One Poison Counter = GG? | Proliferate Control | 13 Rare Standard Budget Magic: the Gathering (MTG)
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 5 ก.พ. 2023
- Can a poison deck built around spells and directly poison damage rather than toxic creatures compete in Phyrexia: All Will Be One Standard on just a 13 rare (or $60 for paper players) budget? Let's find out!
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You are 100% right about the "infect trap" comment; a lot of the toxic decks I see utilize poison but do not need it because they usually win by reducing the opponent's life to 0. They end up playing like lesser versions of decks that already exist, while your deck takes full advantage of poison as a wincon.
Huge disagree.
@@Crusina ...How? Why would someone want to win by doing two methods at once? Instead of just focusing on one?
Venerated rotpriest and other proliferate decks will probably be the only effective ones for poisoning people out tbh
@@gaminggeckos4388 I think the question would be: How much are you investing into each strategy? If you have both a card like Prologue to Phyresis AND Furnace Punisher (which is cards that work in only one strategy), then sure, you are splitting. If you just play one plan and stack damage or counters incidentally, outside your actual strategy, you are not losing anything.
@@gaminggeckos4388 This kind of mentality is why netdecking can be both good and bad. On the bad end, it really just lowers the general skill of people who become incapable of thinking for themselves/outside of the box.
The fact that you can not grasp why says a lot about the state of people who play this game.
So you know Seth: the "HumanToken" player that got you had their name in _Mythic Orange_ ; As Arena tells us on load screens ALL the time, that opponent was a WotC Employee!
I had one game against a MYTHIC ORANGE once, so I was sure to say hi. No reply back. Heartbreaking
You can also tell because their name didn’t end with VIP
@@tkalle1299 ooh, nice catch! Missed that detail!
It's hilarious that Justin Parnell, who hates Infect, got double poisoned out on Commander Clash and then poisoned out a second time by Seth on Early Access Day.
What episode of commander clash had Justin parnell?
@@taylormilleman7337 th-cam.com/video/5wILefTrtks/w-d-xo.html
Praetor bowl
Thank youuuu!
poison is ok in standard, but in commander it is absurdly broken.. maybe if they upped the lethal poison to 20 for commander.. also, would be nice if there were more than three cards that remove poison counters would make the mechanic better in my opinion.
@@ibstrummin2 Hard disagree, it'd extremely far from broken in commander, there's a reason you never see it.
This deck is real, some board clearing/sweeper spells are definitely needed. Standard is going to get real weird
Agreed. If you want to stick to Dimir, then Gix's Command is probably the most attractive option if you keep the creatures in. If you drop the creatures, then Drag to the Bottom is really the only maindeckable option, which requires running the triomes, and taplands suck - so a creatureless version is probably just not viable in Dimir until they print another good black sweeper.
Does drag to the bottom require triomes though. While gruul aggro might go big with counters the selesnya toxic aggro decks and the simic rotpriest decks don’t actually have a lot of toughness on board. -3/-3 might be more than enough to kill their board
@@Icameron259 I actually got this deck and added Gix's command, it does work very well.
@@Icameron259 dropping the creatures and running drag is definitely the way to go; all the creatures do in this list is turn on opposing removal, and the curve is low enough that 7 tap lands won't hurt too much (especially if running cut down)
@@jaded718 with no creatures you don't have enough things to put the first poison
Seth, probably better known as "Saffron-is-this-deck-actually-busted-Olive" imo
Seems like a super fun deck!
I looked up at 4:50 and got freaked out cause I thought Seth's face was melting
Been watching a lot of horror short movies on TH-cam lately. Weird video ticks and distortions do not help my calm.
Okay so that wasn't just me
I first noticed it when he showed Vraska in the deck tech and thought it was a cool little Phyrexian corrupted thing the editor did
Huh, I'll have to ask the editor. I'm not sure if they did it on purpose of if it was a bug.
This deck is neat. It's like slow storm.
Ha, slow storm is a good way to think of it actually.
The fact that this is basically just a refined version of a ONE UB draft deck is pretty cool. If it can stand up to any of the popular decks in Standard, that would say a lot about the power level of this set.
