My wife had to buy an epipen in Paris and we were stressing out about how much it was going to cost and how much of a hassle it was going to be. We walked into a green cross, asked for one, and the pharmacist just put two on the counter and charged us about 10 Euros. The same pen,s each, were over $300 in the US. Fuck the US pharma cartels.
Same in Canada. Anyone with a half descent job here will have extended medical and pays nothing for prescription or behind the counter meds. You always see the bill anyway and it's never alarming. My mom is retired and gave up her extended medical, which her work offers to retirees, rather than pay premiums. My dads blood pressure meds are like $300 a YEAR. He doesn't pay for it now because he still works.
Not mentioned: Patent law is pretty wonky with pharmaceuticals. Stuff that should be public domain now is not, as companies can patent incremental changes, which extends the patent on the original drug. What is even more messed up is that the incremental change doesn't even need to be more medically effective; it just can't be less effective. So, these companies can change one chemical for a substitution, have basically the same drug, but it is protected for twice as long under patent law. This is why we don't have generics for all drugs.
@@thodan467 There's also the issue that many drug companies won't invest in research for drugs that are needed but don't pay well enough (most notably new antibiotics); million-dollar ideas are too small for multi-billion dollar corporations. Thank goodness for publically-funded research at universities.
Back in 2010, I unexpectedly lost my health insurance, and found that one of my prescriptions was doing to cost $1,000 per month when I was making about $1,400/mo. I couldn't go off of the med without getting very sick. I complained on social media, and an Italian friend looked it up and found that the med cost 30 Euros a month there. Luckily the health insurance thing got solved, but I was sorely tempted. I thought that was bad until a similar thing happened to my nephew, and his medicine was going to cost $19,000... Yes, nineteen thousand, with three zeroes, for six weeks. Again, he couldn't go without the medication without getting very sick, very quickly. And again, luckily the insurance problem got sorted out, because like...
To be fair, we arent in a free market. At first, the prices of care wouldn't be so high if companies are allowed to do stuff, but we are often held back by regulations and permits. I relate it similarly to utilities companies, if there is no regulations on who could operate or not, then there will be competition. But we dont exactly have that.
You're only looking at a portion of the issue. Greater supply = lower prices. When the gov't infringes on the free market, they make it so competitors are restricted from creating more supply, keeping prices artificially high. Look at the history of medicine- the freer the market has been, the cheaper medicines were, and the more innovation we had. The ridiculous cost of medicines has largely been a recent result of crony corporations making deals with corrupt politicians (basically most politicians), and the government passing more and more regulations. Red tape = more money for gov't and their friends, and higher prices for normal people. You are likely very familiar with the Golden Rule. But are you familiar with the #nonaggressionprinciple it is built on?
@@Samanthayeoqy But we need regulation to ensure that it is quality in the first place. Lets not forget that one of the founders of the FDA was theodore rosevelt himself- who lost his six year old girl, because he gave her cough medicine that has been laced with an active ingredient found in anti-freeze today. Why? because its sweet, an makes it appealing to children- but also cheap, unfortunately, also extremely toxic and deadly. The poor girl took three days to die, shrieking in agony all the way. Regulation is not the problem. Regulation is the only reason we have drugs that work, and are safe to use. Next, I'm canadian we have a two teir medical system- For a lot of the general need cares and what not, its covered by our taxes and with one single party payer who negotiates on behalf of so many gives them a lot of bargaining power to lower prices. This means even our poorest citizen can get access to life saving treatment, visit the doctor for early detection and not lose their ability to feed themselves over it. the free market only works if everyone is A, informed- B, able to say no, and C, healthy competition. It only works when all three is involved- if not, then regulation is the only way to solve it because us collectively deciding not to buy something does not do enough to fix it.
@@shanelawrence7438 thats under the perview of FDA. Similar to how food is being sold. The government still regulates the safety aspect of it. The question is why cant medicare negotiate prices? Why cant companies import goods that is FDA approved.
Exactly, inelastic demand is a major contributor. If ur options are only one drug or nothing and nothing means your life. Your gonna buy it and they will gouge you.
This has been a thing for a long time. I grew up in a Seattle-area suburb in the '90's that has a disproportionally high population of elderly people, and it was very common for groups of old people to get together and charter a bus to go up to Vancouver every month just for the purpose of getting their prescriptions.
Partially true. One could say it's greedy to want to pay less for something. And profit- do you expect to be paid for work you do? You want to profit from exchanging your time and labor? Does that make you bad? People's greed balances out. They're expensive here because of the crony control the pharma industry has with help from protectionist laws and regulations they lobby for. Let's look at insulin- it's existed for generations. Any half decent college graduate with a science degree would be able to manufacture insulin. The reason you can't just start up a business selling insulin to people in your town is because the costs of getting permits, licenses, insurance, and all the other things pharma has mandated through gov't help makes it prohibitively expensive. This makes it so the a company producing it can only begin if it charges a lot more than the real cost to make it. By this crony method big pharma is able to make huge products since competition is restricted, politicians can pretend like they're "making society safer" when their job is supposed to be to PROTECT OUR INALIENABLE RIGHTS, and the people are screwed.
You guys rock! Loved the crossover with Vitals this episode. I’m sure it’s been requested a lot already, but an episode on the recent gas price hike would be really great. There is a lot of information (and misinformation) out there about it that is hard to sort through. Thanks as always!
