My thoughts too. The episode is childish, but so is Doctor Who. It's a decent episode I think. I expected it to be this silly because disney now owns it, and the Christmas special was... unique
@@geekygalaxy4307 you know disney can only suggest things, right? they don't actually have any control over the show, they only bought the streaming rights
One thing about this episode that really annoys me is that we don't have any reason to believe that the bogeyman is sentient or misunderstood. It was created to be a monster that terrifies children by a broken machine and it doesnt do anything to show its got any other goal or is even capable of having another goal. Instead we are meant to just accept that it is when the characters say it is(despite having no reason to assume this) because... that's the kind of story we expect from Who? Honestly, the whole thing just vexed me because it feels completely unearned and accounted for by the rest of the story. Also, the near death of the bogeyman feels like a reference to the human-alien hybrid from one of the alien movies, and paired up with the "its one of the babies" thing(The human Alien hybrid seeing Ripley as its mother), the whole ending feels like RTD decided to tack on his response to the death of the hybrid, rather than being related to the rest of the story.
@@michaelbocash9173 except doctor who isn't usually a children's book, and even for a children's book, "As brave little Sir Bill prepared to throw the bag of dragonsbane powder at the dragon that had been burning down the village to defeat it, he stopped and remembered that the evil dragon, son of Satan himself, is also a child and decided not to. And the dragon stopped trying to burn down the village and became a dog. The end." Isn't exactly up to snuff. Also, in most children's books, the "evil monster or villain" does get defeated, or some form of comeuppance(to make this episode more storybook accurate, the bogeyman should have swallowed one of the babies, and then have the doctor cut the baby out, like in little red riding hood). Regardless of our opinions on the fact that those are the stories we tell children, you cant deny that those or the kind of stories we do tell them.
If they kept the episode the same and just removed the "Talking babies" angle (since The Doctor literally understands baby language already) I think the episode would've been way better. The babies develop intelligence, but just don't speak english. The Doctor translates what they're saying and can still have conversations with them like the "Not born wrong" speech. The fact that Ruby can't understand them could've added tension to situations where the Doctor isn't present and Ruby has to take charge.
So I had 2 main criticisms. I get there’s a reduced episode count and that means the development and plot has to be rushed along but Russell rushing Fifteen and Ruby’s friendship with the early Tardis Key and 6 month time skip kind of skips them gaining each other’s trust and getting to know each other. They’re just instant besties. The other is that Russell has leant too far into the silliness aspect of the show that Ncuti (after 4 episodes) hasn’t had an “I am The Doctor” moment yet? Like it hasn’t let Ncuti flex his acting muscles the same way Matt or David did?
Even with the reduced episode count, there was no need to dump so much character development and information into one episode. Couldn't Ruby have waited an episode or 2 to get a key (we know she didn't need it for the plot of The Devil's Chord). 2 hearts... Is that essential information? Gallifrey's gone? (That's very personal, not essential and barely gets a reaction). Also since space stations actually do have small engines (to make minor corrections to the orbit) then the whole fart thing could have been avoided by pumping the waste into the engines (overcoming a lack of fuel, rather than a lack of engines).
I’m gonna parry these takes with Moffat era (I actually said this lol) When series were split in two, with all its flaws, each part didn’t felt rushed. When Doctor give a key to a victorian Clara it also doesn’t. So you can actually have the same pace in less time. Unless you wanna put all possible exposition at once :/
I dunno. I feel like from the Christmas episode, they just got each other. Not every friendship needs months to become best friends. Sometimes you just meet someone, you instantly connect, instantly understand each other and you become best friends instantly
I rewatched Rose. That has silly, that has info dumps, that has perky assistant…but it was all done so much better. The Doctor is mysterious, Rose is confused and slightly scared. The info dumps are lighter. Not sure what RTD is going for currently but we need more grounding to allow for silly and musicals. I’m in the This is a Toymaker affected Universe so am hoping once the fantasy is dispelled we can get back to science fiction and fun with an edge.
especially when we already did fantasy stories with Matt Smith and Moffat, yet in his usual egotistical way, RTD is pretending Doctor Who didn't exist between Season 4 and Season 11.
Completely different scenarios. This had to catch up new fans with all the lore much quicker while not getting boring for old fans. If the Doctor had spent 20 minutes telling us everything we already know then it would have been so much worse. Better to spend 30 seconds giving a recap and then move on
@@jameskilgour387 I feel like that's sort of a self constructed issue, they sort of needed to choose to either bore old fans by giving a bit more background or leave new fans a bit confused for the first little while, they can't really do both
Found it kind of wild it was essentially just Chinese/Japanese characters, thought it would be an altogether unrecognisable script like from the Satan 2 parter from Ten's era
Yeah, considering how English from just 1000 years ago is very unintelligible to modern English speakers. The 19,000 year difference with very familiar characters seems less reasonable.
@@golden_gloo I mean, the Latin alphabet was developed around 2,700 years ago and in that time only a few letters have changed from that to modern English writing. I thought it was pretty reasonable especially since none of the characters were actual Chinese characters (hanzi). Not to mention we know literally nothing about the writing system other than that the characters kinda look like hanzi and the language is influenced by or derived from Cantonese. It could be an alphabet, an abjad, a syllabary or any number of different writing systems which would be very different from hanzi which is a logographic system. Old English being unintelligible to Modern English is irrelevant because we're talking about a writing system. The writing system of Old English and the writing system of Modern English are almost the same with again the exception of a few letters being different. The long S, Eth, Thorn, Wynn, and Ash are all the letters in Old English we stopped using in Modern English, and W and J are the letters we added.
@@golden_gloo Hell the Long S was in use until the 19th century hence why you still see it in say the American declaration of independence (Sorry you had to gain the attention of a Linguistics autist lol)
Here’s the thing: the bogeyman is a cool concept with an amazing design. A literal machine is very cool, harkening back to the girl in the fireplace. I’d go so far as to say that the only thing not good about space babies was the space babies
Agree. I do wonder if the early reception internally to this ep is why they doubled up. I would feel quite nervous even as a fan if Space Babies was the episode lingering in my mind for a week. For a lot of the new / returning audience I think it would have scuppered any momentum for the rest of the series.
Kinda like New Earth being overshadowed by The Christmas Invasion so it doesn't even get to have the prestige of being the first episode of a new Doctor
With allegories towards abortion and immigration I think I’m done with the show. It’s been touched by quotas by black rock. There’s plenty of old spinoff novels I can spend time with until this is cancelled
Ok -ish episode but very brave choice for a season opener. I get why they released this together with the (way better, but still brave) second episode.
Except it was weirder in a different way. Like with Ruby saying stuff like "you never hide" as if they didn't just have their first proper adventure last episode where he very much ran and hid. And then it was just way too big of a threat for a second episode yet it set stuff up like it was the first episode. Frankly they should have just made Maestro the first episode with some added moments and changes to serve as the opener, and then made it a two parter. Episode 3 being space babies could have made it at least excusable.
@@Comicbroe405the 6 month skip is just one missable line of dialogue however, its not actually something you can feel or notice while watching as from our perspective they only just met (i know christmas was ages ago but space babies picked up immediately)
@@DrPickle205 I know there was a 6 month time skip, but that skip and that change in their relationship doesn’t feel earned, because it goes from “they’ve just met and are getting to know each other” to “they’ve been friends and going on adventures for ages” in one episode and that one episode came out simultaneously.
I’ve seen a theory online that the butterfly, the timeline change, and the snow, are all caused by Ruby, as she brings things that she thinks about into reality - which makes sense with the fact that butterflies wouldn’t exist at this point in time. Obviously it’s not confirmed, but for the moment, headcanon accepted.
Was it bad? No! It was awful! If this episode is some viewers first experience of watching Doctor Who then I wouldn't blame them if they never watched another episode again. You can't polish a turd.
@@Sparx632 We all can disagree as to whether or not it was a decent or awful episode, but I think most can agree that Space Babies is not a particularly good introduction to Doctor Who.
