It should be noted that Bortolotti faced a similar controversy at the tail end of 2023. Despite being a lower-ranked player, his case was resolved within three months, with no suspension. The player's case wasn't made public until a conclusion was reached, just like Sinner's.
Thanks Andy for bringing back the reality of stuff regarding Sinner unfortunate case. It's so clear that he's innocent and it's very nice from you too speak it out loud and explain why logically he's 100% innocent. You're the best, hopefully you'll invite him to the show and speak about it to explain it. Sinner is a so nice guy, here he's the victim
Marco Bortolotti, a doubles player then above 100 in the rankings (currently 87), was tested last October during the Lisbon Challenger, tested positive for Clostebol, is a very similar case to Sinner who was judged the same way.
I Like Sinner he strikes me as a decent young man, especially at WTF's when he could have lost a match to knock Djokovic out which he did not do. That stood out to me and as we know he lost to Novak in the final after that, My two questions are..... How did his physio not know the dangers of using that and treating Sinner?Is he a complete thick or maybe I would look at possibility of sabotage if Jannik is innocent of wrong doing. And second question. Why didnt they wait until after the US Open to announce it rather than put Jannick though so much stress unless of course the Media were sitting on it and they had to do it straight away. Sinner reputation is now tarnished regardless of his innocence which is very unfortunate for him.
Thank you, Andy, for this informative and objective discussion! Most people like to jump into conclusions and spread hate -- it's tedious and harmful for everybody...
My opinion … there is jealousy and some envy in some comments…..please per favore Caro Jannik IGNORA!!! We are all so proud of you, your behavior in and out of the tennis court. You have 2 weeks ahead put all behind you.. You made me a fan 👵🏼old as I am. I love your interviews…and I Am a million of people following you with joy respect and as I sad already RESPECT. 👏 BRAVOOO
I've seen enough people talking "Why previous players treat horribly, and he was treat like this?" I mean, don't you want society improve to be better? Future players can be treat better according to this case when facing dopping issues. I'm sure everyone don't want to be treat like Simona.
@@gabrielleirbag2030 Exactly! Rank 156 has no power, no draw, no heavily invested corporate sponsors. #1 in the world is a different (preferential) case.
But Simona's case is also different.... It's harder to explain how that substance that also improves performance more directly got into her body plus she had bio passport irregularities which is much bigger red flag.
@@gabrielleirbag2030 Number 300+ tennis player (Marco Bortolotti) had the same problem a year ago. Same steroid as Sinner and he was cleared in the same way (and you even haven't heard of his case). The "special treatment" for Sinner as number 1 is completely rubbish.
My question for the people complaining about “special treatment” for Sinner- if the consensus in the last high profile case (Halep) was that it was handled poorly and the punishment was too severe, why are we pissed about how Sinner’s case was handled? Isn’t this a drastic improvement? I feel like these are the same kind of people who argue against student debt relief with the argument, “Well I had to pay it, so they should too!” If you improve a system, someone is inherently going to benefit from those improvements. Is it fair? No. Would we rather have the system never been improved? Hell no.
You make a good point. I think most people would welcome the positive change with open arms if the case wasn't kept secret for almost 4 months. Add that to the fact that the change started with the World #1 and you get the scepticism that most people are having
@@GhostofGerulaitisLol sure pal. Way to really engage in a substantive manner. (Though for what it’s worth, I’m an Alcaraz fan who typically roots against Sinner, so I have no skin in the game)
Thank you Served team. You have informed me greatly by including a general overview of the doping provisions for tennis players (holy crap) and then layered on details of the Sinner case that I simply didn't know as yet. I was not one of those who jumped to conclusions or wanted to Sinner's hide for this. Not because I don't care or I'm some paragon of critical thought. I was just sad for him, his team, his family, Italy, and tennis as a sport. Andy, for a guy whom I always enjoyed but saw as a bit of a hothead while playing, you've shown yourself to be a much more nuanced thinker than I ever realized. People need to chill in their rush to opinion. What happens next is anyone's guess, but I'm willing to reserve judgment and let the story unfold as it will. Well done, team!
I'm a big Halep fan and I always defended her, but to be fair, Halep never mentioned that she ingested the contaminated supplement, not even on the ITIA documents, until later on when she said she will sue the company (btw what happened with that case, did she dropped it or what?), which caused all the speculations and misunderstandings with the consequence of the disastrous handling of her case. It sucks what happened to her and it pained me as she was my n°1 athlete in women's tennis. But, there really can't be a comparison between the two cases, Halep ingested something with negligence, the other has been massaged by someone else who has been negligent using a medication that was not his, there was no way for Sinner to know what was on the hands of his physio. Sinner is an unfortunate victim in all this.
@@АртемРоманов-ы4у Firstly, your comment makes no sense. But, let me put some sense into it, if you go to a hotel and I hand you a towel on which I rub some clostebol then you pass it on your face, then you get found to have doped, who would you blame then, yourself for using the bathroom and needing the towel, or blaming the hotel and its personnel? Just a random contamination scenario... looks like your monocell is refusing some simple facts. You people are really brainless, or just mean haters.
It literally says on the label that the product contains anabolic steroids (as is required by Italian law). I expect them to be able to read and be careful which products they use.
Andy you are a legend and thank you for providing this perspective through this live show. Personally, the biggest takeaway for me from this show not just in this scenario but in any instance in life is to treat every situation with grace and to focus on the facts. Feelings aren’t bad but we shouldn’t be driven or draw conclusions just by feelings. Well said. God bless!
Thank goodness we can rely on two of the finest players in tennis history, Denis Shapovalov and Nick Kyrios to draw these important distinctions on good judgment and ethical behaviour. 😒
As a medical practitioner myself who’s worked on athletes for over 20 years, I can say that this is basic common sense and a huge part of our job to know what is banned - and not have those substances anywhere near an athlete. This is total negligence on the Physio part and completely unprofessional.
Thanks for sharing your experience. I totally agree with you. The Physio should be the one in question, not the player. How does it work Ashley? As a Physio, are you given a list of meds/cream that you can't use on athletes? He was given medical a substance that is legal in Italy and purchased over the counter.
@@DepecheModeTimeAgain Yeah. The real story is that he doped himself with an infinitesimal amount of a substance known to be a bad enhancer. At the same time, he asked his physio to cut himself on purpose and have people witness his bandage to create an alibi. This must be the most plausible explanation. By far. What a criminal mastermind this Jannik Sinner.
@@moniquepate3201 Actually if the physio had been at fault and negligent, Sinner would have been suspended for two years. The story was spun in such a way showing no fault or negligence from the physio!
My question is why was Sharapova banned for 2 years even though she was NOT AWARE the medicine she was taking for years suddenly and without any notice was added to the list of 35.000 prohibited medicines, while Sinner is ruled not guilty because he was not AWARE!!! This to me seems completely incoherent. I am not an expert in sports rules, I only ask a question and maybe an expert can answer me. Thanks
Thank you Andy for an objective and well-researched take on the situation. As you say, facts matter more than opinions, especially if these are driven by personal biases. It would have been very easy to join the internet crusaders on this. Everyone is thirsty for controversy and is willing to believe the most non-sensical theories, despite facts.
Oh man gotta love Andy. The knowledge that he shares as a person that lives of tennis, the objectivity and personality make him perfect for helping make sense of complex situations such as this one
Actually I didn’t like it much. Seemed kinda condescending for the ones who wanted more insight through a former players perspective without being biased. Right now Brooksby is going through a ‘provisional suspension’ bcuz he missed 3 drug test. He was going to be banned until 01/25 until they realized not all 3 misses were valid. And this is one player who’s missed playing and at least he was able to have a surgery and use his time. But other players, especially women and men not in the top rankings have them coming to you at your requested time. I’ve read where players had to leave practice and run to their rooms only to have missed the person and get marked and had to fight it. And every time I hear someone say I guess Sinner could afford better lawyers bcuz he’s a top players to have it kept out of the press ticks me off bcuz Halep has/was in the Top 3 for what 5 years straight... and she got dragged through the mud immediately only to have her suspension to be only 9 month after she spent what 2 seasons fighting it? Maria Sharapova ended up having hers reduced and changed too. These doping rules do need to change but why hasn’t ATP of ITIA come out with a statement saying bcuz of new standards they are changing rules and not immediately suspending players? That would be GREAT and I feel everyone would applaud them. But transparency needs to be their middle name. Oh, one more thing Andy on why no one mentioned about Roland Garros and the bolognese... maybe it was bcuz many players came back with positive drug test and it obviously looked suspicious with 40 player virus 1-3. That really makes more sense to me... I don’t think tennis would like to embarrass Roland Garros about serving bad food to the public. But yeah, you go ahead.
I think Sinner's theory is plausible. Furthermore, I don't consider this guy to be a 'cheater'. He's a sincere human being, a devoted sportsman and in the tennis game for the long run. He wants to become the next legend alongside Alcaraz, Rune and Medvedev. I believe he would never jeopardize his career by deliberately using banned substances. That's simply not the guy he is. I've been following Sinner for a couple of years now and this whole fine mess just doesn't add up. I think this truly was a very unfortunate course of events. A stupid accident. Let's not start cancelling Sinner, he is one of the good guys.
It isn't always a minuscule amount. And you can speculate all you like, I don't claim to have any knowledge of how quickly different substances leavw the body, but unless you havw evidence that this was in Jannik's system earlier then we have to accept the findings as they stand.
