Which look of which lens did you prefer? And what is your opinion when it comes to the question "Is Leica glass worth the money"? I would be interested to learn more about your thoughts, so please feel free to share them here. Also: In case you want to support my work and get access to additional content, please head over to my Patreon page: www.patreon.com/karinmajoka Lots of love, Karin 🤍
Hallo, Ich hatte bis vor kurzem das VOIGTLANDER ULTRON 28MM F2.0 TYPE II VM ASPHÉRIQUE zu meiner Leica M, das wirklich ein klasse Objektiv ist. Fantastische Schärfe, 1A Fertigungsqualität sowie hervorragende Farbwiedergabe, die Photos waren total beeindruckend! Man kann dieses herrliche Objektiv zu 100% empfehlen. Da ich mir nun eine Q3 zu meiner M hinzugekauft habe, dessen 28er das Voigtländer ja ersetzt, habe ich das 28er Objektiv von Voigtländer zu meinem Bedauern verkauft. Grüße aus Luxemburg.
Die Nokton Linse. Warum? Die Farben sehen besser aus (wärmer), der Helo Effekt bei F1.4 ist genau der Look den ich feier und es gibt kein chromatischen Aberration wie bei der Leica.
I bought the Nokton 35 mm 10 months ago and have been extremely happy with it. I don't mind small imperfections like vignetting, but the reason why I decided to change it for a Leica Elmarit was the focal length. I wanted to exchange it for a 28 mm lens instead and having seen som reviews, I decided the pricy Elmarit 28 mm was right for me. I expect to shoot it a lot for street, cityscape, architecture and landscape and the 50 mm Summicron for portraits and everything else. I ended up becoming annoyed by the constraints of a 35 mm and wanted something more versatile and moderne as my go to lens. But I have to say that the colour rendering of the Nokton and sharpness produces really lovely pictures. I will try to sell it, but I will keep it, if I can't get a decent price on it.
Strange, to me the Nokton actually looks sharper in the centre from f2 (at 13:30). Either way if the 'sharpness' is the thing people notice about your photos then that's not a good sign. Some of the most amazing images I've ever seen aren't even fully in focus! For me I prefer cheap stuff because I can be more adventurous and focus on capturing images than worrying about super expensive gear.
Glad it’s not just me! The Nokton certainly does look sharper in the centre crops from f2, and not just because of the higher green/red colour fringing on the lens engraving from the Summicron. Unless maybe those crops were captioned the wrong way round…
As a collector of the very finest cameras, I personally believe that’s all about their character, charm and experience of shooting. The fun factor. Not necessarily the price, sharpness or speed. It’s about that instant moment that you grab that equipment and, from the first few shots, you know you are hooked. That sweet formula that makes in love for photography again and again.
Also agree. I’ve had a few dozen lenses over the past 20 years, budget to Leica APO lenses, as well as some of Sony, Canon, Sigma and Voigtlanders best. Quality was ultimately not the prevailing factor for me. “Good enough” with great ergonomics (largely, compactness) wins. If the lens quality is the make or break for a picture, then I wasn’t taking a great picture to begin with.
I have both lenses and with film I don't think there are enough differences to justify the cost of the Leica, but with my M11 it is pretty obvious that the Leica is much sharper. I also have the Voigtlander 35 APO Lanthar and it is a bit sharper than the Leica and there is no color fringing when looking into the sun, you should check it out. So far the APO is my best 35mm lens (even compared to my Nikon Z & F glass) but it's kind of large and obtrusive so I have yet to decide between the two.
I don’t understand why everybody is talking about sharpness. The most obvious difference that gave the Nokton away was color rendition. The Summicron has a much more natural, balanced color rendition, while the Nokton clearly is much warmer and on the magenta side of things. It’s not necessarily bad, but it’s obvious. I don’t have money for the Summicron, but I have to say I was an inch away from buying the Nokton, and this video might have swayed me away and made me stick to my original plan to put a Zeiss Biogon on my Leica M4 rather than the Nokton. Thanks!
This. I see these sort of videos all the time and this is literally the first time someone has pointed out this extremely obvious difference. Voigtlander has a look, and if you know that then the "blind tests" are not blind in the least.
I can’t tell… I’m surprised as I thought I knew the look of both of those lenses. I thought they were quite different lenses but you show that the differences are in real life very small… thank you.
I totally agree! I still think the Leica outperformed the Nokton when it comes to technical details. But in the end it does not really matter because the "real life" test results showed how close and hard to distinguish they actually were.
I clocked the Summicron right away simply because I use a 50mm Summicron F2. The modern crons are so sharp. I found your Nokton to have noticeably warmer tones with a little more distortion. I’m currently shopping for a 35mm lens so this comparison was super helpful. Because I mostly shoot cars, I think I would go with the option that is more neutral in color rendering to highlight the true color of the cars. The sharpness doesn’t matter as much to me.
I preferred the Nokton more and it had more of a look I wanted. I have a bunch of the Cosina Voigtlander lenses and I love them. I also have a Super Nokton for my Micro 4/3 body and it's a top favorite even though I rarely shoot it wide open
I have that same 11827 35mm Summicron and use it on my M6 TTL and also M11. Having taken it all over the world, I can say it's a completely solid performing lens at all apertures. Glad I didn't compromise.
That sounds great! Actually, having the M10 now, tipped me over the edge staying with the Summicron and not the Nokton. I love how the Summicron renders on digital as well, it's so versatile!
Nice to see pictures from Münster. A nice and fair comparison. The Nocton looks very good but I guess in the end we all want the summicron. did not know that they are so close...
This was great - it's just a shame that the lens hoods gave this away quite early on who was shooting what. Still very interesting results. Great video.
Totally true, I only realised it in the edit (and hoped people would not pay attention too closely haha). But it was so bright that day, that shooting without a lens hood would be a terrible option.
Leica lenses are super expensive, but from my experience, they hold their value well. I sold some Lenses after using them for years and got the same price for them. I also like that they are designed to be used fully opened. When you compare the Voigtländer f1.4 to the even more expensive Summilux, you will see a massive difference at f1.4. But I can also understand that not everyone can afford such lenses. I want to say that these lenses are not only crazy expensive but also great performers.
I think if you're really into Leica and know you'll use the system for a long time, having your most used lens be a Leica might be worthwhile, then use third parties for the rest of your focal lengths
There's no point having a faster lens if it doesn't perform well wide-open. I only shoot Leica glass and prefer the subtle creamy fall-off and 'soft' sharpness. Highly recommend the 28 Elmarit prea(spherical) inexpensive (by Leica standards) and just jaw-dropping gorgeous.
Great content! The purist will not agree but I guess you can enjoy a Leica camera with a non Leica lens. Sure a lot of the Leica lenses are great. But totally not in reach of my budget. So Voigtlander makes great lenses you can enjoy the great M bodies with a very good lens without paying the price most people can not afford. Another great alternative for me are the Carl Zeiss lenses. A bit higher in price as Voigtlander but IMHO also better performing. And now I am gonna make the purists 🤮. I own 2 7Artisan lenses. Both very well made. Focus is smooth and tight! All metal and glass. A 35mm f2 and a 50mm f1.1. And both perform above what there price would suggest! I use the 50mm on my old M8 that is 66mm on that camera. I shoot Monochrome jpegs with this camera, and the results are absolutely stunning! Keep up the good work!! Kind regards.
I prefer the Nokton, as it's more "Rock & Roll. The lens is not perfect, in the same way we as humans are not perfect, and it's always good to embrace the error. Also, as Henry Cartier-Bresson once said: "Sharpness is a bourgeois concept"... That's not to say this statement should be used as an excuse for poor technique, rather that not every image has to be sharp to be credible...
First of all, thanks for this cool comparison, it's a great idea to have these two excellent lenses go head to head. I honestly had the right guess during the video as to which was the Leica lens. The images with the Summicron had that slightly clearer, cooler color shades, aka "Leica look", to me. With the Nokton, I found the colors more vibrant and the look a bit more washed out, more vintage style. If money was no object, the Summicron would be my first choice, but in real life I would probably go with the Voigtländer and still be very happy with it. 🙂
Karin, loved the video and I appreciated the challenge. Elmar was shooting the Leica. Voigtlander colors are to my eye more saturated. And while no one can argue that there are some incredible Third Party lenses, the Leica ecosystem is my preference. That they retain their value certainly helps when pulling the trigger on each and every lens purchase. Continued happiness and success to you and yours. Be Blessed, Doc Chaps
Nice comparison video! Some others have noted the lens hood giving it away, which I noticed as well 😅, but I guessed it right before that, but ONLY because of some distortion on some of the straight on shots of buildings where a window edge or other straight line was at the edge of the frame. If it weren't for that distortion I probably wouldn't have been able to tell much of a difference. I have the Nokton myself and have always enjoyed shooting with it and am perfectly happy with the photos it makes. I definitely don't feel like the Summicron is worth $2000 more for my purposes...but then, i've never actually used one myself.🤔
Sharper yes if that’s what you’re going for. If you want depth of field and natural rendering, more a classic look, then the f2 is not good enough. The 1.2, the 1.5…
So So close! I’m just blown away that you can get such amazing quality and sharpness from film. I preferred the Leica but as said it was so close. Great video and a decision I’m going to have to make soon when I get my M6 or MP.
