I have been in need of a lead hardness tester for a long time. But they are pretty pricy. I saw one on you tube and thought I could make one like that.
What you need is a series of "standards" to calibrate it. Also the more you turn the point into the lead the more difference you're going to see and the more accurate your results will be.
Nice machine work. Two suggestions, one, you might take some ingots to a local mechanical engineering college, or a local shop, and ask them to test them on a Brinell Hardness Tester to get actual Brinell numbers to calibrate your chart to them. Also, maybe also calibrate the unit using two turns on the indenter, to see if the results change.
Perhaps you have discovered by now, but the Cerrocast is a low temperature casting material that's used commonly by gunsmiths and other machinists for the purpose of measuring chambers and other internal dimensions. It has specific shrinkage/time values that allow precise measurements to be taken. Check Rotometals for their version, which may be listed with their trade name. It melts at the temperature of M&Ms. Cool stuff. Your craftsmanship is praiseworthy!
Very nice machine work.. Looks like somebody knows how to use a Milling machine, Surface Grinder and a lathe... Nice work.. Ive been trying to figure out a way to make one of these with materials I have available. and you just hit the nail on the head, especially with the Valve Spring .. got plenty of those.. LOL
You can shoot soft bullets and not get leading. It is all about bullet size not hardness. Also pure lead doesn't harden when you water drop. For it to harden some with water you need other metals in there besides pure lead. If you haven't already check out the castboolits forum. Tons of info there.
I use a 50/50 ww and dead soft in my 45, powder coat and no problems. I do slug the barrel anf make sure I have at least one to two thousandths oversize
This is a very robust tool, and a good way to get a comparative hardness on you lead alloy. One point that you mention is that you are getting barrel leading, this is almost always due to too hard an alloy with a less than groove diameter bullet, the only way you will encourage leading with a soft bullet is to be driving it too fast, the bullet then strips, leaving lead in the bore, but the soft lead bullet obturates on firing and completely fills the bore, a hard alloy will not, allowing gases to get by and melt the lead onto your bore, just try a pure lead bullet, depending on your rifling type.
And, its rather pricy. It has a very low melting point, just less than boiling water. I work on many very old combination guns (drillings) where the rifle barrel may be in an obsolete or non-standard calibers. A chamber casting is about the only way to determine exactly what it might be.
Thanks for the video. I didn't see the other guys rig but yours seems to be an improvement in design from what you say. My only question would be the angle of the point ...changing that angle would change the range of changes. It would not be a big deal but if you did want to document many different tests it may not give you enough difference between each of them. A sharper point might give a larger range. About the hardness changing with age...From what I understand it is the antimony that causes lead alloy to harden with water AND change hardness with age. I don't think pure lead will change.
This is a great design, thank you for sharing. I like the fact it uses an indicator and penetration versus using using optics to measure dimple diameters. I'm trying to replicate this, do you know what type of engine the valve spring came from?
I have a bunch of salvaged lead that I cleaned up and made into ingots. I have molds for fishing weights. I melted both the lead and zinc wheel weights together because I didnt think that the fish would care too much either way. It was interesting to see the layers of melted materials in the crucible they didnt mix looked like free water flowing over the top of an ice layer if that made sense. .
considering how the metals tend to float until they reach their melting points I assume so. IE the metal clips from the wheel weights floated on the melted lead. Zinc melts at roughly 75 degrees hotter than lead. so I am making assumptions but yes I think so
Hey Uncle Buck, ya better mark that new contraption "Boo-let hardness tester", so a hundred years from now we all won't be fooled by Tubal Cain in a "What is this tool" video!
I am thinking you should put a commercial lead bullet in your lil indicator there and compare it to your samples. Nice build looks like should do the job.
This makes precise hardness testing so accessible, thank you. I know lead, the material that all these videos focus on, is a pretty soft metal. But could this work with testing the hardness of other metals and alloys? Like aluminum, bronze, cast iron, or even steel if a diamond tip was used and the whole structure beefed up?
I wonder if it had more to do with sizing or lube. I've been running straight range scrap through my 9mm's, .45's, and .38's for years. Range scrap is a good 4-5 BHN softer even than WW.
I have a question I just came from harbor freight tools . They have a chain break tool can we make something similar tool like your from that ? It is seems like very similar
When I want to make something I go to the collage of you tube and research. then I think long and hard it that is what I want. I try to see if there could be any improvements then I go forth! lol
What you need is a series of "standards" to calibrate it. Also the more you turn the point into the lead the more difference you're going to see and the more accurate your results will be.
Ingots, slugs, bullets, sabots!
Amazing work brother!!!!
I'd buy one!
Nice machine work. Two suggestions, one, you might take some ingots to a local mechanical engineering college, or a local shop, and ask them to test them on a Brinell Hardness Tester to get actual Brinell numbers to calibrate your chart to them. Also, maybe also calibrate the unit using two turns on the indenter, to see if the results change.
The results will be different since the indentation point is tapered.
Perhaps you have discovered by now, but the Cerrocast is a low temperature casting material that's used commonly by gunsmiths and other machinists for the purpose of measuring chambers and other internal dimensions. It has specific shrinkage/time values that allow precise measurements to be taken. Check Rotometals for their version, which may be listed with their trade name. It melts at the temperature of M&Ms. Cool stuff. Your craftsmanship is praiseworthy!
Thank you. I am just an amateur machinist in my home shop. But I have fun making things I need.
Great , Just made mine and works a treat, compering it to commercial made bullets to my own
Very nice machine work.. Looks like somebody knows how to use a Milling machine, Surface Grinder and a lathe... Nice work.. Ive been trying to figure out a way to make one of these with materials I have available. and you just hit the nail on the head, especially with the Valve Spring .. got plenty of those.. LOL
You can shoot soft bullets and not get leading. It is all about bullet size not hardness. Also pure lead doesn't harden when you water drop. For it to harden some with water you need other metals in there besides pure lead.
