Just to put my two cents in, as someone with mental illness- people can have future plans and unfortunately still commit suicide. Just something I hear a lot and I don't think people who have not experienced mental illness can always believe/understand.
THIS. I understand the thought process, but I think people are too quick to say 'oh they had plans for something therefore they couldn't have been suicidal.' it's unfortunately not that simple
thank you- so many misconceptions about suicide out there when it is sadly so common and will affect so many of us- having future plans, being afraid of the dark, neither will prevent an actively suicidal person from committing. Hope you're doing well
Telling your kid "it's just a phase" is certainly one way to ensure that they'll think twice about sharing things with you in the future. I feel so bad for Tiffany and wish she could've gotten the help and support she obviously needed
I hate seeing families stuck in the “they would never take their own life” space. The truth is we never know how our loved ones feel about life and their mental state.. so most of the time we could never know that they intend to end their lives.
Seriously. I've heard the same thing from families who found their loved one hanging in their basement, or dead with a needle in their arm. "We didn't know he was sad, we didn't know he was even using drugs". Some people hurt silently and take their own lives, others hurt and tell us and take their own lives.
Thank you! My sister took her life a year ago, after being abandoned by our mom for years, and my mom and some other family are in denial about it even though she left a couple suicide notes. They told everyone it was an accident and tried to hide the notes. I'd literally talked her down from taking her life for hours multiple times before this, and they refuse to even talk about it. It's extremely frustrating.
Very true. Sometimes it can even be “obvious” and people still overlook all the signs or their cries for help. I’m around the same age she was when she passed away and i really think that people underestimate how much teenagers go through mentally.
CPS being called on the family numerous times, her recent breakup, description of being sad and lonely by her friends, and her tweets definitely point me in the direction of an impulsive suicide- I think the credit cart incident was the last straw. Her parents are definitely in a state of denial. Such a sad and horrific case overall.
And all those immediately panicked texts and calls from friends and the voicemails left on her phone... I think the family knew deep down and worried about what she might do to herself, even if they can’t face it now. :(
Exactly. If a toddler or a young kid disappeared late at night, I could understand immediately flying into a panic. But a teenage girl? Yeah, I definitely get the feeling they knew she could do something drastic
If the mom or dad said something awful to her during the argument, specifically, the mom because of the credit card, there’s a good chance she’s in denial, because it would’ve meant that it was “her fault” because of what she said to her daughter.
Yeah, my sister took her life a year ago. She left a couple suicide letters, and my mom and some family refused to believe she did it. They told everyone it was an accident and tried to hide the letters from us.
The mother says there's "no way" that Tiffany would have taken her own life, but she said the same thing about her daughter stealing her friend's credit card. Unfortunately this mother seems to be in denial.
I agree. Understandably, families have a really hard time accepting when a loved one, especially one's child, dies by suicide. I've experienced that denial firsthand. But it's strange to me that they'd rather believe she was raped and murdered.
I think she jumped in front of the train and the parents are unable to accept it. It is far easier to be angry and fight for “justice” than face immense grief. Even if they had video of her jumping in front of the train, I think the parents still would not believe it. I think she made a rash decision in a moment of panic that had a permanent consequence. Very sad story all around.
Sad, but I agree. The train clearly ripped her from her clothes when she jumped in front of it. It was going 80 mph. I've seen this happen to people who get hit by cars while crossing the street. It's gruesome to think about, but fairly common. Still makes my heart hurt for the family.
I agree. And how they found the shoes propped up on the side of the tracks might’ve just been someone moving them out of the way or leaving them for whoever to come back and get the shoes? Idk. I think this is a horrible story about a mentally lost girl who didn’t want to hurt anymore. So so sad. Rest in peace Tiffany
The only thing I can think of is how hard it would have been for them to bury her in the pieces they recovered. They probably also didn’t think the investigation would have been done so close minded by the railroad police
I think the parents don’t want to admit things were not picture perfect. The investigation was sloppy for sure, but I think the parents don’t want to be looked at as people who had a daughter who committed S and was mentally suffering.
My daughter in laws brother suffered with some mental illness. One day, he went to work, afterwards visited with mom, rented a movie and that night committed suicide. He told his mom about his plans for going fishing the next week, a vacation he was going on the next month and so on. No one thought he would do this, everyone was in complete shock. You just don't know what is going through a person's mind.
Railroad Conductor's wife here- I tried posting last week about the Ohio Train Derailment and for whatever reason, my comment wasn't made public, but I'm going to try again this week! Firstly, the maximum allowed speed of a freight train is 70mph and that speed is only allowed on straightaways, where no bends or curves are present, meaning the train crew should have had a clear view of the tracks for hundreds of feet (if not further) so there's really no way her body was placed on the tracks without the crew noticing far before they hit her body or mistaking it as "a girl throwing herself in front of the train". Secondly, an axe is absolutely NOT an item that is kept or allowed on any freight train. If the investigators found a wood axe, it was not tied to the train or it's crew. Also, the standard is to cut brush and trees back at least 20ft on either side of the railroad tracks- giving the crew ample room to walk along/work on the train when it breaks down- so if there was another person there either throwing or pushing her in front of the train, that would have been easily visible by the crew. I would say, other than it being self inflicted (either intentional or accidental), the most likely theory would be that she may have been running from someone or something. Maybe she was assaulted and was fleeing from the perpetrator and ran across the tracks? I'm not sure but I can't see how it could be a 'murder'.
My husband is a conductor as well and sadly his trains have hit many people, both by accident and by suicide. He said the same thing about the engineer would have been able to see her on the tracks beforehand. Though, there have been negligent engineers who weren’t diligently watching the tracks. And it’s more common on freight than it is on passenger so it’s possible they looked away at that moment…but the odds are she wasn’t on the tracks ahead of time
@@alleyj826 it’s also hard to stop a train… cars of small size have a hard enough time stopping at 70mph let alone a long train so sadly even if they seem someone on the track they cannot always stop in time all the can do is make themself a more known such as a horn blazing to let them know the train is for sure a coming. It’s sadly so easy for a human to end up infront of the train and the men in the train not have time to come to a stop
@@Souls-at-zer0 I never once said the train could have stopped. I’m well aware they cannot. My husband has seen some horrible accidents. I said the would have SEEN her.
@HotKey Success I believe she refers to the way her family and friends first thought was that she had or was going to hurt herself. If she had no history of hurting her
@@Jb-nd4bu Yeah I think it’s very telling that their first thought was that she’d hurt herself. Unfortunately I think this is clearly a case of suicide, very sad.
Indeed. No one reacts the way they did just because someone is missing for literally 5 minutes. It makes no sense whatsoever, they clearly knew she was impulsive, she may not even have been suicidal, but the parents knew she would be the type of person capable of doing something this final without giving it proper thought.
Yeah, this case kind of pissed me off. It’s so painfully obvious that this was a suicide, I can understand that the family doesn’t want to accept that because it’s just way too painful, but at some point you’ve got to stop pointing fingers at people when there’s literally nothing to work with. And it was obvious by accounts by teachers and students that things at home were not great, there was AT LEAST one instance of physical abuse but also accounts from friends that the parents were not all that excepting of Tiffany being a lesbian. I think the fact that the credit card incident was so vague tells us all that we need to know, there were some choice words that in retrospect probably push Tiffany over the edge and I think deep down her mother most likely knows that, but can’t except it for obvious reasons. The real victim here is Tiffany, who even in death her cries of pain are being completely ignored by her family.
I feel she took her life. As sad as it is. Her parents were not accepting of her sexuality, the mom was being abusive, she went through a breakup, then the whole stolen credit card situation could have just pushed her over the edge. It seemed impulsive and teenagers (hormones) can cause them to do very scary and impulsive things. We’ve all been there. I just think it’s too elaborate for a murder and had she been on the tracks already, the train crew would have seen her. The investigation was absolutely botched though and I do pray her family gets closure one day.
@@TheAtl198 Did you not hear the beginning of the video where they explained CPS getting involved with the family? I believe they said her mother lost her temper and punched her.
This was so *obviously* a suicide. The parents can't accept it and are in denial because otherwise they would have to consider how their own behaviour affected her mental health (including the mother being physically abusive!). It's psychologically easier for the parents to blame someone external than look at themselves and how they could have prevented this by accepting her for who she was and giving her the love and support she needed.
@@Amanda.Marie40 Oh, come on. If you abuse someone physically and mentally and they become depressed and die by suicide, it isn't an unrelated coincidence. It was her choice to take her life, but she clearly never would have made that choice if her parents were supportive and loving. They are to blame.
She very clearly did it and I bet they’d argued. Look at those first images…she clearly had an argument and immediately left by herself. 1:20:57 The shoe thing isn’t suspicious at all…she took them off. There’s nothing suspicious about this case.
@@soude85 shredded in the quarter of a mile she was dragged for. Her limbs were cut off, skull torn to pieces, and you think cotton shorts will survive?
My brother died by suicide via train. This was a hard episode to watch, but also relatable. It is hard to accept that our loved ones would make such a gruesome, permanent choice. Hoping her family can find some peace in the future.
There has been speculation and rumors that the family wasn’t as accepting of Tiffany sexuality as they claim, and apparently social services had gotten involved with the family as Tiffany claimed that her mother hit her. To me, I really think this girl was struggling and honestly it was a suicide, especially since her shoes were removed and found which is common among suicides. It saddens me that we don’t get the full picture honestly as I believe this girl was struggling under immense pressure.
I see that taking off shoes are common in Japanese culture, but I don’t think it is common in others.. I couldn’t find much on the subject for American culture and taking shows/clothes off. it’s weird because I felt the total opposite, the shoes and clothes being off are about the only thing that make me second guess a suicide.