I have the nokton 35 1.4 and love it! There is just one thing that didn’t really show up that much in the review though. At wider open apertures the colors change pretty vastly for me, a lot of times I really like how this looks (also the bokeh gets swirly at 1.4) but it could be seen as an imperfection
I honestly rarely use any lens wide open, which is why I did not really put this in the focus of the review - but that is in fact a good point! The Bokeh of the Nokton is a but more agitated and swirly, but the Bokeh on the Summicron is a bit more calm and smooth in my opinion. Imperfections are not always a bad thing. :)
@13:29 center sharpness comparisson at f2 the Summicron looks worse. Am I blind? The Summicron is known for its heavy vignetting even at small apertures, so probably there are still some correction playing a role.
I choose the lens that gives the images I like the most. My three favourite lenses are 21mm Elmarit f2.8 ASPH, Nokton 35mm f1.4 classic MC II and Planar 50mm f2 ZM. I tried a variety and chose on image not price nor brand. I can’t be bothered with the Leica snobs, they are obviously more bothered about being big heads than their image quality :-)
Great comparison. I sold my Nokton 35mm f1.4 to fund a 50mm Summicron. The Voigtländer is the perfect first start in the world of the M-lenses. I loved the compact size. Maybe I will buy one again 🙂
I love my Voigt collection for the SL2S , placebo makes you think Leica lens may be leaps ahead while actual perceptual difference maybe negligible. Great video
What a great review and very helpful in decision making considering that I’ve shot with the voigtlander 35 1.4 MC & MCII for four years. I’ve been trying to find out if it was worth the swap. I’d say very much so from this video.
My impression is that the differences aren't really big if you shoot film and mostly use medium apertures, like in street photography. I own the Nokton 35mm 1,4 (Version I though) myself and like the compactness and the image quality is mostly great. It has some annoying issues though, the distortion and vignetting can be nasty and wide open it is really soft, which makes not really a good option for low light. So I look for an upgrade, but the Leica 35mm lenses are definitely out of my price range 😕 Maybe the new Voigtländer Ultron 35mm 2,0 or the Zeiss Biogon? We'll see... Happy shooting, I would also like to see a video about your experiences with the M10 so far!
I like in field tests. I'm not very interested in lens performance on the test booth. Colour fringing is a showstopper for me, vignetting isn't. I like vignettes, and if I ever want to get rid of it, Capture One will do the job. Also, the Nocton compares a lot more to the Leica 35 mm f1.4 Steel Rim. Compared to the Steel Rim, the Nocton performs much closer to the Leica than in this comparison. In some fields even better. For me, the Nocton 35 mm f1.4 II is the better choice, but I totally understand your decision. I will never change my Summicron 50 mm (Version IV) with any other lens. Some lenses are pure magic. Thank you for your honest comparison. I like the style of this video and will definitely look for further content on your channel.
From the first few photos my bet was on Karin using the Nokton. After a few more I was quite sure she does. Those photos just had much more of the orange tone (for me, subjectively, too much). One thing 3rd party lenses can't beat Leica lenses at is the colour reproduction. With Elmar's photos it was clear how more natural the colour reproduction is, even despite the "vintage" orange tone of the Kodak 200 film. Of course, a blind comparison is much easier if you know you're comparing 2 groups of photos made with just 2 lenses, than having a bucket of photos which are not labelled A / B and you have to guess each photo individually. My conclusion - I was considering buying Nokton as my 35mm lens (right now shooting with a 50mm Summicron) and I came here to validate whether Nokton is enough for my needs. The decision is I'm starting saving for a 35mm Summicron instead.
Nice comparison. Just by looking at the photos, I couldn't say which was shot on which lens. But I did work out who was shooting which lens quite early on in the video. I won't say how I knew, so as not to spoil it for other watchers. I owned the Nokton 35mm and it's a fantastic little performer.
Haha, I know what you are referring to. I only noticed it later because we did not film everything from behind. I just hoped people would not pay too much attention ;) Thanks for your comment!
As an owner of the Summicron 35mm. I personally feel one should use the lens that one feels gives them the look they want. I also use TTArtisan, Light Lens Lab and Thypoch lenses. I have the Voigtländer 21mm and 90mm Skopars on my to buy list.
Karin! Do a comp with the old V1 or V2 Summicron (Rigid or Dual Range) and the Nokton. I'd be curious to see how the old Summicron compares to your Nokton Classic.
Warum heißt Elmar wie die Bezeichnung einiger Leicaobjektive? Ich war zunächst irritiert. Wieso raten, wenn es da unterm Bild steht? Und war nicht vom Summicron die Rede?
Do a comparison for the summicron vs Voigtlander Ultron v2 35/2 please. The Ultron is better but would love to see if you still chose the Summicron for character. Thx
Karin, I now challenge you to try out some vintage LTM lenses on your M6, which are even less money than the Nokton. The Canon lenses are little jewels made with Japanese precision and are frequently compared to Leica's best from that era. They probably won't outperform your Summicron ASPH, but perhaps your audience might enjoy a review.
I actually got a 50mm Canon LTM lens as a gift recently which works great. It has some fungus though so it wouldn't be a fair comparison - but it's a fun lens for sure!
I figured that the images that were tack sharp were from the summicron. While the others weren't tack sharp. Not necessarily a bad thing if you want some character vs sterile images. I was looking at the corners of the image for sharpness. At least in my opinion that's how I was able to tell the difference. which do you prefer?
Hello and thank you for this interesting video. The give away was when I saw the lens hood on your camera ... But I still enjoyed the video and I was very very much surprised at the look of the files coming from the Voigtlander. I have shot the older version (on a Leica M9) and was not very happy with center sharpness and most importantly colour fringing but it seems they've made everything better now and for a third of the price compared to the Summicron!!! Great value for the money, great to be able to go out and shooot with a lens that gets good results and will generate less stress if banged (a little). I have also shot with a Summicron ASPH 35mm (on the M9 and then on a M240 and an M6 as well) but I was less than happy with it: seems to me that (at least on my version) the Leica "pop" was lacking and overall build quality was to par with the Voigtlander; but not over the top.
Super Review und sehr schöner, praxisbezogener Vergleich. Kommt gerade richtig, da ich plane von der Fuji X-Pro3 auf eine Leica M (wohl die Monochrom Typ 246) umzusteigen. Bin noch in der Entscheidungsphase… Das Nokton steht bei mir auf der Liste und dieses Review kommt mir gerade gelegen. Dankeschön dafür ✌🏻☺️ Ich mag den Look und ja, vom Preis her isses auch sehr ansprechend.
Vielen Dank für deinen Kommentar, das freut mich! :) Oh, spannend! Wo stehst du grade im Entscheidungssprozess, wieso wird es vermutlich die 246 Monochrome? Das Nokton ist super, das Review zeigt mir nochmal wie nah die beiden Objektive in der Praxis doch aneinander sind.
@@KarinMajoka Hi ! Ich bin grad auf der Suche nach einem guten Angebot für eine M246. Monochrome daher, da ich immer mehr feststelle das ich bei Street hauptsächlich B/W fotografiere und eine Kamera mit Monochrom-Sensor reizt mich schon seit langem. Andererseits überlege ich auch die X-Pro3 zu behalten und mir die Voigtländer Noktons für den X-Mount zuzulegen und dann nur mit monochromen Fuji-Rezepten bzw. Lightroom-Presets zu arbeiten. Morgen bekomme ich ein Nokton 23 f/1.2 geliehen. Vielleicht läuft das auch darauf hinaus. Ist ja auch eine finanzielle Frage ;). Mal schauen wo der Weg hinführt.
As always, love your videos. I actually purchased the Nokton for my M6 based on research and the earlier video you mentioned. I haven't been disappointed. Do you ever discuss 50mm options? I'll have to look at your library of videos. Though I've been in the industry for over 35 years I am continuously surprised that people would tell other people how to use, or what gear they should be using. Shoot what you want, that fits your budget and serves your art.
I would love to underline your last sentence several time! Word, I could not agree more! :) Glad to hear you are happy with the Nokton, it's a fantastic lens. So far, I have mainly shot 35mm lenses on the Leica and have tried out 28mm more recently. 50mm is not a focal length I use too often which is why I have not made any comparisons between lenses here.
Give the Nokton 50 F1.5 II a go, honestly the best jack-of-all-trades 50, fast, super small, cheapish, well made, sharp, and extremely pleasant render.
Great video! What would you recommend like first 35mm lens for Leica M: Voigtländer Ultron Vintage Line 35mm f/2 Aspherical Type II or Zeiss C Biogon T* 35mm f/2.8 ZM Thank you
Since moving from a digital Leica M setup to the MP (analog) paired with the 35mm Summicron v4, I've been wondering if it makes a noticeable difference with this vintage v4 rather vs a newer ASPH Summicron -- at least enough to justify the cost. Still not sure; is it primarily on digital you notice, etc. One thing though: the size. The compact size of the v4 can't be understated compared to heavier glass and what it's like to have it around your neck all day. Cheers and thanks for the review!
