DOES FURIOSA SIGNIFY THE END OF THE GIRL BOSS? | Film Threat Rants
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 22 พ.ค. 2024
- Alan Ng and guest cohost Derek Anderson @The_DA rant about whether or not "Furiosa" has ended the girl boss era.
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All I wanted was old man Max with Mel Gibson's return.
Mel and his weird American accent.
Nooooo... they will turn him into anther Han Solo or Jake Skywalker.
@@kevinscott3781 Maybe we would get lucky and get a Logan style movie and since Max is already a bitter, damaged character unlike Luke, but I agree they would find a way to ruin it
Ikr!!! There’s no Mad Max without Mad Mel!!!!!
Never gonna happen.
Superman wasn't meant to be relatable but to be inspired.
True, but that doesn't sell.
@@megadeuce2350 Why is he still around to this day?
@@megadeuce2350he doesn't have to. Showing people that there is good in the world needs no price tag
Clark Kent is the one that is relatable.
That is why Christopher Reeve was a better Superman
Superman's real weakness is that he would do anything to save humanity. He's hard on himself if he even loses one.
Yeah, there’s too much focus one what he can do and not enough on what he cannot do. Stories like “Superman: Grounded pt.5” explore his limitations dealing with corruption, environmental pollution, people that fear his presence due to how often it means a big battle will take place, he fills with fury that he has to contain when he discovers a child abuser etc. There are a lot of writers that don’t know how to handle the characters they are given or perhaps even editorial mandates that push someone like Clark in the flying brick direction of plot lines. It’s fine to not like Superman but the explanations given can often ring quite hollow.
He struggles with possessing the power and responsibility he has. He’s given up his powers before and that still never stopped him from being heroic which teaches him that only he is capable of using his gifts appropriately. As I recall, he also uses his powers to save people because he holds his fathers, Johnathan Kent and Jor El, in such high esteem, who both also had faith in him to do the right thing.
Don’t forget saving cats out of trees 🤦
The whole reason the 3rd act of Aliens is so good is the character arc is flawlessly built. Modern writers just can't do that. They dont understand arcs because they see life through the lens of privilege, not growth.
The reason it was well liked was because there was plenty of room for a few girl bosses back then. Now it's all we have. If that came out now, people would reject it. Sure, it's better when the writing and acting is better. But is EVERY. SINGLE. HEROIC. LEAD. IS FEMALE. At some point we need to know why exactly.
Aliens 3? I thought that movie sucked due to SW wanting the script changed, during her anti-gun phase.
@@rushmore39273rd act of the film Aliens. Not alien 3.
More likely studio interference only allows for a v narrow bandwidth of what they deem marketable female leads. Are there bad writers? Absolutely. All of them tho? No. The problem goes back to the money
There are good writers but they're being sidelined and shouted down in the writer's room. They can see which way the wind is blowing so when they see a character that checks all the boxes but has a terrible arc they just keep quiet instead of getting told by the diversity officer that they are culturally insensitive and need to be less white.
To the two previous fans, no one cares about Hollyweird Movies' "MESSAGE" anymore. Especially in this economy.
We never did I want to be entertained there's nothing a movie can teach me
@@calfowler6838at this point woke agenda still continue until 2030s, hollywood golden era is gone, nobody can't beat 50s until 90s era anymore
But this movie does care. It's very clearly there to show us the STRONK WOMAHN. I don care if she is in survival mode. We are still being shown that the strongest warriors are the girlies. Which is ridiculous.
This guy just doesnt get it. There is no such thing as a "boy boss". Action films are naturally the realm of the male. This is social engineering that is being forced on people. Action film, and heroes like Superman are there to encourage men to protect their society. Guess what? If a bunch of men enlisted in the army, or a police or a firefighting team made entirely of women really isnt going to be as good. So this dude is trying hard to pretend that the genders are identical, and have identical, and its silly.
...And thats why the big money has moved to gaming (which they also will take away from us)
There is NO SUCH THING AS A BOY BOSS, as someone has already said. Male heroes predate female heroes by hundreds of thousands of years for a reason. Beowulf was NOT A CHICK FOR A REASON! Males fighting as heroes is far more natural, and societally desirable. And men are the ones who like reading adventure stories and watching adventure films. GIRLS LIKE ME ENJOY READING ABOUT HEROIC MEN. When you try and turn boy stuff in to girl stuff, you end up with stuff no one likes. Girls have different adventures. More nuanced, with mysteries, where they make friends, and stand together. And get rested. Yes, we like being rescued.
This! we've had stories written for women, with female leads, for ages! and they love them!
Taking stories written for men and swapping the male leads turns them into stories for no one, no matter how many Black-stone (no censor pls) credit you got for it.
@@MadsterV exactly
Not to mention the countless stories real and fictional of wives and the power they had by and through their husbands. Abigail Adams comes to mind immediately. In fact most if not ALL of the Founding Fathers' wives were HUGE influences on their work.
To say or think that women have had no say in history is a foolish task...
But think of all the fairy tales we have led by women. I wonder if it's because those stories are often told by women to their children that they're often female led. 🤔
This is a fantastic point. In society when women weren’t equal, there was an entirely different way that women flexed. I’ve thought about that a lot as both my grandmothers were very domineering women ( both born in 1910’s or so.
Me when i never talked to a women in my life.
I don't think Furiosa needed more of a backstory than she got in Fury Road. I won't see a Mad Max movie unless it has Mad Max in it.
I agree completely! You notice they still need to put Max's name in the title. Who the hell wants a story about furiosa..NOT I! In the first movie furiosa could have been written out there was no need for her as a character
@@joshuabrzezinski2828 I loved Tom Hardy as Max, and thought Furiosa was just a generic character to be honest. I was hoping the next MAd Max would be more about Mad Max, what a letdown.
