Considering how many times the evils were sealed or they were temporarily destroyed and that the heavens never used that to their advantage tells me that the angels are lazy bums.
@@Kris-wo4pjah I’m pretty sure the eternal conflict is the literal reason for being on both sides. the lore has described both angels and demons as being “instinctual beings”. I don’t think “winning” is on the agenda for either side as they would lose their purpose for existing. I think it’s just kinda hardwired into them, like eating or procreation for real life humans. I also think that’s why things ended up the way they did between lillith and inarius. both were doing shady shit from the start and I don’t think angel and demon could ever truly from a lasting union.
@rctecopyright Yeah that’s where the creators lost the plot for the sake of the story. Too bad they couldn’t have fit in a good mitigating circumstance to make the plot work. This way it’s just pointless to play and more entertaining to watch videos speculating on the story. I’ve long since lost interest in the story but enjoy the discussion on the story telling and this channel does a good job of that.
@@chamuuemura5314 The problem with Diablo lore is this 50:50 balance crap, which makes everything pointless. Hell does hell stuff but Heaven has to act stupid and weird otherwise it would be a too obvious decision for mankind or us as player who to follow in this conflict because there is nothing worse than Hell. It's also a problem that mankind is supposed to be half demon and half angel. You can never have a meaningful conclusion on anything like that. Generally you want Good to win or overcome the side which is basically nothing but psychopathic mass-muderers but here you don't know what all of that is supposed to mean with this 50:50 thing. Even if you get rid of both sides, it achieves nothing. What would even be the moral of the such a story? It's meaningless there is no higher goal it's just endless conflict for the sake of conflict.
i mean it could still be part of Mephisto plan to invade Sanctuary via soulstone , wouldnt be the first time the PrIme Evils lost on purpose to leave Hell
I think when trying to understand Lilith it is easy to forget that in this universe Angels and Demons are truly alien beings that do not fundamentally experience reality like humans or even neph do. I think the closest we got, and in turn a cataclysmic cognitive dissonance, was when Sanctuary was first made, but these are "immortal" beings born with who and what they are immediately. Sure they can 'choose', but fire can only be contained; never taught not to burn unless extinguished. What's good for the burning Hells is never good for anyone and high Heavens only exists so there is at least one area in this whole franchise that doesnt look like it smells absolutely terrible.
Honestly i still trust the demons more as a whole group. They both hate humans cuz they fear them or dont think they should exist but demons are atleast upfront about it.
@@Kris-wo4pj'd trust the angels, angels are generally honest about their disgust of you and some of them even like you. The demons lie and manipulate, they don't think you're disgusting, they think you're fodder.angel won't torture you, they'll simply squash you like an ant, demon will point a glass over your head and watch you burn for fun. Personally I'd rather be killed quickly than be treated as a toy
Love these videos. Will you be doing Lore videos on some of the dungeon bosses? It sucks that diablo devs dont care about lore much because i wanna know about some side bosses like the Drowned Sea hag and Blood bishop
Bit hypocritical for Lilith to kill someone elses' child, when she herself loathed Inarius for doing the same to their own. That, and claiming to /care/ about mortals. XD
@@KrigHammar But she also made definitive enemies in doing it the way that she did. She even hung around to see how sad and broken donan became after realizing his son was turned into astaroth.
I have never understood the “Lillith is the good guy” crowd. Her ambitions were to absorb the essence of her dad and become a Prime Evil. She slaughtered countless people. I don’t care if Inarius and the Church of Light are dicks, she is still the bad guy. (So is Inarius in my book). At the end of all of this Mephisto wins. So nothing was basically accomplished by either her or Inarius.
People lack the depth of understanding to see that both Inarius and Lillith are wrong as they are too far apart, the right choice is a balance between the two which neither care to reach
No such thing as a good guy in this game. Even tyrael he keeps disappearing to be anything. Shes just the lesser of two evils i feel. She'd make sure humans survived and got their full power back just cuz theyre useful to her. Inarius would wipe us out when he cant use us anymore if he every got baxk to heavwn.
I love these lore videos! I was wondering if I could request that you cover the tree of whispers, and its intentions. It takes the debts of men and demons alike, implying demons need its information. Did this tree exist before the nephalem, relying simply on the debts of demons? Is there a force the tree serves? Has Lilith the mother of Sanctuary caused this devilish dealership, or even acknowledged it’s existence?
