300 PRC the ultimate 30 caliber? - The Real Gunsmith
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 6 ธ.ค. 2018
- Randy talks about Hornady's new 30 PRC caliber. Why try to reinvent the wheel?
God bless.
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Thanks for the overwhelming response to this video, as well as our other videos on The Real Gunsmith Channel! We appreciate your comments and questions. Due to the volume of the comments and questions, some which would take some time to answer, we just don’t have the time to respond to them all. However many of the questions will be answered in future videos. Our first priority is to our paying clients. Writing out long answers would take time away from that, and I won’t put them “on hold” to post long answers here. If you have questions about getting gun work done or a custom rifle built, contact us at randyselby@randyscustomrifles.com . I have a wide range of prices for custom rifles so even the “average Joe or Josephine” can get into a custom package, just as accurate as the higher end rifles. For our detractors, we appreciate your difference of opinion, too, but I stand by my decades of experience. To all of you, thanks again for your overwhelming support. Stay tuned! God bless you all. Randy and Cathy +JMJ+
Just out of curiosity , since Hornady factory ammo cant be called precision rifle ammo because it has to jump 0.140 '' to the lands or has what is called excessive freebore then what is the freebore on a true weatherby cartrige? Last time i checked if you ordered a 300 weatherby reamer without the excessive freebore you couldnt shoot factory weatherby ammo in it because it would have excessive pressure due to needing alot of freebore to obtain the speed they were desiring to get?
What are your thoughts on the 50 Alaskan conversions on the marlin lever action?
The Real Gunsmith Thank you for the information about that long shot I was thinking about it I listen to you I’ll stick to my 400 yard shots
@@brock454xx They are sharp looking. Have never had one in hand to fully examine. It's good to see fine craftsmanship.
@@isaiahcurtis9964 The throat on a .300 Wby chamber is .437. I've found no problems with pressure of a throat .240 long with factory ammo in the .300 Wby, so this is untrue.
The 300 PRC was developed over the past 10 years at the request of USASOC. The M107 was damn near a liability during the early months of the Afghan war. So we looked at the .338 LM while it did the job it was also a bitch to hump at 14,000 ft of elevation and follow up shots were hindered by recoil. We then had AMU develop the M24e1 in 300wm. Again it worked but ammo capacity and and bolt throw were an annoyance but lack of ability to seat high BC bullets in the 300wm were a real issue. We took the remaining 338lm rifles and had them re chambered and worked to accept the 300 Norma. This was a great performing cartridge but still retained some of the problems of the 338 sized actions. Then Hornady developed the 300PRC it had all the features we wanted in a long range interdiction rifle with only slight sacrifices in velocity compared to the others we emoluments in combat. While it might not be your ideal .30 cal for slaying white tail yearlings it has worked better for dropping dirt bag insurgents than anything we’ve used to date. That alone is enough for Hornady to get my respect. Especially since they didn’t try and reinvent the wheel.
THIS thank you, so sick of these lies
You gotta admit though as a gunsmith, where he’s coming from, this is nothing a wildcat hasnt done or came close to so it is t exactly brand new BUT you are very correct. I own one, its disgustingly sick in badassness. Also yes the throat and chambering was a masterpiece design in its way tighter tolerance in the PRC at .308 in the leade vs .312-.316 in the WM. This along with the proper throat length gives a best in class seat for precision launching of long high BC bullets for extreme travel. Like launching a rocket off a perfect 90° launch tier vs a warped or crooked one as the prc doesn’t allow for off concentricity. Also i bet the long range bullets are less important on human targets as we probably aren’t as tough as big game in that aspect. (I WOULDNT KNOW) so I imagine bullet selection for best ballistic trajectory would be easier. Though side note the 220gr ELDXs i shoot from mine are VERY accurate at near 1/2 moa @100.
Over the years I have shot a lot of game with a Model 70 control round feed 300 Win Mag and a 200 grain bullet. This combination has shot well and performed well on both deer and elk out and past five hundred yards. Lest we all forget most of the long distance world record were archived with the 300 Win Mag. Oh yes i’ve bought into the hype that cartridge manufactures peddle and yes I have a bunch of rifles, but for me the most under performing and biggest disappoint has been the 6.5 Creedmore.
