I heard an interesting argument concerning the manger. If Joseph had to go to Bethlehem, his ancestral town, for the census, then it means he had family there, uncles, aunts, cousins, etc, and that's where he and Mary would have gone for a place to stay. There would have been no need for her to give birth in a barn of all places. Family was really important for those people.
+Francois Lacombe I've heard it argued that it is a misunderstanding of the culture at the time that leads us to the idea that Mary gave birth in a stable. Rather, the word we read as "inn" is actually the guest bedroom in the home of Joseph's family. Since someone (or more likely, many someones) were already staying there, Mary and Joseph stayed in the main room downstairs, akin to camping out in the living room. It just so happens that people would also bring their livestock inside during the night.
I'm having a very secular Christmas this year I think, even more so than last year, where I did go to church, since my stepmother was performing with the youth orchestra that she helps to lead. This year it's just family and no religion, the way I prefer it. I'd like to return those Christmas wishes and add that I enjoyed the video.
Seems like, 2,000 years ago, they didn't even know how to write consistent fiction, never mind history. Then, too, the way the authors of the synoptic gospels borrowed from each other, it might as well have been authorship by committee ... _And we all have heard the saying that is true as well as witty,_ _That a camel is a horse that was designed by a committee!_ -- Allan Sherman
9 ปีที่แล้ว +4
+Troubleshooter125 I think "consistent fiction" as we know it today is a very young concept. Before the literary genre of novel appeared, the narratives weren't too polished.
Should have added in the contradiction of where jesus was born in a manger and a house in two different stories. Oh, you did in the graphic. Nevermind. LOL
in France, we have this star fixed once and for all. You can see it in the sky, it's the brightest, we call it " the shepherd'star ". It's the 1st star you can see when the night begin. ...And it's Mars... Ahhhh, christians....
You didn't even mention Festivus as a footnote, even though it's today! This channel is sinking in the mire of commercialism. But yes, Merry Christmas to you too!
As someone who's non-religious, I've always quite enjoyed the Jesus story. I mean, its mythologized as all hell even if you take out all the spiritual elements, but its still a good story, especially for the time it was written in. And besides, a lot of the stuff we think we know about Alexander the Great or Julius Caesar is incredibly mythologized as well, so we humans have a long tradition of making grand folk heroes out of otherwise fairly ordinary human beings. As far as Abrahamic prophets go though, you have to admit Muhammad has easily the best story, although like those other three men mentioned above, much of what we know about him is romanticized beyond recognition.
I think the magi make sense of a storytelling point of view. If you want to emphasize how important a character is, let the wisest people of all over the world acknowledge him.
+seleroan That's the point. A central theme of the Christ story is that Jesus didn't come just for the Jews but for all of mankind. Having non-Jews recognize Jesus' as a king when he is just a baby is a foreshadowing device.
I don't know if this is the right place to ask but I would really like to see "five stupid things about dyslexia" I have dyslexia so plz excuse any spelling errors
Dude, first you complain that the Nativity story is historically inaccurate, and then in your second point you go on to make a textually inaccurate claim (that the Magi came to Jesus in Bethlehem when he was an infant). Most scholars believe the Magi didn't visit Jesus for several years, that he was a toddler or young boy even. If you are going to criticize (and by all means feel free to do so) at least get your criticism nailed down or else you'll just look like another whiny agnostic that doesn't know what they are talking about. Love your channel, but your theological prowess needs some sharpening up man.
+daniel beard Absolutely! I value this channel for its ability to challenge me and be thought provoking. If it's going to be petty and inaccurate, then what's the point?
If you are going to refute something you better have a way more better answer than "most scholars". Or your comment will be dismissed (and rightly so) as a BUTTHURT comment. In other words: If you write about facts you fucking better refer clearly to them, otherwise...........
+daniel beard you mean like when he said "that bit was probably added", I should argue like he was? Okay, most scholars "probably" think the Magi visited Jesus as a scholar. It's not even a question though. It's simple textual criticism. We know what the Bible does say and what it doesn't say, and what he's claiming the Bible says is simply not true. www.gotquestions.org/three-wise-men.html - I don't have a problem with him criticizing organized religion, or even Christianity specifically. My problem is that he is creating a strong man when he says that they believe one thing, and they don't.
+daniel beard If he's going to attack a religion, hopefully he can attack them for things they actually believe rather than things he says they believe.
I heard an interesting argument concerning the manger. If Joseph had to go to Bethlehem, his ancestral town, for the census, then it means he had family there, uncles, aunts, cousins, etc, and that's where he and Mary would have gone for a place to stay. There would have been no need for her to give birth in a barn of all places. Family was really important for those people.
+Francois Lacombe I've heard it argued that it is a misunderstanding of the culture at the time that leads us to the idea that Mary gave birth in a stable. Rather, the word we read as "inn" is actually the guest bedroom in the home of Joseph's family. Since someone (or more likely, many someones) were already staying there, Mary and Joseph stayed in the main room downstairs, akin to camping out in the living room. It just so happens that people would also bring their livestock inside during the night.
+Francois Lacombe What I was taught growing up is that apparently lots of people were from Bethlehem and has just "filled it up".
