So great to see a mic shootout video where specs and details are covered for each mic. Thank you for the time and effort you guys put into this. It’s truly appreciated!
Videos such as this one are invaluable, it's a shame there are so few out there. Not that it's surprising - I can only imagine how much work it took to put it all together. Hats off for all those hours you spent on this gem, we're all greatful!
Really good comparison.... I personally prefer the e 602 II which I use now, I used to use the D112 but it makes the bass drum sound like a bouncing basketball. I would still use the D112 if I was looking for a more "classic" 80's/90's sound. I use a reso head with a Remo Powerstroke P3 clear batter head packed with a pillow.
Weve been talking about doing a video on what different heads do on a kick. Some engineers here argue it does little, our session drummers argue its a huge difference. Feel wise i imagine theres a big difference. Soundwise… not sure. What are your thoughts on the powerstrokes?
I like the powerstroke P3 as it is a clear single ply head with the muffle ring on the outside. You get more "slap" on the clear head vs double ply or coated heads. Then again I add the Remo Falam Slam double pedal patch which changes the sound. There is a video from the Art of Drumming you tube channel that compares bass drum heads but didn't compare vs adding the impact patches or different brands.@@meistudiony
Days of my life ill never get back lol. It taught me a valuable lesson though. Never try to compare this amount of mics ever again. Lol Thanks for checkin it out!
D12vr works in almost every scenario thanks to the active circuit Sennheiser e602 seems to sound good no matter what. Also its bleed control was phenomenal. d12 has the widest delta between “amazing” and “dumpster fire” depending on scenario/placement This video is sorely missing the m88. It’s a top 5 kick mic imo.
I would have loved to get the 88 in there unfortunately there is not one person i know near me that owned one that I could grab it from before doing it. I would like to hit that mic in the future and put it through its paces. To me the D12 is very mid forward which works well on bass, low brass and outside kick. Not a big fan of it inside.
I agree! It should have been on here. It's also on my list to get. I have been putting together my own kick mic arsenal and have curated the "popular" ones including Audix D4 and D6, Sennheiser e602 II and e902, Warm Audio WA-47F, AKG D12VR and D112, Yamaha Subkick, Lewitt DTP640 Rex (criminally underrated mic), Telefunken M82, Shure SM7B and Shure SM7dB. Some of these mics like the RE20 or the Heil just weren't pleasing to my ears. The Audio-Technica did prompt a second listen and make me consider adding it as well.
I didn't like any of the D12s even though they're so beloved. In most positions I didn't like E602, ATM25, Beta 52A, or D6. The M82 and PR40 had the most unique character but would need another mic like the BL8 to round out the sound. The ND68 is one of best all round sounding to me in most of the positions, with the PL33 often being quite a bit worse for not much cheaper. The RE20 was just okay, but the RE320 was similar for a lot cheaper. The SM7B was similarly okay, would be interesting to compare it to the SM57 for way cheaper. Of all these mics, I'd be most likely to buy the ND68 and RE320, the PR40 or M82 for character option but they're very expensive, $149 for the PR40 must be a typo because they're $349 on Heil's site, and the BL8 for convenience and simple low end sound.
Yet an other proof that I don’t like two of the most popular mics for kick and why. The D112 sounds like a basketball hitting the ground (I love it on some bass amps though)and the beta 52 has so much attack in a narrow band that everything from the kick to any bleed has that resonance very pronounced. I ve found my golden ratio mic that sits somewhere between those two and I find it more useful and easier to place and eq and more versatile, I v bought a ev pl33 that was a bargain at 80€ new and I love it. I may find occasionally better mics for some use cases but it is still a great sounding versatile mic that I like in most kicks and also at the port of percussions like a canon, a Darbouka, a djembe etc One of my favourite mics for kick is the m88 maybe not a kick mic but it is great for that. I want to buy a v7x and I will try it for kick cause it seems to have similar low end extension as the m88
The m88 is like the swiss army knife of mics. Doesnt matter what you throw at it, it can handle it. The PL33 was surprising to me. No one ever talks about that mic. I dont know anyone that uses it but its got a great tone to it for kick and floor tom.