There is something so depressing to me that a channel associated with PBS, which is at least partially federally funded, is explaining how to side step government regulations because our system is not working. As someone with a chronic illness who has people in her lives with chronic illness, let me state and restate this: You do not benefit from saving money on taxes to not have a nationalized system. A.) Our economy and development loss out on a massive amount of work and innovation because people either can't work or have to chose a less productive job because they can't get medicine. B.) Preventative healthcare is much cheaper than having to get surgeries or be hospitalized because you couldn't get preventative care. With worse outcomes C.) Following that, often tax payers do have to pay for the hospital bills of people that couldn't pay and end up in the hospital because they had an emergency. D.) Even if you aren't now, YOU WILL GET CHRONICALLY ILL. It's called getting old. You will at some point need to rely on medication, and it's better for everyone if there were decades of preventative care leading up to that that, again, let you work longer and need less care (which as an economic and social cost) when you get older. Also, like, care for your fellow man.
I think that capping prices of drugs, like Biden is doing with insulin and having transparent pricing for all medical costs like Trump suggested would fix many of the problems. I think we should try that before we move to a solution that would never be undone. Something that will give us the some problem Canada has, the extreme wait times to be seen, to get tests done, to get a diagnosis and treatment.
@@SilverHawk214 There's no extreme wait times in Canada, is just that if it's not life threatening you will be schedule and any specialist or procedure will take 1-3 months, not intermediate. If it's urgent, you will be taken care with the same urgency as any other high income country.
"Care for your fellow man" comes in two levels. Most people are familiar with the Golden Rule. Which is basically- do good things to others. The other is less known, but MORE IMPORTANT: the #nonaggressionprinciple, which basically is the idea that you shouldn't do bad things to others. That's it's wrong to violate other's natural rights. For example- if you see a hungry poor person, it's wonderful to give them some of your food and/or money. But there are many who essentially promote the idea that it's ok to steal from your neighbors (doing something bad to people) if you intend for some of the money to help the poor person. *If you are hurting some people to help others, you are not being a good person.*
@@ricardocabrera8344 How do you determine what is life threatening? Any small thing could be urgent. I don't remember the channel but I watched a Canadian on this platform that caution us against universal Healthcare because she wasn't seen for 6 months over something seemingly small, took a turn for the worst, was treated but nearly died. Could have easily died despite trying to go in for 6 months. Again, we should try another method first, as there will be no going back from universal Healthcare.
@@SilverHawk214 what we have now is 100% not worth saving, and I'm flabbergasted anyone thinks as such lol, for profit companies choose who lives and dies now anyway... lol.
How can their high prices be reflective of the steep cost and research? Meanwhile in other countries the same drug is many times cheaper. They are just having your eyes out lol.
The defenders of this system argue that the drug companies sell the drugs at a loss in those countries. That is, of course, a lie, no company would operate in a country in which it's not making a profit. The real reason is those countries have systems that reduce the cost, for example a national healthcare provider (like in the UK) or a single-payer insurance system (like in Germany) that are allowed to negotiate drug prices, and due to how big that market is the drug companies have to agree to reasonable prices to not be left out. The video said other countries legalise low drug prices; I don't know the situation in all countries but I don't know any country that does it, it's more about the negotiating power, and it could be replicated in the US easily if Medicare and Medicaid were allowed to negotiate
The town of Palomas, just over the border in Mexico, when I last visited had a population of a few thousand people, but it had three dentists, 5 opticians, and 6 pharmacies. The dental clinic I visited was every bit as clean and modern as would be found in the US. I bought a bottle of acetaminophen that was the fastest working I've ever had. I had written a paper on pharmacist liability for school, and interviewed a pharmacist while I was in town. He said Mexico had much the same laws as the US when it came to liability, but Mexico had three differences that made litigation less likely: 1. the cost of living was much lower; 2. extended families made it likely to get care; and 3. companies were more likely to volunteer help if someone was injured. In the US, that last would be treated as an admission of guilt, so there is an incentive to deny, deny, deny.
You absolutely should be careful where you buy from, specially in this cases. But I have to say, after hearing "experts" saying it was too dangerous to buy baby formula from Europe (EU and Switzerland being 2 of the biggest exporters of baby formula BTW) I have become quite skeptical on official American sources on this, specially in the context of a huge shortage with people desperate enough to try and make homemade formula.
There are many good, reputable pharmacies in Canada that will require a prescription and will ship to the US. Substantial savings and high quality controls. It's a shame the US has turned into a third-world nation and we are required to do this.
@@everythingisfine9988 Just don't go to some shitty hole in the wall. Pretty much every grocery store is a Pharmacy here. Costco for example has a Pharmacy at every location. London Drugs has locations everywhere and started in Canada as a Pharmacy.
I am from Bangladesh (smol country next to India). I can fly there, buy actually good branded medicines (most of them are exported to rich countries) for a fraction of the cost. And visit my family and still have left over money for "stuff". Next time I'm getting my wisdom teeth out! Cheap AF!
I mean you could and should include not only Western Europe but whole European Union countries - all are regulated by EMA (European Medicines Agency) and the local ones are more likely to ban some drugs rather than do the opposite.
As someone who works in research and development for pharma companies, I can guarantee you that the price for R&D is an excuse, just check the profit margin for any new drug launched in the recent years.
Makes me super thankful that I live in a country where being alive isn't a privilege for the wealthy but a basic human right that everyone can participate in ...
@@Armin-qm3uz In a part of the world where healthcare isn't perfect, but accessible by all no matter your background, your wealth, religion or sexual orientation. I am from Norway, but the same can be said of many other countries healthcare systems. I do not think any nations healthcare system is perfect, certainly not the states where you get economically raped just by stepping inside the E.R. or needing an ambulance.
I live in Vancouver, Canada. I work at London Drugs been there 22 yrs and going strong. We get a lot of people south of the boarder coming to buy drugs that they can't afford in there own home country. For example. A man and his wife in there 40's need special drugs, in the there state of Washington it cost $900 USD. for 90 days. Here in Canada for the same name brand is $236 CND price but for 120 days supply. If they were Canadian it would be free or a small fee. Sorry in my 62 yrs of life The U.S.A is now the land of shooting rip off your follow man before they do it to you.
