+Nukle0n I'm too cheap to buy snap caps so I take an expended cartridge case and de-cap the primer.Then I fill the primer pocket with hot glue.The glue is kind of pliable and elastic and I've never damaged a firing pin with this method.
+Nukle0n Maybe someone could 3d print some snap caps with the primer areas hollowed out. I guess a softer plastic would be best, since it would stand less of a chance of damaging an antique.
I can see how this version required pretty much the least amount of modification to upgrade a single shot rifle. The modified bolt and base plate are easily swapped out and could be mass produced seperately. I suspect the idea behind the design was to produce something that could be applied by anyone in the field provided you had the new parts.
They would probably have issued just one magazine per rifle; to be refilled in situ. Even if there was a carrying case it would looked similar to an ordinary cartridge pouch. And being German, in the 1880s, it would have been leather.
That magazine has some downright amazing sheet metal work that has gone into it, all of those compound curves would be a nightmare for production! One part that you didn't explain, It seems like the little lever on the outside far right was a shell feeding mechanism to only allow one cartridge into the loading area at a time. You can see the little finger protruding into the inside of the magazine where it would make contact with the cartridges. Each time the cover closes it would allow the cartridges to freely feed into the loading area, then cut it off once the cover opened and hold the cartridges back. It is a pretty ingenious system considering how little the original firearm would have to be modified, receive remains untouched, bolt could be refitted with an adapted bolt handle, only a new trigger guard/floor plate. but it's not as simple as a gun should be, too many moving parts to fail in the feeding mechanism. Thanks for the video Ian I always learn something new by watching. I'm going to join you patreon shortly!
i really enjoy learning about these dead ends in technology because they spark all kinds of interesting what if questions. Its fun to imagine what the world might look like today if some of those bizarre dead ends were instead technological mile stones or even revolutions.
What I really like about your videos is that you are so concerned about history- you know SO much about all those interesting- and important, historical details!
"It's sort of a very steampunk sort of external lever and mechanical setup sort of...device." That's unironically the best description for this thing, captures the weirdness really well. :D
+TheSkipjack95 I thought it also very well thought out. For what it is. Obviously this is NOT battle ready, but that aside a lot of thought went into the design. I find it fascinating.
+William Hayden I find it fascinating that these sorts of things were designed without the benefit of CAD software, 3D modelling, or even calculators. They really had to role up their sleeves and hit the drawing board back then.
Holy hell Ian really doesn’t age! Im watching this in 2022 and had to double check its really from 2015, as he looks exactly the same as his most recent video i saw, good stuff man!
I love this! It turns the G71 into a magazine rife with minimal modifications. Something like this would’ve probably been the half-live upgrade for this rifle, if it ever got one.
Un-flipping believable. What a great job you have. I have seen enough of your videos to know that you are good at what you do but...wow, what a great gig you have going there.
Shekel-Man I think the Remington-Lee or a variant of it came out commercially around 1879ish with the removable box magazine . And the Spencer used a removable tube magazine in the buttstock.
+TheNextGamer87 If I only knew 3d modeling I could already have done several of this stuff for FO3/NV/4 But as long as I'm terrible at it there aren't many chances
***** I would more like to know what the hell happened to China, after all they are the main cause of all of it. Then France that relies a lot in nuclear energy, a nuke there would probably cause a domino effect that would affect the countries and, last of all, most of the nations around France would be very interesting to know how they manage to hold up with the radioactive winds. Well, obviously here we're mostly to talk about weapons, but there's still need for something to glue the thing together.
