Kiesel vs. Ibanez Guitars - A Comparison...Hopefully Not a Literal Shootout
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 25 ส.ค. 2024
- A question that has ended friendships, destroyed comment threads, ruined marriages, crumbled empires, and caused continents to divide. I try to get to the bottom of the Ibanez vs. Kiesel debate, with an eye on the used $600~1200 range. Which will reign supreme?
I've owned many Carvin/Kiesel and Ibanez Prestige guitars over the years. Both are excellent, but there are sweet spots in the price for each one, especially on the used market.
Yes, I'm aware that Ibanez Premiums are cheaper and often have stainless steel frets. Two problems. One, I don't own one to compare, and two, I don't own one because I don't think they compete with the quality of Ibanez Prestige or Kiesel...at all. I've played a couple, and wasn't interested in what they offer.
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am i the only one that hears macaroni noises when he talks?
Yeah, he needs a drink of water badly!!!
😋. 🤣
HeroUnit210 Was that really necessary, helpful or relevant to this conversation?
Joshua Schmidt I found it thoroughly helpful. Really helped me decide which guitar I preferred
@@SchmirtleFirpOmPomWemgyulan yeah, hopefully it'll help this guy get a better microphone
There are several Ibanez premiums that come with SS frets around $1000-1300. But they are typically Indonesian made (which isn't a deal breaker for me). But if you're going to spend $1100 on a not japanese Ibanez, well you'd be better off spending $1300 on an american made Kiesel.
I've picked up a couple Ibanez Premiums and haven't been super impressed. The Universe Premium specifically was pretty disappointing. I'd be curious about a Premium AZ but I didn't want to spend $1300 to find out. But the fact that the base Kiesels are $1099, and cheaper on Reverb...pretty hard to argue it haha.
Their customer service sucks so much though. I'd feel more comfortable to buy a prestige for that 1300 price (Sweetwater will alway give discounts as well)
Coming from an ibanez guy,, I agree with you 110%. Keisel is a much better value. And I only like Japanese ibanez.. the rest are lacking in different ways.
I could be completely arrogant please forgive me... But this whole American thing is quite silly I feel .. lol. America has made cheap budget guitars so has Korea and Indonesia. On top of that my MIM strat plays better to me than my MIA. I really think this whole country of origin thing is kind of dumb for the most part... I have had terrible guitars from every country and have had great guitars from every country... America this America that...We still make garbage too man. Good stuff as well.... Asians are some of the best craftsman in the world. By the way Kiesel is a Semi custom shop....
@@realtruenorth I noticed that as well
Great video man. Hard to find good gear reviews/comparisons which are actually objectively critical of the products
Thanks dude. Both are awesome, but I think a $1000 Kiesel is pretty tough to beat. I've been seeing some ridiculously cheap Ibanez Prestige guitars on Reverb lately...hard to pick when you are comparing to a $500 Prestige. When comparing new prices, Kiesel is an easy win because even the Ibanez Premiums are $1000 now.
@@TheGuitarPit Yup, after watching this video I actually bought one of the new Kiesel crescents for around $1200. I was considering going for a cheaper prestige, but I thought I deserved something nice after playing on a budget schecter for 7 years.
@@celestialmonkey Awesome man, lemme know how you like it. I've been considering a Crescent or Aries with an evertune, but I'll probably have to order that next year.
I have never owned an Ibanez. I am lefthanded so I own both a Carvin CS6 and a Kiesel C6. This was an easy decision since Kiesel will easily allow you to customize a lefthanded guitar at no additional cost. I love both of my guitars
Where on earth is this man finding Ibanez prestige guitars for 6-800?
In 2018, before the virus of unknown origins, you could get an entry prestige model for about $800 bucks. It's hard to believe. I understand, but the used market during the bug drove used to new prices because there being more demand than the product. If you look at reverb price history most RG Prestige's made in the last decade they were going for under a grand and even now you can find say an RG655 Prestige for about a grand and that will probably drop substantially by this time next year.
Why is there even a comparison? Keisel is purely custom shop it wins every time.
Eh, old Japanese Ibanez guitars are respected for a reason. They're incredible values used. But yeah if you're spending $1200+ I'm team Kiesel all the way. We'll see after NAMM though, looks like Ibanez is stepping up their game a bit.
Kiesels are ugly as sin
Yes
Why have a comparison? Because people like you blindly choose winners without real facts or reasons.
i ts a waste of time for me to watch this
I won a rare 2001 s370 Ibanez. It's my first Ibanez and man I love it. The guy I won it from is a serious luthier. I could tell when I got it. Deep cleaned and restored. The thing was oiled and cleaned so well it's like new. Eric C TH-cam channel. Great Guy. Thanks man. Awesome show. Both totally nice.
I was an Ibanez fan for 20 years, had at least 15 Ibanez (premium, prestiges, team j
Craft...) until I get a Kiesel.
They are different products, Ibanez is an standard guitar that could make happy everyone, but Kiesel is for someone who knows exactly what he wants.
I'd rather a flat fingerboard than a thicker neck to shred, and Kiesel has 20" fingerboard option. Otherwise, since I taste the hipshot tremolo+locking tuners, get rid of all double locking Ibanez tremolos. No one was as stable and smooth as the hipshot. The only ibby tremolo worth mention is the original lo-pro, modern ones are garbage.
The ibanez stock pickups aren't very pleasent either, unless you get one with real Dimarzios.
At same price point I choose Kiesel period.
Yeah, the lo-pro rocks... I mentioned it in my Universe review. Thanks for sharing your experience!
same. All Ibby prestige until I took the plunge to Kiesel. Ibanez Prestige are amazing guitars, still have my PWM100, but Kiesel's just play sooo beautifully, not to mention they're gorgeous in most cases.
Well I should feel glad I picked up a Vanquish for $400 lol.
I love ibanez too, never tried kiesel..but yeah, i kinda agree with the ibanez pickup things
Ibanez s-series has a wonderful s521 model: it has a fixed bridge, it does not look 1:1 as RG, it is super light, and it's very affordable. I bought one to be a kind of "work horsie": one can travel with me, and one I'm not afraid to scratch. And it's now the most played of my guitars. The author totally needs to check it out.