Oh God, why did they do that?? 😡🤬😤Church on Ruby Road: do a shot everytime The Doctor says ‘Merry Christmas’. Is it f’ing offensive to say Babies as opposed to Space Babies? Wtf
Space Babies was not it for me. Everything just felt a little off. I do like Ncuti, his personality is coming through and Golda's performance was great, but really showed up the poor quality of the rest of the episode. The concept would probably have worked better with teenage 'kids' a bit like peter-pan. The CGI mouths were weird. Not to mention the immediate dramatic scoring of speeches (the music was lovely but it fells like we havent earnt this gravitas yet?) Pet peeve is yet another companion that is a central mystery - clara impossible girl, amy crack in the wall, donna-doctor, bad wolf rose (i do really love donna and like rose, i just think I'm a little tired of it now). Also also. A TARDIS key already??? We've had basically no time with Ruby yet, and it feels rushed. I noticed that phonecall straight off, reminder of Rose and Martha. Again, something that could have wither been skipped or integrated differently? But maybe I'm just cynical 😂
It felt like they were going for an any %speedrun which also sucks because part of it felt like RTD didn't trust us as viewers or new viewers. We did not need to get everything explained in the first episode and told to us in the first few minutes. This is supposed to be a new "era" but right off the bat it felt like I was being told I needed a PhD in Doctor Who history just to get started and I am a long term fan. Can't imagine what it was like for completely new viewers.
the speeches feel forced. The first one is like "ok, here is what you need to know" and the second one "ok, here is another piece of information about me and the tardis". Like it's supposed to be emotional but it just feels like you dumped that on my lap, it's not earned at all!
@@vullord666i watched it w two friends who've never seen it and both aren't into nerdy stuff or even sci-fi and they understood it all perfectly after this and the special
I like Rose and Donna because they fulfilled their own destinies. Rose as Bad Wolf only happened because she made it happen, and it wasn’t a huge part of er character arc, it was more so a season mystery that ended up being caused by her. Same for Donna. She ended up becoming the Doctor Donna, but it wasn’t some big mystery the Doctor had to unravel about Donna as a person, it was just Dalek Caan messing up the timeline to fuck with Davros.
Nah this is still miles better than Chibnall. At the very least 15 and Ruby have personalities, character arcs, and an actual dynamic. The same just can't be said about 13 and "the fam."
This episode was, uhh… not great, lol, but I appreciated all the character work Russell did to make 15 and Ruby characters you’d A) actually believe would want to travel together and B) have enough depth to make me wanna tune back in to learn more about them. It’s not a high bar to cross, but after the Chibnal era’s cardboard companions and the perpetually distant relationship between the Doctor and her companions, it was nice to see some warmth and humanity.
I think the worst part is how obvious the Disney influence is now. Scenes feel way too fast-paced, there aren’t really any lingering emotional scenes, and overall the tone is just WAY too childish. Old doctor who had goofy looking villains but the character interactions were super nuanced and felt so real. This is just feels like a Tiktok attention deficit version of Doctor who.
It's really bad just on the logistics side. I don't know why Disney was allowed to F this up so much. According to Disney episode 1 is special 4, but specials 1, 2, 3, AND 4 are all still separate entries (I was literally recommended special four after watching the new episodes... despite that also being listed as episode 1). One huge problem with Maestro is just how heavy that episode is with references. You basically HAVE to have watched special 3 giggle (and even then it feels like there were hidden episodes I missed), except again Disney can't just put those specials together with the show itself.
It's weird seeing the difference between failure due to incompetence with good intentions with chibs and a very clearly preplanned decision to dumb it down here
@@robopistachio2369 Honestly? Twice Upon a Time would have been the perfect end for Doctor Who. The Doctor finally accepts his time is up, and lets himself be taken on that battlefield, surrounded by everyone he's ever loved.
@@epiccarrot88 11, 12, and 13 seasons were awful, and honestly, based on these few episodes, don't think this one is gonna be much better (though I hope I am wrong). So it's like that episode with Capaldi was really the last one
You know, as bad as the fart propulsion scene was, it at least didn't come out of nowhere; several times, it was stated that machines were malfunctioning and there was an intense pressure buildup. Aside from the gross-out part of it being stink gas, the fact that the established pressure build-up was caused by a system malfunction and was released in a big burst to propel the station *does* make sense.
Well, okay, but how will that station keep going in the direction they want it to? Or stop when it arrives instead of crashing straight into the planet? It's got no engines, no navigation, no brakes, it's not actually a ship.
They needed about 15-30 minutes more run time to really flesh our the tonal difference between the above and below deck and build up the Boogeyman as being misunderstood. The game of this episode should have been jumping back and forth between the Doctor and Ruby being essentially in a Alien movie and Star Trek Babies. There is a really good episode hidden in here somewhere.
You say the episode doesn't really have a political commentary, but I feel like many are missing the part where it was explained that there was this big push to have more and more kids be made, but as soon as there was, they were abandoned and forgotten about... Which is absolutely something our own governments do constantly... Its more politically charged than you realise.
it was abortion commentary... ruby: "you mean they force the babies to be born but they don't help look after them?" jocelyn: "yeah it's a weird planet" ruby: "not as weird as you think". we also got small boat/illegal immigration commentary with the lines about having to physically turn up on another nation's land to apply for refugee status... which in itself is already untrue. very politically charged episode under the hood.
There was something even darker about the subplot of keeping them as babies. Which I didn't really understand, I don't think they explained it but if they did it wasn't explained very well. Like it's something a human adult physically has to "activate" for them was how I understoof it. Meaning they both are forced to be born and live, but because they were abandoned couldn't go. Reminds me so strongly of how those that lean towards anti-abortion also tend to be anti-welfare for those babies once they're born or growing up.
The first scene kinda left me thinking that Ncuti isn’t the Dr, saying that the name the dr is just a title his people gave him and that he’s the last time lord and that he was adopted. He was the first time lord!
2:41 Hey Harbo, those sauropods wouldn't be Brachiosaurus, according to The Doctor the sequence takes place 140 million years ago, placing it in the Early Cretaceous around 10 million years younger than Brachiosaurus... BUT the Brachiosauridae family were still widespread in the Early Cretaceous, so these still make sense as a related Brachiosaurid titanosauriform. They're actually a fairly impressive reconstruction, especially compared with some prior Doctor Who dinos!
it's like we made a wish on a monkey's paw and get our wish but with a horrible twist. we all just wanted doctor who to be fun again... so now we get talking babies, snot monsters, and farting spacestations.
i just hope the show gets cancelled. then it can be revived later on down the road as something worthwhile instead of it just digging itself deeper into mediocrity until it gets to the point where nobody will even want it to get brought back
1:53 Agree to disagree. I think it would have worked a lot better on every level if they had explained all those things gradually throughout the series instead of lazy crammed into the beginning
I think there was a missed opportunity for a joke. The Doctor speaks baby. Ruby could have responded to the babies speaking and the Doctor could have said "you speak baby too?" Or something along those lines. Also, to get around the horrible CGI mouths, they should have made the prams talk a-la Stephen Hawking's chair. Keep thw kiddie voices, but have then come from the prams. No one would bat an eye or ask "why don't they just make the babies speak?"
People are always begging for less conventional companions who aren't just young people from present Earth, would have been interesting if we had Rubathon Blue for the rest of the series. It's sort of similar to The Girl Who Waited and how the Doctor denies future Amy the chance to exist, alternate futures are treated with respect so why not alternate presents? It's almost taken as a joke that the Doctor stops this being from existing.
Problem with that is it's the companion who is kinda a surrogate for the viewer in the DW world - they have to be relatable so a young adult human is the optimal choice as the vast majority of viewers have been a young adult human at some point (or still are, or will be soon) I agree they should definitely play with alien/alternative companions a bit more but I don't think you can anchor the main companion role around one, they would have to be a secondary companion or a temporary thing for a few episodes tops...
@@stevencrisp753I think people can still relate to companions who are alien or from the past and future, they just have to look and act vaguely human. I never had trouble relating to lots of the classic companions who weren’t from modern day Earth.
So how will the space station stop when it gets to the asylum planet? How did they even aim it in the right direction? It would be amazing luck for it to be in exactly in the right place for the aim to be right. Fart joke over sci-fi.
The Slitheen were literally entirely fart jokes..immature jokes are not new to DW (Also I'm assuming since it's so far in the future, once in range they could radio the planet and then safely land)
@@SketchyDoodles yeah that's exactly the problem! Like, surely RTD must have once read a review in the last 20 years which criticized the fact that he had a truly terrifying Concept, in the form of aliens taking human form by skinning them and then making it into a joke about fat people farting! Or did he just look at one of those reviews and said: "What is it was a giant ass in space that farted!"
The tone of the episode was definitely off. Episodes in the past that were orientated towards children but had some aspects that adults could enjoy or dark moments which were a dramatic tonal change. But this episode was just stupid jokes over the stories quality. It seams like RTD doesn't know what he's doing anymore, especially with the language being used. It's almost as if RTD is trying to use 'hip new lingo' and it's just missing the mark. Oh, and I don't like this focus on everything being connected to Ruby's birth, it would be better if that aspect was more subtle. But on a worse note, can we get some sympathy for Martha, that's another companion who got the phone upgrade thing as well as keys to the taridis on her first (second technically) episode! It still makes me sad....