+54Simon54 I was recently re-reading Neuromancer where it is alluded to that Bonn was destroyed in some sort of nuclear incident. As Fallout 4 had also just come out, I was thinking the same thing, Germany/Europe would make a great setting for a fallout game (also, while I've nothing but love for the city, I'd like to see my old haunt of Hamburg in post-apocalyptic mode)
+CeeDee Player A canceled Fallout game would have taken place in China (partly). It was planned that a cult of followers of a new chinese emperor tried to launch a superweapon against the US and the faction of the player. While it is fair to say that China is responsible for the radioactive wasteland in North America, I wouldn´t blame them for the war. Who started it remains debateable, even though one NPC in the Fallout Universe claimed "the damn reds" to be the initial attackers. But he was a US-Government figure, so he wasn´t the most reliable source. Keep in mind that Fallout does not take place in a post-apocalyptic version of our world. The US in 2077 have probably reached the peak of nuclear energy use, as cars, household objects and handguns are powered by it. Cramming more reactors into one square mile than we see in the Fallout Universe would be hard, so France would probably equally or less fucked than the US. Also a reactor doesn´t explode just because it is hit with from the blast of a nuclear bomb, and even if it gets damaged to the point of a worst case scenario, a explosion similiar to a bomb isn´t really what would happen. It would irradiate a great area around the plant, but not as spectacular as one would hope.
I really love these 18th- and 19th-century kludge rifles. Muskets converted to breach loaders, breach loaders converted to magazine feed. It takes a special kind of cleverness to make it work. It's not as efficient, cost-effective, or compact as a purpose-built weapon, but it makes sense if you've already got obsolete rifles lying around. The 20th century didn't really have an equivalent, unless you count the handful of machine guns converted from bolt-action rifles.
+Hertog Willem While I don't personally know the answer, it is likely that we could not come to a final agreement with the consignor. Darn shame too with all the exposure he would've gotten from Ian's video.
+Rock Island Auction Company Its great that you have established a partnership with Ian! Not only does it increase exposure but Its a great way to share the history of these amazing and rare firearms. Without collectors and historians, so much of this interesting knowledge and heritage would be lost forever. Thank you!
+Rock Island Auction Company That's too bad. I'm really curious to see what this prototype would go for. I just made a comment that it was too bad that Ian couldn't shoot it, but I know those opportunities are few and far between. The only ones I remember him shooting off the top of my head are automatics. I imagine having Ian demonstrate an old auto is fully functional is quite a boost come time to bid.
+Rock Island Auction Company I remember reading about this experimental improvement in the late 80s,and yes there was one small poor quality image in that book. Never even crossed my mind that what I just saw Ian do would happen. So I very much wish to thank both Ian and RIA for the opportunity and the cogent explanation. Way to go,fellas. This sharing of information to interested parties is what this whole technology does best. Good on you both.
+Dan L The first successful box magazine was the Remington-Lee 1879. Not mid 1800s, but it was at a time when most rifles if they were repeaters at all used a tube magazine. And yes, that's Lee as in James Paris Lee, designer of the Lee-Enfield.
+Forgotten Weapons Assuming that they did manage to issue extra of these external clips, would it be reasonable to say it couldve been used as a detachable mag?
+RandomOinker They 'could" have, certainly, but at the time, it would not have been a viable option for a military to order extra magazines, each made specifically for each individual rifle, when the doctrine of the day was by order volley fire.
11mm of BLACK powder though, not the more modern smokeless powder. Its the same stuff used in muskets and shit, not what most everyone walked into world war one with. They needed it to be that big to compensate for the lack of power with just making the cartridge massive.
The idea was mass > speed. There was no real ballistic armor then, so what people did was have a bigger bullet to impart all the force, rather than a smaller bullet going faster. Black powder's less effective nature also played into this somewhat.
can you get ammo for these rifles still? After watching and hearing your description, I realize one of the rifles hanging on my wall at home is a Gewehr 71/84. even though it it probably the oldest one up there it has the smoothest action, and I've always wanted to shoot it. not a lot, since it is in good condition, but just a couple times maybe.
It can be found on places like Gunbroker. the 11MM Mauser round was also known as the .43 caliber Mauser round and was made until the mid 50s. You can still find surplus sometimes but is it pricey. Some people have modified 45-90 casings like you said and it works fine. I have about 200 rounds all together and fire my gun every once in a while. I won't fire stuff from early years, I don't trust it but the later stuff works fine and is smokeless so you don't get that cloud of smoke that ticks off other people on the gun range.
