My gunsmith buddy showed me a trick when I mounted a scope on my RPR and the scope was touching. He cut some brass shims, I don’t remember how thick for sure maybe 50/1000s, and put them under the scope in the rings and that was enough to create daylight clearance. Worked like a charm.
Don't forget, eye relief changes depending on what power you have the scope on. You're better off mounting your scope in prone on the highest magnification. Hi magnification = shorter eye relief, and low magnification = longer eye relief. In prone, you will normally be on high magnification because you're steadier and your head will be farther forward. So when you shoot off-hand, you typically will be on a lower magnification which will give you a longer eye relief and your head/eye will naturally be farther back from the scope anyways. So setting it up in prone on the highest magnification puts the scope at the perfect distance from your eye in all positions. =) ~Jared
Oh yeah.. Unless the perfect distance from your eye is making the scope touch the barrel like you said lol 😆😆. That's when going to higher rings comes in. 😄
Very true! What’s crazy about these VX5’s and 6’s is that the eye relief between lowest and highest power is soooooo small that it doesn’t make a difference. I believe it’s literally under 1/4 inch.
What I have found with scope rings,is that each manufacturer has their own idea of what high,med & low is there is no standardization. One manufacturers High is another manufactures med
I wish they wouldn't even bother with the low, medium and high all together and just give a measurement. Especially with rings that mount to a rail. It isn't that hard to just say how many millimeters it is above the rail and then I don't have to guess and hope they fit right when I get them home or order them.
I have a tendency to stick with the same manufacturer. Talley. No surprises with the height,they are excellent rings for the price, and they pretty much cover every rifle out there.
Spring if your new to setting up a rifle and scope , there are many things to know to get it right . And there are tools for the job you may not have but a good gunsmith will , like a lapping bar and torque wrenches correct bits and drivers and levels . Even the best rifles and scopes will shoot poorly if not set up right . You may be very technically experienced but without the tools it's hard to get it right . Just food for thought when your making a large investment like that . Good luck and happy hunting .
An excellent refresher on mounting scopes correctly. I have encountered this problem as I'm sure many others have usually a high mount have been the problem solver. Not only to clear the front of the scope from the barrel but it has helped with handling the bolt by keeping the distance far enough from the back of the scope to make it more comfortable. Thank you!
Good video. I have a Weatherby in 270 with a Nikon 50mm objective scope on it. The rifle is devastatingly accurate at longer distance where it is a proven long range killer. At the time of set up, I chose the medium height rings & although I have the required gap from the barrel, however, frustratingly it is not enough to allow me to use an unmodified lens cap at the objective end...a real pain in the arse when it is raining or drizzling...
The higher the rings, the higher the comb needs to be if you find you are lifting your head to see reticle. Howa rifles (as well as CZ, Tikka and Sako) have notoriously lower comb heights than more common makes. You will almost assuredly need to add some form of cheek riser if you're planning on using 50mm objective or more scopes.
Definitely!... Great common sense when it comes to mounting a scope!... I have 56mm bell on my Strike Eagle (5x25x56) and did my measurements before buying the correct ring size, also planned for bubble to be on one of them to measure tilt!... Make's it easier to mount!... Set out 25 yards with bullet light in the chamber to zero in on the barrow!... Worked out beautifully on my POF-308! Mounts:Zeiss Precision Ultralight 1913 Mil-Spec Rifle Scope Mounting Rings with Anti-Cant Bubble Level 34mm X-High
Thank you for sharing your wisdom on this subject... this saves a lot of grief! And, since I'm kind of ADD, thank you for sharing it in a concise, straightforward manner.
my uncle (who was my primary firearm and hunting mentor as a kid) once told me, when setting the depth of a scope, to close my eyes, grab my comfortable cheek weld, make sure i’m in the most comfortable position i can obtain, then open my eyes and push/pull scope into center of the scopes full fov range. made sense back then and ever since.
With large objectives, I prefer using a chassis or stock with adjustable LOP and adjustable cheek rise. This allows me to locate the scope optimally (bell clearance, etc) and then tailor my natural position to the scope. Given the cost of optics with these 50mm+ objectives, the cost of the chassis or stock is pretty tame. A big plus is the tendency to pick up additional rigidity and reduce overall weight slightly with these swaps.
My old Marlin 30-30 and I have taken alot of whitetail over the years and I never noticed until I started watching videos about scope mounting that my scope is too high. I have medium rings and I need low I guess. I have to lift my cheek up a little to see through the scope so I don't get that weld on my stock but like I said I've taken my share of deer and hogs with it, never missed, so I might just leave it alone. Thanks for the video.
Just a small physics tip (and you can verify this pretty easily with a pen or pencil in your hands): where possible, mount the rings such that the distance between them is maximized. To demonstrate why you do this, hold a pen level in front of you placing your fingers as close to the center as you can - then making some small back-and-forth motions note how much the ends of the pen move. Next, do the same but with your fingers our toward the ends of the pen, i.e. with your fingers at a near max distance away from each other, make similar back and forth movements. You should be able to see that the ends of the pen move much less when your fingers (the "rings") are further apart relative to the movements made when your fingers are closer together. Unless you are using el cheapo rings or an action with misaligned taps, the greater the distance between your rings, the straighter your scope will be relative to the action (and barrelm if the action and barrel are mated correctly). Vibrations from shooting will also have less impact on POI, etc, when the ring distance is greater.
I just bought a pair of DNZ Game Reaper one piece mounts for my T3X Superlite and Remington 700. The rings are rather close compared to two piece base and ring mounts, and now after reading your post I'm having second thoughts about the DNZ mounts. What scope mounts would you recommend for a sturdy mounts for hunting? Thanks for bringing the ring distance importance to light.
