! And tbh my standards the channel is kinda blowing up rn! Hopefully I can keep riding this wave
I came here after watching the anime so i could get some recap of the manga. But i didnt expect such a well written and edited video! You definitely gained a new subscriber and i hope to see more of your work!
You definitely caught my attention! Ended up watching the whole way through, amazing effort and well done!
Super excellent video and analysis. Makes me want a reread of the manga to see what new ideas I notice.
i’m a tad late but this may just be one of the greatest video essays i have ever seen. the promised neverland is such a mind blowing and thought provoking piece of media and i LOVE seeing people have different opinions/feelings on it. great work!
I'm sure the explanation in-universe but the Goldy Pond being illegal is probably to reflect the fact that Canned Hunting is illegal in many places today. Essentially trapping an animal where it can run but never truly escape
Great video essay! I only ever watched the first season of the anime so seeing how it went on is really interesting.
From what you made out the parallels to our meat industry were by far the most interesting part about this piece of media and it's sad that they drop that.
I also remember that when Norman died my brain didn't even register it as an actual death. He was just too important. So that really took a while to set it and I'm honestly a little sad they didn't stick to their guns there and kept him dead
This was interesting video and the production value is really good. Nice one
You made me watch such a long video in a language i'm not fluent. You're just gorgeous! What an incredible analysis. Thank you for that. I agree with everything, still the manga somehow keeps being one of my favorites stories ever.
Fantastic work
Great video and impeccable song choices ;) thanks for including me in the project! :D
I'm always amazed by how much your presentation of both visuals, trough your editing, and ideas, trough your script, keeps getting better and better each video!
I'm an anime only watcher so this is the perfect opportunity to learn more about the series, since the anime kinda ruined it for me
Great job!
I wanted to know the ending but couldn't get myself to keep reading after the goldy pond arc. Thank you for your service 🙏🏼
a beautiful and intriguing video
I enjoyed every minute of this fantastic analysis with all the hard work you also put into the visuals. As someone who generally liked the manga I still agree with every weakness you put up or at least understand why some people may dislike certain aspects or arcs of the story. Goldy Pond was my favorite arc to read but I agree that it all just seemed to convenient and Emma surviving what should have been a fatal injury (in fact the same injury that killed Isabella in the end) even after getting no medical treatment until 3 days later when Yugo carried her back to the shelter was... well, convenient.
After this arc, there is this long ass timeskip which really takes the reader out of the story. I wish that the author at least used the timeskip to give us more info about Norman and the Lambda farms. Okay, that may have been to early to reveal him but I hoped that at some point we would have learned more about how these farms worked, how Norman was part of the escape plan, who and how actually came up with this plan, etc. I ended up reading a great fanfiction about this part of the story and it showed me how much potential there was in telling another interesting escape story with great characters.
Then my biggest personal complaint about TPN is Ray's character as he was my favorite. I somewhere read that the author intended to really kill him at the end of the escape arc and that definitely shows in how irrelevant he becomes immediately after this arc. Which is a shame.
When it comes to the ending (meaning their life in the human world): I am completely fine with it. It is a happy end but there is a downside with Emma losing her memories. Obviously there is another pacing issue because they wrap up a two year search for her in one or two chapters, but other than that it concludes what the aim of the story has always been: Emma living a happy life with her family.
Грустно, что я не успела на «вечеринку», но хочу вас поблагодарить за такое глубокое погружение в материал и в целом за отличную работу! Вы передали словами (и изображениями) все мои чувства относительно Манги и аниме. Спасибо Вам!
Finally was able to get around to watching this. I haven't fully caught up with the manga, but I have to say... I pretty much agree with all your points. The first arc set up something really exciting with some tight storytelling, but I'm disappointed at where it all went form there. It could have been so much better.
Also your editing in this video was so great! Love your choice to add color to the black and white illustration to highlight a character's quote. Great idea!
Shared, liked, saved; dude, nice work!
Great video! I don't really watch many shows so this was really interesting and it was nice to hear your perspective as well. (1:19:47 "It Coudln't")
Aww fuck how did I not notice that?? Good catch lol I need to hire a proofreader
The very same quality, if not more, of channels that enjoy much larger audiences. Keep it up mate
Good job. Thank you❤
Man, that pen made so much change in the story
This was excellent, thanks so much. As a staunch animal rights advocate/vegan/whatever you want to call it, I appreciate how eloquently you addressed the allegories head-on and in an unbiased manner. Your channel really deserves more love. I've enjoyed all of your content so far and this was a treat.
I love how many people will read this and not see how it relates to veganism
Timeskip looking like Mess is a nice touch
Fuck now I wanna rewatch the first season of the anime, Absolute banger video man, you did an amazing job
I just changed my rating of The Promised Neverland from 9/10 to 8/10 because of this. Great video!
I love this story, though the fandom discourse I encountered is often disappointing. The beginning of the story goes from a thriller survival story to simply relying on a Theocratic Monarchy to solve divides by another isolationist policy. And then the fans I met is busy justifying Genocide and is really sexist against Emma for being idealistic.
Humans of our world and present has more similarities to Demons society than the children's mutual aid structure. Readers (who agrees in Genocide as practical) I have discussions with basically communicates that humans has to be extinct for other life forms on earth to have value.
So this video really washed my icky experience. When the draw for me is largely how un-apologetically the initial setup viewed the systems as wrong, and those in conflict can still work with each other with love or defiance towards the system.
Excellent work, I'd love to see you go into a deep dive about Phil. The manga basically scrapped whatever initial plan they had with him. (at least in my eyes)
Speaking of which, when reading Promised Neverland weekly as it was coming out, I genuinely became vegetarian for two years because it effected me greatly and had me questioning if our real life was humane.
Aisha too
I appreciate this video. I didn’t know how I feltl about TPN's second half, besides disliking it. I have strong opinions on the first half - I know exactly why I like the first chapter and why I dislike Goldy Pond - but reading weekly and losing interesting around the timeskip, reading new chapters became a chore. And it's not a series I was particularly inclined to reread. I know the second half was boring and most plot developments felt unearned, but I never dug into it like you have.