Did the under barrel solution require any modification, or change of the bolt? I have no experience whatsoever in machining, but i can imagine you would need to replace the standard bolt, with the new bolt with the required finger to operate the horse shoe magazine.
tolle videos , die du da machst ! selbst wenn man das englische nur spärlich versteht wie ich , ist es leicht zu begreifen :-) great videos that you make there! even if one understands the English only sparingly, like me, it is easy to grasp :-D universal translator :)
That is interesting and a great way to retro-fit an old single shot, but I can see why it did not win. It might be cost effective compared to basically replacing all the rifles with new ones, but I suspect in combat conditions this would have all kinds of issues. If your rifle is tilted, the round could just kick out of the rifle entirely. If you are running and working it, the round could pop out and you chamber nothing but air. The good aspect though, if it fails, you still have a working rifle.
I am interested in purchasing this rifle, Do you have any knowledge on why this rifle was pulled from the auction, or whether or not it will be back during a future auction?
I think the Krag was inspired by that rifle. Maybe not, but this rifle is about 15 years older than the Krag, so it could not have been inspired by the Krag.
It would be interesting to see you guys demonstrate the use of these weapons, and how they operate with ammunition in the cycle, by utilizing something like snap-caps, or dud rounds. That way you could easily showcase how the firearm operated, without too much concern for the overall integrity of the firearm's condition.
This has a great deal going in it's favor. Minimal work done on the actual rifle, none of which affected it in its primary role, a quick (relatively) change feature in case of in-the -field damage and the magazine lockout. These could be delivered pre-loaded as well. Frankly, it is the next best thing to a box magazine without the problems of more machining and having to be held up higher in the prone position. There was real promise shown here.
Would it have been too complicated to have added the bottom plate and modified bolt to the under barrel, tube fed model they adopted in the end so as to be able to use magazines as well?
Cool design what a contraption, wonder if you were not quick enough with the action if you could actually have several rounds bounce out of the mag? I like the fact they thought to make it removable ans still retain a working firearm without the magazine. Pretty slick I remember reading somewhere about a horse shoe design magazine but could never really picture it in my head. It does look pretty high tech for the time.
Looking at it, I would think that there might be an issue with the new round coming into place too quickly and preventing the expended case from being fully ejected (a kind of traffic jam). Also there is that gap with exposed wood in a recess, that seems like it would make make the surface a new round is passing over really rough. A new round might even just skip out? Is there any known information on why this failed trials?
You always do an excellent job with these but sometimes you overlook very important details in your videos. Things that may be obvious to you, because your there, but in no way can the rest of us know. How do you load the magazine? From your description there doesn't seem to be a feed lip of any kind? Does the lid serve as a feed lip?
I imagine that is probably less than reliable and possibly a little fiddly, with rounds having to land just the right way and the timing being close, it is, none the less, very clever.
I've been hearing a lot of mentions of Military Observers in your videos lately. While its something i've heard of before, I've never actually seen any good documentation on the subject. Do you, (or anyone reading this message for that matter) know of any documentaries or written material on these people and how this was done? Thanks!
Wait, sorry if I'm being an idiot. But what stops all the bullets from springing out at once? I don't see any mechanism to ensure that only one bullet gets "spat out" of the magazine.
That looks pretty cool! I mean, it looks rather frail and fragile with all that thin metal, but in the 1870s, I think we're still talking about organized line infantry, like the 18th and early 19th century. Not a whole lot of running around, ducking for cover, and the like, to be had.
+NormanMatchem Actually the german army was a little bit farther than line infantry. And while running around was an integral part of battles since ever, taking cover was one of the main advantages of bolt rifles, as loading a musket while lying down is pretty hard. The german war (or prussian-austrian war) of 1966 is a good example of modern (german) tactics and technology against more traditional line infantry. Turns out standing in a line isn´t the best idea while shot at. Who knew?
Luke DS No, I think it was easily perceivable that I meant the small conflict where a polnish province went to war with Austria. I nearly caused a East-West confrontation. The reason to the conflict was the price of milk.
Jorvard There was really no such thing as Prussia in 1966 man, and they wouldn't have been using line infantry, dude the A-H empire wasn't even using line infantry during WWI they wouldn't have been using them 1966!
I think I'm missing something: In the brief moment when the dust cover is opened but before the bolt is manually closed, what's preventing the follower from spitting extra cartridges out?