I had the gun shop mount my new scope. It did not work at all for me, I had the black ring even at 2x, I think they mount then forward for safety, but really, it just forces the shooter's face to crawl up the stock. I remounted my scope, selecting bases and rings that provided good site picture, but also worked with my natural and most stable off hand position. The position you shoot from is something to think about, because eye relief changes a bit if you shoot prone or bench or off hand. Sometimes you have to compromise. The other thing is clothing. I mounted my scope in the summer in a t-shirt. I hunt up north in late fall with quite a few layers on. I calculated that my clothing was adding about 5/8 to 3/4 of am inch. I chose to deal with this with a slimmer recoil pad, taking 1/2 an inch off my length of pull. I shoot a 7mm 08, and it is quite mild in terms of recoil, so this worked out fine and I did not have to chop up my nice walnut stock!
pseudopetrus Gday mate I’m thinking about buying a 7mm08 and was wondering what you think about them any feedback would be much appreciated mate would be using it for mostly deer and ferrel pigs thanks Yogi Australia 🇦🇺🤙🤙
Thanks so much for the video. I was working on my scope today and realized it was too low and wasn't sure of the best approach, so that's how I came to be here. Just wanted to say thanks for the clear n concise breakdown of proper mounting.
Thanks for the tip Randy! I am just getting into this sport and as luck would have it I do have to mount two scopes onto two mossberg patriot rifles I recently purchased. It was clear to me that the scope optics housing should not touch the rifle rig in any way but it is your point about the eye relief that really interested me. I am aware of the "getting scoped" phenomena having once seen it happen to another person so I am keen to avoid the same thing happening to me but I do find I am having problems with getting the full field of view in the scopes mounted on my air rifles. Have yet to do the mounting on my patriot rifles but it was clear to me I was doing something wrong. Now I know what that is!
You can put a shim in there as well and then you are still low as possible but it wont be touching. A shim made from a pop can works perfect I've done it many times and it does not flex or lose accuracy.
Great Video! i am by no means an expert. However, I've done well so far with my Vortex Viper 50mm bell. First on an M&P10; and just tonight changed from a cantilevered mount to vortex low pro series on my NEW Savage 110 Tactical. Leveled the rail in the gun vice, then leveled the turret. Maybe im a natural lol instinctively pulled the scope back to me. This maximized my eye relief. With the 2nd highest comb on my accufit stock im catching a great view of the reticle every time i shoulder the rifle. Now to zero this thing! Looking to break a record with my 308 lol now im dreamin'
Along with your ring height some have Picatinny/Weaver bases that are 3/8" or higher in thickness. I personally have scopes mounted with these bases and low .92 rings with a 34mm tube and 56mm bell on the scope and have 1/8" clearance between the scope and the barrel. People have to factor in all these heights when getting their overall height of the mount vs diameter of the scope and of course your cheek placement and sight alignment.
Correct. That is what I use when I have a 44mm. I use a variety of scopes for a variety of situations, so I end up using mediums on my smaller scopes and high on my larger scopes.
But using a smaller lens diameter will limit the amount of light absorbed, so you won't be able to see your target as well in poor light (bad weather/early morning/evening,) so there's a definite tradeoff.
@@sorenfranson3323 yes, but coating and glass quality make a huge different as well. So does magnification - dialing back on magnification with provide a brighter image. I would rather have a slightly smaller objective that fits well than a slightly larger objective than doesn't fit me well. I have several 44s, and the only 50mm works well but requires a cheek riser. (but it is a target rifle not a hunting rifle so I am okay with it)
Wouldn't it depend on the type of rings and rail? I just mounted a Leupold VX6 4-24X52 on my 7mm with low rings and it has more than enough clearance. Maybe because I use a picatinny rail or that the tube is 34mm. I ran into some issues with Tally rings that look similar to what you have. Thanks for the vid!
I built a custom thumb hole rifle, 270 Mauser bolt action, and mounted the scope too low. The heat from a sunny day would change the impact point at 100 yards. I raised the scope and installed an adjustable cheek weld and the heat displacement problem went away.
3:03 Not only that, for picatinny rail users (and possibly standard) it would also allow the use of magnification adjustment on some scopes. Because it had "lock" them there because lack of clearance.
I have a 1941 custom Mosin Nagant 91/30 and I installed a new scope mount (after I found the old one I installed years ago was falling apart and came loose) and I ran into the same issue except that the scope bell contacted the mount itself as the new mount pins into the rear sight. Since it was only a 2-3mm difference I opted to remove a small amount of stock from the mount itself, allowing the scope to sit with a few millimeters of clearance. However I ran into issues where I just could not get a consistent grouping and when attempting to bore sight the scope, I had to bottom it out however I was still inches below the reticle. For argument sake I then clicked the scope up and up to bring it to "center" to start over, however this brought the reticle down. I am assuming at this point my scope is trashed and even though there is millimeters between the bell and the mount, the scope had been banging off of the mount too many times while shooting. Would you agree with this assessment? I ordered a new scope and will be using taller mounting rings to test if that is what caused the issues I faced when attempting to sight in the rifle.
Thank You for this information. I have a Weatherby .257 I want to install a Vortex Viper 6-20X50 and with stores closed now it's tough to chose the right fit
Good video. I was in a bit of a dilemma with going w/med Leupold BC rings or high for my 50mm. I know guys like to go as low as possible, but I jump on a stock high, plus the Remington Model 700 has a nice cheekpiece. I went with the high rings, and, although I have a good deal of space between scope and barrel, it seems to work for me. If you get too low it's hard to clean between scope and barrel and I have seen rust spots on a barrel of a LOW mounted scope.
Thanks much for this video! Your point is well understood and taken. However there remains one question which I would appreciate your feedback on. Regarding sliding the scope back towards the eye sufficiently to allow a full field of view without truncating the periphery of that f.o.v. with the dreaded black ring of darkness😱: Q: when mounting a variable scope, should you have it set to its lowest or highest magnification? I originally set all of my Leupolds by leaving them on the lowest mag., but then I get the dark ring of f.o.v. reduction when adjusting to the highest....forcing me to stretch my neck forward to fill the f.o.v.😡 This is true whether considering the 2.5-8 or any of the 1-4 or 1.5-5 models. Thanks again Randy....much appreciated indeed.