I don't think there are many manga chapters where I remember the day they came out as vividly as I do the day of TPN's debut. I still think it's one of the best chapter 1s I've ever seen in Jump. An opening that doesn’t just follow the blueprint but is built around setting up a twist that will hook you, that stuck in every reader’s mind.
I like your breakdown of the four pillars on which TPN's appeal is built - complexity, stakes, mystery, and difficulty - but I was surprised at the praise for Goldy Pond because that's the arc where I personally felt TPN lost those qualities. The drop in complexity, the shift from mindgames to action, used to bother me more, but now it’s the drop in difficulty that disappoints me.
I think that the appeal of the first arc is in the asymmetry. No matter how many advantages the kids have, no matter how intelligently they plan, Isabella is their physical and mental superior, and has the backing of the demons. I really enjoyed the breakdown you had of specific moments and actions the kids took that emphasized the difficulty, and I think that works because it's paired with an inherently asymmetrical conflict that believably necessitates all that.
And Goldy Pond loses all of that. I honestly think that the single biggest mistake of the series was giving the kids guns and letting them get so skilled so fast. 99% of demons are simply no longer a threat at that point. They're no longer underdogs. There might be dangerous threats, but it’s no longer a dangerous world.
The second issue is I think it was way too easy for Emma to stumble into another group of talented kids. The beginning of Goldy Pond recaptured the sense of asymmetrical danger that the first arc had. It felt like it evolved the tension, put Emma into an even more dangerous situation than before. But that ends way too quickly when she finds her allies, and from there the children are on the attack. I think most of the fights against the hunter demons were simply too easy, personally. It felt to me like the kids were already so good at outthinking and outshooting the demons that they could have done this at anytime.
Leuvis was still a good villain. But I think his presence doesn't maintain the sense of difficulty and stakes. Rather, it limits it. The only threat to the children is a rare, particularly powerful demon. Who else can be a threat once they've defeated him? Almost nobody. The only major threats after that are a forgettable mercenary and the Queen herself, both of whom were boring.
I think the series was losing the sense of mystery even earlier than Goldy Pond, though.
I think I have different priorities from the author here. When a setting is built around the mystery of what’s outside the walls, my imagination runs wild. The magic of how many insane things could be out there. If there’s demons, then what else is there? I expected an Edge Chronicles-level world of mystery and dangerous creatures, or at least something like Nausicaa. I think the sense of danger and difficulty would have remained if there were countless unique fantastical threats, all dangerous to humans, to find.
Even Attack on Titan, a series I loathe to praise, did it right. The reveal of what's really out there in the world completely recontextualizes everything.
In TPN, from chapter 1, we know this setting has demons who eat farm-grown humans. At the end of the series, that still pretty much sums it up. There’s more details, but the core idea isn’t evolved much. The only big answer is about the other universe which I honestly just think is lame, because that’s not “what’s outside the walls.” What’s outside the walls is already answered by the question.
In another place I have to disagree, I don’t think the demons are varied enough. I think they fall into the biggest trap with fantasy races - they’re a monolith. They all revolve around eating humans. Their differences are differences in opinions on whether they should eat humans, or how they should eat humans. They’re, as you point out, essentially humans, but humans vary way more than this. I think this reduces the mystery further. Maybe if it didn’t skip over the kids infiltrating society, it could have explored this.
I feel like Musica is where the meat symbolism falls apart. It's already shaky, because humans have no parallel to needing to eat something specific to maintain sapience. But Musica is such an easy solution. Humans don’t need meat in that way, so the concept just doesn’t apply. Once she shares her power, maybe a conflict more similar to real life would begin, as some demons might still want to eat humans for pleasure, but the story is already done.
I think the reason I lost interest completely after Goldy Pond was how little felt earned after that. It was the moment when they solved some riddle about the seven walls and we didn’t see the riddle itself, just were told they solved it. As you say, looking up the solution to the puzzle in a game.I feel like this basically fills the rest of the series in so many places that we can't even comment on them all. Like, in addition to Norman's sanctuary erasing the stakes, it also feels so unearned how he apparently just made that place exist.
I have to mention this at basically any TPN discussion, but Shadows House has filled the TPN-sized hole in my heart. It's a similar series down to having a botched anime adaptation by Cloverworks. It's also about intelligent children in an unique fantasy setting scheming and planning to survive. It has strengths and weaknesses relative to TPN and certainly isn't perfect, but I think it's maintained its quality much better and is an overall great read.
I also think there are a lot of similarities in discussion to here to Mistborn, particularly its first book. Similar themes about oppression, and built around a character dynamic similar to Emma and Norman’s moral conflict. Though it goes in very different directions with it. It also has the advantage of not portraying its political solution as perfect since it has a lot of sequels to explore consequences in.
Really, the "everything is okay if a rightful monarch is put in place" is just too big of a topic to even get into here.
Mistborn also has an interesting comparison with regard to your religion question. In Mistborn, religion is largely something for the upper class, not the lower class. I think the connection is that when the oppressed group is dehumanized enough, they don’t even get religion to give them hope. There’s something very human (though not universally) about choosing to have faith that better times will come. But livestock don’t get religion. This isn't necessarily an idea TPN develops further, and I have no idea how the existence of the god demon plays into this, but I think this is consistent with the themes.
As to some of your other questions:
2. This one is baffling. A sign of friendship? Saying factory farming is bad but hunting yourself is not? That contradicts Goldy Pond. Maybe something about self-sacrifice? Emma doesn't want others to die, but if she thinks her own mortality is inevitable, she'd want it to be something with someone she respects? Honestly, no idea.
4. I think it was just a plot device. But I think it might represent something about the imperfection of reality, that can never match up to ideals. It wants perfect people to come meet it, but it's literally governing an imperfect solution to a problem. And it doesn't allow you perfect solutions, but requires Emma to give something up. So a personification of reality's compromises? Something that literally cannot allow Emma a perfect solution by its nature. I actually kind of like that, though I don't think the series commits to the idea very well since Emma gets the happy ending anyway. The idea that perfect solutions don't exist feels weird when it's paired with how much the series frames Emma as just being correct about everything. I would prefer that the series show that her solution is imperfect by it being imperfect, not by having that forced on her by god.