People laugh at a magazine cut off on a bolt action rifle but it's really identical in function to a selector switch on a fully automatic weapon today you can save the full amount of fire power until you need it and hence save ammunition
Very clever and complex but I must ask, why didn't they make an internal magazine or a removable box mag? and why weren't these simpler solutions thought of?
They were thought of -- just not yet. We have the benefit of seeing and evaluating the end products of a long line of thought processes, and this sort of trial piece represents an earlier point on that line, where the inventor is trying to learn whether or not his concept is practical.
If everything worked as intended this seems like it would be better than just tubing, but I imagine it either was too expensive or that there were feed problems they weren't able to reliably fix within the time restraint.
I wish u would have some empty shell casings for these guns so we can see if they actually worked in practice instead of just pointing and how it was going to work
I love these weird guns. I only wish you had some snap caps so we could see the action work.
+Ryawshum I don't think it's easy to find snap-caps for 11x60R Mauser.
I know. But a man can wish.
+Nukle0n I'm too cheap to buy snap caps so I take an expended cartridge case and de-cap the primer.Then I fill the primer pocket with hot glue.The glue is kind of pliable and elastic and I've never damaged a firing pin with this method.
+Nukle0n Maybe someone could 3d print some snap caps with the primer areas hollowed out. I guess a softer plastic would be best, since it would stand less of a chance of damaging an antique.
+JohnLeePedimore
too poor, you meant
I can see how this version required pretty much the least amount of modification to upgrade a single shot rifle. The modified bolt and base plate are easily swapped out and could be mass produced seperately. I suspect the idea behind the design was to produce something that could be applied by anyone in the field provided you had the new parts.
good point.
can you imagine how crazy the webbing would have looked for those magazines?
They would probably have issued just one magazine per rifle; to be refilled in situ.
Even if there was a carrying case it would looked similar to an ordinary cartridge pouch.
And being German, in the 1880s, it would have been leather.
Beautiful looking rifle, would like to see some cartridges cycled through to get a better idea of the concept
That magazine has some downright amazing sheet metal work that has gone into it, all of those compound curves would be a nightmare for production!
One part that you didn't explain, It seems like the little lever on the outside far right was a shell feeding mechanism to only allow one cartridge into the loading area at a time. You can see the little finger protruding into the inside of the magazine where it would make contact with the cartridges. Each time the cover closes it would allow the cartridges to freely feed into the loading area, then cut it off once the cover opened and hold the cartridges back.
It is a pretty ingenious system considering how little the original firearm would have to be modified, receive remains untouched, bolt could be refitted with an adapted bolt handle, only a new trigger guard/floor plate. but it's not as simple as a gun should be, too many moving parts to fail in the feeding mechanism.
Thanks for the video Ian I always learn something new by watching. I'm going to join you patreon shortly!
i really enjoy learning about these dead ends in technology because they spark all kinds of interesting what if questions. Its fun to imagine what the world might look like today if some of those bizarre dead ends were instead technological mile stones or even revolutions.
What I really like about your videos is that you are so concerned about history- you know SO much about all those interesting- and important, historical details!
Love the extra little clicks when feeding a new round. Must sound awesome in full-motion
"It's sort of a very steampunk sort of external lever and mechanical setup sort of...device."
That's unironically the best description for this thing, captures the weirdness really well. :D
I love these intermediary designs between single shots and modern semi
That is really clever.
+TheSkipjack95 I thought it also very well thought out. For what it is. Obviously this is NOT battle ready, but that aside a lot of thought went into the design. I find it fascinating.
+William Hayden I find it fascinating that these sorts of things were designed without the benefit of CAD software, 3D modelling, or even calculators. They really had to role up their sleeves and hit the drawing board back then.
+George W (Rrolf) You are a descendant of Babbage?
+Heather Spoonheim What was that about steam powered computers?
+azmanabdula Magik!
Man i really like the way this magazine functions.
Holy hell Ian really doesn’t age! Im watching this in 2022 and had to double check its really from 2015, as he looks exactly the same as his most recent video i saw, good stuff man!