Owned a Prestige. Sold it to get a Kiesel, and very happy I did. The Kiesel standard neck with oil finish is probably the nicest I've ever felt. The Ibanez Wizard neck was way too thin for me, you almost have to alter your normal hand positioning to accommodate the thinness. I found it awkward, and it certainly didn't help me play any faster for what it's worth. Wasn't really wowed in any other regards either, the Dimarzios seemed to lack clarity to me, edges of the locking nut were sharp.
I used to be a die hard thin neck guy, but I've slowly drifted towards the thicker ones. Kiesel first, then PRS...now I'm thinking my Friedman neck is my favorite, and that thing is pretty thick. DiMarzios have never been my go-to pickups, but I like the Crunchlab and Liquifire in the JP6.
Yeah u are damn right since i was a beginner i want ibanez.. I am a strat user till i brought one ibanez i fully regret my decision Ibanez is no longer for me as i fully developed my skills and plays Jazz fusion.. it is so hard on the neck because of the neck.. Ibanez is big no no for me.. I am planning to buy one kiesel guitars I wanna know if the neck is as thick as strats or Gibson please hear my answer thanks
I would say the Kiesel standard neck is something between a strat my neck and the Ibanez Wizard neck. Not too thick or too thin. They do offer a thicker neck profile as well if you wanted something closer to a strat. I’m sure the sales guys could offer more guidance.
@@mikefairbanks5575 Thanks Man Its fine as long as its thinner as my current ibanez Guitar thanks man i am planning to buy osiris or zues..
Kiesel has several pickup options. The Beryllium pickups are a more classic sound. And they will install your choice of pickups as long as they have the right form factor.
Ibanez doesn’t have a custom shop option online. Ibanez does allow custom models but only by an endorse if I’m correct. Kissel gives you more freedom. They allow built models and custom models.
Yeah that's probably true. Do they even have those Ibanez USA customs anymore? I know they did forever ago, but I can't remember seeing one in the last 10 years. Either way, it'd be insanely expensive if they did have the option.
I don't know how I have not seen this video yet Chris.. this is exactly the comparison I was just googling and you already covered it! Thanks man!
One of my older videos :P Now that Ibanez has some SS frets and high end pickups in their new models, maybe they can get back to competing...but the price is still crazy high. Maybe once the new models are on the used market? Until then, I still think Kiesel wins :P
I don't think that I've ever heard anyone do a review playing Devin Townsend riffs,so kudos to you !
Thanks buddy!
Chris, your channel is super underrated. Any time you put out new content, I know its going to be great!!! :)
Thanks man, appreciate that!
Call me a KIESEL fanboy, but IMO, they blow away any Ibanez. I owned an Ibanez Jem 777 LNG #360 and sold it. It sounded fine, but cheap construction. Basswood body. Dented so easily. YES, I played it!! I own another Ibanez and sold it to. Finally I made the call to KIESEL and ordered a Kiesel Crescent. Best guitar I've ever played! Sounds, feels and looks amazing! Quality AMERICAN MADE craftmanship! BUY A KIESEL!!
I am an ibanez owner and fan, but i have no doubt Kiesel is a better guitar and plan on joining the family soon.
I myself am waiting on tax season and once I get my tax money I'm definitely calling Kiesel.
Basswood is terrible. Bad foundation makes bad guitar. I have an rg7, great neck. Body wood just a little better than balsa. My kiesel alder OM8 with Fishmans is the top level axe period.
Andy James' sig model is basically a crescent. You know it has to be good.
I simply get over how some companies will charge so much money for a basswood guitar?
Neck shape and feel is huge, can’t overemphasize that. I loved my lower end S series for many years. Picking up any non wizard neck felt like a baseball bat for about a year. Eventually switched to PRS and recently bought a Kiesel Zeus. Absolutely different price ranges, but the fit and finish on Kiesels seems hard to beat. Nice video, and thanks for taking the time to compare and state when subjectivity came into play.
I was a die-hard thin neck guy for YEARS. Grew up playing an Ibanez JS100 and EBMM JP6. But slowly I've been going thicker and thicker. Lately even the Friedman necks are feeling good to my taste, and they are what I would have considered a baseball bat neck 10 years ago. Tastes change, I guess! The thinner stuff cramps my hand pretty quickly now.
@@TheGuitarPit See for me the thicker ones cramp my hands!
This is going to be a long post:
I had the original Ibz RGA 121 in 2006 or 07 I can't remember. It was a team J-craft guitar and for the most part it wasn't bad, AFTER I modded it. The guitar was capable of being dependable with a few changes. There was side to side play in the bridge. I eliminated the play by wrapping paper around the post where the bridge fits on, and then saturating that with some super glue, and that tightened the fit of the bridge right up. I also had the neck glued on in addition to the bolt-on screws. The guitar was really solid. It stayed in tune like no other guitar I ever had. I'd play it hard, do shows, do practices.. and leave it on a stand, come back a week later and it was still in perfect tune. I am a perfectionist when it comes to being in tune, and if it were even slightly out of tune, I'd tune it before playing it. It was a solid, stable, and rigid, dependable and easy to play guitar. I loved it.
The downside, the bridge was made of brass. Over the years the bolts bent forward under the string tension, requiring me to adjust the setup from time to time, until they bent far enough that it was done. I tuned at the time to D standard with 9 gauge strings, this should not have ruined the guitar. The model was discontinued the next year, so replacement parts were not available while I owned that guitar. BRASS is a bad idea for guitar parts, period.
I replaced it with an RG1451 Prestige in 2010 or 11, can't remember. I always liked the RG shape with the pickguard - it was the one thing I didn't like about the RGA, that the RGA was an arch top and couldn't have a pickguard. I also liked having the middle position single coil pickup. The 1451 looked like it should be an equal performer to my RGA, but it wasn't, it was a total lemon. Despite having what looked like a well designed bridge the 1451 would not stay in tune to for even one measure of music. There were issues all over this guitar. The nut wasn't aligned with the frets, there were high frets on the fretboard, the bolt-on neck was unstable, and the bridge was unstable too.
Let me tell you what it took to get this 1451 guitar fixed. It took me from 2012 until now to finally figure out how to fix all of the problems. I had a create tools that would allow me to correct the nut cut at the end of the fretboard. I remounted the nut and it turned out perfect. I got that job done in 2016. I had been working on tools to redo the string nut, and correct the scale length. Stew-Mac has a calculator for giving the exact measurements and this helped a lot. In addition to the tools I made, I also had to buy a surface plate so I could get the contact surfaces of the nut absolutely FLAT. So, in a way I started building my own workshop. After I fixed the nut I leveled/crowned/polished the frets.