For all the comments that miss the point - Andy clearly explains the process and why there was no disclosure until yesterday - If you want to know why Halep went through what she did (or Sharapova etd) DYOR and you will hopefully understand - This is clearly a one-off where there was absolutely no 'performance enhancement' - call it commonsense, nuance or whatever you want, it is the correct outcome. Andy's example from the challenger tourny is a perfect example of how ridiculous this could get....... as per usual I'm with Andy.
@@QuantumPsycheqpsych6969 the alibi is just too convenient. How long did it take them to figure out where the steroid came from so quickly. You wash your hands before giving a massage unless you are a Neanderthal! Utter BS excuse. He was microdosing and should be banned like all the others. He's no Saint he's a sinner!
Imagine if you're Sinner and you are actually innocent. Through no fault of your own you went instantly from the best player in the world with basically no controversy to a cheater who got prefrential treatment from the ATP. I mean this couldn't have been way out of his control. Btw that physio should definitely be fired.
I would have really liked to hear you talk a bit about Halep and why she had to fight for 2 years. I’m not saying Sinner is guilty but it just appears like there are different rules for different people.
Halep’s case is simply different because she was not able to convince the judge she was innocent in the first place. She indeed took substances without knowing they were not legal trusting his team. Sinner’s case looks to be different as he allegedly did not take substances but a member of his team did. Unfortunately this already occurred to another low ranked tennis player here in Italy (Bortolotti) with the same substance and also this guy got away with it in the same way Sinner did. It is a really complicated matter as it looks like the system does not work fairly.
Yeah, smashing! this show just gets better and better. All very natural infront of the camera, got a great blend of humour, information, humility and entertainment. Rapidly becoming my favourite show on TH-cam...
Thank you for being fair to Sinner who has experienced so much abuse & hate since this thing exploded. Hard to believe the comments online which is a very sad commentary on how judgmental and cruel people can be. It's mob mentality. on full display. People passing harsh judgements without knowing all the facts. It's hard to believe that Sinner has been carrying this burden the last 7 months and still played the way he did all through out. No wonder he has been sick on and off the last two months. I don't blame some of Jannik's fellow players for being outraged but Nick Kyrgios who is now a commentator for ESPN should just zip it and keep his thoughts to himself. Besides, Kyrgios lost to Sinner in Miami 2022 which Kyrgios didn't take too nicely. By making all these nasty comments makes him appear to be a sour grape.
For those who were raising their hand, I'm sure you never felt unjustly accused and even if this was the case, surely you blamed yourselves and not the system or anyone else. Surely this is what happened.
Jon said the worst thing you could say about an athlete is if you are accused of being a doper. I disagree, the worst thing is if you bet against yourself and throw a match or bets within a match. Far more sinister against the integrity of the game. Not condoning those trying to cheat the system with performance enhancing drugs, but my guess is very few do it with the rigors of testing, factoring in the long tennis season. Maybe you can do it during the short offseason and it is out of your system when you start playing again, but even then, doubt the benefits would be long lasting.
The cream/spray may be legal in Italy, but the package has a large doping warning in red on it, so the trainer had to know there was a risk with it, and should have used another medication.
Oh I was waiting for this and didn't expect this to be so fast! I actually want to ask about the amount of "less than a billionth of a gram". What's the threshold for it to be tested positive? I mean it sounds like a really really tiny amount, but if from a biomedical point of view it is higher than the legal amount then it's still questionable. And besides that the "less than a billionth of a gram" is what has been found, which doesn't mean the amount he consumed. It could totally be that he took a larger amount but then mostly metabolized and faded.
That's exactly the question. Those who just state the minute amount intentionally forget what you just mentioned. There is a reason why the rule is written this way.
They have look back 1 year at his tests and always have been negative. Tested every single month, until February was fine. This is how you know it was a contamination, the minuscule amount and the previous negative test
That substance takes quite a lot of time to fade away. Sinner was playing another tournament just 15 days before (atp 500 that he won) and he was completely fine. So I'd say his version does actually make a lot of sense. Furthermore, there is a picture of Sinner's physio in the stands during Indian Wells and you can clearly see he has a little bandage all over his pinky finger. I mean, this is just really convincing.
In this case it wasn’t. Anabolic and corticosteroids are very long acting meds with long half lives - it wouldn’t suddenly disappear from his body. That’s why the amount they found in his body made it very easy to reverse extrapolate the rough dose, which was very low
I repost this from my comment of another youtube-video on Sinner's case: In their announcement the ITIA didn't give enough attention to their evaluation of the STORIES OF FERRARA AND NALDI. The evaluation of whether Sinner was oblivious does not exist before this primary evaluation. To state this is not to compromise the legal protection of the player, for the very simple reason that it is the PLAYER -- and no-one else -- who appeals to the stories of his staff-members. Things don't look incredibly pretty even in the official pdf that presents the details of the case (that not many people have cared to find) --- but they do look better. In the pdf the ITIA make a reference to the fact that they were provided with Ferrara’s bank record that prooves the purchase. This is a good start, of course, but still leaves something to be desired. Hence, it was always more suspicious than that Ferrara should purchase a product with a huge "DOPING" signage that he should carry it around while on tour with Sinner and handle it in Sinner's proximity in such a careless way. Therefore, when the report does not say whether the ITIA received a picture of the product on site in Miami, the question emerges whether Ferrara had in truth purchased the product to cover Sinner’s bases -- something I would definately do if my player was on clostebol. What further deserves attention here is the position of Ferrara. We should remember that it is not in the least in his own interests to go against the story of Sinner. There is no ban (provisional or long-term) for him if Sinner's story is found credible -- such are the rules for coaches and staff. Carelessness, while fatal for athletes in these kinds of cases (google case Johaug), does not entail severe consequences for coaches. On the other hand, in the case he WOULD attempt to build a case against his player, he would not only certainly loose his job (which by now he might have anyway but this is not the point) but possibly his status within the whole of Italian tennis where Sinner is huge. I cannot therefore help but feel that the rules for coaches and staff should be stricter. If they were, the interests of the player and the team-member would not align in such a way as to compromise the integrity of cases such as Sinner's.
Kygrios probably feels some kind of way about the baby gens. By virtue of his age, in tennis years his career is drawing to a close. He missed the boat to be one of the next big things in tennis with his cavalier, I couldn't care less attitude, towards tennis.
I say to the people who are doubting this: are you really doubting a justice system? Are you really going to say NAH DONT BELIEVE IT 😡😡 after a rigorous procedure from numerous experts and professionals (ie people who know what they’re doing) have cleared Sinner? The only system that’s broken here is the system that allowed Sinner to be able to fight to clear himself when so many others in his position would’ve been unable to afford to do so. Wish there was more financial support for lower ranked players, otherwise this could’ve been a career ender even if they were as innocent (as the process has concluded) as Sinner was.
@@SamJones-x7q Incomparable? Or inconvenient? Truth is, no system is perfect and any justice system can be open to abuse or flawed judgements. Not saying that’s the case here but it general it is true. I bring up Trump’s trials because they were a very public recent example of a weaponised and corrupt justice system.
@@ohwellwhateverrmate I completely agree with you about Trump. God knows how he’s able to run for president. The reason why I said it’s incomparable is that we’re comparing a guy with a criminal record who’s managed to twist the system into running for the highest office in a country to a guy who got cleared for having minuscule amounts of a substance in his body. It’s just not the same is it. One has a criminal record but still manages to run for President, the other doesn’t have a criminal record and was cleared of any wrongdoing.
@@ohwellwhateverryeah completely agree with you about Trump. God knows how he’s able to run for president. The reason I say it’s incomparable is that one was found guilty, yet still twisted the system for his benefit, and the other was found not guilty. Trump has a criminal record and is still somehow able to run for president, Sinner was cleared of any fault and wrongdoing for a minuscule amount of a substance found in his body. Just isn’t the same really is it.
Jannik Sinner is being treated preferencially. Maria Sharapova was suspended for 2 years because by mistake she got a substance that had just been placed in the blacklist. I like Sinner a lot, but I think he is being favoured because another Italian, Andrea Gaudenzi, is the actual ATP chairman. There are other many cases of players who experienced the same treatment.
Sharapova didn't contest the charges and seek an emergency hearing and appeal like Jannick did. Also, if she had she likely would have been unsuccessful bc she did take the drug directly (and to enhance performance), she just wasn't up to date on what was banned Kudos to her owning her mistake, but we're talking totally different cases
Maria’s medication, meldonium, was NOT a mistake she was taking it at super-therapeutic doses for a decade with the intent of performance enhancement AND had ONE YEAR of multiple warnings from the WTA in 2015 that it was being banned in 2016. She wasn’t ignorant she just ignored this. Don’t make up history - there’s no comparison between hers and Jannik’s cases. Sharapova was taking it with the intent to cheat. The drug is make by the Latvian pharmaceutical company Grineks and is normally used at doses in the 50-100mg range for 6 weeks to 3 months. It is a heart failure drug that works by increasing oxygen content and effectiveness of the heart’s pumping, thereby increasing exercise tolerance. Maria was taking 200-500mg 2-3x a day (at least 10x the recommended therapeutic dose which again is indicated for elderly heart failure patients not young healthy athletes) The ONLY reason she was taking this was for the perceived increased anaerobic oxygen tolerance to increase performance!