@alphariusomegon4819 I agree Tom hardy is an excellent actor I wished they used him more instead they made him a mute so he didn't outshine furiosa. That was my point keep the first movie but without furiosa she was not needed or wanted. I grew up with mad max and I just want max in a mad max movie
Just saw the movie in IMAX. It’s bad.
Still not watching it 😭
Still not watching it, and it's still girl boss.
In Superman 2 with Christopher Reeves, superman has a weakness. General Zod threatens to kill more innocent civilians if Superman doesn't give up. Superman has to retreat. Great movie.
I immediately thought of that too. Superman’s fatal flaw is he cares too much about humans. A great weakness. He also gave into his own desires early on by putting his love for Lois first and sacrificing his immense power to be with her. (I guess his version of Superman was too much for a human woman to handle. Lol)
It is also a three on one situation and in the Donner Cut that's explicitly stated when General Zod says "he fled in fear of us".
@@sassy7766God I love the Donner Cut, Brando dies again as a result of his Selfishness, so he can get his powers back! Best version of the movie!
😂he treated because of the budget and lack of cgi. Man of Steel is way better
We saw the hero's journey in alien and terminator. We don't see that anymore.
In the first movies, they were survivors trying to survive a situation no ordinary person could or did. In the sequels, they pick up some new skills and face that danger. It was great. Alien is still one of my favorite movies.
Salt with Angelina Jolie was the first big dumb example I remember of the obviously petite girl boss kicking too much ass
The Drew Barrymore, Cameron Diaz, Lucy Liu Charlie's Angels.
Xena is the first I remember, and that was when I was a little girl.
How about Ms. 45 ?
At least in that one, she used her brains more to get out of situations. I'd say Angelina Jolie was better in the movie "Those who wish me dead". Even when they made her a firefighter that was a Veteran, she still couldn't beat the bad guy all by herself and needed help.
Yeah, been around for years. Aeon Flux, Atomic Blonde, Serenity, Buffy the Vampire Slayer (though was sorta doing girl boss in a poking fun kind of way), Tomb Raider, etc.
Fun fact: Vazquez from Aliens was also in T2, where she played the stepmother.
And the annoying foster father was the leader of Hilltop in walking dead.
You are a hero that I didn't know I needed.
When you see it side by side, she looks quite different 😂
In the post-apocalyptic world of Mad Max, they can't produce fuel, but build prosthetic limbs that look alien and operate with magic.
Haha true, but they do have gastown to produce fuel
Her prosthetic arm actually ran on a small motor, so it needed guzzoline. Not very magic at all. I guess you didn’t even watch the movie but just wanted to bash for being woke, even though it wasn’t.
The princess of mars. John Carter had the last hot princess. Vulnerable yet strong. Beauty and strength. Can’t say enough about the actress and character
100%
And also not really the hero. That was still Carter.
It saddens me we never got a trilogy. Underrated film, much like Treasure Planet.
I always thought that Lynn Collins (the actress you're talking about) should have been in the running to play Wonder Woman at some point.
i love that movie honestly....too bad it flopped....
DUCK FISNEY!
You're crazy if you think Captain Marvel had no flaws lol... Nobody liked her. That's a pretty big character flaw!
Her powers are not (or shouldn't be) all there is to her, same as sexuality shouldn't be the only defining characteristic of a LGBT character.
Captain Marvel didn't have a character development because no one had written it.
I can't believe people actually paid to watch her first movie. I was hyped for the Infinity saga, but I wasn't hyped enough to spend money on that crap.
@@DavidMartinez-ce3lp most (me included) were tricked into believing her backstory would be important in the Infinity saga.
Her backstory is "I'm awesome, always have, I'm better than all of you put together" and if her "weakness" was being an asshole, it never comes back to bite her.
Her part in Infinity was "I'm so awesome I've got better things to do than to save half the universe, cya" which I guess is on character. They should have shown her fading away in some remote corner of the universe, but no.
It's just lame writing.
@MadsterV really? I never thought for one second she was integral to Endgame based on all the trailers they put out. They shoehorned her into Endgame and made her a deus ex machina at the beginning and the end. It's some of the laziest writing I've ever seen. I'd say it's one of the reasons the movie was so disappointing. She should've never been in the movie. She was only in it for 15 minutes, and everything she did could've been done by one of the main Avengers. She just took away screen time from more important characters that people actually cared about.
Girl Boss idea is also kind of an insult to women. It pretends that women are better than men at all the things that men are usually obviously better at than women. Why? Because film makers believe women need a pat on the head or something? Women have lots of power over men. For example, as demonstrated by Femme Fatale characters from movies of 80 years ago.
Exactly. Women in the real world are ALL WEAKER THEN MALES. That doesnt mean we are less than men. We have different skill set. But that is why Furiosa is a Girl Boss. And why there is no such thing as a Boy Boss. Superman might be an idealized man. But Neither Captain Marvel, nor Furiosa, nor Wonder Woman are idealized women. They are just very physically strong women. There have been adventure stories about heroes like beowulf forever, and they have all been about men, until very recently. Now they are all about women. It's not normal. Its social engineering.
Not just Femme Fatales. Chinese period dramas around harems have some of the best examples of female strengths in adversarial conditions. It wasn't easy for women to weird power in those times, let only in Dynasties like the Ming and Qing which got more heavy handed when it came to women's influence on national affairs (it could cost you your head). But women still found a way. Keeping your child alive to put them on the throne or taking the highest position when another woman's child had it took skill. People like Wu Zetian who managed to rule in her own right are straight-up impressive. She got educated by her father (the education you got back then was based on sex and station) and used her intelligence and female advantage to get that close to the throne without starting a war.