@@mark-fd8ol I used to think that, until I compared with my American brother in law in Georgia. Income taxes actually come out similar, but property tax is a lot higher. Sales tax in Canada is higher so it comes out pretty much the same. Real estate on the other hand is massively overpriced in Canada, bit that's a different issue.
The R&D being responsible for higher prices in the US also assumes there is no R&D in other countries with lower prices, which is ridiculous. As an exemple let's remember the "Pfizer" Covid vaccine was in fact developed by Biontech, a small German company, and they only made a deal with Pfizer in order to scale up the testing and manufacturing of it.
It also presumes that American tax-payers don't already fund a huge part of the R&D, and that pharma is footing the entire bill, which is completely untrue.
As Canadian it’s so weird for me to even see a “DEBIT/CREDIT Card Machine” to PAY 💰 at Doctors office. In Ontario, anyone Under 24 or Above 60 or Unemployed people with low income who don’t fall in this age group pay 💰 “$0” for prescriptions and Healthcare is funded by Public Taxes here.
Sunny does the government pay for any doctor or do you have to go to specific doctors? In my country national health care is basically free but if you want, you can go to a private doctor (let's say you trust it more.... You don't want to wait as much or for whatever reason) and then and only the you have to pay. Like paying for a private school if you don't like the public one.
@@TheAllMightyGodofCod wow, there are for sure private doctors in Canada as well but they are very rare and far to spot any. If there is an emergency then it doesn’t matter which one you go. You’re covered regardless. But just to say if there is no hospital available at all you went to private doctor or something like that then entire thing is covered as long you were admitted in a basic room rather than any fancy room or stuffs.
Okay but the FDA is not considered a "gold standard" across the world, certainly not in the EU or by the WHO. Sure, it is considered a reliable source of a second opinion, but in no way the leading standard.
I live on Mexico and this is not really truth, we have our own version of FDA that approves medicine releases and we have good brand pharmacies where you can purshase medicines.
When FDA Funded in Part by the Companies It Regulates it is beneficial for them to say buy only in USA and approve increasingly more new drugs each year.
Not too far from me (in NYC), a 27 year old died because he couldn't afford insulin. He was very proud to have finally gotten his own apartment, but when he turned 27 he fell off his parents insurance, and was unable to cover all the costs. He didn't tell anyone, and was found dead after apparently trying to "ration" it for weeks, skipping days at a time. That sort of senseless tragedy should never happen in "the wealthiest country on earth".
"as long as the drug don't have any serious health risk" Literally almost any drug does have serious health risks, I'm confused now... But maybe I'm just pulling you by your words. Glad to be living in EU once again.
Yeah I do! $15 insulin pen (out of USA) same brand, same kind, $100 in USA. So no thanks ! Everytime I go out of USA which is quite often I buy my 3 month Worth staff for less than month price in USA. 🤷🏼♀️
This was well thought out and helpful. I particularly liked that you poked holes in pharma's claim about their R&D expenses. It's worth mentioning Mark Cuban Cost Plus Drugs as a good alternative as well. They are aiming to produce 2,000 or so different drugs within the year.
The problems of capitalism can be solved by more capitalism, they say! Tell that to the diabetic kid who is at the risk of dying after the recent price surge in insulin within US.
ironically the drug industry is not a free market. Its a oligopoly that for some reason also has protection from international companies due to import bans!! Free market for thee but not for me.
Cost Plus Drugs by Mark Cuban has been a game changer for many people already. When more companies follow in Cubans' footsteps drugs will drop in price more and more!
Great video! I've been buying online for more than a decade for my wife's asthma. It's not a simple process unfortunately. This is a great video to help!
@@osmosisjones4912 i will bet you 100$ that the same drug companies sell the same drugs for a 1/10th of the cost abroad cause either they are legally forced to or actual free market capitalism makes it only competitive at those prices. It's hillarious that free market is always argued by these companies when regulations are being discussed and yet they have total oligopoly over US market due to ban on drug imports?????
Hey! I finally got a recommendation from your channel. I just realized there’s a bunch of vids I haven’t watch. The algorithm hasn’t recommended any in a long time.
No lie, Cancun and all of the beaches near by have thousands of pharmacies targeting foreigners. I can attest that you can get antibiotics without a Doctor's note.
Buying Medicine Abroad Counterfeit drugs are common in some countries, so only use medicine you bring from home and make sure to pack enough for the duration of your trip, plus extra in case of travel delays.
A friend with chronic pain bought opiates from a pharmacy in Mexico. Using a fentanyl tester, he found that what he purchased had fentanyl in it. Stay safe out there 🙏
Adverts for prescription drugs don't make any economic sense to me. Adverts for food, entertainment, clothes, travel, household items, cars, etc. make sense because they all apply to an extremely broad segment of the population. But an advert for a new Crohn's disease medication or arthritis or psoriasis apply to only a small subset of the population.
But I have to sit through every god damn one of them anytime you watch anything on network television. And don't even think about listening to the radio unless you want to hear about ED and testosterone replacement every 10 minutes. I guess only men listen to the radio, and you must be 60+ to watch traditional media.
Do pharmacists not have the power in the US to give people generic brands when they exist? I have never had to pay for a name brand drug when a generic brand exists in Canada. My pharmacist will AUTOMATICALLY give me the cheapest one because they're chemically identical. And can we get a nod to the cutthroat capitalism at play here?
I used to be overweight and had to be on insulin due to developing Type 2 Diabetes. I was surprised to find out people were paying over $1600 for the same insulin vials/pens I was spending $45 a month on in Haiti... How can the "wealthiest" country in the world be the one with the least accessible healthcare/medication cost?
Instead of buying drugs that come in airplanes we really need to pass sensible regulation so that American consumers don't subsidize millionaire CEOs' over bloated bonuses. Products and services that effect people's health should not have this high of a mark up for profit!