If you haven't already check out the castboolits forum. Tons of info there.
Been there quite a bit. I have started mixing Lyman #2. My bullets are coming out much nicer. Thanks for watching and commenting.
I use a 50/50 ww and dead soft in my 45, powder coat and no problems. I do slug the barrel anf make sure I have at least one to two thousandths oversize
Great job brother. I like the one line marking. It would be less confusing that way.
Thanks I am easily confused! lol I am really happy with how it turned out.
This is a very robust tool, and a good way to get a comparative hardness on you lead alloy. One point that you mention is that you are getting barrel leading, this is almost always due to too hard an alloy with a less than groove diameter bullet, the only way you will encourage leading with a soft bullet is to be driving it too fast, the bullet then strips, leaving lead in the bore, but the soft lead bullet obturates on firing and completely fills the bore, a hard alloy will not, allowing gases to get by and melt the lead onto your bore, just try a pure lead bullet, depending on your rifling type.
cerrocast is a mix used for casting chambers. it is 60% tin and 40% bismuth
And, its rather pricy. It has a very low melting point, just less than boiling water. I work on many very old combination guns (drillings) where the rifle barrel may be in an obsolete or non-standard calibers. A chamber casting is about the only way to determine exactly what it might be.
Thanks for the video. I didn't see the other guys rig but yours seems to be an improvement in design from what you say.
My only question would be the angle of the point ...changing that angle would change the range of changes. It would not be a big deal but if you did want to document many different tests it may not give you enough difference between each of them. A sharper point might give a larger range.
About the hardness changing with age...From what I understand it is the antimony that causes lead alloy to harden with water AND change hardness with age. I don't think pure lead will change.
WOOOHOOO
You've been talking about making one for awhile. Iam willing to bet that the unknow ingot is your lyman #2 lead.
Take care
could be thanks Les.
This is a great design, thank you for sharing. I like the fact it uses an indicator and penetration versus using using optics to measure dimple diameters. I'm trying to replicate this, do you know what type of engine the valve spring came from?
Nice, testing hardness with an indicator. Might work with other metals also. Thanks for sharing....13
Thanks for watching and commenting.
I have a bunch of salvaged lead that I cleaned up and made into ingots. I have molds for fishing weights. I melted both the lead and zinc wheel weights together because I didnt think that the fish would care too much either way. It was interesting to see the layers of melted materials in the crucible they didnt mix looked like free water flowing over the top of an ice layer if that made sense. .
Do you think it is possible to get the zinc out now?
considering how the metals tend to float until they reach their melting points I assume so. IE the metal clips from the wheel weights floated on the melted lead. Zinc melts at roughly 75 degrees hotter than lead. so I am making assumptions but yes I think so
I like the one mark I wish they would have something like that for cars it would take a lot of gues work out of it
Either use a gas check, or powder coat them.
Or you could powder coat them and install a gas check.
Hey Uncle Buck, ya better mark that new contraption "Boo-let hardness tester", so a hundred years from now we all won't be fooled by Tubal Cain in a "What is this tool" video!
Good idea! lol
Now I know what to do with the spare dial indicator ....
I am thinking you should put a commercial lead bullet in your lil indicator there and compare it to your samples. Nice build looks like should do the job.
That is a good plan. I think I will do that and show more how this was built.
very nice job !
Thanks
This makes precise hardness testing so accessible, thank you. I know lead, the material that all these videos focus on, is a pretty soft metal. But could this work with testing the hardness of other metals and alloys? Like aluminum, bronze, cast iron, or even steel if a diamond tip was used and the whole structure beefed up?
No use a rockwell test this only will work on soft matrial .
I wonder if it had more to do with sizing or lube. I've been running straight range scrap through my 9mm's, .45's, and .38's for years. Range scrap is a good 4-5 BHN softer even than WW.
+Hans “Hanzy4200” S. sizing is the most important variable.
Nice job..
Thanks
I need to make a lead hardness tester sometime.
A little odd, sometimes handy, fin to make, and why not?
I needed it to standardize the lead for my cast bullets.
I have a question I just came from harbor freight tools . They have a chain break tool can we make something similar tool like your from that ? It is seems like very similar
Nice job my friend.
Thanks
Do you mix antimoniun together mixed with lead
It is in with the linotype.
Nice tool. I think I will make one. Do you know how to convert your indicator readings into Brunel hardness scale ?
No I just compared it to commercial bullets and went from there.
kinda interesting buddy. be currious what plain ole lead wadd cutters are. great tool you made there bud ! cheers
Thanks John I have 3 different bullets that I bought from commercial casters. I will be checking them to see what they read on the indicator.
Is that dial some kind of depth gage? Looks like that should give some very accurate measurements.
+Dana Webb It is a dial indicator used in machining operations. It is very accurate.
I'm starting to recall what those are now, that's pretty neat setup youve put together.
great video. Do you have a drawing of it, for sale?
What kind of spring did you use?
Where did you get the spring,I want to make my self one of these.
Thanks
It is a valve spring from an automobile motor.
There's not much you can't make is there?
When I want to make something I go to the collage of you tube and research. then I think long and hard it that is what I want. I try to see if there could be any improvements then I go forth! lol
Is there anyway you can list all the parts you used to make that.
Oh boy I made all the parts except the dial. Didn't really have a plan just made it. I'm not a machinist.
Thank you for getting back to me.
would u make me one, and how much. I have the dial indicater
Sorry just can't do that.