Girl bosses only imprint masculine traits on women and deny feminine strengths as strengths. There's nothing wrong with a Joan of Arc type female warrior, but why are they the only ones who get the limelight? Most women of note aren't warriors in the masculine sense.
I was legit thinking about Erin Brockovich while typing this as the guy said her name. 😅
These are the women that come to mind when I think of what a strong female used to represent.
I think it’s more that feminist is the wrong word because it doesn’t concentrate on the positivity of the feminine. Instead it purports that toxic, male behavior is negative when men engage in it but can only be viewed as positive when women do it. So to a feminist, being feminine is not the ultimate goal, the ultimate goal is to take on the role of a man. A woman who acts like a man is superior to a man that acts like a man
@@sianais except by most accounts Joan wasn’t a warrior but an inspirational figure. She boosted morale and inspired men to heroics. She didn’t do much herself as far as actual fighting was concerned.
The so-called "girl boss" is barely even a character. If anything, she's a one-note, two-dimensional "toxic masculinity" stereotype with boobs. These writers take what they think men like male action heroes and just make it a chick, so the girl boss is an insult to both men and women.
Furiosa is a girlboss in every way. She is using the popularity of Mad Max to try and get us to buy into the girl boss. You dont think Furiosa attacks people? Did you watch the film. Anyhow, none of that matters. Wether she is the shrewish girl boss, or the strong and silent girl boss, she is still very much a girl boss.
Male heroes can not be boy bosses, because their character stems from the natural abilities that men have, and women do not. Youre not a woman, and I am. Im weaker physically than men. No matter how much I go into survival mode, I will never get anywhere trying to fight men. That doesnt mean Im less strong as a person. I have my intellect. I have my ability to organize, and my empathy, my ability to help people get along with each other. I can give birth to children and raise them, and I can support people. All of those abilities can be used in a leadership capacity, or a support capacity. But they are not real good in a lone wolf capacity. Thats where women are the weakest.
Emphaty, agreability, calmness and memory.
AND WHATS EVEN MORE STUPID IS THEY PIT HER AGAINST LARGE AND MUSCULAR CHRIS HEMSWORTH. CAN THESE WOKE FILM MAKERS GET ANY MORE STUPID. JUST GIVE THEM TIME, THEY WILL MANAGE.
shills gotta shill, that's how they put food on the table and get early access. good to see people can still have their own opinions.
One look at the Furiosa poster, and I already know what the movie is about. Maybe I'm wrong, but that's the impression I get. They are not selling this to me. I'm not interested.
I feel very safe skipping this. Nothing of value missed. Same old woke sh**.
I’ve been saying it for several years now. These girl boss movies are setting a bad and dangerous examples for little girls. They are growing up with the impression that they can beat up a man. Even a coked up man. As a little girl in the 80s we were told to otutsmart, strike quick to stun and then run like hell. I outweigh my husband. Just horsing around he can pick me up easy. If he was to ever want to hurt me, I don’t stand a chance.
Between T1 and T2 Linda Hamilton starred in the tv show Beauty and the beast. Her character Catherine is a socialite lawyer working for her dad. She is attacked in a case of mistaken identity. The beast saves her and nurses her back to health. When she returns to her life, she learns self defense and does grut work for the district attorney. Her damsel in distress is stronger. But when she gets in situations that she can be overwhelmed despite her training, the beast arrives to save the day. Sometimes she saves him too. They overcome the obstacles together, as a team. Linda said in interviews that show made her realize she liked being a physical actress. I firmly believe no Beauty and the Beast, no bad ass Sarah in T2. That show was on when I was 10-11. Her method of self defense was always a stuck with me. Which is why I worry about these little girls watching the girl bosses. We can’t nest up a man with our strength. We have to accept that and find other ways.
I absolutely agree with you on that, but I would argue that this modern "girl-boss" trend in media is as equally destructive to little boys as well. They are being taught that they are all terrible people and oppressors, while also being portrayed as disposable, their lives are unimportant, and they just inherently deserve to be mistreated or used as target practice. I have two young cousins, both preteens, and already I've seen the adverse effects it has had on them and their self esteem. It really hurts to see them like that, they're both such good kids, and they don't deserve to feel that way.
Yep. The most dangerous thing you can be in any situation is overconfident. Look at how men who have never really trained in something like jiu-jitsu or MMA or boxing act. They really think they could just "see red" and smash a skilled, stronger opponent. The truth is, against someone who knows what they're doing, that kind of guy lasts about... half a second. It's not even a fight, it's a mugging.
It used to be just men who thought like that, but now movies and TV shows are sociallly engineering *girls* to have the same delusional confidence that if they walked down the wrong alley they could just hulk up and beat someone up by sheer will, and it is incredibly dangerous.
@@clockworkcrazy5121 yes I agree that it’s absolutely destructive for little boys too. They are being forced to restrain what comes natural to them because a narrative is telling them their male instincts are wrong. My heart breaks for them.
@@Cryptic0013 absolutely!
@@sassy7766 Thank you. It's always reassuring to know that others care.
How did we end up with Mad Max with a girl boss? So stupid
Money!
@@MadsterV you do now that George Miller wrote Furious almost straight away after the fury road script and to almost made straight away but he and Warner Brothers got into a fight about back pay. Hey then wrote a mad max script and it was going to be after this movie and without Furious.
Why did anyone like Prey? It was like remaking Predator 1987 and making the female hostage the main character. That's all they did, so lame.
I tried watching it twice and couldn't make it to half of it. Are you telling me that a little girl is going to defeat what killed Jesse Ventura, Carl Weathers, Bill Duke and almost Schwarzenegger? GTFOH!