Another thing to remember that pharmacies and pharmaceutical companies often give coupons to reduce the cost regardless of income, I know this personally as I had to take a med that was $1000 after insurance and with the coupon only ended up costing $25…know your options and resources
When I lived on the border of Mexico and was making minimum wage. I had a terrible infection and couldn't afford the antibiotics. Luckily my Spanish is decent. Researched what my medicine was called in Mexico. Public transit + the cost of medicine was only $10. They would have been over $100 with insurance if I had stayed in the US.
Why does the mon... the health system in the US always seem like a joke? I'm always shocked to see how much expensive health (a basic human right) is in the US. Here in western Europe, nobody minds about the FDA. We have our own controls that are at least as good.
And this before we delve into the utter ****show that is PBMs. Seriously though, any pharma company that tries to tow that "it will affect our research!" line and shows stock buybacks on their books should be heavily fined and publicly called out.
Think about that, if selling drugs in country with steap price regulation wasn't profitable, why would american drugs companies bother to get them certified for those countries?
What about ordering & getting a script for opioids for pain management online when your local doctor cant refill your script & u severally need it? In particular oxycodone. Is that ok & safe to do?
"most of western europe"??? Seriously???? What about Poland.....???????? The ignorance. You know "Eastern Europe" includes Russia and Belarus. I guess Poland is Central Europe- literally dead central because of Russia, but why is it not on the map? They just blocked out all of what they consider "eastern Europe" The ignorance astounds and bothers me. It's kind of like "Africa is all the same " it's just ignorance. That's all it is.
10% odds of counterfeit drugs, but I get to save $1200 a month? Even without factoring that I can likely find a reputable vendor, I'll take those odds!
I'm torn about the marketing. Yes, it's absurd and I feel there should be a lot less of it. I used to play an online game that gave you extra points if you watched an ad, and one ad was for a drug for a condition I have. After watching the ad I did some research and asked my doctor, and took that drug for several years to my benefit. I'm certain I would eventually have discovered it on my own, but this ad brought it to my attention sooner. Still, few people take the time to go beyond what the ad says, and it's the willing ignorance of the patient that really racks up the money for the drug companies.
Not to mention pharmaceutical companies don't always do the research. Most of the time it's done by independent Laboratories paid for by our tax dollars and then the pharmaceutical companies swoop in and simply buy the drug creation.
"Buying medicine internationally is illegal and buying it nationally is unaffordable" Basically, damn you if you do and damn you if you don't. You're screwed.
One of my scripts costs $6000 in the US. I have gotten the same drug with the same results for under $200 (no generic). It's too ridiculous when I was just trying to control my eczema, cracked bleeding hands is not fun
i think its about $10US for insulin in australia =/. 250% mark up is for brand named drugs, of which there are 'home brand' options that are half the price down here
There are industries that should not be profit driven - medication production is one of that. I think that US government understands this perfectly, but lobby is stronger then common sense in Washington
My wife had to buy an epipen in Paris and we were stressing out about how much it was going to cost and how much of a hassle it was going to be. We walked into a green cross, asked for one, and the pharmacist just put two on the counter and charged us about 10 Euros. The same pen,s each, were over $300 in the US. Fuck the US pharma cartels.
Same in Canada. Anyone with a half descent job here will have extended medical and pays nothing for prescription or behind the counter meds. You always see the bill anyway and it's never alarming. My mom is retired and gave up her extended medical, which her work offers to retirees, rather than pay premiums. My dads blood pressure meds are like $300 a YEAR. He doesn't pay for it now because he still works.
@@geoffmooregmI am an exporter for pharmaceutical medicine, I want export to USA, or UK and europe, do you happen to have any importer?
Mine cost $760
Not mentioned: Patent law is pretty wonky with pharmaceuticals. Stuff that should be public domain now is not, as companies can patent incremental changes, which extends the patent on the original drug. What is even more messed up is that the incremental change doesn't even need to be more medically effective; it just can't be less effective. So, these companies can change one chemical for a substitution, have basically the same drug, but it is protected for twice as long under patent law. This is why we don't have generics for all drugs.
But the salaries of the scientists who developed the drugs are a negligible portion of the cost.
@@lyarcadia
the whole process is very expensive and most drugs fail on the road
@@thodan467 There's also the issue that many drug companies won't invest in research for drugs that are needed but don't pay well enough (most notably new antibiotics); million-dollar ideas are too small for multi-billion dollar corporations. Thank goodness for publically-funded research at universities.
@@micahbush5397
Other problem,
Back in 2010, I unexpectedly lost my health insurance, and found that one of my prescriptions was doing to cost $1,000 per month when I was making about $1,400/mo. I couldn't go off of the med without getting very sick. I complained on social media, and an Italian friend looked it up and found that the med cost 30 Euros a month there. Luckily the health insurance thing got solved, but I was sorely tempted.
I thought that was bad until a similar thing happened to my nephew, and his medicine was going to cost $19,000... Yes, nineteen thousand, with three zeroes, for six weeks. Again, he couldn't go without the medication without getting very sick, very quickly. And again, luckily the insurance problem got sorted out, because like...
Yeah, that whole "free markets bring prices down" theory doesn't really hold up if the consumers can't negotiate lower prices.
To be fair, we arent in a free market. At first, the prices of care wouldn't be so high if companies are allowed to do stuff, but we are often held back by regulations and permits. I relate it similarly to utilities companies, if there is no regulations on who could operate or not, then there will be competition. But we dont exactly have that.
You're only looking at a portion of the issue.
Greater supply = lower prices. When the gov't infringes on the free market, they make it so competitors are restricted from creating more supply, keeping prices artificially high.