The fact that the voigtlander goes from a pro mist filter look to tack sharp adds a level of creative flexibility for night time photography with lights that some would not think about. Otherwise give me a sony body and a 35mm gmaster for sharpness. 😛
I own and shoot the Nokton VM II a lot, and I felt that Elmar was getting different results than what I would have gotten so I figured he would be shooting the Leica. That being said it was just a guess, but pretty early saw I was right (Lens hood gave it away). What I didn't expect was the chromatic aberration of the Leica, it was a bit much for my liking and this video just showed me it probably wouldn't be worth the upgrade. I also thought the Nokton was a bit sharper in the centre (maybe because of the fringing) but yes the Leica is way better in the corners. In the end, on film I probably wouldn’t see the difference in sharpness, but I would like to have less distortion and my Leica 50mm feels better than my Nokton, and when shooting film, with a Leica its a huge part of the experience. But, I just can’t justify the much higher price when the Nokton just seem really good as well so I probably stick to it for a little while longer. Thanks for the Video!
This Voigtlander lens was the first I bought for my M11P, but I have bought a couple of Leica lenses since, the 50mm Summilux and the 28mm Elmarit. Suffice to say I never use the Voigtlander now.
This is crazy! I loved the warmth of the Voigtlander images sooo much and was convinced that was gonna be the Leica lens! Glad that it isn't though lol need one of those Voigtlander lenses!
Does it also depend on whether you shoot film or digital? I’d imagine for film you would not necessarily want a super clinical modern Leica lens? I shoot on an M6 + f5.6 28.mm summaron - I love the vintage look it gives. I’m looking for a faster lens but wonder which of these two would suit film. For digital I guess the Leica hands down.
Have you looked at the Voigtlander Ultron 35mm f/2? I think it is extremely competitive against the Summicron. The Nokton 1.4 is great for the small size, character, and fast speed. The messy bokeh at low DOF can be polarizing. I enjoy it.
Hi, sorry fot off topic question: I've seen the TT art 28mm. Do you think that it is necessary to calibrate it, since I want to use it only with analog leica.. thank you
Enjoy your Summicron! 🙂 I was unable to tell the differences between the two lenses, in the street photographs shown in your presentation. It does not suprise me that your side-by-side comparison images showed the Nokton to have more visible distortion, or that the Summicron has sharper corners. I have owned neither lens, but did quite much “homework” on 35mm lenses, in the past. I test-shot a new friend’s Voigtlander Nokton II MC, during a meeting at a coffee shop in a nearby city, earlier this year. (In return, he had the opportunity to try my M10, before he made a decision whether to buy a pre-owned M10-R from an on-line seller.) My initial impression of the Nokton was quite favorable! Cosina/Voigtlander makes excellent lenses. I already have several of them, for the Nikon F-mount and for Leica. My APO Lanthar 50mm Aspherical may is one of the most stunningly “perfect” lenses I have ever used. Ultimately, however, when I did buy a 35mm lens, this past summer, I opted for Leica, though a Summilux-M 35mm f/1.4 Steel Rim “Re-Edition” lens. This may well be the only Leica M lens I ever purchase new, rather than pre-owned, so, I am glad that it works well, for me. I already had the excellent, but large Zeiss Distagon 35mm f/1.4 ZM, with very modern optics, so, it made sense to buy the Leica 35mm M lens with a more-vintage character and compact size. I know that I will have to sell lenses, to compensate my budget, but feel that it will be worth it.
Thank you, I am sure I will! :) That's true, some differences in the 101 comparison where kind of "expected" but it's still great to actually test it and not only trust what people are saying about these lenses. I had the chance to try out the re-released Summilux In Wetzlar on its release day and really enjoyed it for the short time I had it. A great lens to achieve great performance closed down, but really artsy, painterly quality shot wide open. Thanks for your comment!
Dear Karin, great video. Have you tried the Voigtlander 35mm Ultron F2? I am looking for a budget M mount lens. I simply can't justify spending almost 6000 for the Summilux as an amateur photographer.
It looks like the Leica lens' settings were a bit off. Several images were overexposed. So I preferred the Voigtlander, based on correct exposure. Both lenses delivered color, contrast and clarity equally well. Good thing. I have all Voigtlander lenses on my M11.
I might be wrong but I feel like there is a slight color cast to the Nokton, the skin tones looked a little yellow-greenish on the film shots. The Summicron seemed more clinical in it's color rendition. With that being said, in this day and age it's almost nothing at all to slightly nudge a slider in lightroom to fix the difference. All and all I think I actually like the Nokton a bit better. I especially like the price a lot better. I just don't see the $2000 of extra value in the Summicron to make it worth it unless you are taking very technical photos in which case you probably wouldn't be using a range finder. Also, Leica owner spends $1500 on a camera and $2600 on a lens to only shot the cheapest budget film.(Just kidding😉)
Great video, as always. I only have 2 M lenses - a 50mm Leica Summicron and the latest CV 35mm Nokton f1.5 - so it’s impossible for me to compare the results of different types and manufacturers of lenses at those focal lengths. That said, I see no reason to buy anything other than the CV 35mm for that focal length. I shoot digital and mainly for a black &white final image so colour rendition is irrelevant. Personally, I can discern no practical difference in the “look” of a CV lens from a Leica or Zeiss - I must just be blind to it!
The color is where it's easy to spot the Voigtlander. This is why I moved away from Voigtlander glass when I left the Sony ecosystem. Leica color science craves less influential glass- and Voigtlanders have a characteristic pop. Great for those who like the pop Voigtlander adds- as seen in the comments by people who prefer it. For others, Leica lenses (or some other third party lenses) make more sense. For the type of photography seen here though, any lens is fine. It's simply not demanding at all from a performance perspective. I don't mean that in a bad way or anything. It's just not dependent on the things which truly separate the lenses.
I own the Leica 28mm f2 summicron and the voigtlander 28mm f2 voigtlander. is the leica better? yes. is it work 4-5x the amount? (second hand). No. BUT if you buy on the second hand market you are unlikely to lose money unless you lose or damage the lens. I also own the 35mm f2 summicron and the 7artisans 35mm f2. the leica is leagues ahead but the 7artisans is so mega and the colour and image rendering is so nice... also Steve mccurry-esk on occasion. I still shoot it even though I have the leica. Considering the voigtlander 35mm f1.5 for that close focusing and shallow DOF.
I have seen another similar video and, as far as I remember, the only difference was in the way harsh light was recorded when bouncing back from either a mirror or a glass surface. I don't shoot Leica because I cannot afford it, however I would be tempted to match glass and body but Im strange and not always rational.
Hmmm… like them both. Own them both ( version 1&2 of the Voigtlaender). Use them both. Strangely the voigtlaender V2 is on my M8 for B/W most of the time. The 35 2 is on my film Leicas or on the 240. But … the enlarged prints of shots taken with the 35 2 are breathtaking sometimes, by enlarged I mean poster size for exhibits or the wall at home with a size of 1.5 to 1 m or even bigger…
I got a summicron 35 a few months ago and I really love it but I don’t like how expensive it is and I’m thinking of selling it for that reason alone. Also recently I tested out a Q3 and so something will have to go (summicron 35) but hopefully I can try out a nokton at some point Also I just wanted to state that in my opinion the chromatic aberration on the summicron is a benefit. I think it adds s really nice dimension to the images but I’m a fan of chromatic aberrations
I totally get that, sometimes you have to shuffle some gear around to make room for something new. Interesting thought about the chromatic aberrations, seeing it as a strong point rather than weak point.
Think the Summicron is more dreamy, cause of that ill use it with more contrasty film like Colorplus! But i love that in Gold the Nokton punches out the colours cause of contrast!
I'm doing research I found a Nikon Z7 with a Sigma 135mm DG lens and a Leica M240 with a summicron-m 35mm f/2 asph on it. And yes found they were in a bin, I live in a nice building I'd say some rich bloke tossed it. Shutter was not working properly on the Leica, but sorted that out!
My opinion: it’s worth the money if you can afford it. It means if it‘s not going to hurt your bank balance, just do it. The experience of shooting with a Summilux or Summicron is really good. But if it’s gonna make you feel some impact on your bank account, and Preis-Leistung-Verhältnis is a thing for you, then don’t do it. Actually, between my Nokton 50/1.1 and my 11726, I could not see a big difference in terms of sharpness. I tested 50 Summicron and I could tell the difference(between the test photos, I even forgot which one was Nokton and which one was Summicron). The improvement in pure picture quality is not worth the money. But the feeling, the focusing, and at some scene, you can feel it later that Nokton is going to perform differently, but that doesn’t happen a lot.
always a good video... thanks... I elected to keep a Nokton 35 f/1.4 and an Ultron f/2. I like the slight darkened corners and slight softness in the corners on many photos, as well as the more contemporary sharp all over look for others.
Thanks for your comment. :) That's so nice to hear! Because this is exactly what I mean: "Perfection" in a lens is not always good! Some people love the quirks and imperfections a lens has because it was character.
Lens A just has that bit more contrast I come to know with Leica lenses. I found the same experience with the Voigtlander 28mm f2 Ultron (first gen) and later made the jump to a 28 Summicron ASPH. Voigtlander by no mean a bad lens, and hard to argue if a 28 summicron is worth the money as value for money is very subjective. But if you can afford it, the result is worth it. Plus you don't really spend money buying a leica lens as they will keep their value much better than the Voigtlander. (I lost money selling the Ultron)
Funny how different perception is, I kind of feel like lens A (the Summicron) is a bit less contrasty while the Nokton is a bit more punchy. The point about keeping the value is very valid though!