It's so over rated. The characters are all very bland and one dimensional so it's hard to care what happens to any of them.
@@lanemyer774 Well, truth to be told, she did kill it with the help of several men. But at the end she smugly pretended as if she did all the work herself.
The predator didn't even know how his equipment worked and he shot himself
You had many people praising that movie, even on this side of things, because it turned out to not be the worst thing ever. It was mid at best. Just because something is not the worst thing ever doesn't mean it's worth my time.
The writers are hacks. This is the problem.
There are plenty of good writers out there, they just can't get a job, because they aren't woke commies.
They are activists posing as writers.
@@Princess_Feona I wrote the same, only I used the forbidden word C.O.M.M.I.E., and it got deleted. 😄
@@tomigun5180 and yet you would vote for someone who actively fawns over Russia. Smart move from the trailer park.
@@JonDavis4678 and you would vote for someone who actively & secretly sold Russian’s uranium. Cry harder.
Yea, still not paying to see 95 pound girls throwing around 200lb dudes with ease. Hard pass on Mad Max sans Mad Max movie.
That’s NOT this movie. Furiosa gets her ass kicked throughout the movie. She doesn’t throw any guys around. She uses weapons toward the end to even up the odds, like a woman would have to do to have any chance at all.
@@jim9685769 Yeah she does. Guess what? Women cant win fights with men. Men have reflexes so much faster than women, the difference is just insane. I once saw the women's saber champions try and duel a high school boys team. And a women's world champion soccer team play a boys high school team. Honestly it's still insulting the audience and annoying that women always win fights that count in these shows. And why are men unable to grab weapons exactly? What they weren't smart enough to think of it? If you need to dumb down men so your girl boss can come out on top, your girl boss is a girl boss.
You pretty much described Black Widow in the MCU
@@Bingo_the_Pug He pretty much described 1) Prey 2) Damsel 3) Rebel Moon 4) Madame Web 5) The Marvels 6) The Last Jedi 7) The Acolyte. 8) Rings of Power.... and we could keep going forever.
Fun fact, Ruby Rose broke her neck practicing an action sequence with a 260 pound man. She weighed 85 pounds at the time and is a vegan.
The woman in Blade 3 was big problem. She was taking down vampires. Blade wasn't being shown during those fights. And they don't justify why she can fight that good. While Ryan Renalds is getting crapped on.
I think we were supposed to assume that because she was Whistler's daughter that she could do all these things, but it didn't make sense.
Jessica Biel was in excellent shape. That alone convinced me that she trained all her life to kill vampires. It was the earbuds that disturbed me. Hearing your enemies during a fight is vital.
@@tomigun5180 She was in excellent physical shape. She was in poor acting shape. She was unbearable in that film.
Agreed, though I’m really ok with Ryan getting crapped on.
The real tragedy is how we've been conditioned to mistrust anything with a female lead. Right now, if the original alien were to be made exactly as it was in the past (maybe with better effects) there would be an immediate reaction of "oh Lord, another tough chick". Which isn't fair but absolutely justifiable after a decade of insufferably badly written female protagonists. The industry literally spoke this situation into existence by hammering the idea that women have to be perfect, geniuses, without flaws and God like in their physical abilities while denigrating men at every opportunity.
That's what's sad about the Furiosa movie. I personally haven't seen it yet, but I've been hearing that she's anything but a girl boss and gets her ass kicked for most of the movie. People are justifiably skeptical even with good word of mouth. Hollywood has done this to themselves.
Yep, I just can’t trust modern movies with a female lead anymore.
Whether they're good or not, movies with women in typically male roles are now overplayed. I'm fully over it.
Exactly. The pendulum is swinging too far back - I don’t think people realize how sexist it makes them sound whenever they see a female lead and just immediately say “girlboss”. It’s all about execution
One of the things that made Alien good is that the hero being a girl was a plot twist. It actually wasn't written to be a woman. The script just had names like Ripley etc.
Worst argument. Superman is not a boy boss. Kryptonite is called story telling. He is also susceptible to magic. Anyone who reads All Star Superman or understands the lore developed in the 60’s would never make such a horrible argument. Superman has a great story and legacy.
Also, it isn’t about how indestructible Superman is. It’s about how fragile the lives surrounding him are. He has a zoo filled with endangered or even last surviving life forms from across the vastness of space for crying out loud hahaha
It has to be said that both Ripley and Sarah Connor in both sequels are most concerned with protecting children (Newt in Aliens and John Connor in T2). That is one of the main reasons it worked so well, its a motherly instinct trope that resonates with all parents but especially mothers. The feminine qualities of protecting the young is essential to their characters. Make female characters feminine again!
"Are women going to think their feelings are the universe?" Yes. "Will women stop trying to one-up men out of spite?" Hmmm, I think I'll start walking down this path away from them.
The rise of president trump during 2016 -17 is the reason why whamen agenda has become disgusting and idiot, that's why this year when creepy joe loses hollywoke and whamen will cry for victimhood
If men start walking away from women our race ends. And this movie isnt made for women. Women have no interest in Furiosa. Women might like bad role models but more like Barbie. This type of movie is made for infantile men who fetishize the woman warrior because it makes them feel secure and mothered. I think someone already said as much.
I can tell you've worked for women.
I wonder if they will change Jack and the Beanstalk to Jill and the Beanstalk for children so that boys dont get the crazy idea they might be the ones to go and slay the giant. Obviously thats a woman's job. Jack can sit and hide.