This deck looks like my jam, love proliferate with walkers and it’s a deceptive way to win a game I think. Happy to see some gameplay with this deck.
Little neat trick. See what the next chapter of an opponent's saga does and maybe proliferate on it. The 1 cost red saga could miss the +1/+1 counter bonus if done right, and some others are really screwed over.
Situational, but I totally agree!
Hit that on a Kikijiki. Forced it to flip & killed the creature-side with sorcery speed removal
Dunno if anyone has mentioned it, but the names with orange letter are Arena employees :]
Love the content!
This is one of the decks I'm most excited to try out!
This is what I was waiting for! Now I might get into standard
This is exactly the deck I wanna make, so excited
When spoielrs cameby, this was the deck i wanted to build for standard. Hyped
I've made this deck but the pauper ver, gonna be testing it seems solid
I have been thinking about brewing a deck just like this for my channel! Great looking list :)
Go for it. It's super fun!
"Isnt the opponent is the best pointed, poisner, Poison counter!" That hiccup when Phoenix Chick hit the board had me dying XD
Ohh, our LGS does two headed giant for midnight prerelease and my partner and I built UB proliferate control and GW toxic. We had games go by when we never even saw a rare. This set's commons and uncommons are so good.
Just a day or two ago I talked with a friend about the possibility of a deck, that just puts on a single poison counter and then just proliferates from there. Glad I had a good instinct for something like that working.
This looks like a cool deck to shift my old UB Combat Research tempo list into.
In reference to the mention of needing a sweeper for the deck, you could use the triomes to power Drown in Sorrow for a sweeper and to keep the deck UB without touching white.
I think this is the first time I've seen an Orange nickname (WotC Staff) I see the message pop-up about it from time to time but never actually played against them
Seems like a really fun deck, plus its the first time that the non budget version of a deck is cheaper for me to craft than the budget version so im def going to try it out!
We know the real reason that Seth made this deck: He wanted to make a Venser deck since Venser is his favorite Planeswalker
It's not the return of Venser I was hoping for, but it will do for now :)
@@MTGGoldfish I feel you, he's my favorite too. I still jam Venser, the Sojourner in decks for the feels.
Venser plus stonehorn dignitary. My combo deck I built all those years ago. I hated Karn because Venser gave his spark to him(this was before I knew what Tron was).
@@MTGGoldfish I don’t think he’s gonna be returning from that, homie 😂
You could have made that game end in a draw when you played Varska for life because her entire effect would resolve before game state check if you are dead at zero life and it would also check and see that your opponent had 10 poison at the same time.
You lose the moment your life is 0. You pay the life apon cast and imediately lose
Life is checked on receiving priority so since you receive priority after the Varaska ability resolves first, you would loose before the poison counters were checked. At least thats my understanding.
@@thatsgerman1 State-based effects are checked for every player whenever someone begins to receive priority. Its not just everything attached to the active player. It would be a draw.
@@redblackdg i believe theyre talking about vraska's 0 loyalty ability which makes you lose 1 life and proliferate, not the phyrexian mana. unlike the phyrexian mana, the life loss of vraska's 0 is not a cost, so it happens during the resolution of the ability, along with the proliferate
@@colinbrown74 Yep you are right, I misread the rules
I saw the deck explanation and thought about a Sultai version including Evolution Sage from War of the Spark for the landfall proliferate triggers.
The mindsplice thing might be good here gives you a lot of extra mana to combo proliferate and card draw
I have been using this deck with a few tweaks and carries me to diamond. Changed the field of ruins with mirrex and add 2 copies of gix's command for swarms. Also running 2 edict and 2 snares (for pesky enchantments / artifacts). Cut 2 of reject imperfections and only running 20 lands. With decent card draws land won't be a problem.
Such a powefull deck thanks for new idea sir :)
I was super exited to brew something like this, i love it
i scrounged up the deck during the prerelease, only 1 wraska tho, and no vensers, but im exited to play it
When I saw all the blue and black direct poison and proliferate cantrips get spoiled this is immediately what I wanted to build and refine.
