Very informative video, but I think that the biggest issue that Tyler and Ronny had is what the rivets were attached to. As mentioned in the case of Tyler and by Ronny, the rivets were attached to the metal skin of the roof of the vehicle which is actually really thin and just ripped apart like a sardine can under load.
Your math is solid. I'm not trying to stir anything up, but I posted it in Ronny's video comments. If he notices them and it checks out positively, I'll point him over here. You did the math, you deserve the cred; I just didn't want to volunteer you for an internet drama fest. Never know how these things are going to roll out. I wonder if he'll see my comment. In any case, thanks for the video. I like your content.
Great Video, You are the first person that preaches vehicle load safety. With all the accessories people add to there vehicles most do not consider this issue.
Thanks for bringing this issue to light in the recent explosion of overlanding . Could only imagine hitting the brakes and having the entire rack and all its gear shoot off like a bobsled. Thanks for keeping it safe Overland Lady 😁✌
It wont just all a sudden happen. Like mentioned, there’s going to start having a bit of play and over time that bit of movement can do big damage and even make the roof completely fly off.
Rivets are not stronger when compared to bolts. They are used for the reasons you state, good for blind areas, they make manufacturing easier etc. I know in the automotive industry, anything that uses a rivet for load/structure components alsorequires a bonding agent. Bolts/nuts/washers are far better than rivets.
I've got a Frontrunner Slimline II for my 4Runner. Great brand and the customer service has been outstanding. No crazy lead times and plenty of accessories.
Great video! I've noticed here in North America people don't usually consider weight, and proper function/performance first.. weight in the vehicle, weight on the vehicle and weight on top of the vehicle, also aerodynamics (to a point), suspension height, tire size and spacing... in a nutshell form over function can lead to safety issues. Research, research, research!
Thank you for presenting this valuable information, Monique. I own a '19 GMC Savana 2500 cargo van and will be traveling and living in it for however long it takes me to visit all 48 lower states, Canada and Alaska. I ordered the "common" roof rack you see on most white work vans. I was going to mount an Arksen cargo basket on top of it, either 64" or 84" but I was hesitant to complete the project as I don't want the set up falling off my roof and possibly causing a serious accident on the highway. I had planned to carry extra fuel, a 20 pound bottle of propane and a Sea Eagle inflatable raft on the roof. After hearing the horror stories about roof racks I've decided to let the "experts" mount and secure one for me.
It was my understanding that Frontrunner do not have a reduction for offroad, due to their bolt through support plate mounting system, as opposed to the Rhino rivet through sheet metal version.
I think you may forgetting that at the time Rohnny and everyone else bought the rack, static and dynamic weight were listed solidly on the website. Since then, they added a calculator and etc, adjusting your thoughts/intentions of your build. I think you mentioned this, but I used to follow this site a lot. They've slowly changed/adjusted their site, along with install instructions throughout the years.
I commend you in bringing this information to the overlanding/off road community. If some one sees this and takes a second look at there rack & gear maybe it will save there lives. I have much respect for you. ✌
The real crunch is the rack sells for $1800 in Australia plus shipping and fitting and the 30 kilogram off road weight has to be evenly distributed over the rack, that's easy if you can spread it out my 17inch alloy rim and BFG KO2 weight 34 KG so that's out $2500 for a spot to mount an awning and a couple of max tracks its an expensive and costly on fuel consumption as well
Got the crestone (from sherpa equipment) on my 4runner and loving it! Top notch quality, thicker aluminum material v.s prinsu. Wind noise is minimal to none (oem without a roofrack)
Also the lower your platform is to your roof and the more feet you have the better. Lot of pressure placed onto platforms when going off road and Rhino and many others have it wrong.
You were right to call the mistakes out. However, off road is almost impossible to calculate. So many variables, speed, terrain, weather, weight distribution (all weight). Vehicle-Model Specific calculation. Repeat - Vehicle-Model Specific calculation. Static at rest. Why tents with bodies are heavy but at static with tent weight will usually be 3x weight. Also, check your mounts periodically they will work loose and you can keep an eye on your set up. You don’t need all that stuff.
This is great! Can’t believe how many people don’t read. Had this info when I installed my rhino 3 years ago. Sad how many people just jump on the bandwagon blaming rhino.
Great video. This is something that has frustrated me for awhile. Most of the bed-rack's I want for a future Gladiator don't even tell you the weights they can carry. Or, if they do, they only give you one weight limit. We need Static, Dynamic and then we also need Static and Dynamic Off-road limits... but most manufacturers won't tell us.
You used the same formula for Frontrunner racks as you did for the Rhino racks. But Front runner do not use that formula. They state that their racks have a specific static load rating and a dynamic load rating, regardless of whether you are on or off-road. So whilst a Rhino rack has a load rating of 30-35kg a Front runner has a load rating of 150kg dynamic load, which means you can use the entire 75kg weight limit of your cars roof (minus the weight of the rack/basket).
It’s explained in the video that the formula is universal physics. The force applied to the anchor is different when moving. Has nothing to do with brands. Rhino Rack simply put the formula in writing. This is why I encourage using your logical judgement and common sense to think instead of taking brands words.
Great, informative video. Been looking into all of this as I'm about to grab a new rack. I believe the Front Runner rack only has one rating, for both on and off road? So that's the roof rating - the weight of the rack?
Very detailed Monique. Having a ute I depend on ARB tradies mount design that leverage on the tub and roll bar structure to mount the rack. That is way more assurance than on the roof. Great explanation, appreciate it.
I get ur point but I think Ronny was right he just took a way a third from the total load weight for normal driving to get the correct weight for off road loading rate
I lost track of everything you said after you put dem glasses on! lol Good thing I went back to re-watch everything. Much appreciated for the info as I'm waiting to pull the trigger on a rack!!!
Great research and information. BUT , you skimmed over and missed a very important part . Rivets can be very good in the right application, car roofs is not one of those applications as the metal in the roof is too thin and because of this the rivets used have to match so they don’t pull through the roof ( which once loaded is what’s happening. ) so an M 8 bolt is ten time stronger than the rivet that is ok for a car roof . The M8 nut that the manufacturer has as part of the roof is a lot stronger than a drill hole , of which the bolt solidly crews into Rather a hole for rivet to slide through . For car roofs that don’t have the nut / bolt application, the Front Runner system of pulling the ceiling lining out and putting in a steel bar to transfer the load over a bigger distance, with nut n bolt holding from both roof and ceiling is a guzziliion times stronger than the rivet system . Anyway bloody stay beautiful
Ya 100 series with this roof mount base is definitely a benefit! Guess that's the vehicle difference on those ones unfortunately don't have. I believe the reason for using certain fasteners is engineered but the installation process can make a huge difference. Maybe I have a trust issue, maybe my bad experiences with shops made me look at human error before an engineered product.
Not withstanding general calculations, I have to disagree with your comments regarding the strength of rivets (particularly the variety utilised for the Rhino rack). When not used en-masse, they have limited strength on their own especially when subjected to loads of a twisting nature or in shear. Their use in construction, bridges and aircraft is not a great comparison as the way they are used (in number, pattern and the materials being mated) is so different. Fixing a roof rack with a small number of rivets through a thin base metal is not a recipe for longevity if loads on the rack start to amplify movement over time, especially if the vehicle is subjected to the stresses of 4WD tracks. Love the channel though, cheers.
I agree. If you have to use a blind fastener, use a Rivnut. Blind rivets should never be used in a structural/load bearing application unless there is no other option( and you use a sealing/bonding compound).
I'm glad that you don't have a hording problem, if you did then you would need to tow a trailer around with you. All jokes aside, I wonder if the 'Kings' rooftop tent and roof rack are within vehicle OFF ROAD specifications. There are literally thousands out there here in Australia.