Look at the history of medicine- the freer the market has been, the cheaper medicines were, and the more innovation we had. The ridiculous cost of medicines has largely been a recent result of crony corporations making deals with corrupt politicians (basically most politicians), and the government passing more and more regulations. Red tape = more money for gov't and their friends, and higher prices for normal people.
You are likely very familiar with the Golden Rule. But are you familiar with the #nonaggressionprinciple it is built on?
@@Samanthayeoqy But we need regulation to ensure that it is quality in the first place. Lets not forget that one of the founders of the FDA was theodore rosevelt himself- who lost his six year old girl, because he gave her cough medicine that has been laced with an active ingredient found in anti-freeze today. Why? because its sweet, an makes it appealing to children- but also cheap, unfortunately, also extremely toxic and deadly. The poor girl took three days to die, shrieking in agony all the way. Regulation is not the problem. Regulation is the only reason we have drugs that work, and are safe to use. Next, I'm canadian we have a two teir medical system- For a lot of the general need cares and what not, its covered by our taxes and with one single party payer who negotiates on behalf of so many gives them a lot of bargaining power to lower prices. This means even our poorest citizen can get access to life saving treatment, visit the doctor for early detection and not lose their ability to feed themselves over it. the free market only works if everyone is A, informed- B, able to say no, and C, healthy competition. It only works when all three is involved- if not, then regulation is the only way to solve it because us collectively deciding not to buy something does not do enough to fix it.
@@shanelawrence7438 thats under the perview of FDA. Similar to how food is being sold. The government still regulates the safety aspect of it.
The question is why cant medicare negotiate prices? Why cant companies import goods that is FDA approved.
Exactly, inelastic demand is a major contributor. If ur options are only one drug or nothing and nothing means your life. Your gonna buy it and they will gouge you.
I love how Julia and Phillip explains this topic and other topics very well and without any bias. You two are the best
Is this a joke?
This has been a thing for a long time. I grew up in a Seattle-area suburb in the '90's that has a disproportionally high population of elderly people, and it was very common for groups of old people to get together and charter a bus to go up to Vancouver every month just for the purpose of getting their prescriptions.
Why are drugs so expensive over here, The short answer: Greed And Profit
Partially true. One could say it's greedy to want to pay less for something.
And profit- do you expect to be paid for work you do? You want to profit from exchanging your time and labor? Does that make you bad?
People's greed balances out. They're expensive here because of the crony control the pharma industry has with help from protectionist laws and regulations they lobby for.
Let's look at insulin- it's existed for generations. Any half decent college graduate with a science degree would be able to manufacture insulin. The reason you can't just start up a business selling insulin to people in your town is because the costs of getting permits, licenses, insurance, and all the other things pharma has mandated through gov't help makes it prohibitively expensive. This makes it so the a company producing it can only begin if it charges a lot more than the real cost to make it.
By this crony method big pharma is able to make huge products since competition is restricted, politicians can pretend like they're "making society safer" when their job is supposed to be to PROTECT OUR INALIENABLE RIGHTS, and the people are screwed.
You guys rock! Loved the crossover with Vitals this episode. I’m sure it’s been requested a lot already, but an episode on the recent gas price hike would be really great. There is a lot of information (and misinformation) out there about it that is hard to sort through. Thanks as always!
There is something so depressing to me that a channel associated with PBS, which is at least partially federally funded, is explaining how to side step government regulations because our system is not working.
As someone with a chronic illness who has people in her lives with chronic illness, let me state and restate this: You do not benefit from saving money on taxes to not have a nationalized system.
A.) Our economy and development loss out on a massive amount of work and innovation because people either can't work or have to chose a less productive job because they can't get medicine.
B.) Preventative healthcare is much cheaper than having to get surgeries or be hospitalized because you couldn't get preventative care. With worse outcomes
C.) Following that, often tax payers do have to pay for the hospital bills of people that couldn't pay and end up in the hospital because they had an emergency.
D.) Even if you aren't now, YOU WILL GET CHRONICALLY ILL. It's called getting old. You will at some point need to rely on medication, and it's better for everyone if there were decades of preventative care leading up to that that, again, let you work longer and need less care (which as an economic and social cost) when you get older.
Also, like, care for your fellow man.
I think that capping prices of drugs, like Biden is doing with insulin and having transparent pricing for all medical costs like Trump suggested would fix many of the problems. I think we should try that before we move to a solution that would never be undone. Something that will give us the some problem Canada has, the extreme wait times to be seen, to get tests done, to get a diagnosis and treatment.
@@SilverHawk214 There's no extreme wait times in Canada, is just that if it's not life threatening you will be schedule and any specialist or procedure will take 1-3 months, not intermediate. If it's urgent, you will be taken care with the same urgency as any other high income country.
"Care for your fellow man" comes in two levels. Most people are familiar with the Golden Rule. Which is basically- do good things to others.
The other is less known, but MORE IMPORTANT: the #nonaggressionprinciple, which basically is the idea that you shouldn't do bad things to others. That's it's wrong to violate other's natural rights.
For example- if you see a hungry poor person, it's wonderful to give them some of your food and/or money.
But there are many who essentially promote the idea that it's ok to steal from your neighbors (doing something bad to people) if you intend for some of the money to help the poor person.
*If you are hurting some people to help others, you are not being a good person.*
@@ricardocabrera8344 How do you determine what is life threatening? Any small thing could be urgent. I don't remember the channel but I watched a Canadian on this platform that caution us against universal Healthcare because she wasn't seen for 6 months over something seemingly small, took a turn for the worst, was treated but nearly died. Could have easily died despite trying to go in for 6 months.
Again, we should try another method first, as there will be no going back from universal Healthcare.
@@SilverHawk214 what we have now is 100% not worth saving, and I'm flabbergasted anyone thinks as such lol, for profit companies choose who lives and dies now anyway... lol.