Hey, Pax: I've been out of the studio for about 30 years, and sometime in that period it became fashionable to take the "woofer" from an NS-10 and use it to mic a kick drum. Now, I can imagine how this happened. Since NS-10's sound like crap, some bored engineer probably decided to see if he could make something useful from one. I just wonder, what the heck does it sound like?
So the sub kick originates from that exact situation. It sound like…. A sub… in that theres very little to no high end and just a ton of bottom energy. Think a kick mic with a low pass filter down around 100hz or less. The ns10 speakers were so prevalent, since studios would have fools that would blow them regularly. Thankfully, yamaha had plenty in stock back in the day and engineers found fun ways to use them when the ns10 dropped out of favor (thankfully). So the speaker as a diaphragm, a mic transformer (some used the transformer from an sm57 which was left over from doing the tranformerless mod). To an xlr connector and held up by a snare stand. Avantone makes pretty decent replicas of the speaker which arent crazy expensive. Perhaps that might be a fun bench tips video to do one day. Ive been working on a smaller version of the same idea for a long time with varied results. Maybe ill just grab an avantone and try it out. Great comment! Thx
Yamaha actually sold a dedicated subkick mic, using one of those reverse wired ns10 speakers housed inside a small drum shell. It sorta looked like a small snare drum! I'm sure you will find some audio demos of the mic on youtube if you search "Yamaha Subkick" and lots of home made examples. They are nearly always combined with another kick drum mic to get the attack, with the subkick getting the low end only!
I haven’t tried one made with an NS-10 speaker, I ve heard live a Yamaha subkick and one that a friend made from a guitar speaker and I liked the low end coming from the subs. I have recorded a sub kick that I “made” the easiest way, I used a 30w Ibanez bass combo amp that I have which has a jack going from the amp to the speaker, I connected the jack to a di and I ve put the whole bass amp in front of the kick and record it. It has a tweeter also in the middle so I don’t know how much different it may be from a typical sub kick. Because of the size of the speaker it has a bit of slow reaction to transients, a huge low end extension and maybe because of the position it has a sound that reminds you the kick you feel on the chest when a kick drum is played in front of you. Even with a tweeter in my occasion most of the energy is on the sub the lows and low mids after them it drops significantly similar to using a high cut filter. Nice sound for combining with a mic inside
Absolutely EPIC! and so useful! So many within and between mic and method combinations. Great job organizing and standardizing all the stats and graphs. Thanks!
Not a whole lot... especially in the bottom end. Its definitely compressed. If you watch in anything less than 1080p the sound is significantly different (at least to my ears) so Im guessing however bandwidth limited the video is the audio also gets squished.
the voicing switch on the 320 i wish was on the RE20 as another option from the high pass. The tone is more modern, not a bad thing and works well on a bunch of different sources. Thanks for watching!
D12VR and BL8 sounded superior on my monitors. Also among my least favorite is the one I most often use and am rarely satisfied with, the Beta 52. I’m curious to know how you placed that BL8 boundary mic for this test.
For my taste & style I’m sold on the sennheiser e602ii. It really shocked me. Was & still is a big fan of the Beta52, but now I’m looking at that e602. It sounded wonderful in every application! Thank you for this video!
@@meistudiony yes its really helpful ! For example , i always overlook the Sennheiser e602 II and now i fall in love with the boomy sound ! Thanks for this kind of videos i very appreciate it
I'm no-pack, reso on. I like the EV ND68 here as kind of a punchy unbiased sound, and then the Sennheiser e602-II for something opposite. Maybe throw in the Beta52A and you could probably cover just about anything.
The ND68 was the surprise of the bunch for me. Was not expecting such a balanced sound from a mic that is so off the radar. Thanks for checking it out!
@@meistudiony I created samples of my 22x16 Premier Signia maple bass drum, with internal muffling, and the EV ND68 sounds nearly identical to my 90's AKG D112 in the same position inside the bass drum, with the only distinction being "maybe" the D112 has a touch more low end, however, the EV ND68 is much easier to work with in terms of getting it inside the port hole and positioning it within the drum. I also created outer kick samples, but I have not reviewed those yet.