Maria’s medication, meldonium, was NOT a mistake she was taking it at super-therapeutic doses for a decade with the intent of performance enhancement AND had ONE YEAR of multiple warnings from the WTA in 2015 that it was being banned in 2016. She wasn’t ignorant she just ignored this. Don’t make up history - there’s no comparison between hers and Jannik’s cases. Sharapova was taking it with the intent to cheat. The drug is make by the Latvian pharmaceutical company Grineks and is normally used at doses in the 50-100mg range for 6 weeks to 3 months. It is a heart failure drug that works by increasing oxygen content and effectiveness of the heart’s pumping, thereby increasing exercise tolerance. Maria was taking 200-500mg 2-3x a day (at least 10x the recommended therapeutic dose which again is indicated for elderly heart failure patients not young healthy athletes) The ONLY reason she was taking this was for the perceived increased anaerobic oxygen tolerance to increase performance
Great to see 5 men’s singles players from USA in the Top 20. Of those, I think Tiafoe is the most in form right now. 12. Fritz 13. Shelton 14. Paul 16. Korda 20. Tiafoe
😂😂so did you listened the podcast ?? They literally said he was tested negative from the first tournament he played at Australian Open untill 10 days before they found that microscopic amount of clostebol..so when you think he was heavy doped?
The catalyst for transforming good players into great ones is intense competition and proximity. When a cluster of skilled players regularly compete against each other, it fosters an environment where continuous improvement is essential. Being the best in a region can lead to complacency, but having someone slightly better nearby drives growth. This concentrated dynamic sparks a cycle of continuous levelling up, ultimately forging greatness. Greatness emerges when good players are surrounded by others who push them to improve. Proximity and rivalry create the perfect storm for growth, as players strive to surpass those who are slightly better, fueling a continuous cycle of excellence
Also to say 'he's the worst at doping' would not be true if the drugs were clearing his system and he only had trace amounts a few days after ingesting the drugs....hence why he would have very very small amounts in his system days later. So I think it's a bit simplistic to say such things. Do people who dope get caught with huge amounts of steroids in their system? No!
This is not true. In fact, traces of clostebol were still present in the second test, in a dose very similar to the first test, even though several days had passed.
@@mausaedof8398 Do your research. The duration for steroids to clear from the system depends on the type of steroid used: Steroids typically stay in the system for about 4 to 12 hours. It takes around 5 to 6 half-lives for a drug to be completely eliminated. After about 4 to 5 half-lives, a medication is considered “cleared” from the body. The range of detectability times can vary from a few days to 18 months after the last use, depending on various factors.
@@3nonvathat’s a poor argument tbh. The trainer was consistently applying the product to his hand throughout the time period and would’ve continued giving Sinner treatment as such, so it’s likely the contamination re entered Sinner’s system more than once. Remember, Sinner was only notified after Miami, so it’s not like they kept going with the same stuff after they got the notification.
There are two issues: 1) the test does not determine if a player was doping. Most athletes found with clostebol in their bodies had less than 2 nanograms/ml. The metabolism of the drug is relative fast so the amount found will be dependent on when was the administration done. Timing is essential. If you recently took the medication you will be found with high levels of it. But if a couple of days passed the amount will be similar to Sinner. The same if you accidentally was in contact with the drug few hours before the test then you might have similar amount of the drugs that can last for several days. The bar for the doping agency to potentially destroy the career of a player should be higher than just finding trace amount of a drug that can go to your body by just touching another person. Very important will be to know if there were serial test done and what was the time frame. Or if an alternative like a hair test should be done. 2) there is discrepancy between sinner case and how lower ranked players were handle by the authorities. It seems that the main difference between sinner and several other cases is that the authorities decided to believe sinner explanation but not the other players explanation. Moreover it seems that legally in these “doping cases” the defendants have the burden of proof with go against a basic legal principle that is the accuser that should have to probe beyond any doubt that the defendant is guilty. Because the positive test results with low amount of these substance can not serve as undeniable proof of doping. They are a proof of having the substance in your system. But the low amount does not proof doping.
If you're more popular, more important, more money making, you will definitely get different treatment compared to some average joes, that's just how the world and capitalism works sadly
Do you know Bortolotto? He is another italian tennis player, not the number one, not popular, not money maker... Well, same situation, same treatment. Exactly the same.
A low ranked tennis player in Italy was considered innocent for the same substance (Bortolotti). Still the system does not work fairly and needs to be improved as Sinner was lucky he was able to prove his innocence.
There are two significant records both held by Connors which Djokovic doesn’t have: most titles and most matches won. *TITLES* 1. Connors 109 2. Federer 103 3. Djokovic 99 4. Lendl 94 5. Nadal 92 *MATCHES WON* 1. Connors 1274 2. Federer 1251 3. Djokovic 1116 4. Nadal 1075 5. Lendl 1068
I am kind of amazed by the players who attacked Sinner when he was contaminated by no fault of his own--that could potentially happen to them, too, and then what? Maybe I'm not surprised: it was Nick Kyrgios.
@@francesco7649 yeah the tactic won’t work you pathetic shill. You will not stop the truth from getting out. It’s too late. Sinner is a cheater and the officials running ATP are corrupt to the bone.
@@setblack_cat1 Sinner is a cheater and deserves a 2-year ban. The ATP officials covering for him deserve to have their livelihoods taken away from them.
I'm still confused. Is EVERY player allowed to appeal immediately and be allowed to continue playing until the appeal is adjudicated? And does every player get to have their case adjudicated within a few months? if not, this is where the unfairness lies.
If someone took clostebol to enhance performance, how would they take it? Just before it disappears from the bloodstream, would it measure as a billionth of a gram?
Sinner should not be allowed to play this is ridiculous especially being a number one player it does not matter if it’s an accident oh I accidentally took something that is illegal oh your number one so it’s ok go ahead play …. Cmon Tennis .. ur better than this!’ I love you Andy and your insight is so appreciated 😊
Why should he not be allowed to play? The contamination was in March. He was exposed with no knowledge. It is no longer in his system. It was never in a level to enhance performance. He was cleared of blame. To want to stop him playing is just straight up viciousness and vengefulness.
Why should he not be allowed to play? The contamination was in March. He was exposed with no knowledge. It is no longer in his system. It was never in a level to enhance performance. He was cleared of blame. To want to stop him playing is just straight up viciousness and vengefulness.
So much talk about this chemical not being effective at the dose it was found. 1) Is there published evidence that a certain minimum amount is needed for performance benefits? No. 2) drugs are eliminated from the body with time, so could it have been present, beforehand, at a higher concentration? Yes.
Can Mr. Roddick answer a question about when he was scheduled to play doubles with Marty Fish at the US Open and decided not to play or was not allowed to play.
the big question is why the heck you need a drug ointment with clostebol ingredient for cut in the finger? like most ppl just use band aid and let it heal naturally (and sometimes just adding antiseptic) no?
@@ValentinG23 but like this or not it is the pcs of news that we got from the media 😬 (and we can't verify it for a fact but told by the media and Jannik team spokeperson as fact anyway)
@@KNful if they would have said that Yannick looked at a passing asteroid that had used that cream/spray i would have believed that more that the bs they came up with 👎👎
Based on the half-life of clostebol, the amount in his system would be performance-enhancing in as few as five days prior. Meaning, he could have been given a performance-enhancing amount of the drug 5-6 days prior to the test to result in one-one billiionth of a gram of the drug at the time of testing. So, the amound found at the time of testing isn't as minor as what people think.
Minuscule amount in the drug test wouldn’t enhance his performance? There’s minuscule amount when the drug test is done, cuz the bulk of it had already washed out of his system. Do other cheaters caught have large amount of a banned substance in the drug test? It’s always trace amount. Why? Cheaters know the pharmacokinetics of a substance and will take it so that by the time the drug test is done, the drug is washed out of the system by the kidneys or by the liver. Often times they get caught because the substance is removed slower than expected due to other factors, like drug interactions, which slows down the kidneys or the liver, or illness can alter the removal process, allowing the substances to circulate in the body longer than expected.
Regardless of whether Sinner knowingly doped or not, there's a huge issue with Clostebol doping in Italian sport. A Google search will bring up articles on the subject. It's rampant in Italy. This goes a lot deeper than this individual case.
Are you Italian? I guess not or you'd know that trofodermin is like the most common over the counter no prescription medication if you suffer from like dermatitis (or if you say want cuts or blisters to close quicker). Maybe all it needs to happen is to not make that easy to get so accidental contamination can go down
@@lio896It is rampant. There is a huge warning on the product. And still you use it knowing that tomorrow the control guys might come to check on you?
Comparing something to a grain of salt is just silly. Like Gill said, it takes a 1/5 of vodka to get drunk but much more beer. Size means nothing when you are talking about a substance you're both unfamiliar with. And we don't know the exact amounts on ingestion, only what was still traceable... twice
Exactly. They authorities set the threshold for a reason and the amount doesn't matter. Positive test is a positive test, the actual amount doesn't make a positive test negative.
Sinner’s reputation is intact despite critics who attacked him without reading the International Tennis Integrity Agency (ITIA) report and included in there is also the full PDF decision report link by Sport Resolutions: “Independent tribunal rules 'No Fault or Negligence' in case of Jannik Sinner: No period of ineligibility imposed by Sport Resolutions panel”.
They knew the second they decided not to initially suspend him he had to be found innocent . Otherwise they admit to letting a cheater play. You don’t believe their story stop pretending you do
@@RamZar50 well I know the process isn’t to let a player who tested positive to keep playing lol - Unless of course you’re going to later deem him innocent. Thats the only option literally. You can’t let him play and then say he’s been guilty for half a year . This was so incredibly obviously a coverup from the start .