So if toyota says the roof holds x off road then you would subtract the rack weight from that rating. Which then tells you what you can load on the rack right? So offroad says roof can hold 100lbs, rack ways 50lbs, then you can only put 50lbs on the rack?
No, her explanation is more detailed with an engineer’s point of view with the stresses of driving off-road. There are a lot of variables that can be considered to get an exact weight limit. She did a good job at explaining that. Her calculations are good. The safety factor she used (2/3 ratio) is because for off-road driving, a lot more abuse is given to the roof rack. For your question, if your vehicle was sitting in the driveway or even just driving on a smooth surface, you would be safe with your calculation. I apologize if I added to the confusion of this topic. For example: My GX470 factory roof limit is 130lbs My roof rack is Victory 4x4 weight = 49lbs Victory 4x4 dynamic load limit = 250+ lbs (Stated in a Q&A on the website, also dynamic is load limit in motion) As you can see the rack can handle more than the vehicle’s roof. This does not mean I can load the roof to that much weight. The vehicle roof can only handle its own limit. In my case, Smooth surface driving: Roof limit - rack weight = remaining allowable weight to be added to rack. 130lbs - 49lbs = 81lbs remaining Off-Road Driving: Safety factor : 2/3 of roof rack rated dynamic load 250lbs x 2/3 = 166.67lbs This is the weight limit I should not exceed on the roof rack during heavy off-road driving. Notice that weight is still greater than my roof capacity, so therefore remember to not exceed the vehicles own roof weight limits. So for me since my rack capacity exceeds my vehicle roof capacity in either equation, I fall back to my original weight limit with the roof rack of 81lbs remaining. Each vehicle has different roof load capacities and ways that aftermarket roof racks attach. These variables can either increase or decrease the load limit allowed. Again I apologize if this just made it worse to understand.
So did they have to remove your roof lining and fasten your roof rack to your vehicle with rivets. On my Tacoma there are Toyota manufactured mounting points, on the roof of my truck. This is why my prince to rack is fastened into and it’s not fastened to the roof with rivets surely this must be better.
Wth? Rivets holding on a roof rack? For off roading? Why not just use 2 sided sticky tape? Remove the headliner and install it securely! Even just a swag and traction boards are going to push the max rating off road. Edit: good video! I like your channel. You seem like you would be fun to do a trip with!
I hear what you are saying , but the installation instructions come with the rack , and the warning are displayed prominently on those instructions , but recently I tried to find the info on Rhino website and it was hard to find using their own search engine. One thing I would note is that before one starts to look for a roof rack for a particular vehicle , one should check the manufacturers specifications, as they warranty the vehicle , not the likes of Rhino. That should be the bible regarding dynamic and static load ratings , not the roof rack manufacturer , installer or supplier. IMHO
Who would have thought that driving through roadworks where they are resurfacing the road is “Off Roading”? It never occurred to me that buying a roof rack could be so technical. Why am I thinking not fit for purpose.
To save any confusion about what you have said regarding on road / off-road, maybe actually provide a precise example. The inputs into the calculation and what you ended up doing.
Great video. I would go to the vehicle manufacturer to find the roof weight allowance. I wouldn’t trust a third party company telling me the rating for the roof. Does Toyota state the roof weight limit for the Prado at 120kg?
2 types of load ratings, static and in motion. They both have 2 different load ratings and weights can change massively. And if the rack provider, cannot show the actual weight loadings for your vehicle roof loading do not buy there racks.
Thank you very much for the clarification . But only Rhino Rack has the offroad factor of 1.5 . Frontrunner does not have that. In general they only are mentioning that the dynamic load is 1/3 of the static load. For example for the slimline Rack the static load is 300kg . 1/3 would then be 100 Kg, as well for offroading !!! of course the rack weight must be deducted from the 100Kg, but no offroad factor to be applied on the the Frontrunner..this a Rhino Rack specific calculation only. Means you can load more on the Frontrunner rack for off road. So I don't get it why your calc. results with less for the Frontrunner Rack:-) 🙏
No matter what rack as long as mounted on factory rated rail, it should go with factory rating allowance. Unless custom mounted & bypass factory mounting points. Brands can claim whatever but from physics perspective when you are moving up&down&right&left&forward&backwards, you are introducing new forces other than the 1G of gravity. Hence the rack and its mounting points aren't only fighting gravity from the load above but also other complications. This industry standard is not trademarked or invented by Rhino. Simply a "general guideline" in the industry. Rhino was possibly the only one listing it out for people to know had they read the instructions. Other brands only listed "use good judgement" "common sense" which is less clear.
i'd never have a roof home. It takes me 2 minutes to set up my tent which weighs less than 3 lbs. and cost A LOT less. talk about more space and money for Beer!! ;)
I have 3lb light weight tent for backpacking as well, I Also bought a roof top tent to go over landing. Two completely different things and can not really be compared.
Hey, how did you get your land cruiser to Fraser island!?🤔 Honestly confused.. it's the same vehicle innit? And isn't it right side driving in ausi??🤷🏻
@@kavinda1878 Guess it does confuse some people haha. Check out my channel intro video: th-cam.com/video/RHFF4zx35MQ/w-d-xo.html explains a lot of things
I'm a bit confused about calculating the final cargo rating. Do we (A) Use the vehicle load rating minus the roof rack weight first before dividing by 1.5 or do we (B) Vehicle load rating divide by 1.5 then minus the roof rack weight. In your video you are doing (A). In Ronny's video, he is doing (B). In Tyler's comment to Ronny, he seems to be doing (A) but in his very own video he seems to show (B) at time stamp 9:11 th-cam.com/video/eMx232haRyo/w-d-xo.html
@@OverlandLady - 👍. I was actually asking for myself because I want to do what you do, but I'm just not sure what's the best way for me when I'm ready -- A small trailer, or a tent and roof rack. Thanks for your reply O'Lady. Great videos.
Sorry Monique, but I think you’ve got something wrong here too. It’s only Rhino Rack that has the 2/3rds off road rating. I think you’ll find Frontrunner doesn’t have this because of the way they are bolted to/through the roof. So Ronnie and Tyler’s changes were justified
Hi, It appears Rhino Rack has updated their website and where you specified at @16:19 which used to show the load rating in number, now it just appears as a load calculator you have to nut out the number yourself. I have a 150 Prado and unfortunately for me there is no mention of my Prado's roof load rating in my user manual. toyotamanuals.com.au/document/landing_page/landcruiser-prado-150-series-owners-manual-oct-12-aug-13 When I ring my local Toyota service center they also have no idea what it is (or too scare to confirm)
Yes in my video i mentioned that for earlier model vehicle they put a chart, which i am lucky for. For newer vehicles they put the calculations on the same spot where mine had a chart. So again you can’t miss it.
Andy Lo, Page 296 of the manual posted in the link . "Do not exceed 80 kg (176 lb.) cargo weight on the roof luggage carrier." "If driving for a long distance, on rough roads, or at high speeds, stop the vehicle now and then during the trip to make sure the cargo remains in its place."
c'mon! 10kg is BIG difference!! On a person is life-changing (at least wardrobe-changing) and also it is in gear. It can impact the amount of liquids; the level of comfort extra bedding; food; etc..
No idea?? Pmsl, clearly you don’t go 4x4 and see these two guys path the way to make our lives easier in the camping/4x4 world and if Australia isn’t the founders of one of the best 4x4 gear on the planet, Rhino rack, ARB, oztent, redarc, patriot campers need I say more?
@@richardghalayini2666both ronny and tyler said it them sevles that they had no idea pmsl. Clearly you don't go 4wdriving. I'm well aware of the the gear that's available in Australia I live in the VHC mate and I'm out on the tracks every weekend. So get off your high horse and I would've added drifta to that list need I say more?