Honestly I could not tell! I really enjoyed the lens review with both the studio scenes and the street photography. I think that both lenses look great. I have used Voightländer lenses on a Cosina/Voightländer R body and a Zorki IV. They are great performers and feel nice when focusing and working the aperture ring. I have used them with an adapter on my Fuji T-T2. I have not had the pleasure of using any Leica lenses, so I don't really have a dog in this fight. One thing I would say is that there once were a lot of disparities between old Leica and Zeiss Lenses compared with the Japanese lenses from Canon, Minolta, Konica and others in the middle to late twentieth century. Some of Leica and Zeiss's superiority came down to more fiddly tolerances and higher levels of machining and manufacturing. But by the 1980s the Japanese had caught up through through higher quality control and now by having more robots do the work. I don't think there is any meaningful quality differences between lenses made in Germany and lenses made in Japan. Everything comes down to trying to find a balance between optical qualities, ease of manufacturing, and price. I also expect that there were different engineering philosophies and design choices that drive the performance of contemporary Leica and Voghtländer lenses. All these things come down to trade offs in lens performance, color quality, the type of Bokeh, and ease of manufacturing, cost of manufacturing, etc. For example, I am guessing Leica was fine with slight chromatic aberration because this was present in their historical lenses and they wanted to emphasize sharpness in the corners. (I don't know the exact optical formulas and science here, but from what I understand there are balancing acts with all these qualities.) Seems to me that Cosina/Voigthländer was not setting out to copy the Summicron, but instead wanted something with better chromatic performance and faster aperture, while keeping costs reasonable.
Leica glass was the best 70 years ago on 35mm cameras. It was no comparison - the precision engineering, coatings, designs, glass quality was unmatched. Medium format cameras obviously had a superior image quality and great optics from Zeiss and others, but on 35mm Leica was king. The bodies of course were elegant and durable and rangefinders were discrete and allowed for slow handheld shots for photojournalism, street, art photography and other scenarios that made it a more versatile tool. Other manufacturers weren't producing bodies that were as full featured and none of them had optics that could compete. However, In the very late 70's, and continuing into the 80's and 90's, all the big manufacturers caught up. Nikon AI glass was exceptional and rivaled what Leica was producing and many other manufacturers had caught up as well. Still, that reputation had stuck due to effective branding and marketing. The vast majority of people will fail in blind tests or prefer non-Leica lenses and there really is nothing to justify the price tags associated with Leica glass. They don't have special MTF curves, they don't have special designs (they've been reproduced and copy cats have existed for years), all manufacturers have exceptional coating and fantastic manufacturing processes with finer tolerances that today are superior then stuff we considered elite in the 80's and 90's. Of course some vintage lenses do have unique characteristics in out of focus areas but there are lots of modern lens designs like that as well. Realistically, you have to go out of your way to buy 'bad lenses' nowadays cause even the cheap stuff is very good by historical standards. Ultimately people can of course buy whatever they want but for the hobbyist or working photographer, paying for a 3000 dollar f2 35mm lens is totally unnecessary and it's not going to unlock any new potential in you. Put another way - your shot will not go from forgettable to award winning because you used Leica instead of voigtlander. However, by saving that 2000 dollars you might be able to go on a trip and take an award winning shot with that voigtlander :) With that said, I understand many people are very motivated by what equipment they use and it compels them to pick it up and shoot which is important so. Yea.
Shooting with all kinds of lenses for my Leica M10 and M2 - no prestige at all. But I find myself always going back to the Leica 50mm Summilux ASPH. I know it’s on the high price spectrum, but it just creates magic. I think @benjhaisch captured why it’s so wonderful in one of his videos. It’s my forever lens.
I’m a bit late to comment … use the Voigtländer Ultron 1.7 35 mm, which is impressive in both sharpness and rendering. But I‘m still tempted by the Summicron V5 or 6, and trying to stay strong … 🎉
i liked your photos more. i use a voigtlander nokton 40mm 1.4 on my Leica CL and i know it gives a better contrast usually than the leica lenses :) i also love the build of the voigtlander lenses! 😃
I preferred the Leica, but I think it might have been the exposure. I didn’t see a difference in the quality of the images. I have some Zeiss and Voightlander lenses. The quality is excellent for the price.
cool video Karin! :) I'm curious if you can test the Summilux 35mm in the near future :) I recently sold my 50mm 1.4 Summilux ASPH, because I realised that at my current situation with 2 small kids I only shoot casually with the M system and therefore 2500€ sitting on the shelf collecting dust is something I didn't like. I settled for the Nokton 35mm 1.4 for now as my only M lens since it makes financially sense, but I have to admit, I miss the Summilux :..D Grüße aus BaWü :)
I feel like the Voigtlander 35mm F2 APO Lanthar is a better comparison to the Simmicron. After having had it, it's 50mm F2 APO and 90mm F2.8 APO Lanthar siblings i'm absolutely mind blown at just how sharp and CA free those lenses are even wide open.
Maybe you should also compare Ultron 2/35 VM II to both testes lenses. I am pretty sure you would be surprised, how the latest version of Ultron beats also Summicron lens, while wide open :)
Great video. I usually like all your videos. This one included.....i still use my colour Skopar upto this day. Also at minute 2:38 - 2:40 gave away which lens you were using i believe. especially the lens hoods i think. nevertheless, personally i could not guess which was leica or voigtländer by only looking at the photos. waiting for the next video :)
Thank you so much, I appreciate your comment. :) Yes that's true - if you pay attention closely, there were some clips where you could spot wither a square or round lens hood, which have it away in the end.
It was not a blind test; I can recognize from the beginning that Karin is using Voigtlander because of the hood during the photowalk.-) I own both these lenses, I use Nokton for BW and Summictron for color.-)
You cannot see the differences between Voigtländer, Zeiss and Leica that easily in a video, especially when there is not much bokeh involved. You can however see them on a computer screen. Leica lenses are smaller compared to similar lenses, they usually have better corner sharpness and they give your image a je-ne-sais-quoi. On a computer screen i can tell photos shot with Leica, Zeiss and Voigtländer apart, in most cases easily. Is it worth the extra money? It's a hobby, everyone has to know that for himself.
I spotted it in the first shot. I’d be interested to see a comparison with the Zeiss ZM lenses. They’re sharp but perhaps not as good as the Leica. Now I want a Summicron!! Darn it!
It is sharp at F8. But the Nokton is simply sharper. ;) Also take into account that this is probably a 300x zooms, which is nothing people really do in practice.
I guess, beside Leica owners, most of people know that anything branded "Leica" is mainly just for those who can afford it, no matter how sharp their eyes are at nitpicking or how high their photographic skills are, or how trully needed these products are for their photography. In fact, by not putting a Leica lens on your M body you defeat the main concept of owning a M camera : the distinctive factor. Kidding aside, I know the other 35mm rangefinders are... different, maybe not as comfy or hyped. But still, my point stands : you can make them work. Buy a Bessa put any lense you want and keep the change you saved (thousands of euros) and shoot a shit ton of films :)
I liked this comparison. Unfortunately at 04:46 we can see the side of your lens which kind of gives it away. The lens you shot with has warmer and more vivid colours that I associate with Zeiss lenses so I guessed that was the Voigtlaender. Cheers.
That's true, I was hoping people would not pay that close attention 😬 It's really hard filming each other without showing the lens and not wanting to film everything only from behind. I totally agree, the Nokton is a bit more punchy on the film images.
Which look of which lens did you prefer? And what is your opinion when it comes to the question "Is Leica glass worth the money"? I would be interested to learn more about your thoughts, so please feel free to share them here. Also: In case you want to support my work and get access to additional content, please head over to my Patreon page: www.patreon.com/karinmajoka
Lots of love, Karin 🤍
Hallo,
Ich hatte bis vor kurzem das VOIGTLANDER ULTRON 28MM F2.0
TYPE II VM ASPHÉRIQUE zu meiner Leica M, das wirklich ein klasse Objektiv ist.
Fantastische Schärfe, 1A Fertigungsqualität sowie hervorragende Farbwiedergabe, die Photos waren total beeindruckend!
Man kann dieses herrliche Objektiv zu 100% empfehlen.
Da ich mir nun eine Q3 zu meiner M hinzugekauft habe, dessen 28er das Voigtländer ja ersetzt, habe ich das 28er Objektiv von Voigtländer zu meinem Bedauern verkauft.
Grüße aus Luxemburg.
Die Nokton Linse. Warum? Die Farben sehen besser aus (wärmer), der Helo Effekt bei F1.4 ist genau der Look den ich feier und es gibt kein chromatischen Aberration wie bei der Leica.
B
Spotting the chrome ring on Karin's lens at 2:38 spoilt the game for me. 😏
Me too 😅
I think the voigtlander looks great. It was the one that I preferred.