@@kurtmyers9740the long distance world records these days are being broken by 416 Barrett, 408 cheytac, and 375 cheytac.
@@kurtmyers9740true about the 6.5 cm. Can’t kill deer nor bear at 350 yards. And I own 3 of it. Switching over to the 300 PRC.
All I know is my new 300prc is the finest shooting rifle I’ve ever owned. .5 moa. Out of the box using box ammo! I spent a fortune with gunsmiths on my 300wm and my 300 rum trying to get them to shoot anywhere close to this accurately.
If the hornady people are so dumb how is it working so well?
Exactly.
This guy may be a good gunsmith, (his longevity in the business tells him so) but his curmudgeonly ranting diatribes are unconvincing. It's as if he believes he's the only one who knows rifles, cartridges, and ballistics.
If you believe him and his posts, ( See 6.5 "Westerner") Hornady, Nosler, Remington, Winchester, and the other gun and cartridge manufacturers he's bashed in his other videos, either don't know what they're talking about, or are outright, "Liars!"...his word. 👎🏾👎🏾
I’d say he’s seen quite a few wild cat cartridges and wild claims over the years and has become a bit jaded. But things have changed, especially in projectile design and accuracy of rifles out of the box
What Randy is speaking to is how the new cartridges and company’s are coming out and advertising they have a cartridge that will out perform the older cartridges we have had and used for decades in most cases. I think people are so quick to try and poke holes through his videos and arguments they’re not realizing the key point of…all things equal as far as a rifle and handloading a cartridge to its full potential no the 300 PRC is not better than a 300 win or Weatherby. Same with 6.8 westerner and advertisements claiming it out performs the 7rem and if you build a rifle the way it should be and handloading is done correctly he’s 110% correct in saying those claims are false. Now if he got on here and said even if you take a production rifle and box ammo comparing the two cartridges and for example the 6.5 PRC doesn’t edge a 264 win mag then I’d agree he would be wrong in some cases.
@@nickcannon1558it’s inherently more accurate than a Weatherby or wm it’s efficiency and design puts them both to shame they will die right beside the old Mauser rounds. Old people only think about case capacity and his lack of research and incoherent anti innovation babbling is doing nothing but ruining his name
You are absolutely correct sir, from a hunting perspective. Particularly from the POV of a custom gunsmith catering to high roller hunters.
This ctg is for someone wanting too compete in long range competition or for someone that just loves banging steel at a mile with an off the shelf rifle.
The most significant difference is the twist rate. A 300 Weather by, H&H, Winchester, et all have a 1 in 10 twist. The PRC has a 1 in 8 twist. This is not significant too a custom gunsmith, he can chamber a 300 Winchester in any twist he can get a barrel blank in. But to someone buying an off the shelf rifle they are pretty much stuck with the SAMMI spec twist. So Hornady comes out with a extremely long 250 gr Aluminum tipped target bullet with a .878 BC that a 1 in 10 twist won't handle. The best solution is a new ctg with a new SAAMi spec 1 in 8 twist.
The 1 in 10 twist for competition 30 cals has always been too slow. I won a 1000 yd service rifle completion decades ago with an issue M14NM shooting 168 gr Sierras. The weird thang was all my shots were in the 9, 10 or X ring, but they were also all key holing. They were going subsonic just before hitting the target. This was with issue white box match ammo. The answer was a hand load with a 1/2 gr more powder.
the 300 prc is designed around the ability to run bullets with higher BC than previous 30cal projectiles. That is what makes it different. There are no 75 year old high bc 30cal bullets so the idea that its 'just a 30 cal in a necked down case' is missing the entire point of the cartridges develpment. Without that key point, its easy to understand why someone would think that.
You do not have any older 30cal cartridges designed to accomodate these bullets because these bullets did not exist in that form. The chambers, the case, the spacing, velocity and charge can not be reproduced by any combination of the previous cartridges. similar? yes.... same? not at all.
This man pisses me right off 1/2 of the time and inspires me 1/2 of the time. I guess that's fair.
Mark Cox feel free to watch someone else. Geez, everyone has their quirks and he’s a knowledgeable and informative person. Take the rough with the smooth
Old man Syndrome. He knows best because he is old and used it a lot...not much scientific data to rely on here folks.
