Two things: One- Still bunged up. With a wife that's a primary (elementary) school teacher this time of year I become a guinea pig for all the germs the little miracles pick up. Second: I put a lap of the full oval in, driven in a Ford GT so you can see what it was like for the sports cars in around 1965 or so.
I'll always remember the banking as the race where Pete Aron in the Yamura just edged out Scott Stoddard in the BRM to become world champion. Sarti's accident kind of put on damper on things though.
@@getnaenaed4222 Let's not forget that leading the race comfortably that day was Nino Barlini...he maintained for years afterwards that had Ferrari not withdrawn his car from the race as a mark of respect to Sarti, he would have won at Monza and won the championship by a single point from Aron and two points from Stoddard.
The Monza banking is one of the only times where Sterling Moss thought he was done for. His steering broke at the Race of Two Worlds and his quote was something to the effect of "suddenly my arms were crossed and I knew there was not much chance of survival so I closed my eyes... when I opened them it was all hot and dusty and thought... if this is hell it isn't so bad" What a legend
A small bit of trivia for all of you: 1) The banked corner behind Parabolica is freely visitable to this day... with a little bit of climbing and moving through the surrounding woods, but you can still visit the whole corner until you face the gates that basically lead inside the current circuit's perimeter. 2) The oval's back straightaway is currently used as a parking lot for weekend workers and security personnel during the Italian Grand Rpix weekend, and I assume pretty much every event held at Monza. I know this for a fact because I used to work there as a steward in 2020.
a few years ago I managed to get on the first banked corner in my car about half way round and drove from there to about three quarters round the second banked corner
@@NonFlyiingDutchman Dude, that's awesome! I figure it would be impossible to take the corners at top speed given the bumpy nature of the surface and the sheer danger of it all, but really, how cool is that to live it in first person? Kudos to you, my friend. Sincere kudos.
@@AidanMillward Oh, whoopsie! Is there an actual difference between the two terms? I mean, I'm Italian, I can speak and write English but at times I tend to use the words I'm most familiar with, unaware of eventual different meanings. That leads to a lot of hilarious mishaps, though!
@@MegaFeb it was pretty cool. I didn't go above about 15mph as I was dodging cyclists and people walking their dogs but I got some in-car footage of it all the same!
Great one ! I didn't realize they stopped running on the oval so early. I remember the iconic final scenes of the movie "Grand Prix" with the Monza oval as part of the track. Figured they were still running on it in the mid 60's. Never forgotten my initial response when I first saw the oval on the big screen.
Its crazy that they thought "well, this flat oval is too dangerous. Right, tear it up" only for a few years later to think "hey, what if we brought the oval back but with insane banking? Thatll be safer right? Right?!"
The Monza oval sounds like something euro nascar and normal nascar could run a joint race at. Sort of like when nascar had the United States and Canadian series both race at Daytona at one point. Don’t know if it’ll ever happen but it sounds interesting.
I believe it would be the longest oval on the schedule. But trying to do any ocean crossing in the timeframe NASCAR runs would be difficult. An offseason invitational like the '90s Japanese races may be more likely.
@@mannacler Those were offseason exhibitions. I don't know how the logistics would work with a race in the US one weekend, Europe the next, and then back to the US.
I was lucky to see the Monza GP a few years ago . I got to walk on the banking it has a wonderful feeling made me smile like a six year old me watching my first GP had
I definitely did not expect a Star Trek reference in a video about Monza's oval, and even less for that reference to be one of the best speeches/scenes Star Trek has to offer. A surprise, to be sure, but a welcome one.
Been wanting to put it in forever tbh. Got the Pale Moonlight Garak “I only did what you told me to do so get off your high horse” speech in, now for Benny.
This oval is a legend and should never be destroyed because it isn't raced. As the Colosseum should never be for the same reason, because it's an historical landmark at this point. Should it be modified to race modern cars (possibly Euro NASCAR) ? I guess it could. And I did watch a WWE show in an antique Roman arena in France and it was a blast, so if someone knows some people at Rome's townhall, it could be a good idea too 😅
Sim-veteran of that 10km monster since GPL. An rFactor 917K on it is a scary, scary thing. As is a 1955 Mercedes W196 - rF or GPL. Nuts. Lots of pucker factor, and I luv it!