@@jonlucente4709 Nonsense. There’s a process in place and it was followed. Read all 33 pages of the Sport Resolution report. Thorough investigation, no coverup and no favoritism.
All players should have the same treatment. If that substance is Ok in that small amount, that should be official and applicable to all players. However, if that substance is forbidden, it is irrelevant whether it is small amount or huge. This should really be simple. It is unfortunate that it happened the way it happened, but generally rules are there to be followed and if you are #1 player you should obviously set an example and just ask to be treated as everyone else. We all love Jannik, but this is just not fair to all other players who have been punished and perhaps as well had some unfortunate circumstances. Just think about it. And yes, if your phisio had a cut, and an open wound, it is really questionable why he hadn’t covered the cut as any other person should do? Thank you as always Andy for your show, love to watch it and I have to mention that I was your big fan when I was a teenager! 😌❤️🎾
I really love listening to Roddick on his podcast, but I think there's an issue with saying that he is here to give an objective take and then he reads a text from Sinner's coach and from an anonymous player who's story has nothing to do with Sinner's... Cahill will definitely defend his player, so because of the inherent bias he shouldn't be taken as an objective truth take. The player's story about spaghetti involved a group of people and a contaminated spaghetti that the player didn't know about, but the entities stopped the investigation straight away as soon as it was found out. Also Roddick kept on bringing up the anecdote of Sinner being the worst ever doper in the world because the trace amount he had in his sample was too small to make any effect, neglecting the fact that having a trace amount might indicate you had more in your system before. Especially since this is a substance known for washing off pretty quickly. Roddick was once no1 in the world and he has a much bigger emotional attachment to Sinner's position than he is aknowledging. Most of the takes he's giving are his own personal feelings toward the risk and reward of doping and losing the place as best player in the world. We'll only ever know what we're told, so for me the best take was from his producer who said we should be suspicious, but never too cynical where we dip into conspiracy theories.
"you had more in your system before". Well, this is probably true, but more than a billionth of a gram could be 1.15 billionth of a gram... I mean sinner was tested before and definitely several times after the positive sample. So the time of positivity is really narrow. I don't know how much this clostebol stays in blood and how quickly its concentration decreases. And I think neither do you. Anyway I think that the scientists (who didn't know they were judging sinner) have probably a better knowledge of you and me together and I bet they had all the timing of previous tests too. I honestly have no knowledge that allows me to doubt what they have decided, but, if you do I would like to see which are the textbooks and formulas you are using.
I can add that on march 10 the quantity was 0.86pg/mL and on the 18th it was 0.78pg/mL (I could be wrong of 0.0x since I'm going by heart). I think this gives a little perspective.
@@DadeSpace I'm not really arguing on guilt or innocence, we only know what we're given and he's been cleared of charges. That's why I used the word 'might', a person with trace amounts might or might not have had more in their system. I agree, I'm not a scientist and that's why I didn't make a comment about whether or not Sinner is doping. My point was on Roddick claiming that he's being super objective and this is a facts before feelings take, then proceed to give a very feelings forward and a bit of a biased account. I don't blame him, he's been a top player for many years and it is natural that his empathy leans towards someone in the same position.
I’m hoping the way Sinner was treated is the new normal. If the next player to go through this gets an extended suspension during the investigation stage, there will be a lot of bad blood and calls of bias - especially if that player is WTA or an under represented ethnic group
It's so unfair to other tennis players who experienced similar misfortune but didn't have the luxury of receiving any favors. Suffice it to mention the Polish tennis player Kamil Majchrzak, who was in disbelief at the information about how smoothly Sinner's case went through, and his match cycle was not disturbed in any way. Halep lost entire years of her professional career, Majchrzak lost 13 months, and for both of them it meant being cut off from their life's passion and source of income, not to mention having to fight for their good name.
It's not like if some cases were treated badly, then Sinner's too has to. As Andy said in the podcast, there were no favors, everything was done by the book and they disclosed all immediately after there was a resolution, as it should be. Sorry for Majchrzak and Halep, but I repeat, if their cases were treated badly (I have no idea what happened to them, but I presume you are not lying) it's a fault of whoever did that, not Sinner's.
Hi Andy, looking forward to the video! Can't wait to hear your thoughts on Sinner. I have an opinion, It smells. However, at the top of the game anything goes, just don't get caught.
I'm am alcaraz fanboy, but this is something that I don't think too deeply into at all except the part of the team. I dont feel like it taints his legacy.
His team let him down on so many levels and they need to admit it rather than add layers and layers of BS. If they admitted this it would help Sinner's image.
Of course his legacy is tainted forever. In a sport with an incredibly lenient anti-doping programme, you don't test positive twice and keep your reputation unharmed.
It should be noted that Bortolotti faced a similar controversy at the tail end of 2023. Despite being a lower-ranked player, his case was resolved within three months, with no suspension. The player's case wasn't made public until a conclusion was reached, just like Sinner's.
Because like Andy said it is the way the process works
Thanks Andy for bringing back the reality of stuff regarding Sinner unfortunate case. It's so clear that he's innocent and it's very nice from you too speak it out loud and explain why logically he's 100% innocent.
You're the best, hopefully you'll invite him to the show and speak about it to explain it. Sinner is a so nice guy, here he's the victim
Marco Bortolotti, a doubles player then above 100 in the rankings (currently 87), was tested last October during the Lisbon Challenger, tested positive for Clostebol, is a very similar case to Sinner who was judged the same way.
Andy I love you, what you said about Sinner is touching and reasonable, so different from the everage, Big respect!
Finally, somebody who speaks facts and data, thanks that is a service to good communication. I have just subscribed to your channel.
I Like Sinner he strikes me as a decent young man, especially at WTF's when he could have lost a match to knock Djokovic out which he did not do. That stood out to me and as we know he lost to Novak in the final after that, My two questions are..... How did his physio not know the dangers of using that and treating Sinner?Is he a complete thick or maybe I would look at possibility of sabotage if Jannik is innocent of wrong doing. And second question. Why didnt they wait until after the US Open to announce it rather than put Jannick though so much stress unless of course the Media were sitting on it and they had to do it straight away. Sinner reputation is now tarnished regardless of his innocence which is very unfortunate for him.
Because the ITIA ruling is out now
Thank you, Andy, for this informative and objective discussion! Most people like to jump into conclusions and spread hate -- it's tedious and harmful for everybody...
Andy Roddick is the best thing that happened in tennis EVER
not if you ask chair umpires in his matches
EVERRRRRR
Bravo Logic to Andy Roddick, I never disappointed I like him since early 2002 and Now I am Sinner's fan
Finally, a responsible and informative video about what happened.
@@vitorsherman yeah your astroturfing doesn’t work here
@@sleepyjoe7389asylum is looking for you 🤣
My opinion … there is jealousy and some envy in some comments…..please per favore
Caro Jannik IGNORA!!!
We are all so proud of you, your behavior in and out of the tennis court.
You have 2 weeks ahead put all behind you..
You made me a fan 👵🏼old as I am. I love your interviews…and I
Am a million of people following you with joy respect and as I sad already RESPECT. 👏 BRAVOOO
Sinner forever ❤️
Steroids sinner 💉🥕💉🥕🔥
I've seen enough people talking "Why previous players treat horribly, and he was treat like this?" I mean, don't you want society improve to be better? Future players can be treat better according to this case when facing dopping issues. I'm sure everyone don't want to be treat like Simona.
yeah let's see what will their judgemennt be if the rank #156 has the same sustance in their body
@@gabrielleirbag2030 Exactly! Rank 156 has no power, no draw, no heavily invested corporate sponsors. #1 in the world is a different (preferential) case.
But Simona's case is also different.... It's harder to explain how that substance that also improves performance more directly got into her body plus she had bio passport irregularities which is much bigger red flag.
@@gabrielleirbag2030
Number 300+ tennis player (Marco Bortolotti) had the same problem a year ago. Same steroid as Sinner and he was cleared in the same way (and you even haven't heard of his case). The "special treatment" for Sinner as number 1 is completely rubbish.
You can't seriously be expecting players to be better in the future though. There was no official policy change just one different outcome.
My question for the people complaining about “special treatment” for Sinner- if the consensus in the last high profile case (Halep) was that it was handled poorly and the punishment was too severe, why are we pissed about how Sinner’s case was handled? Isn’t this a drastic improvement? I feel like these are the same kind of people who argue against student debt relief with the argument, “Well I had to pay it, so they should too!” If you improve a system, someone is inherently going to benefit from those improvements. Is it fair? No. Would we rather have the system never been improved? Hell no.
As soon as you put special treatment in quotes you revealed your biases.
You make a good point. I think most people would welcome the positive change with open arms if the case wasn't kept secret for almost 4 months. Add that to the fact that the change started with the World #1 and you get the scepticism that most people are having
I'm glad Roddick explained that the timing of it going public should be after the final tribunal decision.
@@GhostofGerulaitisLol sure pal. Way to really engage in a substantive manner.
(Though for what it’s worth, I’m an Alcaraz fan who typically roots against Sinner, so I have no skin in the game)
Was looking for a shred of this somewhere and thank you!
Thank you Served team. You have informed me greatly by including a general overview of the doping provisions for tennis players (holy crap) and then layered on details of the Sinner case that I simply didn't know as yet. I was not one of those who jumped to conclusions or wanted to Sinner's hide for this. Not because I don't care or I'm some paragon of critical thought. I was just sad for him, his team, his family, Italy, and tennis as a sport.