Drummer here, I find that it has a lot to do with the kick head and muffling. Some of my personal favs I use are: ATM 25 Sen 602 (original) D112 mk1 Wish I had a d12 or a d30. Favorite kick head is a power stroke 3 or a coated power stroke 3. I tend to like my drums big and open. Thank you for the video! Now I gotta watch it all the way through lol.
Thanks for the comment. Prior to this video i had the kick setup very muted. Since doing this i like the sound more open as well. Our session drummer mentioned he wanted to put some single ply skins on the kit next time we change heads. From the engineering side i gravitate towards pinstripe on the toms. But im looking forward to checking out different skins to see how that changes tone. Appreciate you checking out the channel!
@@meistudiony You're no doubt one of the best audio channels on TH-cam. I'm, dying that your channel hasn't blown up yet but cherish it like others. perhaps you need to sell some plug ins and spew some bullshit like the 99% ;P My favorte heads are Remo, Ambassador, Emperor, Black Dot and Pin Stripe. Remo just sound like records to me and other brands are just fine. They just seem slightly off. Negligible differences at the end of the day I am sure. An unmuted coated ambassador on snare just sounds like a snare to me. Cheers.
@@BlueHouseSoundStudio i sincerely thank you! I dont plan on shilling plugins any time soon, and one of the reasons i started this channel was to try and NOT contribute to the BS factor as much as possible. Research is getting harder these days as there just so much misinformation out there. But yeah... You think doing a video on different skin types would be worth it or has it been done to death?
So great to see a mic shootout video where specs and details are covered for each mic. Thank you for the time and effort you guys put into this. It’s truly appreciated!
Thanks so much for the comment. This is probably the hardest video I've done (time and prep wise).
Videos such as this one are invaluable, it's a shame there are so few out there. Not that it's surprising - I can only imagine how much work it took to put it all together. Hats off for all those hours you spent on this gem, we're all greatful!
I have started following your channel - Thanks for the incredibly insightful and comprehensive reviews/shootouts. Great work!
Thanks so much for the follow and checking out the videos! I really appreciate it! If theres anything you'd like to see be sure to hit me up!
great job dude! very unique and very detailed.
Thanks for checking it out. This was a rough one to put together!
Really good comparison.... I personally prefer the e 602 II which I use now, I used to use the D112 but it makes the bass drum sound like a bouncing basketball. I would still use the D112 if I was looking for a more "classic" 80's/90's sound. I use a reso head with a Remo Powerstroke P3 clear batter head packed with a pillow.
Weve been talking about doing a video on what different heads do on a kick. Some engineers here argue it does little, our session drummers argue its a huge difference. Feel wise i imagine theres a big difference. Soundwise… not sure. What are your thoughts on the powerstrokes?
I like the powerstroke P3 as it is a clear single ply head with the muffle ring on the outside. You get more "slap" on the clear head vs double ply or coated heads. Then again I add the Remo Falam Slam double pedal patch which changes the sound. There is a video from the Art of Drumming you tube channel that compares bass drum heads but didn't compare vs adding the impact patches or different brands.@@meistudiony
I've always used that exact description for the D112!
This must have taken FOREVER to do!! Wow really great work gentlemen!
Days of my life ill never get back lol. It taught me a valuable lesson though. Never try to compare this amount of mics ever again. Lol
Thanks for checkin it out!
D12vr works in almost every scenario thanks to the active circuit
Sennheiser e602 seems to sound good no matter what. Also its bleed control was phenomenal.
d12 has the widest delta between “amazing” and “dumpster fire” depending on scenario/placement
This video is sorely missing the m88. It’s a top 5 kick mic imo.
I would have loved to get the 88 in there unfortunately there is not one person i know near me that owned one that I could grab it from before doing it. I would like to hit that mic in the future and put it through its paces.
To me the D12 is very mid forward which works well on bass, low brass and outside kick. Not a big fan of it inside.
I agree! It should have been on here. It's also on my list to get. I have been putting together my own kick mic arsenal and have curated the "popular" ones including Audix D4 and D6, Sennheiser e602 II and e902, Warm Audio WA-47F, AKG D12VR and D112, Yamaha Subkick, Lewitt DTP640 Rex (criminally underrated mic), Telefunken M82, Shure SM7B and Shure SM7dB.