@@reneec6297 Unfortunately it’s likely that the train ripped all of the items off her and scattered them all over the place. The shoes being where they were is kind of weird but I’m betting they were grabbed by someone on the tracks (homeless or otherwise) and then just forgotten where they were left.
Taking off shoes before a suicide is not common in American culture. I've never once seen or heard of it happening, and I've been a psychiatric nurse in the US for a decade.
I have no clue about America specifically but it is a thing in the western world as well. When being trained for a job at an elevated location where suicides take place from time to time (people jump) we were told to be alert for people taking their shoes off.
I can't imagine the grief the family is going through, but I think the police got it right. The fact that she was missing for five minutes and they were frantically trying to get ahold of her says it all
I experienced SI for over a decade, and really did believe that I would eventually die by suicide, but I still went on to complete undergraduate and master's degrees. I remember thinking during that time that it was so irrational to be stressed about my school work when I "knew" I would be taking my own life any day now and school wouldn't matter, but I did the work and stressed about it anyway. I guess it was just a coping strategy to get through the day (or hour) -- more of a distraction than a reflection of how I saw myself in the future. All this to say, I think it's a fair theory that Tiffany could have been experiencing SI and at the same time was making plans for her future. It's probably more common than people realize.
This is a case of suicide and a family unable to let go. Its very sad, the investigation wasn’t very good, but i understand why the police ruled it as suicide. The idea that she was kidnapped or killed is absurd. The driver saw her STANDING on the tracks.
Did he though? Made contradicting statements.if you put yourself in his shoes you could defs agree that a lot of ppl Would lie about that so they don’t lose they’re job due to paying zero attention and running over a dead girl laying on the tracks😂 I’m 50-50 on this being suicide. It’s not an easy one that’s for sure
@@Sebastian-km9qx They wouldn’t lose their job regardless because trains are incredibly difficult to slow down, there’s only so much the conductor and engineer can do. Everyone knows that. He had no reason to make contradictory statements.
Yeah in the Netflix show they kept suggesting she was forced in front of the train but I fully believe she would've been turned away from the impact as much as possible if that was the case. Definitely wouldn't have been seen standing up and diving in front of the train.
@@Sebastian-km9qxI've dealt with a lot of train calls and it wasn't the student with the different statements it was the lead conductor. The student was just off on the timing a little bit but that's regular human error when remembering something traumatic. And between the multitude of suicide by train incidents and just how deadly trains are they weren't facing any job loss no matter the situation so not a reason to lie there. I still go back and forth in my head about this one bc her life story is so similar to mine and I grew up just 2 hours north but was the same age. But years of being a first responder tell me suicide was the cause
As someone who lost my own son to suicide I can tell you even though I knew it was, I didn’t want to believe it and was so hard to except for me, my son even had plans to fly and visit us for Christmas and was so excited to meet his first and only niece by his brother who was being born on Christmas. Not saying this poor girl died by suicide and the family won’t except it but this is a hard one and very well could have
KENDALL AND JOSH THANK YOU!! I remember requesting this case on Kendall's channel years ago. I grew up in Mays Landing and went to highschool the same time as Tiffany but I went to a private one in town. I've walked those same train tracks dozens of times. Her family has been fighting since it happened for awareness. To this day there are billboards on the roads in and out of May's Landing with Tiffany's face on them. No matter what happened whether suicide or foul play, awareness of cases like these is important. I appreciate everything you and the mile higher crew do!
I watched another video on this months ago. How do they account for finding shoes so far from the tracks? How and why would she walk that far with no shoes? The bottom of her foot was pretty pristine. Also very little blood given the horrific dismemberment... this points to the fact that she possibly wasn't alive when she was hit by the train. Just questions. 🤷🏻♀️
I'm from Egg Harbor Township and can attest to the fact that there is still signage everywhere regarding Tiffany's case. Almost 10 years later and signs are still up, crazy. Also, I completely believe that she was already dead before being placed on the train tracks, considering the aftermath.
@@Just_MHO_thomasina I think the other video must have reported incorrectly. One of her feet was crushed by the impact, and the other had some cuts, scrapes, and dirt. I also don't think she was walking on the gravel that long- if you look at a map of the area, most of the walking from where the shoes were found to where the impact site was part of a golf course, which would have been very soft to walk on.
Just my 2 cents on the brother not telling how Tiffany died. I'm a respiratory therapist for 8 years, and when I found my grandmother unresponsive in our kitchen. I jumped into CPR, but afterward, I just couldn't tell my mom what happened. It's 100% different when it's one of your love one's.
JOSH, I met you this past weekend at cafe rio! It was super rad meeting you! I absolutely love all you and Kendall do for families and getting out so many stories. You guys are absolutely amazing! ✌🏻😝✌🏻
I completely agree that she deserved a more thorough investigation, but it seems this was a suicide. Her mother did not seem receptive to her friends claims that she was self harming, so I don’t find it hard to believe she is dismissing her daughters pain yet again simply because she doesn’t want to believe. Some people REALLY don’t understand mental illness or suicide so I think she would rather believe someone else hurt her daughter rather than accepting that she didn’t know her daughter as well as she thought she did and that she was capable of doing this.
I think there definitely could’ve been more investigating, but teenagers make snap decisions sometimes and tumblr was/is notorious for not monitoring suicidal ideation posts. I think this was most likely suicide. Overall tragic for everyone involved.
@@Cinder_311 isn't there a Japanese custom to take off your shoes before offing yourself, entering the afterlife. for the same reason you take off shoes before entering a home, so you don't drag the mess inside ? Not 100% I just thought I've heard this before
She was more than likely ripped from her clothes when she jumped in front of the train going 80 mph. The force of the impact can cause that to happen. I've actually witnessed this happen to a woman crossing the street who got struck by a car going about 50 mph. She flipped into the air and spun in the air and then landed and when she did her shoes and pants were totally off, panties pulled down to her ankles and shirt and bra pulled all the way up to her armpits. It's gruesome yet a fairly common occurrence to happen to someone who is struck that hard and fast by a large moving object with that amount of force.
@@Cinder_311 Maybe she wanted to walk barefoot, feel the ground beneath you one last time. Even if it did hurt to walk on the ground, as someone who has struggled with mental illness and self h*rm myself, I highly doubt the pain would’ve mattered in that situation if you are already in that level of a distressed mindset (in fact it might’ve even sadly been welcome).
From experience, my mother hit, punched and lashed out physically to me in my teens. It never just happened once and it messed me up. To this day I’m not over it at 42 y/o. When someone who is supposed to love you unconditionally is so quick to hurt you it effs up your psyche.
When they said her mom confessed to bruising her it definitely makes you wonder how many times it might have happened before 😖 I made another comment on someone else’s post about why she wouldn’t have left a suicide note for her parents but your comment makes me think she had a good reason not to.
She may not have set out to kill herself. Maybe she was fleeing the very uncomfortable situation of being caught stealing and mentally started to spiral about everything that had been going on. She heard the train coming because you can hear them from quite a ways away and seized the opportunity without thinking. It did say she was impulsive.
My house is about 200 feet from a railroad track and it runs along the side of my community. The quantity and diversity of items alongside the tracks is crazy. There's a decent chance that the stuff they found by the tracks are entirely unrelated. There's so much stuff. For example, for whatever reason, some guy came into my community and left his entire backpack in the bushes by the tracks. I reported it to the cops, who picked it up. One item inside was....surprise...a towel...there was also a knife and some other sort of...survival related items you might expected someone to have who doesn't have a place to go.
@@sumaya776 It wouldn’t be easy, there would be a lot of dangerous debris and rocks. Totally possible though. Especially if she is in a really bad place mentally, she may have been damaging her feet and mot even caring cause her ultimate plan was suicide. Personally I feel she lost her shoes when she was hit and then a homeless person picked em up, thought they were gonna take them for themselves, then forgot or discarded them where they were found.
Same! I’m in Montreal. I’ve got commercial train tracks and urbain trains with a golf course too. Walking my dog in the past 12 years the amount of random and weird items I’ve seen… countless. Last summer found a half burned life size doll dressed in a police uniform. Few years back a neighbour walking his dog ended up finding a man hanging on a tree…
Police officer here. Just letting you know something for future information. The police don't always notify the family of a death. It depends on the county. If the police don't do the death notification, it's the responsibility of the medical examiner to notify the family. I'm not sure how they do it out where this death happened, but I just wanted you to know that a notification isn't always two cops knocking on your door at 3am to notify you.
Of course we don’t know for sure if she actually committed suicide, but the feeling I get from the family interviews denying that possibility (especially from her mother) is that they’re continuing to invalidate what she was going through in death just as they did in life. Between calling her sexuality a “phase” and only taking her to one therapy session to address her tough home life, this girl’s struggles were being ignored. And now by denying the possibility that she took her own life, her family continues to do the same thing. Invalidating her from the grave. I also agree with others points that it’s very rarely only once that a child is hit in the home. All this to say, two things can also be true at once. She could have been struggling and also been murdered. And this investigation was certainly botched and should be looked further into. But that doesn’t change the fact that her family appear to be in denial that suicide is possible. While they shouldn’t blame themselves, and it’s usually a combination of things that leads someone to that decision, I think we can all see it’s the most likely scenario. Although I can only imagine what they are going through and how tough it would be to admit.