@overlandlady touche` I have spent a sufficient amount of time and effort to make sure my system will support the live load of my components. Truck cap can support 600lb Thule aero rails 400lb Truck can support 1300b Air bags can support 2500lb Roof top hard shell tent 180lb Me 230lb In-bed rollout bed tray 60lb All gear in the back of the truck 400lb
@@OverlandLady I have watched over a hundred videos about overland exploring and all the ways to outfit a vehicle. I want to personally thank you for covering the topic of weight. NO ONE has done so in any of the videos. I was very surprised to see that you were able to reference one! Keep up the great work you are doing. Your videos are getting me through these dull days of waiting and building. Would love to bend your ear sometime about more specific build questions...
@@GoogleToobUser GVM is quite strictly enforced in Australia so i guess that's where my awareness comes from. You can also feel it in handling too once loaded/overloaded/unevenly loaded.. It's simple physics I had through everyone should at least be aware of it...
@@OverlandLady absolutely! I am still working out suspension and tire size concerns... There are lots of parts that contribute to the overall handling of the vehicle. I have been told a few different technical by different experts. As a mechanical engineer, I am fairly confident that there are NOT so many correct configurations. So, you can imagine, I am putting a lot of thought into every aspect of my build. I will be living in it indefinitely and it HAS TO BE rock solid reliable. I will be documenting everything about the build and why I chose one thing over the other options/scenarios. I really appreciate you taking the time to respond to me. I am honored to have your attention given your adventures! Thank you. Be well! Looking forward to your next post.
Yes good maths. I think you find that front runner will match the on road rating with the off road rating. Hence they will match the 75kg - the eight of the racks.
There is no difference in dynamic rating on or offroad with the front runner system because it bolts through the roof and into the vehicle structual members.. sorry to disappoint you.. it is also too late to see the numbers the system is rated on and offroad in documentation after you have purchased a systemthatturns out to be not fit for purpose.. I own a rhino rack pioneer system here in australia and I cant wait to get it off my vehicle..
wow, one of the clearest and most informative videos, it would be useful if you could add some information also on the correct weight distribution and also on some types of objects that are loaded incorrectly, for example petrol or water that when the tanks are no longer full they act as if they were "live animals" kicking... I'm afraid too and dont trust anyone, so mi safe limits it is 50% :D
Good vid, just a heads up if you go front runner keep receipts or you will not get any warranty. I no first hand on this, so I’m now going to go with a new arb roof rack plus the info they give you is the of road load plus the roof on my car can take about 100kg.
The problem is not with the rack or the brand it’s the fitting U JUST CANT FITT A RACK WITH RIVETS to the roof first it’s impossible to hold the weight off road and it will cause permanent damage to the roof after drilling it and ur manufacture warranty is out of the window
The roof need to be drilled regardless in their application, not mine. I believe certain fasteners choice and designs are engineered based on ISO 11154 for crash test and such. With intended use within limits. Many things could contributed to the failure in Tyler’s case, potentially an oval hole or missing washer that started the rattle/play and in combination with overload. When products are engineered i look for fault from install first.
This whole kerfuffle has now made me confused about roof systems completely now. Basically, it would be impossible to mount a rooftop tent on essentially all vehicles. An I Kamper, for example, weighs 160 pounds/ 73 kg. Can someone explain to me then how this can be mounted correctly and how so many Overlanders have rooftop tents without issue. Including 1000s who drive Tacomas? What roof can actually hold the weight of a rooftop tent alone, much less the weight of the rack itself and other accessories?
This comes to choosing the right vehicle for the right purpose. And in my description i mentioned the numbers are just benchmarks for reference. 1kg over doesnt mean u are done. For a truck/ute, the tub rack / bed rack usually can hold way more than cab roof rack. And jeep wrangler’s backbone system bypass factory roof load allowance.
@@OverlandLady it seems to me there aren't many roofs that could actually support a tent. At a weight minimum of around 75 pounds without the rack, I can't imagine many trucks can support that weight. Which probably explains why so many trucks use the bed rack system instead. Maybe the category name should be changed to bed tents 🤣. I was convinced I was going to get a RTT on my Tacoma, now I'm questioning it.
@@TH-camBinging You're right. There aren't. Roof load limits are getting lower and lower. RTT tents can be put on many truck racks (like Yakima and Thule), and some reinforced truck toppers. But if you put an iKamper on your Subaru (or whatever) the roof isn't going to handle it. The name "Roof Top Tent" is a bit of a misgnomer at this point. If determined to go that route, Go Fast Campers have an RTT that's 40kg called the Ultra Lite. That's the lightest RTT on the market. But that, plus your body weight and that of your partner (if you have one) are still going to exceed the roof limits on most cars/trucks.
Here's one Americans opinion...anyone who puts that much weight on the highest part of an offroad vehicle...is an idiot..first you increase your chances offroad for a rollover...second same for on road but at significantly higher speeds with a lot more unpredictable idiots on the road too...third is the wind resistance on a lifted vehicle....add all three and you're dead...forth you increase you chances of fall when climbing the steps and breaking your neck...but that's just my opinion...
So what. Rhino’s responsibility goes WAY beyond putting some hard-to-find information on a document. Spend a moment, for instance, on the imagery Rhino uses in their advertising, respectfully, I am not buying your argument.
Im just speaking from experience in response to people saying the information is hidden. - not so hidden to me while it’s the first thing i noticed. More so an educational material for people to pay attention to load and proper usage. Not a defence for certain brand.
It is an industry-standard based on engineering. On and Off road are not going to be the same load because of the different forces introduced to the system rather than just 1G (gravity). If you watched till 22:57 Front Runny claimed offroad to be 1/3 of static which is also confusing...
@@OverlandLady Hey, yes just finished the video. I can understand what your saying but I think the main issue is the warranty not given for the overloading of the Off Road Rating. I was very curious as I couldn't see it stated by Front runner, only the suggestion you found. I just spoke to Kevin Schultz from Front runner and he stated that they can't give an off road load rating as the conditions of this varies. So what I believe front runner is saying, they back their product beyond the vehicle manufactures maximum roof load rating. So if there was a warranty issue it wouldn't be a problem. I would assume this is why Ronny and Tyler have moved to a Front runner rack. Love your channel from here in Aus
@@tallan4151 I was mostly surprised how they found this information difficult while I'm here like,,,, this is the first thing I saw after opening the box! Guess I'm overly cautious and rather not to have issue happen where I need to deal with warranty or any repair since those are time lost on the road. Honestly speaking I do no have much experience in regards to warranty cuz I don't break em enough...
@@OverlandLady I can’t comment on the leaflet that comes with the racks unfortunately, I haven’t been stung with all this load rating business Iv heard a lot have tho. I earlier was referring to Front Runner and their Load Ratings. Keep being cautious it’s the way to be,less to worry about then 👍🏻
You keep missing the point, again. 😔 IF It was so easy to find and calculate these load raitings, then nobody would be complaining about it. Too much room for human error. The fact is, Rhino rack could make it a lot easier if they gave a shit. 1. Rhino really HAVE made it too difficult to find those load ratings, mainly when you're trying to choose a roof rack. It's usually too late once it's unboxed, then you read the install manual and find the load rating isn't what you require. 🤭 2. The rivets used on these Rhino track mounts are NOT suitable for any serious offroad use, and they're certainly not stronger than using a nut and bolt system. Failure on their rivets are common here is Aus. Even happend to me, yes the rivets were installed correctly, and no it wasn't overloaded. Rhino didn't want to know me so I ended up repairing it myself using a combination of stronger rivets a nuts/ bolts. It has not failed since. 😉
Your comments were really really well researched and put out very humbly. I have a 105 and a rhino platform rack, am completely happy with how it is mounted and the fact that I can carry 50 kilograms of weight. And I should add that anyone contemplating loading more on their roof rack needs to really consider how many pieces of equipment you really need to take. A family group may need to consider towing a trailer but I’m not an expert in any way
I'm watching everything in reverse - first this video, then Ronny Dahl, and finally Tyler Thompson. It's like time is flowing backwards haha. Edit: Hey Monique, you can even call out Andrew St. Pierre White at 4xoverland because he's eating his words too now. A couple of years ago he uploaded a video where he described Rhino Rack as being somewhat better engineered than Front Runner. Edit 2: I have a Front Runner rack with 2 items affixed - one ARB awning and one Alu Cab privacy enclosure which both add up to about 20 kilograms.