I did a few laps on the whole track in AC with a modern f1 car and nothing is as scary as opening DRS in the Oval. Your wheel becomes so light. you can feel it so well, that nothing is supporting that rear one slight bump and it goes at 300+kph
Been to monza twice, just an awesome vibe on gp weekend. The banking had a similar effect on me as Notredam, a we did it cause we could project and truly inspiring
They'd have to use plates or whatever they call the speedway package now so you'd get pack racing and at Monza that has all the ingredients of an absolute disaster. Somehow Michael McDowell would win.
Always a pleasure watching these. Though there us an outcry if the oval is to be torn down, what about if it was modified to current IndyCar standards: lower banking, maybe re-profiling the corners and of course, repaving it to be smooth?
@@AidanMillward True, but the counterpoint to that would be, in some way, it would be recreating the original reason for (re)building the oval - The Monzanapolis Series
That thing that really boggles my mind is not only the speed, but the kind of suspension as well relative to the bumpy nature of the track. While these cars weren't necessarily producing the sort of speeds that say Indy 500 Qualifying was in the CART days, the fact that they kept up this speed on a bumpy track and on suspension (which I don't imagine was AT ALL made with racing on Ovals in mind) is just insane. How many corrections had to be made per lap to ensure you didn't meet your maker?
Hey Aidan or anybody who knows was there ever any contact between the cars in transition? A> Cars completing Parabolica and making right traffic to merge onto the oval OR B> completing turn 4, making left traffic to merge onto the boot? I assume the "transition area" was taken at full throttle regardless of where you were heading. It would involve quick reflexes and possibly mind reading @ 190 mph.
I was lucky enough to be at Monza this year for the GP. I managed to climb up on to the banking (which by the way is far steeper than any camera does justice) and the surface itself was actually pretty decent. It's what's holding it up that is the problem. The concrete is crumbling, there's exposed reinforcing steel and cracks everywhere. They're never holding competitive racing on that circuit again. Not without massive expense certainly.
The answer is easy: motorcycle races. In the early days of motorcycle racing in the US they had board tracks of similar length & banking, and the little bit of film footage surviving of those races is sensational. I believe there was a board track at Sheepshead Bay in Brooklyn that was at least 2 miles in length and over 30 degrees banking. And, yes, board tracks meant wooden boards, which was the racing surface. I don't know how well motorcycles would handly concrete, but if they can race on wooden boards, they should be able to handle concrete.
I went on to the Monza oval during a race weekend just near the first chicane. The steepness of it really is incredible. You don't really notice it until you try and walk up it or in the case of my friend, fall over backwards while trying to walk up it. He was ok, we all laughed.
When I discovered Richie Axelson I too embarked on an archive binge to get the full saga (crazy to think he started ten years ago). Axelson Sr's year with Ferrari was indeed awesome. I'm still waiting for a mod to bring the 1951 season to life - the supercharged Alfa versus the 4.5-litre Ferrari would be fun to do online.
They actually wanted to race the 10k layout again for the 1963 Italian Grand Prix. But following problems on the first day of practice they changed the layout to the Grand Prix circuit. Changing the layout during the event is something F1 could have helped to avoid the Indy mess in 2005. But by then it was forbidden to do this kind of change.
I think if the oval were to ever come back I think there some series that COULD race on it, and I mean a big emphasis on “could” since some series can definitely make it work while some is more just me pulling ideas out me butt. So bare with me. Cause if it were to come back the oval is definitely gonna need a overhaul for safety, doesn’t matter, the guardrails will be replaced with the usual concrete wall with safer barriers in front of it in the corners and down the back straight with a catch fence put to it in some way like every oval and especially every high speed oval with a bus stop style chicane put on the back stretch for the oval + road combo. Kinda like the version we see on iRacing where it’s the same old modern circuit we all know and love with the oval section, but instead of the oval being flat out ya have a chicane to cut speeds down some. But in terms of cars and their speed, probably the more likely scenario would be GT cars and maybe NASCAR Euro cars would run on the oval + road combo course. Mainly cause NASCAR Euro cars, as far as I’m aware aren’t really set up to go past 150-160 mph, so the oval + road combo would be more suited. U can maybe have NASCAR’s top 3 series run either the oval or oval + road combo with them looking to take the Cup series to run an international race. So it would be cool for them to do this for an non points race either fit inside the schedule somehow or during the offseason. And the GT3s since while they’re fast, they’re still slow enough to run for something like Monza on the combined circuit, kinda like how GT3 is with the Nordschliefe. Could be run under the SRO and be maybe a 1000km endurance race for nostalgia. Although if ya wanna go for broke and the FIA wanna play devils advocate, they could have the ELMS or play Russian Roulette and have the WEC race the oval + Road combined every now and then. Could it be possible? Maybe. But we’ll never know. The only place that that little fantasy can come true is within sim racing.