6. I feel like this is probably accidental in the same way that most battle shonen just implicitly value might-making-right. I suppose we could try to think of it as a point being made specifically in the context of the world they exist in. That intelligence is necessary to fight against oppression? No, that feels really weird. Maybe that the demons essentially created their own downfall by breeding for intelligence? Doesn’t connect to real life well but maybe makes sense?
Great video! I feel like this is, as you say, an absolutely interesting manga to talk about even if it's so flawed. I feel like you struck deep into the point for both the technical and thematic aspects of the series, even if I disagree about Goldy Pond.
I like your perspective on how even if the series doesn't provide answers, there's value in the questions it asks. A lot of discourse is all about cohesiveness, and I feel like I would expect most video essays to say TPN fails because it doesn't deliver on its promises. Which is a valid perspective to take and one I do agree with. But I like that you recognize that what we get out of it has value even if we're only getting things out of one part of it.
youtube did NOT want to let me post this comment. i still have no idea if i had to remove some words that accidentally triggered a filter or if i just had to lower the character count for some reason??? sorry if the number of times i posted edited versions as a test gave you notifications or something.
Don't worry I only got the one notification! Usually when youtube automatically deletes comments for whatever mysterious reason the creator never even sees them.
But hey thanks for your perspective! Sorry it's taken me so long to respond. Whether Goldy Pond was the last good arc or the first bad arc seems to be a pretty big splitting point among people who read the manga. I think you're right that it does lose a lot of the features that made TPN interesting, but to me it was only clear that that had happened once the arc was over. It still felt asymmetrical enough to me personally, with how the illegality of the hunting grounds and their lack of recent battle experience put them on the wrong foot and still manage to almost win...or at least it seems like they're almost winning. While the battle is still it really seems like a lot of the kids are dying. Like how many of them get stabbed all the way through? And it wasn't clear at the time that Leuvis was so high up the political ladder. We know he's a duke but not that he's literally first in line to the throne. For all we knew then there could have been 100 demons out there stronger than Leuvis still. But yeah tbh I definitely could have come down a lot harder on the second half of the series than I did. It felt important to me to give it as fair a shot as I could because almost everything else I've seen written about it is almost entirely negative, and there still is a lot of cool stuff worth talking about there. If mostly conceptually.
Oh and I'll definitely follow up on your Shadows House recommendation! You seem to like (the beginning of) TPN for similar reasons as I did, so I trust that I'll find it interesting as well.
Goldy pond was good for me, I don't agree about it not having stakes.
The talented kids that you mentioned were kids that had been planning for years for that one day to take down the farm, they just fit emma in the plan.
It isn't just blatant plot convince because those kids were put in there by the demons themselves, and out of the 50 kids about 8 were in on the plan.
The only reason they were able to put up a fight in the first place is because they were in an isolated situation, which you will notice is the case everytime they fight demons.
And about the seven walls, we did see emma and ray solve the riddle.
The 10 ri North, east, south, west, up down, referring to the dimensions of cube.
And the seven walls being forward, behind, left, right, up, down and the last wall being time.
After which emma and ray conclude that they have to let go of their own limiting beliefs, their 'walls' in order to meet the demon god or whatever.
Criticism is due where criticism is due, but those two instances were just not it.
Ure so good at this 😩
Ahh thank you! That means a lot coming from you
i watched the anime second season and then this and wow, so so so so much was missed
The music from Celeste was choice- I love your reconstruction videos! Great work.
Oh damn, this is 3x as long as I expected XD Going outside of wifi range, wish me luck boys!
End of the month joys
KAI'S DEMON VO DEBUT OMMGGGGGG IT'S EVERYTHING I'VE EVER WANTED
They did such a good job right?? Such a good villain voice
Hey, congrats on the video and the very well thought out script. It even made me think if producing essays like that could be a career option for me lol. Anyway, just wanted to say that I first had contact with the TPN anime (first season), then I received a spoiler that Norman was alive, and finally I read the manga from the point where Norman finds his friends again (after time skip) until the ending; Just recently I have read the first arc of the manga. So my thoughts are: I think the biggest catch of this story for me are the emotional core and the characters. I remember getting very sad and wepting a lot when Norman dies in the anime, so that's why I was interested the most in the part where he is back. Emotionally, the ending worked well to me, and it produced a meaningful catharsis. I think it's a bit bittersweet, instead of a perfect happy ending. But, watching your video made me think that the ending catharsis of the series could be a lot stronger if the stakes were higher and there was more development, for example, to Ray's character. I also think it is very cool that you highlight the political subversive aspects of the story and how this is not common. Being a revolutionary and vegan person myself, I never stoped to think that messages like these are uncommon in fiction. I will pay more attention to that from now onwards.
Now, just a thought: I think fiction could improve a lot, in general, if people took a more collective aproach to it. Like having a team of script writers, instead of just one writer, giving creative and narrative input to a certain story, constructing the plot collectively. After all, a lot of the folklore and mythical or religious stories that are very powerful and touching until today were changed a lot by lots of people, taking a form that it's more appealing and good for everyone. Of course individual scriptwriting also works and it's nice, but it often doesn't and lots of people get disappointed and even a lot of money and work is spent in very questionable scripts (GoT is a good example). That's why it should also be possible to rewrite stories, without having the worry of copyrights (of course, with everyone, the writer and the re-writer, earning a just money for their jobs). Okay, that's literally collective ownership of copyrights I'm talking about, and a very communist point of view, but that's it, Im happy I shared it :)
nice video! as someone who only watched the anime, it was interesting to learn about the directions the original story went in through this. big fan of the soundtrack choices as well, do you have a full list of everything you used? i recognised hollow knight, gris, bastion and celeste.
Thank you! I dont have a list I should really put one together. The music in Part 5 is all from Metroid Prime, and you recognized all the rest. Oh and the title screen song was from youtube's free audio library and its name is in the description
As someone who has only ever heard echoes of the Promised Neverland's first plot arc via the internet, and then radio silence besides "it bad now", I like how this analysis gives the story a fair shake the whole way through.