Totally agree with you. It saddens me that even her final decision to take her own life is not accepted by her family to this day. They keep dismissing her and invalidating what she was going through even after death. May her soul be finally free and in peace 🩶
There is a rainbow flag at her memorial bench. I don’t think it’s realistic to assume that her parents didn’t accept her sexuality, based off that one statement…
It was suicide in my opinion. I have strong doubts about the mom 'just walking' and suddenly finding the missing shoes. It wouldn't surprise me if she arranged for the shoes to be 'found' so she could galvanize the police into action.
Sadly I think this was a quick decision suicide .. she left her phone at the driveway because she just wanted to get away from everyone calling her. She left her shoes because maybe she bought them with the stolen credit card? She just kept walking/running because she was so upset and when she saw the train she made a decision to jump. Her clothes being missing I think is from the impact of the train.. people who get hit by just a car sometimes have their shoes fly off.. I couldn’t imagine clothes staying on after being hit by a train going 80mph. I don’t think she knew about the train , she was probably just so upset and walked that way and saw the train… I think her parents are in denial , and the fact they blocked the friend is probably because they know deep down it was a suicide and are looking for people to blame .
The behavior of the family the evening Tiffany died backs up the suicide theory. When a young adult walks away after a fight with her bf most families are going to figure she simply needs time and space. This family appears to have gone into full panic mode, including texting Tiffany about not hurting herself. The family hasn't provided anything that would make me think murder.
Yeah this is how I feel. I went to sign the petition and the family lawyer literally mentions the uncle that ID'd her body made a statement to the responders on scene that corroborated her being suicidal but once the family said otherwise he tried to take it back.
My brother in law decided at the last minute to jump off a bridge a year and a half ago. He left his cell phone, car keys and wallet on his seat in the car so he could be identified right away. I hope the family gets their answers soon. So heartbreaking.
Watched on Spotify but came over here to comment. I live 15 minutes outside of this area. I understand the parents need for answers, but unfortunately I think suicide is the correct cause. IMO of course.
I definitely agree. I feel absolutely horrible for her parents and understand their search for different answers. But I think that suicide or an accident is much more plausible than any kind of foul play.
As someone who has attempted on their life multiple times, I too had plans for the future but still wanted to be gone. I still seemed happy on the outside, I still was active in my community and my friend and family circles. We never know whats going on in someone’s life. It is so sad to me that the parents are so stuck on this.
I was also told as a child by my mother that my sexuality was a “phase” and it’s still something I still think about frequently. This poor girl killed herself and the parents are just in complete denial that they fucked up with their kid and their treatment of her contributed to her suicidal thoughts. She needed some serious help… but perhaps the parents thought this was a “phase” too.
I took my daughter to counseling for self harm. The counselor talked to both of us together and each of us separately and and then at the end she spoke with both of us again. My daughter did open up with her alone, and spoke about things she wouldn’t speak about with me present.
I know it’s tragic and the family is probably in grief but I think she killed her self. They say that she wouldn’t have walked around naked or barefoot but she was hit by a train. Her clothes probably came off that way. They say she wasn’t suicidal or didn’t have mental health issues but her social media and friends say otherwise. She also just got into trouble for theft. I think it was an impulsive choice she made in that moment.
This was almost certainly a suicide. The parents weren’t supportive of her being gay and this is a tragic example of what that can cause. I feel bad that they are in major denial though.
This is such a horrific case but imo I really do think it was suicide. There are definitely things that should’ve been done in the investigation to rule out other options and to be sure of it but it’s hard to imagine it was something else. I understand it must be really difficult for the family to want to accept that your child may have been struggling and you didn’t see it but that is so so common when it comes to suicide. It’s easier to hide than people think. All love to the family and friends, this is a brutal and devastating thing to go through ❤
Seeing the Unsolved Mysteries episode I was dead set on something suspicious happened, foul play, etc. But watching this and knowing more details especially the Tumblr account has me thinking she did unalive herself
I am so happy this case is FINALLY getting coverage! It is still widely talked about in the town, it's obvious to everyone who looks at this case that it was majorly screwed over by authorities. Justice for Tiffany and her family
243 episodes and I swear I've watched a majority of them twice if not more, thank you guys for such good quality content all year every year, and as always, much love from Ohio! 💚
The investigation was done very poorly. But it's so hard in these situations because the railroad stops for no one and with 2 initial witness statements, you're right, it's open and shut to them. I happen to know someone who jumped in front of a train. It was tragic. It was sudden. Sometimes people see an opportunity to end it all and take it. It doesn't matter if it's "scheduled". It's very possible she wasn't alone, and whoever was with her is scared to come forward. But I think it's also tragic that she was struggling and didn't have the support to get the help she needed. Of course, anything is possible. But teens can be impulsive.
I know Janelle pivoted her career from what she thought she would be doing. However, i think it was meant to be that everything happened the way it did because now she is able to help educate us on a psychology side on a lot of cases including this one. Love you guys! Keep up the amazing work❤
totally agree!!! may not be a typical job for a masters in psychology, but i think it means a lot to have someone so qualified weighing in on the conversation or used as a resource. love you janelle !
I think the family is in denial. My Dad committed suicide when I was 12, and for years I thought no way, he wouldn't do that, only as I got older and starting remembering little pieces of the puzzle did I realise how depressed he must of been. Even years after I felt so much guilt that I missed the signs 😔
I'm sorry for your loss. The "would have, could have, should have" game is endless and you were a kid. That being said I do agree the parents sound in denial. I think our society wants to blame somebody for every bad thing that happens, but sometimes bad things just happen and there's no one person or thing to blame for it.
I’m so sorry for your loss. I agree with the previous user though, you were just a kid. I know that might be hard to accept because of grief, but I wanted to at least reiterate that point. Hopefully… to alleviate some of that guilt ❤
When I was a teen, I tired to unalive myself. The only thing I wanted to do at that moment was to cause my parents as much pain as they had caused me. This makes me believe that this was a suicide.
This is truly so much better than the episode on Unsolved Mysteries. The authorities involved in this investigation really dropped the ball considering there was hardly an investigation at all. I hope the family receives answers that help them to find closure ❤️
Thanks for covering. I'm still in the beginning but know you guys will paint a better picture than Unsolved Mysteries. I watched that episode shortly after it came out and this case has stuck with me ever since.
I strongly believe the parents are in a state of denial and refusal to accept that their child was unstable and unfortunately decided to end her life. There was no indication of r@pe and according to the timeline, it would be highly unlikely that there would have been time or opportunity for an act such as r@pe, murder and transportation of a body to the train track. I understand the frustration and how it would be very difficult to accept that your child or family member would choose "s" word. This doesn't excuse the rushed police work. I also understand the frustration there. But I do believe this is a case of denial on the parent's part. They were in denial of her sexuality, as the mother stated she believed was a phase, they denied her potential cutting, only had one therapy session, etc. Denial and refusal to accept reality, imo. Very sad situation all around. Just my opinion, of course.
I’m confused by the one comment about how she messaged her friend that night apparently, yet her phone was found in the bushes and was by the home the whole night?
This is why sadly if they did more of an investigation they could of gotten her cell phone records. This would show exactly when the phone was left at the house. It would of given more information and closure. They just ruled it suicide automatically. So they most likely didn't think they would get enough to get the cell phone records & data. They probably never even did forensics on the phone either, which also would provide more insight on any deleted videos, calls, messages etc.
They said the friend said that she heard that Tiffany messaged that to a friend that night. But it may have been a different night or never even happened at all. You know how people gossip.
Parents in denial of the suicide, they can't accept that they saw the signs and that the poor girl had been calling out for help, with her actions at least. The lying, stealing, etc. would have been out of character ( you would think), she clearly wasn't mentally healthy. The parents have been selfish. Let that girl rest!!
Yes, that’s a major sign actually! Giving away your stuff and feeling happy all of the sudden are signs psychiatrists / therapists often recall with suicidal patients
When my husband passed to suicide, detectives came to our home and separated my 13 year old, my 15 year old and myself and interviewed each of us. As traumatic as this was for the three of us, it was a thorough investigation and it was an obvious suicide with my husbands case. Not sure why, in this case, there wasn’t a more thorough investigation.
My husband committed suicide by hanging and it was apparent. A thorough investigation was completed by the police regardless of the obvious nature. I wish everyone received that level of concern.
@Phoebe Rhoades I'm sorry for your loss and that of your children. My husband and I only had one child, two at the time, and he has no memories; I'm sure teens have so many memories and heartache.
I love Kendal so much, her empathy, compassion and passion for victims and their families both on here and her own channel genuinely make me so happy, she's the sweetest, most genuine person out there and it just gives me so much hope in the world
I do think it was probably suicide but not planned, she'd just been found out by her mother and she was very overwhelmed. I think she ran off dumped her phone so no one could ring her. In that frame of mind my phone going off would really make me feel worse. She just went out trying to maybe clear her head and calm down but she saw/heard the train and the idea just stuck. I think it's one of those cases with parents where they refuse to believe their kid was depressed because it means that they missed the signs and don't want to admit it.
I'm almost wondering if in an emotional break down she tore all the clothes off that she had bought with the stolen credit card :( I could see my young emotional self doing that. But at the same time it is weird .. I can see both sides
I didn’t think of that either but I agree that would make logical sense. I wonder if they ever figured out what items of clothing she purchased on that credit card…
I'm glad I decided to look for a second perspective on this case because _wow,_ Unsolved Mysteries totally had me convinced that Tiffany was kidnapped and murdered. I do think that her parents/uncles probably had a lot of say in how things were framed since they were the main people being interviewed, but yeah, 10 minutes into this podcast and it's pretty clear that her suicide didn't come _completely_ out of nowhere.