Some of these mics like the RE20 or the Heil just weren't pleasing to my ears. The Audio-Technica did prompt a second listen and make me consider adding it as well.
I didn't like any of the D12s even though they're so beloved. In most positions I didn't like E602, ATM25, Beta 52A, or D6. The M82 and PR40 had the most unique character but would need another mic like the BL8 to round out the sound. The ND68 is one of best all round sounding to me in most of the positions, with the PL33 often being quite a bit worse for not much cheaper. The RE20 was just okay, but the RE320 was similar for a lot cheaper. The SM7B was similarly okay, would be interesting to compare it to the SM57 for way cheaper. Of all these mics, I'd be most likely to buy the ND68 and RE320, the PR40 or M82 for character option but they're very expensive, $149 for the PR40 must be a typo because they're $349 on Heil's site, and the BL8 for convenience and simple low end sound.
Youre right, i havent looked in a while but the PR40 is $349 new, I picked it up for $150 used. Good catch! Thanks for checking it out.
Yet an other proof that I don’t like two of the most popular mics for kick and why. The D112 sounds like a basketball hitting the ground (I love it on some bass amps though)and the beta 52 has so much attack in a narrow band that everything from the kick to any bleed has that resonance very pronounced.
I ve found my golden ratio mic that sits somewhere between those two and I find it more useful and easier to place and eq and more versatile, I v bought a ev pl33 that was a bargain at 80€ new and I love it. I may find occasionally better mics for some use cases but it is still a great sounding versatile mic that I like in most kicks and also at the port of percussions like a canon, a Darbouka, a djembe etc
One of my favourite mics for kick is the m88 maybe not a kick mic but it is great for that. I want to buy a v7x and I will try it for kick cause it seems to have similar low end extension as the m88
The m88 is like the swiss army knife of mics. Doesnt matter what you throw at it, it can handle it. The PL33 was surprising to me. No one ever talks about that mic. I dont know anyone that uses it but its got a great tone to it for kick and floor tom.
Hey, Pax: I've been out of the studio for about 30 years, and sometime in that period it became fashionable to take the "woofer" from an NS-10 and use it to mic a kick drum. Now, I can imagine how this happened. Since NS-10's sound like crap, some bored engineer probably decided to see if he could make something useful from one. I just wonder, what the heck does it sound like?
So the sub kick originates from that exact situation. It sound like…. A sub… in that theres very little to no high end and just a ton of bottom energy. Think a kick mic with a low pass filter down around 100hz or less.
The ns10 speakers were so prevalent, since studios would have fools that would blow them regularly. Thankfully, yamaha had plenty in stock back in the day and engineers found fun ways to use them when the ns10 dropped out of favor (thankfully). So the speaker as a diaphragm, a mic transformer (some used the transformer from an sm57 which was left over from doing the tranformerless mod). To an xlr connector and held up by a snare stand. Avantone makes pretty decent replicas of the speaker which arent crazy expensive.
Perhaps that might be a fun bench tips video to do one day. Ive been working on a smaller version of the same idea for a long time with varied results. Maybe ill just grab an avantone and try it out. Great comment! Thx
Yamaha actually sold a dedicated subkick mic, using one of those reverse wired ns10 speakers housed inside a small drum shell. It sorta looked like a small snare drum! I'm sure you will find some audio demos of the mic on youtube if you search "Yamaha Subkick" and lots of home made examples. They are nearly always combined with another kick drum mic to get the attack, with the subkick getting the low end only!
I haven’t tried one made with an NS-10 speaker, I ve heard live a Yamaha subkick and one that a friend made from a guitar speaker and I liked the low end coming from the subs.
I have recorded a sub kick that I “made” the easiest way, I used a 30w Ibanez bass combo amp that I have which has a jack going from the amp to the speaker, I connected the jack to a di and I ve put the whole bass amp in front of the kick and record it. It has a tweeter also in the middle so I don’t know how much different it may be from a typical sub kick. Because of the size of the speaker it has a bit of slow reaction to transients, a huge low end extension and maybe because of the position it has a sound that reminds you the kick you feel on the chest when a kick drum is played in front of you. Even with a tweeter in my occasion most of the energy is on the sub the lows and low mids after them it drops significantly similar to using a high cut filter. Nice sound for combining with a mic inside
Absolutely EPIC! and so useful! So many within and between mic and method combinations. Great job organizing and standardizing all the stats and graphs. Thanks!