Its ridiculous, insulin shouldnt cost hundreds of dollars and it doesn't anywhere else in the world, the reason they charge so much, because they can.
This is what we get when we elect politicians who are owned by corporations and spend decades writing laws to serve said corporations
How can their high prices be reflective of the steep cost and research? Meanwhile in other countries the same drug is many times cheaper. They are just having your eyes out lol.
The defenders of this system argue that the drug companies sell the drugs at a loss in those countries. That is, of course, a lie, no company would operate in a country in which it's not making a profit.
The real reason is those countries have systems that reduce the cost, for example a national healthcare provider (like in the UK) or a single-payer insurance system (like in Germany) that are allowed to negotiate drug prices, and due to how big that market is the drug companies have to agree to reasonable prices to not be left out.
The video said other countries legalise low drug prices; I don't know the situation in all countries but I don't know any country that does it, it's more about the negotiating power, and it could be replicated in the US easily if Medicare and Medicaid were allowed to negotiate
Especially considering how much the American tax-payer actually funds the research and development. (ie. QUITE A LOT!)
The town of Palomas, just over the border in Mexico, when I last visited had a population of a few thousand people, but it had three dentists, 5 opticians, and 6 pharmacies. The dental clinic I visited was every bit as clean and modern as would be found in the US. I bought a bottle of acetaminophen that was the fastest working I've ever had. I had written a paper on pharmacist liability for school, and interviewed a pharmacist while I was in town. He said Mexico had much the same laws as the US when it came to liability, but Mexico had three differences that made litigation less likely: 1. the cost of living was much lower; 2. extended families made it likely to get care; and 3. companies were more likely to volunteer help if someone was injured. In the US, that last would be treated as an admission of guilt, so there is an incentive to deny, deny, deny.
You absolutely should be careful where you buy from, specially in this cases. But I have to say, after hearing "experts" saying it was too dangerous to buy baby formula from Europe (EU and Switzerland being 2 of the biggest exporters of baby formula BTW) I have become quite skeptical on official American sources on this, specially in the context of a huge shortage with people desperate enough to try and make homemade formula.
There are many good, reputable pharmacies in Canada that will require a prescription and will ship to the US. Substantial savings and high quality controls. It's a shame the US has turned into a third-world nation and we are required to do this.
That the joke , it does feel like we becoming a third word country for the middle class.
@Mike Horan What Canadian pharmacies would you recommend?
@@everythingisfine9988 Just don't go to some shitty hole in the wall. Pretty much every grocery store is a Pharmacy here. Costco for example has a Pharmacy at every location. London Drugs has locations everywhere and started in Canada as a Pharmacy.
America is a third world country with first world makeup 😂
I am from Bangladesh (smol country next to India).
I can fly there, buy actually good branded medicines (most of them are exported to rich countries) for a fraction of the cost. And visit my family and still have left over money for "stuff".
Next time I'm getting my wisdom teeth out! Cheap AF!
I go to Bangladesh for buiness and I always get medicines there . Perfect quality ,
They spend that much on ads AND most countries don't even allow pharma ads!!!!! Common sense
I mean you could and should include not only Western Europe but whole European Union countries - all are regulated by EMA (European Medicines Agency) and the local ones are more likely to ban some drugs rather than do the opposite.
As someone who works in research and development for pharma companies, I can guarantee you that the price for R&D is an excuse, just check the profit margin for any new drug launched in the recent years.
If you need it to survive and stay healthy, it should be free.
But unfortunately, money rules our world...
Makes me super thankful my job pays more almost everything my family needs. Messed up system where the average citizen end up looking abroad
Makes me super thankful that I live in a country where being alive isn't a privilege for the wealthy but a basic human right that everyone can participate in ...
@@Mr.Engineer. where do you live?
@@Armin-qm3uz
In a part of the world where healthcare isn't perfect, but accessible by all no matter your background, your wealth, religion or sexual orientation.
I am from Norway, but the same can be said of many other countries healthcare systems.
I do not think any nations healthcare system is perfect, certainly not the states where you get economically raped just by stepping inside the E.R. or needing an ambulance.
When your healthcare is tied to your job, your job has you by the short hairs.
I live in Vancouver, Canada. I work at London Drugs been there 22 yrs and going strong. We get a lot of people south of the boarder coming to buy drugs that they can't afford in there own home country. For example. A man and his wife in there 40's need special drugs, in the there state of Washington it cost $900 USD. for 90 days. Here in Canada for the same name brand is $236 CND price but for 120 days supply. If they were Canadian it would be free or a small fee. Sorry in my 62 yrs of life The U.S.A is now the land of shooting rip off your follow man before they do it to you.
We pay more taxes in Canada though.
@@JennyFarley yes i do agree to that
@@mark-fd8ol I used to think that, until I compared with my American brother in law in Georgia. Income taxes actually come out similar, but property tax is a lot higher. Sales tax in Canada is higher so it comes out pretty much the same.
Real estate on the other hand is massively overpriced in Canada, bit that's a different issue.
The R&D being responsible for higher prices in the US also assumes there is no R&D in other countries with lower prices, which is ridiculous. As an exemple let's remember the "Pfizer" Covid vaccine was in fact developed by Biontech, a small German company, and they only made a deal with Pfizer in order to scale up the testing and manufacturing of it.
It also presumes that American tax-payers don't already fund a huge part of the R&D, and that pharma is footing the entire bill, which is completely untrue.
As Canadian it’s so weird for me to even see a “DEBIT/CREDIT Card Machine” to PAY 💰 at Doctors office.
In Ontario, anyone Under 24 or Above 60 or Unemployed people with low income who don’t fall in this age group pay 💰 “$0” for prescriptions and Healthcare is funded by Public Taxes here.
Sunny does the government pay for any doctor or do you have to go to specific doctors?
