Deutsche Grammophon's "Original Source" Vinyl Reissue Series Discussion With the Key People
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 2 ส.ค. 2023
- I was recently invited , along with Mark Ward, one of our two classical music experts, (the other being Michael Johnson) to discuss DGG's all-analog reissue project with "Original Source" producer Rainer Maillard, mastering engineer Sidney Meyer, DGG Heritage Director Johannes Gleim and Thomas Mowrey, former DGG producer and U.S. Marketing Director and "godfather" of many of the original quadrophonic recordings sourced for this series, for a lively and very informative discussion about these exciting new reissues. Check it out!
Since this is borrowed whole from DGG, there are no Tracking Angle "bumpers" but I still know what you've got behind your back. - วิทยาศาสตร์และเทคโนโลยี
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Thank you so much for providing us with these amazing engineering artists and Mr Ward's insightful comments. Kudos Michael.
What an absolutely amazing video! Many thanks!
Love these long form discussion videos. More of this, please!
Fantastic video by Rainer& Sidney explaining the process in detail in brutal nerd modus! Love that. These new reissues from DG are simply incredible. As a reel 2 reel tape collector (7.5ips), I can confirm that these tapes covering DG recordings from the 60ties sound (eg DG Karajan Beethoven first circle) sound amazing in contrast to the published DG vinyl during the 70ties.
Simply fantastic video. Thank you.
Hi Guys and lady, what a fabulous and interesting discussion ! Exciting video as Well! One of the best moment spent with TH-cam. Thanks a lot for your shared extensive knowledge and contribution to raise the standards of the music we do love.
It's a FANTASTIC series ! Will definitely get more as they are released.
Sidney - I just picked up the latest releases and you knocked it out of the park once again! Looking forward to the next batch as well. Keep up the tremendous work.
I am super happy and excited by the response to this video and classical music generally on this TH-cam channel and on TrackingAngle.com.
Ultra High Quality Video! Many thanks Michael for getting true / authentic expert „round the table“. Helped me a lot to better understand some of the technical details which some so-called experts and audiophiles have been amateuring about without having the experience to support their statements. Of course, the Original Source Series is one of the big highlights this year, and I am happy that this time I am on the „right side“ of the Atlantic as far as limited supplies go.
What a treat. Thanks
Just fascinating. Thankyou.
NICE TO HEAR THERE'S STILL AN AUDIENCE FOR CLASSICAL RECORDS
The factory video was great! I managed to purchase the SCHUBERT QUINTET record, easily the best sounding DG I own........Thanks
Great show Folks, so not boring as it seemed from the outset. I was worried DG would never ever release good sounding analog records again - the germans have pleasantly surprised us, danke!! I've ordered 3 of them and look fwd to compare them to some of the over rated audiophile records coming out recently - I shall take my copies to the classical music shrine in Tokyo LION KISSA and have them play them! And that was an awesome, geeky, but well done documentary about the making, Kudos Rainer and Sidney!! (never seen Fremer so well behaved before - hey no one thought we'd get analog records again from slow DG either ;)
great video and a great panel discussing the DG catalog!! The DG catalog contains so many treasures, but they were pressed on such poor sounding vinyl in the past. I had a large chunkc of the DG classical catalog at one time, but have slowly gotten rid of a lot of it. Using these 1970s pressings sets the bar artificially low for these new releases. Its ironic Johannes mentioned the success of the Blue Note Tone Poet series. The Tone Poets have all been really superb. During the discussion on transferring 4 tracks to 2 tracks, eliminating one tape level was mentioned several times. What was not mentioned was the mastering signal chain used to cut the final lacquer. What is DG using? The original 1970s signal chain or have they done some improvements to it. With the Tone Poet series, Kevin Gray has raised the bar significantly on what vinyl can sound like using his new mastering signal path electronics. You can hear the SQ improvements in all of the Tone Poets and his other cuts. Perhaps it would be worthwhile for DG / Beliner to visit Kevin Gray and take a look at his signal chain and see where they can make improvements in their own.
Need to check.. the only LP I have that had such dedication on the grooves data was the Technics Audio INspection VOL4 45rpm (goes full +6db)..... the sound that can be in an Vinyl when there are no standardized limitations will go all beyhond what I ahev listened before .... is just amazing. The VOL I is cut at half speed with dbx .. was done in 1975 with the new SP-10 ... its sounds amazing ...
Amen to more like this please. Michael, do you know if the stereo mixes of multi-channel SACDs are done in the same manner?
Die Beteuerung im Video das die Titel eine genügend hohe Auflage hätten war schon vor drei Zagen NICHTS WERT …das verärgert mich.
Hi everybody. The idea is splendid! I have the LvB Kleiber 7th and it sounds so much better than my clean original! But the choice of the titles could improve a lot and I mean musically.
amazing! keep that project going. i wish you doing some limited QUAD SQ vinyl, but the market for QUAD is very small. i know only few people in my country who may have interest in it (including me, of course). I build for myself a tube-based SQ-QS decoder, it outperforms mass produced IC-transistor based devices.