I found that the bridge of the 1451 didn't sit flat, I leveled the bottom of the bridge on my surface plate, and reworked the mounting screws and I was able to stabilize the bridge. The guitar still, would not stay in tune. I had the neck glued on and it was still not stable in the pocket, so I decided to completely mod this part of the guitar. I bought a router, made some templates, bought the wood I needed, and I rebuilt this neck pocket. Some changes I made, are that the neck now sits a slightly higher than it did originally, and the tilt back angle was reduced. Even with this rebuilt pocket the neck was unstable, and I figured out that the neck heel making contact with the body at the very back of the pocket was interfering with it. So, I repositioned the neck, filled/redrilled the mounting holes, and pinned it in using steel rods. Anyway the guitar works now. I had to teach myself how to do all of this.
If you think the 1451 being a lemon was a fluke, it wasn't. A few years ago I tried the RG651. It was even more unstable than the 1451 used to be. My first 651 would come out of tune while I was tuning it. I couldn't get all 6 strings in tune at the same time. I returned it, and the second guitar that I exchanged it for had the exact same trouble. One thing I noticed was that I could fit a .50mm pick between the body and the neck because the rout was so poorly done on both guitars. Those are gone now.
3 Ibanez non-tremolo lemons in a row, is NOT CHANCE.
I've been playing on non-tremolo guitars since running into stability problems with floyd rose style locking nuts. Just about everyone I complained to turned a deaf ear and started criticizing my playing habits, as if they knew what my playing was like. "Oh you're just not cut out for Floyds". Ibanez themselves never responded. I've had several guitars that I threw the locking nut in the trash. I replaced the FR nut with a bone nut, removed most of the old nut platform, and rebuilt it to accept a Kahler "locking nut" behind the string nut. This was like how it was done in the 80s. IT WORKED. A little paint to hide the repair, and it was finished. Yeah, I just have bad technique... hah. Guitars I modded like this were a Jem, one 90s era Korean RG, and a 2000s BC Rich Warlock.
I love the basics of the Ibanez RG's design, but the hardware, and structural integrity of these instruments has cost me time and money. I suppose though, they inspired me to learn how to fix stuff, not that I should have had to. I just want to buy and play on stuff that works. Ibanez does not do that for me. They (to my knowledge) haven't even started putting graphite or carbon rods in the necks yet. IMO They cut corners with cheap parts and materials and too many guitars leave the factories suffering from hidden defects from poor workmanship and cost cutting measures.
I still have another RG, a 321 that has (SURPRISE) an unstable neck pocket that I'll be working on. I love the feel of these guitars, and the shape, and the design features, but they're all crap to me. I don't even think Ibanez cares. Why should they care when countless people of questionable talent buy their junk and love it. I'm sure they love those profits. Just once, I'd like to buy something that needs NO SURGERY to get it working right. I am interested in Kiesel, after seeing the one sent to Rob Scallion they left quite an impression on me.
Wow, thats incredibly unfortunate to hear. I doubt I am a perfectionist on the same level as you, but I do feel like you must have also had an unheard of bad spree of lemons. I really did enjoy my RGA321. Never an issue with it whatsoever. For floyds, I just don't have the patience to deal with them. I find them too fussy to get perfect, and never want to deal with string changes or action or gauge changes. It's just more than I need, so I'm better off skipping it.
You may find better luck with Kiesel. I'd recommend you check out the Aries or Delos. I've had both and they've been stable, lovely guitars to play. I've also had a Vader, DC600 JB100 and CS3. All of which were solid, but the Aries and Delos really appealed. I don't love Kiesel stock pickups, but you can always mail Kiesel a set to have preinstalled on your build.
@@TheGuitarPit The Headless X series looks appealing. I like the idea of the stainless steel frets and the 0 fret.
With what I've learned, I should be employed in the industry, IMO :)
I watched your live videos, you're good. But as someone who has always found Ibanez to be reliable, I have to say maybe you had some bad batches? They may not do it for you anymore, but they sure look good on you :) Hahahahahaha..
@@emberofparmenides Well, I appreciate your compliment. Thanks.
Great video man. Helped me a lot in my decision
Omg the lip and mouth smacking with headphones is soo stressful lmao 😂
I think the biggest difference is going to be the neck construction. Not just profile. But the Carbon fiber rods in the Kiesel are going to help that neck with stability.
And of course, the Kiesel finishes are going to be top of the line.
I appreciate that Devin riffing ;)
Thanks buddy!
I have not played an electric guitar in probably 15 years. My poor Ibanez is in deep deep storage. Your review was well done and ideas well represented, but in terms of sound, to my ears, the kiesel sounds like an ibanez holding it's nose. Super nasal and strangled. But hey, great thing about guitars, we have huge choice and something for everyone.
Regarding your point about wiring: Kiesels and Ibanez's have the exact same 5-way switch. Compared to my 2019 RG Prestige, my 2016 Kiesel Aries's wiring was wayyy sloppier. Still both great guitars, also great video! You hit just about every point on the head.
Can't wait to order my first kiesel...awesome custom guitars
Good luck with that.
Well I definitely have a love/hate relationship with Ibby's, there are things I like about them, and things I really hate. I still have a heavily modified RG7620 ( built a brand new neck, changed to locking tuners, changed pickups, refinished the body, brass block for lo pro edge, tremol-no), it kind of is a consensual abusive relationship lol. I don't play it as much as my kiesel, but I will never sell it since I put so much into it.
A lot of things in this comparison are correct, but I believe the majority of Ibanez guitars come with jumbo frets. Ibanez guitars are way cheaper than Kissel, a decent Ibanez could come as low as $700 and even the prestige series normally maxing out at $2000, while Kissel is looking at $2000 for some of the lowest end stuff and normally around $3000 for a guitar with comparable specs to an Ibanez in the $1500-$2000 range. Of course I’m saying this all 3 years after the video, so that may be the reason for the inconsistency.
I want to choose between them but i think Kiesel guitars are better. Thank you for making the comparison!
Yeah, depends on what you're looking for. Both are great, but for $1200 I'd go Kiesel :)
Why would you spend $2000 for an Ibanez Prestige when you could build a custom made Kiesel guitar?