It's a great lens and I saw really happy with it for the most part. :)
I bought the Nokton 35 mm 10 months ago and have been extremely happy with it. I don't mind small imperfections like vignetting, but the reason why I decided to change it for a Leica Elmarit was the focal length. I wanted to exchange it for a 28 mm lens instead and having seen som reviews, I decided the pricy Elmarit 28 mm was right for me. I expect to shoot it a lot for street, cityscape, architecture and landscape and the 50 mm Summicron for portraits and everything else. I ended up becoming annoyed by the constraints of a 35 mm and wanted something more versatile and moderne as my go to lens. But I have to say that the colour rendering of the Nokton and sharpness produces really lovely pictures. I will try to sell it, but I will keep it, if I can't get a decent price on it.
That intro is my comment section 😂
Hahahah feel you! 😂
Strange, to me the Nokton actually looks sharper in the centre from f2 (at 13:30). Either way if the 'sharpness' is the thing people notice about your photos then that's not a good sign. Some of the most amazing images I've ever seen aren't even fully in focus! For me I prefer cheap stuff because I can be more adventurous and focus on capturing images than worrying about super expensive gear.
Glad it’s not just me! The Nokton certainly does look sharper in the centre crops from f2, and not just because of the higher green/red colour fringing on the lens engraving from the Summicron.
Unless maybe those crops were captioned the wrong way round…
Without a doubt the nokton was way sharper all the way from f2 to f5.6, from f8 all lenses look the same anyway sharpness wise
As a collector of the very finest cameras, I personally believe that’s all about their character, charm and experience of shooting. The fun factor. Not necessarily the price, sharpness or speed. It’s about that instant moment that you grab that equipment and, from the first few shots, you know you are hooked. That sweet formula that makes in love for photography again and again.
Also agree. I’ve had a few dozen lenses over the past 20 years, budget to Leica APO lenses, as well as some of Sony, Canon, Sigma and Voigtlanders best.
Quality was ultimately not the prevailing factor for me. “Good enough” with great ergonomics (largely, compactness) wins. If the lens quality is the make or break for a picture, then I wasn’t taking a great picture to begin with.
I have both lenses and with film I don't think there are enough differences to justify the cost of the Leica, but with my M11 it is pretty obvious that the Leica is much sharper. I also have the Voigtlander 35 APO Lanthar and it is a bit sharper than the Leica and there is no color fringing when looking into the sun, you should check it out. So far the APO is my best 35mm lens (even compared to my Nikon Z & F glass) but it's kind of large and obtrusive so I have yet to decide between the two.
Yes but not good for late night bar shots. Or many other things where lower aperture numbers like 1.2 excel.
I don’t understand why everybody is talking about sharpness. The most obvious difference that gave the Nokton away was color rendition. The Summicron has a much more natural, balanced color rendition, while the Nokton clearly is much warmer and on the magenta side of things. It’s not necessarily bad, but it’s obvious. I don’t have money for the Summicron, but I have to say I was an inch away from buying the Nokton, and this video might have swayed me away and made me stick to my original plan to put a Zeiss Biogon on my Leica M4 rather than the Nokton. Thanks!
This. I see these sort of videos all the time and this is literally the first time someone has pointed out this extremely obvious difference. Voigtlander has a look, and if you know that then the "blind tests" are not blind in the least.
Exactly...!
@@SourPlanet 👌
@@matankedar7050
Totally obvious…!
I can’t tell… I’m surprised as I thought I knew the look of both of those lenses. I thought they were quite different lenses but you show that the differences are in real life very small… thank you.
I totally agree! I still think the Leica outperformed the Nokton when it comes to technical details. But in the end it does not really matter because the "real life" test results showed how close and hard to distinguish they actually were.
I clocked the Summicron right away simply because I use a 50mm Summicron F2. The modern crons are so sharp. I found your Nokton to have noticeably warmer tones with a little more distortion. I’m currently shopping for a 35mm lens so this comparison was super helpful. Because I mostly shoot cars, I think I would go with the option that is more neutral in color rendering to highlight the true color of the cars. The sharpness doesn’t matter as much to me.
I preferred the Nokton more and it had more of a look I wanted. I have a bunch of the Cosina Voigtlander lenses and I love them. I also have a Super Nokton for my Micro 4/3 body and it's a top favorite even though I rarely shoot it wide open
I have that same 11827 35mm Summicron and use it on my M6 TTL and also M11. Having taken it all over the world, I can say it's a completely solid performing lens at all apertures. Glad I didn't compromise.
That sounds great! Actually, having the M10 now, tipped me over the edge staying with the Summicron and not the Nokton. I love how the Summicron renders on digital as well, it's so versatile!
Nice to see pictures from Münster. A nice and fair comparison. The Nocton looks very good but I guess in the end we all want the summicron. did not know that they are so close...
Münster is not such an easy city for street photography though. Totally agree, they are in fact really close!
This was great - it's just a shame that the lens hoods gave this away quite early on who was shooting what. Still very interesting results. Great video.
Totally true, I only realised it in the edit (and hoped people would not pay attention too closely haha). But it was so bright that day, that shooting without a lens hood would be a terrible option.
I had noticed the lens hoods also but still enjoyed the video, especially the side my side comparison.
Leica lenses are super expensive, but from my experience, they hold their value well. I sold some Lenses after using them for years and got the same price for them. I also like that they are designed to be used fully opened. When you compare the Voigtländer f1.4 to the even more expensive Summilux, you will see a massive difference at f1.4. But I can also understand that not everyone can afford such lenses. I want to say that these lenses are not only crazy expensive but also great performers.
I agree with that! :)
I think if you're really into Leica and know you'll use the system for a long time, having your most used lens be a Leica might be worthwhile, then use third parties for the rest of your focal lengths
There's no point having a faster lens if it doesn't perform well wide-open. I only shoot Leica glass and prefer the subtle creamy fall-off and 'soft' sharpness. Highly recommend the 28 Elmarit prea(spherical) inexpensive (by Leica standards) and just jaw-dropping gorgeous.
Great content! The purist will not agree but I guess you can enjoy a Leica camera with a non Leica lens. Sure a lot of the Leica lenses are great. But totally not in reach of my budget. So Voigtlander makes great lenses you can enjoy the great M bodies with a very good lens without paying the price most people can not afford. Another great alternative for me are the Carl Zeiss lenses. A bit higher in price as Voigtlander but IMHO also better performing.
And now I am gonna make the purists 🤮. I own 2 7Artisan lenses. Both very well made. Focus is smooth and tight! All metal and glass. A 35mm f2 and a 50mm f1.1. And both perform above what there price would suggest! I use the 50mm on my old M8 that is 66mm on that camera. I shoot Monochrome jpegs with this camera, and the results are absolutely stunning!
Keep up the good work!!
Kind regards.
I prefer the Nokton, as it's more "Rock & Roll. The lens is not perfect, in the same way we as humans are not perfect, and it's always good to embrace the error. Also, as Henry Cartier-Bresson once said: "Sharpness is a bourgeois concept"... That's not to say this statement should be used as an excuse for poor technique, rather that not every image has to be sharp to be credible...
First of all, thanks for this cool comparison, it's a great idea to have these two excellent lenses go head to head.
I honestly had the right guess during the video as to which was the Leica lens. The images with the Summicron had that slightly clearer, cooler color shades, aka "Leica look", to me. With the Nokton, I found the colors more vibrant and the look a bit more washed out, more vintage style.
If money was no object, the Summicron would be my first choice, but in real life I would probably go with the Voigtländer and still be very happy with it. 🙂
Karin, loved the video and I appreciated the challenge. Elmar was shooting the Leica. Voigtlander colors are to my eye more saturated. And while no one can argue that there are some incredible Third Party lenses, the Leica ecosystem is my preference. That they retain their value certainly helps when pulling the trigger on each and every lens purchase. Continued happiness and success to you and yours. Be Blessed, Doc Chaps
Nice comparison video! Some others have noted the lens hood giving it away, which I noticed as well 😅, but I guessed it right before that, but ONLY because of some distortion on some of the straight on shots of buildings where a window edge or other straight line was at the edge of the frame. If it weren't for that distortion I probably wouldn't have been able to tell much of a difference. I have the Nokton myself and have always enjoyed shooting with it and am perfectly happy with the photos it makes. I definitely don't feel like the Summicron is worth $2000 more for my purposes...but then, i've never actually used one myself.🤔
The Voigtländer 35mm f2 Ultron beats the Summicron 35mm f2 in image quality and is also sharper than the Nokton 35/1.4. Absolute recommendation.
I was thinking that would be a better comparison
Sharper yes if that’s what you’re going for. If you want depth of field and natural rendering, more a classic look, then the f2 is not good enough. The 1.2, the 1.5…
So So close! I’m just blown away that you can get such amazing quality and sharpness from film. I preferred the Leica but as said it was so close. Great video and a decision I’m going to have to make soon when I get my M6 or MP.
I have the nokton 35 1.4 and love it! There is just one thing that didn’t really show up that much in the review though. At wider open apertures the colors change pretty vastly for me, a lot of times I really like how this looks (also the bokeh gets swirly at 1.4) but it could be seen as an imperfection
I honestly rarely use any lens wide open, which is why I did not really put this in the focus of the review - but that is in fact a good point! The Bokeh of the Nokton is a but more agitated and swirly, but the Bokeh on the Summicron is a bit more calm and smooth in my opinion. Imperfections are not always a bad thing. :)
@13:29 center sharpness comparisson at f2 the Summicron looks worse. Am I blind? The Summicron is known for its heavy vignetting even at small apertures, so probably there are still some correction playing a role.