IMO - Jill only has to stab the giants ankle ONCE to give Jack a chance to deal a final blow. Through teamwork they succeed; A partnership, with absolute trust and faith in each others roles. That's the scene where Jill overcomes her absolute terror of the monster that crushed her parents. The scene where all the girls in the audience scream YESS! GET HIM! GO JILL GO!!! And the giant wouldn't have fallen if she hadn't overcome that fear. They'd both be dead. Teamwork.
Give me those narrative angles again and I'll go back to the cinema.
@@yorkipudd1728 How about JACK(keyword there) and the Beanstalk stays exactly just like the way it is. Your premise sounds way to much like “Updated for modern audiences”
@@yorkipudd1728why do you need Jack at all, other than to show him up and that Jack HAS to have Jill to get the job done? Yea, go write a story about Jill, we Jack’s don’t want you around, we’re just fine as is.
I get what you’re trying to say but you’re falling in the same trap as the rest of them, stop being brainwashed.
@@c1ph3rpunk You are both missing my point. A heroine overcoming their fears is what we're missing IMO. The crap ones are all perfect from frame one. IF a Jill was involved in a Jack and the Beanstalk movie, YEAH she should hide behind Jack for 90% of it. But there's nothing wrong with her helping Jack. On screen Teamwork, like in Raiders where the female is physically a female but also tough as boots and helps. Mostly.
I just wanted Mad Max in his own movie... the character was sidelined in the previous movie, and now it's a full on girl boss "replacing" Max. When all we wanted to see is Mad Max himself in new adventures. I'm sick and tired of seeing stick think women being shown beating up hulking men... so immersion breaking!
I already have my Mad Max trilogy thank you.
You have 4 mad max movie in the span of 40 years, and now you're getting 1 Furiosa movie and you're upset? We had 3 movies of Max doing his own thing, i don't want a rehash, they tried with Thunderdome and as much as I like that one, it's not great.
Reflecting back on those movies, you can see they needed a fresh take, and focusing an entire world around just 1 character would have kept it boring
. You want more Max? The video game was seriously underrated and worth any fan's time...But now people are starting rumors that Miller going to "correct Furiosa' by casting Hardy again as Max..
How would that make sense if Miller is currently out there promoting the current (still unreleased) movie? Would he trash his own movie like that and risk getting another one funded? Nope, fake movie fans need to stop trying to pre cancel movies for everyone, go play in Yellowflash's hate filled comment sections.
Bring it down a notch, he just said that he wanted a Mad Max film about Mad Max. Who do you think people pay to watch in James Bond flicks? Yellowflash is shit content though, that part you could have hammered on about for a bit longer haha it’s fine that Furiosa got her own movie, but people will still want more Mad Max, even if you or I don’t want more of it.
@@gringles There's no notches to take down, he wants something more akin to Road Warrior, guys on motorcycles and leashes, i get it. The problem starts to present itself when fanbases minimize a movie franchise full of cool characters to just one main character, Max was always a side character to everything else going on. Just because you start a movie following him, doesnt mean its his movie. Who narrates The Road Warrior? Max or the kid telling the story? It keeps seeming like Max inserts himself into other people's issues, its always been the case outside the first one. So again, when i see people say "i just want a mad max movie", it makes zero sense when those movie where never just about him. Did you guys watch them? I understand art is subjective, but even Miller stated that multiple times in interviews. Like i said, hijack a franchise over what you "think" it is, over what it actually is. Ever think Miller wanted to get away from Max but loved the world? He sat and grieved on set during Beyond Thunderdome since his co creator had recently died, I think this is deeper than dudes running around in black leather.
@@robcoguy6909 Ok then. I’m not pushing back on these points, I’m simply restating that he wants a movie about Mad Max. It isn’t a big deal for people to want that, regardless of what his presence was in prior movies. If they never get a Max focused movie again, I’m sure they’ll survive hahaha I don’t know why you’re asking “if you guys” watched the other movies. Someone could have seen those movies and still wanted more Max.
Kryptonite was his kryptonite 😂
Blue Eye Samurai ended the “girl boss” trope. She was a true badass on her own
It ended nothing they're just repackaging it. They know they can't make them rey palpatine perfect anymore but they're never backing down off that hill
Great anime. But we still need more adventure stories with male heroes. Why are they always with men? Im not questioning the amazing quality, but even Blue Eye samurai is a girl boss story. It's still not relatable to women. It's not to me. And it's just the amount!! There are JUST TOO MANY women bad asses, and not enough men. Women cant be feminine while killing.
a male flawless character is boring; but when female, it is also propaganda; that is why it is so obnoxious.
Superman wasn't boring at all. It was a great character. He didnt need some psychological frailty, or whatever. And he often fought creatures stronger than himself.
@@michellestr8998 i want thinking about superman; he is iconic; i was just thinking about boring writing. male boring characters are just boring, but when woke propaganda is added, it becomes much worse. not just banal, but actually destructive.
@@michellestr8998 that is why superman is hard to write for;
@@stellifriends7785not disagreeing but which movie has a perfect male protagonist?
Superman isnt boring at all.
For every movie with no girl boss there's 10 new ones keeping the trend, far from over.
This was the best discussion on the girl boss problem I've seen yet.
Good job guys and thank you.
I happen to think its by far the worst. For one thing, this guy is pretending the genders are completely no different. As if the action, sci fi, fantasy and superhero stories were not originally created by men for men, and about things that come naturally to MEN! A hero like Superman is NOT a "boy boss" No such thing as "boy boss" exists. He is the natural idealized version of a man. But a female superhero is not an idealized woman at all. Women are not the ones we need to join the army, or join the fire department. MEN are. Men are naturally stronger, faster, with better reflexes.