Rob Krochenski I set my eye relief at the highest magnification and this is why: eye relief is less critical at low power. If walking around set at 2.5x, I can shoot quickly and have fewer issues with head position. But, if at 8x, I am likely prone and that usually results in your face to be closer to the scope with the most critical eye relief. I’d rather be solid at high magnification in the prone because my shot will be longer and more deliberate.
I'm no professional gunsmith but their is one other option for people that are at the optimal cheek weld, eye relief and are set on the scope bell size and want the lowest wiew and bore height. Just relieve a bit of barrel, it's at the strongest area and a credit card amount will not have any negative implications. This can be done to match the finish and will not be noticeable. Great video, I'm not trying to rain on your parade just another option for the very picky customers.
Just bought a Ruger precision rifle and a vortex diamondback tactical scope with a 50mm lense, I didn’t see any videos so I went with vortex medium rings... hope they are high enough 🤞but at the end of the day, I might be sending them back for higher rings.
I have the 6x24x50 Diamondback Tactical. Am using the Burris XTR Signature rings. Started out with the 1.50 height. Was to high so I went to the 1.25. As stated, each ring Manufacturer is different as I had leupold rings before these
One other thing to consider is the clothes or layers you’ll be wearing when you’re hunting in the north generally add more layers moving the gun away from my body so we have to take that in consideration and our set up, enjoy the video thanks
In a round about way this is true. Eye relief is the same distance from the scope to the marksman's eyeball no matter where it is placed on the rifle. Craning your head forward might put your eyebrow closer, magnum eyebrow is more often a function of improper fit, improper hold, and shooting a heavy recoiling rifle without the necessary weight, brake, or suppressor to manage the weight. Randy- Have you ever considered a rifle school such as Long Range University? Cody WY isn't far from your stomping grounds and even an experienced shooter can improve.
Good stuff overall but the term eye relief as used is confusing. To paraphrase what Phil said, the distance from the scope at which the eye sees the full view never changes whether the scope is forward or back. Sliding the scope back puts it CLOSER to the eye, not farther, so allows/requires the cheek and eye to be farther back on the stock. I prefer a scope to be quite far forward to fit me. Scope cuts on eyebrow are due to putting the eye too close to the scope, for whatever reason.
I have a vari x 3x9x40 on my 300 win mag that you can't slide paper between the scope an barrel since 1989 and the only time I have ever had to adjust my settings is between weak and hot loads.
I don’t get this trend of going with large objective lens on hunting rifles. Any good quality 40mm scope will collect enough light that you still be able to see clearly after legal shooting hours. I get the larger the objective the more light transmission. But on a hunting rifle once you go over 40mm you’ll need to mount the scope high enough that getting a check weld will become difficult. I don’t get the high magnification trend either. I shoot 1000 yards regularly and I rarely go over 15X. I don’t understand going over 12X on a hunting rifle. But like I always say do what you like.
Good advice I mean it should be comon sense and I know most hunters and rifleman knows about this things I appreciate your input on what size of rings to use according to the size of your scope again ty .
99% of my rifles have med rings. i usually use 40 mm. i like metal one piece mounts if i can use them. I like the one piece dove tail mount. but have a couple rifles that have aluminum mounts too. the thing to remember is metal to metal, mount to rings, dont use aluminum rings on metal mount. good video. having a cheap line up tool works good too. and torque too
Trouble is.....every manufacturer's low/med/high rings are all ( mathematically) different as to how high each of these are....there is no "standard" for all this. The result is that you need to assemble a number of dimensions on paper to see if your scope "system" works as intended. And not all scope ring / base manufacturers have these numbers or at least make it difficult to get.
Cant believe how many people have this problem, I didn't mount my scope I got the guy in the gun shop to do it for me. Can't get my scope covers on I was told the scope needed to be as low as possible 🤔 I'm pissed now, thanks for the heads up they will be changing them foc!!!! 🤙🇬🇧
I mount mine using a plumb line and make sure the rifle/scope combo works when I aim the rifle upward at a 45 degree angle with medium amount of clothes on to simulate colder weather. VX3I scopes have horrible eye relief to begin with.
Or you can determine how high you need to raise the scope to clear the barrel and get shims from Brownells to raise it just the amount you need instead of the larger jump between medium and high mounts.
Ive used aluminum shims under the scope in the saddle of the rings to rais the scope enough to clear. Its a rigged way to do it but all of them ive done never move and shoot 1 hole at 100 yards.
I noticed he uses dual dove tail leaupold rings and bases.I have them on all my hunting rifles,you don't have to worry about the windage screws coming loose on the other style.it's solid that way!
Even if it’s not touching , barrel whip can come into play depending on caliber, stiffness of the barrel and barrel profile. I don’t hunt elk but I bet those magnum rifles with backcountry pack it in barrel profiles have a bit more whip than a rig built for sitting in a blind.
I use the lowest rings I can, but I also only use 40mm maximum objective bell size. There's no reason for the 50mm or larger objective bell size on a hunting rifle. Additionally people run into problems with the bolt hitting the Ocular eye piece with low rings. I've seen thus with Vortex scopes. Leupold scopes don't have this problem.
The video is not incorrect, but it fails to mention how he deals with the cheek weld issue now that he has higher rings. This is a major problem for most gun owners and is why there are many aftermarket stocks, and now even factory stocks, with adjustable combs.
45 years ago I built a custom 270 from a Mauser action and custom stock. I mounted a Burris 3-12 x 50 fullfield and had this exact problem. I switched to the tall mounts and installed an adjustable cheek rest to compensate for the extra height. (dimes @ 200 yds.)
My target rifles have the eyepiece set back 4" from the back end of the Savage receiver. They're set for prone position use. Makes switching scopes easy to do. I always wondered why scope manufacturers don;t run a rounded rubber trim ring on the eyepiece instead of the metal razor edge????? You just know somebody is going to eventually bop themselves in the head with it. (if you haven't done it, you haven't been shooting long enough, lol)
Every scope I own has that feature. Either a rubber ring or a rounded edge. I haven't see one with a sharp edge in decades. Only time I ever scoped myself in the head was the first time I shot my 30-06 when I was a teen and weighed like 95 lbs. Back in the mid 80's. My dad was like "Be careful with that, that is lot of gun don't smack yourself in the head.". I walked out the door mumbling to myself "whatever old man.". First shot WHAM! Got me right above the eye. 30 some years later and still haven't forgetten that moment lol.