I choose the lens that gives the images I like the most. My three favourite lenses are 21mm Elmarit f2.8 ASPH, Nokton 35mm f1.4 classic MC II and Planar 50mm f2 ZM. I tried a variety and chose on image not price nor brand. I can’t be bothered with the Leica snobs, they are obviously more bothered about being big heads than their image quality :-)
Great comparison. I sold my Nokton 35mm f1.4 to fund a 50mm Summicron. The Voigtländer is the perfect first start in the world of the M-lenses. I loved the compact size. Maybe I will buy one again 🙂
Interesting, that you made the switch from 35mm to 50mm with that! It's a great and really affordable lens you cannot go wrong with. :)
@@KarinMajokaNow - several years ago - there are many different lenses in my bag. Too much 😂
The Lecia lens produces images with more contrast. Good or Bad?
I love my Voigt collection for the SL2S , placebo makes you think Leica lens may be leaps ahead while actual perceptual difference maybe negligible. Great video
What a great review and very helpful in decision making considering that I’ve shot with the voigtlander 35 1.4 MC & MCII for four years. I’ve been trying to find out if it was worth the swap. I’d say very much so from this video.
Thanks for sharing! :) Glad you are happy with your choice!
My impression is that the differences aren't really big if you shoot film and mostly use medium apertures, like in street photography. I own the Nokton 35mm 1,4 (Version I though) myself and like the compactness and the image quality is mostly great. It has some annoying issues though, the distortion and vignetting can be nasty and wide open it is really soft, which makes not really a good option for low light. So I look for an upgrade, but the Leica 35mm lenses are definitely out of my price range 😕
Maybe the new Voigtländer Ultron 35mm 2,0 or the Zeiss Biogon? We'll see... Happy shooting, I would also like to see a video about your experiences with the M10 so far!
I prefer the Nokton here. Not that they look hugely different. May be I just prefer the images you took this day.
I like in field tests. I'm not very interested in lens performance on the test booth. Colour fringing is a showstopper for me, vignetting isn't. I like vignettes, and if I ever want to get rid of it, Capture One will do the job. Also, the Nocton compares a lot more to the Leica 35 mm f1.4 Steel Rim. Compared to the Steel Rim, the Nocton performs much closer to the Leica than in this comparison. In some fields even better. For me, the Nocton 35 mm f1.4 II is the better choice, but I totally understand your decision. I will never change my Summicron 50 mm (Version IV) with any other lens. Some lenses are pure magic.
Thank you for your honest comparison. I like the style of this video and will definitely look for further content on your channel.
From the first few photos my bet was on Karin using the Nokton. After a few more I was quite sure she does. Those photos just had much more of the orange tone (for me, subjectively, too much). One thing 3rd party lenses can't beat Leica lenses at is the colour reproduction. With Elmar's photos it was clear how more natural the colour reproduction is, even despite the "vintage" orange tone of the Kodak 200 film.
Of course, a blind comparison is much easier if you know you're comparing 2 groups of photos made with just 2 lenses, than having a bucket of photos which are not labelled A / B and you have to guess each photo individually.
My conclusion - I was considering buying Nokton as my 35mm lens (right now shooting with a 50mm Summicron) and I came here to validate whether Nokton is enough for my needs. The decision is I'm starting saving for a 35mm Summicron instead.
Nice comparison. Just by looking at the photos, I couldn't say which was shot on which lens. But I did work out who was shooting which lens quite early on in the video. I won't say how I knew, so as not to spoil it for other watchers. I owned the Nokton 35mm and it's a fantastic little performer.
Haha, I know what you are referring to. I only noticed it later because we did not film everything from behind. I just hoped people would not pay too much attention ;) Thanks for your comment!
As an owner of the Summicron 35mm. I personally feel one should use the lens that one feels gives them the look they want. I also use TTArtisan, Light Lens Lab and Thypoch lenses. I have the Voigtländer 21mm and 90mm Skopars on my to buy list.
Nice comparison. Enjoy your new lens. I only have two lenses for my two Leica M's (film and digital): the same 35mm Summicron and the 28mm Elmarit.
Thank you! :) The 28mm Elmarit seems to be a great lens as well.
That at 1:51 , well, not on TH-cam, can you put a link in the description for downloading the raw files somewhere? 😄
I have a Voightlander 35mm f1.4 Nokton Classic E on my Sony camera. I absolutely love it.
Karin! Do a comp with the old V1 or V2 Summicron (Rigid or Dual Range) and the Nokton. I'd be curious to see how the old Summicron compares to your Nokton Classic.
Warum heißt Elmar wie die Bezeichnung einiger Leicaobjektive? Ich war zunächst irritiert. Wieso raten, wenn es da unterm Bild steht? Und war nicht vom Summicron die Rede?
Do a comparison for the summicron vs Voigtlander Ultron v2 35/2 please. The Ultron is better but would love to see if you still chose the Summicron for character. Thx
Karin, I now challenge you to try out some vintage LTM lenses on your M6, which are even less money than the Nokton. The Canon lenses are little jewels made with Japanese precision and are frequently compared to Leica's best from that era. They probably won't outperform your Summicron ASPH, but perhaps your audience might enjoy a review.
I actually got a 50mm Canon LTM lens as a gift recently which works great. It has some fungus though so it wouldn't be a fair comparison - but it's a fun lens for sure!
I figured that the images that were tack sharp were from the summicron. While the others weren't tack sharp. Not necessarily a bad thing if you want some character vs sterile images. I was looking at the corners of the image for sharpness. At least in my opinion that's how I was able to tell the difference. which do you prefer?
Always cool seeing Eastblockboy!
Hello and thank you for this interesting video. The give away was when I saw the lens hood on your camera ... But I still enjoyed the video and I was very very much surprised at the look of the files coming from the Voigtlander. I have shot the older version (on a Leica M9) and was not very happy with center sharpness and most importantly colour fringing but it seems they've made everything better now and for a third of the price compared to the Summicron!!! Great value for the money, great to be able to go out and shooot with a lens that gets good results and will generate less stress if banged (a little). I have also shot with a Summicron ASPH 35mm (on the M9 and then on a M240 and an M6 as well) but I was less than happy with it: seems to me that (at least on my version) the Leica "pop" was lacking and overall build quality was to par with the Voigtlander; but not over the top.
Super Review und sehr schöner, praxisbezogener Vergleich.
Kommt gerade richtig, da ich plane von der Fuji X-Pro3 auf eine Leica M (wohl die Monochrom Typ 246) umzusteigen. Bin noch in der Entscheidungsphase…
Das Nokton steht bei mir auf der Liste und dieses Review kommt mir gerade gelegen. Dankeschön dafür ✌🏻☺️ Ich mag den Look und ja, vom Preis her isses auch sehr ansprechend.
Vielen Dank für deinen Kommentar, das freut mich! :)
Oh, spannend! Wo stehst du grade im Entscheidungssprozess, wieso wird es vermutlich die 246 Monochrome?
Das Nokton ist super, das Review zeigt mir nochmal wie nah die beiden Objektive in der Praxis doch aneinander sind.
@@KarinMajoka Hi ! Ich bin grad auf der Suche nach einem guten Angebot für eine M246. Monochrome daher, da ich immer mehr feststelle das ich bei Street hauptsächlich B/W fotografiere und eine Kamera mit Monochrom-Sensor reizt mich schon seit langem. Andererseits überlege ich auch die X-Pro3 zu behalten und mir die Voigtländer Noktons für den X-Mount zuzulegen und dann nur mit monochromen Fuji-Rezepten bzw. Lightroom-Presets zu arbeiten. Morgen bekomme ich ein Nokton 23 f/1.2 geliehen. Vielleicht läuft das auch darauf hinaus. Ist ja auch eine finanzielle Frage ;). Mal schauen wo der Weg hinführt.
As always, love your videos. I actually purchased the Nokton for my M6 based on research and the earlier video you mentioned. I haven't been disappointed. Do you ever discuss 50mm options? I'll have to look at your library of videos. Though I've been in the industry for over 35 years I am continuously surprised that people would tell other people how to use, or what gear they should be using. Shoot what you want, that fits your budget and serves your art.
I would love to underline your last sentence several time! Word, I could not agree more! :)
Glad to hear you are happy with the Nokton, it's a fantastic lens. So far, I have mainly shot 35mm lenses on the Leica and have tried out 28mm more recently. 50mm is not a focal length I use too often which is why I have not made any comparisons between lenses here.
Give the Nokton 50 F1.5 II a go, honestly the best jack-of-all-trades 50, fast, super small, cheapish, well made, sharp, and extremely pleasant render.
Great video!
What would you recommend like first 35mm lens for Leica M: Voigtländer Ultron Vintage Line 35mm f/2 Aspherical Type II or Zeiss C Biogon T* 35mm f/2.8 ZM
Thank you
Since moving from a digital Leica M setup to the MP (analog) paired with the 35mm Summicron v4, I've been wondering if it makes a noticeable difference with this vintage v4 rather vs a newer ASPH Summicron -- at least enough to justify the cost. Still not sure; is it primarily on digital you notice, etc. One thing though: the size. The compact size of the v4 can't be understated compared to heavier glass and what it's like to have it around your neck all day. Cheers and thanks for the review!