Re: Superman. Telling Superman stories is difficult--not just because he's so powerful that really nothing is a challenge but more so because his character is such that we *already know how he will act.* He is moral and will always act morally. There is no drama in that unless you use him to play out philosophical delemmas.
Thus, the most interesting stories with Superman are how he affects imperfect people around him.
I liked Angelina Jolie in "Those who wish me dead". Even though she was a firefighter and Veteran, she still needed help beating the bad guy. Never felt like she was a girlboss. She was very motherly in that movie.
The difference between Superman and Captain Marvel is that Superman never let's his powers and physical might dictate his character outside of the heroic acts he does. He doesn't feel the need to be arrogant, rude, entitled, or to demean the women around him.
His true strengths come from his noble character. He's a gentleman and really cares about humanity. His powers let him show it on a grand scale, but even when he's just Clark Kent he shows his strength on a human level.
He's super even when he's just a man.
Captain Marvel is just an entitled feminist with a chip on her shoulder.
The only reason Captain Marvel did well in the theaters was because Marvel duped everyone into believing it was critical to the story of Infinity War and End Game. Because up to that point every movie beforehand was part of building that story. Her movie had no effect whatsoever on the plot.
I have no desire to see it.
The difference between Furiosa and other modern movies is purely George Miller. Modern movies are usually decided upon by a committee or focus group, Furiosa is just George Miller doing what he wants to do.
Thank you! George Miller is a true storyteller unlike most other film makers these days!
I am glad that George kept control of the Mad Max franchise. I have heard he wants to do a third Max movie concluding Max’s story. I pray he has enough time to do it, but i hope the franchise ends with him. No one in this modern age could do the franchise justice except him.
Furiosa is still just a girl boss, taking over for a story line that has traditionally featured a man. And Im sure they will make sure to show us how much tougher, and braver she is than Max. Im not seeing it.
@@Tamikawashere My wife has adamantly said, "This is just 'The Road Warrior' but with a girl." It's been years since I've seen "The Road Warrior" but neither one of us are remotely interested in ..... what's her name? I'm supposed to remember her name, but I'm too exhausted with trying appease waifs trying to be tough.
@@Tamikawashere and so was Fury Road, honestly. The only reason people didn't bash it was because it came out before the girl boss was happening in every movie
As I consider "girlboss" a pejorative, I do not count neither Ripley or Sarah Connor as such. They were developed and developing characters, plain and simple.
Are people really asking for this movie? Really?
no. Its girl boss nonsense.
ppl were asking for another mad max movie, starring mad max. instead we got furiosa part 2.
you do now that George Miller wrote Furious almost straight away after the fury road script and to almost made straight away but he and Warner Brothers got into a fight about back pay. Hey then wrote a mad max script and it was going to be after this movie and without Furious.
@@mystique666 you talking about wasteland? ya, furiosa prt 2 would have performed extraordinary if it was released 10-20yrs earlier. problem is, the industry miller is working in unfortunately screwed him over by chasing his audience away w an over-abundance of grrlboss shitflicks n all good faith has been burned up. I was excited for this film for years just cuz I love miller's vision n fury road was a rare diamond in movies from the last 20yrs. sadly, he released furiosa prt 2 TODAY, in this time period, when ppl have no more tolerance for action flicks starring 90lb lil grrls grrlbossing big mean men. the trope is done. and I'm sure miller, as smart n competent as he is, had a great movie in mind, made a great movie n couldn't wait to hear honest criticism. sadly, no one really watched it to give him his criticism. but on the brightside, once it hits streaming, millions of ppl will watch it from the SAFETY of their homes.
@@Jhunta yea I was talking about wasteland. The is that if it doesn't do good in the cinema you can almost say goodbye to The Wasteland movie which does star mand Furious isn't in it a well. I just hate how people haven't seen it think the Furiosa in the film is a girl boss because she isn't. She doesn't beat up any 200 pound guys, she learn stuff from a man and when she finally met up Dementus she doesn't fight him. They g
Even Vasquez was still better written tough woman than modern day girl bosses. Vasquez fit the role perfectly and went down as a hero. When you look at characters like Captain Marvel you feel like this woman will let you die if you're a straight man because "the message" dictates men are trash.
You guys touched on all the topics I was hoping for, really great discussion
Except Im still unclear on how she isnt a girl boss. Unless there are lots of men in the story much stronger then she is... which I doubt. The message is still that women are stronger than men, and dont need men to protect them. They can do it all themselves.
You don't have to add men to the movie to prove it's not a "girl boss" movie, as the guys explain in their review it's more about not having all the male characters in the movie to have the sole purpose of looking weak and artificially propping up the girl boss in doing so. I haven't seen the movie but these guys do spend like 10 minutes explaining this exact point. You could disagree but if you watched the video I don't know how you can be confused on their position
Me too. How exactly is Furiosa correcting the mistakes of the Girl Boss trope?
But Vasquez was in love with the other heavy gunner, and when he died, you can see cared for him and his death is what really hardened her
"DRAKE! WE ARE LEAV-ING!"
I don't think Vasquez was in love with him, but I think their friendship was genuinely deep and affectionate.
@@timmholl9238 Yes, they were in love with their smart guns. It was comeradery.
It didn't really need to be a live thing. They left that vague, but they were definitely tight friends and had a brother sister chemistry at a minimum. Vasquez is an awesome character
@@timmholl9238 I'm with Comic Book Girl 19 on this one. My headcanon is that they were having incredibly grunty, dudebro sex every chance they got, but she'd call him gay if he ever confessed to having feelings for her (and vice versa).
George Miller made a second Furiosa movie in exactly the same vein as he made the first nine years ago.
This signifies nothing about Hollywood at large.
Another comment: What very important aspect did Ripley and Sarah share that drove them to be so determined?