I'm curious about Astaroth. His soulstone isn't attuned for hatred (we attune it in campaign), so is it safe to assume that he doesn't originate from mephisto's domain? Even his look doesn't match meph's estetic, which is mostly undead. Also the place where soulstone is placed matters in lore: mephisto had his soulstone in hand, baal in chest and diablo in forehead, just like astaroth. Maybe he is from diablo's domain? Or if we go by mixing colors, from both diablo's and baal's if it's even possible? Even his gimmick feels the most fitting for baal
It's the color. Blue, gold and crimson. The positioning matters though and so you may be correct about his origins, as he is rebirthed through the forehead for whatever reason 🤷🏾♂️. Maybe an oversight? There are two separate studios that do the gameplay and animations.
You've got to also consider when Diablo was reborn in d3 the black soulstone was plunged into Leah's chest Edit: my theory is that he's from somewhere between Diablo and Baal's region of hell because he gains strength from causing fear and destruction which are Diablo and Baal's motifs respectively
If I remember well from Diablo II, the Soulstone colors are like this: Crimson- Diablo Gold - Baal Blue- Mephisto So I assume Astaroth is from Baal's domain. As for placement: Forehead - Diablo Chest - Baal Hand - Mephisto Strange though that Astaroth would originate from Baal's domain but is summoned like Diablo.
@@Rogu75ell he caused alot of terror through his destruction. However, something mephisto isn't granted through the story is his cunning manipulation of the player character and neyrelle. So, he could be doing the same with Astaroth and lilith. Knowing lilith would seek a way into the cathedral, he summoned an outside demon from different realms knowing their loyalty lies with themselves first. Idk, it seems like alot of things would have to fall into play for mephisto, but he is a master manipulator ontop of being the lord of hatred so I wouldn't put it past him
@@NyxVellum As long as man is afraid of the dark, the Lord of Terror will always be the most powerful... Hence Diablo... Take all the time you need to drown your listeners in the utter futility that the humans of Sanctuary are actually up against.
I know I haven’t heard the whole lore of Astaroth. But I heard rumors he did cause such destruction to the druids, and even Donan was forced to seal him in the soulstone. When Lilith freed Astaroth for him to grant her safe passage to Mephisto’s cathedral, he possessed Yorin, Donan’s son, in order to take his true form as well as torment Donan mentally as his bonus. I at first thought Astaroth was a brutal demonic warrior. But after what I saw during my campaign on D4, Astaroth seemed to have a lot more tricks up his sleeve other than just his flames.
What tricks, what did astaroth do that got passed everyone, I'm genuinely curios. Is there something in the side quests that tell you more about what he was up too because all I know is he burned alot of things
@@NyxVellum Okay, same thing happened with the Prime Evils as well, but when that happened their souls returned back to the soulstones, not to the Burning Hells. In this case, how did Astaroth return to Hell?
Not likely to see Astaroth return. He is not important enough. We will most likely see the primes and remaining lesser evils in the expansions. As for a Paladin character that's got just as much as any other. Personally I'd rather see a monk. I imagine we will get one class per expansion.
Just realized how much Lilith and Asteroth remind me of Kerrigan and Stukov or Sylvanas and (I forget his dumb name) for me wow lore begins and ends with durotan
What's weird is that demons defeated while bound to a soulstone usually return to the stone, like the prime evils in Diablo 2. How Astaroth got sent back to hell and not the stone seems like a plothole to me
Pretty sure that Donan's very long attunement process expelled Astaroth from the stone so that it could be used on Mephisto later. Its color even changes from Astaroth's orange essence to Mephisto's blue hue after the attunement.
Something's wrong with the audio of this video. And I am sure there are other adjectives suitable for all the demons rather than using formidable over and over again..
Astaroth was such a badass and cool demon. Well done for creating a new Demon Blizz. I hope to see more of him in the future. A bit weird he respawned so fast in the Burning Hells when there were probably a few weeks from when he got killed by the hero and granting Lilith passage through the Hellfire wall and sea to Mephistos Cathedral. Probably made him come back fast as hell (no pun intended) when Donan attuned the soulstone towards Hatred.