@Log Splitta you just contradicted yourself as you attempted to argue your point. Nice.
Go watch Mark and Sam after work. Pretty much the same conclusion
@@avidsledder i think mark is taking the rough with the smooth 50/50 like
I appreciate your experience and expertise but in the data driven age that we live in you should also provide the data comparisons for your audience to separate opinions from facts.
He saving you the trouble, in this data driven age numbers can be used to prove any point ,experience Trumps data
In what world do you live in that “numbers can be used to prove any point” no they cant if the data is gathered correctly and the person presenting the data isn’t lying
@@arkoutarkout3654 Just because you have "experience" doesn't mean it's accurate information. Opinions don't make something a fact just because he's an old timer.
@@AnthonysOutdoors ok guy who dose not build gun you must be "right "
Lol...when you say experience out weighs numbers and then invalidates someone else’s experience
300RUM with 220gr Hornady ELDX is a fantastic combination. 3000fps out of a 26” barrel with 4000ft/lbs energy is devastating on game at all ranges including extreme long range (500-1000) yards.
For those who don’t know about the 300RUM, it is a 404 Jeffrey necked down to a 30 Cal cartridge. Has more knock down power than 338 Win Mag and will knock down any 4 legged creature roaming North America and the world.
Another great video by Randy, appreciate your wisdom and experience good sir....keep the content coming!
Look at any ballistic calculator and the 300 RUM with a Hornady 220gr ELD-X bullet has more energy than a 338 Win Mag with a 225gr bullet that is similar. Facts are the facts. Bigger diameter of bullet doesn’t necessarily mean efficiency and the 338 Win Mag is not an efficient version of the 338 caliber.
Poacher’s use 7.62 x 39 & .22LR to kill elephants, Rhinos and everything else....pretty sure a 300 RUM would get the job done.
My 30-378wby laughs in the face of your little 300rum 😆
.300 prc will get access to longer higher bc bullets that won't fit into cartridge such as .300 win mag
Im wanting to see a 30 nosler vs 300 PRC. Dont really see much on the 300 PRC still.
People are shooting 225 eld or 230 grains bullet's in 300 win mag so if the bullets are longer than that it wil be heavyer to and that slows down the bullet Speed so much that it wil not make up for the better Bc. And it is not that big off an difference in speed between 300win and 300prc. If you not shooting a 300 Rum or something like that.
@@MyAudioPipe There are instances where one is better than the other. If you want to mag feed heavy bullets, the PRC is superior. But if you don't mind sticking with
Yes, an importance consideration for match bullets. For a hunting bullet, terminal performance is critical, and more BC is nice, but NOT a substitute. I think it's important to keep in mind that Randy is coming more from a hunting background. The long throats on many newer rifles is a real thing. Proverbial hot dog-in-hallway situations. A mass producer of budget rifles can hardly be blamed for throating deep because the one time the try to go shorter everyone is only bashing them for factory ammo that won't chamber (6mm creedmoor comes to mind).
@@Hill_Billy_Without_A_Hill 300 PRC’s solitary advantage is its longer head height and throat, which play nicer with extremely long, high-BC bullets. But if you have little interest in shooting past 600 yards, there’s little difference in performance between the two. In fact, because it’s got a shorter throat that engages light-ish, short-shanked projectiles faster, the 30 Nosler actually may provide more consistent accuracy with popular deer-weight bullets. Read the article in shooting times, has 300 prc compared to all others and what the advantages are. Times change, so do bullet design, efficiency, etc.
From my recollection, the 300-378 is an absolute beast at accuracy and distance. It doesn’t lose a lot of energy and velocity that the standard .308 caliber magnums do.
I think everyone is missing the point of this round. Its primary purpose isnt as a hunting rifle.. it's an extreme long range round
I just found your channel and I love your honesty and no bull views on different things. I’ve learned quite a bit on different videos you’ve done in hand loading. Thanks for all the good info you bring to this channel.
Buying bullets off the counter like most of us do the 300 prc beats the 300 win mag at long range so that's what matters to me shelf accuracy as it would most I believe
One thing is for sure, it’s hard to teach an old dog new tricks. I remembered the same resistance from the 30-06 purists when the 308 was developed.