Not trying to "call out" anyone in terms of eating their words. Just simply describing how I was a bit in shock people don't see or find it hard to dig out the calculation, while here I'm like you should know it by the time of install already, if not earlier if done your research. But then again, my rack's mouting method is different than their truck/ute cab mounting so it'll ease off people's worry of me overloading.
I absolutely hate my Rhino Pioneer rack and the fact that the boards run along the length of the vehicle. It’s 100 times more flexible to have them go across, like on the Frontrunner. I’m most likely going to build my own rack with 80/20 profiles and sell the Rhino rack. Unless you have drop-in slugs for the Rhino rack, you have to plan out in great detail how you’re going to lay out your stuff, and you’re forced to take stuff off to get other mounting slugs into the track. A completely idiotic and ridiculously overpriced system. Not to mention how expensive all the gadgets for it is.
Sorry, but you say it was not hard to find, but it was not disclosed on the top level marketing spec sheet (and it it should be). Instead it is buried in installation documents. Clearly it is not sufficiently disclosed if very experienced off roaders did not know about it (unless you are suggesting they are lying or stupid). You throw around accusations of negligence a lot but really gloss over this manufacturer not disclosing this "industry wide rule" in the marketing specs you showed in the video.
Perhaps being relatevely green in the field provides one good thing: the humbleness to learn everything and not assume information.. I figured it's not hard to find becasue I came across it when I read the instruction. given I needed to read the instruction - newbie. Guess it's a perk to be a beginner.
You are way off. Front runner has no offroad load rating. Where you said there isnt much difference between the two is garbage. The front runner is rated to 300kgs all day long on or off road..... how ever the manufactuers load rating determines what can be up there. Not sure why you bothered to show the calculations for the rhino compared to the front runner. Also the instructions you talk bout, kind of pointless reading the numbers AFTER one springs cash for the roof rack... should be up front and out there in the store or online so the buyerr can determine if they want to spend the money in the first place.....
Easy to do when for a Prado 150, the load ratings in the printed catalogue are different to the information in the rack packaging which is different from the fitting pages formula. For my vehicle the difference between what was published for offroad on the sale brochure and the fitting page formula is 51kgs. The load rating for on road carrying capacity is 60kgs higher in the sales brochure than the car mfg's limit.
To tell you the truth - I was binge watching your videos (the are very well made, they are entertainig, nice to watch escapism) but i gradually started geting strange vibes that a marketing team is behind everything. I get that nowadays to finanace adventures you have to have sponsors, etc etc. Some content creators do better some do worse in trying to incorporate paid segments into their videos but still retain "independent" balanced outlook on products. But This video is just staight up unapologetic marketing department talk. I sadly lost all suspenction of disbelief for further adventures :(
Full disclaimer i do not have any brand pay me. Would be nice to tho lol. The idea of making this video totally come from myself. Rhino rack is not involved at all. Im just purely very struk by the fact that no one read instructions and the simply physics of force diffence between static and moving are not common sense... i do not represent rhino rack in this in any way. Just my own opinion.
This whole "call out" thing was completely unnecessary, all of the relevant points could have been made without it. "The video is not about calling people out, or telling them they are doing something wrong" yet that's what you made this whole video about.
This video was a public response to all the messages I got asking about my rack. No it's not rivets and its sturdy as hell. I recently had a roll over and the rack saved me you could say.
Pretty good video generally, only just found it... Sorry for the long post, but it does need it. As a person who does overland preparation as well as trips, these stories are horrifying me, Pop rivets should never, never, never (did I make that clear?) be used to fix a rack to a vehicle! Bolt to the factory fittings with suitable bolts or clamps to the gutter rail depending on the type of build form your vehicle has. Pop rivets are litterally designed to hold sheets of metal together where there is no load bearing capability. As for roof weight, keep it as low as possible as you want low CoG on your vehicle, so preferably, don't fit a rack at all. Roof load ratings, the thing here is choose the vehicle and more importantly the products wisely! Personally I recommend avoiding anything that has an on and off road weight, stick with products that have one weight rating or take the off road weight as total - it's the little things like that extra 1/3rd weight that you'll forget when you hit a trail. It is worth noting that in Europe especially, things changed in 1998 and suddenly we were allowed more rack weight. The Land Rover Defender went form 75kg to 150kg, nothing changed in the vehicle though! Slowly going through your videos, so might throw a few more comments up. :-D Stay safe and if you're ever in this part of the world, say hi!
Tyler Thompson's video: th-cam.com/video/eMx232haRyo/w-d-xo.html
Ronny Dahl's video: th-cam.com/video/r32xd9z4SZ4/w-d-xo.html
Also L2FSBC (robert pepper) has a lot of info about this as well as off road driving and recoverys winching technics.
Very informative video, but I think that the biggest issue that Tyler and Ronny had is what the rivets were attached to. As mentioned in the case of Tyler and by Ronny, the rivets were attached to the metal skin of the roof of the vehicle which is actually really thin and just ripped apart like a sardine can under load.
This is another video that is important from someone with experience with them. th-cam.com/video/-JmNPBKIyVE/w-d-xo.html
Love that you’re adding the safety angle to an area that isn’t discussed much. Thanks for the detailed perspective!
Your math is solid. I'm not trying to stir anything up, but I posted it in Ronny's video comments. If he notices them and it checks out positively, I'll point him over here. You did the math, you deserve the cred; I just didn't want to volunteer you for an internet drama fest. Never know how these things are going to roll out. I wonder if he'll see my comment. In any case, thanks for the video. I like your content.
Thank you. To be fair Tyler originally did the math correctly so I was just confused what went off in the process till him calculating his own
Great Video, You are the first person that preaches vehicle load safety. With all the accessories people add to there vehicles most do not consider this issue.
Thanks for bringing this issue to light in the recent explosion of overlanding . Could only imagine hitting the brakes and having the entire rack and all its gear shoot off like a bobsled.
Thanks for keeping it safe
Overland Lady 😁✌
It wont just all a sudden happen. Like mentioned, there’s going to start having a bit of play and over time that bit of movement can do big damage and even make the roof completely fly off.
Rivets are not stronger when compared to bolts. They are used for the reasons you state, good for blind areas, they make manufacturing easier etc. I know in the automotive industry, anything that uses a rivet for load/structure components alsorequires a bonding agent. Bolts/nuts/washers are far better than rivets.
I've got a Frontrunner Slimline II for my 4Runner. Great brand and the customer service has been outstanding. No crazy lead times and plenty of accessories.
Great video! I've noticed here in North America people don't usually consider weight, and proper function/performance first..
weight in the vehicle, weight on the vehicle and weight on top of the vehicle, also aerodynamics (to a point), suspension height, tire size and spacing... in a nutshell form over function can lead to safety issues. Research, research, research!
Not just North America. World wide over loading and weight distribution is rarely considered. Then throw in weight/mad in motion. 🤯.