I'm afraid i fell out of love with doctor who. I'm usually very optimistic, but i had a hard time getting through the episode. very jarring imo. dialogue felt off. just meh
I'm pretty sure that it's a really intentional stylistic choice to make the acting and script incredibly ADHD, hyperactive and really non-naturalistic. Why he's done it though I can't fathom
At the end of the show my mouth was open but there was nothing I could figure out as far as saying something about it. I am still stunned and confused as to what that actually was. Ditto for episode 2.
How to fairly easily take this episode from a 3/10 to an 8/10 imo: 1) Remove the dang Bogey-man, use it elsewhere if we must. 2) Spend more time on the Jurassic Period with the butterfly effect. 3) Keep the babies at a mental age of 1, while technically being around 6/7. This creates an additional moral problem to explore along with the eugenics for the back half of the ep. 4) Have The Doctor confront the governmental body whom abandoned the babies, this gives him an Atraxi moment out the gate for muh precious callbacks for the dumb (sarcasm) Americans who apparently can't go back and watch old new Who to figure out who this 60 year old character is if they actually enjoy their first episode.
5:24 I disagree with this; the Doctor's purpose and mission is that he _chooses_ to protect people and give them another day. Ever since he left Gallifrey, he's _always_ had something to drive him, be it to avoid the Hybrid, find out why good prevails in the universe, or to simply comfort a crying child. It's completely wrong to say that the Doctor has no mission; sure, he stumbles into situations, but he always does it with the intent of helping.
Im glad Im not the only one who thought what I did about this episode. To me: this episode was written by a three year old. Talking babies is novel enough, but the plot was just nonsense after nonsense. And going to the beginning of time just for a cheap gag. The bad writing just goes on and on...
@@saskruffriders8234 Yeah, I wasn't thinking. Ik what part you mean, I just thought you meant the whole episode. My bad, sorry. Agree with your points tbh. The Devil's Chord was much better imho.
Omgg what you said just reminded me of some little episodes (like 5 minutes) in the Matt Smith era. Children wrote them and they made it, I think it was as a gag for Red Nose Day, not quite sure, but space babies it's like children wrote a concept and they ran with it.
One thing I'm really glad this episode did was warm me up to Ruby Sunday. I think she'll be great and I'm super intrigued as to what's inside the mystery box for this series.
This episode, along with most of the newer episodes, don't really have a plot so much as a premise, a resolution, and some time spent in the middle either wasting time or discussing emotional stuff or expositing. None of these episodes make you feel like the characters are slowly reaching a goal, or uncovering clues about a mystery, or the stakes slowly increasing, they just feel like a premise and an ending.
Whoever thought the babies should actually talk with CGI needs to have a long, hard look at themselves. I thought it was so cringy I could barely watch tbh
Exactly how I felt, if this had been a 13 & fam led story I probably wouldn’t have enjoyed it half as much, but Ncuti & Millie’s chemistry absolutely redeemed it for me
The third act needed a rewrite. Especially the scene where the nanny (I forget her name) started crying because she somehow realized the bogeyman was somehow one of her children. All of that needed polish to be remotely convincing or to feel at all earned. It could have been poignant. Instead it was just convenient.
That horrific moment when you realise the Doctor left the station with no way to stop and propelling directly towards a planet entirely composed of refugees. Since it wasn't shown how it stopped this could definitely happen
I think that you were a bit too uncritical of the 15th Doctor and Ruby in this episode. I liked them quite a bit in the Christmas special, even if the episode itself was kind of average, but in this episode I was really expecting to see a bit more from both of them, more than just generic enthusiasm and being a very good person all of the time, more disorientation or fear at being marooned like this in such a weird situation from Ruby, and maybe a bit more of the anger or the darker side of the 15th Doctor, and for both of them to, you know, sometimes just slow down a little and actually take time to reason things out carefully and think, rather than just ADHD running through everything at 500 miles an hour. They're still nowhere near chib level, but I think that if they don't start showing some more depth and character changes instead of just the same obvious surface traits, it's going to be a problem
The Villian was trying to intimidate the doctor. Some Villains will tell Characters to defeat them as intimidation, It can pressure them and make them think that the villian wants them to do it as a plan or trick
Idk, for some reason a vocal minority of this fanbase makes me wanna feel bad for not liking the characterisation of the doctor but for now I don’t get a timelord with thousands of years to his name. Like yes it’s explained the baggage of his past has been lifted because 14 retired on earth for a while but so what? That just gives the character a clean slate to be so juvenile and scared, like calling the crew space babies? Running from an enemy and not even trying to reason with them head on. I don’t why I should feel like I’m being wrong for feeling mixed over this incarnation .
They gave the space station a butt. They gave the space station a butt. So yeah, Space Babies was incredibly bad. The premise is painful, and I spent virtually the whole run dreading the prospect of another episode like this. A "C" is incredibly generous, imo.
Honestly, a spaceship of actual six year olds desperately trying to keep the ship running to make sure the next batch is successfully hatched would have been a lot of fun. This was bizarre and kind of unpleasant.
As a Doctor Who fan since 1980.... this sh1t is retowded. And the new TARDIS interior looks like a demented bad guy's operating/torture chamber... cold, sterile, scary, unwelcoming. Like you're just waiting for the floor to open up and reveal a huge tank filled with flesh-eating alien aquatic creatures with tentacles.
Bro what... The new console room is great especially with the colorful lighting & the set actually looks so much bigger on the inside than before. This is subjective but truly a weird critique.
Actually, the 5th Doctor visited the Age of the Dinosaurs in that towering masterpiece, "Time-Flight".... although we didn't get to see any dinosaurs. I guess they must have been hibernating, or something.
I loved the idea of a Baby Geniuses/Alien mashup, but damn it could’ve been way better than it is. Have the babies speak Stephen Hawking style or something. I get that Doctor Who is a show that constantly practices and preaches tolerance of all life-forms, so I get why they can’t poke fun at talking babies too much, but I wish they gave the babies more to work with.
Is it just me or is it surprising that the fifteenth doctor is very musical and baby focused so far? Like are we leading up to a lullaby centered Big Bad?
I can see the vfx team tried really hard with the talking babies but while its a clever bit of gimmickry, it makes them more uncanny valley than cute unfortunately - especially when one of them says "I love you Ruby" but looks terrified in the eyes! I didn't mind the episode for the most part, even the info dump at the start I can excuse for the newbies. The snot monster and farting space station was where I started eye rolling. I also wasn't sure, is there a significance to the Doctor constantly saying Push the Button? Am I supposed to start playing a Sugababes track? Or maybe Chemical Brothers? Or indeed constantly correcting himself to say Space Babies not just Babies? If it was a drinking game I'd be well and truly sozzled! I'd agree, a middling episode, didn't love, didn't hate it (although things above did lower in my estimation...)
I think my expression may have mirrored baby Erik's during whole chunks of the episode... Could really nobody get the poor baby to not-frown, not even when he told Ruby he loved her?
Good video. I thought it was good. I say a C as well. It's great seeing Ruby first adventure into the future and her chemistry with 15 is great! I understand about the babies and the humor, hope you got some sleep after both episodes.
A bit early for a TARDIS key for Ruby, no? I would prefer if it happened after 3/4 episodes, maybe after an adventure where they are stuck with no foreseeable way out and the companion proves themselves.
@Idk-ys7rt he seemed giddy he just had an excited adventure and he enjoyed his time with her he wants her to stay. Boom is more like "yeah I made the right decision" kinda vibe yknow I hope
I was pretty disappointed by the reuse of the 'mother trying to protect child goes against the doctor's wishes' trope, felt like a rehash of episodes like the S3 finale, Turn Left, The Hungry Earth etc
@@mujiescomedy279 idk feels like a very RTD trope to blame mothers for the episode's problems when they go against the Doctor's wishes, I know not every episode like that was written by RTD but look at any mother in series 1-4 and it happens
That speech about being free and keeping going for moments like this I found really grating because it felt like it took the idea of being last of the time lords and laughed about it. To me 15 felt flippant and shallow, which was such a shame.
The episode was a pile of shit - it even admits it literally. It kind of felt like RTD made it deliberately bad (like Moffat did with Hell Bent), because I'm not convinced it was an accident.