I can't believe they took the time to even air this on that show. Of all the unsolved cases that deserve another look THIS is one of the ones they pick? The most obvious "it was suicide" one of them all?
Thank you for advocating for us to sign. I do think that tragically it was a suicide, though there are some odd things, such as the shoes. But after thinking about a family not being able to try to exhaust all avenues in their search for understanding of the crushing loss of their daughter, that breaks my heart. So I have signed the petition. I appreciate you discussing the reasons why we should. I am praying for this sweet family. ♥️
THANK YOU for shedding light on this case. it still doesn't sit right with me knowing some of the smaller details and the transit police definitely just tried to close the case as fast as they could. I hope some day the truth can come to light for Tiffany's family😢
One of my best friends in high school had a similar experience of not being told about his mothers murder. He learned about it through the news that showed up on the scene talking about a murder/suicide between ex’s before anyone even called him HOURS later. His mother was in surgery for an hour before she passed and he never had the chance to say goodbye because he didn’t even know.
The rumor around here in Mays Landing is that the shoes are one of the items she bought with the stolen credit card. That’s why she took them off and left them
This case really has me frustrated - whether they speculate an accident, suicide or homicide there is NO reason for them to not test the axe, the knife, do the rape kits. Basically everything you guys said is so right. There were so many things overlooked, and even if it was a suicide, wouldn’t they want to be CERTAIN? The axe looked really sus to me. It could be a really bad coincidence it was there but it really stood out. It breaks my heart nobody will ever really know what happened to this girl unless there’s some sort of miracle. Despite the actions of her mother and their relationship, my heart still goes out to the whole family. I can’t imagine living everyday without knowing answers to how a loved one passed.
kind of a random theory, but what if it's both suicide and foul play? Her friend argued with her about the credit card then left, her parents yelled at her and she ran off in distress. Maybe that friend and others picked Tiffany up in the car, drove her to rough her up physically/sexually/etc with her cell phone, shoes and headband being thrown and her shorts/shirt ripped by them. Tiffany either gets dumped near the train tracks still alive or she escapes their vehicle. This traumatic assault pushes her over the edge to just stay on the train tracks when the train comes. As someone whose dealt with suicide attempts/mental health, you can for sure have future exciting opportunities planned and still want to harm yourself. From what her online history has said, to her family and friend issues, to her uneasiness with the future, maybe this event sent her over the edge mentally. Everything can snowball all at once.
After knowing how her mother was treating her, and how many times cps went to their house, I think she committed suicide. Her mother refuses to admit that she was upset, and they did not even bring it up in the Netflix episode. I believe she literally said that the ONLY thing her daughter had to be upset about was the credit card. What about you hitting her? What about you denying her sexuality? The break up? There were multiple things going on in this poor girls life and this was the last straw. Who knows what she said to her daughter in those final moments. Who knows what she threatened.
Although I’m young I lived next to AC my whole life and never ever heard about this and neither has my family. It wasn’t talked about enough. Thank you for spreading awareness
I’m around her age. As someone who was a depressed teen in tumblrs glory days there was a ton of su**ide glamorization and desensitization. Tiffany reminds me a lot of a friend who posted very similar things and was emotionally turbulent and ended up taking her life in a dramatic and public way as well.
When you are in catastrophic accidents where the body receives an unbelievable amount of trauma, clothes come off. Especially depending on how the body was found. There also might not have been...enough of her to complete a rape kit. Medical examiners, the ones who perform the autopsies, do not always make scene. A coroner will pick up the deceased.
I find it confusing why the parents would say that they don’t believe she was suffering with her mental health yet they all jumped and panicked really quickly when she walked off that night. It does seem as though they knew she was struggling and they knew she may try something extreme so they quickly had everyone looking for her. I feel bad for them but it seems obvious that she made a rash decision that night after the argument.
The tweet, could it be "I shouldn't feel happy right now, but now that I've decided to (commit) I feel at peace"? It reminds me of my older Facebook posts from 13-15, and that is my first impression of it.
Exactly. Even though I think it was impulsive and unplanned and an accumulation of stressors, I thought the same thing. She had the seed planted in the back of her mind.
My grandmother was hit by a train at age 19. She says that she was roofied at bowling. The engineer saw her lying across the tracks and pulled the brake, but the train still made impact. She survived after being freed with the jaws of life. After sustaining a broken skull, she was released from the hospital two days later. Much later in life, the engineer got in touch with her and they had a beautiful friendship before he passed away a few years ago. It's crazy to think how similar Tiffany's story is to hers 💔
Do they not get the impact a train would have on a teenagers body?? It’s gonna knock her shoes off and clothes. If her body was in pieces, her clothes would be messed up too.
Every train needs to have a camera on it recording! There are truly sooo many accidents. Many more than we know about because a lot are kept out of the news. If you notice, you rarely ever hear names of the employees because they are highly protected by the union.
Thank you for covering this. This happened a few minutes from my house and I think about her every time I drive over those train tracks. I wish the family can get some closure soon 😞😢
A person that have been hit by a train usually gets recovered without any close on, it’s a strange phenomena as the close gets removed somehow during the collision. I have a family member who was a head of a passenger train and she had quite a few situations during nearly 5 decades on the job in which she had to recover bodies from under her train, and in all cases they were missing their clothes, it would be recovered all over the tracks. It’s horrific scenes for sure.
Just to put my two cents in, as someone with mental illness- people can have future plans and unfortunately still commit suicide. Just something I hear a lot and I don't think people who have not experienced mental illness can always believe/understand.
THIS. I understand the thought process, but I think people are too quick to say 'oh they had plans for something therefore they couldn't have been suicidal.' it's unfortunately not that simple
thank you- so many misconceptions about suicide out there when it is sadly so common and will affect so many of us- having future plans, being afraid of the dark, neither will prevent an actively suicidal person from committing. Hope you're doing well
@@MYCATSEGA12 I am, same to you!! 🩵
I agree
I can agree
Telling your kid "it's just a phase" is certainly one way to ensure that they'll think twice about sharing things with you in the future. I feel so bad for Tiffany and wish she could've gotten the help and support she obviously needed
I hate seeing families stuck in the “they would never take their own life” space. The truth is we never know how our loved ones feel about life and their mental state.. so most of the time we could never know that they intend to end their lives.
I have lost 5 people to this - none of them showed any signs in advance. On the contrary, they hid their struggles pretty much perfectly.
Seriously. I've heard the same thing from families who found their loved one hanging in their basement, or dead with a needle in their arm. "We didn't know he was sad, we didn't know he was even using drugs". Some people hurt silently and take their own lives, others hurt and tell us and take their own lives.
Thank you! My sister took her life a year ago, after being abandoned by our mom for years, and my mom and some other family are in denial about it even though she left a couple suicide notes. They told everyone it was an accident and tried to hide the notes. I'd literally talked her down from taking her life for hours multiple times before this, and they refuse to even talk about it. It's extremely frustrating.
So very true! You just never know for sure.
Very true. Sometimes it can even be “obvious” and people still overlook all the signs or their cries for help. I’m around the same age she was when she passed away and i really think that people underestimate how much teenagers go through mentally.
CPS being called on the family numerous times, her recent breakup, description of being sad and lonely by her friends, and her tweets definitely point me in the direction of an impulsive suicide- I think the credit cart incident was the last straw. Her parents are definitely in a state of denial. Such a sad and horrific case overall.
And all those immediately panicked texts and calls from friends and the voicemails left on her phone... I think the family knew deep down and worried about what she might do to herself, even if they can’t face it now. :(
Exactly. If a toddler or a young kid disappeared late at night, I could understand immediately flying into a panic. But a teenage girl? Yeah, I definitely get the feeling they knew she could do something drastic
Agreed. They want to place blame anywhere they can.
I can absolute relate to this. If she had nothing tying her down, she had no reason not to kill herself. It was the last straw.
EXACTLY!!!
If the mom or dad said something awful to her during the argument, specifically, the mom because of the credit card, there’s a good chance she’s in denial, because it would’ve meant that it was “her fault” because of what she said to her daughter.
Yes absolutely this. The parents def come off as being in denial imo. Sad case I couldn’t imagine being in their shoes 😢
Yes. I believe this unfortunately.
I did get an "in denial" vibe from them, unfortunately. I couldn't imagine that feeling , though.. how awful. 😢
Yeah, my sister took her life a year ago. She left a couple suicide letters, and my mom and some family refused to believe she did it. They told everyone it was an accident and tried to hide the letters from us.
I agree. I think she was having a mental health episode, possibly hypomanic. Stealing money is a common sign
The mother says there's "no way" that Tiffany would have taken her own life, but she said the same thing about her daughter stealing her friend's credit card. Unfortunately this mother seems to be in denial.
Exactly 👍
EXACTLY!!!
Facks, Sam R. Most parents never admit that their child would be capable of $uicide.
Agreed! A rape kit!? Why!?
I agree. Understandably, families have a really hard time accepting when a loved one, especially one's child, dies by suicide. I've experienced that denial firsthand. But it's strange to me that they'd rather believe she was raped and murdered.
I think she jumped in front of the train and the parents are unable to accept it. It is far easier to be angry and fight for “justice” than face immense grief. Even if they had video of her jumping in front of the train, I think the parents still would not believe it. I think she made a rash decision in a moment of panic that had a permanent consequence. Very sad story all around.
Nailed it
Agreed 😔
Sad, but I agree. The train clearly ripped her from her clothes when she jumped in front of it. It was going 80 mph. I've seen this happen to people who get hit by cars while crossing the street. It's gruesome to think about, but fairly common. Still makes my heart hurt for the family.