To be totally fair I think the Ibanez AZ prestige earns it. It had the features are on the same level. But my main point in the video is I don't think a $1200 prestige has features that beat a $1200 Kiesel. I've owned a couple of both and don't really think the lower end prestige models are worth $1200. If they're used and $650, then they look pretty damn good.
I used to play Ibanez guitars and I can't even compare them with Kiesel. And on top of it the quality of Ibanez went downhill. I liked the older models from 15 years ago.
I think the RGA321f is one of the best Prestiges ever, so I think this was a pretty fair comparison. I didn't have the AZ when I made this video, but they aren't really in the same category or price bracket.
I mean you have to choose between their pick up options but yeah.
@@PaulKingMetal Hey I agree with you my older Ibanez guitars are shitting on the newer ones....
Hi, I have a question, which guitar is better to buy, because of built quality? I like 3 brands IBANEZ RG Series , Schecter and well the KIESEL too Ibanez and Schecter have cheap models, but I don't know about the Kiesel cheap models these guitars are expensive.
Indo made is always a dealbreaker for me. I’ve had too many issues, but they’re great instruments fwiw. I gotta say kiesel/carvin is the superior option.
Ibanez thin necks are really great for Ibanez 7 string guitars. It’s really sick to have on extended range guitars but 6 string guitars with thicker necks are usually also pretty good
Nice Heavy Devy riffs
That kiesel is gorgeous
Sooo comfortable too. Aries is a really cool model. I intend to order a new one in a bit.
@@TheGuitarPit siiiick
On your point about Ibanez and bridges, they have always made a fixed version of pretty much all their guitars in every range. I get the floating trems might not be everyone's thing, but I think
it stops being a factor if you own multiple guitars. The prestige's (some premiums) have been using "proper" Dimarzio pickups for a few years now. That't generally the Tone Zone and Air Norton, but as you've mentioned that also offer bare knuckles. As far as variety, well they do make more than just the RG. The S, ARZ AZ, Iceman/Fireman. Since you've mentioned used, the old discontinued SZ guitars are more akin to a PRS style. They're fixed bridge, with a shorter scale, fatter smaller radius neck, and Seymour Duncans.
I had the Tone Zone and Air Norton in an RG652AHMFX. I thought they sounded alright, no better or worse than the RGA's DiMarzios or a set of Lithiums. And sure, they make plenty of hardtails, but when you're looking at the used market I'd say the majority of them are floating. Never checked out an SZ, I'll see if I can track one down some day.
Hi, so went back in time and played an RG550 and love that neck.... I wish there is a Kiesel with a similar neck :(
Kiesel Thinner profile is close but the Ibanez is both thinner and wider I think still.
Good video dude thanks
Very informative review, thank you for that, since I´m in the market for a new guitar, and was leaning towards Ibanez, but seeing this review and seeing several youtubers leaving Ibanez and ESP/LTD for Kiesel makes you think twice. Could you also make a test/review on fanfrets vs normal? Keep on the good work :)
Thanks, and you bet. It's on my list, I'm just waiting for a half-decent fanned fret guitar to have a good price. I've never played a multiscale so I'm curious about them too.
I'll add a note about the floyd rose options as you aren't into them. The Ibanez edge is superior to the floyd rose. It has replaceable knife edges, a pop in arm that you can adjust the tension on, and the components are made of similar alloys. Ibanez has the better trem system. BUT, it doesn't blow the floyd rose away. They are close so I would not make my decision based on which trem it has. I'm like you, I'd pick based on the neck and if it has the floyd or the Edge it's going to do what you need.
Yeah I think the lowpro edge on my Universe is the "best" floyd system I've played to date. I still don't love it though :P
That silver kiesel is so sick, where can I find it on internet, I want that exact shape man, so beautiful.
I'm a left-handed guitar player. Finding instruments to just try is a challenge at best. I live near metro Detroit Michigan. I was lucky enough to find an Ibanez J-custom. I really like the double locking trem system. I wasn't sure about the neck profile (fender style player for years). I like it a lot now. I'm thinking about having a local builder make a neck thru for me. I have some wants that are not likely to be found. I will do some research on Kiesel, and try to locate a dealer near me.
Awesome comparison man. Detailed and informative 🤘
Hahaha, I thought I was the only that would verbally point out the comfortable feel and sound Kiesel pickup selectors make. So smooth and...well, "thlunky"
Everyone loves a satisfying switch or knob! :)
I have to tell you after watching how Kiesel's are made I would almost immediately in every case gravitate to the Kiesel guitars. One feature i absolutely LOVE is the FACT that Kiesel uses 2 carbon fiber shafts on each side of the truss rod! You had forgot to mention that point.
I mean nobody wants to mess with the truss rod. So having 2 carbon fiber shafts to keep that neck straight is an extremely cool thing. Another thing that's standard on Kiesel guitars is glow in the dark dots ( fret indicators ) along side the fret board/top of the fret board if you're looking down at the guitar.
Plus Kiesel is American made that seals the deal right there. And get this I have like 3 Ibanez guitars 0 Kiesels. That's gotta change! I just heard about kiesel guitars not to long ago which is why I don't own one yet.
Check out my recent Delos review, or my older Aries review. Both are crazy good guitars. I also have a JB100 video. Every single one of them are the best bang for buck in their segment, easily. The pickups aren't great, but you can send Kiesel whatever pickups you want to have put in. I'd recommend you check one out, with pickups of your choice.
The Guitar Pit are the Seymour Duncan pickups on the jb100 not great?
@@maxloyd9682 Mine was strangely spec'd with Lithium pickups, so they sounded...lithium-y. Not my favorite.
Love the finish on the Kiesel one (I believe it is a A6 Aries?) If yes, can you share the finish options that were used?
Correct. I have a video review on it. It's an A6 from a Kiesel run, so it's pretty simple. Maple neck, ebony board, antique swamp ash finish, and the previous owner installed Bareknuckle Holy Divers in it.
I just wanted to say thank you very much for the comparison.
I am putting together a Kiesel build right now, but knew nothing about their necks and was having a tough time finding out what I wanted to know. I have an Ibanez MBM (hardtail) with a custom neck profile which is basically a Wizard III. I have no problem going a little deeper, but the Kiesel standard necks looks almost like a 60s Fender, which is too deep.
Now I know I want the thinner neck profile. It was a big decision, so you helped me out a lot. Thx again.