Wishing You and Your loved ones a pleasant and joyful holiday season, Steve :) Greetings from Switzerland !
Cheers Steve, I'll share that one on Christmas day.
Merry Santa Day and happy and peaceful 2016 to you fellow heathens
I'm having a very secular Christmas this year I think, even more so than last year, where I did go to church, since my stepmother was performing with the youth orchestra that she helps to lead. This year it's just family and no religion, the way I prefer it.
I'd like to return those Christmas wishes and add that I enjoyed the video.
A fine job done on this subject, Steve! Hope that the holiday season is good to you and your family!
Axial tilt is the reason for the season.
everybody knows the Star of Bethlehem was the birth of an alternate universe. sheesh.
Seems like, 2,000 years ago, they didn't even know how to write consistent fiction, never mind history. Then, too, the way the authors of the synoptic gospels borrowed from each other, it might as well have been authorship by committee ...
_And we all have heard the saying that is true as well as witty,_
_That a camel is a horse that was designed by a committee!_
-- Allan Sherman
+Troubleshooter125 I think "consistent fiction" as we know it today is a very young concept. Before the literary genre of novel appeared, the narratives weren't too polished.
Gábor Koszper As regards the bible, THAT is the understatement of the day!
This one goes in my favorites
Should have added in the contradiction of where jesus was born in a manger and a house in two different stories.
Oh, you did in the graphic.
Nevermind. LOL
in France, we have this star fixed once and for all.
You can see it in the sky, it's the brightest, we call it " the shepherd'star ".
It's the 1st star you can see when the night begin.
...And it's Mars...
Ahhhh, christians....
+adrienfourniercom yes this is what you get with lots of lsd and religion by mad libs
Blasphemer! The Babble says Jeebus was born, isn't that enough?
"He is the son of God, our Messiah. King of the Jews."
"And that's Capricorn, is it?"
My ex husband wanted to name our first child Malchior. Glad that never happened.
+radicalbacon
Yeah, I agree. Balthazar is much nicer. :)
Happy Agnostica, Steve!
You didn't even mention Festivus as a footnote, even though it's today! This channel is sinking in the mire of commercialism.
But yes, Merry Christmas to you too!
Manger (Archaic): A trough used to feed livestock, mainly swine.
Today the Magi would have a magic GPS
As someone who's non-religious, I've always quite enjoyed the Jesus story. I mean, its mythologized as all hell even if you take out all the spiritual elements, but its still a good story, especially for the time it was written in. And besides, a lot of the stuff we think we know about Alexander the Great or Julius Caesar is incredibly mythologized as well, so we humans have a long tradition of making grand folk heroes out of otherwise fairly ordinary human beings.
As far as Abrahamic prophets go though, you have to admit Muhammad has easily the best story, although like those other three men mentioned above, much of what we know about him is romanticized beyond recognition.
Merry christmas
I think the magi make sense of a storytelling point of view. If you want to emphasize how important a character is, let the wisest people of all over the world acknowledge him.
+Gábor Koszper ...Except that people from those cultures didn't believe in the Jewish god.
+seleroan And they didn't follow the Jewish God, they followed a cosmic event.
+seleroan That's the point. A central theme of the Christ story is that Jesus didn't come just for the Jews but for all of mankind. Having non-Jews recognize Jesus' as a king when he is just a baby is a foreshadowing device.
It's Decembertime!
Haha, the chin scratch at the end...
nailed it!!!!
marry jean and joe bob in dude were's our home
I don't know if this is the right place to ask but I would really like to see "five stupid things about dyslexia"
I have dyslexia so plz excuse any spelling errors
I always figured the taxes were cheaper if you were tallied in Bethelehem.
if only they had hotels.com back then....
Tacos
:-)
Flat Earth?
Dude, first you complain that the Nativity story is historically inaccurate, and then in your second point you go on to make a textually inaccurate claim (that the Magi came to Jesus in Bethlehem when he was an infant). Most scholars believe the Magi didn't visit Jesus for several years, that he was a toddler or young boy even. If you are going to criticize (and by all means feel free to do so) at least get your criticism nailed down or else you'll just look like another whiny agnostic that doesn't know what they are talking about. Love your channel, but your theological prowess needs some sharpening up man.
+Eric Russell Do I smell butthurt around here?
+daniel beard Absolutely! I value this channel for its ability to challenge me and be thought provoking. If it's going to be petty and inaccurate, then what's the point?
If you are going to refute something you better have a way more better answer than "most scholars". Or your comment will be dismissed (and rightly so) as a BUTTHURT comment.
In other words: If you write about facts you fucking better refer clearly to them, otherwise...........
+daniel beard you mean like when he said "that bit was probably added", I should argue like he was? Okay, most scholars "probably" think the Magi visited Jesus as a scholar. It's not even a question though. It's simple textual criticism. We know what the Bible does say and what it doesn't say, and what he's claiming the Bible says is simply not true. www.gotquestions.org/three-wise-men.html - I don't have a problem with him criticizing organized religion, or even Christianity specifically. My problem is that he is creating a strong man when he says that they believe one thing, and they don't.
+daniel beard If he's going to attack a religion, hopefully he can attack them for things they actually believe rather than things he says they believe.