Thank you for presenting this valuable information, Monique. I own a '19 GMC Savana 2500 cargo van and will be traveling and living in it for however long it takes me to visit all 48 lower states, Canada and Alaska. I ordered the "common" roof rack you see on most white work vans. I was going to mount an Arksen cargo basket on top of it, either 64" or 84" but I was hesitant to complete the project as I don't want the set up falling off my roof and possibly causing a serious accident on the highway. I had planned to carry extra fuel, a 20 pound bottle of propane and a Sea Eagle inflatable raft on the roof. After hearing the horror stories about roof racks I've decided to let the "experts" mount and secure one for me.
It was my understanding that Frontrunner do not have a reduction for offroad, due to their bolt through support plate mounting system, as opposed to the Rhino rivet through sheet metal version.
Rivets don’t apply to my vehicle
That’s my understanding as well. That’s the difference between Rhino and Frontrunner.
I think you may forgetting that at the time Rohnny and everyone else bought the rack, static and dynamic weight were listed solidly on the website. Since then, they added a calculator and etc, adjusting your thoughts/intentions of your build. I think you mentioned this, but I used to follow this site a lot. They've slowly changed/adjusted their site, along with install instructions throughout the years.
I commend you in bringing this information to the overlanding/off road community. If some one sees this and takes a second look at there rack & gear maybe it will save there lives. I have much respect for you. ✌
Please do not diminish yourself , you make complete sense . Thank you.
Well done for raising awareness.
The real crunch is the rack sells for $1800 in Australia plus shipping and fitting and the 30 kilogram off road weight has to be evenly distributed over the rack, that's easy if you can spread it out my 17inch alloy rim and BFG KO2 weight 34 KG so that's out $2500 for a spot to mount an awning and a couple of max tracks its an expensive and costly on fuel consumption as well
Got the crestone (from sherpa equipment) on my 4runner and loving it! Top notch quality, thicker aluminum material v.s prinsu. Wind noise is minimal to none (oem without a roofrack)
Very impressive & informative. Stay safe out there. Thank you.
Also the lower your platform is to your roof and the more feet you have the better. Lot of pressure placed onto platforms when going off road and Rhino and many others have it wrong.
You were right to call the mistakes out. However, off road is almost impossible to calculate. So many variables, speed, terrain, weather, weight distribution (all weight). Vehicle-Model Specific calculation. Repeat - Vehicle-Model Specific calculation.
Static at rest. Why tents with bodies are heavy but at static with tent weight will usually be 3x weight.
Also, check your mounts periodically they will work loose and you can keep an eye on your set up. You don’t need all that stuff.
This is great! Can’t believe how many people don’t read. Had this info when I installed my rhino 3 years ago. Sad how many people just jump on the bandwagon blaming rhino.
Great video. This is something that has frustrated me for awhile. Most of the bed-rack's I want for a future Gladiator don't even tell you the weights they can carry. Or, if they do, they only give you one weight limit. We need Static, Dynamic and then we also need Static and Dynamic Off-road limits... but most manufacturers won't tell us.
You used the same formula for Frontrunner racks as you did for the Rhino racks. But Front runner do not use that formula. They state that their racks have a specific static load rating and a dynamic load rating, regardless of whether you are on or off-road. So whilst a Rhino rack has a load rating of 30-35kg a Front runner has a load rating of 150kg dynamic load, which means you can use the entire 75kg weight limit of your cars roof (minus the weight of the rack/basket).
It’s explained in the video that the formula is universal physics. The force applied to the anchor is different when moving. Has nothing to do with brands. Rhino Rack simply put the formula in writing. This is why I encourage using your logical judgement and common sense to think instead of taking brands words.
Great, informative video. Been looking into all of this as I'm about to grab a new rack.
I believe the Front Runner rack only has one rating, for both on and off road? So that's the roof rating - the weight of the rack?
Very detailed Monique. Having a ute I depend on ARB tradies mount design that leverage on the tub and roll bar structure to mount the rack. That is way more assurance than on the roof. Great explanation, appreciate it.
Ya having a tub to mount on is so nice. Im curious to see all the quick release system on the arb rack!
I get ur point but I think Ronny was right he just took a way a third from the total load weight for normal driving to get the correct weight for off road loading rate
You minus the roof weight first and then taken out a third. He did the two steps reversed which gives you a lower number.
I lost track of everything you said after you put dem glasses on! lol Good thing I went back to re-watch everything. Much appreciated for the info as I'm waiting to pull the trigger on a rack!!!
Great research and information. BUT , you skimmed over and missed a very important part . Rivets can be very good in the right application, car roofs is not one of those applications as the metal in the roof is too thin and because of this the rivets used have to match so they don’t pull through the roof ( which once loaded is what’s happening. ) so an M 8 bolt is ten time stronger than the rivet that is ok for a car roof . The M8 nut that the manufacturer has as part of the roof is a lot stronger than a drill hole , of which the bolt solidly crews into Rather a hole for rivet to slide through . For car roofs that don’t have the nut / bolt application, the Front Runner system of pulling the ceiling lining out and putting in a steel bar to transfer the load over a bigger distance, with nut n bolt holding from both roof and ceiling is a guzziliion times stronger than the rivet system . Anyway bloody stay beautiful
Ya 100 series with this roof mount base is definitely a benefit! Guess that's the vehicle difference on those ones unfortunately don't have. I believe the reason for using certain fasteners is engineered but the installation process can make a huge difference. Maybe I have a trust issue, maybe my bad experiences with shops made me look at human error before an engineered product.
@@OverlandLady or maybe your just smart and should give yourself some credit
Not withstanding general calculations, I have to disagree with your comments regarding the strength of rivets (particularly the variety utilised for the Rhino rack). When not used en-masse, they have limited strength on their own especially when subjected to loads of a twisting nature or in shear. Their use in construction, bridges and aircraft is not a great comparison as the way they are used (in number, pattern and the materials being mated) is so different. Fixing a roof rack with a small number of rivets through a thin base metal is not a recipe for longevity if loads on the rack start to amplify movement over time, especially if the vehicle is subjected to the stresses of 4WD tracks. Love the channel though, cheers.
I agree. If you have to use a blind fastener, use a Rivnut. Blind rivets should never be used in a structural/load bearing application unless there is no other option( and you use a sealing/bonding compound).
I'm glad that you don't have a hording problem, if you did then you would need to tow a trailer around with you.
All jokes aside, I wonder if the 'Kings' rooftop tent and roof rack are within vehicle OFF ROAD specifications. There are literally thousands out there here in Australia.
Steel rack itself already weights a ton......
Very informative video! Now I need to take a better look at my vehicle weight. Keep up the good work. :)
So if toyota says the roof holds x off road then you would subtract the rack weight from that rating. Which then tells you what you can load on the rack right? So offroad says roof can hold 100lbs, rack ways 50lbs, then you can only put 50lbs on the rack?
On my chart the offroad load is already the final number with the specific rack system i have. They have done the calculations.
@@OverlandLady They?
The simple answer to your question is, yes.
@@shaggycharlie77 so she is wrong?
No, her explanation is more detailed with an engineer’s point of view with the stresses of driving off-road. There are a lot of variables that can be considered to get an exact weight limit. She did a good job at explaining that. Her calculations are good. The safety factor she used (2/3 ratio) is because for off-road driving, a lot more abuse is given to the roof rack.
For your question, if your vehicle was sitting in the driveway or even just driving on a smooth surface, you would be safe with your calculation.
I apologize if I added to the confusion of this topic.
For example:
My GX470 factory roof limit is 130lbs
My roof rack is Victory 4x4 weight = 49lbs
Victory 4x4 dynamic load limit = 250+ lbs
(Stated in a Q&A on the website, also dynamic is load limit in motion)
As you can see the rack can handle more than the vehicle’s roof. This does not mean I can load the roof to that much weight. The vehicle roof can only handle its own limit.