The fact that the voigtlander goes from a pro mist filter look to tack sharp adds a level of creative flexibility for night time photography with lights that some would not think about.
Otherwise give me a sony body and a 35mm gmaster for sharpness. 😛
I own and shoot the Nokton VM II a lot, and I felt that Elmar was getting different results than what I would have gotten so I figured he would be shooting the Leica. That being said it was just a guess, but pretty early saw I was right (Lens hood gave it away). What I didn't expect was the chromatic aberration of the Leica, it was a bit much for my liking and this video just showed me it probably wouldn't be worth the upgrade. I also thought the Nokton was a bit sharper in the centre (maybe because of the fringing) but yes the Leica is way better in the corners. In the end, on film I probably wouldn’t see the difference in sharpness, but I would like to have less distortion and my Leica 50mm feels better than my Nokton, and when shooting film, with a Leica its a huge part of the experience. But, I just can’t justify the much higher price when the Nokton just seem really good as well so I probably stick to it for a little while longer. Thanks for the Video!
This Voigtlander lens was the first I bought for my M11P, but I have bought a couple of Leica lenses since, the 50mm Summilux and the 28mm Elmarit. Suffice to say I never use the Voigtlander now.
Really nice comparison, love the images you both shot!
Thank you! :)
Got it early on. The Leica seemed crisper to me. Great review and thanks for your efforts and presentation Karin.
This is crazy! I loved the warmth of the Voigtlander images sooo much and was convinced that was gonna be the Leica lens! Glad that it isn't though lol need one of those Voigtlander lenses!
Does it also depend on whether you shoot film or digital? I’d imagine for film you would not necessarily want a super clinical modern Leica lens? I shoot on an M6 + f5.6 28.mm summaron - I love the vintage look it gives. I’m looking for a faster lens but wonder which of these two would suit film. For digital I guess the Leica hands down.
Thank you, great review. Any chance of adding a comparison of the Zeiss 35mm lens with these.
Have you looked at the Voigtlander Ultron 35mm f/2? I think it is extremely competitive against the Summicron.
The Nokton 1.4 is great for the small size, character, and fast speed. The messy bokeh at low DOF can be polarizing. I enjoy it.
Hi, sorry fot off topic question: I've seen the TT art 28mm. Do you think that it is necessary to calibrate it, since I want to use it only with analog leica.. thank you
Enjoy your Summicron! 🙂 I was unable to tell the differences between the two lenses, in the street photographs shown in your presentation. It does not suprise me that your side-by-side comparison images showed the Nokton to have more visible distortion, or that the Summicron has sharper corners. I have owned neither lens, but did quite much “homework” on 35mm lenses, in the past. I test-shot a new friend’s Voigtlander Nokton II MC, during a meeting at a coffee shop in a nearby city, earlier this year. (In return, he had the opportunity to try my M10, before he made a decision whether to buy a pre-owned M10-R from an on-line seller.) My initial impression of the Nokton was quite favorable!
Cosina/Voigtlander makes excellent lenses. I already have several of them, for the Nikon F-mount and for Leica. My APO Lanthar 50mm Aspherical may is one of the most stunningly “perfect” lenses I have ever used. Ultimately, however, when I did buy a 35mm lens, this past summer, I opted for Leica, though a Summilux-M 35mm f/1.4 Steel Rim “Re-Edition” lens. This may well be the only Leica M lens I ever purchase new, rather than pre-owned, so, I am glad that it works well, for me. I already had the excellent, but large Zeiss Distagon 35mm f/1.4 ZM, with very modern optics, so, it made sense to buy the Leica 35mm M lens with a more-vintage character and compact size. I know that I will have to sell lenses, to compensate my budget, but feel that it will be worth it.
Thank you, I am sure I will! :)
That's true, some differences in the 101 comparison where kind of "expected" but it's still great to actually test it and not only trust what people are saying about these lenses.
I had the chance to try out the re-released Summilux In Wetzlar on its release day and really enjoyed it for the short time I had it. A great lens to achieve great performance closed down, but really artsy, painterly quality shot wide open.
Thanks for your comment!
Dear Karin, great video. Have you tried the Voigtlander 35mm Ultron F2? I am looking for a budget M mount lens. I simply can't justify spending almost 6000 for the Summilux as an amateur photographer.
It looks like the Leica lens' settings were a bit off. Several images were overexposed. So I preferred the Voigtlander, based on correct exposure. Both lenses delivered color, contrast and clarity equally well. Good thing. I have all Voigtlander lenses on my M11.
Hello Karin, i have no idea about Cameras but i always enjoy these videos! keep on keeping on!
I might be wrong but I feel like there is a slight color cast to the Nokton, the skin tones looked a little yellow-greenish on the film shots. The Summicron seemed more clinical in it's color rendition. With that being said, in this day and age it's almost nothing at all to slightly nudge a slider in lightroom to fix the difference. All and all I think I actually like the Nokton a bit better. I especially like the price a lot better. I just don't see the $2000 of extra value in the Summicron to make it worth it unless you are taking very technical photos in which case you probably wouldn't be using a range finder.
Also, Leica owner spends $1500 on a camera and $2600 on a lens to only shot the cheapest budget film.(Just kidding😉)
Love your new Viedo, Karin! His name being Elmar makes it quite confusing though ;) 😄
I have the Nokton and it’s really my favorite lens. It’s just so bright and beautiful
Great video, as always. I only have 2 M lenses - a 50mm Leica Summicron and the latest CV 35mm Nokton f1.5 - so it’s impossible for me to compare the results of different types and manufacturers of lenses at those focal lengths. That said, I see no reason to buy anything other than the CV 35mm for that focal length. I shoot digital and mainly for a black &white final image so colour rendition is irrelevant. Personally, I can discern no practical difference in the “look” of a CV lens from a Leica or Zeiss - I must just be blind to it!
The color is where it's easy to spot the Voigtlander. This is why I moved away from Voigtlander glass when I left the Sony ecosystem. Leica color science craves less influential glass- and Voigtlanders have a characteristic pop. Great for those who like the pop Voigtlander adds- as seen in the comments by people who prefer it. For others, Leica lenses (or some other third party lenses) make more sense.
For the type of photography seen here though, any lens is fine. It's simply not demanding at all from a performance perspective. I don't mean that in a bad way or anything. It's just not dependent on the things which truly separate the lenses.
I own the Leica 28mm f2 summicron and the voigtlander 28mm f2 voigtlander. is the leica better? yes. is it work 4-5x the amount? (second hand). No. BUT if you buy on the second hand market you are unlikely to lose money unless you lose or damage the lens. I also own the 35mm f2 summicron and the 7artisans 35mm f2. the leica is leagues ahead but the 7artisans is so mega and the colour and image rendering is so nice... also Steve mccurry-esk on occasion. I still shoot it even though I have the leica. Considering the voigtlander 35mm f1.5 for that close focusing and shallow DOF.
I have seen another similar video and, as far as I remember, the only difference was in the way harsh light was recorded when bouncing back from either a mirror or a glass surface. I don't shoot Leica because I cannot afford it, however I would be tempted to match glass and body but Im strange and not always rational.
Hmmm… like them both. Own them both ( version 1&2 of the Voigtlaender). Use them both. Strangely the voigtlaender V2 is on my M8 for B/W most of the time. The 35 2 is on my film Leicas or on the 240. But … the enlarged prints of shots taken with the 35 2 are breathtaking sometimes, by enlarged I mean poster size for exhibits or the wall at home with a size of 1.5 to 1 m or even bigger…
I got a summicron 35 a few months ago and I really love it but I don’t like how expensive it is and I’m thinking of selling it for that reason alone. Also recently I tested out a Q3 and so something will have to go (summicron 35) but hopefully I can try out a nokton at some point
Also I just wanted to state that in my opinion the chromatic aberration on the summicron is a benefit. I think it adds s really nice dimension to the images but I’m a fan of chromatic aberrations
I totally get that, sometimes you have to shuffle some gear around to make room for something new.
Interesting thought about the chromatic aberrations, seeing it as a strong point rather than weak point.
Think the Summicron is more dreamy, cause of that ill use it with more contrasty film like Colorplus! But i love that in Gold the Nokton punches out the colours cause of contrast!
I'm doing research I found a Nikon Z7 with a Sigma 135mm DG lens and a Leica M240 with a summicron-m 35mm f/2 asph on it.
And yes found they were in a bin, I live in a nice building I'd say some rich bloke tossed it.
Shutter was not working properly on the Leica, but sorted that out!
It was easy to tell, because the shape of the hoods was visible in the video that gave it away.
That said, both look great.
My opinion: it’s worth the money if you can afford it. It means if it‘s not going to hurt your bank balance, just do it. The experience of shooting with a Summilux or Summicron is really good. But if it’s gonna make you feel some impact on your bank account, and Preis-Leistung-Verhältnis is a thing for you, then don’t do it. Actually, between my Nokton 50/1.1 and my 11726, I could not see a big difference in terms of sharpness. I tested 50 Summicron and I could tell the difference(between the test photos, I even forgot which one was Nokton and which one was Summicron). The improvement in pure picture quality is not worth the money. But the feeling, the focusing, and at some scene, you can feel it later that Nokton is going to perform differently, but that doesn’t happen a lot.
always a good video... thanks... I elected to keep a Nokton 35 f/1.4 and an Ultron f/2. I like the slight darkened corners and slight softness in the corners on many photos, as well as the more contemporary sharp all over look for others.