I knew a guy called Geaorge Marsh who drove for bugattii in the thirties and who went over the banking at Brooklands. He also worked for Philips Eindhoven so he is traceable.
I'm thinking of go to the vintage races this year. Sure they don't race like in England where they destroy million dollar cars, just drive with some enthusiasm. Thank you for making me think about this. Arigatou gozaimasu sensei Aidan.
honestly, while expensive, a return to the oval could be very interesting too see. Nascar has shown intrest in the last 2 years of hosting a race internationally like they used to do at Suzuka and Twin Ring Motegi. While the Oval would need a full repave, safer barriers, catch fencing, and a meriod of other modifications in order to get it up to spec, how possible this will be is probably just a pipe dream, and if Nascar does go to europe itll probably be at silvertsone or a quatermile in a stadium like in LA, but nascar can use their Daytona/Talladega Package for this and not have to build a whole custom setup.
I'll always remember the oval as being the track that helped Kyle Larson get his seat at Hendrick Motorsports in NASCAR, which led to him winning the 2021 NASCAR Cup championship. Still shaping the motorsport landscape today.
No one fights a lion or bull to death in the colosseum anymore, but there are no plans to demolish it. Monza banking should stay on for the same reason.
Maybe some point in the future it could be used for the handcycling in the Paralympics (like Brands Hatch was used in 2012 when London hosted Olympics and Paralympics) if Milan/Rome host Olympics and Paralympics.
30 degrees? yea thats a steep oval, and its got little barrier on it so that would be very dangerous especially for modern cars with their even higher performance to race on, though they do make cars safer in some ways today with the fire suppression and break away parts as well as traction, but even longer then indy yea that would be fast for those kind of openwheel cars.
What Monza should do is commission a replica, in bronze, of all of the noteworthy cars that ran on the oval and position them all high up on the banking in chronological order. So you can walk the oval and see each car/driver one by one, frozen in time. That would be epic.
With parabolic banking and a concrete surface with expansion joints that had to be one scary ride. It would be interesting to see what NASCAR could do on that track.
More than likely if it was to be used again , like the Monza Rally restrictions as to how far up the banking you can go and a chicane down the unused straight might be enforced
Didn't WRC do a stage that was partially on the oval last year, or am I losing my mind? I know that's techincally "Rally Monza" but it's also something international audiences can watch. Anyhow, it looks like absolute murder on your suspension and body to go over those bumps. Also I never expected to see a DS9 reference in this video, and especially to that monologue!
The only way races will happen on the oval again is if they install catch fences the same as Daytona and dega.. plus safer barrier everywhere and repave the banking to todays standard . Would love to see it though
I did some laps around here on rf2 in a 69 F1 car (I think an AAR at the time) and even with those cars I wore myself out because holding it through the bumps in the banking was a WORKOUT
So I'm confused... weren't they using the Oval in 65 when the Frankenheimer movie "Grand Prix" was filmed there? Or did they just film the oval for that movie even though it was no longer part of the actual circuit?
If you mean parts of the track that go underneath each other, then yes. Technically though because Monza no longer uses the Oval portion it goes under as part of the Grand Prix, that makes Suzuka the sole active original purpose built track to maintain having a part of itself go underneath.
Unlike Broadlands, the italians are keeping a good job of looking after it. Sadly I suspect Rockingham could go the same way and Cinch likely to sell-up or demo the oval :( Given that EuroNASCAR hasn't visited the latter. I doubt EuroNASCAR on the Monza oval will be unlikely.
...a purpose-built formula one circuit that had the cars traveling in an oblique oval going from flattish ground near the pit lane...to 90⁰ perpendicular from the ground running clockwise round a circuit that had the fans looking down from the top of the track...they'd enter from the bottom through a door like on Rollerball..."The Wall of Death, Motordrome, Velodrome, or Well of Death, is a Carnival Sideshow featuring a silo- or barrel-shaped wooden cylinder, typically ranging from 20 to 36 feet (6.1 to 11.0 m) in diameter, and made of wooden planks, inside which Motorcyclists, or the drivers of Miniature Automobiles, travel along the vertical wall and perform Stunts, held in place by friction and Centrifugal Force. The original Wall of Death was in 1911 on Coney Island in the United States."
