I would have guessed Arrau would be the reference. It's an iconic performance with an artist whose teacher was a pupil of Liszt's. I haven't listened to the Richter in a couple decades but i remember its leaving me a bit cold. My first recording was Argerich, which i loved at the time. Now, my favorite hands down is Zimmerman. Truly sublimating his technique to the architecture and sweep of the composition. Two excellent recordings, with two very different visions of the work.
Just bought the Wand Beethoven cycle you recommended a few days ago. Amazon just made it available. Love your recommendations, I may be poor in wallet but rich in spirit.
It's been decades since I tried to keep up with what is newest and best. I'm happy to live with one or two or three favored recordings of this piece or that. (OK, a few things I have 5, 6, 7 of; but not many.) Kind of like hanging out with old friends. I'm pleased that a number of them have been been among your reference recordings. Perhaps not always the best, but plenty good enough for me.
I like this comment. I have no shortage of recordings which are technically awful, but I love for some reason or another. The world premiere live performance of Moszkowski's Piano Concerto in B Minor, Op.3 comes to mind immediately. As far as I know, it's never been released commercially. The woodwinds are sharp, and the sound quality is poor. However, there is a certain fiery passion and energy in this performance that is absent in Hyperion's commercial studio recording. I'm so glad I made horrible quality audio rips of this live recording years ago because I can't find it anywhere nowadays; but when I want to hear Moszkowski's Op.3; I go to this bad live performance over the Hyperion studio recording every single time.
Perhaps my favorite work for solo piano. Listened to dozens of recordings back in the day and Richter is definitely a superb reference that's also one of my favorites. Argerich and Arrau are great as well. In general, I've found elite pianists tend to do this piece well, and it's diverse enough so that different pianists can bring their own personality and perspective to it, and most of them are valuable. You can highlight its volatile emotions, its fiery virtuosity, the spirituality, the contrapuntal musicality, the dynamic swings, all while playing it with either a lot or little rubato an dpeddle... and most all of these takes "work" if you're like me and aren't dogmatic about what kind of performance you want.
Couldn't agree more with your judgement and 'gaunt' assessment. The atmosphere Richter conjures up especially in the spectral, eerie closing moments puts me in mind of haunted castles with dark cavernous interiors and Dracula played by Bela Lugosi.
Hahaha! My cat, Max was pawing at Mildred! 'Max and Mildred' - goes well! Anyway, I love the piano music of Ferenc Liszt, and the B minor sonata is something special - special when Richter gets his hands on it.
According to the Richter discography by Falk Schwarz, this recording of the sonata was done live in Livorno, 1966, and first issued in 1994 in the Authorized Recordings set.
I have just watched the horror movie The Mephisto Waltz (1972) based on the Liszt piece Very funny film with a great Jerry Goldsmith score also based on the Liszt piece
It makes sense that Richter's "gaunt" interpretation (to use your well-chosen description, Dave) would have been the reference version back in the day when Liszt was out of fashion. That "gauntness" gave the lie to the stereotype of the composer as all about vapid showmanship. Richter (like Arrau and Brendel) reveals a probing intellect at work beneath all those notes. Speaking of Arrau, it was a live performance of the work by him when he was on tour during my college years that helped dispel that stereotype and enabled me to overcome my bias against the composer.
I know you're not expressing this opinion and merely acknowledging it, but anyone who says that Liszt is all about "vapid showmanship", I genuinely feel sorry for. To use one of Dave's expressions, they're simply "not listening". These are clearly people who are eager to adopt a mainstream opinion, and I guarantee none of them have ever arrived at this opinion on their own; it's simply an opinion they regurgitate without even being remotely familiar with the lesser explored regions of Liszt's prolific output.
@@kingconcerto5860 This stereotype is out there, and it influenced my regard for Liszt's music for most of my youth. That stereotype turns Liszt into a kind of 19th Century Liberace. Fortunately for me Arrau's performance of the b-Minor Sonata aroused an interest in the composer that led to a purchase of Phillips Classics recordings of Arrau and Brendel playing Liszt. I was especially intrigued by Liszt's late, experimental works that anticipate developments to come. We can't forget, etiher, the huge amount of instrumental and vocal music Liszt composed. He was a major figure, but I think some listeners still regard him as shallow when compared with Bach, Beethoven and Brahms.