As an outsider, I was entertained the whole way through, but I can see how, for someone who was with the series from the start, the theming and plot contrivance does take a real turn and, if accidentally, disregards what most fans got attached to it for. I appreciate that even in your disappointment, you still take the time to draw out what the _new_ themes become by the end and what bits you do appreciate (like that one human hunter's death or the reunion between the three original main kids).
Edit: ok, so I commented this before the actual ending arc where everything gets resolved. That ending is absolutely bonkers. Like, so bonkers it's funny.
Don't worry Norman did a little off camera mining to get the poison
1:04:05 AYO IS THAT DUMA FROM FIRE EMBLEM GAIDEN/SHADOWS OF VALENTIA!?!?!?!
also, YOUR VIDEO WAS AWESOME, keep up the good work, to anyone reading this, have a nice day, and keep yourself safe!
man, this is fucking beautiful
im surprised to see so much was cut from the anime
Only just started, and already liking the Bastion music.
I love when people notice the bastion music! Such an underrated game these days
@@Skyehoppers You use the music really well to bring across certain atmospheres/emotions.
I read somewhere that Kaiu Shirai had to rush the end of the manga, so things probably wouldn't feel so forced in the end, and even it could have been totally different.
the only bit of this story i have ever actually consumed myself is season one of the anime. my friend told me to not watch or read much further than that, and now i am VERY glad. this seems like it had _so_ much potential. wasted.
the grace field arc was genuinely masterful. the plot, the horror, the expertise of the tension and mystery building, and everything in between, is some of the best i've ever seen, anywhere.
pretty much everything after the goldy pond arc fell so, so, so short.
Thank you 😊
I really loved your perpective about the manga, obviously i don't agree with everything but you're the first person that i see talking about some subcontext topics like capitalism, veganism, and the questions with a vision similiar to mine, however i don't have an definive opinion about some off these topics but i really like the reflection. Iff you ever made another video telling us more about tpn i would definetly watch
Ray remembering what happened inside the womb is the worst thing in this series. Its totally unneeded!
I just finished the Promised Neverland and I never saw those parallels with the meat industry. Although now that you mention it makes too much sense.
When your breakfast fought back in the nutshell
The discussion about the separation of humanity from nature as a threat reminds me a lot of the period where that was kind of...half in limbo. One of the most fascinating "case studies" of this civilizational pivot is...of all things, Chinese poetry. There's a marked shift in the poetry of the Early Tang dynasty which views nature as a quaint and lovely thing, that views trees, in isolation, in a garden, as a site of beauty. Prior to this, and indeed, still in practice, nature was far far less tamed, and writings about nature tended to be more colored by a tense reverence for the danger of wolves.
On the off chance that this is of interest to anyone, a further reading I suggest is:
The Retreat of the Elephants: An Environmental History of China
By Mark Elvin
Also on the note of deflates stakes, I know it's super early days into AoT/SNK but I legitimately lost like 9/10ths of my interest when Eren survived getting got in the beginning despite being de-limbed in the belly of a titan. I thought for all of like 30 seconds that the series was gonna be brave enough to make Armin the protagonist and that was an enticing idea. Stakes are something I hate to see dropped. My least favorite literary trope *by far* is the "fall off a cliff" death-- off screen demise we're assured totally happened (that totally didn't), so turning a gutpunch into a fakeout is... tiresome.
The fact it's such a prevalent trope that people expect it in their media sometimes, are dismayed when someone *doesn't* come back from what was supposed to be a high stakes failed gamble or some such is genuinely disappointing to me.
Amazing video!! I watched this and reacted somewhat "live" to it on discord so just... let me drop all my gushing from there here haha- (sorry about the "he" when referring to you since I'm reacting ashjs, also shoutout for putting your pronouns in your twt description, as someone who actually went to check)
the highlights/colors on characters are fun!!
"even a main character, who is framed as the smartest of all, can be killed off" WELL ABOUT THAT *wheezes
rly curious if he'll critic that or not... [you did and I agree with that critic so much, so I'm glad how just hearing that line about GF arc was in itself a hint to the later critic sdhjsd]
(positive thing about the video but kind of a spoiler for its production ig) WOAH HE ADDED DUBBED SEGMENTS
(wording when talking about ray, positive) "he has only one way to re-affirm his humanity - denying his oppressors the pleasure of consuming him." WHY DID HE WORD IT LIKE THAT wow [in general all your wording was really fun and in itself an art aaa-]
the isabella dub aGAIN - MA'AM YOUR VOICE IS PRETTYYYY
MODERN / SYMBOLIC INTERPRETATION OF GF ARC
25:26 (positive, never actively realized this) "the system can be taken to represent anything the reader perceives as injustice. like how I don't think it's meaningless that Emma, a girl who is not traditionally feminine in appearance or action, is presented with a reality where dedicating herself to motherhood is the only way to live" WOW. WOW. MY WIG?? GONE
he also talks about the meat industry subtext with amazing explanations and wording wow
"if being hunted was as common a threat as, say, cancer; wouldn't change everything about how society functions? and shouldnt that change how we understand and treat other animals?"
"does knowledge of this ceremony [gupna/respect] reduce the horror she experienced? no. of course it's very little comfort to know the death of her little sister was of spiritual meaning to the murder." [...] "What I see here is a willingness from TPN to explore difficult ideas. the broader implications of its premise are taken seriously and given the time to breathe. It is obvious to any reader with typical human emotions that the farm the children escaped from is an institution that should not exist... what might that tell us about our farms?" HELL. YES. AAA- not to bash on meat consumers at all btw, I still havent gone completely vegetarian, let alone alone vegan, either BUT GOD HE SAID THAT SO WELL.