In my case,
Smooth surface driving:
Roof limit - rack weight = remaining allowable weight to be added to rack.
130lbs - 49lbs = 81lbs remaining
Off-Road Driving:
Safety factor : 2/3 of roof rack rated dynamic load
250lbs x 2/3 = 166.67lbs
This is the weight limit I should not exceed on the roof rack during heavy off-road driving. Notice that weight is still greater than my roof capacity, so therefore remember to not exceed the vehicles own roof weight limits.
So for me since my rack capacity exceeds my vehicle roof capacity in either equation, I fall back to my original weight limit with the roof rack of 81lbs remaining.
Each vehicle has different roof load capacities and ways that aftermarket roof racks attach. These variables can either increase or decrease the load limit allowed.
Again I apologize if this just made it worse to understand.
So did they have to remove your roof lining and fasten your roof rack to your vehicle with rivets. On my Tacoma there are Toyota manufactured mounting points, on the roof of my truck. This is why my prince to rack is fastened into and it’s not fastened to the roof with rivets surely this must be better.
no rivets for me either. Bolted onto factory mounting holes.
Wth? Rivets holding on a roof rack? For off roading? Why not just use 2 sided sticky tape? Remove the headliner and install it securely! Even just a swag and traction boards are going to push the max rating off road.
Edit: good video! I like your channel. You seem like you would be fun to do a trip with!
I hear what you are saying , but the installation instructions come with the rack , and the warning are displayed prominently on those instructions , but recently I tried to find the info on Rhino website and it was hard to find using their own search engine. One thing I would note is that before one starts to look for a roof rack for a particular vehicle , one should check the manufacturers specifications, as they warranty the vehicle , not the likes of Rhino. That should be the bible regarding dynamic and static load ratings , not the roof rack manufacturer , installer or supplier. IMHO
Who would have thought that driving through roadworks where they are resurfacing the road is “Off Roading”? It never occurred to me that buying a roof rack could be so technical. Why am I thinking not fit for purpose.
To save any confusion about what you have said regarding on road / off-road, maybe actually provide a precise example. The inputs into the calculation and what you ended up doing.
Very well explained great video
This is a great video about roof rack. Thanks.
Great detailed video. The teacher vibe makes me want to call you Mrs. Lady.
Well done Overland Lady.
Miss! Not Mrs. 😁
Great video. I would go to the vehicle manufacturer to find the roof weight allowance. I wouldn’t trust a third party company telling me the rating for the roof. Does Toyota state the roof weight limit for the Prado at 120kg?
Cant remember the exact number but Prado i believe has a lower rating than Landcruiser
If you still have the user manual, it will tell you in there. I have a 2004 Lexus GX470 (Prado) and it is rated for 130lbs/59Kg roof capacity.
2 types of load ratings, static and in motion. They both have 2 different load ratings and weights can change massively.
And if the rack provider, cannot show the actual weight loadings for your vehicle roof loading do not buy there racks.
Thank you very much for the clarification . But only Rhino Rack has the offroad factor of 1.5 . Frontrunner does not have that. In general they only are mentioning that the dynamic load is 1/3 of the static load. For example for the slimline Rack the static load is 300kg . 1/3 would then be 100 Kg, as well for offroading !!! of course the rack weight must be deducted from the 100Kg, but no offroad factor to be applied on the the Frontrunner..this a Rhino Rack specific calculation only. Means you can load more on the Frontrunner rack for off road. So I don't get it why your calc. results with less for the Frontrunner Rack:-) 🙏
No matter what rack as long as mounted on factory rated rail, it should go with factory rating allowance. Unless custom mounted & bypass factory mounting points. Brands can claim whatever but from physics perspective when you are moving up&down&right&left&forward&backwards, you are introducing new forces other than the 1G of gravity. Hence the rack and its mounting points aren't only fighting gravity from the load above but also other complications. This industry standard is not trademarked or invented by Rhino. Simply a "general guideline" in the industry. Rhino was possibly the only one listing it out for people to know had they read the instructions. Other brands only listed "use good judgement" "common sense" which is less clear.
@@OverlandLady 👍 right...I agree:-)
i'd never have a roof home. It takes me 2 minutes to set up my tent which weighs less than 3 lbs. and cost A LOT less. talk about more space and money for Beer!! ;)
Wow what tent is that?
@@OverlandLady REI Co-Op Quarter Dome, 1 person.
I have 3lb light weight tent for backpacking as well, I Also bought a roof top tent to go over landing. Two completely different things and can not really be compared.
@@Outwest483 Good for you. Everyone has different needs. I’m all about simplicity and time. So I really have no need for all the extras.
John Cadogan has also made a video regarding these issues. Well worth a watch. Thanks for your video , good content as usual.
good info. Thank you for doing the research and sharing!
Hey, how did you get your land cruiser to Fraser island!?🤔 Honestly confused.. it's the same vehicle innit? And isn't it right side driving in ausi??🤷🏻
By Barge just like everyone else. I brought him back to Canada.
@@OverlandLady all the way from Ausi!?? How long did it take 😲😲😲 would have been a amazing though
@@OverlandLady btw what about the left hand right hand driving issue!?
@@kavinda1878 Canada already have lot of RHD import. as long as 15 year old you can import them. drive as is no conversion needed.
@@kavinda1878 Guess it does confuse some people haha. Check out my channel intro video: th-cam.com/video/RHFF4zx35MQ/w-d-xo.html explains a lot of things
I'm a bit confused about calculating the final cargo rating. Do we (A) Use the vehicle load rating minus the roof rack weight first before dividing by 1.5 or do we (B) Vehicle load rating divide by 1.5 then minus the roof rack weight. In your video you are doing (A). In Ronny's video, he is doing (B). In Tyler's comment to Ronny, he seems to be doing (A) but in his very own video he seems to show (B) at time stamp 9:11 th-cam.com/video/eMx232haRyo/w-d-xo.html
A is the equation on the manual
Wouldn't it just be easier to tow a small camper/RV like an Aliner, that has all you need?
Yep would be ideal
@@OverlandLady - 👍. I was actually asking for myself because I want to do what you do, but I'm just not sure what's the best way for me when I'm ready -- A small trailer, or a tent and roof rack.
Thanks for your reply O'Lady. Great videos.
Trailer definitely gives you more space but can be slightly limiting in terms of terrain.. and driving with a trailer is a whole other skillset
Sorry Monique, but I think you’ve got something wrong here too. It’s only Rhino Rack that has the 2/3rds off road rating. I think you’ll find Frontrunner doesn’t have this because of the way they are bolted to/through the roof. So Ronnie and Tyler’s changes were justified
Thank You!
Hi,
It appears Rhino Rack has updated their website and where you specified at @16:19 which used to show the load rating in number, now it just appears as a load calculator you have to nut out the number yourself.
I have a 150 Prado and unfortunately for me there is no mention of my Prado's roof load rating in my user manual.
toyotamanuals.com.au/document/landing_page/landcruiser-prado-150-series-owners-manual-oct-12-aug-13
When I ring my local Toyota service center they also have no idea what it is (or too scare to confirm)
Yes in my video i mentioned that for earlier model vehicle they put a chart, which i am lucky for. For newer vehicles they put the calculations on the same spot where mine had a chart. So again you can’t miss it.
Andy Lo, Page 296 of the manual posted in the link .
"Do not exceed 80 kg (176 lb.) cargo weight on the roof luggage carrier."
