BLOOD BOWL IS APPALLING DON'T PLAY IT
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 25 ส.ค. 2024
- A straightforward rant about why Blood Bowl is a terrible game and why you should not play it. Feel free to comment and argue with each other, but I will not be reading them because I know I am right, and you are wrong and I do not care what you have to say about Blood Bowl.
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Now I love BB even more. It evokes true emotion.
I always wondered what the "no" sign was for, but I assumed it was for whenever the kids came running into the room asking for something 😄
Me too 😂
A 1000 no's and one yes is still a yes
Flax I REALLY like these recent uploads you've made. TH-cam is rough but these occasional videos weather its a vlog, song or game review really make me a HAPPY MAN. I'm a feller that cant catch streams, but Pyrion Flax content is amongst my favorite. So when I see Pflax on Games Night, Mystery Quest, and the Main Channel, damn its a good day.
Couldn’t have said it better my man
yup. Im with this guy.
It'd be like XCom if 17% of the time they shot themself
The new xcom's also have the same problem with rng.
The old xcom's don't because you have many guys and you don't invest as much into each of them.
"That's Blood Bowl, baby!"
No joke this is why those Mario and Rabbids games are fantastic. It's either 100%, 50% or 0% its entirely about positioning.
@@jonathan2847 xcom is way more forgivable than bloodbowl , you can load back if you mess up to much which you can't do with bloodbowl and if you want the true experience you have iron man which you shouldn't play with mod because it can make the game really unstable.
Also Xcom teaches you how to play as you go. Blood bowl tells you a few rules then makes the campaign mode so bloody difficult for newbies it’s insane! Lots of people like ragging on the AI for being bad at the game but my experience is that it’s almost insurmountable even getting through campaign mode. Absolute savage game that seems to enjoy smashing any enthusiasm out of someone interested in giving it a go
You see. You need to pray to Nuffle harder.
This rant is made from an elf player😂. While i understand/agree with some of the complaints i do believe there is much depth in the game and its built around a failure mechanic. Good players understand they will fail and prepare for the inevitable.
Lmao 'he's an elf player' just my thoughts...
It's almost like he hasn't heard that the best blood bowl players roll the fewest dice...
Hahaha has this fella ever watched regular football matches?
This reminds me of the time where, in Bloodbowl 2, I lost my +2 movement level ups Dwarven Runner to death into medic reroll death vs a Lizardman team named after Bad Dragon dildos.
In hindsight, really funny, but that really took me out of the game.
Thats why i love It, the strategy mixed with rng and permadeath generates so much suspance and takes away all the boringness of a mathematical game like chess. Also i love that you cant get attached too much to a team, cause every team you develop is to be considered a single "run" at the game, not your precious jewel representing your entire coach career.
I bounced off Blood Bowl 2 when it was released and this honestly gave me an itch to play it again. The youtube review version of "don't think of a pink elephant"
Listen, I think the game could be better if it used a D10 but I've been playing for 20 years and basically think it's the greatest game of all time.
I absolutely recognize that your opinion is not only valid, but has a lot of truth to it. Many games I've won are because my opponent gets a terrible roll into a terrible reroll. Inversely, many of the games I lose are because of the same calamities inflicted upon myself.
I still love it lol 😂 I guess im a psychopath.
I agree, I love Bloodbowl, getting screwed by the dice is kinda the point lol, the game is not meant to be taken seriously, if your playing this game strictly to win and not for fun you need to go play something else this is not your game. The SPP is meant to be spread out over season not level up every single game
He's obviously never thrown a fling for a one turn to win or tie a game you have no business being in
.. especially with the sound effect on fumbbl. :)
I feel you, but you're playing the game as a board game when more often than not it's a gambling game...your strategy should revolve around mitigating potential disasters. I will not disagree with your opinion, as it is valid, but i don't think it's a bad game because of the nonsense probabilities.
Blood Bowl is X-Com with a ball. These hard probability based strategy games aren't for everyone.
Its not X-com with a ball though is it.
X-com is like rolling a d100 with far more reliable factors such as positioning, flanking etc etc
That and guys will level after killing like 2 enemies.