I agree. And how they found the shoes propped up on the side of the tracks might’ve just been someone moving them out of the way or leaving them for whoever to come back and get the shoes? Idk. I think this is a horrible story about a mentally lost girl who didn’t want to hurt anymore. So so sad. Rest in peace Tiffany
I think this as well
For the family to say "we KNOW she was murdered," the immediate question is why did you have her cremated if murder was suspected?
I was about to comment the same thing when I saw your comment. I was surprised the family did not seek an independent autopsy.
The only thing I can think of is how hard it would have been for them to bury her in the pieces they recovered. They probably also didn’t think the investigation would have been done so close minded by the railroad police
It’s possible people don’t think about this when they are in the position of making the decision of what to do with the body of a loved one.
I think the parents don’t want to admit things were not picture perfect. The investigation was sloppy for sure, but I think the parents don’t want to be looked at as people who had a daughter who committed S and was mentally suffering.
My daughter in laws brother suffered with some mental illness. One day, he went to work, afterwards visited with mom, rented a movie and that night committed suicide. He told his mom about his plans for going fishing the next week, a vacation he was going on the next month and so on. No one thought he would do this, everyone was in complete shock. You just don't know what is going through a person's mind.
Railroad Conductor's wife here- I tried posting last week about the Ohio Train Derailment and for whatever reason, my comment wasn't made public, but I'm going to try again this week! Firstly, the maximum allowed speed of a freight train is 70mph and that speed is only allowed on straightaways, where no bends or curves are present, meaning the train crew should have had a clear view of the tracks for hundreds of feet (if not further) so there's really no way her body was placed on the tracks without the crew noticing far before they hit her body or mistaking it as "a girl throwing herself in front of the train".
Secondly, an axe is absolutely NOT an item that is kept or allowed on any freight train. If the investigators found a wood axe, it was not tied to the train or it's crew.
Also, the standard is to cut brush and trees back at least 20ft on either side of the railroad tracks- giving the crew ample room to walk along/work on the train when it breaks down- so if there was another person there either throwing or pushing her in front of the train, that would have been easily visible by the crew. I would say, other than it being self inflicted (either intentional or accidental), the most likely theory would be that she may have been running from someone or something. Maybe she was assaulted and was fleeing from the perpetrator and ran across the tracks? I'm not sure but I can't see how it could be a 'murder'.
My husband is a conductor as well and sadly his trains have hit many people, both by accident and by suicide. He said the same thing about the engineer would have been able to see her on the tracks beforehand. Though, there have been negligent engineers who weren’t diligently watching the tracks. And it’s more common on freight than it is on passenger so it’s possible they looked away at that moment…but the odds are she wasn’t on the tracks ahead of time
@@alleyj826 it’s also hard to stop a train… cars of small size have a hard enough time stopping at 70mph let alone a long train so sadly even if they seem someone on the track they cannot always stop in time all the can do is make themself a more known such as a horn blazing to let them know the train is for sure a coming. It’s sadly so easy for a human to end up infront of the train and the men in the train not have time to come to a stop
@That's what I was thinking, maybe she was being chased & ran to try to escape to the other side, if not, then it was suicide.
@@Souls-at-zer0 I never once said the train could have stopped. I’m well aware they cannot. My husband has seen some horrible accidents. I said the would have SEEN her.
I'm so sorry for your husband and other train conductors, having to see that.
If I were with my therapist and I was suicidal I'd never say it in front of my mom. She should have a session alone if that was an option.
Same. And if the home life wasn't great, as if a child would say that out loud and risk making things even worse for themselves.
I wouldn't even talk alone with a therapist. Psychologists don't understand the difference between active suicide and just a suicide threat/thought.
Just the response to her initially going missing tells me everything I need to know, I feel sorry but the family is clearly in denial.
💯
which response specifically are you referring to?
@HotKey Success I believe she refers to the way her family and friends first thought was that she had or was going to hurt herself. If she had no history of hurting her
@@Jb-nd4bu Yeah I think it’s very telling that their first thought was that she’d hurt herself. Unfortunately I think this is clearly a case of suicide, very sad.
Indeed. No one reacts the way they did just because someone is missing for literally 5 minutes. It makes no sense whatsoever, they clearly knew she was impulsive, she may not even have been suicidal, but the parents knew she would be the type of person capable of doing something this final without giving it proper thought.
even in death no one is listening to this poor girls cries. rest in peace queen, some of us see your struggle and sympathize.
Yeah, this case kind of pissed me off. It’s so painfully obvious that this was a suicide, I can understand that the family doesn’t want to accept that because it’s just way too painful, but at some point you’ve got to stop pointing fingers at people when there’s literally nothing to work with. And it was obvious by accounts by teachers and students that things at home were not great, there was AT LEAST one instance of physical abuse but also accounts from friends that the parents were not all that excepting of Tiffany being a lesbian. I think the fact that the credit card incident was so vague tells us all that we need to know, there were some choice words that in retrospect probably push Tiffany over the edge and I think deep down her mother most likely knows that, but can’t except it for obvious reasons. The real victim here is Tiffany, who even in death her cries of pain are being completely ignored by her family.
@@jellyjamese3134 accepting
@jellyjamese3134 You said it. Makes me cry for her and her family. The desperation in everyone is heartbreaking. 😢
I feel she took her life. As sad as it is. Her parents were not accepting of her sexuality, the mom was being abusive, she went through a breakup, then the whole stolen credit card situation could have just pushed her over the edge. It seemed impulsive and teenagers (hormones) can cause them to do very scary and impulsive things. We’ve all been there.
I just think it’s too elaborate for a murder and had she been on the tracks already, the train crew would have seen her. The investigation was absolutely botched though and I do pray her family gets closure one day.
Agree 100 %
Agreed
How was the mom abusive?
@@TheAtl198 the mum punched her and gave her bruises?
@@TheAtl198 Did you not hear the beginning of the video where they explained CPS getting involved with the family? I believe they said her mother lost her temper and punched her.
This was so *obviously* a suicide. The parents can't accept it and are in denial because otherwise they would have to consider how their own behaviour affected her mental health (including the mother being physically abusive!). It's psychologically easier for the parents to blame someone external than look at themselves and how they could have prevented this by accepting her for who she was and giving her the love and support she needed.
If a person chooses to end their life it’s their own fault, can’t put that on anyone else
@@Amanda.Marie40 Oh, come on. If you abuse someone physically and mentally and they become depressed and die by suicide, it isn't an unrelated coincidence. It was her choice to take her life, but she clearly never would have made that choice if her parents were supportive and loving. They are to blame.
She very clearly did it and I bet they’d argued. Look at those first images…she clearly had an argument and immediately left by herself. 1:20:57 The shoe thing isn’t suspicious at all…she took them off. There’s nothing suspicious about this case.
@@ClassicRiki Why would she take off her shoes and more importantly where are her shorts? How is it possible that they were never found?
@@soude85 shredded in the quarter of a mile she was dragged for. Her limbs were cut off, skull torn to pieces, and you think cotton shorts will survive?
My brother died by suicide via train. This was a hard episode to watch, but also relatable. It is hard to accept that our loved ones would make such a gruesome, permanent choice. Hoping her family can find some peace in the future.
Sorry for your loss
so sorry for your loss i can’t imagine ❤
That's really sad, so sorry.
There has been speculation and rumors that the family wasn’t as accepting of Tiffany sexuality as they claim, and apparently social services had gotten involved with the family as Tiffany claimed that her mother hit her. To me, I really think this girl was struggling and honestly it was a suicide, especially since her shoes were removed and found which is common among suicides. It saddens me that we don’t get the full picture honestly as I believe this girl was struggling under immense pressure.
I see that taking off shoes are common in Japanese culture, but I don’t think it is common in others.. I couldn’t find much on the subject for American culture and taking shows/clothes off. it’s weird because I felt the total opposite, the shoes and clothes being off are about the only thing that make me second guess a suicide.
@@reneec6297 Unfortunately it’s likely that the train ripped all of the items off her and scattered them all over the place. The shoes being where they were is kind of weird but I’m betting they were grabbed by someone on the tracks (homeless or otherwise) and then just forgotten where they were left.
Taking off shoes before a suicide is not common in American culture. I've never once seen or heard of it happening, and I've been a psychiatric nurse in the US for a decade.
I have no clue about America specifically but it is a thing in the western world as well. When being trained for a job at an elevated location where suicides take place from time to time (people jump) we were told to be alert for people taking their shoes off.
@@TheAtl198 Well, my father did so it happens.
I think that when she left her phone behind it was a definite sign she was done with this life
I can't imagine the grief the family is going through, but I think the police got it right. The fact that she was missing for five minutes and they were frantically trying to get ahold of her says it all
Missing where for 5 mins. I didn’t hear that part dammit😫
I experienced SI for over a decade, and really did believe that I would eventually die by suicide, but I still went on to complete undergraduate and master's degrees.
I remember thinking during that time that it was so irrational to be stressed about my school work when I "knew" I would be taking my own life any day now and school wouldn't matter, but I did the work and stressed about it anyway. I guess it was just a coping strategy to get through the day (or hour) -- more of a distraction than a reflection of how I saw myself in the future.
All this to say, I think it's a fair theory that Tiffany could have been experiencing SI and at the same time was making plans for her future. It's probably more common than people realize.
glad ur still here ❤
I really hope things have been easier for you. ❤
This is a case of suicide and a family unable to let go. Its very sad, the investigation wasn’t very good, but i understand why the police ruled it as suicide. The idea that she was kidnapped or killed is absurd. The driver saw her STANDING on the tracks.