Andy, for a guy whom I always enjoyed but saw as a bit of a hothead while playing, you've shown yourself to be a much more nuanced thinker than I ever realized. People need to chill in their rush to opinion. What happens next is anyone's guess, but I'm willing to reserve judgment and let the story unfold as it will. Well done, team!
I'm a big Halep fan and I always defended her, but to be fair, Halep never mentioned that she ingested the contaminated supplement, not even on the ITIA documents, until later on when she said she will sue the company (btw what happened with that case, did she dropped it or what?), which caused all the speculations and misunderstandings with the consequence of the disastrous handling of her case. It sucks what happened to her and it pained me as she was my n°1 athlete in women's tennis. But, there really can't be a comparison between the two cases, Halep ingested something with negligence, the other has been massaged by someone else who has been negligent using a medication that was not his, there was no way for Sinner to know what was on the hands of his physio. Sinner is an unfortunate victim in all this.
Very convenient to blame on someone and so easily get away with the violation, "oh you poor boy, you didnt know, dont do it next time ok sonny"
@@АртемРоманов-ы4у Firstly, your comment makes no sense. But, let me put some sense into it, if you go to a hotel and I hand you a towel on which I rub some clostebol then you pass it on your face, then you get found to have doped, who would you blame then, yourself for using the bathroom and needing the towel, or blaming the hotel and its personnel? Just a random contamination scenario... looks like your monocell is refusing some simple facts. You people are really brainless, or just mean haters.
It literally says on the label that the product contains anabolic steroids (as is required by Italian law). I expect them to be able to read and be careful which products they use.
@@AMINOMMA so stupid excuse, right?
@@AMINOMMA Exactly, this is bizarre.
Love you Andy, without you this sport wouldn't be as exciting today, miss your 140mph serves
Andy you are a legend and thank you for providing this perspective through this live show. Personally, the biggest takeaway for me from this show not just in this scenario but in any instance in life is to treat every situation with grace and to focus on the facts. Feelings aren’t bad but we shouldn’t be driven or draw conclusions just by feelings. Well said. God bless!
Intelligent and factual analysis. Thank you Andy.
Thank goodness we can rely on two of the finest players in tennis history, Denis Shapovalov and Nick Kyrios to draw these important distinctions on good judgment and ethical behaviour. 😒
Right? I didn't see anyone from the top 10 making any comments about it. Just these nobodies.
@@Aliceteacup I have to disagree with you strongly. They’ve been carried away before knowing all the facts, like a lot of people.
@@mariamunroe6861 What proof do you have to back up your opinion? Do you know more about the Sinner case than Andy Roddick does?
@@mariamunroe6861 what is that you don’t get about what happened?
Fyi there is irony in this statement
As a medical practitioner myself who’s worked on athletes for over 20 years, I can say that this is basic common sense and a huge part of our job to know what is banned - and not have those substances anywhere near an athlete. This is total negligence on the Physio part and completely unprofessional.
Thanks for sharing your experience. I totally agree with you. The Physio should be the one in question, not the player. How does it work Ashley? As a Physio, are you given a list of meds/cream that you can't use on athletes? He was given medical a substance that is legal in Italy and purchased over the counter.
Except if it’s not the real story…..
@@DepecheModeTimeAgain Yeah. The real story is that he doped himself with an infinitesimal amount of a substance known to be a bad enhancer. At the same time, he asked his physio to cut himself on purpose and have people witness his bandage to create an alibi. This must be the most plausible explanation. By far. What a criminal mastermind this Jannik Sinner.
@@moniquepate3201 Actually if the physio had been at fault and negligent, Sinner would have been suspended for two years. The story was spun in such a way showing no fault or negligence from the physio!
My question is why was Sharapova banned for 2 years even though she was NOT AWARE the medicine she was taking for years suddenly and without any notice was added to the list of 35.000 prohibited medicines, while Sinner is ruled not guilty because he was not AWARE!!! This to me seems completely incoherent. I am not an expert in sports rules, I only ask a question and maybe an expert can answer me. Thanks
Thank you Andy for an objective and well-researched take on the situation. As you say, facts matter more than opinions, especially if these are driven by personal biases. It would have been very easy to join the internet crusaders on this. Everyone is thirsty for controversy and is willing to believe the most non-sensical theories, despite facts.
Oh man gotta love Andy. The knowledge that he shares as a person that lives of tennis, the objectivity and personality make him perfect for helping make sense of complex situations such as this one
Actually I didn’t like it much. Seemed kinda condescending for the ones who wanted more insight through a former players perspective without being biased. Right now Brooksby is going through a ‘provisional suspension’ bcuz he missed 3 drug test. He was going to be banned until 01/25 until they realized not all 3 misses were valid. And this is one player who’s missed playing and at least he was able to have a surgery and use his time. But other players, especially women and men not in the top rankings have them coming to you at your requested time. I’ve read where players had to leave practice and run to their rooms only to have missed the person and get marked and had to fight it. And every time I hear someone say I guess Sinner could afford better lawyers bcuz he’s a top players to have it kept out of the press ticks me off bcuz Halep has/was in the Top 3 for what 5 years straight... and she got dragged through the mud immediately only to have her suspension to be only 9 month after she spent what 2 seasons fighting it? Maria Sharapova ended up having hers reduced and changed too. These doping rules do need to change but why hasn’t ATP of ITIA come out with a statement saying bcuz of new standards they are changing rules and not immediately suspending players? That would be GREAT and I feel everyone would applaud them. But transparency needs to be their middle name. Oh, one more thing Andy on why no one mentioned about Roland Garros and the bolognese... maybe it was bcuz many players came back with positive drug test and it obviously looked suspicious with 40 player virus 1-3. That really makes more sense to me... I don’t think tennis would like to embarrass Roland Garros about serving bad food to the public. But yeah, you go ahead.
Sinner es un chaval honesto y yo no he dudado de él e ningún momento , al revés, creo que lo está pasando mal injustamente, Fuerza Sinner ❤❤❤
I think Sinner's theory is plausible. Furthermore, I don't consider this guy to be a 'cheater'. He's a sincere human being, a devoted sportsman and in the tennis game for the long run. He wants to become the next legend alongside Alcaraz, Rune and Medvedev. I believe he would never jeopardize his career by deliberately using banned substances. That's simply not the guy he is. I've been following Sinner for a couple of years now and this whole fine mess just doesn't add up. I think this truly was a very unfortunate course of events. A stupid accident. Let's not start cancelling Sinner, he is one of the good guys.
maybe not him, but maybe guys from his team?
very true.........
I AGREE 100%
U post this Peter Pan story under every thread? Got some bucks for it?
@@l.lewbowski6871 Peter Pan-story? Are you a conspiracy. theory man? A guy that's not able to trust his fellow humans?
Thank you for your fair and measured approach. I'm a Sinner fan and your mentions of grace literally brought tears to my eyes.
It isn't always a minuscule amount. And you can speculate all you like, I don't claim to have any knowledge of how quickly different substances leavw the body, but unless you havw evidence that this was in Jannik's system earlier then we have to accept the findings as they stand.
This live show was hands down one of the best!!! 👏👏👏
For all the comments that miss the point - Andy clearly explains the process and why there was no disclosure until yesterday - If you want to know why Halep went through what she did (or Sharapova etd) DYOR and you will hopefully understand - This is clearly a one-off where there was absolutely no 'performance enhancement' - call it commonsense, nuance or whatever you want, it is the correct outcome. Andy's example from the challenger tourny is a perfect example of how ridiculous this could get....... as per usual I'm with Andy.
Yeah we're not buying this shilling. You shills have failed and it will be extremely painful for you.
Maybe if Sinner and his team didn’t hid this for 6 months, everyone would understand. Instead it got out now, and he looks like a big cheater
@@BeepsAndBeatsbut they were waiting for a trial resolution though, totally legal and according to the system they set.
They did everything by the book @@BeepsAndBeats
@@QuantumPsycheqpsych6969 the alibi is just too convenient. How long did it take them to figure out where the steroid came from so quickly. You wash your hands before giving a massage unless you are a Neanderthal! Utter BS excuse. He was microdosing and should be banned like all the others. He's no Saint he's a sinner!
Thank you, Andy!
Imagine if you're Sinner and you are actually innocent. Through no fault of your own you went instantly from the best player in the world with basically no controversy to a cheater who got prefrential treatment from the ATP. I mean this couldn't have been way out of his control. Btw that physio should definitely be fired.
it has already been fired
sorry he...
Andy you are great. You explained the situation of Sinner brilliantly. You did bring nuance in a shitstorm situation.
You shills are not safe. Extreme pain.
@@sleepyjoe7389ancora qui ? Perchè non vai a dormire? Cosa ti ha fatto Sinner? Ma tu sei un troll
Thanks for your unbiased analysis of the Sinner case
The quickness with which I jumped on this episode… 😂
Me too lol
hahahahaa me too lol
Me too lmao
We need people like A. RODDICK in national politics, making arguments based on facts with DECENCY!!!
According to ITIA the substance is less then 1 billionesm per gram, is not even "doping", so what the hell we talking about?
I know- inflammatory headlines I am afraid
0,000000001g/g says it all. Not guilty.
@@Slaaayer92 thanks, your honor.
@@AlfredoArcangeli always a pleasure. Case closed.
I would have really liked to hear you talk a bit about Halep and why she had to fight for 2 years. I’m not saying Sinner is guilty but it just appears like there are different rules for different people.