Its not X-com with a ball though is it.
X-com is like rolling a d100 with far more reliable factors such as positioning, flanking etc etc
That and guys will level after killing like 2 enemies.
I loved the Bloodbowl (2?) league you did with NorthernLion, Crendor, Dodger and others. Introduced me to some good guys. Big fan of NL's stuff since.
The d6 game sounds like a goofy side game mode you'd play for craic
Apothecary is on a d16, not a d6
Nuffle has forsaken him.
I think the appeal of blood bowl for me personally is that the ludicrous rng can happen to both players and the relatively high odds of something dumb happening makes for really good emergent narratives. Also most good plays are made that all your important rolls in the game are based on 2d6, and that then turns failure into a 1/36, which is much more manageable. I can't tell if this is a bit or not but I'm glad that you're stopping playing something you're not enjoying. I personally love blood bowl
I love to see people being so passionate about something.
To bad you don't enjoy it, but hey plenty of other games to spend your time on. Think that most Blood Bowl players will agree with you points, except that that is those design choices is what makes them love the game.
Sounds like my son ( who is 7 ) when he can’t win at something so says he hates it and it’s not a good game 😂 just enjoy playing blood bowl and chill
I love blood bowl 2, and fumble. I don't think there is a problem with the core design tbh, its all about risk minimization. I do think the game should play faster. and yeah guys lvl up way too slowly.
Try the 7s version on tabletop... less players and less turns on a smaller pitch make it a much faster game
Your repeated 'that does not make sense' reminded me of the Chewbacca defense. As such I wholeheartedly agree with you
Man, that’s about the most wrongheaded take you could make about bloodbowl. For a halfling to kill a dragon, they wouldn’t d do it on a 6. They would need to roll 3d6 with the dragon picking the result. If they rolled triple 6, then they would need to meet the dragons armor, which we will assume is an 11, then they’ll need to roll a 10-12, if that succeeds, then it’s 15-16 to kill it and it probably has regen.
Though when playing the ai my experience is that this will happen about 98% of the time as a sure fire thing …
I love how evil Blood Bowl is. I love the fear that comes from a 1d6 engine! The best part is how all that horror is so often for nothing: sure, somebody just pissed on your intricate sand sculpture, but now you're that much cheaper: woe betide your next opponent!
Thanks! It's hilarious watching someone who "should get it but somehow doesn't" go off on the thing you love, bitching quite reasonably about earnest gripes that you think are actually features and not bugs. Whether that was genuine or camp is almost immaterial to the fact that it was fun to watch.
I'm going to preface this one with the disclaimer: I've watched your video, and can understand your grievances with it. Okay, we cool now?
While I do like you trying to liken Blood Bowl to D&D 5e, it's a very inaccurate analogy, it's essentially the classic "Apples and Oranges" comparison. I don't know how much you've dipped into the TTRPG space, but Blood Bowl's dice system is more akin to the d6 dice pool system where you try and build the biggest pool possible to maximise your chance of success. Games in this genre usually have a separate critical success and failure system rather than using the highest and lowest numbers respectively. A game that follows this system, such as Blades in the Dark, would be a more accurate analog.
Blood Bowl is akin to these kinds of RPGs, but in those you can usually build up more than the three dice maximum in your specialty area. I suppose you could say the game at its core is about risk mitigation, which can be fun. I enjoy it, but only on occasion, I couldn't play it all the time. It's like Catan for me, I hate Catan because I've never played a game of it where someone hasn't been shut out by the dice rolls, and it's not fun for that person.
Anyway, that's a side rant for another day. My point was that while the analogy was good, the analogy is ultimately inaccurate because of the fundamental differences at the very core of the RNG of the two games.
I don't play Blood Bowl but I do like it and like to watch people play it. Not because I'm a psychopath, but because I'm a sadist; I enjoy the pain and suffering.
that does help. schadenfreude is a BIG part of blood bowl.
lol - straight away you saying them picking up the ball and failing despite them being an expert player - makes me think that youve never watched a game of rugby played in the wet - and seeing international level superstars drop the ball like it's a greased egg yolk.