Motherhood.
The Girl Boss(Sukeban) films from the 1970s were rad.
Sister Street Fighter
I’ll take the Teressa Woo “Angel” series any day.
Fury Road started the whole bait and switch girl boss era. It deserves more hate lol
_Mad Maxine_
@@slicedtopieces Tam Pax
so cute that you’re streaming this from your grandchildren’s room 🥰 they must have loved seeing all their toys lined up behind grampa! 😍
The girl boss trope has become so tedious, in fact, it has been for a few years now.
"Girl Boss" characters are not just written like men, they're written like villains. If a man was written the same way, they'd be recognized as a villain. Female characters are somehow supposed to be viewed as empowered and amazing when portraying toxic traits.
It’s not just lack of “character flaws”, it’s also the rejection of purpose bigger than yourself. The best protagonists rose to the occasion because OTHERS needed them. Ripley overcomes her fear and trauma because Newt was in danger, same thing for Sarah Connor, for Chief Brody, Alan Grant, Indiana Jones, Luke Skywalker. Their development grows not from some narcissistic need to prove themselves, but because their is a threat to everyone else and they need to do their part. Hero’s are sacrificial by nature, they have to be. When the lives of others are more important than their own. “Hero’s” nowadays seek nothing more than their own glory and recognition. It’s all about what makes them happy.
yes! someone overcoming odds for their own benefit is not a hero. I mean congrats on your success, but that ain't a hero.
Great video guys!
Mr. Terrific! Great pfp and account name!
This movie I really think is going to flop
Girl bosses have always existed in cinema, dating back to the times when actresses like Mary Pickford, Marlene Dietrich, and Bette Davis were stars of the silver screen. They may not have been physically intimidating, but they were tough women who were both feminine and scary. Nowadays, girl bosses are unrealistic and don’t have the same gravitas
The word "girlboss" wasn't even a thing. Those women you mentioned were all identified as action girls. A girlboss is a type of action girl that exists for the sole purpose to undermine men.
You pretty much mention the difference between a strong woman and a girl boss, kinda like the difference between something progressive and something woke.
@@xdomeman none of those women were action girls
@@DavidLeeAndrews oh. Still better than boss girls
@@xdomeman agreed 👍
Chris Hemsworth just isn't Mad Max, either.
I won't ever watch this.
We have hit the point where it's not I'll watch it when it's streaming, but rather I will never ever watch that trash.
Yeah, he literally isn't Mad Max in this movie. His character is a guy named Dementus.
Awesome video guys, agree 100%.
How that if only the girl bosses are. little more gritty we can do without male heroes, and its OK to replace them?
btw another couple of great recent female leads done well
River in Serenity ... broken until she found her purpose but once she found it she was incredible to see!
Naomi in the Expanse
so fragile yet again so incredibly strong and it was so beautifully written that you really felt for ALL of their cast!
no matter how they identified!
because they were ALL just people
trying to do the best in bad times
today Hollywood ONLY pushes hate!
With Captain Marvel, I think that instead of Brie Larson, they should have used Katheryn Winnick.
Katheryn is a few years older than Brie, but she also is not only beautiful, feminine at times, she also regularly practices martial arts and is trained in it. She also played Lagertha in Vikings, so she has experience playing a woman who balanced strength and feminity. And the MCU is not against using older actors for action roles, so there's no reason not to have considered her.
Coupled that with a better written script/story for Captain Marvel, we could be in a different place with Marvel where people wanted to see more Captain Marvel. Heck, maybe the Marvels would have been a good movie.
But even then, Brie was a fine choice in my eyes. She had the comedy and drama chops from her prior work, so she fit the mold for the MCU. She just got saddled with a couple of failures that were not her doing: A badly written script/story, and a character who just wasn't someone a lot of people felt towards. She also had been tainted by the establishment to give out some foolish rhetoric, and embarrassed herself.
I don’t have a problem with Carol Danvers. She’s always been a decent character… At least early on in the comic books. But, I think her mentor should’ve been the original Mar-Vel. I don’t like that they wrote my captain Marvel out of the universe by making him a girl. It would’ve undermined their narrative that she i.e., Carol Danvers, didn’t need no man to help her.
Sarah Connor is a mother. Ellen Ripley is Newt's surrogate mother. Their badassery is predicated on protecting their children. Their strength comes from their femininity.
In contrast, a girl-boss is a woman who acts like a man, denying the feminine. Also, a girl-boss as normally written has no character arc. Everything even possibly interesting about these characters has already occurred before the movie starts.
I have zero shame in admitting that the same way some women watch any trash movie Henry Cavill makes because it’s him, I watch any trash movie Anya Taylor Joy makes. I love Fury Road so I’m looking forward to this even if ends up being trash lol
In Fury Road, they meet a bunch of old women who use a woman in danger to lure men out into the open where the women can kill and eat them.
Yet, inexplicably, we are expect to cheer for these murderous cannibals for the remainder of the movie solely because they are women.
I'll never trust George Miller after that.
No, you're supposed to accept them because they are working to help our protagonists reach their goal. The reach is crazy in this one and reeks of Anti- Wokism
@@jgphilosophy9963not. He has a point. A gang of men wouldn't be treated like that. The audience would rightfully be expected to be disgusted.
Except if it's females. We've seen that in a bunch of modern media. Its never their fault, you're expected to forgive them.
They’re women trying to survive a post apocalyptic wasteland just like everyone else dude. I doubt George Miller was trying to get the audience on their side just because they are women. I think you’re projecting a bit
Ugh! We’re they cannibals ? I didnt catch that….😮
Don't remember them being cannibals. Thought they just robbed and killed anyone they caught. Seemed like hippies and vegans. Nothing suggested they ate people as far as I could see
Derek is killing it in this video. Great analysis! Alan is great, as per usual.