It's a massive mission for me to travel to European events from South Africa, but I did manage it for the Le Mans race in 2022. Monza is definitely high on the list of events I would love to experience, and if I get the chance, I'm going to be tramping all over that oval.
Couldn't run an American Stock Car at Monza, our oval tracks are setup to run counter-clockwise and Monza is definitely a clockwise circuit. If ya don't think so look at Parabolica exit with banking in background and that's Nascar Turn 1, on big tracks the big wreaks happen on straights not corner. It looks terrifying and ya can't run Nascar clockwise cause that would put driver next to wall, it would have to be a British or Australian series with cars set up to run clockwise
Please leave the oval as is. To bring it up the modern standards would destroy what it is, especially as the banking is built upon "stilts". Besides, Europeans are not big on ovals anyway. Fun fact. David Hobbs was one of the winning co-drivers in that last oval race.
Two things: One- Still bunged up. With a wife that's a primary (elementary) school teacher this time of year I become a guinea pig for all the germs the little miracles pick up.
Second: I put a lap of the full oval in, driven in a Ford GT so you can see what it was like for the sports cars in around 1965 or so.
Looking forward to the tierlist
Get well soon Aidan
Glad I waited,(knew it couldn't be dead air),that banking looked pretty intimidating from the car!Feel better buddy .
I hear you on the germs… I work in the same environment. I combat it by consuming chocolate but even that has at best tempered the impacts.
was that lap done in iRacing? I'm guessing yes.
I'll always remember the banking as the race where Pete Aron in the Yamura just edged out Scott Stoddard in the BRM to become world champion. Sarti's accident kind of put on damper on things though.
I see your a man of culture
Aron put him in the hospital in Monaco when they were still teammates, so I always thought Stoddard should've won the championship that day.
😂😂
Brilliant - and underrated - comment! Love Frankenheimer. 👍🏻
@@getnaenaed4222 Let's not forget that leading the race comfortably that day was Nino Barlini...he maintained for years afterwards that had Ferrari not withdrawn his car from the race as a mark of respect to Sarti, he would have won at Monza and won the championship by a single point from Aron and two points from Stoddard.
@@thecoastofswitzerlandmusic8860 What a brilliant documentary he made about the 1966 season. Stoddard's comments about the banking were spot on.
The Monza banking is one of the only times where Sterling Moss thought he was done for. His steering broke at the Race of Two Worlds and his quote was something to the effect of "suddenly my arms were crossed and I knew there was not much chance of survival so I closed my eyes... when I opened them it was all hot and dusty and thought... if this is hell it isn't so bad"
What a legend
A small bit of trivia for all of you:
1) The banked corner behind Parabolica is freely visitable to this day... with a little bit of climbing and moving through the surrounding woods, but you can still visit the whole corner until you face the gates that basically lead inside the current circuit's perimeter.
2) The oval's back straightaway is currently used as a parking lot for weekend workers and security personnel during the Italian Grand Rpix weekend, and I assume pretty much every event held at Monza. I know this for a fact because I used to work there as a steward in 2020.
a few years ago I managed to get on the first banked corner in my car about half way round and drove from there to about three quarters round the second banked corner
@@NonFlyiingDutchman
Dude, that's awesome!
I figure it would be impossible to take the corners at top speed given the bumpy nature of the surface and the sheer danger of it all, but really, how cool is that to live it in first person?
Kudos to you, my friend. Sincere kudos.
Straight. Not a straightaway.
🤪🤪🤪🤪
@@AidanMillward
Oh, whoopsie!
Is there an actual difference between the two terms?
I mean, I'm Italian, I can speak and write English but at times I tend to use the words I'm most familiar with, unaware of eventual different meanings.
That leads to a lot of hilarious mishaps, though!
@@MegaFeb it was pretty cool. I didn't go above about 15mph as I was dodging cyclists and people walking their dogs but I got some in-car footage of it all the same!
I see Aidan, I click 'like',
Simple!
This is the way
Yep. Always
The oval banking has been used recently, I watched WRC cars take it on during the Power Stage for the Rally Monza in 2020 and 2021.
Great one ! I didn't realize they stopped running on the oval so early. I remember the iconic final scenes of the movie "Grand Prix" with the Monza oval as part of the track. Figured they were still running on it in the mid 60's. Never forgotten my initial response when I first saw the oval on the big screen.