Thin sounds like the way to go if you want something more on the Ibanez side of things. I woudn't say their normal neck is thick though, still fairly thin. I recently ordered the "thicker" profile on my HD6 and I'd say that's starting to get fairly big :) Stop by my discord if you want to chat about builds, lots of Kiesel fans in there! discord.gg/KjWzGpx
Hey cool vid, nice to hear some dev / ziltoid tunage in the sound clip, I've played ibanez for 30 years I'm curious about kiesel
I own several Ibanez guitars: 1 from every range (from an MIK RGT42 to a one off J.Custom spot model). I also own a Kiesel, and a second one is currently being built.
The AANJ of Ibanez is the best neck joint on a bolt on for high fret access. Kiesel's neck joint is not bad, though. However, Kiesel offers many Neck Thru, Set Thru, and Set neck options as well which will have even better neck joints than the AANJ.
Stainless steel frets, plus luminlay side dots as a standard feature is a huge plus for Kiesel. Their thin neck profile is PERFECT for comfort, in my opinion. And the option for locking tuners and strap locks from the factory is another HUGE plus.
I still give my Ibanez guitars a lot of love, and prefer their body shapes. The Edge and Lo Pro Edge are my favorite trem systems.
But that said, Kiesel offers kick ass guitars, made to your specs, for less than what youll pick up a J. Custom for.
And for anyone wondering, the quality of my J. Custom and Kiesel are about the same. I may still buy an Ibanez from time to time, but I already have my next 2 Kiesel builds planned.
I also own a Suhr Modern Custom (made for me, original owner). The quality of the Kiesel is very close to the Suhr, except the Suhr has a better fret polish and setup out of the box. The neck pocket is also better fit on the Suhr. But the Suhr was twice the price ($4300). Kiesel makes a damn good guitar for the price. I used to not be a fan, but then I finally ordered one and it sold me on them.
I will also say, despite the fact that the Suhr was PLEKed, the Kiesel's frets are just as level and had one of the best fret jobs on any guitar Ive owned. Sure, they're not as pretty as a J. Custom, but they play better IMHO.
Great comment. I have nothing against Ibanez -- I just bought an Ibanez AZ. I think they're both great guitars. But if you're on the used market @ the $1000 price range, I think a Kiesel is the way to go. Like you mentioned, they both have pros and cons but the value you get out of the Kiesel models is hard to beat. And wow, a $4300 Suhr...that's brutal. I'm curious how it compares to the Ibanez AZ prestige, but I don't have one to compare it to.
@@TheGuitarPit I'm curious how the AZ and Suhr compare as well. When the AZ was announced I had just put in my order to have the guitar built, so I had to pass on the AZ for the time being. And unfortunately no shops near me stock the prestige AZ.
But again You shouldn’t be comparing a guitar that is mass produced against a custom made
I have had many Ibanez guitars and and still have an Affirma bass and all good experiences. However, my Carvin and now Kiesel Leia are all I want to play. They just feel so much better and the tones from the Mahogany and flame maple top on the Carvin and Swamp Ash with maple neck through on the Kiesel, both neck through, just sustain for days. Amazing craftsmanship.
Kiesel has been coming out with some REALLY hot guitars. I have yet to play one, but im stacking my dough! 😉
Heck yeah. I think my next one will be like Larremore Music's Aries, but with an Evertune! th-cam.com/video/ypWCGHXe69U/w-d-xo.html
Another great video Chris! Keep it up brother.
Thanks buddy! Crankin' these things out!
Great video! I just can not digest that tuning it defeats all melodic elements from music , Kiesel guitars are beautiful but the price not so much
I'd love to know how the Kiesel neck compares to the SG with the '61 profile! Any ideas? Do a comparison video of those two!
I'd assume the Kiesel is thinner but I've never owned an SG. Maybe someone else will see this and get your question answered.
The regular Kiesel neck carve(not the thinner) is actually not far off from a 61 SG carve, its thinner but not shreddy thin.
I primarily play bass. Ibanez by far makes my favorite mass produced basses. Their boutique shop series is excellent.
For guitars, I've never been a super fan of Ibanez. I just don't get why the guitars feel much worse than their basses.
I have a Kiesel guitar too (Zeus). It just sounds great. Easy to play. It's also hard to argue against how customizable it is.
Since it's been 4 years and ibanez are basically championing the AZ line as their main goose I gotta say they both have their individual strengths. I love my AZ because the neck is insanely comfortable and it's really versatile in its tones. Like they made one of the best all arounder guitars that still have a unique personality. While keisel just continues to excel at what they've been doing for years. .
Ibanez doesnt slag off their customers when they have a qc issue and complain.
Is that a good or bad thing 😂
oh are you sure about that stainless steel frets on kiesel guitar, Jeff kiesel did say they used a aloy that was somewhat between nickel and stainless."the best of both worlds aloy" :-) but maybe not on all their guitars.
In fact, Ibanez is pushing SS frets in every prestige Line, also, they all started to came out with Duncans and Dimarzios after 2014. There's also the Premium line, which comes with SS frets and Dimarzios for a lower price.
That's true now...wasn't last year. As it stands, you can get a Kiesel Delos for $1049 and a Ibanez AZ Prestige for $1999. They're pretty similar, but I think the Ibanez has slightly better pickups. The premium indonesian guitars don't compete with Kiesel, at all. Not on the same level. Either way, right now Kiesel is generally cheaper, similar features, and their pickups are pretty meh. Can't really go wrong with either, depending on what features you want.
Have you tried sticking a Zippo lighter casing in-between the bridge block and the body on an Ibanez bridge? I was having stupidly bad tuning issues with my Ibanez S and now I tune once a week if I play a lot. If it's on the back burner then I don't have to retune.
I have a Kiesel Aries with 2 double coils and a single coil between them, all Lithium. With just a 5-way switch and single tone and volume control the tonal versitility of this layout is amazing! The pots in Kiesel guitars are of excellent quality; clear, quiet, solid, and effective throughout their entire range of rotation. With that in mind, to some that may dislike the Lithium pickups, I'd recommend dialing back both the tone and volume knobs a bit and then reevaluate your opinion of them. I find that I am able to dial-in tones similar to many different guitar makes, various genres, and eras of music. While the Lithium humbuckers are pretty "hot'' passive pickups overall, (my bridge position sounds nearly as dirty as the Dimebuckers I have in other guitars) they have a very broad band of usable and differing tones available when compared to most guitars/pickups I have experienced.