Hearing “Drown in Ichor” on double speed was monkaS
Lol fr
14:31
@@jackatheBOSS also during the deck tech
Scheming Aspirant in a dedicated poison control deck isn't there for "proliferate drain two" he is there for being an x/3 blocker on turn two, and having a passive "proliferate gain two life." Part of the same reason Sheoldred is in decks with Vrasksa, just to offset the suicide black aspects of the deck to help keep you alive.
Sideboard vs aggressive creature decks.
I loved the march of burgeoning life double take. Then his other video plays that same deck hilarious
Seth's nasaly voice always makes me happy. Always a good day when there's a goldfish video.
Looking forward to turn 1 rotpriest scoop, lol
*Thanks for the content* !
This deck reminds me of old UB Rogue Mill, it also split it's strategy for winning, although I remember milling out people far more often than reducing their life to 0
Many rogues got a lot better if there were 8 cards in the GY, so it was not exactly betting on 2 horses
Saga's seem like would be great in this deck with that much proliferate and maybe even small Kaito. Phasing of zalfir is a good borard whipe and founding the third path can recur your draw and removal spels.
Edit: also Life of Umezaua seems nice
I'd like to disagree. I can see where you are coming from, but that isn't where this deck is going. You don't really need Proliferate in Saga decks and adding Sagas to a "proliferate poison counters" will be watering down the whole "proliferate poison counters" plan. See also: SaffronOlive's short comment about people often splitting their strategies into two weaker variants instead of going all in on one strategy. He commented that in the game against that other poison/proliferate deck, where the opponent was also trying to drain him. Instead of playing that drain card, the opponent could have played a card, that helps with the poison strategy. Which SaffronOlive did do and consequently won the game. Because his strategy was more focused.
@@ThorsShadow The deck can use some answers to agro like the board whipe saga and Life of umezaua. It kills 1thoughtness creatures and gains life so it seems lika good fit even if it doesn't contribute to the win con. The saga s aren't a different strategy but help the existing one
The saga does play around the rotpriest which I think will see a lot of play in the upcoming time.
@@alexsandor6135 Yeah, I can see where you're coming from. Thanks for explaining your point. Didn't think about these specific options. Maybe as Sideboard cards against aggro, then?
@@ThorsShadow Yeah maybe just sideboard would be good but a mainboard board whipe is probably needed in this deck
After scanning the set, I knew Poliferating Poison Counter Control Decks, were coming ASAP
Biggest reason I don't run tri color decks much, lack of rare lands.
I actually have an Artisan (common and uncommon only) version of this deck, it's surprisingly competitive.
I’d love to play this deck how I get these cards on arena? Do I just have to open it in packs?
I spent only about 100 bucks on phyrexia all will be one set boosters, got everything I needed for an awesome toxic/proliferate deck with volrath the shapestealer as commander. It does.....alot
A suggestion for improving the proliferating even more? Maybe try throwing a couple of the Thrummingbird in this build. Thrummingbird proliferates either on dealing combat damage or attacking, not sure off the top of my head. If you've already considered this, all apologies, I just thought of that particular card after seeing them at the prerelease I went to & cracking a couple
I think that the issue with Thrumming bird is that it has to deal combat damage for the proliferate trigger. there isn't any value like with Venser or the bat, since one makes tokens and gains life and the other gives poison and is recursive.
Yeah, I totally get it. I just thought it'd be neat to toss a couple in, not a full 4, and maybe not even mainboard for that matter, but with it being an extra body that kinda fits the theme & is easy to cast, I don't know, just saw it working, possibly a maybeboard card perhaps?
Bilious Skulldweller is a really solid choice for a 3rd creature. being able to cast proliferate anticipate and drown in ichor on curve is massive.
Do u think this deck can run blast zone? proliferating counters onto it would be a neat strat to give access to a boardwipe type effect and help deal with go wide decks easier
good idea. I'll run it as a 2-of and see how it does.
I wonder if you almost always have to mulligan until you get a card that gives that first poison counter. It seems like such a struggle without it.
There's so many ways to give your opponent that first counter that it seems unlikely to be that much of a problem. 8 toxic creatures + the card draw seems pretty sufficient.
You guys should sell a shirt that just says "Did we break it?". I'm always waiting for the inevitable "Did we break it?" from Seth every video. Rarely am I ever disappointed.