I started this on the side while drawing, ive transitioned to actively watching sdhjsd SO YEAH IT'S PRETTY GOOD. he's recapping a lot though so yeah (tho that also has dubbed segments / sfx at parts and editing)
[REACTION END]
I also think your laying out of its core qualities is 1:1 what I also believed it to be and seeing you adjust their validity with the story's progression really further confirmed it for me too.
also 38:19 "these hunts are very illegal" [in text on screen: like I still don't understand how this doesn't count as straight-up breaking the promise? does anyone know why?" THANK YOU. literally I'm so confused about that too sdhjsd - like when he said he'd stop her from forming future connections with her family I totally thought this would mean that... like seeing them again would just negate the promise or something? then again I guess GP established that that wouldn't happen for... some reason. Breaking promises is fine guys. it doesn't actually break them.
I also pretty much agree with everything starting around 46:26.
GF arc is just so perfect as a self-contained season aaa- Additionally along with what you said about Yugo and Lucas' Death being true, I also thought it was very weird to timeskip and then kill them shortly after because... they have changed since before and we technically haven't seen them live that peaceful life with everyone... what am I supposed to mourn here?
(I also have a problem with the fact that Yugo was like "no we can't go after her, it's impossible" when Emma was yeeted to GP, but then when we see Ray and him again they're just going in??? sir when did you change your mind, what-)
1:02:57 Yeah you said it very well. While S2 did.... a lot of things very... uh... interestingly, it actually made this somewhat worse by even calling Norman's acts in S1 out and saying he was wrong even though... he really wasn't dhasjsd-
1:18:30 never realized that contradiction, AMAZING point actually.
Okay yeah I don't have as nice of a final segment/closing words as you do so. BYEEE
Haha this was really fun to read! Im glad you enjoyed it :)
Queen's gardens music from Hollow Knight? Good pick!
Edit: Ooh, resting grounds too.
Edit: hornet's theme?
White palace, dung defender, soul sanctum ... Imma just stop listing these.
Nice to meet a fellow Hollow Knight fan.
I found your content very recently and the moment I saw you were covering this topic, I was incredibly eager to hear your opinion. I broadly do agree with your poitns here, though I actually find myself more critical than you were towards the ending of the story. Everything after Goldie Pond, to me personally, hit the worst elements of both time skips and pacing to disconnect me heavily from the storyline and it was hard to keep myself invested afterwards. That being said, some of your more charitable reads on the way the themes play in with the aristocracy and capitalism do at least resonate enough with me to acknowledge it. The fact I felt this way about one of your essays only speaks to the quality you put into it, I'm so eager to see more of your content!
Hey! I just finished watching the video. Great stuff, really! I loved your analysis of the whole thing! Though there's some stuff, mostly near the end, I personally don't agree with, so I thought It'd be fun to discuss them here.
First of all, I wanna preface by saying that TPN has been a hugely formative work for me as a person, and as a teenager, my ideologies might be still "unrefined" and impressionable, though I sincerely hope this doesn't take away the validity of my insight.
In my eyes, the idea of veganism has never really been a core theme of the show. While I do understand that the parallels are undeniable, especially with the imagery and the scene where Emma kills a bird, I see these as more symbolic than anything else. From the point where it's defined that the demons want to eat the humans for their brains, especially the ones with higher intellect, the parallel is kind of broken, because the character's human intelligence (self-awareness being, as far as we know, a near exclusively or just flat-out exclusively human trait within our world) is put in the forefront as a main factor in the decision of who gets shipped out and when. By that point forward it doesn't really work, because it's essentially equating human intelligence to how much meat a pig has on its bones. In my eyes, the symbolic correlation between the human farms in TPN and real animal farms, is supposed to represent how deeply unfair the demon society generated by the promise really is, as its lowest sentient members are treated as disposable animals only being reproduced for the sake of generating food.
You also mentioned how you see the Emma vs Norman ideological conflict as fundamentally less complex than the conflicts from the Grace Field escape arc, and while there are definitely less moving pieces on the chessboard, so to speak, the single two-way conflict is strong enough philosophically to compensate, in my opinion. The big appeal of the King of Paradise arc is how morally grey everything feels. While Emma's convictions are ultimately proven right, she is never really portrayed as 100% correct in the eyes of the characters; even Emma herself admits to her ideology being kind of objectively wrong from any standpoint besides a moral one. This is very interesting because:
1- Emma’s struggle against her own ideals, as she comes to terms with the fact that she doesn’t feel ok with Norman’s plan. There’s a whole chapter in the manga that basically amounts to Emma turning to Ray and saying, in reference to her disagreeing with norman: “I know I’m wrong, but still-” In general, I feel like Emma is one of the best depictions of an idealistic character in media because, in multiple occasions, she’s shown to struggle with and be very anxious about her own choices and ideals. But that’s a whole different discussion, and I actually plan on making a whole video about this in the future.
2- Norman’s moral ambiguity. While he does play a mostly antagonistic role in the arc, and is ultimately depicted as the one in the wrong by the end, Norman himself never turns truly evil. So, depending on how you read him, he’s either one of the most sympathetic antagonists out there, or one of the most antagonistic deuteragonists/anti-heroes(?) in existence. When the anime was coming out, I actually remember sitting down with some other people that were watching it and having the good ol’ “who do you think is in the right?” conversation. That an antagonist in a shounen manga like this can generate such a thing is already impressive; the fact that he can do all that while still being a very much beloved person by the protagonists while staying a “bad guy”, is some really damn clever writing, in my opinion.