Its crazy that they thought "well, this flat oval is too dangerous. Right, tear it up" only for a few years later to think "hey, what if we brought the oval back but with insane banking? Thatll be safer right? Right?!"
Coffee with Aidan ☕. My favorite time of day. Watch most of what you post. The sim racing is kind of boring to me but I love everything else.
The Monza oval sounds like something euro nascar and normal nascar could run a joint race at. Sort of like when nascar had the United States and Canadian series both race at Daytona at one point.
Don’t know if it’ll ever happen but it sounds interesting.
As one of the world's premier series Nascar should have a Euro venue. Monza, Brooklands or Montlhery given their histories are where they should be.
I believe it would be the longest oval on the schedule. But trying to do any ocean crossing in the timeframe NASCAR runs would be difficult. An offseason invitational like the '90s Japanese races may be more likely.
@@benjaminbrockway5998 I think that the Nascar circus has been to Japan before for a non-championship event and to Australia once too.
@@mannacler Those were offseason exhibitions. I don't know how the logistics would work with a race in the US one weekend, Europe the next, and then back to the US.
@@benjaminbrockway5998 I did say non-championship events.
Should be put back in operation. Would be a challenge for pilots and car makers and such a big spectacle for fans.
for sure! just needs NASCAR barriers added and a fresh coat of tarmac!
I don't like modern Monza and I don't like ovals, but for some reason I love old Monza with the oval combined. Go figure.
Monza oval vs. Talladega for the world's true Cathedral of Speed and...GO!
I can't imagine how bad the bottoming out must have been on those high banks.
Maybe that's another reason why F1 couldn't race round there now, the porpoising would be horrific!!!
@@nathanielkhoom6043 Same with modern sports cars honestly, with a surface that rough.
I was lucky to see the Monza GP a few years ago . I got to walk on the banking it has a wonderful feeling made me smile like a six year old me watching my first GP had
That episode of DS9 is one of the best episodes of TV ever.
it really is something to see in person.. vibes of an ancient long-abandoned temple in the jungle
Just got back from Thanksgiving in NC and visited the NASCAR HOF. You can walk on a 31 degree banked section of track. It’s amazing how steep it is.
I definitely did not expect a Star Trek reference in a video about Monza's oval, and even less for that reference to be one of the best speeches/scenes Star Trek has to offer. A surprise, to be sure, but a welcome one.
Been wanting to put it in forever tbh. Got the Pale Moonlight Garak “I only did what you told me to do so get off your high horse” speech in, now for Benny.
its been a while since ive watch your channel and is always a treat. cheers
That was fun! I was thinking I have to get a sim and try that oval out but then you included it for us. Thank you so much!
I'm at a loss how the DS9 reference relates to the video topic but I loved it. And I read it in the character's voice i my head.
It's a fantastic piece of history, and a blast to drive on the simulador!
been throwing some cars round the '66 monza course on ac and it's completely nuts
This oval is a legend and should never be destroyed because it isn't raced. As the Colosseum should never be for the same reason, because it's an historical landmark at this point.
Should it be modified to race modern cars (possibly Euro NASCAR) ? I guess it could.
And I did watch a WWE show in an antique Roman arena in France and it was a blast, so if someone knows some people at Rome's townhall, it could be a good idea too 😅
Sim-veteran of that 10km monster since GPL. An rFactor 917K on it is a scary, scary thing. As is a 1955 Mercedes W196 - rF or GPL. Nuts. Lots of pucker factor, and I luv it!
i love waking up to a new AM story! thanks aidan, awesome as always
Even reading that quote from DS9 brings tears.
Took them quite a while to get Avery back after that take.
seeing the old pictures pre war with no trees but you can still see the same layout is insane
wonderful stuff as always..... Merry Christmas Mr Millward
I did a few laps on the whole track in AC with a modern f1 car and nothing is as scary as opening DRS in the Oval. Your wheel becomes so light. you can feel it so well, that nothing is supporting that rear one slight bump and it goes at 300+kph
Good memories of this one from GT Legends days, You had to be careful coming out of the last banked corner onto the straight with a powerful car,
Been to monza twice, just an awesome vibe on gp weekend. The banking had a similar effect on me as Notredam, a we did it cause we could project and truly inspiring
They'd have to use plates or whatever they call the speedway package now so you'd get pack racing and at Monza that has all the ingredients of an absolute disaster. Somehow Michael McDowell would win.