I love this! It turns the G71 into a magazine rife with minimal modifications. Something like this would’ve probably been the half-live upgrade for this rifle, if it ever got one.
Quarter life upgrade (they were still in use in WW1 35 years later).
Un-flipping believable. What a great job you have. I have seen enough of your videos to know that you are good at what you do but...wow, what a great gig you have going there.
I really enjoyed the cool design of the magazine mechanisms. Very interesting. Thanks, Ian.
Pretty smart idea and a great recycling idea.
One of the best Mauser mods. I've ever seen. Too bad it wasn't adopted. No more problems with the "Spitzer" pointy bullets soon to come!
Does this count as the first detachable mag fed rifle?
Shekel-Man I think the Remington-Lee or a variant of it came out commercially around 1879ish with the removable box magazine . And the Spencer used a removable tube magazine in the buttstock.
That magazine seems to be very well made and of high quality material.
That looks steampunk as fuck.
This conversion is really clever and so enjoy your video's. Being a gun collector you think you know a lot till I watch you.
what a form fitting magazine. really clever design too.
Probably somewhat unreliable and/or espensive. Otherwise they would've made all magazines like that, I think. But the idea is cool.
I really wish you could shoot all these really cool experimental guns , they are so cool
I'm a liberal European who's never really held a gun but this channel has shown me how interesting the history and engineering of them can be
Same.
Do you think you will ever take a look at the Mauser M98K F1?
Was the magazine reloadable while installed on the rifle?
+farenheit1100 Yep.
This rifle is so steampunk; nice find Ian!
+TheNextGamer87
Get in touch with the Nexus. Someone will want to make something like this.
+TheNextGamer87
If I only knew 3d modeling I could already have done several of this stuff for FO3/NV/4
But as long as I'm terrible at it there aren't many chances
*****
I would more like to know what the hell happened to China, after all they are the main cause of all of it.
Then France that relies a lot in nuclear energy, a nuke there would probably cause a domino effect that would affect the countries and, last of all, most of the nations around France would be very interesting to know how they manage to hold up with the radioactive winds.
Well, obviously here we're mostly to talk about weapons, but there's still need for something to glue the thing together.
+54Simon54
I was recently re-reading Neuromancer where it is alluded to that Bonn was destroyed in some sort of nuclear incident. As Fallout 4 had also just come out, I was thinking the same thing, Germany/Europe would make a great setting for a fallout game (also, while I've nothing but love for the city, I'd like to see my old haunt of Hamburg in post-apocalyptic mode)
+CeeDee Player A canceled Fallout game would have taken place in China (partly). It was planned that a cult of followers of a new chinese emperor tried to launch a superweapon against the US and the faction of the player.
While it is fair to say that China is responsible for the radioactive wasteland in North America, I wouldn´t blame them for the war. Who started it remains debateable, even though one NPC in the Fallout Universe claimed "the damn reds" to be the initial attackers. But he was a US-Government figure, so he wasn´t the most reliable source.
Keep in mind that Fallout does not take place in a post-apocalyptic version of our world. The US in 2077 have probably reached the peak of nuclear energy use, as cars, household objects and handguns are powered by it. Cramming more reactors into one square mile than we see in the Fallout Universe would be hard, so France would probably equally or less fucked than the US. Also a reactor doesn´t explode just because it is hit with from the blast of a nuclear bomb, and even if it gets damaged to the point of a worst case scenario, a explosion similiar to a bomb isn´t really what would happen. It would irradiate a great area around the plant, but not as spectacular as one would hope.
I really love these 18th- and 19th-century kludge rifles. Muskets converted to breach loaders, breach loaders converted to magazine feed. It takes a special kind of cleverness to make it work. It's not as efficient, cost-effective, or compact as a purpose-built weapon, but it makes sense if you've already got obsolete rifles lying around. The 20th century didn't really have an equivalent, unless you count the handful of machine guns converted from bolt-action rifles.
Absolutely fascinating...Thank you for your presentations. I think you are extremely knowledgeable. You should have your show on the Outdoor Channel!
Thanks for showing. It is amazing at the time period that someone thought of that. Cool design very rare.
Why is it pulled from the auction?