To me, you somehow both read too much and not enough into the message of the whole series. I don’t think it's meant to be interpreted so literally. The standing message here really is the emotional one about the inherent value of human life and idealism as a form of thinking. I don’t think the work itself is specifically targeting capitalism or any sort of specific direct parallel. While there is some similar wording and comparison to current world capitalism, we have to remember that the demon world’s power structure is completely different from contemporary republics. It’s a monarchy, down to wealth being defined exclusively by birthright. And the kids themselves, while unknowingly being prepared to be eaten, actually grew up pretty privileged. They had food, comfortable housing and a loving family. That’s way more than most of the demon population had! Despite that, aside from when they compare themselves to the children from the mass production farms, there is never any deep reflection regarding the comfortable situation of the kids’ upbringing. If the message really was “eat the rich”, wouldn’t the kids have to “eat themselves” too? Unless it’s some weird French revolution sorta deal, where both the upper and the lower class are seen as bad, and only the middle class is good, I can’t imagine this being it. I see the queen and the demon society’s flawed structure as a whole as a representation of the emotional “impurity” of humanity. Independently of the system itself, it targets the concept of human greed itself and how it can manifest in multiple different scenarios. That’s precisely the reason why Mujika is crowned the new queen without that many drastic alterations to the demon society as a whole. In that sense, it’s not even necessarily about the person in charge, but about the ideals driving said person. That goes along nicely with the weird focus on spirituality in the latter portions of the story. It isn’t really about religion itself, but the will to be kind despite major societal issues that plague the world. I would actually go as far as saying that the series takes a fairly agnostic approach to it all, seeing as the kids themselves don’t seem to be religious, (and are strongly driven by direct logical reasoning) and the gods the demons worship (well, at least mr. scribbles over there and his dragon) turn out to be actually real, and can drastically affect the world which they govern. Going off of that, I believe “the one” is more comparable to some sort of ultimate authority figure than an actual god.
To conclude, in my interpretation, the story is mostly about the idea of idealism directly contrasted with darker more real circumstances than your average shounen manga, but still resulting in great things. You mentioned how you believe Norman is the one who “won” the Grace Field Escape arc, but saying that is denying the impact Emma’s ideals had on him to begin with. He would’ve never actually tried to escape with everyone. It’s made clear that he tries his crazy plan because, and not despite of, Emma's idealism. The Norman we see after the timeskip is a version of himself who has been far detached from those ideas of empathy that got him in that situation in the first place. In essence, it’s what becomes of Norman’s ideals and methods without Emma there to affect him. In the same vein, a theoretical failed escape from the house, where they actually try to free everyone, is what would happen if only Emma was there, without Norman and Ray to keep her grounded. Going off of that, we can establish a theme of co-dependence between ideals, where people influence other people for the better. The same pattern can be seen later in the Goldy Pond arc, where Yuugo’s cynicism is also shaken up by Emma’s idealism, while still not being completely destroyed. It’s this idea of open-mindedness that ultimately allows Emma to make the right decision in not deciding to commit genocide on the demons, and it’s Peter Ratri’s lack thereof that results in his eventual suicide at the end of the series. So, in the end, I’d say the message of the story ends up being “Human life is inherently valuable not just because we are persistent and can have strong emotions, but because we have the power to possess very powerful, but different, forms of thinking that, when in harmony, can result in amazing things.” The same thing can be seen in the borderless human world, where humanity has learned to tolerate each other’s different ways of thinking and work in harmony, because at the end of the day, they’re all one thing: human.
I was actually planning to talk about some of the extra topics you left in the comment up there, but I figure this is already long enough as it is haha!
Yo thanks so much for this comment! Super interesting perspective and you've given me a lot to think about. If you ever do make your own video definitely tag me as I'd love to hear your thoughts even more fleshed-out. This is exactly the kind of comment I was hoping to get on this video and you've effectively challenged some of my beliefs about the show. Some counter-points though!:
I think it's interesting you downplay the vegan elements of the first half of the story but say "I see these as more symbolic than anything else." Symbolic of what, then?
I think I pretty much completely agree with you on the Norman-Emma conflict, and you said it even better than I did! I didn't mean to sound too critical when I referred to this conflict as less complex. You're right that it's a very deep topic to cover, and the story takes it pretty seriously and explores it a good amount.
To be clear, I don't claim that the author directly intended TPN as an anti-capitalist work. While I think Shirai definitely has a strong political ideology, he also intentionally muddies the waters quite a bit in a way that makes it impossible to see clearly what he believes. Whether he did this for his own personal reasons or at the request of his editors we'll never know. And you're right that in the literal sense, no the demons do not have capitalism because the rich are royalty rather than private citizens. BUT I think there's still enough in the text for a valid anti-capitalist reading. First of all is the specific fixation on the way they seized control over the farms to solidify their power. The ownership of the means of production is maybe THE most important pillar of Marx's critique of capitalism. The difference between capitalism and socialism is defined by that relationship: whether the goods of a society are owned by a select few, or by the workers that labor to produce them. TPN clearly doesn't think royalty is inherently bad, as shown by how Mujika becomes the new queen, so really it seems to blame how the past set of royals *behaved*, which has clear similarities to modern capitalism. It shows that the lower classes of demon society were suffering specifically because they lacked access to the means of production. Also, you're misunderstanding who "the rich" in "eat the rich" actually is. In Marxist theory the classes are, again, defined by their relationship to the means of production. It's true that the kids were quite comfortable growing up, but they are not among the ruling class because they own absolutely no capital. They have no say in how their world is run. When people criticize the rich, they rarely mean that it's bad to have nice things or a comfy life, but rather it's bad to consolidate all power in the hands of a few and use that power to exploit others. That's also why "eat the rich" only extended to the twenty or so demons at the very top, even though it looks like the demon capital city is pretty wealthy in general compared to other towns we've seen.
Lastly, I do agree with your statement about the true message of the series! And you worded it very well. I just don't think the story succeeds in communicating that last part, that different forms of thinking in harmony produce the best result. I just don't think it challenged Emma enough to earn that conclusion. She was too right too often, and even though she expresses some self-doubt, no situation is given to her that *really* tests her fortitude in my opinion, aside from losing Norman in the very first arc.
I agree with basically all your points! Took the words out of my mouth
I wasn't expecting the hollow knight music 😄
TPN Season 1 of the anime and the 1st part of the manga was a masterpiece, easily my favorite arc in anime
The Promised Neverland is truly a masterpiece.