Love these videos man, always very well researched
Love Richie Axelson and his son's exploits in the 89 Indycar series.
I heard he’s the same guy. He’s like Ash from Pokémon. Never ages.
The monza oval is a must see attraction for me if im ever in Italy.
Cheers from the Pacific West coast of Canada.
Always a pleasure watching these. Though there us an outcry if the oval is to be torn down, what about if it was modified to current IndyCar standards: lower banking, maybe re-profiling the corners and of course, repaving it to be smooth?
Lowering the banking would “butcher” it.
@@AidanMillward True, but the counterpoint to that would be, in some way, it would be recreating the original reason for (re)building the oval - The Monzanapolis Series
That thing that really boggles my mind is not only the speed, but the kind of suspension as well relative to the bumpy nature of the track. While these cars weren't necessarily producing the sort of speeds that say Indy 500 Qualifying was in the CART days, the fact that they kept up this speed on a bumpy track and on suspension (which I don't imagine was AT ALL made with racing on Ovals in mind) is just insane. How many corrections had to be made per lap to ensure you didn't meet your maker?
Hey Aidan or anybody who knows was there ever any contact between the cars in transition? A> Cars completing Parabolica and making right traffic to merge onto the oval OR B> completing turn 4, making left traffic to merge onto the boot? I assume the "transition area" was taken at full throttle regardless of where you were heading. It would involve quick reflexes and possibly mind reading @ 190 mph.
I was lucky enough to be at Monza this year for the GP.
I managed to climb up on to the banking (which by the way is far steeper than any camera does justice) and the surface itself was actually pretty decent. It's what's holding it up that is the problem. The concrete is crumbling, there's exposed reinforcing steel and cracks everywhere. They're never holding competitive racing on that circuit again. Not without massive expense certainly.
The answer is easy: motorcycle races. In the early days of motorcycle racing in the US they had board tracks of similar length & banking, and the little bit of film footage surviving of those races is sensational. I believe there was a board track at Sheepshead Bay in Brooklyn that was at least 2 miles in length and over 30 degrees banking. And, yes, board tracks meant wooden boards, which was the racing surface. I don't know how well motorcycles would handly concrete, but if they can race on wooden boards, they should be able to handle concrete.
I went on to the Monza oval during a race weekend just near the first chicane. The steepness of it really is incredible. You don't really notice it until you try and walk up it or in the case of my friend, fall over backwards while trying to walk up it. He was ok, we all laughed.
I remember a few locals celebrated the opening of the oval by 69ing on it the night of the unveiling ceremony after everyone went home.
Niceeeeeee...
That old oval is really fun in project cars 2 !
When I discovered Richie Axelson I too embarked on an archive binge to get the full saga (crazy to think he started ten years ago). Axelson Sr's year with Ferrari was indeed awesome. I'm still waiting for a mod to bring the 1951 season to life - the supercharged Alfa versus the 4.5-litre Ferrari would be fun to do online.
They actually wanted to race the 10k layout again for the 1963 Italian Grand Prix. But following problems on the first day of practice they changed the layout to the Grand Prix circuit.
Changing the layout during the event is something F1 could have helped to avoid the Indy mess in 2005. But by then it was forbidden to do this kind of change.
The Monza oval banking is absolutely terrifying to watch.
It's awesome that iracing has the oval available. Wish they would have added the historical course when they added Hockenheim.
I think if the oval were to ever come back I think there some series that COULD race on it, and I mean a big emphasis on “could” since some series can definitely make it work while some is more just me pulling ideas out me butt. So bare with me. Cause if it were to come back the oval is definitely gonna need a overhaul for safety, doesn’t matter, the guardrails will be replaced with the usual concrete wall with safer barriers in front of it in the corners and down the back straight with a catch fence put to it in some way like every oval and especially every high speed oval with a bus stop style chicane put on the back stretch for the oval + road combo. Kinda like the version we see on iRacing where it’s the same old modern circuit we all know and love with the oval section, but instead of the oval being flat out ya have a chicane to cut speeds down some. But in terms of cars and their speed, probably the more likely scenario would be GT cars and maybe NASCAR Euro cars would run on the oval + road combo course. Mainly cause NASCAR Euro cars, as far as I’m aware aren’t really set up to go past 150-160 mph, so the oval + road combo would be more suited. U can maybe have NASCAR’s top 3 series run either the oval or oval + road combo with them looking to take the Cup series to run an international race. So it would be cool for them to do this for an non points race either fit inside the schedule somehow or during the offseason. And the GT3s since while they’re fast, they’re still slow enough to run for something like Monza on the combined circuit, kinda like how GT3 is with the Nordschliefe. Could be run under the SRO and be maybe a 1000km endurance race for nostalgia. Although if ya wanna go for broke and the FIA wanna play devils advocate, they could have the ELMS or play Russian Roulette and have the WEC race the oval + Road combined every now and then. Could it be possible? Maybe. But we’ll never know. The only place that that little fantasy can come true is within sim racing.