Exactly. All of this “short action” craze has hardly any significance in any situation other than PRS. A 30-06 can do ANYTHING the.308 can. As bad as the malcontents dislike it, the .308 can’t do everything the ‘06 can. 😎
And 300 weatherby slaps both
@@marcogram1216 Exactly!
It still doesn’t do anything a 300 win mag doesn’t. And with the heaviest 30cal bullets the win mag actually will hit higher speeds before it hits pressure problems.
@@jamesstewart9970 yeah I don't think so.
Just bought a 300 prc. Love it.
Nothing new can ever be better than the old stuff. That mentality prevents advancements in anything.
Sir I respect your passion for guns and your willingness to share knowledge. I have a 6.5 Creedmoor and consistently get under half MOA groups and now around .08-.02 MOA groups out to 450 yards. The research I’ve done on the 300 PRC isn’t claiming to be the best hunting cartridge as that entails such a large number of circumstances. They promote it as a new long range hunting cartridge that allows a shooter to go from ELR to hunting an Elk past 700 yards and they sell different ammunition according to the different circumstances. It was originally used by one of Hornadys employees as he tested projectiles past 1000 yards. And it’s been in the making over 10 years, when the company realized the potential they decided to market it. Other commenters have already stated that Barretvwas awarded a contract for the MRAD to be chambered in the 300 PRC. They chose this after testing multiple calibers and found it better than the 300 Norma while shooting past 2000 yards. Ballistics are a fickle thing that are extremely circumstantial(all the external inputs on a bullet based on environmental factors). I personally this year shot a deer with a Smith and Wesson 460 at 50 yards, the thing spun around dropped it from to the ground and when rear wheel drive into a thicket. Over 300 yards of blood splattered on trees and logs I found no body. My grandfather shot a doe at 60 yards with his muzzle loader .50 cal and it didn’t bleed a drop of blood found it in 15 yards. I’ve done perfect heart lung shots on bucks that have run over a quarter mile. Meanwhile my cousin in law shot a doe in the flank and it died in 30 yards. I say all this to point out that todays shooting world is about pushing what is logical because often things just don’t make sense. We have people shooting out past 4000 yards now, recently David Tubbs son in law hit a 36”x36” plate at 2200 three for three cold bore with no sight in earlier that day in under three minutes. I have nowhere near the knowledge you have and probably never will. But if I’ve learned anything from the history of gun development, time at the range, studying ballistics, and learning under a gunsmith. It takes something that seems counterproductive to lead to something revolutionary. Again I have a great respect for you doing these videos and sharing your knowledge. Thanks for the time and effort you put into it.
MAN I couldn't have said it better myself!!!
Thomas, are you saying you consistently get .08-.02 moa groups? You do realize that the math on that comes out to ~.375" groups at 450 yards, right?
I know it doesn’t sound real but it is. My brother and I had just shot some two liters at that distance and then I moved down to a 16oz bottle. So I figured I’d throw up a target and used the app SubMOA to double check and get the officially group sizes.
Old grizzled flannel-shirted bearded guy calmly dropping gun wisdom on us all. This is why the internet exists. Thank you firearm Santa; here's another delighted subscriber.
PERFECT! The 300PRC has 2% more case capacity than the .300 win mag. The neck is just 1.1mm(0.043") longer for longer bullets, BUT because of the extrem l.o.a of the .300 PRC it's not suitable for more light bullets. That's where the .300 win mag beats the .300 PRC.......
I get your point, and I appreciate your knowledge of cartridges and rifles.
Here’s what Hornady was seeking:
The .300 PRC is a non-belted, non-rebated rim case. Of the comparable cartridges that you mentioned, only the .300 H&H needs a belt, as you know, because of case taper. The others do not. The wsms and saums have rebated rims. The largest mainstream.30 cal case with neither belt nor rebated rim is the .30-06. So they upgraded.
…and it fits in a standard magnum action. We aren't going be paying an arm and a leg for factory rifles.
buszero1 military has adopted 300PRC in the Barrett MRAD. 6.5x284 was rebated rim, long action, and burned barrels
buszero1 I have no idea if 300 PRC makes it. I’m not even sure what “making it” looks like for a big magnum that is inherently narrower in appeal than a tastes-like-chicken round like 6.5cm. The PRC and the 30Nosler are best designed big 30s out there: no belts, std magnum bolt face, no rebates on the rim. Nosler is better with lighter bullets, PRC with heavier bullets. I have no use for the lighter bullets in a caliber, so I prefer the PRC, but I can see the Nosler’s appeal for guys looking for a modernized 300wm for hunting loads.