Did he though? Made contradicting statements.if you put yourself in his shoes you could defs agree that a lot of ppl Would lie about that so they don’t lose they’re job due to paying zero attention and running over a dead girl laying on the tracks😂 I’m 50-50 on this being suicide. It’s not an easy one that’s for sure
@@Sebastian-km9qx They wouldn’t lose their job regardless because trains are incredibly difficult to slow down, there’s only so much the conductor and engineer can do. Everyone knows that. He had no reason to make contradictory statements.
Yeah in the Netflix show they kept suggesting she was forced in front of the train but I fully believe she would've been turned away from the impact as much as possible if that was the case. Definitely wouldn't have been seen standing up and diving in front of the train.
@@Sebastian-km9qxI've dealt with a lot of train calls and it wasn't the student with the different statements it was the lead conductor. The student was just off on the timing a little bit but that's regular human error when remembering something traumatic. And between the multitude of suicide by train incidents and just how deadly trains are they weren't facing any job loss no matter the situation so not a reason to lie there. I still go back and forth in my head about this one bc her life story is so similar to mine and I grew up just 2 hours north but was the same age. But years of being a first responder tell me suicide was the cause
He saw her once he was over her, Never said anything of her standing on the tracks.
My dad was a train engineer and killed 4 teens who tried to beat train and it destroyed him. I feel for the family and also for the engineers
Kendall and Josh. You BOTH look healthy and radiant. Such lovely people. Thanks for all you do.
One of her sisters doesn’t even speak to the mom and that says a lot. They’re definitely in denial as to what actually happened
How do you know that one of the sisters doesn’t speak to the mom?
@@Luciana-kj1xl I saw it on a Reddit thread. The user that commented it had confirmed they knew the family to the moderator with an ID and photos
As someone who lost my own son to suicide I can tell you even though I knew it was, I didn’t want to believe it and was so hard to except for me, my son even had plans to fly and visit us for Christmas and was so excited to meet his first and only niece by his brother who was being born on Christmas. Not saying this poor girl died by suicide and the family won’t except it but this is a hard one and very well could have
I’m so sorry for your loss. ❤
I am so sorry for your loss. Thank you for sharing your thoughts.
I'm so sorry about your son. Thank you for sharing with us. Sending you all the love. 💜
Sending you and your family love and light 🫂
I’m so sorry for your loss❤
KENDALL AND JOSH THANK YOU!! I remember requesting this case on Kendall's channel years ago. I grew up in Mays Landing and went to highschool the same time as Tiffany but I went to a private one in town. I've walked those same train tracks dozens of times. Her family has been fighting since it happened for awareness. To this day there are billboards on the roads in and out of May's Landing with Tiffany's face on them. No matter what happened whether suicide or foul play, awareness of cases like these is important. I appreciate everything you and the mile higher crew do!
I went o Hammonton high school!
I watched another video on this months ago. How do they account for finding shoes so far from the tracks? How and why would she walk that far with no shoes? The bottom of her foot was pretty pristine. Also very little blood given the horrific dismemberment... this points to the fact that she possibly wasn't alive when she was hit by the train. Just questions. 🤷🏻♀️
I'm from Egg Harbor Township and can attest to the fact that there is still signage everywhere regarding Tiffany's case. Almost 10 years later and signs are still up, crazy. Also, I completely believe that she was already dead before being placed on the train tracks, considering the aftermath.
@@Just_MHO_thomasina I think the other video must have reported incorrectly. One of her feet was crushed by the impact, and the other had some cuts, scrapes, and dirt. I also don't think she was walking on the gravel that long- if you look at a map of the area, most of the walking from where the shoes were found to where the impact site was part of a golf course, which would have been very soft to walk on.
@@Just_MHO_thomasina around the 1:04 mark, you can see a snapshot of her literally walking without shoes on
Just my 2 cents on the brother not telling how Tiffany died. I'm a respiratory therapist for 8 years, and when I found my grandmother unresponsive in our kitchen. I jumped into CPR, but afterward, I just couldn't tell my mom what happened. It's 100% different when it's one of your love one's.
I’m confused. What happened to your grandmother?
@@lauralange1384 probably nothing as traumatic as this. However it was her mother that she found dead and that alone made it traumatic.
I think it's massively unhealthy for the family to be 100% sure she was murdered. That tells me they are in denial badly
JOSH, I met you this past weekend at cafe rio! It was super rad meeting you! I absolutely love all you and Kendall do for families and getting out so many stories. You guys are absolutely amazing! ✌🏻😝✌🏻
Dude that’s awsome I’m jealous you met one of them lol
Was so cool to meet you! 😀
I completely agree that she deserved a more thorough investigation, but it seems this was a suicide. Her mother did not seem receptive to her friends claims that she was self harming, so I don’t find it hard to believe she is dismissing her daughters pain yet again simply because she doesn’t want to believe. Some people REALLY don’t understand mental illness or suicide so I think she would rather believe someone else hurt her daughter rather than accepting that she didn’t know her daughter as well as she thought she did and that she was capable of doing this.
Yeah. And honestly I suspect that no matter how thorough an investigation, the parents won't accept it. Super sad.
What are your thoughts about her taking her clothes off right before doing it, though?
@@HemlocktheCryptid as I recall, she presumably only took her shoes off. The rest of the clothes could have been ripped off during the incident.
I think there definitely could’ve been more investigating, but teenagers make snap decisions sometimes and tumblr was/is notorious for not monitoring suicidal ideation posts. I think this was most likely suicide. Overall tragic for everyone involved.
Why would she take her shoes off and neatly place them aside tho I wonder
@@Cinder_311 isn't there a Japanese custom to take off your shoes before offing yourself, entering the afterlife. for the same reason you take off shoes before entering a home, so you don't drag the mess inside ?
Not 100% I just thought I've heard this before
@@Cinder_311 why would some else do that? I doubt a homicidal maniac would remove someone’s shoes and neatly place them aside…
She was more than likely ripped from her clothes when she jumped in front of the train going 80 mph. The force of the impact can cause that to happen. I've actually witnessed this happen to a woman crossing the street who got struck by a car going about 50 mph. She flipped into the air and spun in the air and then landed and when she did her shoes and pants were totally off, panties pulled down to her ankles and shirt and bra pulled all the way up to her armpits. It's gruesome yet a fairly common occurrence to happen to someone who is struck that hard and fast by a large moving object with that amount of force.
@@Cinder_311 Maybe she wanted to walk barefoot, feel the ground beneath you one last time. Even if it did hurt to walk on the ground, as someone who has struggled with mental illness and self h*rm myself, I highly doubt the pain would’ve mattered in that situation if you are already in that level of a distressed mindset (in fact it might’ve even sadly been welcome).
In my opinion, Kendall was beating around the bush & didn’t want to show that she didn’t think it wasn’t a murder.
She is very respectful. I understand. Her and Josh always play different/roles & points of views.
From experience, my mother hit, punched and lashed out physically to me in my teens. It never just happened once and it messed me up. To this day I’m not over it at 42 y/o. When someone who is supposed to love you unconditionally is so quick to hurt you it effs up your psyche.
I'm so sorry you suffered through that
When they said her mom confessed to bruising her it definitely makes you wonder how many times it might have happened before 😖 I made another comment on someone else’s post about why she wouldn’t have left a suicide note for her parents but your comment makes me think she had a good reason not to.
The mother definitely loses credibility in my opinion after admitting to the whole hitting her daughter and bruising her situation
@@Poisonousivie bruising her. The mother admitted to punching her!
@@Poisonousivie wasn't she considering buying her mum a cat?
couldn't have been completely terminal.
She may not have set out to kill herself. Maybe she was fleeing the very uncomfortable situation of being caught stealing and mentally started to spiral about everything that had been going on. She heard the train coming because you can hear them from quite a ways away and seized the opportunity without thinking. It did say she was impulsive.
My house is about 200 feet from a railroad track and it runs along the side of my community. The quantity and diversity of items alongside the tracks is crazy. There's a decent chance that the stuff they found by the tracks are entirely unrelated. There's so much stuff.
For example, for whatever reason, some guy came into my community and left his entire backpack in the bushes by the tracks. I reported it to the cops, who picked it up. One item inside was....surprise...a towel...there was also a knife and some other sort of...survival related items you might expected someone to have who doesn't have a place to go.
That's true. Good point. I didn't think of that.
I have a question for you where her shoes were found could someone easily walk barefoot to the train tracks. That part of the case always bothered me.
@@sumaya776 It wouldn’t be easy, there would be a lot of dangerous debris and rocks. Totally possible though. Especially if she is in a really bad place mentally, she may have been damaging her feet and mot even caring cause her ultimate plan was suicide. Personally I feel she lost her shoes when she was hit and then a homeless person picked em up, thought they were gonna take them for themselves, then forgot or discarded them where they were found.
Same! I’m in Montreal. I’ve got commercial train tracks and urbain trains with a golf course too. Walking my dog in the past 12 years the amount of random and weird items I’ve seen… countless. Last summer found a half burned life size doll dressed in a police uniform. Few years back a neighbour walking his dog ended up finding a man hanging on a tree…
Police officer here. Just letting you know something for future information. The police don't always notify the family of a death. It depends on the county. If the police don't do the death notification, it's the responsibility of the medical examiner to notify the family. I'm not sure how they do it out where this death happened, but I just wanted you to know that a notification isn't always two cops knocking on your door at 3am to notify you.
Appreciate the insight, that’s so interesting. Even if ID is found on the body it would still be the ME?
idk the way they all instantly started calling and texting her panicking says a lot, they might have known more but just dont wanna admit it
Of course we don’t know for sure if she actually committed suicide, but the feeling I get from the family interviews denying that possibility (especially from her mother) is that they’re continuing to invalidate what she was going through in death just as they did in life.