A help with this if you are using a larger objective may be an add on, stock cheek piece that allows you dig in but maintain center eye to center scope alignment. Without that, I like to play with the un-scoped rifle, giving some serious thought to my scope choice.
Wow glad I stumbled upon this video. I mounted a 50mm to my Browning BAR the other day and it's touching the barrel. This saved me from wasting ammo at the range. I've always hunted without scopes so I'm new to this. Good to know thanks for the video.
Correct me if I'm wrong but sliding your scope backwards doesn't change your eye relief, or the eye relief of the scope. I just changes the position of your head/neck while adjusting to get the proper distance from the scope?
This is pretty interesting. I think Nikon makes a scope that has a 60mm ish scope with a cutout in the lens, sinking it closer to line of shot to deal with this problem. It depends on 1:the size of your scope front outer diameter, 2: your montage"rings" 3: barrel to- chamber diameter increase if any, 4: stock cheek height in relation to both line of shot and line of aim. 5: stock buttplate-to relief length.
@Chris Young sorry if i don't know the exact terms. English is not my native language. But i do understand the mecanics of how it works unless i got something very wrong..
Thanks Randy, great video. I’m having trouble picking out a scope and scope rings for my Remington 7MM Magnum. It was my grandpas and he had an old weaver scope with flip rings on it so you can shoot Iron sites as well. Trying to maybe find someone that will be tall enough so I can also shoot iron sites, is that a good idea? Currently looking at a Vortex Optics Viper PST Gen I 6-24x50 SFP Riflescope - EBR-1 MOA Reticle.
Thank you I have a Swarovski z5i 2.4-12x50 and I also have a 25/06 HOWA model 1500 Is this also the reason I ran out of elevation adjustment because of the medium rings? Paper barely fits through
No that’s a separate issue. You run into this problem when shooting long distances. Easily solved with a 20 MOA rail. This gives a slight angle to the rail and gives you 20 MOA more elevation adjustment
Is using the high or extra high rings needed for something like a Ruger 10/22? It has a way small diameter barrel then the rifle in the video obviously. Just wondering if that would be the same circumstances while using a 50mm objective lens on a 10/22.
Do you find eye relief is different, depending on your position? I find that if I am prone with a scope for standing, the relief is off. If I set the scope for prone relief, then it works better.
Yes, shooting position surely tweaks eye relief. Adjust it to your most common shooting positions and mark the location on the scope so you do not lose that mark when you level it and tighten the rings.
Thanks for this clear video, have been looking for a simple "chat" on the subject. Have a 3.5-10x50 and I can't get it back far enough for the 3.3" eye relief. Anyone have some thoughts on the battle between scope to bore distance vs eye relief/ring height? Should I just go to a 40mm or go to a higher ring and not sweat it?
I know im late to the party, but what type of rifle is it? You might need to use cantilever rings or a 1 peice ar15 type scope mount. Typically, " medium" rings are all you need for all but enormous scopes. try using risers if possible to test out new heights.
My gunsmith buddy showed me a trick when I mounted a scope on my RPR and the scope was touching. He cut some brass shims, I don’t remember how thick for sure maybe 50/1000s, and put them under the scope in the rings and that was enough to create daylight clearance. Worked like a charm.
Don't forget, eye relief changes depending on what power you have the scope on. You're better off mounting your scope in prone on the highest magnification. Hi magnification = shorter eye relief, and low magnification = longer eye relief. In prone, you will normally be on high magnification because you're steadier and your head will be farther forward. So when you shoot off-hand, you typically will be on a lower magnification which will give you a longer eye relief and your head/eye will naturally be farther back from the scope anyways. So setting it up in prone on the highest magnification puts the scope at the perfect distance from your eye in all positions. =) ~Jared
Oh yeah.. Unless the perfect distance from your eye is making the scope touch the barrel like you said lol 😆😆. That's when going to higher rings comes in. 😄
Jared Moyer ok I look into those videos. But first what is about the 7mm08 that you love about?
Very true! What’s crazy about these VX5’s and 6’s is that the eye relief between lowest and highest power is soooooo small that it doesn’t make a difference. I believe it’s literally under 1/4 inch.
Wrong. Maybe with your scope from the 80s
One thing you dont want is to have your scope at the highest mag. They even teach you that in the military..
What I have found with scope rings,is that each manufacturer has their own idea of what high,med & low is there is no standardization. One manufacturers High is another manufactures med
Firearm Solutions thank you for putting that out there !! I have noticed the very something,,, frustrating to say the least !
I wish manufacturers would standardize centerline to top of mounting surface. Would make life much easier!
I wish they wouldn't even bother with the low, medium and high all together and just give a measurement. Especially with rings that mount to a rail. It isn't that hard to just say how many millimeters it is above the rail and then I don't have to guess and hope they fit right when I get them home or order them.
I have a tendency to stick with the same manufacturer. Talley. No surprises with the height,they are excellent rings for the price, and they pretty much cover every rifle out there.
That's actually what I was hoping would be explained in the video. So thanks.
I'm new to hunting deer and target shooting..this is exactly what I needed to know. Thank you Sir. Hello from Texas USA
Spring if your new to setting up a rifle and scope , there are many things to know to get it right . And there are tools for the job you may not have but a good gunsmith will , like a lapping bar and torque wrenches correct bits and drivers and levels . Even the best rifles and scopes will shoot poorly if not set up right . You may be very technically experienced but without the tools it's hard to get it right . Just food for thought when your making a large investment like that . Good luck and happy hunting .
Don't forget a laser bore sighter. Helps you get on paper before you waste ammo trying to sight in.
Welcome to the club, brother.
@@scbane pull the bolt and use your eye to "bore sight". Save your cash on a fancy machine.
I too am a noob from Pennsylvania this was a useful video
Everyone needs a neighbor like this guy.