The recording venues are opaque and have been the subject of much discussion, not helped by inaccurate information. The consensus appears to be that the concerti were recorded in 1961 at Walthamstow Assembly Hall, London and the Sonata was recorded somewhere in Livorno in 1966. By coincidence I'm visiting Livorno next week on holiday so I'll make some enquiries as to where it might have been recorded.
I searched for the original LP version of the sonata, and it seems it has nothing to do with the Mercury team but was recorded in 1966 in Suffolk, Aldenburgh Parish Church. It was first released on LP not before 1976 on a Label called Discocorp, then resurfaced in the mid-80ies on the russian Melodya label and then finally in 1988 on Philips CD. I wonder how this can then qualify as a reference recording, Dave has always insisted that availability would be a key criterion, this seems to be very limited for this version (at least more than for both, the Arrau and the Argerich)
I can't argue with your selection of Richter as reference. However, worth knowing are the early 20th century recordings by Alfred Cortot and Vladimir Horowitz which in different ways are astonishing. This is in spite of "lo-fi" recorded sound.
Thanks for the video @DavesClassicalGuide I've never listened to the Richter but I'm curious if you have ever heard Ernst Levy's Sonata? And the Benediction de Dieu dans la solitude that comes after? I always thought this was a great pairing of Liszt's amazing piano work. Cheers 😊
Would it be possible for you to make a refrence-recording video on Liszt's Dante Sonata? I would be very grateful. And thank you a lot for the wonderful work you have been doing on this channel. It is delightful to listen to you and you have been a big and positive influence in my knowledge of classical music and recordings of it. Thank you! 😊
Yes. Arrau is so well-known for his Beethoven, but I've always felt he had a special genius for the ur-romantics Liszt, Chopin and Schumann. He has both the technique and the tone to make the Liszt sonata special.
Arrau’s teacher, Martin Krause, was Liszt’s last pupil. That’s why Arrau liked to brag that he had, musically speaking, a somewhat direct lineage to Beethoven himself through Krause, Liszt and Czerny (Liszt’s teacher and a Beethoven pupil)…
OK, I am probably going get in trouble here. This Sonata that was released as a filler for the classic renditions of the Liszt concertos is most likely from the 70s - if not the 1980s. A live recording, it is not Richter at his best. I have several other live Richter recordings from the early 60s, which are far superior to this one, but in inferior sound. I think Philips decided to release this latter-day performance Richter, which would be in better sound. That it is, but not in performance! Look elsewhere for better Richter performances of the Sonata.
I agreed with your statement on CT some 2 or 3 decades ago: "Liszt is trash" though I truly love a few pieces. I give this sonata another chance every few years... to no avail.
Dave, this must be the reference recording for the Liszt piano sonata for incomparable quality of the playing, but the recording is a 1966 concert in Livorno released in 1994 as part of an expensive 21 CD box with authorised concert recordings. (See notes Jed Distler (page 108), Sviatoslav Richter Complete recordings Decca, Philips & DG recordings, CD 18). Is this is not a problem to become a reference recording?
No, it isn't. Before it came out we had the usual screaming by the nutty piano fans and many different, excellent options. When this came out, it provided a point of focus, because even people who aren't necessarily Richter fans felt it was necessary--even if it wasn't going to be their first choice.
![Liszt - Sonata in B Minor, S. 178 (Audio+Sheet) [Argerich]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/bHx6kigiOEs/mqdefault.jpg)
I would have guessed Arrau would be the reference. It's an iconic performance with an artist whose teacher was a pupil of Liszt's. I haven't listened to the Richter in a couple decades but i remember its leaving me a bit cold.
My first recording was Argerich, which i loved at the time. Now, my favorite hands down is Zimmerman. Truly sublimating his technique to the architecture and sweep of the composition. Two excellent recordings, with two very different visions of the work.
Just bought the Wand Beethoven cycle you recommended a few days ago. Amazon just made it available. Love your recommendations, I may be poor in wallet but rich in spirit.