I had the feeling this deck was good, but seeing it in action makes it look REALLY good
Would Liliana of the Veil be good for a non budget version of the deck? Proliferate seems like it could let you hit her ult very fast, plus you can pitch voidwing hybrid to her +1 and immediately get it back. And she's just an overall good card.
playtested Lilli and no, she actually slows the deck down. 99% of the time she's a 3 mana sorcery speed Sheoldred's Edict that doesn't hit walkers, and the other 1% you proliferate her so you can -2 a second time.
hype!!!!!
Do you think you could try an Against the Odds deck that wins with Myrel Tokens + Falaji Vanguard alpha strikes?
My best advice for anyone picking up this deck is to run zero creatures; they're just a tempo suck since there's not enough of them to overwhelm removal, especially since a there's a lot of exile removal at this point. Just running more removal, sweepers, and card draw to maintain velocity will get the job done nicely
@@Rosiestoned i go with drag and a handful of ub triomes; malicious malfunction also works
Best of three this deck on live!
Yo at 4:55 seth's face morphs so bad he looked like one of the aliens on the movie they live
How would you go about making this Pioneer viable, or would it be dead on arrival because of the meta?
One upgrade could be path of peril in the sideboard because it would help against boros and mono red.
I feel like the same deck/strategy could work with simic or sultai.
Venerated rotpriest is almodt guaranteed to get you the 1st counter. Also isn't there a rat with toxic 1 and deathtouch for a black, wouldn't that also work here?
simic poison abuses interactions with Ivy and auras (also destroys this deck)
Bilious Skulldweller is rather good. being able to cast proliferate anticipate or drown in ichor on turn2 has won me quite a few games.
One of my favorite things about Seth during early access day is he always takes the time to activate different card styles, sleeves, and his basic lands and then always forgets to change the pet and avatar.
Sweet deck as usual.
Is there a viable version of this for pioneer?
The most awaited deck
Literally the only deck in the play queue right now.
I want to see a Pioneer version with Flux Channeler!
What would have happened if you plussed Vraska at 17:00? The life loss and proliferate are on the same effect, would that have been a draw?
yup. Vraska's ability fully resolves, then SBA checks and sees both players are dead.
Rotpriest is so good tho. I love the gu toxic deck it's so fun and dynamic.
prologue to phyresis my beloved
I love the budget series! Awesome video!
Something I haven't seen anyone talk about, at 17:10 -ish, when you're at 1 with a Vraska, opp at 9 poison, if you do your Vraska's 0 to lose a life, draw a card, and proliferate, the game would end in a draw. The game checks for poison kills and damage kills at the same time (SBA). Reminds me of deflecting palm making me have to say a few times that I got it in 4.
The proliferate effect happens later on the stack than the life loss, and since life total is a static check, he would've died before he had the chance to choose which counters to proliferate.
@notyourbusiness5530 I don't think that's true. You put the 0 ability on the stack. Once it resolves, you carry out each of its instructions. Included in those instructions are "lose 1 life" and "proliferate". There's no point in between doing those two things that state-based actions are checked, and losing the game to 0 or less life and losing the game to 10 or more poison counters are both checked at that time. Erego, any effect that gives lethal poison counters and lethal loss of life to two different players will have those players lose the game simultaneously. In a 2 player game, this will result in a draw.
Should Vraskas Fall be in this deck too?
I think it depends on the meta. It's pretty bad against things with Wedding Announcement and other token makers, but if it's killing a non-token creature most of the time I think it's worth it.
I've been playing a grixis poison control.
0 creatures, you use hostile negotiations for sweeper, galvanic iteration for doubling up, vraskas fall for efficient removal. Every card in the deck except for like 5 and the lands cause opponent to gain poison or proliferate
Editor 👍 cutting out down time, and adjusting video to audio to fit and sound good, but choppy, regardless 👍
Was that last game against postie?
Since there are so many Aggro Decks outside, i go with Scheming Aspirent. I win way more matches right now.
I would love to play it, though I would prefer a explorer version.
Hmm, maybe we'll have to give it a try in Explorer once we set is out.