Yeah, Lithium pickups seem to be hit and miss with most folks. I had good luck with them, but it probably depends on what you're looking for. Worst case, you can have Kiesel install whatever pickups you want, if you supply them. You still get a USA custom shop guitar for a fraction of what it costs elsewhere.
I have an aries with the same setup and its my favorite guitar rn, i also have a ct6 with lithiums and a cs3 they are all amazing guitars
Love the Predator sights at the Kiesel admittance lol. Great, honest comparison.
Ha, yeah...I'm honestly a fanboy of both brands. Just trying to be honest and avoid those comparison videos where the final verdict is "uhhh i dono!" I do know, but it's *my* opinion. Other people can make up their own minds :)
Where did you get those flamed pickup covers on the Kiesel? I don't see anything like that in their humbucker lineup.
They are bare knuckle holy diver pickups with the burnt chrome finish.
@@TheGuitarPit Nice. I was going to say it doesn't look like they have much in the way of options on their site for pickups. I've moved toward ultra-clean humbuckers. Right now I have Lindy Fralin Pure PAFs in my little green Ibanez RG and even when I take it to jazz jams everyone says it sounds great. I think they are 7-8k output but I think that's the type of humbucker EJ used on Cliffs of Dover. I don't understand the prominence of these modern ultra-high output pickups that sound flat and plastic on the clean channel. All the modern shred guys use them and cover up how bad they sound with a shit ton of reverb and delay.
@@AlexHand Yup, I'm with you on that. Exactly the same. Usually I've been preferring the PRS 85/15's, 58/15LT's, or Suhr Thornbuckers. Arcanes are great too. Kiesel has a bunch of options (you have to call) but 95% of them are very modern. I'd just send them a pair to install while it's being built, honestly. I used to have Bare Knuckle high output stuff in almost everything. Now I only have 1 guitar with them left.
the Jason Becker hummed like fuck
6:24 Autotheist: Deconsecrate - The Facless, right before the solo and 6:56 Hyperdrive - Devin Townsend. Did I get it right!?
You are correct, even with my poor playing of each haha. :)
But there are other great options too, MusicMan, Cort, Jackson, Charvel...
If you want jumbo stainless steel frets and slightly thicker neck than Ibanez ho with a Jackson for a lower price point than a Kiesel.
I’m a fan of the Wizard neck, but then again I really love the Jackson Fusion neck which I think might be even thinner.
I am not a fan of burl finishes at all and both Ibanez and Kiesel have a ton of guitars with a burl finishes, I just think it makes a guitar look like you made it out of an cabinet or dresser or some shit like that, some of em are very pretty though. I do like the look of some of the Kiesels but I have always been an Ibanez guy RG 550 all the way, there is just something about that guitar that just keeps me mesmerized, maybe it's just because of it's craftsmanship, hell I just like it, I guess that's really what it comes down to.
I have an Ibanez Prestige with the super wizard neck, jumbo frets, Dimarzio pickups and Edge tremolo, birdseye maple fingerboard and ash body, as well as two custom shop Kiesels, one with the older WIlkinson and another with the new Kiesel/Hipshot tremolo. The two things I like about the Ibanez are the 5 way switch, where you don't get the single coil noise, but rather humbuckers in parallel or serial, etc., whereas with the Kiesel you get the old-fashioned settings with that god-awful single coil noise, and the Edge tremolo can go up a perfect 4th at really low string action. Everything else, I prefer about the Kiesels, and I have had my pickup switching changed for 20 Euros, so no biggie.: The EVOJ, or stainless steel jumbo frets, the Hipshot/Kiesel tremolo, the neck may not be as thin, but neither is it as wide as the Ibanez, which makes the Kiesel more comfortable to me, the fact that you can design whatever you want, even have the amazing piezo system installed, and even the synth pickup for ultimate versatility. I like my Ibanez, but I pretty much always play my Kiesels, and I will definitely buy more. Custom shop is the way to go for me.
Yeah both have pros and cons and are awesome, but I would usually grab my Aries 9 out of 10 times so that told me where I was at with my preferences haha.
Damn dude, do some asmr flipping your switches and tapping on your guitars hahah
Hahah. SATISFYING CLICKS [ASMR]....Hrmmmmmmm.
Seeing this video makes me sad since my RGA321 was stolen a few years back 😢
They're both good.
Kiesel is custom guitars brand, they are small and we all know how big and succesfull IBANEZ is.
Yup!
What do you think is the best guitar you can buy for $3200 or less? How do you think the mm jp15 compares to a Kiesel and a prestige az? Do you think a jem7 is worth $1900 used or would a kiesel or prestige AZ, be better?
Hard to say. Depends on personal preference, but I'd say the safe bets are a Suhr Modern or a PRS Custom24. Incredible quality and you can get to either for $3200. If you prefer something cheaper, the AZ Prestige is great, as is the Kiesel Delos. I haven't tried a JP15, but I've heard they're great and a click up from the regular JP6s. If you like the JP6 neck, I bet the JP15 is a safe bet.
For 3k dont buy a kiesel that would be stupid.
I literally just went down this debate and went with an ibanez rg921wgc. The neck and the used price worked out well
Having played both, I prefer the various options available on Kiesel guitars. Killer looks, action and playability. Not that Ibanez is junk by any means.
I agree, but there is nothin wrong with a nice Ibanez Prestige S hardtail :P But at $1099 I think the Aries is an incredible deal and holds up against guitars almost double the price.
@@TheGuitarPit I'd love to see a "shootout" between the Kiesel Carved Top CS24 and the Paul Reed Smith Custom 24.
@@briancicio7738 Yeah that'd be cool. I'd probably get a Kiesel Crescent, if I had to pick. I like the horn shape on that one a bit more. Although the Kiesel CT6 is so cheap on Reverb...really nice models for sale for $1100ish.
Just a side note here, I don't know if most of the people watching can hear it.
But whenever you speak, I can hear your mic picking up the sound of your mouth and lips underneath your voice.
Just wanted to let you know it was there :)
Yeah it was like a $9 amazon mic. I've since replaced it, but thanks :)
Great video with excellent points. My only constructive criticism is to record the guitar sound and tone better. You really didn't give either guitar justice in that regard.