Mr. Hurwitz, you predicted the reactions of the piano people in the comments perfectly! Everyone's giving their own opinion even though noone cares!🤣
It's been decades since I tried to keep up with what is newest and best. I'm happy to live with one or two or three favored recordings of this piece or that. (OK, a few things I have 5, 6, 7 of; but not many.) Kind of like hanging out with old friends. I'm pleased that a number of them have been been among your reference recordings. Perhaps not always the best, but plenty good enough for me.
I like this comment. I have no shortage of recordings which are technically awful, but I love for some reason or another. The world premiere live performance of Moszkowski's Piano Concerto in B Minor, Op.3 comes to mind immediately. As far as I know, it's never been released commercially. The woodwinds are sharp, and the sound quality is poor. However, there is a certain fiery passion and energy in this performance that is absent in Hyperion's commercial studio recording. I'm so glad I made horrible quality audio rips of this live recording years ago because I can't find it anywhere nowadays; but when I want to hear Moszkowski's Op.3; I go to this bad live performance over the Hyperion studio recording every single time.
Ive struggled to appreciate liszt, too many notes, but this recording helped me a lot.
Perhaps my favorite work for solo piano. Listened to dozens of recordings back in the day and Richter is definitely a superb reference that's also one of my favorites. Argerich and Arrau are great as well. In general, I've found elite pianists tend to do this piece well, and it's diverse enough so that different pianists can bring their own personality and perspective to it, and most of them are valuable. You can highlight its volatile emotions, its fiery virtuosity, the spirituality, the contrapuntal musicality, the dynamic swings, all while playing it with either a lot or little rubato an dpeddle... and most all of these takes "work" if you're like me and aren't dogmatic about what kind of performance you want.
Couldn't agree more with your judgement and 'gaunt' assessment. The atmosphere Richter conjures up especially in the spectral, eerie closing moments puts me in mind of haunted castles with dark cavernous interiors and Dracula played by Bela Lugosi.
What a coincidence :) currently waiting for the postie to deliver this some time soon, so it's great to hear your thoughts.
Hahaha! My cat, Max was pawing at Mildred! 'Max and Mildred' - goes well!
Anyway, I love the piano music of Ferenc Liszt, and the B minor sonata is something special - special when Richter gets his hands on it.
According to the Richter discography by Falk Schwarz, this recording of the sonata was done live in Livorno, 1966, and first issued in 1994 in the Authorized Recordings set.
I have just watched the horror movie The Mephisto Waltz (1972) based on the Liszt piece
Very funny film with a great Jerry Goldsmith score also based on the Liszt piece
I thought it was arrau as the best known best regarded recording. I grew up in 60s and 70s. Now I’ll hav3 to get the Richter to compare 😊
It makes sense that Richter's "gaunt" interpretation (to use your well-chosen description, Dave) would have been the reference version back in the day when Liszt was out of fashion. That "gauntness" gave the lie to the stereotype of the composer as all about vapid showmanship. Richter (like Arrau and Brendel) reveals a probing intellect at work beneath all those notes. Speaking of Arrau, it was a live performance of the work by him when he was on tour during my college years that helped dispel that stereotype and enabled me to overcome my bias against the composer.
I know you're not expressing this opinion and merely acknowledging it, but anyone who says that Liszt is all about "vapid showmanship", I genuinely feel sorry for. To use one of Dave's expressions, they're simply "not listening". These are clearly people who are eager to adopt a mainstream opinion, and I guarantee none of them have ever arrived at this opinion on their own; it's simply an opinion they regurgitate without even being remotely familiar with the lesser explored regions of Liszt's prolific output.
@@kingconcerto5860 This stereotype is out there, and it influenced my regard for Liszt's music for most of my youth. That stereotype turns Liszt into a kind of 19th Century Liberace. Fortunately for me Arrau's performance of the b-Minor Sonata aroused an interest in the composer that led to a purchase of Phillips Classics recordings of Arrau and Brendel playing Liszt. I was especially intrigued by Liszt's late, experimental works that anticipate developments to come. We can't forget, etiher, the huge amount of instrumental and vocal music Liszt composed. He was a major figure, but I think some listeners still regard him as shallow when compared with Bach, Beethoven and Brahms.