It's not clear to me why Lilith needed to free Astaroth in order to be granted safe passage by him. And I don't buy the "she needed him to dispel the hellfire blocking the way" justification, because that same hellfire is easily dispelled by an *untrained* horadrim in what appeared to be a trivial spell. Plus...Lilith can fly.
I think they were working off an older story, because I heard something about diablo 4 being scrapped previously, which is why it took like a decade for it to come out again. Not sure if that's why but it's my guess, maybe two different writing teams. Also explains why the drastic change from diablo 2 to 3 since pretty much all the original blizzard north team wasn't on the project
guarding the realm of hatred… did you watch the video? we’ve never been to Mephisto’s realm in any of the other games games thus we’ve never seen the guardian of said realm.
WTF? I thought demons and angels don't just die or keep being dead for long, so in that sense Inarius and Lilith will be back in the fight for Sanctuary.
Too bad He's such an easy fight. Kind of a let down after all the buildup to his entrance. Giant scary dude riding a Cerberus, goes down with less effort than your common named boss demon in a dungeon....
Remember that angle get recycled in to new angles in yhe havens. were as the demon just keep coming back . New angle must be trained and gain battle experience. were demon keep all the experience they have so the demon have the advantage since they keep the battle experience
While we’re being constructive. Love the videos! Your pronunciation of possessives sound off: you say ‘Lilithes’ rather than ‘Liliths’ and ‘Astarothes’ rather than ‘Astaroths’. Looking forward to each new lore video!
I think Astaroth is the weakest part of the game. He just shows up without any real explanation. I kept thinking he must be some minor reject demon from D3 I forgot about. He pops in and the game acts like we should know who he is because he is such a badass, yet I just laugh at his dumb skeletor lookin face.
If you don't know how to pronounce a word, please look it up. It's so jarring listening to this and then hearing a word just spoken entirely incorrectly.
Considering how many times the evils were sealed or they were temporarily destroyed and that the heavens never used that to their advantage tells me that the angels are lazy bums.
I think they like having the war going on or are so use to fighting they refuse to do anything to make it stop.
@@Kris-wo4pjah I’m pretty sure the eternal conflict is the literal reason for being on both sides. the lore has described both angels and demons as being “instinctual beings”. I don’t think “winning” is on the agenda for either side as they would lose their purpose for existing. I think it’s just kinda hardwired into them, like eating or procreation for real life humans.
I also think that’s why things ended up the way they did between lillith and inarius. both were doing shady shit from the start and I don’t think angel and demon could ever truly from a lasting union.
Angel dont looks for victory they looks for balance bro in the lore they also make some kinde of barggein with mephisto
@rctecopyright
Yeah that’s where the creators lost the plot for the sake of the story.
Too bad they couldn’t have fit in a good mitigating circumstance to make the plot work. This way it’s just pointless to play and more entertaining to watch videos speculating on the story. I’ve long since lost interest in the story but enjoy the discussion on the story telling and this channel does a good job of that.
@@chamuuemura5314 The problem with Diablo lore is this 50:50 balance crap, which makes everything pointless.
Hell does hell stuff but Heaven has to act stupid and weird otherwise it would be a too obvious decision for mankind or us as player who to follow in this conflict because there is nothing worse than Hell.
It's also a problem that mankind is supposed to be half demon and half angel. You can never have a meaningful conclusion on anything like that.
Generally you want Good to win or overcome the side which is basically nothing but psychopathic mass-muderers but here you don't know what all of that is supposed to mean with this 50:50 thing.
Even if you get rid of both sides, it achieves nothing. What would even be the moral of the such a story? It's meaningless there is no higher goal it's just endless conflict for the sake of conflict.
you'd think lilith would question why Mephisto's most loyal follower would "betray" him without much more thought than a 2 minute cutscene
Killing humans > everything else apparently.
I have a theory that he was working for mephisto all along and playing his part
Revenge is fueled by hatred. Mephisto would understand.
I mean asteroth got freed so that's a better deal then inprisonment
i mean it could still be part of Mephisto plan to invade Sanctuary via soulstone , wouldnt be the first time the PrIme Evils lost on purpose to leave Hell
I think when trying to understand Lilith it is easy to forget that in this universe Angels and Demons are truly alien beings that do not fundamentally experience reality like humans or even neph do. I think the closest we got, and in turn a cataclysmic cognitive dissonance, was when Sanctuary was first made, but these are "immortal" beings born with who and what they are immediately. Sure they can 'choose', but fire can only be contained; never taught not to burn unless extinguished. What's good for the burning Hells is never good for anyone and high Heavens only exists so there is at least one area in this whole franchise that doesnt look like it smells absolutely terrible.