Holy. I think this is my favorite analysis of the series I’ve ever seen. Usually when people talk about the series, they never talk about the thematic throughlines of religion and the value of human life. I was never quite able to put into words how odd I found its conclusion to be, since its beginning made such strong and pointed criticism of systemic oppression. Emma wins because she’s deserves to? I mean sure, Emma’s optimism is necessary- it’s emphasized how if Norman and Emma didn’t operate under the assumption that escaping with everyone was possible, the plan would’ve never come to fruition- but a major part of her character was about negotiating with the means available to her. Just giving a big sweeping answer about everything being possible if you believe hard enough really undermines the importance of Ray’s realism and how everyone’s circumstance will affect the choices they can make. Not to mention using God as justification feels inherently wrong, since religion is usually used to justify certain hierarchies as natural when the story repeatedly stresses not valuing human or demon life above the other. While the story definetly didn’t have all the answers it needed, and made more than a couple fumbles, I like to read it as an argument for radical hope. Believing in the “impossible” changed the lives of all the gracefield kids and allowed them to find something better. This was really great work and made me fall in love with the story all over again. Thank you for making this.
I have never even heard of this before I feel like I should at least watch the anime to have any idea about whats going on lol
That's fair! Yeah I would recommend watching at least the first season of the anime before watching this video.
@@Skyehoppers i did not expect to see a child die that quickly, but ig thats on me
I think I watched the anime in lockdown 2020 Quarantine and I loved season 1 so much that I actually couldn’t wait for season 2 therefore I read some of the manga (didn’t finish it), These past years as I grew up I’ve realised the story of that anime isn’t just simple and straightforward in some angles it does in fact apply to the real world and was curious if anyone made a video of this anime talking about a “deeper message” this video was amazing revealing the mysteries. But however I wasn’t intending the mystery to be about “meat industry” but I still like that idea too. I’ve always thought of the deeper message in this anime about being - (idk how to describe them but Matrix/elites) people who control this world them getting eaten as meat is just a example how we work all life and just die and the people controlling everything make money regardless they are the devil ( literary) we are their pets and their goal is to divide us in every way possible creating the LGBTQ movement creating division threw religion , political views and even smaller things that wouldn’t cross ur mind. The 1000 year old deal that humans have made with demons is a illustration how these people have literary created a contract with the devil or sold their soul however you want to see it. They control us in every way possible and we can’t rlly do anything about it. The ambition that Emma and the main character have to get in the human side world in real life is to escape Evil mind and get closer to God. You are being controlled by higher people it’s foolish to think otherwise not the government leaders , presidents , general , ceo of companies like blackrock and banks owners but even bigger organisations that controll them. This anime was amazing even tho it took a down side in the end.
Can you elaborate on what you mean by "creating the LGBTQ movement"?
@@Skyehoppers Its the division it brings. the idea goes against one of the biggest things that humans have/use/trust which is Religion. You ever wonder why this couldn’t of been executed more peacefully? Hate and division had to get involved these pride months , events schools forcing kids to learn about LGBTQ history is the devils plan. Look at the film industry (also tv shows) every single one has to have a lgbtq relationship even movies that are watched by kids which ends up influencing the kids it’s brainwashing them. I don’t have a single problem with lgbtq relationships they are born that way so why would I they can like whoever they are emotionally attached too and that’s fine. But recently it’s been a trend just to turn into lgbtq and statistics show that this decade the lgbtq population has increased massively and their brain is just influenced by propaganda. The devil is who wants exact opposite of what God wants . The devil is doing this and it’s working more of todays population is close to Devils teachings than Gods as it’s sad and truth.
Ah yeah thats what I thought. Never post this hateful bullshit in my comment section again. Queer people have existed for all of human history and the devil doesnt exist. Teaching kids about the ways humans actually are is not brainwashing, but a kindness and a truth. You are the brainwashed one. I do not need people who would deny me my rights as a human being to watch my videos. I wont block you, but yeah please never comment again until you understand the absurdity and cruelty of what you just said
@@Skyehoppers so your one of them 🤦♀️ , tell me what I said that is hateful? What do you mean by “that’s what I thought”
The final arc is basically fixed if Norman is a foil to Isabella. Have him attack the human world as well, increase the stakes. Then you go from there
out of curiousity do you have any musical background of some sort? all of the background music cues are really cool and strike me as very musically-aware ig lol, id ask on ur discord but i am sadly Lacking Money
Not really! I mean I took piano lessons as a kid but that's literally it. I do always try to conscious of how music is utilized to create certain feelings in games and movies and etc., so I'm glad that's starting to show in my videos.
39:22 Mouring to Horror
40:47 ...Scary
45:27 Eyes of a pig
Thank you.
the setup of this video is really nice, but the loud sudden noise of the demon's name keeps jumpscaring me 😭i know thats the point but it gets tough to pay attention by lowering the volume in an attempt to not be scared again
Aw Im sorry! They do get quieter as the video goes on
Part way through but just had to mention that i actually agree with the story that humans are a special and noble existence. I literally do not care how much an animal has to suffer for me to eat it. I don't like the suffering but I'm fine with it as long as the meat comes to my table. I'd prefer for no animal suffering but i don't worry about it. Though I'm fine with the idea of artificial meat replacing the real thing if it tastes good.
On the video itself so far the analysis is amazing and it like the writing you put into the script. Overall it's a fun video and I'm gonna continue it now.
DISCLAIMER: SORRY FOR BAD ENGLISH BUT I'M ITALIAN!
I think that the promised Neverland Is a good manga, especially for 3/4 of the manga (15/20 volumes) the last five volumes are generally quite good but with different problems especially the volume n. 18.
Maybe Is not a masterpiece, maybe the ending Is not the best ending, but One thing Is sure, the promised Neverland Is a good manga, especially for the beging.
And i think that the simbolysms are generally good, and really deeps in some parts.
you did look, and sounded too bad. Video was baller, great job. thank you.
I did like how the demon world concluded though, skipping the part where Emma basically made a deal with God. But replacing one corrupt queen with another that has humanity and is guided by spirituality. Ironically doomed to repeat itself eventually, but for now, offers their world peace and prosperity. I imagine many years later, the queen has a family, and it's her own son's and daughters whose blood keeps their people alive but in doing so, divide and pick their people who worship them like gods who come to blows at the slightest political indifference, where those caught in between are forced to pick a side or be cast from society.