In my country national health care is basically free but if you want, you can go to a private doctor (let's say you trust it more.... You don't want to wait as much or for whatever reason) and then and only the you have to pay.
Like paying for a private school if you don't like the public one.
@@TheAllMightyGodofCod wow, there are for sure private doctors in Canada as well but they are very rare and far to spot any. If there is an emergency then it doesn’t matter which one you go. You’re covered regardless. But just to say if there is no hospital available at all you went to private doctor or something like that then entire thing is covered as long you were admitted in a basic room rather than any fancy room or stuffs.
Okay but the FDA is not considered a "gold standard" across the world, certainly not in the EU or by the WHO. Sure, it is considered a reliable source of a second opinion, but in no way the leading standard.
I live on Mexico and this is not really truth, we have our own version of FDA that approves medicine releases and we have good brand pharmacies where you can purshase medicines.
Exactly!!!
When FDA Funded in Part by the Companies It Regulates it is beneficial for them to say buy only in USA and approve increasingly more new drugs each year.
Not too far from me (in NYC), a 27 year old died because he couldn't afford insulin. He was very proud to have finally gotten his own apartment, but when he turned 27 he fell off his parents insurance, and was unable to cover all the costs. He didn't tell anyone, and was found dead after apparently trying to "ration" it for weeks, skipping days at a time. That sort of senseless tragedy should never happen in "the wealthiest country on earth".
"as long as the drug don't have any serious health risk"
Literally almost any drug does have serious health risks, I'm confused now... But maybe I'm just pulling you by your words. Glad to be living in EU once again.
Yeah I do! $15 insulin pen (out of USA) same brand, same kind, $100 in USA. So no thanks ! Everytime I go out of USA which is quite often I buy my 3 month Worth staff for less than month price in USA. 🤷🏼♀️
This was well thought out and helpful. I particularly liked that you poked holes in pharma's claim about their R&D expenses. It's worth mentioning Mark Cuban Cost Plus Drugs as a good alternative as well. They are aiming to produce 2,000 or so different drugs within the year.
The problems of capitalism can be solved by more capitalism, they say! Tell that to the diabetic kid who is at the risk of dying after the recent price surge in insulin within US.
ironically the drug industry is not a free market. Its a oligopoly that for some reason also has protection from international companies due to import bans!! Free market for thee but not for me.
Mt Two Cents: You guys are AWESOME!!! Thank You for always keeping us informed :)
Absolutely you should, all my drugs already come from Columbia
They just elected a communist war criminal so say goodbye to that. Only a few countries actually manufacture meds .
I KNOW PEOPLE FROM 🇺🇸 WHO TRAVEL TO GUATEMALA 🇬🇹 TO FIX THEIR TOOTH, STAY IN A NICE HOTEL AND SPEND 2,OOO USD
Cost Plus Drugs by Mark Cuban has been a game changer for many people already. When more companies follow in Cubans' footsteps drugs will drop in price more and more!
"Other wealthy nations" *shows Mexico*
Me as a mexican: we are wealthy?!
The fact that Medicare can't actually negotiate is insane.
Great video! I've been buying online for more than a decade for my wife's asthma. It's not a simple process unfortunately. This is a great video to help!
Other countries get proscriptions from America 2 cents doesn't even understand Supply and demand
@@osmosisjones4912 i will bet you 100$ that the same drug companies sell the same drugs for a 1/10th of the cost abroad cause either they are legally forced to or actual free market capitalism makes it only competitive at those prices. It's hillarious that free market is always argued by these companies when regulations are being discussed and yet they have total oligopoly over US market due to ban on drug imports?????
@@Andres43280 Exactly, the global supply/demand curve is useless when it comes to medicine because of legal reasons.
Hey! I finally got a recommendation from your channel. I just realized there’s a bunch of vids I haven’t watch. The algorithm hasn’t recommended any in a long time.
No lie, Cancun and all of the beaches near by have thousands of pharmacies targeting foreigners. I can attest that you can get antibiotics without a Doctor's note.
Pharmacy Lobbyists is the problem.
Buying Medicine Abroad Counterfeit drugs are common in some countries, so only use medicine you bring from home and make sure to pack enough for the duration of your trip, plus extra in case of travel delays.
A friend with chronic pain bought opiates from a pharmacy in Mexico. Using a fentanyl tester, he found that what he purchased had fentanyl in it. Stay safe out there 🙏
FDA delenda est.
P.S. Thank you for explaining the risks and benefits so clearly and thoroughly! Harm reduction is seriously underrated.
Julia's eye roll conveyed more info than anything o could ever add.
Most people buying drugs are buying from higher income countries like Canada though.
Man I love this show! You guys are amazing! Is there a donation link besides Patreon?
Adverts for prescription drugs don't make any economic sense to me. Adverts for food, entertainment, clothes, travel, household items, cars, etc. make sense because they all apply to an extremely broad segment of the population. But an advert for a new Crohn's disease medication or arthritis or psoriasis apply to only a small subset of the population.
But I have to sit through every god damn one of them anytime you watch anything on network television. And don't even think about listening to the radio unless you want to hear about ED and testosterone replacement every 10 minutes. I guess only men listen to the radio, and you must be 60+ to watch traditional media.
Definitely. I often do drugs when I’m abroad.
YES! also get medical procedures abroad. Just do your research and you'll pay 1/3 of the price from the u.s.
I am European and I would be extra careful buying something in US because of lack of regulations 😆
It get it, but it's hard to be "extra careful" when you need that drug to live.
Do pharmacists not have the power in the US to give people generic brands when they exist? I have never had to pay for a name brand drug when a generic brand exists in Canada. My pharmacist will AUTOMATICALLY give me the cheapest one because they're chemically identical. And can we get a nod to the cutthroat capitalism at play here?