@buszero1 the 260 Remington is putting up big numbers, if i was to get a 25 cal rifle that would be the one..
@buszero1 as the 300 prc has won a military contract and will be used by our military, I don't think the 300 prc will be going anywhere. So this old dog will have to suck it up and deal with it.
this guy chambered my 300 win mag and man does it shoot nice he knows what hes doing
In context of hunting I do agree that there isn’t much of a difference. However these rounds are being used for long range competition 1000+ yards where the high ballistics provide a slim edge on drops
Among the many rifles I own, one is a Savage 10 heavy barrel in 6.5 Creedmoor. I am also a hand-loader and I load my target bullets to a COL of 2.880"
which is .01 off the lands in my barrel and there is still plenty of room in that magazine.
Perhaps the Hornady/Saami reamer is dimensioned this way intentionally; with the freedom to seat some High BC bullets well past the standard 2.800" magazine length (mine is strictly a target setup). The 6.5 Creedmoor has also given great performance for people hunting with factory ammo out of factory rifles with standard 2.800" length ammo and magazines. They probably don't care how much jump their Remington Corelokt bullet has in their T/C Compass rifle. They are just happy they can afford a rifle, scope, and ammo combination good enough to get their first whitetail buck at 80 yards.
I understand that this is not the way that Randy would design a reamer or cartridge, but for a lot of people it just plain works and there's nothing wrong with that. But I wish he would understand that there IS more than one way to design a cartridge, chamber, reamer etc that suits the needs of shooters other than himself or his customers. I believe this is the case with the 6.5 PRC as well as the 300 PRC. They may not have more volume in the case than the established magnums, or even be a new wildcat, but they will allow many shooters to load their cartridges the way they want, with the barrel twist they want, etc...
There will always be demand for rifles the way Randy makes them, and there will always be companies looking to sell us a new cartridge that might be no more effective than it's predecessor. I'm glad that we live in a time where we can have both.
Thoughtfully said.
In regards to what you said about polymer tipped bullets and the high bc .243 and .264 bullets. I’ve been saying the same thing to people if they ask my opinion! I have a 6.5 Creedmoor and a 6.5 grendel, they’re fantastic cartridges to target shoot and shoot tiny groups with but when it comes to hunting I stick with my 308 or my 30/30 if I’m in some thicker stuff. I’ve got Loads for both those rifles that shoot fantastic and both are a soft point. They may not look the coolest but they WORK and perform how I expect a hunting bullet to perform.
Sometimes old timers can't stand change. Seen it numerous times in the work place! Back on my day....
This guy sounds like he speaks from too much experience. I think it's safe to take him at his word. What benefit does he get from falsifying information?
He is one of the most if not the most experienced hand loader and gun smith on TH-cam and probably one of the top 10 best gun smiths in the world so it is vary foolish and naive of you to doubt his knowledge when any experienced hand loader can confirm what he said is right there is nothing special about the 300 PRC
@brian bowes agreed! I never bought into the whole WSM, SAUM or whatever dumb shit alphabet magnum is the flavor of the week. To exceed 300 weatherby velocities you've either got an obscenely long barrel or loading to super high pressures. All these new cartridges coming out are a solution to a problem which doesn't exist. Except in the minds of engineers, which in it's own right is pretty scary🤣
@@davidmullins2683 his knowledge is flawed because it comes from a constant hunting perspective. The purpose of these cartridges is for precision rifle shooting. Look at every competition shooter and what are they shooting? 6.5 creedmore, .260, and others with long heavy bullets seated shallow in the neck. Why? Because it works and you see groups of .1225 from some of these guys.
They can also be used for hunting since generally speaking more efficiency and consistency down range can be translated over to the hunting world. And who wouldn't want that? More consistent ethical skills.