I think it's worth considering adding the 1 mana rat and pestilent syphoner to the deck instead of the 1/3 creature so that you guarantee getting the opponent to the first toxic counter
Interestingly I think in the game where you almost punted with Vraska, I think if you did, it would have been a draw. You wouldn't check life totals/poison until after the entire ability resolved, and both you and the opponent would be dead.
Is that post malone in the last match???
I dig this style of control. It's a much less boring game with an actual kill condition....need inkmoth in standard. Or any combat toxic land
Yeah, we don't play control super often on the channel, but this deck is really fun! Inkmoth would be a huge, huge upgrade.
@@MTGGoldfish Is Mirrex at all playable for flood protection? It's not great for budget because it's another rare land, but 2 of them could give you a way to take advantage of holding up mana on turns where your opponents don't do much.
Oh dear, this deck will probably show up everywhere since it's budget. 😂
2:13 drown a whaaaat
One thing that I’ve noticed from you guys’ ONE standard vids is that not a single one of your opponents have played a Mirran equipment deck, which could mean one of two things: everyone just wants to have fun with poison and proliferate, or Mirran equipment is just reeeeally bad, which kinda makes me sad actually.
To be honest, Equipment has never been really good in standard, even when we had all the good equipment payoffs and equipment, like Nahiri and Akiri, and Maul.
From drafts I've seen, the equipment decks are very viable. Outside that in constructed, it becomes a bit less viable, at least at the moment.
I personally think it's going to be something we see a lot more in the upcoming set, seeing as the icon is a sword and hopefully ends with the progatonists winning (at some cost). :D
been playing around dimir poison deck for weeks and one big downside is counter against enchantments..
I've been most excited about this deck when these control decks with proliferate came out. Remember they pump planewalkers too. I dare say this strategy could work in other formats too. In modern you get Virulent Wound to start the infect soon and it kills annoying 1 drops like Ragavan. Also if it work in standard it could work in Pioneer too.
I love how this is fast enough for Standard, but when Snap tried the exact same thing in Pauper it was just crushingly slow in that format. Kind of weird to think that Commons can be faster KOs than rares and mythics, don't you think? lol 😂
!punt 10:19, could've used Drown to kill the archfiend
Drown in Ichor is a sorcery though, if it was an instant would could have though.
@@MTGGoldfish I guess that was my punt then :)
16:59 ...Would this have actually drawn the game? Like, the entire loyalty ability needs to resolve before state based actions are checked, right?
That's a good question. I think you might be right that it would have been a draw.
The deck is under 5 tix on Mtgo as of 2/21/23. So free loan program and kinda rotation proof for awhile.
Just wanna say thanks for the deck list! Been having a lotta fun in Arena with it 😁
8:04 is it just glitching out for me?
I was hoping that the game vs covertgoblue got posted!
That match was from the stream, it's in the VOD on the replay youtube! th-cam.com/video/Ye_rPdkdo4c/w-d-xo.html
@@MTGGoldfish thanks! Much love to both channels! You are cool
2:11 what did he say there? Lmao
This is literally my CEDH commander deck...
Compared to commander, it's nice seeing "each opponent gets a poison counter" in standard. Because it only gives poison counters, Planeswalkers don't get out of control, charge counters aren't abused, etc. It doesn't eliminate the pain of proliferate but it does mean you have to make a card choice here to either poison or proliferate. If you run Planeswalkers a poison spell will slow you down, if you run poison you could be proliferating nothing.
Budget poison won against my Team of superfriends !
GG to you !
I'm playing with something practically identical right now and I don't know how it is that absolutely nothing works in this deck. I just lost my sixth game in a row.
2:14 That sounded wrong
I'm still amazed this set cranked up the poison counters, and offers NO way to deal with them.
It seems like they want to do away with engine decks, and start pushing the alt win con decks.
I wonder if Seth's great black fight opponent was post Malone?!?
The first opponent missed playing the phoenix chick from the graveyard for lethal. As a red player that hurt…
I didn't see a point where they had 3 creatures to attack with so I think they played the best options they had
I think CGB built the rot priest deck right because his version can win on damage using Stormchaser Drake for card advantage.