An excellent refresher on mounting scopes correctly. I have encountered this problem as I'm sure many others have usually a high mount have been the problem solver. Not only to clear the front of the scope from the barrel but it has helped with handling the bolt by keeping the distance far enough from the back of the scope to make it more comfortable. Thank you!
Exactly what i was looking for much appretiated this is what youtube is for
I like to use 20 MOA rails and medium rings for big scopes. Also leupold rails and rings are some of the best you can get.
Good video. I have a Weatherby in 270 with a Nikon 50mm objective scope on it. The rifle is devastatingly accurate at longer distance where it is a proven long range killer. At the time of set up, I chose the medium height rings & although I have the required gap from the barrel, however, frustratingly it is not enough to allow me to use an unmodified lens cap at the objective end...a real pain in the arse when it is raining or drizzling...
I have been guilty of leaning forward. Thanks for the excellent information.
The higher the rings, the higher the comb needs to be if you find you are lifting your head to see reticle. Howa rifles (as well as CZ, Tikka and Sako) have notoriously lower comb heights than more common makes. You will almost assuredly need to add some form of cheek riser if you're planning on using 50mm objective or more scopes.
Of course..
Definitely!... Great common sense when it comes to mounting a scope!... I have 56mm bell on my Strike Eagle (5x25x56) and did my measurements before buying the correct ring size, also planned for bubble to be on one of them to measure tilt!... Make's it easier to mount!... Set out 25 yards with bullet light in the chamber to zero in on the barrow!... Worked out beautifully on my POF-308!
Mounts:Zeiss Precision Ultralight 1913 Mil-Spec Rifle Scope Mounting Rings with Anti-Cant Bubble Level 34mm X-High
Well spoken by someone with real experience. I’ve finally learned to sacrifice having the scope super low to get better eye relief and clear the bolt!
This guy is cool. I could listen to him all day.
Randy’s videos are the best. Straightforward and very informative. Keep them coming sir.
Thank you for sharing your wisdom on this subject... this saves a lot of grief! And, since I'm kind of ADD, thank you for sharing it in a concise, straightforward manner.
I used high rings and a 20moa base and have just about 1/8 inch clearance. Perfect fit for me.
my uncle (who was my primary firearm and hunting mentor as a kid) once told me, when setting the depth of a scope, to close my eyes, grab my comfortable cheek weld, make sure i’m in the most comfortable position i can obtain, then open my eyes and push/pull scope into center of the scopes full fov range. made sense back then and ever since.
You chose a good topic and had a clear explanation. Thanks!
Was that a pun? A ''clear'' explanation..?
With large objectives, I prefer using a chassis or stock with adjustable LOP and adjustable cheek rise. This allows me to locate the scope optimally (bell clearance, etc) and then tailor my natural position to the scope. Given the cost of optics with these 50mm+ objectives, the cost of the chassis or stock is pretty tame. A big plus is the tendency to pick up additional rigidity and reduce overall weight slightly with these swaps.
My old Marlin 30-30 and I have taken alot of whitetail over the years and I never noticed until I started watching videos about scope mounting that my scope is too high. I have medium rings and I need low I guess. I have to lift my cheek up a little to see through the scope so I don't get that weld on my stock but like I said I've taken my share of deer and hogs with it, never missed, so I might just leave it alone. Thanks for the video.
Just a small physics tip (and you can verify this pretty easily with a pen or pencil in your hands): where possible, mount the rings such that the distance between them is maximized. To demonstrate why you do this, hold a pen level in front of you placing your fingers as close to the center as you can - then making some small back-and-forth motions note how much the ends of the pen move. Next, do the same but with your fingers our toward the ends of the pen, i.e. with your fingers at a near max distance away from each other, make similar back and forth movements. You should be able to see that the ends of the pen move much less when your fingers (the "rings") are further apart relative to the movements made when your fingers are closer together. Unless you are using el cheapo rings or an action with misaligned taps, the greater the distance between your rings, the straighter your scope will be relative to the action (and barrelm if the action and barrel are mated correctly). Vibrations from shooting will also have less impact on POI, etc, when the ring distance is greater.
I just bought a pair of DNZ Game Reaper one piece mounts for my T3X Superlite and Remington 700. The rings are rather close compared to two piece base and ring mounts, and now after reading your post I'm having second thoughts about the DNZ mounts. What scope mounts would you recommend for a sturdy mounts for hunting? Thanks for bringing the ring distance importance to light.
@@archstanton9703 my example applies only to 2-piece mounts. One piece mount is good
@@ntaylor1829 I appreciate the clarification. I bought a one piece DNZ Game Reapter one piece mount for my Tikka. Thank you and have a good one!
@@archstanton9703how do you like that DNZ? I’m looking at one as an alternative to some Leupold rings and a rail
@@laytonaschauer3675I returned them and went with Sportmatch base/ring combo mounts. They seem to be working fine.
I had the gun shop mount my new scope. It did not work at all for me, I had the black ring even at 2x, I think they mount then forward for safety, but really, it just forces the shooter's face to crawl up the stock. I remounted my scope, selecting bases and rings that provided good site picture, but also worked with my natural and most stable off hand position. The position you shoot from is something to think about, because eye relief changes a bit if you shoot prone or bench or off hand. Sometimes you have to compromise. The other thing is clothing. I mounted my scope in the summer in a t-shirt. I hunt up north in late fall with quite a few layers on. I calculated that my clothing was adding about 5/8 to 3/4 of am inch. I chose to deal with this with a slimmer recoil pad, taking 1/2 an inch off my length of pull. I shoot a 7mm 08, and it is quite mild in terms of recoil, so this worked out fine and I did not have to chop up my nice walnut stock!
All good points. Glad you took it upon yourself.
pseudopetrus Gday mate I’m thinking about buying a 7mm08 and was wondering what you think about them any feedback would be much appreciated mate would be using it for mostly deer and ferrel pigs thanks Yogi Australia 🇦🇺🤙🤙
Thanks so much for the video. I was working on my scope today and realized it was too low and wasn't sure of the best approach, so that's how I came to be here. Just wanted to say thanks for the clear n concise breakdown of proper mounting.