@@taylorharris5601 no one's using any 300 Magnum caliber for a serious competition they're either using a 6.5 Creedmoor because it's light enough recoil they can shoot it all day without killing their shoulder or for ultra-long-range they are uping it to something bigger like a 338 Lapua if not a 416 Barrett or 50 BMG for the truly ridiculously long range shooting so the hunting perspective is the correct perspective to look at a 300 Magnum round from and if you look at the top 5 most powerful 300 Magnum calibers the 300 PRC would only come in 4th which is why I said there is nothing special about it just pick up one of Hornady's reloading manual's and see for yourself they are the ones ones who made it and yet their very own reloading book shows that there is nothing special about it compared to other 300 Magnums it might have a tiny Edge over the old 300 Winchester magnum but by no means is it enough to be worth replacing a 300 Winchester magnum and even if you are buying your first 300 Magnum the 300 PRC still shouldn't be in your top 3 if you want availability of ammo go for the 300 Weatherby if you want something that is considerably more powerful than a 30-06 but doesn't kick as bad as the other 300 Magnums go for the 300 WSM and if you want the most Firepower out of any of the 300 Magnums go for the 300 rum
The main advantage of the Prc is that it it headspaces off the shoulder, not a belt. Another advantage would be the ability to load higher bc bullets in standard mag lengths. I agree from a hunting perspective this cartridge is not the most relevent. However in the long range paper punching community these features have its merits
You can set up belted magnums to headspace off the shoulder.
True but now the belt is completely useless.
Further you still habe the uber short throat from the SAAMI spec chamber. The SAAMI spec chamber for the 300PRC allows for longer, heavier for bore pills.
I also have on good authority that hornady's ELDM 225 is about 0.025" off of the lands with a properly headspaced barrel using SAAMI spec reamer.
@@steve390gold The belt has always been useless on any cartridge with a proper shoulder.
You remind me why I like to keep things simple. As long as I quickly drop what I'm aiming at , and eating it soon after, I'm happy.
@@vincef5832 for hunting you are 100% right, But the 300 PRC was designed mostly for two applacation's. Snipers and the Rage Long Range Shooting and it will outperform the Weatherby, and H&H in factory Guns and Ammo
What the 300 PRC does is this, it's SAAMI spec calls for enough freebore to run heavy bullets in the 212-230 range without taking up case capacity. The factory rifles will also have fast twist barrels to stabilize the long heavy bullets. Yes, you can build a custom rifle in any number of .30's that will run with, or run away from, a 300 PRC. Hornadys new cartridge allows someone who wants to buy an off the shelf rifle, and off the shelf ammo, and go out an shoot some ELR.
2five7 ding ding ding
I'd say that ELR is most commonly done with non off the shell guns and rarely with factory ammo.
I don't have any issue with this or any other cartridge introduced. Its the way they market that I take exception to.
my dad gave me his mk5 300 weatherby as a graduation present.. its killed everything with one shot
He is right about pretty much everything he says,
And I wish I had a fraction of his knowledge .
But the 300 PRC is different from other 30 cal, in that the chamber is tighter without as much slop witch can make for a more accurate cartridge in many cases, and you can buy quality factory ammo from half the price of the 300 Weatherby.
That might work for guys who want to buy factory ammo and make Hornady rich, but us hand loaders fire our cases to the chamber ONCE, then neck size only after that intitial firing so that the cartridge fits the chamber PERFECTLY! No serious precision shooter relies on factory ammo because serious precision shooters KNOW that properly developed hand loads tuned to a particular rifle WILL ALWAYS out shoot factory ammunition 99.99% of the time.
@@mikemagnum7987 lol. Are you related to Ron Burgundy? He had some stats like that for his cologne. "60% of the time, it works every time".
Ditto!!
@@mikemagnum7987 You must not know much about serious precision shooters, because there are many that win matches with factory offerings. The ones that do reload full length size, neck sizing only is a thing of the past.
There are a couple of things I think are nice about the 300prc ,no belt no rebated case ,able to load the bullets long 3.7,ocl ,other than that it's just another 30 cal
Comparing 300 H&H to something like PRC is a bit daft, they are designed for completely different applications.
"I can't deal with a belt"😭 😢😂, hilarious
Thanks for the information Mr Randy
I shoot the 6.5x55 over the creedmoor. Because i live in Sweden it is everywere, and its a 120 year old cartridge that does till the same job. If you load it up to its full potential.