Thank you all soooo much ❤
I am enjoying the first 4 titles in this series which sound great. I found this a fascinating conversation and I am curious to hear more about the “cliffhanger” that was mentioned. I couldn’t find anything from a quick internet search for “public matlass royal mono”. Does anyone know more about this?
I've wanted to get a bunch of these since they came out & they seem to almost be "unobtainium" for even the second pressings. DG knows how popular these have become but have apparently not stepped up production for some unknown reason. Too bad, I'll use the $$ and get some Living Stereo reissues instead.
Nice to see this; I didn't realize that these recordings were newly remixed to this extent, as I have original pressings of most of them, and wasn't following these releases. I will have to pick up some for comparison. I would love to see DG release more of these four track (and higher) recordings released as SACD's or Blurays, in particular the Boston recordings such as the Ozawa Miraculous Mandarin Suite, the rest of the Ravel, the Three Cornered Hat, The Tilson Thomas Tchaikovsky 1st Symphony, the Ma Vlast mentioned here, the Ozawa Roman trilogy, etc. None of these have ever seen actual quad releases, and I quickly grabbed all of the ones previously released by Pentatone (as well as the sole DG Strauss/Holst one).
I want all of them! Where can I get them in the US?
Why do you keep removing my comments ? Is it some kind of a secret that many of those releases are available as high resolution streaming via Qobuz? Or is it some TH-cam auto filter ?
Can we get the 4 track on SACD or Blueray in 5.1 mix?
Wonderful video and I am so glad it was made available to watch here on TH-cam - sadly the disc that I would have loved to hear appear to be all sold out so - oh well.
Some 30 plus years ago, which is a long story in itself, but all that time ago I went to a place that I am certain Michael Framer would call HELL :.) - as in I had to sell my beloved Linn Sondek LP12 c/w Ittok arm and Karma cartridge..... and my Linn Sara's....... and my Kan's....... did I mention it was purgatory as well, and I had to sell my Naim amplifiers...... sigh and just for good measure I decided that if it was going to be hell and purgatory then it may as well be Naraka as well and for those of you who are unenlightened that's the Buddhist version of hell and I went there because I also had to sell about half my record collection and that was the classical bit and the vast majority of that was all the big yellow label and so far as I can see all of these here Original Source recordings were amongst it.
Anyway - the good news is that a short while ago I bought a completely refurbished Naim amp - it's only the Nait, but it's a start and standing alongside it is something I only added this week with a more or less unused Rega Planer 3 with RB330 arm and Elys cartridge. Sadly, it looks like these Original Source pressings flew off the shelves in a matter of minutes, because nobody's got any stock - but fingers crossed I left an order with Presto music for Kleibers 7th - almost the last record that I played on my system all those years ago before my world changed forever in a way that I never thought would happen.
Funnily enough - if just 12 months ago anybody had asked me how do you think you will be listening to music in a year's time, the very last thing I would have said is off a proper hifi system and, of all things, off a vinyl record and because your ears can hear that its better. Fingers crossed, Presto music find a copy of the Kleiber Beethoven 7th that got mislaid in the warehouse.
Once again - thanks for the video, and thanks even more for all the other highly entertaining videos that you have uploaded onto TH-cam.
When did Deutsche Grammophon begin to record in high resolution digital? I would love to see those high resolution digital recordings released on vinyl as well.
These are worth the asking price, I bought the Rite of Spring, and dynamic range and sonic clarity is as good as it get. The packaging and the attention to detail takes this to the top notch. So I bought a second one, Symphony No7, now my issue is which one do I get next?
I haven't heard the new re-issues so I can't comment on those. If they did remix original multi-track (4 or more) , then they may have licked the infamous low-energy DG sound. Unfortunately, the notorious "low-energy" DG sound is not addressed in this video. The downturn in DG sonics began early 70's and remained well into 1990s. Yup ... well into pure DDD digital epoch when vinyl mastering was not an issue. This may very well be related to decisions made by certain DG engineers and producers that were running the show in these decades. Decca, EMI, Chandos, and even minor-player German labels (Tacet, etc), were light years ahead in sonics. Not sure why a major player like DG opted for wimpy sound -- hardly competitive, even for FM stations promoting these labels.
I've been looking for Von Karajan's early 1960s recording of Brahms Symphony #4. It spoiled me for all other recordings, including Von Karajan's later recordings of this piece. I wore my copy out and haven't found another since, either on CD or vinyl.
I'm so tired of record companies asking customers to buy the same discs over and over again. I know it is voluntary, but still. I bought the Mahler 5 with Karajan when it was first released and also later CD versions. I also bought the Blu-tay release in the series DG calls Pure audio, And now... no thanks. Also, if these new ones are so much better why have you produced sub par editions for so many years?
Oh Thomas I hear you! But you have to remember the industry - in terms of reissues - changes with the times and technologies evolving. CD remasters now and 20 years ago are completely different (as are the markets for them), and certainly no-one believed even 10 years ago that vinyl would be the vehicle for so thoroughly revamping the "DG sound"! (This is Mark Ward responding under my channel name, Music on Record).