They don't care about Halep or low ranked players. Have to protect the golden boy!
Thank you so much for this comment. Nobody is assuming he’s guilty, we just need fairness and consistency in the rules.
Halep’s case is simply different because she was not able to convince the judge she was innocent in the first place. She indeed took substances without knowing they were not legal trusting his team. Sinner’s case looks to be different as he allegedly did not take substances but a member of his team did. Unfortunately this already occurred to another low ranked tennis player here in Italy (Bortolotti) with the same substance and also this guy got away with it in the same way Sinner did. It is a really complicated matter as it looks like the system does not work fairly.
@@yaboinick426so does Halep, she’s a former number 1 and GS winner
@@johnvanbreugel2569yes but the cases are different, quantity and how it was ingested, it matters
Andy - such a joy listening to you!! Very informative! Greetings from Evert😊
Loving the number of people who are suddenly doping experts in the comments
On the other hand, it's sad how people accept every excuse made by some characters in nice suits.
@@zorancvetkovic7204idk, maybe blind cynicism and hatred is sadder 🤷♂️
Thank you Andy ❤❤❤
Yeah, smashing! this show just gets better and better. All very natural infront of the camera, got a great blend of humour, information, humility and entertainment.
Rapidly becoming my favourite show on TH-cam...
Thank you for being fair to Sinner who has experienced so much abuse & hate since this thing exploded. Hard to believe the comments online which is a very sad commentary on how judgmental and cruel people can be. It's mob mentality. on full display. People passing harsh judgements without knowing all the facts. It's hard to believe that Sinner has been carrying this burden the last 7 months and still played the way he did all through out. No wonder he has been sick on and off the last two months.
I don't blame some of Jannik's fellow players for being outraged but Nick Kyrgios who is now a commentator for ESPN should just zip it and keep his thoughts to himself. Besides, Kyrgios lost to Sinner in Miami 2022 which Kyrgios didn't take too nicely. By making all these nasty comments makes him appear to be a sour grape.
For those who were raising their hand, I'm sure you never felt unjustly accused and even if this was the case, surely you blamed yourselves and not the system or anyone else. Surely this is what happened.
thank you so much for this, andy. always a good and intelligent voice you are.
Sinner has good lawyers but he needs his team to be more diligent and thorough in what goes into his body.
Jon said the worst thing you could say about an athlete is if you are accused of being a doper. I disagree, the worst thing is if you bet against yourself and throw a match or bets within a match. Far more sinister against the integrity of the game. Not condoning those trying to cheat the system with performance enhancing drugs, but my guess is very few do it with the rigors of testing, factoring in the long tennis season. Maybe you can do it during the short offseason and it is out of your system when you start playing again, but even then, doubt the benefits would be long lasting.
Thank you for answering my son’s question and being so awesome with my daughter! You made a good day, great!
The cream/spray may be legal in Italy, but the package has a large doping warning in red on it, so the trainer had to know there was a risk with it, and should have used another medication.
The fitness trainer did know and said he told the Physio to be careful and keep it away from Jannik. The Physio couldn't recall this.
It's just an excuse.
@@bluepainting oh whatever.. I can't be bothered anymore. The case is closed.
@@bluepainting lol 1 in bilion gram and u talking 😂 loser hater
I was waiting for this after the news about Sinner!
Thank you Andy 🥹❤️
I KNEW I saw Sinner's quad muscles grow by 0.0001mm 😂
Psoas too! That cheater
😂😂😂😂😂😂😭😭👍👏
Oh I was waiting for this and didn't expect this to be so fast! I actually want to ask about the amount of "less than a billionth of a gram". What's the threshold for it to be tested positive? I mean it sounds like a really really tiny amount, but if from a biomedical point of view it is higher than the legal amount then it's still questionable. And besides that the "less than a billionth of a gram" is what has been found, which doesn't mean the amount he consumed. It could totally be that he took a larger amount but then mostly metabolized and faded.
That's exactly the question. Those who just state the minute amount intentionally forget what you just mentioned. There is a reason why the rule is written this way.
I don't like the 'tiny amount' analogy. If they time it, it will be gone or trace levels. Not saying he's guilty, but that argument is redundant.
They have look back 1 year at his tests and always have been negative. Tested every single month, until February was fine. This is how you know it was a contamination, the minuscule amount and the previous negative test
That substance takes quite a lot of time to fade away. Sinner was playing another tournament just 15 days before (atp 500 that he won) and he was completely fine. So I'd say his version does actually make a lot of sense. Furthermore, there is a picture of Sinner's physio in the stands during Indian Wells and you can clearly see he has a little bandage all over his pinky finger. I mean, this is just really convincing.
In this case it wasn’t. Anabolic and corticosteroids are very long acting meds with long half lives - it wouldn’t suddenly disappear from his body. That’s why the amount they found in his body made it very easy to reverse extrapolate the rough dose, which was very low
Thank you Andy
I repost this from my comment of another youtube-video on Sinner's case:
In their announcement the ITIA didn't give enough attention to their evaluation of the STORIES OF FERRARA AND NALDI. The evaluation of whether Sinner was oblivious does not exist before this primary evaluation. To state this is not to compromise the legal protection of the player, for the very simple reason that it is the PLAYER -- and no-one else -- who appeals to the stories of his staff-members.
Things don't look incredibly pretty even in the official pdf that presents the details of the case (that not many people have cared to find) --- but they do look better. In the pdf the ITIA make a reference to the fact that they were provided with Ferrara’s bank record that prooves the purchase. This is a good start, of course, but still leaves something to be desired. Hence, it was always more suspicious than that Ferrara should purchase a product with a huge "DOPING" signage that he should carry it around while on tour with Sinner and handle it in Sinner's proximity in such a careless way. Therefore, when the report does not say whether the ITIA received a picture of the product on site in Miami, the question emerges whether Ferrara had in truth purchased the product to cover Sinner’s bases -- something I would definately do if my player was on clostebol.
What further deserves attention here is the position of Ferrara. We should remember that it is not in the least in his own interests to go against the story of Sinner. There is no ban (provisional or long-term) for him if Sinner's story is found credible -- such are the rules for coaches and staff. Carelessness, while fatal for athletes in these kinds of cases (google case Johaug), does not entail severe consequences for coaches. On the other hand, in the case he WOULD attempt to build a case against his player, he would not only certainly loose his job (which by now he might have anyway but this is not the point) but possibly his status within the whole of Italian tennis where Sinner is huge. I cannot therefore help but feel that the rules for coaches and staff should be stricter. If they were, the interests of the player and the team-member would not align in such a way as to compromise the integrity of cases such as Sinner's.
Thank you @served for keeping the Birthday song for my wife (and Andy) in the episode 😘🙏
Kygrios probably feels some kind of way about the baby gens. By virtue of his age, in tennis years his career is drawing to a close. He missed the boat to be one of the next big things in tennis with his cavalier, I couldn't care less attitude, towards tennis.
I say to the people who are doubting this: are you really doubting a justice system? Are you really going to say NAH DONT BELIEVE IT 😡😡 after a rigorous procedure from numerous experts and professionals (ie people who know what they’re doing) have cleared Sinner? The only system that’s broken here is the system that allowed Sinner to be able to fight to clear himself when so many others in his position would’ve been unable to afford to do so. Wish there was more financial support for lower ranked players, otherwise this could’ve been a career ender even if they were as innocent (as the process has concluded) as Sinner was.
You think the “justice system” never makes an error? Is never corrupt? Oh, sweet summer child. Just look at the American presidential candidates.
@@ohwellwhateverrthe two things are incomparable my child 😂 Next!
@@SamJones-x7q Incomparable? Or inconvenient? Truth is, no system is perfect and any justice system can be open to abuse or flawed judgements. Not saying that’s the case here but it general it is true. I bring up Trump’s trials because they were a very public recent example of a weaponised and corrupt justice system.
@@ohwellwhateverrmate I completely agree with you about Trump. God knows how he’s able to run for president. The reason why I said it’s incomparable is that we’re comparing a guy with a criminal record who’s managed to twist the system into running for the highest office in a country to a guy who got cleared for having minuscule amounts of a substance in his body. It’s just not the same is it. One has a criminal record but still manages to run for President, the other doesn’t have a criminal record and was cleared of any wrongdoing.
@@ohwellwhateverryeah completely agree with you about Trump. God knows how he’s able to run for president. The reason I say it’s incomparable is that one was found guilty, yet still twisted the system for his benefit, and the other was found not guilty. Trump has a criminal record and is still somehow able to run for president, Sinner was cleared of any fault and wrongdoing for a minuscule amount of a substance found in his body. Just isn’t the same really is it.
Love this. Go Andy & the Served team!
Thank you for your approach and your way of sharing
He was allowed to play coz the explanation was plausible
Lol, it was not plausible.
@@pglanvilleit was to 3 independent wada experts, which with all the due respect matter 1 millions time more than you random TH-cam guy
Steroids sinner 🥕💉🥕💉🔥
How do they explain taking away his points, putting him at #2 in points, but then not removing his #1 ranking?
Jannik Sinner is being treated preferencially. Maria Sharapova was suspended for 2 years because by mistake she got a substance that had just been placed in the blacklist. I like Sinner a lot, but I think he is being favoured because another Italian, Andrea Gaudenzi, is the actual ATP chairman. There are other many cases of players who experienced the same treatment.