The circuit the lap is on having both Pepsi and Coca Cola branding right next to each other is genius lol
Another cracking video.
I knew a guy called Geaorge Marsh who drove for bugattii in the thirties and who went over the banking at Brooklands. He also worked for Philips Eindhoven so he is traceable.
I'm thinking of go to the vintage races this year. Sure they don't race like in England where they destroy million dollar cars, just drive with some enthusiasm. Thank you for making me think about this. Arigatou gozaimasu sensei Aidan.
Realistically, I'm not going to buy a 1959 Les Paul, because I'm impoverished, and because I prefer the '60 neck profile. Great video as ever.
honestly, while expensive, a return to the oval could be very interesting too see. Nascar has shown intrest in the last 2 years of hosting a race internationally like they used to do at Suzuka and Twin Ring Motegi. While the Oval would need a full repave, safer barriers, catch fencing, and a meriod of other modifications in order to get it up to spec, how possible this will be is probably just a pipe dream, and if Nascar does go to europe itll probably be at silvertsone or a quatermile in a stadium like in LA, but nascar can use their Daytona/Talladega Package for this and not have to build a whole custom setup.
I'd love to see the oval restored, mainly for use by the NASCAR Whelen Euro Series so they can have a restrictor-plate race.
Thanks for the lap at the end. Get well, or drink enough that you don't care.
which version of the monza track was used in the film "grand prix" (1966)?? ...which i saw in the theater as a 14 y.o..
I feel like that if the oval is repaved, it would likely be reserved for "special" occasions, such as speed runs or one-vehicle endurance testing.
I'll always remember the oval as being the track that helped Kyle Larson get his seat at Hendrick Motorsports in NASCAR, which led to him winning the 2021 NASCAR Cup championship. Still shaping the motorsport landscape today.
*Vietnam flashbacks intensify*
Opening TH-cam and bang.. New Video.. Awesome
I still want to see the day when there’s an Indycar race on the combined circuit. It’d be much better if they were running late 90s CART rules tho.
No one fights a lion or bull to death in the colosseum anymore, but there are no plans to demolish it. Monza banking should stay on for the same reason.
They're destroying monuments and would destroy the Colosseum
ARCA brake weekly community race on monza full circuit, no chicanes.
Also a DS9 reference, oh yes.
Maybe some point in the future it could be used for the handcycling in the Paralympics (like Brands Hatch was used in 2012 when London hosted Olympics and Paralympics) if Milan/Rome host Olympics and Paralympics.
Good commentary. Love racing history.
awesome video
Could they revamp it now (ie the oval)... have a 2nd figure of track along with Suzuka?
30 degrees? yea thats a steep oval, and its got little barrier on it so that would be very dangerous especially for modern cars with their even higher performance to race on, though they do make cars safer in some ways today with the fire suppression and break away parts as well as traction, but even longer then indy yea that would be fast for those kind of openwheel cars.
What Monza should do is commission a replica, in bronze, of all of the noteworthy cars that ran on the oval and position them all high up on the banking in chronological order. So you can walk the oval and see each car/driver one by one, frozen in time. That would be epic.
It's still used for rallying so they'd have to be removable, but that sounds cool
With parabolic banking and a concrete surface with expansion joints that had to be one scary ride. It would be interesting to see what NASCAR could do on that track.
More than likely if it was to be used again , like the Monza Rally restrictions as to how far up the banking you can go and a chicane down the unused straight might be enforced
Didn't WRC do a stage that was partially on the oval last year, or am I losing my mind? I know that's techincally "Rally Monza" but it's also something international audiences can watch. Anyhow, it looks like absolute murder on your suspension and body to go over those bumps. Also I never expected to see a DS9 reference in this video, and especially to that monologue!
Holy Shit that's bumpy AF in the GT40.