Thanks for checking it out. This was quite the task to put together!! Appreciate it!
Thanks for this! Great comparison. In listening back to the published vid, does YT change the sound much?
Not a whole lot... especially in the bottom end. Its definitely compressed. If you watch in anything less than 1080p the sound is significantly different (at least to my ears) so Im guessing however bandwidth limited the video is the audio also gets squished.
The RE320 was a great surprise, especially with the eq switch!
the voicing switch on the 320 i wish was on the RE20 as another option from the high pass. The tone is more modern, not a bad thing and works well on a bunch of different sources. Thanks for watching!
D12VR and BL8 sounded superior on my monitors. Also among my least favorite is the one I most often use and am rarely satisfied with, the Beta 52. I’m curious to know how you placed that BL8 boundary mic for this test.
Thanks for checking it out. The BL8 was placed on a small towel in the center of the kick pointing towards the batter head.
For my taste & style I’m sold on the sennheiser e602ii. It really shocked me. Was & still is a big fan of the Beta52, but now I’m looking at that e602. It sounded wonderful in every application! Thank you for this video!
Thanks for checking it out. It was quite the undertaking. Glad so many people are getting something from this video.
what an incredible effort you did , thanks for this helpful video !
Thanks for the comment, this video was a little overwhelming to put together. Hopefully it helps someone out there with something lol.
@@meistudiony yes its really helpful ! For example , i always overlook the Sennheiser e602 II and now i fall in love with the boomy sound ! Thanks for this kind of videos i very appreciate it
Thank you @@jonathangoldenarrow, this kinda comment makes it all worth it to me!
I'm no-pack, reso on. I like the EV ND68 here as kind of a punchy unbiased sound, and then the Sennheiser e602-II for something opposite. Maybe throw in the Beta52A and you could probably cover just about anything.
The ND68 was the surprise of the bunch for me. Was not expecting such a balanced sound from a mic that is so off the radar. Thanks for checking it out!
@@meistudiony I created samples of my 22x16 Premier Signia maple bass drum, with internal muffling, and the EV ND68 sounds nearly identical to my 90's AKG D112 in the same position inside the bass drum, with the only distinction being "maybe" the D112 has a touch more low end, however, the EV ND68 is much easier to work with in terms of getting it inside the port hole and positioning it within the drum. I also created outer kick samples, but I have not reviewed those yet.
Drummer here, I find that it has a lot to do with the kick head and muffling. Some of my personal favs I use are:
ATM 25
Sen 602 (original)
D112 mk1
Wish I had a d12 or a d30.
Favorite kick head is a power stroke 3 or a coated power stroke 3. I tend to like my drums big and open.
Thank you for the video! Now I gotta watch it all the way through lol.
Thanks for the comment. Prior to this video i had the kick setup very muted. Since doing this i like the sound more open as well. Our session drummer mentioned he wanted to put some single ply skins on the kit next time we change heads. From the engineering side i gravitate towards pinstripe on the toms. But im looking forward to checking out different skins to see how that changes tone. Appreciate you checking out the channel!
@@meistudiony You're no doubt one of the best audio channels on TH-cam. I'm, dying that your channel hasn't blown up yet but cherish it like others. perhaps you need to sell some plug ins and spew some bullshit like the 99% ;P
My favorte heads are Remo, Ambassador, Emperor, Black Dot and Pin Stripe. Remo just sound like records to me and other brands are just fine. They just seem slightly off. Negligible differences at the end of the day I am sure. An unmuted coated ambassador on snare just sounds like a snare to me.
Cheers.
@@BlueHouseSoundStudio i sincerely thank you! I dont plan on shilling plugins any time soon, and one of the reasons i started this channel was to try and NOT contribute to the BS factor as much as possible. Research is getting harder these days as there just so much misinformation out there. But yeah... You think doing a video on different skin types would be worth it or has it been done to death?