Between calling her sexuality a “phase” and only taking her to one therapy session to address her tough home life, this girl’s struggles were being ignored. And now by denying the possibility that she took her own life, her family continues to do the same thing. Invalidating her from the grave. I also agree with others points that it’s very rarely only once that a child is hit in the home.
All this to say, two things can also be true at once. She could have been struggling and also been murdered. And this investigation was certainly botched and should be looked further into. But that doesn’t change the fact that her family appear to be in denial that suicide is possible. While they shouldn’t blame themselves, and it’s usually a combination of things that leads someone to that decision, I think we can all see it’s the most likely scenario. Although I can only imagine what they are going through and how tough it would be to admit.
I completely agree! Murder doesn’t even make sense in this case.
Totally agree with you. It saddens me that even her final decision to take her own life is not accepted by her family to this day. They keep dismissing her and invalidating what she was going through even after death. May her soul be finally free and in peace 🩶
There is a rainbow flag at her memorial bench. I don’t think it’s realistic to assume that her parents didn’t accept her sexuality, based off that one statement…
It was suicide in my opinion. I have strong doubts about the mom 'just walking' and suddenly finding the missing shoes. It wouldn't surprise me if she arranged for the shoes to be 'found' so she could galvanize the police into action.
plausible scenario.
creates a lot of confusion for the suicide theory.
This also crossed my mind. I was curious if anyone else wondered the same.
Damn never thought of that. If so she’s one manipulative bitch… that’s a great actor😂
Sadly I think this was a quick decision suicide .. she left her phone at the driveway because she just wanted to get away from everyone calling her. She left her shoes because maybe she bought them with the stolen credit card? She just kept walking/running because she was so upset and when she saw the train she made a decision to jump. Her clothes being missing I think is from the impact of the train.. people who get hit by just a car sometimes have their shoes fly off.. I couldn’t imagine clothes staying on after being hit by a train going 80mph. I don’t think she knew about the train , she was probably just so upset and walked that way and saw the train…
I think her parents are in denial , and the fact they blocked the friend is probably because they know deep down it was a suicide and are looking for people to blame .
Sadly it appears the only person responsible for Tiffany's death is Tiffany.
it can't be there more to the story then that.
The behavior of the family the evening Tiffany died backs up the suicide theory. When a young adult walks away after a fight with her bf most families are going to figure she simply needs time and space. This family appears to have gone into full panic mode, including texting Tiffany about not hurting herself. The family hasn't provided anything that would make me think murder.
Yeah this is how I feel. I went to sign the petition and the family lawyer literally mentions the uncle that ID'd her body made a statement to the responders on scene that corroborated her being suicidal but once the family said otherwise he tried to take it back.
My brother in law decided at the last minute to jump off a bridge a year and a half ago. He left his cell phone, car keys and wallet on his seat in the car so he could be identified right away.
I hope the family gets their answers soon. So heartbreaking.
Watched on Spotify but came over here to comment. I live 15 minutes outside of this area. I understand the parents need for answers, but unfortunately I think suicide is the correct cause. IMO of course.
I definitely agree. I feel absolutely horrible for her parents and understand their search for different answers. But I think that suicide or an accident is much more plausible than any kind of foul play.
Same especially after the críptic text “should I yes or no”
I agree 😢
@@Jadeikens that was the turning point for me. I can’t imagine what else that would have meant.
Gut feeling is that the parents, and mom especially, are just in very deep denial about Tiffany’s whole life and mindset leading up to her death.
As someone who has attempted on their life multiple times, I too had plans for the future but still wanted to be gone. I still seemed happy on the outside, I still was active in my community and my friend and family circles. We never know whats going on in someone’s life. It is so sad to me that the parents are so stuck on this.
glad ur still here ❤
@@elliemorrisette thank you friend, i am finally at the point of my life i can say i am too❤️
Girl, I’m so happy you’re here talking to us. Let’s be friends ❤
I was also told as a child by my mother that my sexuality was a “phase” and it’s still something I still think about frequently. This poor girl killed herself and the parents are just in complete denial that they fucked up with their kid and their treatment of her contributed to her suicidal thoughts. She needed some serious help… but perhaps the parents thought this was a “phase” too.
This right here! It might have been her rash decision, but their behaviour pushed her in that direction.
I took my daughter to counseling for self harm. The counselor talked to both of us together and each of us separately and and then at the end she spoke with both of us again. My daughter did open up with her alone, and spoke about things she wouldn’t speak about with me present.
I know it’s tragic and the family is probably in grief but I think she killed her self. They say that she wouldn’t have walked around naked or barefoot but she was hit by a train. Her clothes probably came off that way. They say she wasn’t suicidal or didn’t have mental health issues but her social media and friends say otherwise. She also just got into trouble for theft. I think it was an impulsive choice she made in that moment.
This was almost certainly a suicide. The parents weren’t supportive of her being gay and this is a tragic example of what that can cause. I feel bad that they are in major denial though.
This is such a horrific case but imo I really do think it was suicide. There are definitely things that should’ve been done in the investigation to rule out other options and to be sure of it but it’s hard to imagine it was something else. I understand it must be really difficult for the family to want to accept that your child may have been struggling and you didn’t see it but that is so so common when it comes to suicide. It’s easier to hide than people think. All love to the family and friends, this is a brutal and devastating thing to go through ❤
Seeing the Unsolved Mysteries episode I was dead set on something suspicious happened, foul play, etc. But watching this and knowing more details especially the Tumblr account has me thinking she did unalive herself
I watched it too. Completely agree, I thought it was suspicious too. I really hope that the family can find closure. My heart breaks for them.
My nephew got killed by a minivan. His boots flew many yards. Impact can definitely take shoes off.
Not for miles
I am so happy this case is FINALLY getting coverage! It is still widely talked about in the town, it's obvious to everyone who looks at this case that it was majorly screwed over by authorities. Justice for Tiffany and her family
My my dad had future plans and was doing really well and still killed himself… suicide is a weird thing
243 episodes and I swear I've watched a majority of them twice if not more, thank you guys for such good quality content all year every year, and as always, much love from Ohio! 💚
Thank you for all your support!
Poor police work here but unfortunately I think the cause of death is still suicide
The investigation was done very poorly. But it's so hard in these situations because the railroad stops for no one and with 2 initial witness statements, you're right, it's open and shut to them. I happen to know someone who jumped in front of a train. It was tragic. It was sudden. Sometimes people see an opportunity to end it all and take it. It doesn't matter if it's "scheduled". It's very possible she wasn't alone, and whoever was with her is scared to come forward. But I think it's also tragic that she was struggling and didn't have the support to get the help she needed. Of course, anything is possible. But teens can be impulsive.
Sadly this just sounds that the parents are in complite denial of accepting their daughter commited a suicide.
I know Janelle pivoted her career from what she thought she would be doing. However, i think it was meant to be that everything happened the way it did because now she is able to help educate us on a psychology side on a lot of cases including this one. Love you guys! Keep up the amazing work❤
totally agree!!! may not be a typical job for a masters in psychology, but i think it means a lot to have someone so qualified weighing in on the conversation or used as a resource. love you janelle !
I think the family is in denial. My Dad committed suicide when I was 12, and for years I thought no way, he wouldn't do that, only as I got older and starting remembering little pieces of the puzzle did I realise how depressed he must of been. Even years after I felt so much guilt that I missed the signs 😔
I'm sorry for your loss. The "would have, could have, should have" game is endless and you were a kid. That being said I do agree the parents sound in denial.
I think our society wants to blame somebody for every bad thing that happens, but sometimes bad things just happen and there's no one person or thing to blame for it.
I’m so sorry for your loss. I agree with the previous user though, you were just a kid. I know that might be hard to accept because of grief, but I wanted to at least reiterate that point. Hopefully… to alleviate some of that guilt ❤
When I was a teen, I tired to unalive myself. The only thing I wanted to do at that moment was to cause my parents as much pain as they had caused me. This makes me believe that this was a suicide.
This is truly so much better than the episode on Unsolved Mysteries. The authorities involved in this investigation really dropped the ball considering there was hardly an investigation at all. I hope the family receives answers that help them to find closure ❤️
Exactly! Idk something about them not being able to find the rest of her clothes is just chilling…
Thanks for covering. I'm still in the beginning but know you guys will paint a better picture than Unsolved Mysteries. I watched that episode shortly after it came out and this case has stuck with me ever since.
I strongly believe the parents are in a state of denial and refusal to accept that their child was unstable and unfortunately decided to end her life. There was no indication of r@pe and according to the timeline, it would be highly unlikely that there would have been time or opportunity for an act such as r@pe, murder and transportation of a body to the train track. I understand the frustration and how it would be very difficult to accept that your child or family member would choose "s" word. This doesn't excuse the rushed police work. I also understand the frustration there. But I do believe this is a case of denial on the parent's part. They were in denial of her sexuality, as the mother stated she believed was a phase, they denied her potential cutting, only had one therapy session, etc. Denial and refusal to accept reality, imo. Very sad situation all around. Just my opinion, of course.
I’m confused by the one comment about how she messaged her friend that night apparently, yet her phone was found in the bushes and was by the home the whole night?
This is why sadly if they did more of an investigation they could of gotten her cell phone records. This would show exactly when the phone was left at the house. It would of given more information and closure. They just ruled it suicide automatically. So they most likely didn't think they would get enough to get the cell phone records & data. They probably never even did forensics on the phone either, which also would provide more insight on any deleted videos, calls, messages etc.