Your point about bash teams is missing the point too - sounds like you put your whole team in the scrimmage if you are getting that bashed ... hang back, cover lanes - they can only blitz once a turn.... I do agree touchdowns should be 4 though. But casualties arent the easiest to get either.
Your imbalance talk is weird too - literally tells you teams are of different tiers and balance is inherently wonky. Playing a tier 3 team is like selecting hard mode in a video game, its fun BECAUSE its hard and unfair. Not every game has to be totally balanced - go and look at a couple people playing the game over some brews and yelling and screaming and having a pearler time, telling the stories in discords for years to come of the random things that happen that are hilarious (which you - somewhat correctly call bad game design - but are missing out on the fun part).
I feel, that even at a competitive level, with tier 1 teams (yawn) if you are playing only to win, and dont want to ride the waves of chaos. You're doing it wrong.
This coming from a boardgame enthusiast - who has played (and is sometimes bored by) very well designed balanced games (i may also be a lilttle bit of a pyschopath).
TLDR: Blood Bowl is rad, play it.
based and factual
I will play it again today
Super random para social feeling: Would love to hear you talk about Blood Bowl with @roguehobbies. 😅
its the best game ever! Played it for 40 years now.
I enjoy it, but I will never play it competitively again. The only “skill” involved is mitigating the 17% chance of failure on all fronts. It’s basically gambling with extra steps, except with gambling I could actually win some money.
Love this! Dont play it myself for ghe exact same reason but still watch Crendor play here and there.
Video game blood bowl is shit. Tabletop blood bowl with some drinks with friends in a little league is brilliant fun. I play halflings specifically because they are the worst team because its funny when things go well and funny when things go badly.
Playing low armor teams is also a damn pain in the ass, due to the leveling and the injuries and deaths.
A bad roll can feel like it destroyed your team sometimes.
For each boardgame/computer game existing you also find that one guy crying about it for whatever reason....🤷♂
Sounds like rubber banding so that someone who has invested time and money into buying and painting minatures but has a lower skill level (either as the player, or as their team) feels like they'll have fun fluking a win occasionally instead of getting steamrollered every game. Which is fine, I think. Doesn't really translate into the video game though.
Pyrion... NO...
I run a local blood bowl table top league...
You are so wrong... SO SO wrong.
The game is about mitigating chance. Bad things are going to happen.
Just be better...
I massively respect you, and listen to the triforce every week.
You could not be more wrong here.
I will say... i hate BB3 because the RNG is weird, so i dont play it. I play tabletop only (tournament and league) and its the best game ever (most fun anyway)
The thing that gets people into blood bowl (myself included) is the gambling element of it. You play as optimally as possible, hope for the odd misplay from the opponent. And gamble on your boys winning. I've kicked my addiction but still there is a little piece of me who wants to keep rolling those dice.
Funnily enough, the DnD comparison is amazing because in that game critical failure and critical success are 5% and people still often say it's annoying and stupid and there's lots of debate about whether it's actually fun to use that rule because it's just really random and nonsensical in some cases. So it's like Pyrion says, if people have that kind of debate for a 5% chance, imagine a game built around 1/6 critical failure/critical success.
I want to get into blood bowl. Is blood bowl 2 still active? I only see bad reviews for blood bowl 3
Yes Blood Bowl 2 IS still active and quite inexpensive.
Is based on the old leveling spp system, you will see very busted teams against which you can do nothing.
BB3 is more balanced, is not finished though and had a lot of issues at launch.
Imo best blood bowl is on Fumbbl
Find a TT league near you maybe. There are a lot of butthurt griefers out there on the digital platforms😂
BB3 has improved massively over where it was at launch
This clip is hilarious. What is the most ridiculous though is comparing dnd-interactions with miniature game dice rolls. A dice roll in a miniature game can never be as granulated as a dnd-interaction.
Agreed and hey I think his head would explode if he factored the ammoint of d6 in 40k
@@crusibex The distinction between bb and 40k is that tons of d6s are rolled in 40k. Every single d6 roll in blood bowl can immediately end your turn.