Even _if_ Hell Bent was bad, Moffat didn't do it on purpose. Do you even know what the point of that episode was? The entire episode was designed to show the audience that the Doctor _isn't_ a perfect man and demonstrate to him the reason why he sticks to his rules. It also serves as character growth for the Doctor by forcing him to confront his fear of loss and overcome it, as well as punishing him for trying to take the universe into his own hands.
@@Jackson-ub1uv Well Moffat said in an interview he knew exactly what he was doing and was testing how much the fans can or cannot take continuity wise. He admitted he was trolling the fanbase with it.
@@gordonw.8831 There wasn't really anything contradictory in the episode. The only possible contender is the idea that the Doctor left Gallifrey out of fear, but even then it's easy to reconcile; it's clear that he didn't leave for a _single_ reason, but a combination of that fear _and_ his curiosity and boredom.
Speaking from the Disney+ side of things, I seriously don't know what the hell is going on. On Disney+ the Church on Ruby Road (Special 4) is posted as Episode One of season one of Doctor Who (???). It's also still up as special four and heck Disney recommend I watch it after finishing both episodes. Specials 1 to 3 aren't under the show at all. HBO Max at least had the decency to only post specials once under the show in the season they were part of. I feel like part of the problem has to be on streaming. Space Babies was just NOT an opener completely regardless of the quality of the episode. The first few minutes were all exposition and explaining the basic rules and was completely disjointed. It did not feel natural and felt a little insulting in how heavy handed it was. I somewhat appreciate RTD for trying to work in the timeless child, but please for the love of God just ignore it. There's a reason why Chibnall himself barely mentioned it and Gallifrey's yet again destruction. We don't talk about the TV Movie making the Doctor half human as Canon. If the show is getting another soft reboot, RTD should've just used the toymaker to bring things to clean state closer to series 10 and 11. Gallifrey shouldn't be destroyed again and the Timeless Child ignored. But fine roll with it, as least be subtle. I considered Space Babies both as a long term watcher and tried thinking about it from the perspective of a new watcher... and it just doesn't really work like at all. The situation isn't high pressure enough for us to start to get a feel for Ruby or The Doctor anymore than we did in the Christmas special. It also doesn't hugely set things up for the season. And I hate so much how Ruby is yet again another world endingly important companion. Then I watched Maestro and it became more clear what the problem is. I really really wanted to just like the episode because it had all the bones of a great one. But it felt out of production order. The Doctor and Ruby talked as if it wasn't the second episode and they had adventures off screen... which just doesn't work for the second episode. It's like suddenly their relationship developed in the seconds it took me to click "play next". The other problem is a random second episode having what felt like a two parter or special level plot and then yet again calling back to content that wasn't listed under Disney+'s version of the show. I think Maestro if written a little differently could have been the opener we needed since it set up the overarching plot better and put Ruby and the Doctor in a tense situation that showed who they are rather than us being told that over and over. But it doesn't even work as a second episode because of weird miniscule things some not even to do with the writing but literally just how Disney+ put it and the specials up. I was so excited for the new season of Who and I love Ncuti, but it really feels like RTD is kinda lost and Disney is somehow making things worse (in like the dumbest way possible). I think RTD is trying to write what he thinks is "modern" but he's not doing great at it... like at all. This was the biggest problem with the specials too. There were weird moments when he tried to force in progressive language or themes he didn't know how to use. A lot of it also just felt predictable and something out of the David Tenant 2000s era, and like I just don't know what to even do here. I was hoping this would be improved by the time Ncuti properly started but... yikes.
I almost hope Doctor Who is cancelled so rather than you all complaining about Doctor Who, you’ll all be complaining about the lack of Doctor Who instead. Such a weird fanbase.
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Series 1 (2005): Farting Aliens
Season 1 (2024): Farting Space Station
That’s what increase budget means!
lol
My thoughts too. The episode is childish, but so is Doctor Who. It's a decent episode I think. I expected it to be this silly because disney now owns it, and the Christmas special was... unique
@@geekygalaxy4307 you know disney can only suggest things, right? they don't actually have any control over the show, they only bought the streaming rights
@geekygalaxy4307 Disney just owns the distribution, the writing and direction of the show and everything is still the same doctor who companies
One thing about this episode that really annoys me is that we don't have any reason to believe that the bogeyman is sentient or misunderstood. It was created to be a monster that terrifies children by a broken machine and it doesnt do anything to show its got any other goal or is even capable of having another goal.
Instead we are meant to just accept that it is when the characters say it is(despite having no reason to assume this) because... that's the kind of story we expect from Who? Honestly, the whole thing just vexed me because it feels completely unearned and accounted for by the rest of the story.
Also, the near death of the bogeyman feels like a reference to the human-alien hybrid from one of the alien movies, and paired up with the "its one of the babies" thing(The human Alien hybrid seeing Ripley as its mother), the whole ending feels like RTD decided to tack on his response to the death of the hybrid, rather than being related to the rest of the story.
I thought of the queen Alien from Aliens getting sucked out of the airlock right away. Get the comparison to the hybrid as well though.
feels like a ending stolen from chris chibnill, hoomans bad, monster gudd. I really wouldn't of mined if it was evil & got ejected Among Us Style
It was a children's book. It doesn't have to have a clean ending It needed a happy ending.
@@michaelbocash9173 except doctor who isn't usually a children's book, and even for a children's book, "As brave little Sir Bill prepared to throw the bag of dragonsbane powder at the dragon that had been burning down the village to defeat it, he stopped and remembered that the evil dragon, son of Satan himself, is also a child and decided not to. And the dragon stopped trying to burn down the village and became a dog. The end." Isn't exactly up to snuff. Also, in most children's books, the "evil monster or villain" does get defeated, or some form of comeuppance(to make this episode more storybook accurate, the bogeyman should have swallowed one of the babies, and then have the doctor cut the baby out, like in little red riding hood). Regardless of our opinions on the fact that those are the stories we tell children, you cant deny that those or the kind of stories we do tell them.
@@thelonecustodes4344 lol I wouldn’t been fine if a baby died but I’m morbid & hate babies
If they kept the episode the same and just removed the "Talking babies" angle (since The Doctor literally understands baby language already) I think the episode would've been way better. The babies develop intelligence, but just don't speak english. The Doctor translates what they're saying and can still have conversations with them like the "Not born wrong" speech. The fact that Ruby can't understand them could've added tension to situations where the Doctor isn't present and Ruby has to take charge.
Finally a good suggestion!
One change I saw someone say was how about if they had headbands that were psychically linked to their thoughts and what they want to say
Those are all very good ideas. Would have actually made this episode interesting.
A baby in real life might be adorable (some of the time), but talking babies in a show or movie is another matter.
So I had 2 main criticisms. I get there’s a reduced episode count and that means the development and plot has to be rushed along but Russell rushing Fifteen and Ruby’s friendship with the early Tardis Key and 6 month time skip kind of skips them gaining each other’s trust and getting to know each other. They’re just instant besties.
The other is that Russell has leant too far into the silliness aspect of the show that Ncuti (after 4 episodes) hasn’t had an “I am The Doctor” moment yet? Like it hasn’t let Ncuti flex his acting muscles the same way Matt or David did?
I was wondering why i struggling to buy into their friendship a little and you've hit the nail on the head for me. It felt rushed 👍
Even with the reduced episode count, there was no need to dump so much character development and information into one episode. Couldn't Ruby have waited an episode or 2 to get a key (we know she didn't need it for the plot of The Devil's Chord). 2 hearts... Is that essential information? Gallifrey's gone? (That's very personal, not essential and barely gets a reaction).
Also since space stations actually do have small engines (to make minor corrections to the orbit) then the whole fart thing could have been avoided by pumping the waste into the engines (overcoming a lack of fuel, rather than a lack of engines).
I’m gonna parry these takes with Moffat era (I actually said this lol)
When series were split in two, with all its flaws, each part didn’t felt rushed. When Doctor give a key to a victorian Clara it also doesn’t.
So you can actually have the same pace in less time. Unless you wanna put all possible exposition at once :/
It seems like next episode is going to be a lot more serious, so hopefully we get a proper Doctor moment then.
I dunno. I feel like from the Christmas episode, they just got each other. Not every friendship needs months to become best friends. Sometimes you just meet someone, you instantly connect, instantly understand each other and you become best friends instantly
I rewatched Rose. That has silly, that has info dumps, that has perky assistant…but it was all done so much better. The Doctor is mysterious, Rose is confused and slightly scared. The info dumps are lighter. Not sure what RTD is going for currently but we need more grounding to allow for silly and musicals. I’m in the This is a Toymaker affected Universe so am hoping once the fantasy is dispelled we can get back to science fiction and fun with an edge.