Sharapova didn't contest the charges and seek an emergency hearing and appeal like Jannick did. Also, if she had she likely would have been unsuccessful bc she did take the drug directly (and to enhance performance), she just wasn't up to date on what was banned
Kudos to her owning her mistake, but we're talking totally different cases
Completely different cases, she didn't appeal because maybe had no evidence or was guilty
Maria’s medication, meldonium, was NOT a mistake she was taking it at super-therapeutic doses for a decade with the intent of performance enhancement AND had ONE YEAR of multiple warnings from the WTA in 2015 that it was being banned in 2016. She wasn’t ignorant she just ignored this. Don’t make up history - there’s no comparison between hers and Jannik’s cases. Sharapova was taking it with the intent to cheat.
The drug is make by the Latvian pharmaceutical company Grineks and is normally used at doses in the 50-100mg range for 6 weeks to 3 months.
It is a heart failure drug that works by increasing oxygen content and effectiveness of the heart’s pumping, thereby increasing exercise tolerance.
Maria was taking 200-500mg 2-3x a day (at least 10x the recommended therapeutic dose which again is indicated for elderly heart failure patients not young healthy athletes)
The ONLY reason she was taking this was for the perceived increased anaerobic oxygen tolerance to increase performance!
Maria’s medication, meldonium, was NOT a mistake she was taking it at super-therapeutic doses for a decade with the intent of performance enhancement AND had ONE YEAR of multiple warnings from the WTA in 2015 that it was being banned in 2016. She wasn’t ignorant she just ignored this. Don’t make up history - there’s no comparison between hers and Jannik’s cases. Sharapova was taking it with the intent to cheat.
The drug is make by the Latvian pharmaceutical company Grineks and is normally used at doses in the 50-100mg range for 6 weeks to 3 months.
It is a heart failure drug that works by increasing oxygen content and effectiveness of the heart’s pumping, thereby increasing exercise tolerance.
Maria was taking 200-500mg 2-3x a day (at least 10x the recommended therapeutic dose which again is indicated for elderly heart failure patients not young healthy athletes)
The ONLY reason she was taking this was for the perceived increased anaerobic oxygen tolerance to increase performance
Great to see 5 men’s singles players from USA in the Top 20. Of those, I think Tiafoe is the most in form right now.
12. Fritz
13. Shelton
14. Paul
16. Korda
20. Tiafoe
Andy, its not that he's bad at doping, perhaps the small amount found is a residual amount from previous heavy doping? Just sayin ...
😂😂so did you listened the podcast ?? They literally said he was tested negative from the first tournament he played at Australian Open untill 10 days before they found that microscopic amount of clostebol..so when you think he was heavy doped?
The catalyst for transforming good players into great ones is intense competition and proximity. When a cluster of skilled players regularly compete against each other, it fosters an environment where continuous improvement is essential. Being the best in a region can lead to complacency, but having someone slightly better nearby drives growth. This concentrated dynamic sparks a cycle of continuous levelling up, ultimately forging greatness.
Greatness emerges when good players are surrounded by others who push them to improve. Proximity and rivalry create the perfect storm for growth, as players strive to surpass those who are slightly better, fueling a continuous cycle of excellence
Also to say 'he's the worst at doping' would not be true if the drugs were clearing his system and he only had trace amounts a few days after ingesting the drugs....hence why he would have very very small amounts in his system days later. So I think it's a bit simplistic to say such things. Do people who dope get caught with huge amounts of steroids in their system? No!
This is not true. In fact, traces of clostebol were still present in the second test, in a dose very similar to the first test, even though several days had passed.
@@3nonvaYea, but the dosage was consistent with the time mentioned and the period when he was contaminated.
What you're talking about it's just speculation, can you prove it?
@@mausaedof8398 Do your research. The duration for steroids to clear from the system depends on the type of steroid used:
Steroids typically stay in the system for about 4 to 12 hours.
It takes around 5 to 6 half-lives for a drug to be completely eliminated.
After about 4 to 5 half-lives, a medication is considered “cleared” from the body.
The range of detectability times can vary from a few days to 18 months after the last use, depending on various factors.
@@3nonvathat’s a poor argument tbh. The trainer was consistently applying the product to his hand throughout the time period and would’ve continued giving Sinner treatment as such, so it’s likely the contamination re entered Sinner’s system more than once. Remember, Sinner was only notified after Miami, so it’s not like they kept going with the same stuff after they got the notification.
There are two issues:
1) the test does not determine if a player was doping. Most athletes found with clostebol in their bodies had less than 2 nanograms/ml. The metabolism of the drug is relative fast so the amount found will be dependent on when was the administration done. Timing is essential. If you recently took the medication you will be found with high levels of it. But if a couple of days passed the amount will be similar to Sinner. The same if you accidentally was in contact with the drug few hours before the test then you might have similar amount of the drugs that can last for several days. The bar for the doping agency to potentially destroy the career of a player should be higher than just finding trace amount of a drug that can go to your body by just touching another person. Very important will be to know if there were serial test done and what was the time frame. Or if an alternative like a hair test should be done.
2) there is discrepancy between sinner case and how lower ranked players were handle by the authorities. It seems that the main difference between sinner and several other cases is that the authorities decided to believe sinner explanation but not the other players explanation. Moreover it seems that legally in these “doping cases” the defendants have the burden of proof with go against a basic legal principle that is the accuser that should have to probe beyond any doubt that the defendant is guilty. Because the positive test results with low amount of these substance can not serve as undeniable proof of doping. They are a proof of having the substance in your system. But the low amount does not proof doping.
If you're more popular, more important, more money making, you will definitely get different treatment compared to some average joes, that's just how the world and capitalism works sadly
Do you know Bortolotto? He is another italian tennis player, not the number one, not popular, not money maker... Well, same situation, same treatment. Exactly the same.
@@elenavarvello1512the Italian bit might have relevance.
A low ranked tennis player in Italy was considered innocent for the same substance (Bortolotti). Still the system does not work fairly and needs to be improved as Sinner was lucky he was able to prove his innocence.
@@KarmaticEvolution lol Sure, we're such a powerful country... USA and China fear us
@@KarmaticEvolution The fact that they're both Italian is not nearly enough to mean anything.
There are two significant records both held by Connors which Djokovic doesn’t have: most titles and most matches won.
*TITLES*
1. Connors 109
2. Federer 103
3. Djokovic 99
4. Lendl 94
5. Nadal 92
*MATCHES WON*
1. Connors 1274
2. Federer 1251
3. Djokovic 1116
4. Nadal 1075
5. Lendl 1068
I am kind of amazed by the players who attacked Sinner when he was contaminated by no fault of his own--that could potentially happen to them, too, and then what? Maybe I'm not surprised: it was Nick Kyrgios.
Yeh they should be thinking there but for the grace of God tbf
Sinner is dating Kyrgios' ex girlfriend... Might play a part in this...
Kyrgios is an ignorant boor narcissist
Steroids sinner 🥕💉🥕💉🔥
I hope another live audience episode occurs soon! Excellent and robust discussion!
Thank you from bringing context and facts Andy!
Thank you for trying to shill and failing horribly! It will only wake up more people to Sinner’s cheating and the corruption in tennis!
@@sleepyjoe7389 So Sinner was doped in Cincinnati as well since he won...
@@sleepyjoe7389 That’s called defamation. You’re just lucky that no one involved in this situation will ever acknowledge your existence
@@francesco7649 yeah the tactic won’t work you pathetic shill. You will not stop the truth from getting out. It’s too late. Sinner is a cheater and the officials running ATP are corrupt to the bone.
@@setblack_cat1 Sinner is a cheater and deserves a 2-year ban. The ATP officials covering for him deserve to have their livelihoods taken away from them.
Thank you, Roddick. I think at this moment, Sina needs a voice like yours to appear.
I'm still confused. Is EVERY player allowed to appeal immediately and be allowed to continue playing until the appeal is adjudicated? And does every player get to have their case adjudicated within a few months? if not, this is where the unfairness lies.
If I got it right, the difference from Halep's and Errani's case and others, is that Sinner's team knew what he had taken and why.
If someone took clostebol to enhance performance, how would they take it? Just before it disappears from the bloodstream, would it measure as a billionth of a gram?
No
can u please invite john mcenroe to the podcastsssss??? like always? thank u
Sinner should not be allowed to play this is ridiculous especially being a number one player it does not matter if it’s an accident oh I accidentally took something that is illegal oh your number one so it’s ok go ahead play …. Cmon Tennis .. ur better than this!’ I love you Andy and your insight is so appreciated 😊
Informati bene! Sinner non ha preso niente, non ha assunto niente! È solo venuto a contatto, ma se non ti informi bene cosa parli a fare?
Why should he not be allowed to play? The contamination was in March. He was exposed with no knowledge. It is no longer in his system. It was never in a level to enhance performance. He was cleared of blame. To want to stop him playing is just straight up viciousness and vengefulness.
Why should he not be allowed to play? The contamination was in March. He was exposed with no knowledge. It is no longer in his system. It was never in a level to enhance performance. He was cleared of blame. To want to stop him playing is just straight up viciousness and vengefulness.
So much talk about this chemical not being effective at the dose it was found. 1) Is there published evidence that a certain minimum amount is needed for performance benefits? No. 2) drugs are eliminated from the body with time, so could it have been present, beforehand, at a higher concentration? Yes.
Really loved this episode Andy! Great work. You are winning in real life so forget the haters!