I know this is ancillary to the point, but I do wish places like Tower Records were sill around - it was so much fun to go and browse!
Tower Records is still thriving in Japan. I wish we could have them in America!
The recording venues are opaque and have been the subject of much discussion, not helped by inaccurate information. The consensus appears to be that the concerti were recorded in 1961 at Walthamstow Assembly Hall, London and the Sonata was recorded somewhere in Livorno in 1966. By coincidence I'm visiting Livorno next week on holiday so I'll make some enquiries as to where it might have been recorded.
I searched for the original LP version of the sonata, and it seems it has nothing to do with the Mercury team but was recorded in 1966 in Suffolk, Aldenburgh Parish Church. It was first released on LP not before 1976 on a Label called Discocorp, then resurfaced in the mid-80ies on the russian Melodya label and then finally in 1988 on Philips CD. I wonder how this can then qualify as a reference recording, Dave has always insisted that availability would be a key criterion, this seems to be very limited for this version (at least more than for both, the Arrau and the Argerich)
I can't argue with your selection of Richter as reference. However, worth knowing are the early 20th century recordings by Alfred Cortot and Vladimir Horowitz which in different ways are astonishing. This is in spite of "lo-fi" recorded sound.
There are many versions worth knowing!
Thanks for the video @DavesClassicalGuide I've never listened to the Richter but I'm curious if you have ever heard Ernst Levy's Sonata? And the Benediction de Dieu dans la solitude that comes after? I always thought this was a great pairing of Liszt's amazing piano work. Cheers 😊
Would it be possible for you to make a refrence-recording video on Liszt's Dante Sonata? I would be very grateful.
And thank you a lot for the wonderful work you have been doing on this channel. It is delightful to listen to you and you have been a big and positive influence in my knowledge of classical music and recordings of it.
Thank you! 😊
Sure. Let me give it some thought.
Bolet on Decca. I'd not recommend all of Bolet's Decca discography but the Dante Sonata finds him in top form.
It probably doesn't qualify as a "reference recording", but Volodos made the best recording of the Dante sonata IMO.
John Ogdon's Dante Sonata reaches from Hell to Heaven like nothing else I've heard.
Arrau is incomparable in this piece, to my ears
Especially in his first 1969 version
Yes. Arrau is so well-known for his Beethoven, but I've always felt he had a special genius for the ur-romantics Liszt, Chopin and Schumann. He has both the technique and the tone to make the Liszt sonata special.
Arrau’s teacher, Martin Krause, was Liszt’s last pupil. That’s why Arrau liked to brag that he had, musically speaking, a somewhat direct lineage to Beethoven himself through Krause, Liszt and Czerny (Liszt’s teacher and a Beethoven pupil)…
And he was also, IMHO, absolutely unique in Debussy…
OK, I am probably going get in trouble here. This Sonata that was released as a filler for the classic renditions of the Liszt concertos is most likely from the 70s - if not the 1980s. A live recording, it is not Richter at his best. I have several other live Richter recordings from the early 60s, which are far superior to this one, but in inferior sound. I think Philips decided to release this latter-day performance Richter, which would be in better sound. That it is, but not in performance! Look elsewhere for better Richter performances of the Sonata.
I agreed with your statement on CT some 2 or 3 decades ago: "Liszt is trash" though I truly love a few pieces. I give this sonata another chance every few years... to no avail.
It’s wonderful and it’s, of course, the reference recording; and I also prefer Arrau.
Dave, this must be the reference recording for the Liszt piano sonata for incomparable quality of the playing, but the recording is a 1966 concert in Livorno released in 1994 as part of an expensive 21 CD box with authorised concert recordings. (See notes Jed Distler (page 108), Sviatoslav Richter Complete recordings Decca, Philips & DG recordings, CD 18). Is this is not a problem to become a reference recording?
No, it isn't. Before it came out we had the usual screaming by the nutty piano fans and many different, excellent options. When this came out, it provided a point of focus, because even people who aren't necessarily Richter fans felt it was necessary--even if it wasn't going to be their first choice.
I always watch the video despite being a piano nut. 😂