You said it well: science fiction with fun and edge. With this episode, it feels just way too childish (no pun intended)
especially when we already did fantasy stories with Matt Smith and Moffat, yet in his usual egotistical way, RTD is pretending Doctor Who didn't exist between Season 4 and Season 11.
Completely different scenarios. This had to catch up new fans with all the lore much quicker while not getting boring for old fans. If the Doctor had spent 20 minutes telling us everything we already know then it would have been so much worse. Better to spend 30 seconds giving a recap and then move on
@@jameskilgour387 I feel like that's sort of a self constructed issue, they sort of needed to choose to either bore old fans by giving a bit more background or leave new fans a bit confused for the first little while, they can't really do both
Cool visual with the Doctor being able to wave away the Tardis' translation to see what the language actually looks like.
Found it kind of wild it was essentially just Chinese/Japanese characters, thought it would be an altogether unrecognisable script like from the Satan 2 parter from Ten's era
Yeah, considering how English from just 1000 years ago is very unintelligible to modern English speakers. The 19,000 year difference with very familiar characters seems less reasonable.
@golden_gloo that's what I was thinking! Like, the year has 5 numbers not 4, so wild we can still read it...
@@golden_gloo I mean, the Latin alphabet was developed around 2,700 years ago and in that time only a few letters have changed from that to modern English writing. I thought it was pretty reasonable especially since none of the characters were actual Chinese characters (hanzi). Not to mention we know literally nothing about the writing system other than that the characters kinda look like hanzi and the language is influenced by or derived from Cantonese. It could be an alphabet, an abjad, a syllabary or any number of different writing systems which would be very different from hanzi which is a logographic system. Old English being unintelligible to Modern English is irrelevant because we're talking about a writing system. The writing system of Old English and the writing system of Modern English are almost the same with again the exception of a few letters being different. The long S, Eth, Thorn, Wynn, and Ash are all the letters in Old English we stopped using in Modern English, and W and J are the letters we added.
@@golden_gloo Hell the Long S was in use until the 19th century hence why you still see it in say the American declaration of independence (Sorry you had to gain the attention of a Linguistics autist lol)
Here’s the thing: the bogeyman is a cool concept with an amazing design. A literal machine is very cool, harkening back to the girl in the fireplace. I’d go so far as to say that the only thing not good about space babies was the space babies
This was so true of the episode 😂
Probably will be one of the most forgotten episodes of the revival.
Agree. I do wonder if the early reception internally to this ep is why they doubled up. I would feel quite nervous even as a fan if Space Babies was the episode lingering in my mind for a week. For a lot of the new / returning audience I think it would have scuppered any momentum for the rest of the series.
Kinda like New Earth being overshadowed by The Christmas Invasion so it doesn't even get to have the prestige of being the first episode of a new Doctor
@@Synthpopper Sure, though I actually like New Earth.
spoken too soon i reckon
With allegories towards abortion and immigration I think I’m done with the show. It’s been touched by quotas by black rock. There’s plenty of old spinoff novels I can spend time with until this is cancelled
Ok -ish episode but very brave choice for a season opener. I get why they released this together with the (way better, but still brave) second episode.
Except it was weirder in a different way. Like with Ruby saying stuff like "you never hide" as if they didn't just have their first proper adventure last episode where he very much ran and hid. And then it was just way too big of a threat for a second episode yet it set stuff up like it was the first episode. Frankly they should have just made Maestro the first episode with some added moments and changes to serve as the opener, and then made it a two parter. Episode 3 being space babies could have made it at least excusable.
@@vullord666 Her comment makes sense with the 6 month time skip.
@@Comicbroe405the 6 month skip is just one missable line of dialogue however, its not actually something you can feel or notice while watching as from our perspective they only just met (i know christmas was ages ago but space babies picked up immediately)
@@DrPickle205 I know there was a 6 month time skip, but that skip and that change in their relationship doesn’t feel earned, because it goes from “they’ve just met and are getting to know each other” to “they’ve been friends and going on adventures for ages” in one episode and that one episode came out simultaneously.
You forgot Martha in "The Shakespeare Code" re: butterflies. Why does everyone do my girl this way.
For real!
"Tell you what, don't... step on any butterflies..."
Dad's finally come back with the milk and it's skimmed
Fun fact: butterflies hadn't actually evolved yet when they time traveled back to dinosaur time
I’ve seen a theory online that the butterfly, the timeline change, and the snow, are all caused by Ruby, as she brings things that she thinks about into reality - which makes sense with the fact that butterflies wouldn’t exist at this point in time.
Obviously it’s not confirmed, but for the moment, headcanon accepted.
People don’t kno that . They weren’t even there 🥱
They could have aged up the babies to young kids and it probably would have worked much better and been less weird.
At least they could make them cool “robo” voices via some tech instead of moving their mouths… like that.
Was it bad? No! It was awful! If this episode is some viewers first experience of watching Doctor Who then I wouldn't blame them if they never watched another episode again. You can't polish a turd.
I watched this with my dad, the episode ended and he said ... Well that was sh1t.
@@HT-lr1rs Watched it with my dad.
His words
"Well, that didn't do it for me."
It wasn’t that bad
@@Sparx632 We all can disagree as to whether or not it was a decent or awful episode, but I think most can agree that Space Babies is not a particularly good introduction to Doctor Who.
Yep, it was dog shit. So was episode 2
Also take a shot every time The Doctor says "space babies".
Oh God, why did they do that?? 😡🤬😤Church on Ruby Road: do a shot everytime The Doctor says ‘Merry Christmas’.
Is it f’ing offensive to say Babies as opposed to Space Babies? Wtf
No thanks I’ll die of alcohol poisoning
Space babies was shite, the CGI mouth movements were creepy and it wasn't subtle in the storyline. With that said I like Ncuti Gatwa's energy.
Space Babies was not it for me. Everything just felt a little off. I do like Ncuti, his personality is coming through and Golda's performance was great, but really showed up the poor quality of the rest of the episode. The concept would probably have worked better with teenage 'kids' a bit like peter-pan. The CGI mouths were weird. Not to mention the immediate dramatic scoring of speeches (the music was lovely but it fells like we havent earnt this gravitas yet?)
Pet peeve is yet another companion that is a central mystery - clara impossible girl, amy crack in the wall, donna-doctor, bad wolf rose (i do really love donna and like rose, i just think I'm a little tired of it now). Also also. A TARDIS key already??? We've had basically no time with Ruby yet, and it feels rushed. I noticed that phonecall straight off, reminder of Rose and Martha. Again, something that could have wither been skipped or integrated differently? But maybe I'm just cynical 😂
It felt like they were going for an any %speedrun which also sucks because part of it felt like RTD didn't trust us as viewers or new viewers. We did not need to get everything explained in the first episode and told to us in the first few minutes. This is supposed to be a new "era" but right off the bat it felt like I was being told I needed a PhD in Doctor Who history just to get started and I am a long term fan. Can't imagine what it was like for completely new viewers.
the speeches feel forced. The first one is like "ok, here is what you need to know" and the second one "ok, here is another piece of information about me and the tardis". Like it's supposed to be emotional but it just feels like you dumped that on my lap, it's not earned at all!
@@vullord666i watched it w two friends who've never seen it and both aren't into nerdy stuff or even sci-fi and they understood it all perfectly after this and the special
I like Rose and Donna because they fulfilled their own destinies. Rose as Bad Wolf only happened because she made it happen, and it wasn’t a huge part of er character arc, it was more so a season mystery that ended up being caused by her. Same for Donna. She ended up becoming the Doctor Donna, but it wasn’t some big mystery the Doctor had to unravel about Donna as a person, it was just Dalek Caan messing up the timeline to fuck with Davros.
I didn't know this was possible but Russell has outchibbed Chibs
That's why he's the goat.
And at the worst possible episode.
😂😂😂😂😂
Nah this is still miles better than Chibnall. At the very least 15 and Ruby have personalities, character arcs, and an actual dynamic. The same just can't be said about 13 and "the fam."
@@jacksonsweat712 I didn't say worse, I said chibbier
This episode was, uhh… not great, lol, but I appreciated all the character work Russell did to make 15 and Ruby characters you’d A) actually believe would want to travel together and B) have enough depth to make me wanna tune back in to learn more about them. It’s not a high bar to cross, but after the Chibnal era’s cardboard companions and the perpetually distant relationship between the Doctor and her companions, it was nice to see some warmth and humanity.
Ruby feels more like a character now than a plot point.