+Hertog Willem While I don't personally know the answer, it is likely that we could not come to a final agreement with the consignor. Darn shame too with all the exposure he would've gotten from Ian's video.
+Rock Island Auction Company Its great that you have established a partnership with Ian! Not only does it increase exposure but Its a great way to share the history of these amazing and rare firearms. Without collectors and historians, so much of this interesting knowledge and heritage would be lost forever. Thank you!
+gi70st i agree. here's the best place to learn about firearms
+Rock Island Auction Company That's too bad. I'm really curious to see what this prototype would go for. I just made a comment that it was too bad that Ian couldn't shoot it, but I know those opportunities are few and far between. The only ones I remember him shooting off the top of my head are automatics. I imagine having Ian demonstrate an old auto is fully functional is quite a boost come time to bid.
+Rock Island Auction Company I remember reading about this experimental improvement in the late 80s,and yes there was one small poor quality image in that book. Never even crossed my mind that what I just saw Ian do would happen. So I very much wish to thank both Ian and RIA for the opportunity and the cogent explanation. Way to go,fellas. This sharing of information to interested parties is what this whole technology does best. Good on you both.
Beautifully designed.
Fun Fact : This video contains more information on german history than the average german is aware of :) Well researched !
It's amazing that something so intuitively simple like the spring fed box magazine weren't thought of until much later.
quentintin1 I admittedly don't know much about pre WWII firearms. Could you give me examples of box magazines from the mid 1800s? Thanks.
+Dan L The first successful box magazine was the Remington-Lee 1879. Not mid 1800s, but it was at a time when most rifles if they were repeaters at all used a tube magazine. And yes, that's Lee as in James Paris Lee, designer of the Lee-Enfield.
Guns and mouse traps inspire ingenuity.
Enev though the box can be removed was it meant as fix mag or detachable mag?
+Mark Schwartz It was intended to be fixed; they would not have issued multiple mags to soldiers.
+Forgotten Weapons Assuming that they did manage to issue extra of these external clips, would it be reasonable to say it couldve been used as a detachable mag?
+RandomOinker They 'could" have, certainly, but at the time, it would not have been a viable option for a military to order extra magazines, each made specifically for each individual rifle, when the doctrine of the day was by order volley fire.
You keep pumping videos out so fast Ian that you're beginning to set a precedent!
Please, write a book with all those marvellous weapons and photo documentation, i'll buy it.
Exchangeable magazine in the 1880's brilliant!
No, TH-cam, I do not want to watch a T-rex learning the Macarena after watching this.
I like that wraparound pseudo-drum magazine design
I have to say that I love these videos. So many interesting and quirky guns.
11mm? sweet jesus.
Agent Bill Wilson 45 caliber
Tommy gun was 11.43mm
11mm of BLACK powder though, not the more modern smokeless powder. Its the same stuff used in muskets and shit, not what most everyone walked into world war one with. They needed it to be that big to compensate for the lack of power with just making the cartridge massive.
That's gun Jesus to you
The idea was mass > speed. There was no real ballistic armor then, so what people did was have a bigger bullet to impart all the force, rather than a smaller bullet going faster. Black powder's less effective nature also played into this somewhat.
These videos are always so cool and informative, thank you.
im all down for history + guns, but i would love to see this thing shooting.
At first I thought it was a Johnson-esk rotary magazine. The horseshoe design makes it all the more interesting.
Whoever worked on developing that horseshoe magazine had quite the clever mind!
can you get ammo for these rifles still? After watching and hearing your description, I realize one of the rifles hanging on my wall at home is a Gewehr 71/84. even though it it probably the oldest one up there it has the smoothest action, and I've always wanted to shoot it. not a lot, since it is in good condition, but just a couple times maybe.
nevermind, after doing some research, finding people trying to modify 45-90 casings to work tells me you can't find them anywhere.
It can be found on places like Gunbroker. the 11MM Mauser round was also known as the .43 caliber Mauser round and was made until the mid 50s. You can still find surplus sometimes but is it pricey. Some people have modified 45-90 casings like you said and it works fine. I have about 200 rounds all together and fire my gun every once in a while. I won't fire stuff from early years, I don't trust it but the later stuff works fine and is smokeless so you don't get that cloud of smoke that ticks off other people on the gun range.