@@scottwallbank4794 And that's why you manage your risks and mitigate them, that's just how the game is played. You don't play to make the craziest move every turn, you play assuming you're going to fail everything and still manage to come out with the best outcome. It's not the kind of game for everyone but if you don't understand that you simply will never have fun.
I remember buying this playing for about 3 or 4 games online and on the last game realized it was just not for me.
My best player died, don't care 😎
I only need a blitzer, a few linemen and a runner to win this game.
It seems odd that your main concern is that the odds of success and failure aren't realistic in a game about fantasy races playing a comedy sportsgame. However everyone is entitled to their opinions and not everything is for everyone.
I didn’t even realize he was back posting on TH-cam. I came back cause I was wanted to watch an old video of his I remember. Good to see you back!
why you gotta pick on the kobolds?
My man needs to organize his shelves
Not to throw too much shade at the Warhammer universe, but AoS 3.0 gave me similar vibes. So many stinkin rules and it takes so long, and yet it's designed as if it's for a casual audience haha.
Any way to fix the game with house rules? Using D10,12,16, or 20? There’s so much liveable about the game that i don’t want to toss it out for the reasons you mentioned. It always bothered me in the video game how suddenly my players could just be trash. Wanting to get into the physical game i saw your video…
What’s better than a D6’s probability? Would the game make more sense using D10 or D20?
You’re right that it takes forever. 1-2 hours for one match at the table, shorter on console/PC.
I dont remember the last time a pyrion flax video landed in my subscription box. But I am happy to see you are still doing you.
>Complaining about Dwarves
Amazons and Undead rule low TV
>High TV is fun
No it isn't. Everyone having a bazillion defensive skills, rerolls...etc at high levels means matches become a slog and much more predictable.
Hmm sounds like a problem with the core game design then.
@@lazlo686 The core game was fine but they kept adding more and more skills to it and then it became a slog because everyone has a skill to mitigate other skills or failed dice rolls and it became a slog.
I have to admit that Blood Bowl 3 is absolutely infuriating to play and I have installed and uninstalled it multiple times.
However I keep playing Blood Bowl tabletop and it is usually very fun.
Any way to fix the game with house rules? Using D10,12,16, or 20? There’s so much liveable about the game that i don’t want to toss it out for the reasons you mentioned. It always bothered me in the video game how suddenly my players could just be trash. Wanting to get into the physical game i saw your video… oh and change the xp gained for touchdowns and reduced it for hurting other players to incentivize how it’s played??? What you’ve described reminds me of munchkins..
Lol, appreciate the honesty of the video description.
I have played Blood Bowl for over 30 years. It’s the best game ever made ;)
Last year I became the European champion in it❤ this game is a part of me :)
Your d6 rant is not quite fair you forget about rerolls, the best ball handler in the world will have sure hands making it a 1/36 chance of fumbeling the ball
And yes it is chess, saying it has no strategy is so wrong. There is a reason the same country keeps winning and winning (England)
It’s a game of risk management
Also the doctor is on a d16 now ;)
Also played for 30 years I have no idea what game this guy is playing or if he has played more than 1 game.
@@gremlong4 I think there's a certain kind of player who bounces off Blood Bowl due to the 1/6 + 1/9 + 1/36 melting their brain.
IDK, as @TheNiebling notes, the game is about risk management and most experienced coaches tend to make peace with rerolls and positioning. Maybe the hard part for some gamers is that NOT making plays in BB is sometimes the best strategy based on the turn + reroll situation.
@@KavinayKishori'm cyber bullying you
@@jmcburney658 Bring it!
This Is Why I Play Undead and Am Considering Quitting. Honestly If The Game Is Supposed To Be About Dice Rolls Then My Players Shouldn't Have Value Of Any Kind They Shouldn't Cost Gold, Level Up, Or Have Any Value On My Team Considering How Expensive It Can Be To Replace Them. Either That Or They Should Be Using A D10 And Calculating Stats And Exp. Differently.
Is that guy seriously this agitated about the fact that it's possible to fail a dice roll? That's the main criticism? Oh right, afterwards he points out a couple things that actually make Blood Bowl super fun and interesting and lists them as negatives. Great job!