The only way races will happen on the oval again is if they install catch fences the same as Daytona and dega.. plus safer barrier everywhere and repave the banking to todays standard . Would love to see it though
Is anyone else noticing a very slight mismatch between the audio and video?
Thanks!
Let's petition for it to be reinstated using the 2023 specifications! I mean the ride height has been raised so what could possibly go wrong?
I did some laps around here on rf2 in a 69 F1 car (I think an AAR at the time) and even with those cars I wore myself out because holding it through the bumps in the banking was a WORKOUT
Now do it with a direct drive. 😅
@@AidanMillward you trying to kill me dawg?
@@TheBigDawgSL it’s what I did with the f1 car there 🤣
@@AidanMillward you've got balls man. You've got balls
@@TheBigDawgSL it’s only 13nm of torque. 🤷🏻♂️
So I'm confused... weren't they using the Oval in 65 when the Frankenheimer movie "Grand Prix" was filmed there? Or did they just film the oval for that movie even though it was no longer part of the actual circuit?
It was in the movie even though F1 no longer used it because if you had the chance to film a movie at Monza, wouldn't you use the banking, too?
Are Suzuka and the original Monza the only F1 purpose built tracks to feature tunnels?
If you mean parts of the track that go underneath each other, then yes. Technically though because Monza no longer uses the Oval portion it goes under as part of the Grand Prix, that makes Suzuka the sole active original purpose built track to maintain having a part of itself go underneath.
One word: NEEEEEEEOOOOOOOOOMMM!
At least they had WRC touch the oval in 2021
There was a plan to referb it for Cart. However the announcement was made on 9/11 and then Zanadi had his crash.
Funnily enough that 1955 race was also on the 11th September.
You didn't mention the movie!
Unlike Broadlands, the italians are keeping a good job of looking after it. Sadly I suspect Rockingham could go the same way and Cinch likely to sell-up or demo the oval :( Given that EuroNASCAR hasn't visited the latter. I doubt EuroNASCAR on the Monza oval will be unlikely.
Richie axelson is a legend
...a purpose-built formula one circuit that had the cars traveling in an oblique oval going from flattish ground near the pit lane...to 90⁰ perpendicular from the ground running clockwise round a circuit that had the fans looking down from the top of the track...they'd enter from the bottom through a door like on Rollerball..."The Wall of Death, Motordrome, Velodrome, or Well of Death, is a Carnival Sideshow featuring a silo- or barrel-shaped wooden cylinder, typically ranging from 20 to 36 feet (6.1 to 11.0 m) in diameter, and made of wooden planks, inside which Motorcyclists, or the drivers of Miniature Automobiles, travel along the vertical wall and perform Stunts, held in place by friction and Centrifugal Force. The original Wall of Death was in 1911 on Coney Island in the United States."
It's a massive mission for me to travel to European events from South Africa, but I did manage it for the Le Mans race in 2022. Monza is definitely high on the list of events I would love to experience, and if I get the chance, I'm going to be tramping all over that oval.
New what was coming when I seen the title, F1 used to be absolutely bonkers and not in a good way sometimes
Boot shaped course? Pfff, its shaped like a gun and you know it!
Couldn't run an American Stock Car at Monza, our oval tracks are setup to run counter-clockwise and Monza is definitely a clockwise circuit. If ya don't think so look at Parabolica exit with banking in background and that's Nascar Turn 1, on big tracks the big wreaks happen on straights not corner. It looks terrifying and ya can't run Nascar clockwise cause that would put driver next to wall, it would have to be a British or Australian series with cars set up to run clockwise
I believe they ran the Race Of Two Worlds counter-clockwise when it ran in 1957/58.
Didn't the WRC run on the oval recently?
I think i saw some videos
Yep. In 2020 and 2021 seasons when rally Monza was part of the WRC calender due to covid
Zandvoort has banked corners now. Don't know how steep they are, though...
18 degrees, so fairly close, but not quite as steep, and definitely not as fast!
put a chicane in the middle to make it safer
As a guitar player, i concur
Which is why I was cool with Kirk Hammett buying the Peter Green guitar and using it to play Creeping Death. 🤣
@@AidanMillward 😂😂😂👍🏻
Please leave the oval as is. To bring it up the modern standards would destroy what it is, especially as the banking is built upon "stilts". Besides, Europeans are not big on ovals anyway. Fun fact. David Hobbs was one of the winning co-drivers in that last oval race.
What is this Gp Laps thing?
TH-camr who does nice edited videos on classic racing