I think the worst part is how obvious the Disney influence is now. Scenes feel way too fast-paced, there aren’t really any lingering emotional scenes, and overall the tone is just WAY too childish. Old doctor who had goofy looking villains but the character interactions were super nuanced and felt so real. This is just feels like a Tiktok attention deficit version of Doctor who.
It's really bad just on the logistics side. I don't know why Disney was allowed to F this up so much. According to Disney episode 1 is special 4, but specials 1, 2, 3, AND 4 are all still separate entries (I was literally recommended special four after watching the new episodes... despite that also being listed as episode 1). One huge problem with Maestro is just how heavy that episode is with references. You basically HAVE to have watched special 3 giggle (and even then it feels like there were hidden episodes I missed), except again Disney can't just put those specials together with the show itself.
It's weird seeing the difference between failure due to incompetence with good intentions with chibs and a very clearly preplanned decision to dumb it down here
Bold of you to assume that was a Disney choice, especially considering that as far as we know they only have distribution rights, and nothing else.
It's been like this since chinballs era
I agree with pacing being a problem, however I'd say it's been a problem for a while now since around S6.
It just gets worse and worse. Still waiting for a reboot that takes us back to Capaldi's final moments. How many seconds in eternity...
Omg me too 😂 it was all a dream!!
Capaldi really woke up and chose to take a franchise with him
@@robopistachio2369 Honestly? Twice Upon a Time would have been the perfect end for Doctor Who. The Doctor finally accepts his time is up, and lets himself be taken on that battlefield, surrounded by everyone he's ever loved.
@@epiccarrot88 11, 12, and 13 seasons were awful, and honestly, based on these few episodes, don't think this one is gonna be much better (though I hope I am wrong). So it's like that episode with Capaldi was really the last one
@@anakarine5577 Thoughts on Boom?
my favourite part was when the baby gronk rizzled the gyatts
then they skibidi'd all the way to space ohio
Shoot me
Please stop, both of you
@@HarboWholmes nah not Gen alpha taking over!!!!! 😭
Im going to lose it
You know, as bad as the fart propulsion scene was, it at least didn't come out of nowhere; several times, it was stated that machines were malfunctioning and there was an intense pressure buildup. Aside from the gross-out part of it being stink gas, the fact that the established pressure build-up was caused by a system malfunction and was released in a big burst to propel the station *does* make sense.
Well, okay, but how will that station keep going in the direction they want it to? Or stop when it arrives instead of crashing straight into the planet? It's got no engines, no navigation, no brakes, it's not actually a ship.
They needed about 15-30 minutes more run time to really flesh our the tonal difference between the above and below deck and build up the Boogeyman as being misunderstood. The game of this episode should have been jumping back and forth between the Doctor and Ruby being essentially in a Alien movie and Star Trek Babies. There is a really good episode hidden in here somewhere.
You say the episode doesn't really have a political commentary, but I feel like many are missing the part where it was explained that there was this big push to have more and more kids be made, but as soon as there was, they were abandoned and forgotten about... Which is absolutely something our own governments do constantly... Its more politically charged than you realise.
Theres politics in this episode and tbh i thought they were quite obvious in a good way so to say there isnt like Harbo says shows his blind spot
it was abortion commentary...
ruby: "you mean they force the babies to be born but they don't help look after them?"
jocelyn: "yeah it's a weird planet"
ruby: "not as weird as you think".
we also got small boat/illegal immigration commentary with the lines about having to physically turn up on another nation's land to apply for refugee status... which in itself is already untrue.
very politically charged episode under the hood.
There was something even darker about the subplot of keeping them as babies. Which I didn't really understand, I don't think they explained it but if they did it wasn't explained very well. Like it's something a human adult physically has to "activate" for them was how I understoof it. Meaning they both are forced to be born and live, but because they were abandoned couldn't go. Reminds me so strongly of how those that lean towards anti-abortion also tend to be anti-welfare for those babies once they're born or growing up.
The abortion commentary was interesting but it was literally just one scene and then kind of forgotten about after.
And lets not forget the refugee line about needing to turn up on someone else's shores.
I just realized the Boss Baby comparison. That's definitely smtg
I realized while watching, very early on.
The first scene kinda left me thinking that Ncuti isn’t the Dr, saying that the name the dr is just a title his people gave him and that he’s the last time lord and that he was adopted. He was the first time lord!
She wasn't. She wasn't even from Gallifrey. Apparently.
2:41 Hey Harbo, those sauropods wouldn't be Brachiosaurus, according to The Doctor the sequence takes place 140 million years ago, placing it in the Early Cretaceous around 10 million years younger than Brachiosaurus... BUT the Brachiosauridae family were still widespread in the Early Cretaceous, so these still make sense as a related Brachiosaurid titanosauriform. They're actually a fairly impressive reconstruction, especially compared with some prior Doctor Who dinos!
I get the feeling we're being punished for hating Chibnal's era in some twisted way
How one more year with chibbs and the show would of been cancelled
it's like we made a wish on a monkey's paw and get our wish but with a horrible twist. we all just wanted doctor who to be fun again... so now we get talking babies, snot monsters, and farting spacestations.
@@oxenford539 so you're saying... there's always a twist at the end?
i just hope the show gets cancelled. then it can be revived later on down the road as something worthwhile instead of it just digging itself deeper into mediocrity until it gets to the point where nobody will even want it to get brought back
If chibnal wrote this episode it would of been deemed our dog shit but because RTD wrote it people think its camp and fun
FOR REAL
No, Chibnall was just crap, Alfie
@@NicoleM_radiantbabythis is why moffat was really the best and was overhated
Nah. Chibnall’s episodes were boring, this is not.
@@Sparx632 I was bored, though? Starting scrolling on my phone.
1:53 Agree to disagree. I think it would have worked a lot better on every level if they had explained all those things gradually throughout the series instead of lazy crammed into the beginning
No time to do it in the heavily condensed season. It does work better that way but it won’t fit
I think there was a missed opportunity for a joke. The Doctor speaks baby. Ruby could have responded to the babies speaking and the Doctor could have said "you speak baby too?" Or something along those lines.
Also, to get around the horrible CGI mouths, they should have made the prams talk a-la Stephen Hawking's chair. Keep thw kiddie voices, but have then come from the prams. No one would bat an eye or ask "why don't they just make the babies speak?"
Space Babies lost me when a 1000 year old Time Lord told tiny babies, "nobody grows up wrong".
People are always begging for less conventional companions who aren't just young people from present Earth, would have been interesting if we had Rubathon Blue for the rest of the series.
It's sort of similar to The Girl Who Waited and how the Doctor denies future Amy the chance to exist, alternate futures are treated with respect so why not alternate presents? It's almost taken as a joke that the Doctor stops this being from existing.
Problem with that is it's the companion who is kinda a surrogate for the viewer in the DW world - they have to be relatable so a young adult human is the optimal choice as the vast majority of viewers have been a young adult human at some point (or still are, or will be soon)
I agree they should definitely play with alien/alternative companions a bit more but I don't think you can anchor the main companion role around one, they would have to be a secondary companion or a temporary thing for a few episodes tops...
@@stevencrisp753agree. I think that's something that series 10 did really well with Bill and Nardole personally.
@@stevencrisp753I think people can still relate to companions who are alien or from the past and future, they just have to look and act vaguely human.
I never had trouble relating to lots of the classic companions who weren’t from modern day Earth.
So how will the space station stop when it gets to the asylum planet? How did they even aim it in the right direction? It would be amazing luck for it to be in exactly in the right place for the aim to be right. Fart joke over sci-fi.
20 years later and RTD putting fart jokes over sci-fi!
The Slitheen were literally entirely fart jokes..immature jokes are not new to DW
(Also I'm assuming since it's so far in the future, once in range they could radio the planet and then safely land)
@SketchyDoodles but how would they safely land? How would they slow down? They'd need another 'release' in the opposite direction.
@@SketchyDoodles yeah that's exactly the problem!
Like, surely RTD must have once read a review in the last 20 years which criticized the fact that he had a truly terrifying Concept, in the form of aliens taking human form by skinning them and then making it into a joke about fat people farting! Or did he just look at one of those reviews and said: "What is it was a giant ass in space that farted!"
@@daver9819maybe the planet will have some kind of tractor beam it can use to slow the station and land it, it is the far future after all.
The tone of the episode was definitely off. Episodes in the past that were orientated towards children but had some aspects that adults could enjoy or dark moments which were a dramatic tonal change. But this episode was just stupid jokes over the stories quality. It seams like RTD doesn't know what he's doing anymore, especially with the language being used. It's almost as if RTD is trying to use 'hip new lingo' and it's just missing the mark. Oh, and I don't like this focus on everything being connected to Ruby's birth, it would be better if that aspect was more subtle.