I suspect the magazines were either 1) unreliable OR 2) expensive to manufacture. Possibly both.
Kind of strange looking,but really ingenious set up.
Fantastic work of mechanical engineering of 1875.
Did the under barrel solution require any modification, or change of the bolt? I have no experience whatsoever in machining, but i can imagine you would need to replace the standard bolt, with the new bolt with the required finger to operate the horse shoe magazine.
how many bullets does that mag hold?
+moonasha Did you even watch the video ?
+moonasha About 8. That was Ian's guess.
MoonUnit IV thanks I must have missed it
moonasha No problem.
so ahead of its time
Wow, innovative... no wonder it was pulled, who wouldn't want this baby!?
That's an awesome mechanism
tolle videos , die du da machst !
selbst wenn man das englische nur spärlich versteht wie ich ,
ist es leicht zu begreifen :-)
great videos that you make there!
even if one understands the English only sparingly, like me,
it is easy to grasp :-D
universal translator :)
That is interesting and a great way to retro-fit an old single shot, but I can see why it did not win. It might be cost effective compared to basically replacing all the rifles with new ones, but I suspect in combat conditions this would have all kinds of issues. If your rifle is tilted, the round could just kick out of the rifle entirely. If you are running and working it, the round could pop out and you chamber nothing but air. The good aspect though, if it fails, you still have a working rifle.
I read about the trapdoor springfield with many experimental magazines. Do you ever have any specimens of it at RIA?
I am interested in purchasing this rifle, Do you have any knowledge on why this rifle was pulled from the auction, or whether or not it will be back during a future auction?
Niesamowita broń. Super prezentacja.Pozdrowienia
Neat-O! I wonder if we will get to see an M1866/74 Gras rifle ( the Mauser M71's contemporary) with a "gravity" magazine.
Huh. That's pretty snazzy. Definitely something worth seeing.
+Hedlum I wonder if there could possible be remakes of this? I'd definitely like to shoot one myself and see/feel first hand how it works.
True German Steam Punk. Very interesting and clever. Thanks for sharing.
Механизм великолепен !!!! Но почему же вы не показали его в действии?!?!?!
Clever, but too complicated for operation under stress, and it depends on gravity too much, BUt a great insight into history. Thanks.
I think this might be inspired by the Krag Jorgensen rifle or maybe the Krag was inspired by this. Hm. Inspiring piece of work though.
I think the Krag was inspired by that rifle. Maybe not, but this rifle is about 15 years older than the Krag, so it could not have been inspired by the Krag.
It would be interesting to see you guys demonstrate the use of these weapons, and how they operate with ammunition in the cycle, by utilizing something like snap-caps, or dud rounds. That way you could easily showcase how the firearm operated, without too much concern for the overall integrity of the firearm's condition.
While not adopted I think it's quite a brilliant idea.
the feed of the cartridge looks like it would kick out more than just one round for the chamber. or was it somehowe controlled by the mag cover?
This has a great deal going in it's favor. Minimal work done on the actual rifle, none of which affected it in its primary role, a quick (relatively) change feature in case of in-the -field damage and the magazine lockout. These could be delivered pre-loaded as well. Frankly, it is the next best thing to a box magazine without the problems of more machining and having to be held up higher in the prone position. There was real promise shown here.
Would it have been too complicated to have added the bottom plate and modified bolt to the under barrel, tube fed model they adopted in the end so as to be able to use magazines as well?
Cool design what a contraption, wonder if you were not quick enough with the action if you could actually have several rounds bounce out of the mag? I like the fact they thought to make it removable ans still retain a working firearm without the magazine. Pretty slick I remember reading somewhere about a horse shoe design magazine but could never really picture it in my head. It does look pretty high tech for the time.
Looking at it, I would think that there might be an issue with the new round coming into place too quickly and preventing the expended case from being fully ejected (a kind of traffic jam). Also there is that gap with exposed wood in a recess, that seems like it would make make the surface a new round is passing over really rough. A new round might even just skip out? Is there any known information on why this failed trials?