To think that TPN was the first manga i read bc the anime was just that good i couldn't help myself. So unfortunate that the manga failed to keep that quality throughout. Still great worth a read
One thing this series really struggled with was the cast. There was too many characters for the author to honestly keep up with. He also seemed to be afraid to kill off children despite the first arc making it clear children would be killed off and no-one was safe. Ray was heavily sidelined, Norman had all the stepping stones to be a villain but they never commited to it, Emma basically could do no wrong and honestly, the story should have ended with them escaping Grace Field.
Goldy Pond could have been a 'detention' arena the trio could have been thrown into after Krone dies. The story falls into another trap of too much realism in a fantasy. We don't need answers for everything. There's a charm to mystery and the audience not being told everything.
Just finished the manga today!
I still loved the manga its a solid 8/10 not perfect at all but very enjoyable and very thought provoking.
I do still believe it couldve used atleast 25 volumes to flesh out some characters (ray, sonju n mujika and also leuvis returnal)
I believe that the initial premises began to fall apart when the group met Mujika and Sonju (I am referring to the Italian version of the manga, and the same with all the other names): presenting demons who are, in fact, not evil (and we will see later city with families and children in tow), you don't subvert the reader's expectations, if anything you complicate your life as a narrator.
What began as a race for the survival of a group of children, to end in a revolution that makes everyone happy and contented...in my, more than modest opinion, it was necessary to develop the narrative structure:
-exactly as it seemed at the beginning, that is, with the demons in cahoots with a group of adults who sacrificed children for the well-being of others, and therefore the demons were treated as beings with whom it was not possible to empathize;
-or the supernatural system was removed entirely, revealing that wealthy industrialists and rich people of all sorts had built systems to raise children on which to carry out experiments.
I know that in this way the theme of child slavery would have been overshadowed (in fact, it is also suggested in the manga, demons do not use children as colonists or anything else, they eat them or give them as usufruct for experiments), but I clearly felt, after the escape from Grace field and, above all, with the introduction of Mujika, Sonju and Lewis, that the authors had been forced to make a do-gooder turn, with a deus ex machina that, when I read it, I exclaimed "come on! It's not possible that there's always the same child-god who provides the solution to plot problems!" And yet it was exactly like that (not to mention Mujika's miraculous blood that makes everyone vegetarian... what a bullshit)... another problem are the characters: it's true that they couldn't remain with the same personality they had at the beginning, but the fact that the ending is completely positive ruins, in my opinion, the concept of Emma's sacrifice.
I didn't like this wanting to save everyone on her part, I mean, the plot begins with the murder of one of her friends, how is it possible to feel empathy for those who are monsters?
29:13 now you're making good points.
I kinda like at least the half of TPN (and love the first 37 chapters) but there are still a few things I find to be a bit annoying or unlogical
-It is said that they escaped in winter. However the trees still have their leaves. Also all they are wearing are their shirts, pants a knitted? jacket and a scarf
-I get that the children are smart and all, but they seem a bit too quick to adapt on bare survival in the forest. I mean they had a comfy live and all they did was taking tests and playing tag. Okay they can do chores and they had two months of preperation but having big brains isn't enough to survive. Also Gracefield doesn't normally teach you to live on your own, but to be tasty meat (sorry) But okay they were saved eventually by friendly demons, but still
-The children seem to be more focused to Emma as a mother/ big sister figure, but sadly Anna, Gilda, Don, Norman and Ray who also take care of the younger children did get far less credit
-Emma is too strong. Not only she is a big brain, but she also has atlethic skills, great duration, can use big as* machine guns and rifles better than trained soldiers, is loved by every child, has persuation skills and even survives fatal wounds from Leuvis claws, which actually SHOULD be lethal. Is there ANYTHING she CAN'T DO? (Like her only "weakness" is being a bit naive, oh wow)
-In the beginning of Chapter 60 you can see Emma, Yugo and Ray running IN A FREAKING DESERT. In Daytime. With full coat and turtleneck sweater. But these masterminds should know that if you are running in a hot place you will dehydrate faster, because you are sweating more and so you lose more body fluids. Also I see no purpose in running in the beginning. That's just an useless waste of energy, which they should save for the wild demons. Yugo who survived for 13 btw. years should know that too.
-How Ray even knows how to use a gun? I mean Emma gets at least a few panels of training in Goldy Pond, but how does Ray know how to use a machine gun/rifle (whatever)?
-All of Yugo's family members died in GP. However NONE of Emma's newly made friends (like Oliver, Gilian etc.) dies there, even they were badly wounded. it seems unlogical, that EVERYONE can survive that wounds
-When the Bunker is full of 60 children it is weird, that there is food and place for everyone, when Yugo mentioned that the stock is limited when only Emma and Co. arrived there who were only a group of 15. And how do they all get along? No quarrels? No fights? I mean they are all different and have different opinions, and it is quite impossible that such a big number of children get along the WHOLE time and that there is never such things as frustration or trauma. No everyone like each other it's all sunshine and rainbows between them, suuuure
-Everyone of the frickin children agrees with Emma, when she says that she doesn't want to kill the demons, after agreeing to Norman to kill the demons. Everyone has the same opinion
-It is never really show how they manage to find the entrance to the Seven Walls
-Only the nameless minor characters got killed (yeah Conny too, and Isabella) but still
-It is unlogical that Isabella didn't get killed after letting 15 children go, but Sister Krone did so much less but still get killed
-The GP fight is far too long (in my opinion)
-It seems a bit weird that no one of the masterminds of GF noticed that only children who are 6 and older are getting shipped out
-If Emma's, Norman's and Ray's anchestors were the first ones to be sacrifice to the demons, how did they manage to get descendants who will eventually get Emma, Norman and Ray. Or did they already have children?
-Why is Norman so big all of a sudden. He is suppose to be only 13...
-How did Andrew even survive the explosion in first place?
-If Emma is suppose to forget everyone and herself in the end how does she can feel that she is suppose to know them. The children should feel like total strangers to her
This is only my opinion. I sure do like TPN, especially the art, but the story sure has its flaws especially towards the end
I mean we could have this?!