Stop taking it so seriously. You'll have a much better time while playing.
Your complaints are not invalid. Obviously d6 games are flawed -- I know one in which you can DIE DURING CHARACTER CREATION. And obviously no one plays GURPS, so probably not even worth bringing up. You missed some of the ludicrous outcomes in Blood Bowl though. You can struggle to get the ball into the diminutive hands a goblin or snotling, successfully get the Troll to move in the correct direction to throw the little one towards the goal and just have them EAT the little guy instead... ball and all! Once their in the gut, they're dead, dead, dead... beyond the ability of the medics to heal them. That same Troll can vomit on other players... but it's possible for them to find some opponents TOO DISGUSTING TO VOMIT ON! ("Nope... they're nauseating... not gonna vomit on THAT! I only vomit on CLEAN things, like elves and zombies.") And obviously anyone who would laugh at these situations in a pub, three pints in, while playing BB is, in your words, a sociopath. Thank you for warning folks away from this game.
Your dnd analogy reminded me of cheesequest...ahh good times
Its like the whole Bloodbowl genre never had its 2.0 version. Left stuck in the past.
OG Bloodbowl was very different from modern Bloodbowl
@@burningphoneix So, OG bloodbowl was wargaming miniatures and we're still stuck with 1994 version.
I have never played Blood Bowl, never seen any gameplay, don't have any friends who've played it, have never given it more that a fleeting thought. I enjoyed this rant immensely despite this
Lol, 10min to finish a game would be considered casual.. Mansions of Madness & Nemesis are some of my favourite games that takes usually 2+h to play. Not to mention it's a game about risk mitigating (to which re-rolls are a fundamental part of), which obviously isn't his cup of tea. Not to mention not understanding asymmetrical teams.
Comparing rolling a 6 to make a flukey pass to doing something spectacular in D&D is one of the worse takes I think I've ever heard 😂😂😂😂
And then the "special" rant went on hahaha.
Oh this was magical .
Played a game, bunch of my guys got spp and then they didn't have any. I know it's "skill issue" but my guys constantly getting injured and the other team, nothing.
Thank you Pyrion, I was wondering if I should try Blood Bowl, now I know!
Give it a try! It’s a ton of fun! Especially when you have your team established
Someone ran into a kill stack chaos team😂 yeah you're right on dorfs and bb2 to bb3 but the emotional roller coaster of epic fails and suprise heroism has kept me in since 1995😂
Im an avid Blood Bowl player and I endorse this video
I do agree that the game devs probably just dont like the game and try to make it fail.
Blood Bowl 7s takes less than an hour, and some say it is better than Blood Bowl 11s.
Board games/wargames based around D6 are always going to fall into issues. Black Powder you can effectively have a commander not be able to issue orders an entire battle.
In sports insane things happen. Like when Leicester City won the Premier League or when the Patriots somehow gained back a 24 points deficit in one sole quarter and won the whole game in overtime in the Superbowl against the Falcons. Strange things that aren't meant to happen in sports. Same thing in Blood Bowl.
If Lewis Hamilton can crash a car then a player in the middle of a field can fail to pick up a ball.
Don't like the game that's fine and I respect your view. The game for me I enjoy and always shall.
Totally agree about Blood Bowl, I've always thought the RNG was far too much and made it unfun. Loving these videos recently, Flax!
They need to bring in other sided dice. Some stuff should be on d8s 10s or 20s. Depending on what you're trying to do.
@@bibsp3556I recall the question of introducing polyhedral dice being asked of the community while playtesting the current edition. The response from the player base was a resounding "hell no".
@mikt860 lmao yeah I can see that, but don't ask people how to do things right, we are absolute idiots. We don't know what's good for us. D6 just won't cut it these days, we need smaller increments. Just make the whole thing d20 based, 5% increments is chill. 1 always fails, 20 always passes, and the the other 18 can still translate to a d6.