You always do an excellent job with these but sometimes you overlook very important details in your videos. Things that may be obvious to you, because your there, but in no way can the rest of us know. How do you load the magazine? From your description there doesn't seem to be a feed lip of any kind? Does the lid serve as a feed lip?
thats too dang cool, wonder how well it works but still neat.
I imagine that is probably less than reliable and possibly a little fiddly, with rounds having to land just the right way and the timing being close, it is, none the less, very clever.
do you have any examples of a rifle with the externally mounted vertical box magazine that you mentioned?
I've been hearing a lot of mentions of Military Observers in your videos lately. While its something i've heard of before, I've never actually seen any good documentation on the subject. Do you, (or anyone reading this message for that matter) know of any documentaries or written material on these people and how this was done?
Thanks!
This might have been the best-looking gun I ever rifle
man, why do most weapons that are never adopted look so damn beautiful.., I guess when it comes to guns, looks and functionality dont always agree...
Wait, sorry if I'm being an idiot. But what stops all the bullets from springing out at once? I don't see any mechanism to ensure that only one bullet gets "spat out" of the magazine.
This is a way earlier example of an early removable magazine than what discovery channel says
discovery channel realy sucks for history lessons its more entertaining then valubal information
That looks pretty cool! I mean, it looks rather frail and fragile with all that thin metal, but in the 1870s, I think we're still talking about organized line infantry, like the 18th and early 19th century. Not a whole lot of running around, ducking for cover, and the like, to be had.
+NormanMatchem Actually the german army was a little bit farther than line infantry. And while running around was an integral part of battles since ever, taking cover was one of the main advantages of bolt rifles, as loading a musket while lying down is pretty hard. The german war (or prussian-austrian war) of 1966 is a good example of modern (german) tactics and technology against more traditional line infantry. Turns out standing in a line isn´t the best idea while shot at. Who knew?
+Jorvard
Did You mean the Prussian-Austrian war of 1866?
Luke DS
No, I think it was easily perceivable that I meant the small conflict where a polnish province went to war with Austria. I nearly caused a East-West confrontation. The reason to the conflict was the price of milk.
Jorvard
There was really no such thing as Prussia in 1966 man, and they wouldn't have been using line infantry, dude the A-H empire wasn't even using line infantry during WWI they wouldn't have been using them 1966!
Jorvard
Think very carefully about the date You're citing, 1966, did You mean 1866 when line Infantry was actually being used.
That looks like it might actually work... We've gotta get you an assortment of oddball dummy round / snap caps.
reminds me for the external magazines made for the martini henry rifles
Thank you for the birthday present! :D
Did anyone else notice that it 'Lock and Rocks'? Not quite an SLR or AK mag, but definitely pointing in that direction
I think I'm missing something: In the brief moment when the dust cover is opened but before the bolt is manually closed, what's preventing the follower from spitting extra cartridges out?
I was thinking that too.
It looks like you'd just get a shower of cartridges
genius!! what an amazing design!
Beautiful rifle thanks for these alls video veere
That's a really cool prototype. Too bad we couldn't see it shooting... ah, missed opportunities...
Now that is really cool! Thanks Ian!
Can you imagine this magazine system on something like the Charlton automatic rifle?
People laugh at a magazine cut off on a bolt action rifle but it's really identical in function to a selector switch on a fully automatic weapon today you can save the full amount of fire power until you need it and hence save ammunition
Very clever and complex but I must ask, why didn't they make an internal magazine or a removable box mag? and why weren't these simpler solutions thought of?
They were thought of -- just not yet. We have the benefit of seeing and evaluating the end products of a long line of thought processes, and this sort of trial piece represents an earlier point on that line, where the inventor is trying to learn whether or not his concept is practical.
If everything worked as intended this seems like it would be better than just tubing, but I imagine it either was too expensive or that there were feed problems they weren't able to reliably fix within the time restraint.
I wish u would have some empty shell casings for these guns so we can see if they actually worked in practice instead of just pointing and how it was going to work
Would be cool if you could stack 2 extra full magazines in front of the that one. Then drop an empty magazine and pull another full one into place.