Glad it helped!
@@Fresh_Tracks Wow, I didn't really expect you to see my comment since the last one was from a while ago, but I'm glad ya did. Hope you're doing well!
You can also add a spacer that will lift your scope. I had this problem with an AR ten and 50 bell scope. Bas pro shop has them.
Thanks for the tip Randy! I am just getting into this sport and as luck would have it I do have to mount two scopes onto two mossberg patriot rifles I recently purchased. It was clear to me that the scope optics housing should not touch the rifle rig in any way but it is your point about the eye relief that really interested me. I am aware of the "getting scoped" phenomena having once seen it happen to another person so I am keen to avoid the same thing happening to me but I do find I am having problems with getting the full field of view in the scopes mounted on my air rifles. Have yet to do the mounting on my patriot rifles but it was clear to me I was doing something wrong. Now I know what that is!
Great advice, most guys just want their scopes on. I want to pull up and focus right away without adjusting back and forth. Thanks.
2 piece ring and base set up is really old school. Today, a one piece ring and base setup is the way to go, in my opinion.
You can put a shim in there as well and then you are still low as possible but it wont be touching. A shim made from a pop can works perfect I've done it many times and it does not flex or lose accuracy.
Great Video! i am by no means an expert. However, I've done well so far with my Vortex Viper 50mm bell. First on an M&P10; and just tonight changed from a cantilevered mount to vortex low pro series on my NEW Savage 110 Tactical. Leveled the rail in the gun vice, then leveled the turret. Maybe im a natural lol instinctively pulled the scope back to me. This maximized my eye relief. With the 2nd highest comb on my accufit stock im catching a great view of the reticle every time i shoulder the rifle. Now to zero this thing! Looking to break a record with my 308 lol now im dreamin'
Range day 110 tactical zeroing, using 168gr sierra match by federal.
Along with your ring height some have Picatinny/Weaver bases that are 3/8" or higher in thickness. I personally have scopes mounted with these bases and low .92 rings with a 34mm tube and 56mm bell on the scope and have 1/8" clearance between the scope and the barrel. People have to factor in all these heights when getting their overall height of the mount vs diameter of the scope and of course your cheek placement and sight alignment.
Good vid. This is why 44mm objectives exist. Solves this issues while still using medium rings
Correct. That is what I use when I have a 44mm. I use a variety of scopes for a variety of situations, so I end up using mediums on my smaller scopes and high on my larger scopes.
But using a smaller lens diameter will limit the amount of light absorbed, so you won't be able to see your target as well in poor light (bad weather/early morning/evening,) so there's a definite tradeoff.
@@sorenfranson3323 yes, but coating and glass quality make a huge different as well. So does magnification - dialing back on magnification with provide a brighter image. I would rather have a slightly smaller objective that fits well than a slightly larger objective than doesn't fit me well. I have several 44s, and the only 50mm works well but requires a cheek riser. (but it is a target rifle not a hunting rifle so I am okay with it)
@@AdventureOne , true, but all things equal a larger objective will provide you with better light.
Burris Signature rings have interchangeable inserts. The inserts are available +- .005, +- .010 and +- .020. Give them a look!
Wouldn't it depend on the type of rings and rail? I just mounted a Leupold VX6 4-24X52 on my 7mm with low rings and it has more than enough clearance. Maybe because I use a picatinny rail or that the tube is 34mm. I ran into some issues with Tally rings that look similar to what you have. Thanks for the vid!
Great video easy learning ..very informative
Good info. I use a Vortex 3-9x40 Crossfire II scope with medium mounts on my Ruger 10/22 and it is perfect.
I built a custom thumb hole rifle, 270 Mauser bolt action, and mounted the scope too low. The heat from a sunny day would change the impact point at 100 yards. I raised the scope and installed an adjustable cheek weld and the heat displacement problem went away.
I don’t like 50mms for that reason. The VX -6s I have are 42s and you can use low mounts and be ok.
Simply purchased a 44 objective and used low rings... love my 3 x 18 B&C illuminated Leupold
3:03 Not only that, for picatinny rail users (and possibly standard) it would also allow the use of magnification adjustment on some scopes. Because it had "lock" them there because lack of clearance.
I have a 1941 custom Mosin Nagant 91/30 and I installed a new scope mount (after I found the old one I installed years ago was falling apart and came loose) and I ran into the same issue except that the scope bell contacted the mount itself as the new mount pins into the rear sight. Since it was only a 2-3mm difference I opted to remove a small amount of stock from the mount itself, allowing the scope to sit with a few millimeters of clearance. However I ran into issues where I just could not get a consistent grouping and when attempting to bore sight the scope, I had to bottom it out however I was still inches below the reticle. For argument sake I then clicked the scope up and up to bring it to "center" to start over, however this brought the reticle down. I am assuming at this point my scope is trashed and even though there is millimeters between the bell and the mount, the scope had been banging off of the mount too many times while shooting. Would you agree with this assessment? I ordered a new scope and will be using taller mounting rings to test if that is what caused the issues I faced when attempting to sight in the rifle.
THANK YOU RANDY. HOPE SEASON GOES WELL. I'LL BE WATCHING.
Thank You for this information. I have a Weatherby .257 I want to install a Vortex Viper 6-20X50 and with stores closed now it's tough to chose the right fit
Great video Randy. Just did this for bear season this year. Moved up to mediums for my 44mm objective end.
Thanks Randy, I now understand it. I just ordered mounts for my new scope. Very informative.
Good video. I was in a bit of a dilemma with going w/med Leupold BC rings or high for my 50mm. I know guys like to go as low as possible, but I jump on a stock high, plus the Remington Model 700 has a nice cheekpiece. I went with the high rings, and, although I have a good deal of space between scope and barrel, it seems to work for me. If you get too low it's hard to clean between scope and barrel and I have seen rust spots on a barrel of a LOW mounted scope.
Thanks much for this video! Your point is well understood and taken. However there remains one question which I would appreciate your feedback on.