@@bibsp3556 BB Ain't DnD, and it shouldn't try to be. There's some odd choices in the game, and some problems. But I don't believe the D6 needs to change. If that's a deal-breaker for you, so be it. This game ain't for you, and that's okay.
This man as had enough and he CAN'T TAKE IT ANY MORE!
That is the problem with dice based games. Any chance games more or less.
All thats missing is the MS paint drawings, and this is classic P-Flax
I totally agree.
But that is Blood Bowl. That is also the fun.
Sure if you good at calculating and thinking and so on. There is a very good game, I love it too. It is called chess.
I love listening to these Ted talks :D
A halfing Stabs a dragon and crits him 17% of the time. Assuming that a dragon has a big guy at least strength 5+, that means 3 dice opponents choice. Assuming the halfing needs a stumble or a pow, and assuming we are just looking for an armor break of 9+ afterwards (which would likely be low for a dragon) and not a knock out or injury, this would happen...checks the math...0.617 % of the time without a reroll and 1.212 % with a reroll used. Maybe the reason you are bad at this game, is because you actually don't understand it. Blood bowl has a steep learning curve, and the best players in the world can maintain a win rate of 70% or greater of the time. That wouldn't happen if the game is as you describe.
Blood Bowl is one of those games I would love to love but it's just awful. Been playing for ages and finally just ran out of steam with it.
Blood Bowl is the only game I've rage quit and uninstalled.
The D6 problem is an issue prevalent across all GW properties
Most of what was said is the reason I love blood bowl, it’s meant to be a game half skill half luck. The best laid plans can blow up on a bad roll, likewise what looks to be a disaster can suddenly turn into a star play. This is not a game for people with nerd rage, if you can’t find humor in the misery, yea go play something else. My Blitzer went for a touchdown, needed one square, rolled, ….trips over his own feet and dies!! How is that not hilarious 😂. Competitive gamers rage quit, make TH-cam videos, fun gamers roll with it come back and score next drive to pull ahead for the win.
i expected you to bust out a break dance in that velour hoodie
Sounds like he played once in a non league setting.
He is 100% wrong about a bash team Leveling faster. Best teams in BB are agility teams.
He is just sounds like he doesn't understand the game.
Damn this needed to be one of those paint animated videos.. oh Raymond oh Ma oh
Sounds like Blood Bowl is not the game for you. Enjoyed the video.
when you have a bad game and make a video about it
Don't worry Blood bowl is less frustrating than league of legends 😂
It's actually the game I play to chill.
I play human teams only and have a 10V / 1D /0L atm, having a great time bullying teams in low TV 😂
I've been playing Jagged Alliance 2 again Flax, come to realise how much better percentages are for RNG rolls and JA hides them on purpose and I notice I don't get pissed off when my guys miss 👍
Saw you play JA3, it's decent but JA2 is still the king.
Its a FANTASY game it does not have to be realistic!!! 1-2 hours to finish is fast for a boardgame.
I read a review of “reign of fire” years ago that was basically “this movie is terrible because dragons and helicopters is a stupid idea”.
This video is like that.
ooh as soon as I saw this drop in my sub box I knew it was gonna be full of OLD MAN RAGE. It did not disappoint.
What a garbage take lol I couldn’t tell if this was satire or not.
please upload more flax i don't have time to watch your streams but you're my favourite part of the jingle jam and triforcee
Does this mean you’ll play football manager now?
I love Blood Bowl. Have played it for ages. Still, I also have no choice but to agree with this video. The game could be so much better. And I did not and will not buy BB3 until it has become a decent game with all races!
It would be funny if one day you just dropped a "Pyrion Flaxs guide to *some DOTA hero you haven't done*" lol
Top 10 Board Games video incoming?
I'm going to watch this later, so there's a reasonable chance this isn't the outright condemnation of Bloodbowl the title would have me believe. However, I can't believe how cruel, slow moving and unpleasant blood bowl is considering how popular it is. Guildball is a better game, even now, after the publisher cancelled it.
bb1 was fine, it had features that bb2 never had, like live game spectator chat
it also had some quirks that made certain skills just not work and matchmaking was dead
Im not buying the new one after several warnings including this one. Thanks Pflax