Honestly i still trust the demons more as a whole group. They both hate humans cuz they fear them or dont think they should exist but demons are atleast upfront about it.
@@Kris-wo4pj'd trust the angels, angels are generally honest about their disgust of you and some of them even like you. The demons lie and manipulate, they don't think you're disgusting, they think you're fodder.angel won't torture you, they'll simply squash you like an ant, demon will point a glass over your head and watch you burn for fun. Personally I'd rather be killed quickly than be treated as a toy
That fight with him is my fav in d4
Love these videos. Will you be doing Lore videos on some of the dungeon bosses? It sucks that diablo devs dont care about lore much because i wanna know about some side bosses like the Drowned Sea hag and Blood bishop
That's a great idea!
Mephisto had it his way. He's the real mastermind of this game
Bit hypocritical for Lilith to kill someone elses' child, when she herself loathed Inarius for doing the same to their own. That, and claiming to /care/ about mortals. XD
Good point.
most evil thing she does, and it's pretty unnecessary. I guess a demons gotta demon sometimes
@@faceless_man566their very essences are evil. they exist to spread Tathamet’s chaos and darkness. there is no breaking free from that nature.
It was with purposes. Astaroth hated the horadrim so it was more easily convinced to take Lilith offer, since he was driven by ravage toward horadrim.
@@KrigHammar But she also made definitive enemies in doing it the way that she did. She even hung around to see how sad and broken donan became after realizing his son was turned into astaroth.
Good luck convincing me Lilith is the good guy on this one 😅
I have never understood the “Lillith is the good guy” crowd. Her ambitions were to absorb the essence of her dad and become a Prime Evil.
She slaughtered countless people.
I don’t care if Inarius and the Church of Light are dicks, she is still the bad guy. (So is Inarius in my book).
At the end of all of this Mephisto wins. So nothing was basically accomplished by either her or Inarius.
People lack the depth of understanding to see that both Inarius and Lillith are wrong as they are too far apart, the right choice is a balance between the two which neither care to reach
Its just like Supernatural. Both Angels and Demons suck.
There are no good guys in Diablo. Tyrael was the only one, and he’s nowhere to be found.
No such thing as a good guy in this game. Even tyrael he keeps disappearing to be anything. Shes just the lesser of two evils i feel. She'd make sure humans survived and got their full power back just cuz theyre useful to her. Inarius would wipe us out when he cant use us anymore if he every got baxk to heavwn.
I love these lore videos! I was wondering if I could request that you cover the tree of whispers, and its intentions.
It takes the debts of men and demons alike, implying demons need its information. Did this tree exist before the nephalem, relying simply on the debts of demons? Is there a force the tree serves? Has Lilith the mother of Sanctuary caused this devilish dealership, or even acknowledged it’s existence?
What a great idea. I'll look into that.
Good vid been wait for this guy
Thank you for your comment and your nice words.
I'm curious about Astaroth. His soulstone isn't attuned for hatred (we attune it in campaign), so is it safe to assume that he doesn't originate from mephisto's domain? Even his look doesn't match meph's estetic, which is mostly undead. Also the place where soulstone is placed matters in lore: mephisto had his soulstone in hand, baal in chest and diablo in forehead, just like astaroth. Maybe he is from diablo's domain? Or if we go by mixing colors, from both diablo's and baal's if it's even possible? Even his gimmick feels the most fitting for baal
Maybe Diablo? Only Donan would know the answer that.
It's the color. Blue, gold and crimson. The positioning matters though and so you may be correct about his origins, as he is rebirthed through the forehead for whatever reason 🤷🏾♂️. Maybe an oversight? There are two separate studios that do the gameplay and animations.
You've got to also consider when Diablo was reborn in d3 the black soulstone was plunged into Leah's chest
Edit: my theory is that he's from somewhere between Diablo and Baal's region of hell because he gains strength from causing fear and destruction which are Diablo and Baal's motifs respectively
If I remember well from Diablo II, the Soulstone colors are like this:
Crimson- Diablo
Gold - Baal
Blue- Mephisto
So I assume Astaroth is from Baal's domain.