But on a worse note, can we get some sympathy for Martha, that's another companion who got the phone upgrade thing as well as keys to the taridis on her first (second technically) episode! It still makes me sad....
Famously english words: "Pacifico Del Rio" lmao
yeah i was like ummm what? that's spanish, mate.
I'm afraid i fell out of love with doctor who. I'm usually very optimistic, but i had a hard time getting through the episode. very jarring imo. dialogue felt off. just meh
You didn't like the 2nd one? It was a vast improvement.
@@Comicbroe405 didn't watch it yet! I'll definitely give it a chance
I'm pretty sure that it's a really intentional stylistic choice to make the acting and script incredibly ADHD, hyperactive and really non-naturalistic. Why he's done it though I can't fathom
@@natoriousyes3773Definitely do. It's actually good compared to this.
I'll just skip to the next episode.
At the end of the show my mouth was open but there was nothing I could figure out as far as saying something about it. I am still stunned and confused as to what that actually was. Ditto for episode 2.
How to fairly easily take this episode from a 3/10 to an 8/10 imo:
1) Remove the dang Bogey-man, use it elsewhere if we must.
2) Spend more time on the Jurassic Period with the butterfly effect.
3) Keep the babies at a mental age of 1, while technically being around 6/7. This creates an additional moral problem to explore along with the eugenics for the back half of the ep.
4) Have The Doctor confront the governmental body whom abandoned the babies, this gives him an Atraxi moment out the gate for muh precious callbacks for the dumb (sarcasm) Americans who apparently can't go back and watch old new Who to figure out who this 60 year old character is if they actually enjoy their first episode.
5:24 I disagree with this; the Doctor's purpose and mission is that he _chooses_ to protect people and give them another day. Ever since he left Gallifrey, he's _always_ had something to drive him, be it to avoid the Hybrid, find out why good prevails in the universe, or to simply comfort a crying child. It's completely wrong to say that the Doctor has no mission; sure, he stumbles into situations, but he always does it with the intent of helping.
Oh, yes, please, Big Finish, give us alien Ruby. Why was she snuffed out so soon to leave me stuck with talking babies and snot?
Yeah, it was shite
Tbh considering how the dumb premise was, I was surprised they pulled off smtg coherent. I definitely liked the beginning tho.
Im glad Im not the only one who thought what I did about this episode. To me: this episode was written by a three year old. Talking babies is novel enough, but the plot was just nonsense after nonsense. And going to the beginning of time just for a cheap gag. The bad writing just goes on and on...
Beginning of time? They went to the future 😝😂
@@Idk-ys7rt Watch the first 5 minutes of the episode.
@@saskruffriders8234 Yeah, I wasn't thinking. Ik what part you mean, I just thought you meant the whole episode. My bad, sorry. Agree with your points tbh. The Devil's Chord was much better imho.
Omgg what you said just reminded me of some little episodes (like 5 minutes) in the Matt Smith era. Children wrote them and they made it, I think it was as a gag for Red Nose Day, not quite sure, but space babies it's like children wrote a concept and they ran with it.
So close to an alien companion. Damn.
Since Nessa.
Great point, but did Nessa feel very alien..? @@marionbaggins
@@StevenErnest Not feel, but not from Earth, Yes.
Is RTD actually _trying_ to outsuck "Time and the Rani" for all-time worst DW stories? What the hell is his deal?
The 15th Doctor feels like The Doctor being excited to be able to live life and see its vibrant colors for the first time in centuries
One thing I'm really glad this episode did was warm me up to Ruby Sunday. I think she'll be great and I'm super intrigued as to what's inside the mystery box for this series.
Thankful Disney realised the church on ruby road as episode 1 as this new era and space babies as episode 2
This episode, along with most of the newer episodes, don't really have a plot so much as a premise, a resolution, and some time spent in the middle either wasting time or discussing emotional stuff or expositing.
None of these episodes make you feel like the characters are slowly reaching a goal, or uncovering clues about a mystery, or the stakes slowly increasing, they just feel like a premise and an ending.
Whoever thought the babies should actually talk with CGI needs to have a long, hard look at themselves. I thought it was so cringy I could barely watch tbh
The snow better not mean we are getting the great intelligence as the big bad
I really like the pairing of 15 and Ruby. They feel like 10 and Donna to me, in that they're best friends travelling the universe and having fun.
I thought what if it went wrong and the adults became the babies but maybe that was too dark for Russell.
the sanity level killed me lmao
Wheres nathan gibson, is he safe, is he ok?
Edit:i just searched it up
So anyway...
I don't know, I did a google for the name and it's a bit crazy.
Holy shit.
It can't be the same one though? The Nathan Gibson in the news was murdered in 2020...
@@Kranitoko true
@@Kranitokoyeah sure he is the same one?
A definitely agree with the uncanny valley aspect of it, especially the cgi of the baby’s lips moving
glad you went to a C... already feels like an optimistic assessment
Its definitely one of the weaker openers in terms of plot and theme, but in terms of character dynamic between the Doctor and Companion? It was great!
Their interactions are cringe. Witty back and forth marvel dialogue to the point nobody even knows or believes what they’re saying
@@joeswift1064 Completely disagree. But sure
Alright man, what ever you say
@@joeswift1064i can agree with you on that. There is just something that didn´t feel natural to me, in the way they talked to each other.
Exactly how I felt, if this had been a 13 & fam led story I probably wouldn’t have enjoyed it half as much, but Ncuti & Millie’s chemistry absolutely redeemed it for me
I think the old woman from the special is his granddaughter, after watching episode 2 I can tell already
"And I'll see you next time... oh wait... there's another one already out."
😂 good luck Harbo
The third act needed a rewrite. Especially the scene where the nanny (I forget her name) started crying because she somehow realized the bogeyman was somehow one of her children. All of that needed polish to be remotely convincing or to feel at all earned. It could have been poignant. Instead it was just convenient.
That horrific moment when you realise the Doctor left the station with no way to stop and propelling directly towards a planet entirely composed of refugees. Since it wasn't shown how it stopped this could definitely happen
I think that you were a bit too uncritical of the 15th Doctor and Ruby in this episode. I liked them quite a bit in the Christmas special, even if the episode itself was kind of average, but in this episode I was really expecting to see a bit more from both of them, more than just generic enthusiasm and being a very good person all of the time, more disorientation or fear at being marooned like this in such a weird situation from Ruby, and maybe a bit more of the anger or the darker side of the 15th Doctor, and for both of them to, you know, sometimes just slow down a little and actually take time to reason things out carefully and think, rather than just ADHD running through everything at 500 miles an hour. They're still nowhere near chib level, but I think that if they don't start showing some more depth and character changes instead of just the same obvious surface traits, it's going to be a problem
When I saw the dinosaur scene, my brain just instantly went to playing the Jurassic Park theme.
It was awful. Russell is getting worse
What did u think about ep 2?
What didn’t you like about it?
It felt very messy. That's the best way I can describe it.
There was so many plot holes. I mean, the villain literally told the doctor who to defeat her. That's such bad writing
The Villian was trying to intimidate the doctor. Some Villains will tell Characters to defeat them as intimidation, It can pressure them and make them think that the villian wants them to do it as a plan or trick
Idk, for some reason a vocal minority of this fanbase makes me wanna feel bad for not liking the characterisation of the doctor but for now I don’t get a timelord with thousands of years to his name. Like yes it’s explained the baggage of his past has been lifted because 14 retired on earth for a while but so what? That just gives the character a clean slate to be so juvenile and scared, like calling the crew space babies? Running from an enemy and not even trying to reason with them head on. I don’t why I should feel like I’m being wrong for feeling mixed over this incarnation .
Russ's Kill The Moon
That was Love and Monsters.
Worse than that. Don’t think I’ll ever watch this one again.
They gave the space station a butt.
They gave the space station a butt.
So yeah, Space Babies was incredibly bad. The premise is painful, and I spent virtually the whole run dreading the prospect of another episode like this. A "C" is incredibly generous, imo.
Honestly, a spaceship of actual six year olds desperately trying to keep the ship running to make sure the next batch is successfully hatched would have been a lot of fun. This was bizarre and kind of unpleasant.
As a Doctor Who fan since 1980.... this sh1t is retowded.
And the new TARDIS interior looks like a demented bad guy's operating/torture chamber... cold, sterile, scary, unwelcoming. Like you're just waiting for the floor to open up and reveal a huge tank filled with flesh-eating alien aquatic creatures with tentacles.