Great review. The Kiesel JBPB has 22 frets and a thinner neck profile but it won't get anywhere near as thin as a wizard neck. But with The Seymour Duncan Perpetual Burn bridge humbucker it is a traditional Strat design that would be a good pick to shredders who doesn't like the new shapes and bevels of the Kiesels models...not to mention a good portion of the money goes to benefit Jason becker!
Yeah supporting Becker is really great, and like you said, this is a more classic look than most of the other Kiesels. There are 4 headstock options, but I like the silly backwards one :)
Hey there! Nice video man very helpful. I have a little question, hope you can help me. Actually I have about a 1000 USD budget and I saw an Ibanez premium rg1027 that seems very tempting to me, have almost anything I need and it look awesome, but is a premium after all, and for 1000. I still on the fence because people is saying that premiums have recently improved the quality very well. Do you think it will be better save an extra cash and build a kiesel with less fancy stuffs and woods? I've never played a kiesel before so I really don't know.
I love Kiesel quality. I'd highly recommend saving a couple bucks more, personally. I haven't played a recent Premium, but the previous Ibanez Premiums weren't very exciting. For $1000 you should be able to pick up a basic Kiesel Aries or similar on Reverb, or you can custom order one for $200 more.
@@TheGuitarPit Thanks for your reply man! Is very helpful have people like you who helps newbies (and not so newbies)like me with taking a choice. I will go for the kiesel, it will be my first med-high end guitar so thanks for your help!
Thanks for quite an interesting review. I think one day I'll get my hands on Kiesel guitars just to check them. My first guitar was Ibanez RG321 (2007, made in Indonesia) with hardtail bridge, mahogany body. By the way, now - 12 years later - it resonates and delivers just insane sustain. I also played my friend's RGA32 with hardtail bridge, but it has thicker neck which I didn't like a lot. Just get used to thicker one. During the last two years I bought 2 used Prestige models (RG2550 for USD300 with DiMarzio The Breed set (made in 2004 with Edge Pro tremolo) and RG1570Z for USD250 with stock pick-ups and Zero Point tremolo made in 2007) in almost perfect condition except cosmetics on 1570 and I really like them a lot. I can tell that ZP tremolo is quite a different beast, but the tuning stability is perfect even with unlocked locking nut. I made some research on the web and found out that all Prestige series Ibbies are the products of FujiGen factory, while most of Korean and Indonesian ones were/are produced at Cort plants which is the biggest guitar manufacturer in Asia. FujiGen now have their own brand of guitars - FGN which are cheaper than Prestige Ibbies while the quality is the same. They also have an interesting Circle Fretting System on their guitars. Have you ever tried them? It could probably be one the most excellent quality-price ratios out there on the market now.
Wow, nice. Sounds like you got some crazy deals on some Ibanezes for sure. I've heard of the FGN guitars but haven't played one yet. Their used prices on Reverb are pretty appealing, although I'm not sure if they're easy to sell. They look like pretty nice quality (as most things are, from that factory). Did you see Henning's videos on them? He reviewed a bunch of them pretty favorably.
@@TheGuitarPit I've seen a lot of reviews on FGN on the web. They have official dealer with several shops in a city where I live, so I'm planning to check their models. I don't know about reselling them on Reverb in US or Canada, but I can say that there's no problem selling them used here in Ukraine. Anyway, I'll have it sooner or later))
Question... You mentioned the Kiesel has a slightly thicker neck and not as flat as the Ibanez BUT what neck is on that Kielsel the default neck OR the ultra thin version?
The Kiesel "thinner" neck is still bigger than the Ibanez J Custom I just had. That said, it's still pretty damn thin. Depends on what you're looking for I guess. One thing is the nut on the Ibanez is typically wider than Kiesel. You can't pick the nut width on Kiesel I don't think.
Has anybody purchased a Kiesel with a 16 inch fretboard radius? How do they feel with a regular or a thin Kiesel neck?
Ibanez is nearly 10 years older, stainless steel frets in trend for olny last two years.
And to me, steel frets gives some tin can sound. If you want forever lasting frets- Jescar Evo Gold, or Sintoms with 18% of nickel(much harder than traditional 12%)
I think the highlight of Kiesel is the bang for the buck. You get an American made custom guitar for a fraction of a Gibson or Fender. Not to say Ibanez isn’t great.
Yeah, that's right. Ibanez are super solid guitars, but take Delos vs AZ for example. The Delos is basically half the price. If you add a flame top to it and compare to the AZ flame top, it's like 45% cheaper? I guess you could argue the pickups in the AZ are more versatile, but personally I think the Delos is slightly better fit and finish. They're just a crazy value.
I really want an Ibanez Prestige with a hardtail, but seems like I'll have to wait some time for new models to come out... On the other hand, I can't really get a Kiesel considering I'm in Europe.
How about the Ibanez RG5121DBF RG Prestige? Fits the bill, although it's pretty new so it'll be hard to pick one up for a cheap used price.
@@TheGuitarPit yeah, and it's like $1800 new, so it's no good for my budget.. The maple neck on the RG652AHMFX looks damn nice but I'd prefer a different body color and they don't offer any other than that kind of blue.. Oh well.. Anyways, thanks for your video!
I had a RG652AHMFX and it was pretty decent. Nice neck and stuff. I got sick of the color pretty quick too. On the upside, they're super cheap used. I think I sold mine for $800 USD.
How do you think they would compare in the upper price range? I was considering getting an Ibanez j custom, and just started looking into kiesel. What do you think is the best bang for my buck in the $3k price range?
Are there features you must have? If you must have a feature Ibanez doesn't offer on J Customs (multiscale, for example) you might be stuck with Kiesel. I happen to have a J Custom right now, very nice guitar. Very flat, wide neck though. Isn't my favorite. A $1500 Kiesel doesn't play any worse than a $3k Kiesel. I'd skip the extra options and save some cash. You'll lose a TON of resale value if you buy a $3k Kiesel. If you're set on spending that much, I'd get a Suhr personally...
Aren't you comparing apples to oranges here? Kiesel are all custom shop axes whereas Ibanez are not. As for your aversion to trems, try being a lefthander & WANTING a trem fitted guitar. So many brands just SUCK when it comes to us lefties, but at least Ibanez do some. I've never seen a lefthanded Kiesel. (Though they'd probably try to build me one, if I had that kind of dosh)
Good video on the comparison of the two but as you were playing I couldn’t help but notice you have a Marty Friedman style picking slash strumming hand....