As for placement:
Forehead - Diablo
Chest - Baal
Hand - Mephisto
Strange though that Astaroth would originate from Baal's domain but is summoned like Diablo.
@@Rogu75ell he caused alot of terror through his destruction. However, something mephisto isn't granted through the story is his cunning manipulation of the player character and neyrelle. So, he could be doing the same with Astaroth and lilith. Knowing lilith would seek a way into the cathedral, he summoned an outside demon from different realms knowing their loyalty lies with themselves first. Idk, it seems like alot of things would have to fall into play for mephisto, but he is a master manipulator ontop of being the lord of hatred so I wouldn't put it past him
Great vid broski keep it up. I’m newer to the series so each lore video helps a lot with the story and each character in game:)
Thank you very much. I'm happy to hear you find something for you in my videos.
So... no one is gonna say anything about Widowmaker from Overwatch at 7:27?
lol I noticed
Widowmaker at 7:30 just makes sense. Definitely the company she would keep especially after the Medusa skin.
Love the content. Small suggestion, I know D4 is killing it right now, but take it back to the beginning.
Like waaaay back before the events of Diablo 1?
@@NyxVellum Yessir... like the Sin War and all of that. Maybe not cover the lore of it first, but the story itself for context as well as depth.
It would take a long time but it's doable.
@@NyxVellum As long as man is afraid of the dark, the Lord of Terror will always be the most powerful... Hence Diablo... Take all the time you need to drown your listeners in the utter futility that the humans of Sanctuary are actually up against.
Love it when you use lorebits from item tekst or snippes from the games that i missed when playing though.. indgame dialog and stuff
I would like a video explaining how strong the wanderer really is I’m dying to know
That's easy. Very strong.
I think they are stronger than all the prime evils combined, as well as the angels, potentially
@@NyxVellumis the wanderer and a nephilin
I know I haven’t heard the whole lore of Astaroth. But I heard rumors he did cause such destruction to the druids, and even Donan was forced to seal him in the soulstone. When Lilith freed Astaroth for him to grant her safe passage to Mephisto’s cathedral, he possessed Yorin, Donan’s son, in order to take his true form as well as torment Donan mentally as his bonus. I at first thought Astaroth was a brutal demonic warrior. But after what I saw during my campaign on D4, Astaroth seemed to have a lot more tricks up his sleeve other than just his flames.
He'a just following Mephisto's schemes
You nailed it pretty much. He is a mini mephisto.
@@NyxVellum Belial will get jealous
What tricks, what did astaroth do that got passed everyone, I'm genuinely curios. Is there something in the side quests that tell you more about what he was up too because all I know is he burned alot of things
But how was Astaroth's connection with his soulstone broken?
Not sure. I rewatched the fight and when the physical body goes back to being Yorin, the stone falls out.
@@NyxVellum Okay, same thing happened with the Prime Evils as well, but when that happened their souls returned back to the soulstones, not to the Burning Hells. In this case, how did Astaroth return to Hell?
I can see him coming back, with Mephisto, Baal and Diablo. Same thing with the paladin/crusader.
Not likely to see Astaroth return. He is not important enough. We will most likely see the primes and remaining lesser evils in the expansions. As for a Paladin character that's got just as much as any other. Personally I'd rather see a monk. I imagine we will get one class per expansion.
Just realized how much Lilith and Asteroth remind me of Kerrigan and Stukov or Sylvanas and (I forget his dumb name) for me wow lore begins and ends with durotan
Astaroth was so badass in game.
the voice threw me off i was like "wait this isnt dark lore dash"
god damned good job tho. fine work keep it up
How did Astaroth recovered so fast?
What's weird is that demons defeated while bound to a soulstone usually return to the stone, like the prime evils in Diablo 2. How Astaroth got sent back to hell and not the stone seems like a plothole to me
It's a good point.
Because we spent some time to remove him from the stone, to attune it to Mephisto latter
Pretty sure that Donan's very long attunement process expelled Astaroth from the stone so that it could be used on Mephisto later. Its color even changes from Astaroth's orange essence to Mephisto's blue hue after the attunement.