Regarding sliding the scope back towards the eye sufficiently to allow a full field of view without truncating the periphery of that f.o.v. with the dreaded black ring of darkness😱:
Q: when mounting a variable scope,
should you have it set to its lowest
or highest magnification?
I originally set all of my Leupolds by leaving them on the lowest mag., but then I get the dark ring of f.o.v. reduction when adjusting to the highest....forcing me to stretch my neck forward to fill the f.o.v.😡 This is true whether considering the 2.5-8 or any of the 1-4 or 1.5-5 models.
Thanks again Randy....much appreciated indeed.
Rob Krochenski I set my eye relief at the highest magnification and this is why: eye relief is less critical at low power. If walking around set at 2.5x, I can shoot quickly and have fewer issues with head position. But, if at 8x, I am likely prone and that usually results in your face to be closer to the scope with the most critical eye relief. I’d rather be solid at high magnification in the prone because my shot will be longer and more deliberate.
Thanks much!
I'm no professional gunsmith but their is one other option for people that are at the optimal cheek weld, eye relief and are set on the scope bell size and want the lowest wiew and bore height. Just relieve a bit of barrel, it's at the strongest area and a credit card amount will not have any negative implications. This can be done to match the finish and will not be noticeable. Great video, I'm not trying to rain on your parade just another option for the very picky customers.
Just bought a Ruger precision rifle and a vortex diamondback tactical scope with a 50mm lense, I didn’t see any videos so I went with vortex medium rings... hope they are high enough 🤞but at the end of the day, I might be sending them back for higher rings.
Perfect perfect perfect and easy to set up!👍🏾
Fantastic tip. Appreciate the straight to the point presentation.
I have the 6x24x50 Diamondback Tactical. Am using the Burris XTR Signature rings. Started out with the 1.50 height. Was to high so I went to the 1.25. As stated, each ring Manufacturer is different as I had leupold rings before these
Great explanation of a common problem. Thanks!
Glad it helped!
One other thing to consider is the clothes or layers you’ll be wearing when you’re hunting in the north generally add more layers moving the gun away from my body so we have to take that in consideration and our set up, enjoy the video thanks
Yup, a factor to consider.
In a round about way this is true. Eye relief is the same distance from the scope to the marksman's eyeball no matter where it is placed on the rifle. Craning your head forward might put your eyebrow closer, magnum eyebrow is more often a function of improper fit, improper hold, and shooting a heavy recoiling rifle without the necessary weight, brake, or suppressor to manage the weight.
Randy- Have you ever considered a rifle school such as Long Range University? Cody WY isn't far from your stomping grounds and even an experienced shooter can improve.
Good stuff overall but the term eye relief as used is confusing. To paraphrase what Phil said, the distance from the scope at which the eye sees the full view never changes whether the scope is forward or back. Sliding the scope back puts it CLOSER to the eye, not farther, so allows/requires the cheek and eye to be farther back on the stock. I prefer a scope to be quite far forward to fit me. Scope cuts on eyebrow are due to putting the eye too close to the scope, for whatever reason.
I have a vari x 3x9x40 on my 300 win mag that you can't slide paper between the scope an barrel since 1989 and the only time I have ever had to adjust my settings is between weak and hot loads.
I don’t get this trend of going with large objective lens on hunting rifles. Any good quality 40mm scope will collect enough light that you still be able to see clearly after legal shooting hours. I get the larger the objective the more light transmission. But on a hunting rifle once you go over 40mm you’ll need to mount the scope high enough that getting a check weld will become difficult. I don’t get the high magnification trend either. I shoot 1000 yards regularly and I rarely go over 15X. I don’t understand going over 12X on a hunting rifle. But like I always say do what you like.
Good advice I mean it should be comon sense and I know most hunters and rifleman knows about this things I appreciate your input on what size of rings to use according to the size of your scope again ty .
Man howa's is taking over!!
Good advice Newberg! Like your videos....
Glad you like them!
99% of my rifles have med rings. i usually use 40 mm. i like metal one piece mounts if i can use them. I like the one piece dove tail mount. but have a couple rifles that have aluminum mounts too. the thing to remember is metal to metal, mount to rings, dont use aluminum rings on metal mount. good video. having a cheap line up tool works good too. and torque too
Thank you for this video. I’ve always been shooting on iron site and new to scopes
Trouble is.....every manufacturer's low/med/high rings are all ( mathematically) different as to how high each of these are....there is no "standard" for all this. The result is that you need to assemble a number of dimensions on paper to see if your scope "system" works as intended. And not all scope ring / base manufacturers have these numbers or at least make it difficult to get.
Cant believe how many people have this problem, I didn't mount my scope I got the guy in the gun shop to do it for me. Can't get my scope covers on I was told the scope needed to be as low as possible 🤔 I'm pissed now, thanks for the heads up they will be changing them foc!!!! 🤙🇬🇧
A lot of good information. Love the background music. Is a soundtrack available?
I mount mine using a plumb line and make sure the rifle/scope combo works when I aim the rifle upward at a 45 degree angle with medium amount of clothes on to simulate colder weather. VX3I scopes have horrible eye relief to begin with.
Or you can determine how high you need to raise the scope to clear the barrel and get shims from Brownells to raise it just the amount you need instead of the larger jump between medium and high mounts.
What's the minimum clearance you can get away with?
Ive used aluminum shims under the scope in the saddle of the rings to rais the scope enough to clear. Its a rigged way to do it but all of them ive done never move and shoot 1 hole at 100 yards.
great tips...very well done...thanks and more segments like this one...
Thanks, will do!
I noticed he uses dual dove tail leaupold rings and bases.I have them on all my hunting rifles,you don't have to worry about the windage screws coming loose on the other style.it's solid that way!
What the fuck are you talking about? Windage screws on a ring? What?
He’s referring to standard bases and rings, the rear ring is held in by screws which allow you to change windage...
Good tips. Medium rings were the ticket for my set up. ☝️
With a smaller objective lens, medium would be fine on this set up.
Even if it’s not touching , barrel whip can come into play depending on caliber, stiffness of the barrel and barrel profile.