Ha! I've been working on my picking hand since this video, but it's still pretty bad. I think I need to break a couple really old habits :)
I prefer their carvin brand. Omg is the carvin i got sweet I traded a prs for it.
I have a Vader and I love it. Never really been a fan of Ibanez- tried a few and just not for me. What is the finish on that Kiesel? I love it. Great vid 👍🤘 Much support from one musician to another. Liked and subbed.
Thanks Larry! It's antique treatment swamp ash, with a rawtone satin finish. Looks awesome, and doesn't break the bank the same way the quilt tops do.
Its wrong my ibanez btb1905 premium bass have stainless steel frets and not on premium bass you get stainless steel frets
That was a good and fair comparison video. What type of pickup did you have in the antique ash Kiesel?
I bought the Kiesel used and it came with Bareknuckle Holy Divers. I believe they're a hot-rodded JB sort of thing. They sound great, but I didn't want to compare $300 pickups to something you get stock in the other two guitars.
The Guitar Pit yeah I figured that’s why you used the Becker instead. I’ve got the Lithium pickups but would like swap them out with something different. Does it look like the Barenuckle pickups were an easy fit, or did they have to modify the guitar to get them in?
You can hear them in my Aries review video. I believe they fit normally, but they're direct mounted so be careful about drilling through to the back (seen on my JB100 video). In the Aries' case, I believe they will drop in, but the only hitch might be the depth. I don't see any extra routing around the pickup or anything.
I tried to change the pickups out on a Carvin CS3 and the pickups fit, but the route was too shallow. The pickups, lowered to maximum, were almost touching the strings...not to mention the non-standard pickup rings were a huge pain to replace.
The Guitar Pit That’s very helpful feedback. Thanks man.
I've played Suhr, American Strats and Teles, Lower End Gibsons, higher end ESPs, there are so many good guitars at the 1200 price point, but Kiesel takes it home. Do your self a favor and grab a Kiesel. You will be hard pressed to find a seller, as most people keep an instrument like that, so finely made, but if you can get a used Kiesel get it. You will be so happy you did.
I think i just won the internet because I bought a solo6 for 400 and a vanquish for 400 lol
Hello,
What is the wood style and color of they gray guitar you're holding much of the video? I must have missed it, but it looks great and I want to remember it for my dream guitar.
Thanks!!
It's a two piece swamp ash body, with Kiesel's antique treatment and raw tone satin over the top.
the first clean riff sounds like the faceless riff cant think of the name.
You'd be right, albeit poorly played hah. Deconsecrate!
You know over the last week I've really been enjoying your channel. I just looked at your sub count. That's gotta be a discrepancy of sorts. You should be way up there. In time. It will happen. Anyway thank you for the content. Sometimes just chilling out and getting good opinions on models is good. Saving me and others time. Also showing me stuff I may want to grab up. Lolol. Like that insane JB green Keisel that's ridiculously amazing steal. Peace buddy.
Weird, I tried to reply to this last night and I guess it didn't get saved. Thanks, and really appreciate the compliments. Channel is growing at an alright pace...only been at it around 7 months or so :) I'll get there!
@@TheGuitarPit No prob and I'll be along for the ride. Lol. Peace man.
I don't know enough about either of them to be aware of the drama lol. That Keisel sure is perdy. That's my 2 cents.
Ha! Yeah, Kiesel's antique swamp ash finish is really neat. Simple and different enough to be interesting.
The Guitar Pit Also wanted to compliment you on your production. Your sound is immaculate and your video tours of the guitars are beautiful. Well done 😉
Awfully kind of you to say. Thanks, appreciate it. I'm learning as I go so there are still some tiny things that bug me. But hey, I'll eventually figure them all out. Hopefully.
Wizard neck will change your playing and life.
I wish man. They just hurt my hand now haha. I had a J Custom RG more recently than this older video, and even though it was basically perfection....my hands were mad at me. Just too thin for me now. AZs got that covered though!
I play enough that my 1 yr old Jackson guitar is arguably due for a fret level/ crown but I'll likely just swap the frets for ss in a couple months.... It's got noticeable fret wear already and it's not my only guitar. I rotate 3 main guitars that I use 90% of the time and they will all get stainless steel fret jobs in the next 2-3 years. I also will no longer buy a new guitar unless it has SS frets. It's just not economically wise for my usages.
I'm not heavy handed or anything, I just play 2-3 hours a day. Ss frets need to be standard equipment starting at the $900 and up guitar price point. ESPECIALLY on guitars marketed towards metal/ shred.
In high school I was playing 5+ hours a day and chewed through frets pretty fast. These days I play much less (and have more guitars) so it's not a huge issue personally. But like you said, if you play a decent amount and have 1 or 2 go-to guitars, SS frets are a must. I just like the way they feel too, to be honest. A little smoother because they never tarnish, maybe?
@@TheGuitarPit My quantity of playtime on each guitar makes it so tarnish is never an issue. It's all about the wear. I just polished my jackson's nickel frets last week and they were slick as Ice. Today they are still better than before the polish, but they aren't as slick. A good polish on SS frets last longer because the nickel strings can't dig into them as much.
@@SixString_J5 My PRS sat so long it got a weird patina on the frets. I gave it a polish and it sprung back to life, but it seems like when they sit for 6 months unplayed the frets certainly get gunk'd up.
@@TheGuitarPit Yep that happens. My acoustic stays gunky as I don't play it. But when I do It's very noticable. Oddly the main takeaway is the smell. My fingers have this weird metallic smell after playing patinaed frets. My wife is beyond practical and I feel bad having guitars I don't use. Only reason I have my acoustic is because it was my dad's and later my first guitar. I have 1 electric that I don't really use and I'm selling it cause I can't just let it sit there. I have two jacksons and a Japanese ESP I've had new since 1995. I play them each on average 30-60 minutes a day. I have a Kiesel on the way and I'm interested to see how it fits in the mix.
@@SixString_J5 Ha yeah, that weird smell. My PRS is a huge offender of that. The frets do it, as does the brass hardware. Curious to hear what you think of the Kiesel. Sounds like it'll have some stiff competition haha. Let me know when it shows up :)
Within the last year Kiesel snagged Andy James and Paul Wardingham as endorsees. That says a lot. Maybe Loomis will be next?