Less powerful stone
Something's wrong with the audio of this video. And I am sure there are other adjectives suitable for all the demons rather than using formidable over and over again..
Astaroth hates humans? Dang, I thought he kept incinerating us to keep us warm from fierces winters of Scolgen
Aw, and I bought him flowers...
I feel like thew threw away so much potential for the story!! I want more Lilith!!
Agreed, I really hope we see her again… maybe some sort of arc with Inarius, since she sent him to Hell 🤓
Astaroth was such a badass and cool demon. Well done for creating a new Demon Blizz. I hope to see more of him in the future. A bit weird he respawned so fast in the Burning Hells when there were probably a few weeks from when he got killed by the hero and granting Lilith passage through the Hellfire wall and sea to Mephistos Cathedral. Probably made him come back fast as hell (no pun intended) when Donan attuned the soulstone towards Hatred.
"new demon" thats not a new demon my guy
Everyone realizes gaspar stillbane is guarding astaroths area? Everyone realizes this yes? We can’t kill demons rn because we are in hell.
It's not clear to me why Lilith needed to free Astaroth in order to be granted safe passage by him. And I don't buy the "she needed him to dispel the hellfire blocking the way" justification, because that same hellfire is easily dispelled by an *untrained* horadrim in what appeared to be a trivial spell. Plus...Lilith can fly.
I think they were working off an older story, because I heard something about diablo 4 being scrapped previously, which is why it took like a decade for it to come out again. Not sure if that's why but it's my guess, maybe two different writing teams. Also explains why the drastic change from diablo 2 to 3 since pretty much all the original blizzard north team wasn't on the project
Thanks for the warning. I'll be back. Lol
I'm never sure they are useful so knowing I didn't spoil you makes me happy!
He hates us? Nah! He just wants to stab us with his claws
Probably more of a 'burn you alive' kind of guy.
KERIGAH!
Astaroth literally came out of nowhere. Like where was he in the last three Diablos?
guarding the realm of hatred… did you watch the video? we’ve never been to Mephisto’s realm in any of the other games games thus we’ve never seen the guardian of said realm.
WTF? I thought demons and angels don't just die or keep being dead for long, so in that sense Inarius and Lilith will be back in the fight for Sanctuary.
to be honest, asteroth look comical in the cut scene, that eyes lol
If she would have started with Baal and Diablo she would have won. But, you know... writers.
She just wanted to see her dad one last time 😞
All this talk bout Liliths plan yet if you really think bout it shes just a place holder like inarius nit impressed with the story my self
Wow
Haters gunna hate
He really isn't a fan of humanity this guy.
Bro really named his son "Urin"
Too bad He's such an easy fight. Kind of a let down after all the buildup to his entrance. Giant scary dude riding a Cerberus, goes down with less effort than your common named boss demon in a dungeon....
duh doy on the thumbnail
Remember that angle get recycled in to new angles in yhe havens. were as the demon just keep coming back . New angle must be trained and gain battle experience. were demon keep all the experience they have so the demon have the advantage since they keep the battle experience
Promo_SM ✔️
"Kerrigar"
Hi, the subtitles are a mess. Mostly names. It is like someone makes jokes. Or you are using a really bad AI. Someone could take it as an insult...
It's Premiere auto captions and you are right, they aren't good enough. I'll be hiring someone to do these for me very soon.
While we’re being constructive. Love the videos! Your pronunciation of possessives sound off: you say ‘Lilithes’ rather than ‘Liliths’ and ‘Astarothes’ rather than ‘Astaroths’. Looking forward to each new lore video!
I think Astaroth is the weakest part of the game. He just shows up without any real explanation. I kept thinking he must be some minor reject demon from D3 I forgot about. He pops in and the game acts like we should know who he is because he is such a badass, yet I just laugh at his dumb skeletor lookin face.
Please please please learn how to say lilith’s and astaroth’s; its not Astarothus or lilithus
Astarothouss
young yorin, not young dorin/ 6:28
yoran and dorin
If you don't know how to pronounce a word, please look it up. It's so jarring listening to this and then hearing a word just spoken entirely incorrectly.
Lilithes
@@NyxVellum there's a solid 5 or 6 words you say incorrectly all the time it kills me inside :')
I would like to know how he reforms so fast yet we are to believe it takes 50+ years for mephisto to reform