@@musiconrecord6724 Hi Mark! I know all of that but record companies always promises us a new and complete listening experience with every new format. When DG started releasing CDs they claimed that they were made from "the original source". A claim they have made with every new series or edition. So why did they sound so bad? Probably because they were made from bad tape copies and I remember laughing out loud every time a reviewer from Gramophone wrote that the CDs lifted a veil from the speakers. Remember Karajan holding a CD and saying that all else is gaslight. As you know I have a lot of CDs and sometimes when I pull out, say, a Karajan disc from one of the four DG boxes my ears grow tired very soon. And they are supposed to be remastered to "new high standards". But I'm happy for you and other vinyl enthusiasts if DG finally made a quality product, they certainly were very ambitious and put a lot of effort into them. I suppose since they are all analogue digital releases will never happen? Best!
How many titles will be released? How many 4 track originals are there?
Sidney previously mentioned (in a different video) that the initial set of releases is 14 titles.
DG recordings, although there are some very good ones, are unfortunately not very common. Overall, the recordings from Philips (Holland) are much better.
You just need to make direct comparisons, it’s clear. In your comparison example at 29.27mn, if the new version seems better, it is also because the recording level is higher and the levels have not been equalized. As for the more accentuated reverberation on the new version which gives more space?
One of the problems with DG recordings, like many other companies of the time, is multi-microphone recordings = too many microphones.
The best recordings are made with only 2 omnidirectional microphones or three max. A microphone being the opposite of a speaker, you need one microphone per speaker.
This is my personal opinion
Thank you for the records, and for the video, but how come nobody is asking the most trivial question: how come these quad recordings have not been released on quad SACDs or Blu-rays? A couple of quad recordings have been released on quad SACDs by Pentatone, but not these great recordings issued in the Original Source series.
The DG Steinberg Holst: The Planets has been released in 4 track Blu-ray.
@richard.h.shores1956 -- yes, I know, a sadly rare case, and, even more sadly for me, my Trinnov Altitude 16 room correction preamp can only decode it in stereo... :(
Yes, Mark, now we can hear Gilels bang his way through Schubert's Trout in his full brutality!
Oh this is hysterical..... Certainly Curzon with the Viennese on Decca is somewhat less "bangy!" (This is Mark Ward - Music on Record is my channel name)
@@musiconrecord6724 Hi Mark, Thrassyvoulos here, I love this: th-cam.com/video/gMCneamu_PA/w-d-xo.html
@@musiconrecord6724 th-cam.com/video/k5LJ1EgRZWw/w-d-xo.html
@@musiconrecord6724 I also love the Pina Pozzi with the Winterthur Qt. on MMS. Fabulous ensemble playing and true Schubert feeling. Couldn't find it on TH-cam.
@@musiconrecord6724 Yes and of course the fabulous Rudolf Serkin on Columbia. And his son's Peter Serkin on RCA is excellent! Don't forget the Kocsis Zoltan either!
Hello just bought the BSO/Abbado and regret to inform a quality issue. At half time of side 1 there are clicks and pops for around 2 minutes. Why??? I just think that record companies keep behaving as assaulting the consumer pockets and offering speculative priced items with less quality control!!!
I am curious if you used a record cleaning machine before you played the album. And yes, it is a needed thing with new albums, too. If the pressing is defective, did you try to return it for a replacement?
Just washed the album on Ausdio Desk Prox X. The clicks have not disappeared so I've a defective album on an audiophile label that costs too much! jUST A DEFECT THAT SHOULD BE ON THE PLATTER BECAUSE NOT GOOD CLEANING WHEN MAKING THE VINYL PRESS. SHAME ON DEUTCH GRAMMOPHON
@@jwinder2
Great video, but DG was not really a "vinyl friendly" company all those years. We all know they prefered the CD for classical music. And it's kind of cynical, that in 2024 they make money of stuff they recorded end of the "60. I have some of the "70 DG multi track LP's - they are very bad sounding: noisy and lack of dynamics too. And one funny thing here: 1:26:40 - I'm talking about royal money, eh royal mono .... 🤣
Who are these for? The recording industry has released them in various digital editions over and over again for decades. I have quite a few of those (started buying cds in 1985). I guess companies must sell something physical when the flow of cd revenue has dried up. Audiophiles on the other hand want to believe what self styled gurus tell them. And they want to spend. They did not want the mid price cd edition of Karajan's Mahler 5 th. But now they are offered the same recording as a treasured cultural artefact from the golden age of recording, audiophile pressing, gatefold sleeves in pure analog - conveniently ignoring the fact that there is nothing pure in analog recording and reproduction.
Warum macht ihr das nicht auf deutsch? Zumindest die Einspieler wo das schlechte Englisch nur nervt!...
Digital beats vinyl unless you're one of those unfortunate music lovers who claim to hear "warmth". I feel sorry for you.
@@PersonaNonGrata-uz4of😂😂😂
sometimes yes, sometimes no. There are so many variables. And yes, I do have an equal mix of both, with a very carefully selected system on both the analog and the digital side, and I have a fair amount of duplication in my library.