I just turn on my VPN whenever I go to the hospital
The two presenters that they cut to should learn how to appear real and genuine like the hosts of this show.
Also, most pharmaceutical research is funded with tax dollars at NIH than from the industry.
I used to be overweight and had to be on insulin due to developing Type 2 Diabetes. I was surprised to find out people were paying over $1600 for the same insulin vials/pens I was spending $45 a month on in Haiti... How can the "wealthiest" country in the world be the one with the least accessible healthcare/medication cost?
Instead of buying drugs that come in airplanes we really need to pass sensible regulation so that American consumers don't subsidize millionaire CEOs' over bloated bonuses. Products and services that effect people's health should not have this high of a mark up for profit!
Loving the tats! ♡
Funny enough Over The Counter generic medicines in Costco are cheaper than equivalent in Mexico. Especially allergy medication like antihistamines.
Incredibly vital Information! Thank you
This channel does not miss!! 💯💯
More helpful and relevant than ever
Another thing to remember that pharmacies and pharmaceutical companies often give coupons to reduce the cost regardless of income, I know this personally as I had to take a med that was $1000 after insurance and with the coupon only ended up costing $25…know your options and resources
the last thing i need to do is searching for coupons in such a case
and when no coupons are available
@@Subliminalsapper too late, they're in theyre pocket
Where can you find and get such coupons?
@@rotatorcuffs8140 I got mine from the pharmacist at Costco
Glad I'm in canada!
Cool video and very unique content! This is helpful, keep them coming mate!
Yes you should - their prices are much more inline what they should be.
Why care about importation when the legislation could be that drug companies cannot advertise?
New law, Pharmaceutics now must make their ledger public and can only spend 50% of what they spend on R&D for marketing, better wording for the bill.
Wow. That was a fantastic video. Loved it. Thank you!
When I lived on the border of Mexico and was making minimum wage. I had a terrible infection and couldn't afford the antibiotics. Luckily my Spanish is decent. Researched what my medicine was called in Mexico. Public transit + the cost of medicine was only $10. They would have been over $100 with insurance if I had stayed in the US.
Maybe the industry should be more regulated. Those Pharmaceutical CEOs rake in the big bucks.
Loving this channel, how about an episode that talks about different financial tasks to do after having a baby. Like setting up a 529 or something.
Why does the mon... the health system in the US always seem like a joke?
I'm always shocked to see how much expensive health (a basic human right) is in the US. Here in western Europe, nobody minds about the FDA. We have our own controls that are at least as good.
And this before we delve into the utter ****show that is PBMs.
Seriously though, any pharma company that tries to tow that "it will affect our research!" line and shows stock buybacks on their books should be heavily fined and publicly called out.
Think about that, if selling drugs in country with steap price regulation wasn't profitable, why would american drugs companies bother to get them certified for those countries?
76% price increase sounds scary, if you put it like that. But with 2.9% per year, that's entirely in line with inflation...
What about ordering & getting a script for opioids for pain management online when your local doctor cant refill your script & u severally need it? In particular oxycodone. Is that ok & safe to do?
No. Dosages are not controlled, and they may have Fentanyl. Don't do it.
@@fghsinging Thx for info
"most of western europe"??? Seriously???? What about Poland.....????????
The ignorance. You know "Eastern Europe" includes Russia and Belarus.
I guess Poland is Central Europe- literally dead central because of Russia, but why is it not on the map?
They just blocked out all of what they consider "eastern Europe"
The ignorance astounds and bothers me.
It's kind of like "Africa is all the same " it's just ignorance. That's all it is.
cry more
love ur vids. please keep making them
10% odds of counterfeit drugs, but I get to save $1200 a month? Even without factoring that I can likely find a reputable vendor, I'll take those odds!
Honestly, unless you're driving to Canada the vendor is likely not legit.
I'm torn about the marketing. Yes, it's absurd and I feel there should be a lot less of it. I used to play an online game that gave you extra points if you watched an ad, and one ad was for a drug for a condition I have. After watching the ad I did some research and asked my doctor, and took that drug for several years to my benefit. I'm certain I would eventually have discovered it on my own, but this ad brought it to my attention sooner. Still, few people take the time to go beyond what the ad says, and it's the willing ignorance of the patient that really racks up the money for the drug companies.
Not to mention pharmaceutical companies don't always do the research. Most of the time it's done by independent Laboratories paid for by our tax dollars and then the pharmaceutical companies swoop in and simply buy the drug creation.
The last part of the video saved it.
"Buying medicine internationally is illegal and buying it nationally is unaffordable"
Basically, damn you if you do and damn you if you don't. You're screwed.
By the title I was sure this is gonna be about buying weed in Asia or something.
I had never thought about buying drugs overseas
How do they get the prescription for it?
just go to the doctor and thay give you a prescription don't go to the border towns got to the states in land
One of my scripts costs $6000 in the US. I have gotten the same drug with the same results for under $200 (no generic). It's too ridiculous when I was just trying to control my eczema, cracked bleeding hands is not fun
Price control destroy industry
Yes. It's just one problematic variable though. Cronyism is a another big factor.
i think its about $10US for insulin in australia =/. 250% mark up is for brand named drugs, of which there are 'home brand' options that are half the price down here
There are industries that should not be profit driven - medication production is one of that. I think that US government understands this perfectly, but lobby is stronger then common sense in Washington
That's a problem to surreal to imagine any one in a first world country can have.
I'm confused. If generic brands in America are cheaper than getting them from Canada, then what is wrong with getting the generic?
PBS Vitals needs to buy lapel mics!
Price controls don't work
This is such an important video
Americans: how to save on medicine
Literally any other country: government
love you both. Ysll are so insightful
I'm from the UK... My prescriptions are less than £10 each 🙃
7:19 yeah, that'd be crazy! They wouldn't be able to get away with that... right?