Anyone who shills for Furiosa shills for removing Mad Max.
This is one of the greatest conversations of all time.
Derek got it so spot on - "shortcuts" - sadly we live in a world of shortcuts. It is the steps we can relate to because those us living in the real world we know they are real. No shortcuts.
Captain Marvel was presented as someone that was always perfect, and it was all the men in her life that kept her down. And when she gained power randomly through magic, she could finally assert her role as the best.
"Marvel can do no wrong"
Captain Marvel: Hold my tampoon
9:35 I'm bailing. I've heard enough. Superman is and was never perfect, and I relate so closely to the character because there are so many people like you in the world.
The concept of girl boss defeats the very purpose of a female lead, which is having someone weak facing impossible odds, and still winning through sheer willpower, survival instincts, and some luck, while creating plus tension because said weakness. Similarly to when all weapons are taken from the protagonist by the writer(s).
I love that Jeanette Goldstein (Vasquez in Aliens) is in T2 as John's foster mom. She was a pro body builder so she was a legit badass.
Feels like you didn't talk about Furiosa nearly enough in making your point(s)!
8:14 I completely agree with you, and it's one of the biggest reasons I didn't read his comics. In fact, my favorite reads back then were Spiderman, Wolverine, Daredevil, etc. The street level heroes were always more my bag
How can a female action hero signify that it's over? This is still fantasy.
Thats an important point; in Aliens and T2, Ellen and Sarah are MOTHERS. badass but mothers.
In Aliens theatrical cut, that was not revealed. Only the extended edition revealed that.
In other words, we watched both Ripley and Conner grow into the role of the girl boss. It was earned. Apparently in this day and age the “earning it” is misogynistic.
The ultimate girl boss is Alita Battle Angel, a character with grace and strength, and without the obnoxious vibes of Rey Palpatine.
I love that movie. I watch it at least 2 or 3 times a year.
Too bad we will never get a sequel
I'm a huge Mad Max fan. And I'm not watching this movie because it isn't MM. Idgaf who says it's good or whatever. Miller has little time left and wasted it making a movie nobody wants about a character nobody gaf about. A 75lb little girl running around the desert means nothing to me. And the trailer is s**t.
I would rather have had a Max film.
Can we also mention Emily Blunt as the Full Metal B**** in Edge of Tomorrow? She was awesome as a well written "girl boss".
DA is the truth 💯🔥
I think getting rid of the strong, male hero like Superman is sort of analogous to not having fathers in the home. Its meant to accomplish the same thing.
Phenomenal deep dive
sill waiting for MarioKart FuryRoad, that looked awesome
I think a certain type of male really enjoys female warrior types because they appeal to them wanting a mother figure to protect them. Thats probably who liked this. I certainly hope it flops. I dont want this girlbossery to go on forever, and I dont care if its more survival mode, or why she is fighting and beating men.
@@phandaal I hope they are not common at all.
The Furiosa Production is getting nervous. From investors to actors are starting to get all this feedback that they may have made a $168 Million blunder.
By being yet another Boss Babe movie, talk about being woke, and invoking politics during an election and even fans getting told this is not their movie because this movie is for the youth. Not the actual Mad Max fans. And Mad Max fans didn't take that well.
Not even considering the inflation and people not having the excess discretionary income to go watch movies, when many are missing meals.
This movie could flop badly.
It almost lost to Garfield
The only skills these girlboss writers give two damns about are always fighting skills.
because they are written as replacements for male heroes. and these activist hacks have no life experience or understanding of male/female dynamics, and are trying to write women in place of men and the only way they understand that is to have women fighting men, overcoming and replacing them. it sucks cause from the start, the writing just suuuucks.
Oh I hope so!
I work in the entertainment industry. I’ve heard more than one male writer in the last 10 years say “how do you write a female character? You write a male character and just change the character to a female at the end”. In other words, to them there is no difference between writing a male or female character. But that’s obviously nonsense. Yes there are cliches and stereotypes to be mindful of and potentially avoid. But that doesn’t mean men & women think & behave the same.
Superman's weakness isn't just kryptonite. he's also weak to magic. but what makes his story interesting the villains use his code against him. they make him choose between equally bad outcomes. he has to figure out how to beat every scenario at once.
Geena Davis as Charli Baltimore was also a great female character that we see play the innocent damsel (thanks to amnesia) and total badass (but not perfect, or overpowered). Not the greatest movie but still underrated.
Girl boss in movies has made me less likely for me to watch any movie with female leads!! Done with female lead in movies!!
I completely agree. In my opinion he is describing the "strong and silent" girl boss as opposed to the loud and shrill girl boss, but still girl boss.
All new movies feature female leads.
All female leads are perfect girl bosses with male costars who are maligned.
Thus, I avoid all new movies and shows.
Furiosa is just George Miller writing Furiosa just like he wrote her in the first Furiosa movie.
He knew he wouldn't be allowed to make a Mad Max movie in 2024.
Same reason we aren't allowed to get Conan the King.
Derek is spittin too much truth, Hollywood can't handle that level of real
Superman was among the very first superheroes. Writers learned later about the limitations of a god-like, perfect protagonist but the character was baked in already. A real "modern take" on Superman would truly attempt at giving him flaws we (or even he) don't know about yet.
Girl bossing will never die with A) more women in Hollywood than ever before and B) the most radical forms of feminism so far
The girl boss doesn't work anymore. Back in the day, it could be believable. Lack of talent and life experience is ruining the entertainment industry.
Best film of the year so far. Love it.
That's "Furio-SA"