Thanks for your comment. :) That's so nice to hear! Because this is exactly what I mean: "Perfection" in a lens is not always good! Some people love the quirks and imperfections a lens has because it was character.
Lens A just has that bit more contrast I come to know with Leica lenses. I found the same experience with the Voigtlander 28mm f2 Ultron (first gen) and later made the jump to a 28 Summicron ASPH. Voigtlander by no mean a bad lens, and hard to argue if a 28 summicron is worth the money as value for money is very subjective. But if you can afford it, the result is worth it. Plus you don't really spend money buying a leica lens as they will keep their value much better than the Voigtlander. (I lost money selling the Ultron)
Funny how different perception is, I kind of feel like lens A (the Summicron) is a bit less contrasty while the Nokton is a bit more punchy. The point about keeping the value is very valid though!
Honestly I could not tell! I really enjoyed the lens review with both the studio scenes and the street photography. I think that both lenses look great. I have used Voightländer lenses on a Cosina/Voightländer R body and a Zorki IV. They are great performers and feel nice when focusing and working the aperture ring. I have used them with an adapter on my Fuji T-T2. I have not had the pleasure of using any Leica lenses, so I don't really have a dog in this fight.
One thing I would say is that there once were a lot of disparities between old Leica and Zeiss Lenses compared with the Japanese lenses from Canon, Minolta, Konica and others in the middle to late twentieth century. Some of Leica and Zeiss's superiority came down to more fiddly tolerances and higher levels of machining and manufacturing. But by the 1980s the Japanese had caught up through through higher quality control and now by having more robots do the work. I don't think there is any meaningful quality differences between lenses made in Germany and lenses made in Japan. Everything comes down to trying to find a balance between optical qualities, ease of manufacturing, and price.
I also expect that there were different engineering philosophies and design choices that drive the performance of contemporary Leica and Voghtländer lenses. All these things come down to trade offs in lens performance, color quality, the type of Bokeh, and ease of manufacturing, cost of manufacturing, etc. For example, I am guessing Leica was fine with slight chromatic aberration because this was present in their historical lenses and they wanted to emphasize sharpness in the corners. (I don't know the exact optical formulas and science here, but from what I understand there are balancing acts with all these qualities.) Seems to me that Cosina/Voigthländer was not setting out to copy the Summicron, but instead wanted something with better chromatic performance and faster aperture, while keeping costs reasonable.
Leica glass was the best 70 years ago on 35mm cameras. It was no comparison - the precision engineering, coatings, designs, glass quality was unmatched. Medium format cameras obviously had a superior image quality and great optics from Zeiss and others, but on 35mm Leica was king. The bodies of course were elegant and durable and rangefinders were discrete and allowed for slow handheld shots for photojournalism, street, art photography and other scenarios that made it a more versatile tool. Other manufacturers weren't producing bodies that were as full featured and none of them had optics that could compete.
However, In the very late 70's, and continuing into the 80's and 90's, all the big manufacturers caught up. Nikon AI glass was exceptional and rivaled what Leica was producing and many other manufacturers had caught up as well. Still, that reputation had stuck due to effective branding and marketing.
The vast majority of people will fail in blind tests or prefer non-Leica lenses and there really is nothing to justify the price tags associated with Leica glass. They don't have special MTF curves, they don't have special designs (they've been reproduced and copy cats have existed for years), all manufacturers have exceptional coating and fantastic manufacturing processes with finer tolerances that today are superior then stuff we considered elite in the 80's and 90's. Of course some vintage lenses do have unique characteristics in out of focus areas but there are lots of modern lens designs like that as well.
Realistically, you have to go out of your way to buy 'bad lenses' nowadays cause even the cheap stuff is very good by historical standards.
Ultimately people can of course buy whatever they want but for the hobbyist or working photographer, paying for a 3000 dollar f2 35mm lens is totally unnecessary and it's not going to unlock any new potential in you.
Put another way - your shot will not go from forgettable to award winning because you used Leica instead of voigtlander. However, by saving that 2000 dollars you might be able to go on a trip and take an award winning shot with that voigtlander :)
With that said, I understand many people are very motivated by what equipment they use and it compels them to pick it up and shoot which is important so. Yea.
Shooting with all kinds of lenses for my Leica M10 and M2 - no prestige at all. But I find myself always going back to the Leica 50mm Summilux ASPH. I know it’s on the high price spectrum, but it just creates magic. I think @benjhaisch captured why it’s so wonderful in one of his videos. It’s my forever lens.
I’m a bit late to comment … use the Voigtländer Ultron 1.7 35 mm, which is impressive in both sharpness and rendering. But I‘m still tempted by the Summicron V5 or 6, and trying to stay strong … 🎉
The Voigtlander 35 ultron F2 would be a better test as it’s a fab performer. I have this and the Voigtlander 35 F1.4 nokton.
I didn't guess right but I preferred the Nokton in the blind test and assumed it was the Leica, so I was pleasantly surprised.
i liked your photos more. i use a voigtlander nokton 40mm 1.4 on my Leica CL and i know it gives a better contrast usually than the leica lenses :) i also love the build of the voigtlander lenses! 😃
I preferred the Leica, but I think it might have been the exposure. I didn’t see a difference in the quality of the images. I have some Zeiss and Voightlander lenses. The quality is excellent for the price.
cool video Karin! :)
I'm curious if you can test the Summilux 35mm in the near future :)
I recently sold my 50mm 1.4 Summilux ASPH, because I realised that at my current situation with 2 small kids I only shoot casually with the M system and therefore 2500€ sitting on the shelf collecting dust is something I didn't like. I settled for the Nokton 35mm 1.4 for now as my only M lens since it makes financially sense, but I have to admit, I miss the Summilux :..D
Grüße aus BaWü :)
I feel like the Voigtlander 35mm F2 APO Lanthar is a better comparison to the Simmicron. After having had it, it's 50mm F2 APO and 90mm F2.8 APO Lanthar siblings i'm absolutely mind blown at just how sharp and CA free those lenses are even wide open.
The Noktons colors Popped a bit more, thank you for this video. 👍🏼👍🏼
Maybe you should also compare Ultron 2/35 VM II to both testes lenses. I am pretty sure you would be surprised, how the latest version of Ultron beats also Summicron lens, while wide open :)
Great video. I usually like all your videos. This one included.....i still use my colour Skopar upto this day.
Also at minute 2:38 - 2:40 gave away which lens you were using i believe. especially the lens hoods i think.
nevertheless, personally i could not guess which was leica or voigtländer by only looking at the photos.
waiting for the next video :)
Thank you so much, I appreciate your comment. :)
Yes that's true - if you pay attention closely, there were some clips where you could spot wither a square or round lens hood, which have it away in the end.
It was not a blind test; I can recognize from the beginning that Karin is using Voigtlander because of the hood during the photowalk.-) I own both these lenses, I use Nokton for BW and Summictron for color.-)
I could tell right away from the sharpness and highlight rolloff of the photos. Definitely worth the money.
You cannot see the differences between Voigtländer, Zeiss and Leica that easily in a video, especially when there is not much bokeh involved. You can however see them on a computer screen.
Leica lenses are smaller compared to similar lenses, they usually have better corner sharpness and they give your image a je-ne-sais-quoi. On a computer screen i can tell photos shot with Leica, Zeiss and Voigtländer apart, in most cases easily.
Is it worth the extra money? It's a hobby, everyone has to know that for himself.
Interesting thought, I agree! Especially the last sentences, what's "worth it" is always subjective.
I spotted it in the first shot. I’d be interested to see a comparison with the Zeiss ZM lenses. They’re sharp but perhaps not as good as the Leica. Now I want a Summicron!! Darn it!
What gave it away for you (other than the lens hood 😬)?
There is something strange with that summicron, it is not possible that it is not sharp at f8
It is sharp at F8. But the Nokton is simply sharper. ;)
Also take into account that this is probably a 300x zooms, which is nothing people really do in practice.
I guess, beside Leica owners, most of people know that anything branded "Leica" is mainly just for those who can afford it, no matter how sharp their eyes are at nitpicking or how high their photographic skills are, or how trully needed these products are for their photography. In fact, by not putting a Leica lens on your M body you defeat the main concept of owning a M camera : the distinctive factor. Kidding aside, I know the other 35mm rangefinders are... different, maybe not as comfy or hyped. But still, my point stands : you can make them work. Buy a Bessa put any lense you want and keep the change you saved (thousands of euros) and shoot a shit ton of films :)
I liked this comparison. Unfortunately at 04:46 we can see the side of your lens which kind of gives it away. The lens you shot with has warmer and more vivid colours that I associate with Zeiss lenses so I guessed that was the Voigtlaender. Cheers.
That's true, I was hoping people would not pay that close attention 😬 It's really hard filming each other without showing the lens and not wanting to film everything only from behind.
I totally agree, the Nokton is a bit more punchy on the film images.
I am going to say Karin had the Nokton, as I enjoy the slight warming tone the Voigtländer's have over the Leica's.
I have the 40/1.4 SC Voigtländer myself, and it is one of my all-time favourite lenses to use.
I have the Nokton and still want to try a Summicron.