"If driving for a long distance, on rough roads, or at high speeds, stop the vehicle now and then during the trip to make sure the cargo remains in its place."
c'mon! 10kg is BIG difference!! On a person is life-changing (at least wardrobe-changing) and also it is in gear. It can impact the amount of liquids; the level of comfort extra bedding; food; etc..
Its good you shouted out Tyler and ronny . Both those guys had no idea aswell but now have spread the word
No idea?? Pmsl, clearly you don’t go 4x4 and see these two guys path the way to make our lives easier in the camping/4x4 world and if Australia isn’t the founders of one of the best 4x4 gear on the planet, Rhino rack, ARB, oztent, redarc, patriot campers need I say more?
@@richardghalayini2666both ronny and tyler said it them sevles that they had no idea pmsl. Clearly you don't go 4wdriving. I'm well aware of the the gear that's available in Australia I live in the VHC mate and I'm out on the tracks every weekend. So get off your high horse and I would've added drifta to that list need I say more?
THANK YOU
@overlandlady touche`
I have spent a sufficient amount of time and effort to make sure my system will support the live load of my components.
Truck cap can support 600lb
Thule aero rails 400lb
Truck can support 1300b
Air bags can support 2500lb
Roof top hard shell tent 180lb
Me 230lb
In-bed rollout bed tray 60lb
All gear in the back of the truck 400lb
Nice!!! we all need to learn from you
@@OverlandLady I have watched over a hundred videos about overland exploring and all the ways to outfit a vehicle. I want to personally thank you for covering the topic of weight. NO ONE has done so in any of the videos. I was very surprised to see that you were able to reference one!
Keep up the great work you are doing. Your videos are getting me through these dull days of waiting and building. Would love to bend your ear sometime about more specific build questions...
@@GoogleToobUser GVM is quite strictly enforced in Australia so i guess that's where my awareness comes from. You can also feel it in handling too once loaded/overloaded/unevenly loaded.. It's simple physics I had through everyone should at least be aware of it...
@@OverlandLady absolutely! I am still working out suspension and tire size concerns... There are lots of parts that contribute to the overall handling of the vehicle. I have been told a few different technical by different experts. As a mechanical engineer, I am fairly confident that there are NOT so many correct configurations. So, you can imagine, I am putting a lot of thought into every aspect of my build. I will be living in it indefinitely and it HAS TO BE rock solid reliable. I will be documenting everything about the build and why I chose one thing over the other options/scenarios.
I really appreciate you taking the time to respond to me. I am honored to have your attention given your adventures! Thank you.
Be well! Looking forward to your next post.
@Overland Lady, I meant to ask you, what system do you use/prefer for satellite internet and comms?
Great video, very smart and detailed! Thank you!
Yes good maths.
I think you find that front runner will match the on road rating with the off road rating.
Hence they will match the 75kg - the eight of the racks.
Is 4wding not about getting it all wrong? If not drive only on paved roads.
There is no difference in dynamic rating on or offroad with the front runner system because it bolts through the roof and into the vehicle structual members.. sorry to disappoint you.. it is also too late to see the numbers the system is rated on and offroad in documentation after you have purchased a systemthatturns out to be not fit for purpose.. I own a rhino rack pioneer system here in australia and I cant wait to get it off my vehicle..
wow, one of the clearest and most informative videos, it would be useful if you could add some information also on the correct weight distribution and also on some types of objects that are loaded incorrectly, for example petrol or water that when the tanks are no longer full they act as if they were "live animals" kicking... I'm afraid too and dont trust anyone, so mi safe limits it is 50% :D
Good vid, just a heads up if you go front runner keep receipts or you will not get any warranty. I no first hand on this, so I’m now going to go with a new arb roof rack plus the info they give you is the of road load plus the roof on my car can take about 100kg.
i may have a hoarding issue haha I keep everything
The problem is not with the rack or the brand it’s the fitting U JUST CANT FITT A RACK WITH RIVETS to the roof first it’s impossible to hold the weight off road and it will cause permanent damage to the roof after drilling it and ur manufacture warranty is out of the window
The roof need to be drilled regardless in their application, not mine. I believe certain fasteners choice and designs are engineered based on ISO 11154 for crash test and such. With intended use within limits. Many things could contributed to the failure in Tyler’s case, potentially an oval hole or missing washer that started the rattle/play and in combination with overload. When products are engineered i look for fault from install first.
This whole kerfuffle has now made me confused about roof systems completely now. Basically, it would be impossible to mount a rooftop tent on essentially all vehicles. An I Kamper, for example, weighs 160 pounds/ 73 kg. Can someone explain to me then how this can be mounted correctly and how so many Overlanders have rooftop tents without issue. Including 1000s who drive Tacomas? What roof can actually hold the weight of a rooftop tent alone, much less the weight of the rack itself and other accessories?
This comes to choosing the right vehicle for the right purpose. And in my description i mentioned the numbers are just benchmarks for reference. 1kg over doesnt mean u are done. For a truck/ute, the tub rack / bed rack usually can hold way more than cab roof rack. And jeep wrangler’s backbone system bypass factory roof load allowance.
@@OverlandLady it seems to me there aren't many roofs that could actually support a tent. At a weight minimum of around 75 pounds without the rack, I can't imagine many trucks can support that weight. Which probably explains why so many trucks use the bed rack system instead. Maybe the category name should be changed to bed tents 🤣. I was convinced I was going to get a RTT on my Tacoma, now I'm questioning it.
@@TH-camBinging You're right. There aren't. Roof load limits are getting lower and lower. RTT tents can be put on many truck racks (like Yakima and Thule), and some reinforced truck toppers. But if you put an iKamper on your Subaru (or whatever) the roof isn't going to handle it. The name "Roof Top Tent" is a bit of a misgnomer at this point. If determined to go that route, Go Fast Campers have an RTT that's 40kg called the Ultra Lite. That's the lightest RTT on the market. But that, plus your body weight and that of your partner (if you have one) are still going to exceed the roof limits on most cars/trucks.
@@tehschkott seems to me that the best option might be simply mounting one on a bed rack in my truck as opposed to the roof.
@@TH-camBinging yeah that is in fact the only way to do it safely.
Great video!
Here's one Americans opinion...anyone who puts that much weight on the highest part of an offroad vehicle...is an idiot..first you increase your chances offroad for a rollover...second same for on road but at significantly higher speeds with a lot more unpredictable idiots on the road too...third is the wind resistance on a lifted vehicle....add all three and you're dead...forth you increase you chances of fall when climbing the steps and breaking your neck...but that's just my opinion...
You planning to explore the states?
If border is planning to open haha of course
@@OverlandLady still closed? I hear of folks going to Mexico all the time...who closed it? Canada or U.S.?
@@joecerda630 I believe both Canada and US aren't open to each other... no vehicle travel. maybe some people still take planes to sunny destinations.
Thank you!!!!!
Front runner don't have a off-road rating as Ronny said in the same video compared to rhino....so I would say your calculation is wrong.
So what. Rhino’s responsibility goes WAY beyond putting some hard-to-find information on a document. Spend a moment, for instance, on the imagery Rhino uses in their advertising, respectfully, I am not buying your argument.
Im just speaking from experience in response to people saying the information is hidden. - not so hidden to me while it’s the first thing i noticed. More so an educational material for people to pay attention to load and proper usage. Not a defence for certain brand.
Hey does Front runner use the same off road rating formula as Rhino rack?
It is an industry-standard based on engineering. On and Off road are not going to be the same load because of the different forces introduced to the system rather than just 1G (gravity).
If you watched till 22:57 Front Runny claimed offroad to be 1/3 of static which is also confusing...