They said the friend said that she heard that Tiffany messaged that to a friend that night. But it may have been a different night or never even happened at all. You know how people gossip.
The new cameras and lighting looking so good Mile Higher media💚 you guys bring it ever week across all platforms.
Parents in denial of the suicide, they can't accept that they saw the signs and that the poor girl had been calling out for help, with her actions at least. The lying, stealing, etc. would have been out of character ( you would think), she clearly wasn't mentally healthy. The parents have been selfish. Let that girl rest!!
Sometimes people feel content when they have decided to take their lives.
That's what I was thinking too.
Yes, that’s a major sign actually! Giving away your stuff and feeling happy all of the sudden are signs psychiatrists / therapists often recall with suicidal patients
When my husband passed to suicide, detectives came to our home and separated my 13 year old, my 15 year old and myself and interviewed each of us. As traumatic as this was for the three of us, it was a thorough investigation and it was an obvious suicide with my husbands case. Not sure why, in this case, there wasn’t a more thorough investigation.
I’m so sorry for your loss
@@alleyj826 thank you ♥️
My husband committed suicide by hanging and it was apparent. A thorough investigation was completed by the police regardless of the obvious nature. I wish everyone received that level of concern.
@@amyshull8263 this is the same method used my husband as well. I agree with you completely ♥️
@Phoebe Rhoades I'm sorry for your loss and that of your children. My husband and I only had one child, two at the time, and he has no memories; I'm sure teens have so many memories and heartache.
I love Kendal so much, her empathy, compassion and passion for victims and their families both on here and her own channel genuinely make me so happy, she's the sweetest, most genuine person out there and it just gives me so much hope in the world
I do think it was probably suicide but not planned, she'd just been found out by her mother and she was very overwhelmed. I think she ran off dumped her phone so no one could ring her. In that frame of mind my phone going off would really make me feel worse. She just went out trying to maybe clear her head and calm down but she saw/heard the train and the idea just stuck.
I think it's one of those cases with parents where they refuse to believe their kid was depressed because it means that they missed the signs and don't want to admit it.
I'm almost wondering if in an emotional break down she tore all the clothes off that she had bought with the stolen credit card :( I could see my young emotional self doing that. But at the same time it is weird .. I can see both sides
This is a very interesting thought! I can also see myself doing that as a teen.
I didn’t think of that either but I agree that would make logical sense. I wonder if they ever figured out what items of clothing she purchased on that credit card…
That was my very first thought. She took it off because she bought it with stolen credit card. 100%
I'm glad I decided to look for a second perspective on this case because _wow,_ Unsolved Mysteries totally had me convinced that Tiffany was kidnapped and murdered. I do think that her parents/uncles probably had a lot of say in how things were framed since they were the main people being interviewed, but yeah, 10 minutes into this podcast and it's pretty clear that her suicide didn't come _completely_ out of nowhere.
I can't believe they took the time to even air this on that show. Of all the unsolved cases that deserve another look THIS is one of the ones they pick? The most obvious "it was suicide" one of them all?
Thank you for advocating for us to sign. I do think that tragically it was a suicide, though there are some odd things, such as the shoes. But after thinking about a family not being able to try to exhaust all avenues in their search for understanding of the crushing loss of their daughter, that breaks my heart. So I have signed the petition. I appreciate you discussing the reasons why we should.
I am praying for this sweet family. ♥️
THANK YOU for shedding light on this case. it still doesn't sit right with me knowing some of the smaller details and the transit police definitely just tried to close the case as fast as they could. I hope some day the truth can come to light for Tiffany's family😢
One of my best friends in high school had a similar experience of not being told about his mothers murder. He learned about it through the news that showed up on the scene talking about a murder/suicide between ex’s before anyone even called him HOURS later. His mother was in surgery for an hour before she passed and he never had the chance to say goodbye because he didn’t even know.
Thank you guys for covering this case. I live 15 minutes from where this happened.
The rumor around here in Mays Landing is that the shoes are one of the items she bought with the stolen credit card. That’s why she took them off and left them
and then walked for miles over jagged rocks in bare feet
@@hotkeyafl when you’re depressed and feeling suicidal you really don’t care trust me
This was my very first thought. Makes total sense to me.
This case really has me frustrated - whether they speculate an accident, suicide or homicide there is NO reason for them to not test the axe, the knife, do the rape kits. Basically everything you guys said is so right. There were so many things overlooked, and even if it was a suicide, wouldn’t they want to be CERTAIN? The axe looked really sus to me. It could be a really bad coincidence it was there but it really stood out. It breaks my heart nobody will ever really know what happened to this girl unless there’s some sort of miracle. Despite the actions of her mother and their relationship, my heart still goes out to the whole family. I can’t imagine living everyday without knowing answers to how a loved one passed.
kind of a random theory, but what if it's both suicide and foul play?
Her friend argued with her about the credit card then left, her parents yelled at her and she ran off in distress. Maybe that friend and others picked Tiffany up in the car, drove her to rough her up physically/sexually/etc with her cell phone, shoes and headband being thrown and her shorts/shirt ripped by them. Tiffany either gets dumped near the train tracks still alive or she escapes their vehicle. This traumatic assault pushes her over the edge to just stay on the train tracks when the train comes.
As someone whose dealt with suicide attempts/mental health, you can for sure have future exciting opportunities planned and still want to harm yourself. From what her online history has said, to her family and friend issues, to her uneasiness with the future, maybe this event sent her over the edge mentally. Everything can snowball all at once.
this is something I've thought of as well
I was thinking something along the same lines as an option glad someone was thinking the same
After knowing how her mother was treating her, and how many times cps went to their house, I think she committed suicide. Her mother refuses to admit that she was upset, and they did not even bring it up in the Netflix episode. I believe she literally said that the ONLY thing her daughter had to be upset about was the credit card. What about you hitting her? What about you denying her sexuality? The break up? There were multiple things going on in this poor girls life and this was the last straw. Who knows what she said to her daughter in those final moments. Who knows what she threatened.
Although I’m young I lived next to AC my whole life and never ever heard about this and neither has my family. It wasn’t talked about enough. Thank you for spreading awareness
Mom of two here and 13mins in and these parents are deep in their denial. Not helpful at all. Too bad. RIP TIFF 💞🙏
The lighting is alot darker than it used to be.
Right? I thought I was imagining it, but it really seems darker.
Agreed. It's a nice set but it's a bit dark.
I’m around her age. As someone who was a depressed teen in tumblrs glory days there was a ton of su**ide glamorization and desensitization. Tiffany reminds me a lot of a friend who posted very similar things and was emotionally turbulent and ended up taking her life in a dramatic and public way as well.
In surprised an accident isn't a more talked about theory. I think it's much more plausible than a homicide.
When you are in catastrophic accidents where the body receives an unbelievable amount of trauma, clothes come off. Especially depending on how the body was found. There also might not have been...enough of her to complete a rape kit. Medical examiners, the ones who perform the autopsies, do not always make scene. A coroner will pick up the deceased.
I find it confusing why the parents would say that they don’t believe she was suffering with her mental health yet they all jumped and panicked really quickly when she walked off that night. It does seem as though they knew she was struggling and they knew she may try something extreme so they quickly had everyone looking for her.
I feel bad for them but it seems obvious that she made a rash decision that night after the argument.
You covered this in so many details...thank you. The set looks great but I found it to be way darker than usual. Maybe it's just my monitor?!?
The tweet, could it be "I shouldn't feel happy right now, but now that I've decided to (commit) I feel at peace"? It reminds me of my older Facebook posts from 13-15, and that is my first impression of it.
yeah. i thought exactly the same thing
Exactly. Even though I think it was impulsive and unplanned and an accumulation of stressors, I thought the same thing. She had the seed planted in the back of her mind.
My grandmother was hit by a train at age 19. She says that she was roofied at bowling. The engineer saw her lying across the tracks and pulled the brake, but the train still made impact. She survived after being freed with the jaws of life. After sustaining a broken skull, she was released from the hospital two days later. Much later in life, the engineer got in touch with her and they had a beautiful friendship before he passed away a few years ago. It's crazy to think how similar Tiffany's story is to hers 💔
Doesn’t doing very similar at all. Lol
Do they not get the impact a train would have on a teenagers body?? It’s gonna knock her shoes off and clothes. If her body was in pieces, her clothes would be messed up too.
thank you for all you do. you guys don’t know it but you are a huge part of my support system when i’m overwhelmed lol :) 💛
I think she was so upset she listened to that intrusive thought win.. just because you don’t have a “plan” doesn’t make you not suicidal.
Every train needs to have a camera on it recording! There are truly sooo many accidents. Many more than we know about because a lot are kept out of the news. If you notice, you rarely ever hear names of the employees because they are highly protected by the union.
I thought there were cameras on most trains, but maybe not back when this happened.
Best part of my week! Love watching you guys keep up the hard work you do everything so well
Thank you for covering this. This happened a few minutes from my house and I think about her every time I drive over those train tracks. I wish the family can get some closure soon 😞😢
A person that have been hit by a train usually gets recovered without any close on, it’s a strange phenomena as the close gets removed somehow during the collision. I have a family member who was a head of a passenger train and she had quite a few situations during nearly 5 decades on the job in which she had to recover bodies from under her train, and in all cases they were missing their clothes, it would be recovered all over the tracks. It’s horrific scenes for sure.
Exactly just Bc people do not know what does not make it unusual.
yeah but some clothes were found in places where it would be impossible for the train to cause it
@@hotkeyafl I think it was just the shoes and headband, which she could have taken off beforehand.