I would love to be there in person. Maybe do an annual live US Open
26:16 - perfect description of the current state of this information lazy society
Can Mr. Roddick answer a question about when he was scheduled to play doubles with Marty Fish at the US Open and decided not to play or was not allowed to play.
the big question is why the heck you need a drug ointment with clostebol ingredient for cut in the finger? like most ppl just use band aid and let it heal naturally (and sometimes just adding antiseptic) no?
the question is , who would actually believe that pathetic story , it’s an insult to anyone with common sense !!!
@@ValentinG23 but like this or not it is the pcs of news that we got from the media 😬 (and we can't verify it for a fact but told by the media and Jannik team spokeperson as fact anyway)
@@KNful if they would have said that Yannick looked at a passing asteroid that had used that cream/spray i would have believed that more that the bs they came up with 👎👎
@@ValentinG23Anyone with common sense and intelligence is knowledgeable about transdermal delivery, unfortunately doesn't look like you are 😅
it depends on the cut to be honest, he needed a bandage so it was probably a bit deep, it’s a common used spray in italy
Based on the half-life of clostebol, the amount in his system would be performance-enhancing in as few as five days prior. Meaning, he could have been given a performance-enhancing amount of the drug 5-6 days prior to the test to result in one-one billiionth of a gram of the drug at the time of testing. So, the amound found at the time of testing isn't as minor as what people think.
Minuscule amount in the drug test wouldn’t enhance his performance? There’s minuscule amount when the drug test is done, cuz the bulk of it had already washed out of his system. Do other cheaters caught have large amount of a banned substance in the drug test? It’s always trace amount. Why? Cheaters know the pharmacokinetics of a substance and will take it so that by the time the drug test is done, the drug is washed out of the system by the kidneys or by the liver. Often times they get caught because the substance is removed slower than expected due to other factors, like drug interactions, which slows down the kidneys or the liver, or illness can alter the removal process, allowing the substances to circulate in the body longer than expected.
Agree!
I ❤ this podcast!
Regardless of whether Sinner knowingly doped or not, there's a huge issue with Clostebol doping in Italian sport. A Google search will bring up articles on the subject. It's rampant in Italy. This goes a lot deeper than this individual case.
It's not rampant, it's only easier to get contaminated cause you can buy whenever you want a normal medicine with Clostebol in it
There's no "Clostebol doping scandal". The substance is just widely available, thus making contamination easier
Shh don’t tell the truth money is at stake
Are you Italian? I guess not or you'd know that trofodermin is like the most common over the counter no prescription medication if you suffer from like dermatitis (or if you say want cuts or blisters to close quicker). Maybe all it needs to happen is to not make that easy to get so accidental contamination can go down
@@lio896It is rampant. There is a huge warning on the product. And still you use it knowing that tomorrow the control guys might come to check on you?
Thank you Andy. This makes much more sense. My take away “we are bad at nuance at scale”. Im gonna use it for the rest of my life
Comparing something to a grain of salt is just silly. Like Gill said, it takes a 1/5 of vodka to get drunk but much more beer. Size means nothing when you are talking about a substance you're both unfamiliar with. And we don't know the exact amounts on ingestion, only what was still traceable... twice
Both tests were done in the same week though, substances take a long time to leave the system so not surprising it would be found in the same week
@@Apochocolateesp anabolic and corticosteroids they are very long acting medications
@@Apochocolate exaclty. To consider also that Sinner was playing another tournament 15 days before and had no issues...
I love when people question science and medicine just because they want to. The beauty of free speech!
Exactly. They authorities set the threshold for a reason and the amount doesn't matter. Positive test is a positive test, the actual amount doesn't make a positive test negative.
Look, Andy: those four finals lost … they don't matter anymore! Send Roger kisses, as you're the podcast GOAT!
Sinner’s reputation is intact despite critics who attacked him without reading the International Tennis Integrity Agency (ITIA) report and included in there is also the full PDF decision report link by Sport Resolutions:
“Independent tribunal rules 'No Fault or Negligence' in case of Jannik Sinner: No period of ineligibility imposed by Sport Resolutions panel”.
They knew the second they decided not to initially suspend him he had to be found innocent . Otherwise they admit to letting a cheater play. You don’t believe their story stop pretending you do
@@jonlucente4709 You know nothing of the process so stop guessing.
@@RamZar50 well I know the process isn’t to let a player who tested positive to keep playing lol - Unless of course you’re going to later deem him innocent. Thats the only option literally. You can’t let him play and then say he’s been guilty for half a year . This was so incredibly obviously a coverup from the start .
@@jonlucente4709 Nonsense. There’s a process in place and it was followed. Read all 33 pages of the Sport Resolution report. Thorough investigation, no coverup and no favoritism.
@@RamZar50 that proves nothing. They come up with a report to point to to seem objective to naive fans
Off topic. Does anyone know what brand is Andy top?
You are speculating on this story that is close . He’s innocent that’s it ! You are all jealous and wants see people goes down …. Horrible !!
He was found Guilty
@@milanm403 No he's innocent. Read the statment.
All players should have the same treatment. If that substance is Ok in that small amount, that should be official and applicable to all players. However, if that substance is forbidden, it is irrelevant whether it is small amount or huge. This should really be simple. It is unfortunate that it happened the way it happened, but generally rules are there to be followed and if you are #1 player you should obviously set an example and just ask to be treated as everyone else. We all love Jannik, but this is just not fair to all other players who have been punished and perhaps as well had some unfortunate circumstances. Just think about it. And yes, if your phisio had a cut, and an open wound, it is really questionable why he hadn’t covered the cut as any other person should do? Thank you as always Andy for your show, love to watch it and I have to mention that I was your big fan when I was a teenager! 😌❤️🎾
I really love listening to Roddick on his podcast, but I think there's an issue with saying that he is here to give an objective take and then he reads a text from Sinner's coach and from an anonymous player who's story has nothing to do with Sinner's...
Cahill will definitely defend his player, so because of the inherent bias he shouldn't be taken as an objective truth take.
The player's story about spaghetti involved a group of people and a contaminated spaghetti that the player didn't know about, but the entities stopped the investigation straight away as soon as it was found out.
Also Roddick kept on bringing up the anecdote of Sinner being the worst ever doper in the world because the trace amount he had in his sample was too small to make any effect, neglecting the fact that having a trace amount might indicate you had more in your system before. Especially since this is a substance known for washing off pretty quickly.
Roddick was once no1 in the world and he has a much bigger emotional attachment to Sinner's position than he is aknowledging. Most of the takes he's giving are his own personal feelings toward the risk and reward of doping and losing the place as best player in the world.
We'll only ever know what we're told, so for me the best take was from his producer who said we should be suspicious, but never too cynical where we dip into conspiracy theories.
"you had more in your system before". Well, this is probably true, but more than a billionth of a gram could be 1.15 billionth of a gram... I mean sinner was tested before and definitely several times after the positive sample. So the time of positivity is really narrow. I don't know how much this clostebol stays in blood and how quickly its concentration decreases. And I think neither do you. Anyway I think that the scientists (who didn't know they were judging sinner) have probably a better knowledge of you and me together and I bet they had all the timing of previous tests too. I honestly have no knowledge that allows me to doubt what they have decided, but, if you do I would like to see which are the textbooks and formulas you are using.
I can add that on march 10 the quantity was 0.86pg/mL and on the 18th it was 0.78pg/mL (I could be wrong of 0.0x since I'm going by heart). I think this gives a little perspective.
@@DadeSpace I'm not really arguing on guilt or innocence, we only know what we're given and he's been cleared of charges. That's why I used the word 'might', a person with trace amounts might or might not have had more in their system. I agree, I'm not a scientist and that's why I didn't make a comment about whether or not Sinner is doping. My point was on Roddick claiming that he's being super objective and this is a facts before feelings take, then proceed to give a very feelings forward and a bit of a biased account. I don't blame him, he's been a top player for many years and it is natural that his empathy leans towards someone in the same position.
So where can I get producer Mike’s 47 Brand US Open hat?
Another very informative podcast . Thanks
I’m hoping the way Sinner was treated is the new normal. If the next player to go through this gets an extended suspension during the investigation stage, there will be a lot of bad blood and calls of bias - especially if that player is WTA or an under represented ethnic group
It's so unfair to other tennis players who experienced similar misfortune but didn't have the luxury of receiving any favors. Suffice it to mention the Polish tennis player Kamil Majchrzak, who was in disbelief at the information about how smoothly Sinner's case went through, and his match cycle was not disturbed in any way. Halep lost entire years of her professional career, Majchrzak lost 13 months, and for both of them it meant being cut off from their life's passion and source of income, not to mention having to fight for their good name.
It's not like if some cases were treated badly, then Sinner's too has to. As Andy said in the podcast, there were no favors, everything was done by the book and they disclosed all immediately after there was a resolution, as it should be. Sorry for Majchrzak and Halep, but I repeat, if their cases were treated badly (I have no idea what happened to them, but I presume you are not lying) it's a fault of whoever did that, not Sinner's.
Hi Andy, looking forward to the video! Can't wait to hear your thoughts on Sinner.
I have an opinion, It smells.
However, at the top of the game anything goes, just don't get caught.
I'm am alcaraz fanboy, but this is something that I don't think too deeply into at all except the part of the team. I dont feel like it taints his legacy.
His team let him down on so many levels and they need to admit it rather than add layers and layers of BS. If they admitted this it would help Sinner's image.
Of course his legacy is tainted forever. In a sport with an incredibly lenient anti-doping programme, you don't test positive twice and keep your reputation unharmed.