Definitely need a 30m run from the door to the console.
Bro what... The new console room is great especially with the colorful lighting & the set actually looks so much bigger on the inside than before. This is subjective but truly a weird critique.
Talking babies are horrifying; scarier than the Bogeyman.
Actually, the 5th Doctor visited the Age of the Dinosaurs in that towering masterpiece, "Time-Flight".... although we didn't get to see any dinosaurs. I guess they must have been hibernating, or something.
The Butterfly Effect should've been the premise of this episode, not some stupid Space Babies trash
I didn't think I could be left more stunned than I was by Space Babies, but then came Devil Chord. Shocked. Frozen. What in the world did I watch?
2:15 you know what? I totally agree, I mean I guess there isn't really much story potential for the dinosaur age, but nonetheless
I loved the idea of a Baby Geniuses/Alien mashup, but damn it could’ve been way better than it is. Have the babies speak Stephen Hawking style or something. I get that Doctor Who is a show that constantly practices and preaches tolerance of all life-forms, so I get why they can’t poke fun at talking babies too much, but I wish they gave the babies more to work with.
Is it just me or is it surprising that the fifteenth doctor is very musical and baby focused so far? Like are we leading up to a lullaby centered Big Bad?
I can see the vfx team tried really hard with the talking babies but while its a clever bit of gimmickry, it makes them more uncanny valley than cute unfortunately - especially when one of them says "I love you Ruby" but looks terrified in the eyes!
I didn't mind the episode for the most part, even the info dump at the start I can excuse for the newbies. The snot monster and farting space station was where I started eye rolling.
I also wasn't sure, is there a significance to the Doctor constantly saying Push the Button? Am I supposed to start playing a Sugababes track? Or maybe Chemical Brothers?
Or indeed constantly correcting himself to say Space Babies not just Babies? If it was a drinking game I'd be well and truly sozzled!
I'd agree, a middling episode, didn't love, didn't hate it (although things above did lower in my estimation...)
20:38 harbo are you aware of the concept of an homage?
I think my expression may have mirrored baby Erik's during whole chunks of the episode...
Could really nobody get the poor baby to not-frown, not even when he told Ruby he loved her?
Good video. I thought it was good. I say a C as well. It's great seeing Ruby first adventure into the future and her chemistry with 15 is great! I understand about the babies and the humor, hope you got some sleep after both episodes.
A bit early for a TARDIS key for Ruby, no? I would prefer if it happened after 3/4 episodes, maybe after an adventure where they are stuck with no foreseeable way out and the companion proves themselves.
I think he gives it early because he's happier and more trusting yknow
@@jotarodio4750 Maybe but why not after Boom (a tense episode)?
@Idk-ys7rt he seemed giddy he just had an excited adventure and he enjoyed his time with her he wants her to stay. Boom is more like "yeah I made the right decision" kinda vibe yknow I hope
I was pretty disappointed by the reuse of the 'mother trying to protect child goes against the doctor's wishes' trope, felt like a rehash of episodes like the S3 finale, Turn Left, The Hungry Earth etc
Eh?
@@mujiescomedy279 idk feels like a very RTD trope to blame mothers for the episode's problems when they go against the Doctor's wishes, I know not every episode like that was written by RTD but look at any mother in series 1-4 and it happens
@@calligrapherfun1616 which mother went against the doctor’s wishes in space babies? Nan-e opened the airlock before the doctor told her not to
I think they should have given us a whole Rubathon Blue episode.
The episode was kinda like the episode '42 ' , an interesting concept with some dumb ideas that is held up by good prefromances by the main characters
God RTD again with farting heavy stories. For as good a writer as he is he has also written some real stinkers (pun intended)
I'm sorry but you couldn't be more wrong about the smoothness of the exposition dump. Deffo dumbed down and a huge load for our new american overlords
"Dinosaurs as they really were"
-Jim Henson's "Dinosaurs"
😂👏🦕🦖
i thought it was a fun episode tbh, esp the little call backs like the doctors seeing the world through rubys eyes, the doctor zapping her phone etc
I'm glad I'm not the only one who thought of Fing bossbaby with this
I loved space babies . I couldn’t stop laughing. I also was very stoned .
That speech about being free and keeping going for moments like this I found really grating because it felt like it took the idea of being last of the time lords and laughed about it. To me 15 felt flippant and shallow, which was such a shame.
Dinosaurs On A Spaceship... If not living in its natural epoch, where did the triceratops come from?
Although, Solomon's knowledge of Nefertiti, does make this a questionable time scale
After just watching that episode I have no idea what the hell I watched.
The episode was a pile of shit - it even admits it literally.
It kind of felt like RTD made it deliberately bad (like Moffat did with Hell Bent), because I'm not convinced it was an accident.
Even _if_ Hell Bent was bad, Moffat didn't do it on purpose. Do you even know what the point of that episode was? The entire episode was designed to show the audience that the Doctor _isn't_ a perfect man and demonstrate to him the reason why he sticks to his rules. It also serves as character growth for the Doctor by forcing him to confront his fear of loss and overcome it, as well as punishing him for trying to take the universe into his own hands.
@@Jackson-ub1uv Well Moffat said in an interview he knew exactly what he was doing and was testing how much the fans can or cannot take continuity wise. He admitted he was trolling the fanbase with it.
@@gordonw.8831 There wasn't really anything contradictory in the episode. The only possible contender is the idea that the Doctor left Gallifrey out of fear, but even then it's easy to reconcile; it's clear that he didn't leave for a _single_ reason, but a combination of that fear _and_ his curiosity and boredom.
One could argue that someone would hardly spend time, resources and thousands upon thousands just to "troll the fanbase"
Speaking from the Disney+ side of things, I seriously don't know what the hell is going on. On Disney+ the Church on Ruby Road (Special 4) is posted as Episode One of season one of Doctor Who (???). It's also still up as special four and heck Disney recommend I watch it after finishing both episodes. Specials 1 to 3 aren't under the show at all. HBO Max at least had the decency to only post specials once under the show in the season they were part of.
I feel like part of the problem has to be on streaming. Space Babies was just NOT an opener completely regardless of the quality of the episode. The first few minutes were all exposition and explaining the basic rules and was completely disjointed. It did not feel natural and felt a little insulting in how heavy handed it was. I somewhat appreciate RTD for trying to work in the timeless child, but please for the love of God just ignore it. There's a reason why Chibnall himself barely mentioned it and Gallifrey's yet again destruction. We don't talk about the TV Movie making the Doctor half human as Canon. If the show is getting another soft reboot, RTD should've just used the toymaker to bring things to clean state closer to series 10 and 11. Gallifrey shouldn't be destroyed again and the Timeless Child ignored. But fine roll with it, as least be subtle.
I considered Space Babies both as a long term watcher and tried thinking about it from the perspective of a new watcher... and it just doesn't really work like at all. The situation isn't high pressure enough for us to start to get a feel for Ruby or The Doctor anymore than we did in the Christmas special. It also doesn't hugely set things up for the season. And I hate so much how Ruby is yet again another world endingly important companion. Then I watched Maestro and it became more clear what the problem is. I really really wanted to just like the episode because it had all the bones of a great one. But it felt out of production order. The Doctor and Ruby talked as if it wasn't the second episode and they had adventures off screen... which just doesn't work for the second episode. It's like suddenly their relationship developed in the seconds it took me to click "play next". The other problem is a random second episode having what felt like a two parter or special level plot and then yet again calling back to content that wasn't listed under Disney+'s version of the show. I think Maestro if written a little differently could have been the opener we needed since it set up the overarching plot better and put Ruby and the Doctor in a tense situation that showed who they are rather than us being told that over and over. But it doesn't even work as a second episode because of weird miniscule things some not even to do with the writing but literally just how Disney+ put it and the specials up.
I was so excited for the new season of Who and I love Ncuti, but it really feels like RTD is kinda lost and Disney is somehow making things worse (in like the dumbest way possible). I think RTD is trying to write what he thinks is "modern" but he's not doing great at it... like at all. This was the biggest problem with the specials too. There were weird moments when he tried to force in progressive language or themes he didn't know how to use. A lot of it also just felt predictable and something out of the David Tenant 2000s era, and like I just don't know what to even do here. I was hoping this would be improved by the time Ncuti properly started but... yikes.
A return to "Tennant's 2000 era" would be bliss compared to this drivel.
I almost hope Doctor Who is cancelled so rather than you all complaining about Doctor Who, you’ll all be complaining about the lack of Doctor Who instead.
Such a weird fanbase.