@@OverlandLady Hey, yes just finished the video. I can understand what your saying but I think the main issue is the warranty not given for the overloading of the Off Road Rating. I was very curious as I couldn't see it stated by Front runner, only the suggestion you found. I just spoke to Kevin Schultz from Front runner and he stated that they can't give an off road load rating as the conditions of this varies. So what I believe front runner is saying, they back their product beyond the vehicle manufactures maximum roof load rating. So if there was a warranty issue it wouldn't be a problem. I would assume this is why Ronny and Tyler have moved to a Front runner rack. Love your channel from here in Aus
@@tallan4151 I was mostly surprised how they found this information difficult while I'm here like,,,, this is the first thing I saw after opening the box! Guess I'm overly cautious and rather not to have issue happen where I need to deal with warranty or any repair since those are time lost on the road. Honestly speaking I do no have much experience in regards to warranty cuz I don't break em enough...
@@OverlandLady I can’t comment on the leaflet that comes with the racks unfortunately, I haven’t been stung with all this load rating business Iv heard a lot have tho. I earlier was referring to Front Runner and their Load Ratings. Keep being cautious it’s the way to be,less to worry about then 👍🏻
You keep missing the point, again. 😔
IF It was so easy to find and calculate these load raitings, then nobody would be complaining about it. Too much room for human error. The fact is, Rhino rack could make it a lot easier if they gave a shit.
1. Rhino really HAVE made it too difficult to find those load ratings, mainly when you're trying to choose a roof rack. It's usually too late once it's unboxed, then you read the install manual and find the load rating isn't what you require. 🤭
2. The rivets used on these Rhino track mounts are NOT suitable for any serious offroad use, and they're certainly not stronger than using a nut and bolt system. Failure on their rivets are common here is Aus. Even happend to me, yes the rivets were installed correctly, and no it wasn't overloaded. Rhino didn't want to know me so I ended up repairing it myself using a combination of stronger rivets a nuts/ bolts. It has not failed since. 😉
Привет! Ты молодец, продолжай дальше и авто у тебя то что надо и визаш супер! Спасибо тебе огромное!
Прости за ошибки,учусь!
Question, did you have a problem with a whistling noise from the wind? Find this quite annoying
no noise on mine. I hear heaps complaints from people with platforms that has slats going horizontally. My platform goes vertical so not too bad
Your comments were really really well researched and put out very humbly. I have a 105 and a rhino platform rack, am completely happy with how it is mounted and the fact that I can carry 50 kilograms of weight. And I should add that anyone contemplating loading more on their roof rack needs to really consider how many pieces of equipment you really need to take. A family group may need to consider towing a trailer but I’m not an expert in any way
Stay on top of the roof😇👍
I'm watching everything in reverse - first this video, then Ronny Dahl, and finally Tyler Thompson. It's like time is flowing backwards haha. Edit: Hey Monique, you can even call out Andrew St. Pierre White at 4xoverland because he's eating his words too now. A couple of years ago he uploaded a video where he described Rhino Rack as being somewhat better engineered than Front Runner. Edit 2: I have a Front Runner rack with 2 items affixed - one ARB awning and one Alu Cab privacy enclosure which both add up to about 20 kilograms.
Not trying to "call out" anyone in terms of eating their words. Just simply describing how I was a bit in shock people don't see or find it hard to dig out the calculation, while here I'm like you should know it by the time of install already, if not earlier if done your research. But then again, my rack's mouting method is different than their truck/ute cab mounting so it'll ease off people's worry of me overloading.
I absolutely hate my Rhino Pioneer rack and the fact that the boards run along the length of the vehicle. It’s 100 times more flexible to have them go across, like on the Frontrunner. I’m most likely going to build my own rack with 80/20 profiles and sell the Rhino rack. Unless you have drop-in slugs for the Rhino rack, you have to plan out in great detail how you’re going to lay out your stuff, and you’re forced to take stuff off to get other mounting slugs into the track. A completely idiotic and ridiculously overpriced system. Not to mention how expensive all the gadgets for it is.
For other viewers Kg = Kilo-gram ,, 1 kg = 2.205 lbs
Sorry, but you say it was not hard to find, but it was not disclosed on the top level marketing spec sheet (and it it should be). Instead it is buried in installation documents. Clearly it is not sufficiently disclosed if very experienced off roaders did not know about it (unless you are suggesting they are lying or stupid). You throw around accusations of negligence a lot but really gloss over this manufacturer not disclosing this "industry wide rule" in the marketing specs you showed in the video.
Perhaps being relatevely green in the field provides one good thing: the humbleness to learn everything and not assume information.. I figured it's not hard to find becasue I came across it when I read the instruction. given I needed to read the instruction - newbie. Guess it's a perk to be a beginner.
Fair enough.
You are way off. Front runner has no offroad load rating. Where you said there isnt much difference between the two is garbage. The front runner is rated to 300kgs all day long on or off road..... how ever the manufactuers load rating determines what can be up there. Not sure why you bothered to show the calculations for the rhino compared to the front runner.
Also the instructions you talk bout, kind of pointless reading the numbers AFTER one springs cash for the roof rack... should be up front and out there in the store or online so the buyerr can determine if they want to spend the money in the first place.....
Rhonny didn’t get it wrong.
Every single person in australia did
Easy to do when for a Prado 150, the load ratings in the printed catalogue are different to the information in the rack packaging which is different from the fitting pages formula.
For my vehicle the difference between what was published for offroad on the sale brochure and the fitting page formula is 51kgs.
The load rating for on road carrying capacity is 60kgs higher in the sales brochure than the car mfg's limit.
You go, Girl !
To tell you the truth - I was binge watching your videos (the are very well made, they are entertainig, nice to watch escapism) but i gradually started geting strange vibes that a marketing team is behind everything. I get that nowadays to finanace adventures you have to have sponsors, etc etc. Some content creators do better some do worse in trying to incorporate paid segments into their videos but still retain "independent" balanced outlook on products. But This video is just staight up unapologetic marketing department talk. I sadly lost all suspenction of disbelief for further adventures :(
Full disclaimer i do not have any brand pay me. Would be nice to tho lol. The idea of making this video totally come from myself. Rhino rack is not involved at all. Im just purely very struk by the fact that no one read instructions and the simply physics of force diffence between static and moving are not common sense... i do not represent rhino rack in this in any way. Just my own opinion.
This whole "call out" thing was completely unnecessary, all of the relevant points could have been made without it. "The video is not about calling people out, or telling them they are doing something wrong" yet that's what you made this whole video about.
This video was a public response to all the messages I got asking about my rack. No it's not rivets and its sturdy as hell. I recently had a roll over and the rack saved me you could say.
hi how are u????? are you mixed with asian???it's a good combo pretty lady
1stt!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
American waffle, get to the point!
2nd!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :) Stay safe.
Pretty good video generally, only just found it... Sorry for the long post, but it does need it.
As a person who does overland preparation as well as trips, these stories are horrifying me, Pop rivets should never, never, never (did I make that clear?) be used to fix a rack to a vehicle! Bolt to the factory fittings with suitable bolts or clamps to the gutter rail depending on the type of build form your vehicle has. Pop rivets are litterally designed to hold sheets of metal together where there is no load bearing capability.
As for roof weight, keep it as low as possible as you want low CoG on your vehicle, so preferably, don't fit a rack at all. Roof load ratings, the thing here is choose the vehicle and more importantly the products wisely! Personally I recommend avoiding anything that has an on and off road weight, stick with products that have one weight rating or take the off road weight as total - it's the little things like that extra 1/3rd weight that you'll forget when you hit a trail.
It is worth noting that in Europe especially, things changed in 1998 and suddenly we were allowed more rack weight. The Land Rover Defender went form 75kg to 150kg, nothing changed in the vehicle though!
Slowly going through your videos, so might throw a few more comments up. :-D Stay safe and if you're ever in this part of the world, say hi!
Thanks for the advice. Great video. 👍