I don’t hunt elk but I bet those magnum rifles with backcountry pack it in barrel profiles have a bit more whip than a rig built for sitting in a blind.
You can also use front rear extension rings and keep your eye relief and your scope of of the barrel and still use your medium rings
I like the high mount with hole on the mount because i can also see scope and barrel sightings
I use the lowest rings I can, but I also only use 40mm maximum objective bell size. There's no reason for the 50mm or larger objective bell size on a hunting rifle.
Additionally people run into problems with the bolt hitting the Ocular eye piece with low rings. I've seen thus with Vortex scopes. Leupold scopes don't have this problem.
I know you were talking something about scopes, but I was too distracted by the wall in the background. Impressive. :-)
wow very informative tips sir, how i wish to have an original scope here in the Philippines for my airgun....😊...thanks for sharing your knowledge.
The video is not incorrect, but it fails to mention how he deals with the cheek weld issue now that he has higher rings. This is a major problem for most gun owners and is why there are many aftermarket stocks, and now even factory stocks, with adjustable combs.
45 years ago I built a custom 270 from a Mauser action and custom stock. I mounted a Burris 3-12 x 50 fullfield and had this exact problem. I switched to the tall mounts and installed an adjustable cheek rest to compensate for the extra height. (dimes @ 200 yds.)
My target rifles have the eyepiece set back 4" from the back end of the Savage receiver. They're set for prone position use. Makes switching scopes easy to do.
I always wondered why scope manufacturers don;t run a rounded rubber trim ring on the eyepiece instead of the metal razor edge????? You just know somebody is going to eventually bop themselves in the head with it. (if you haven't done it, you haven't been shooting long enough, lol)
DUANE Osman i never did that before only with my friends savage 308 with a broken stock haha
Every scope I own has that feature. Either a rubber ring or a rounded edge. I haven't see one with a sharp edge in decades. Only time I ever scoped myself in the head was the first time I shot my 30-06 when I was a teen and weighed like 95 lbs. Back in the mid 80's. My dad was like "Be careful with that, that is lot of gun don't smack yourself in the head.". I walked out the door mumbling to myself "whatever old man.". First shot WHAM! Got me right above the eye. 30 some years later and still haven't forgetten that moment lol.
A help with this if you are using a larger objective may be an add on, stock cheek piece that allows you dig in but maintain center eye to center scope alignment. Without that, I like to play with the un-scoped rifle, giving some serious thought to my scope choice.
Wow glad I stumbled upon this video. I mounted a 50mm to my Browning BAR the other day and it's touching the barrel. This saved me from wasting ammo at the range. I've always hunted without scopes so I'm new to this. Good to know thanks for the video.
Question Do you set the rifle scope to the highest setting when adjusting the scope eye relief?
Great video randy
I bought the vortex pst viper with 50mm objective from what u are saying I should get large (high) rise mounts
Correct me if I'm wrong but sliding your scope backwards doesn't change your eye relief, or the eye relief of the scope. I just changes the position of your head/neck while adjusting to get the proper distance from the scope?
Weatherby Vanguard with a Vortex 4-16x50, Talley medium rings work. Left about an 1/8” between the bell and barrel.
I have the same setup but on a win. Model 70 . How's your elevation turret? I'm going to have to shim or lap for more elevation!?
This is pretty interesting. I think Nikon makes a scope that has a 60mm ish scope with a cutout in the lens, sinking it closer to line of shot to deal with this problem. It depends on 1:the size of your scope front outer diameter, 2: your montage"rings" 3: barrel to- chamber diameter increase if any, 4: stock cheek height in relation to both line of shot and line of aim.
5: stock buttplate-to relief length.
@Chris Young sorry if i don't know the exact terms. English is not my native language. But i do understand the mecanics of how it works unless i got something very wrong..
Thanks Randy, great video. I’m having trouble picking out a scope and scope rings for my Remington 7MM Magnum. It was my grandpas and he had an old weaver scope with flip rings on it so you can shoot Iron sites as well. Trying to maybe find someone that will be tall enough so I can also shoot iron sites, is that a good idea? Currently looking at a Vortex Optics Viper PST Gen I 6-24x50 SFP Riflescope - EBR-1 MOA Reticle.
Thank you I have a Swarovski z5i 2.4-12x50 and I also have a 25/06 HOWA model 1500
Is this also the reason I ran out of elevation adjustment because of the medium rings?
Paper barely fits through
No that’s a separate issue. You run into this problem when shooting long distances. Easily solved with a 20 MOA rail. This gives a slight angle to the rail and gives you 20 MOA more elevation adjustment
Any ideas on what the minimum clearance can be? Ive got about 2-3 mm from bell to barrel!
I learned the hard way with the clearance with scope and barrel but fixed it and things went better
Is using the high or extra high rings needed for something like a Ruger 10/22? It has a way small diameter barrel then the rifle in the video obviously. Just wondering if that would be the same circumstances while using a 50mm objective lens on a 10/22.
Everyone should know not to make contact between your Barrel and your scope but what is the recommended minimum distance you should allow ?
Do you find eye relief is different, depending on your position? I find that if I am prone with a scope for standing, the relief is off. If I set the scope for prone relief, then it works better.
Yes, shooting position surely tweaks eye relief. Adjust it to your most common shooting positions and mark the location on the scope so you do not lose that mark when you level it and tighten the rings.
some guys have the scope set a bit forward. looks like its set up wrong, until you go prone and shes mint.
Great advice! Very clear presentation and reasoning
Thanks for taking the time partner
Thanks for this clear video, have been looking for a simple "chat" on the subject. Have a 3.5-10x50 and I can't get it back far enough for the 3.3" eye relief. Anyone have some thoughts on the battle between scope to bore distance vs eye relief/ring height? Should I just go to a 40mm or go to a higher ring and not sweat it?
I know im late to the party, but what type of rifle is it? You might need to use cantilever rings or a 1 peice ar15 type scope mount. Typically, " medium" rings are all you need for all but enormous scopes. try using risers if possible to test out new heights.