This is kinda like new fishing lures, designed to catch fishermen, not fish.
You hit the nail on the head with that one
Agreed
@@paulmeek7964 couldn't said it better myself sir
My buddy just bought one
Except the 300 PRC outperforms any and all other 30 caliber rifle cartridges over 500 yards, except the 300 Norma, but the norma has waaay more recoil and a much shorter barrel life
I have to agree with you to a point! 300 PRC does produce some great numbers not necessarily at the muzzle but when you start stretching it out past 1000 yards. However I think this case could have been way better with some more intuitive input! If you have the time I would love to spend with you picking you brain because you definitely have some serious knowledge of these things!
I believe Hornady done a damn excellent job on the 6.5 PRC and the 300 PRC it's they're both great rounds and they're a whole lot cheaper than 300 weatherby
Lol
300 weatherby is half the price of 300prc ammo
@@Hondayo77 in Canada it's the exact opposite lol. I'm finding 300PRC Match for around $70 a box. Some 300 Weatherby ammo is well over $100... and that's if you can even find it in stock.
Mid 2022 and no PRC ammo on shelves, hope hunters can find ammo this fall.
You need to go to palmetto State armory they have plenty
Perhaps we should have stopped at 300 H&H? So far this cartridge is proving to do what it says it does; whether one chooses to seek those challenges is another matter entirely. I like it. Just start out and accept that this needs to be a round with a very long finished COAL and that handloaders will likely push it beyond even that. I was surprised to find that even then magazine feeding is perfectly viable a good bit beyond spec COAL. Time will tell on barrel life, but with the heavier bullets it probably will be reasonable.
No pointless belts, no rebated rim, no silly pointless shoulder 'technology', no funky bolt-face diameters, no problems with neck tension (mostly a fallacy with 300WM I would agree), doesn't recoil like pretty much every other cartridge that can shoot this far, list goes on. I would imagine it's also perfectly fine loaded up with your favorite 200 grain hunting bullet for whatever suits you short of big 5 and perhaps Eland.
You had me at "poppycock"!
I love your opinions and also your observation of the factory ammo.
Very good points, as always!
I always wondered about exactly this subject when expose to the 308 Norma magnum. Love your reference to cubic inches of displacement. An old friend of mine was a 3 Rd generation machinist and big into engine building and metallic reloading used to stress this to me back a few years ago. I bought a 300 wsm before understanding how it's a marketing ploy to sell more stuff/calibers.
James Shults the funny thing about WSM is it was marketed to hunters to be able to save an ounce or two via short action but was majorly adopted by F class shooters for low SD and ease of tuning. It was actually a good product but it was presented to the wrong market
I’ve watched a few of your videos and have liked your perspective on how the industry has evolved over the amount of time you’ve been smithing. However, I don’t agree with a couple of the comments you’ve made on this video. You said that if you have a cartridge that duplicates the capacity of another it can’t be superior.... I’ve found that to be inaccurate in my opinion. I think that’s a very broad brush. There are plenty of case designs that aren’t as efficient as another though they could have equal capacity (think number of reloads... rebated rim, shoulder angle, neck length, available brass per cartridge and the list goes on). I personally shoot the 6.5 PRC and like several things about this round better than another tried and trued round of the 6.5 x 284 even though there are many fantastic things about the 6.5 x 284 that has stood the test of time. My 6.5 PRC is also more valuable on the market for resale as well as if I’m in a pinch and needed a box of ammo. I think that there are so many people in the industry that claim “their way” is the best and there’s no reason for any more chamberings in this or that caliber and they get mad when somebody else does what they did a long time ago in trying to improve something... that’s the way we’re made. We want to move forward. I love having more options other than something that’s been around for 100 years or more. I’m not hating on anything that came before some of these modern rifle cartridges... in fact I just put together a 284 Win which was a case that from what I’ve read didn’t accomplish it’s potential (length and hunting vs target) until decades after it was released. I love the 284 Win, I love the .308. I love the 300 WM, I love the 7 Rem Mag, but I love other cartridges in each of their calibers as well and for different reasons. It’s not all about shooting farther... there are many other factors to why we choose the cartridges we shoot than just range. If somebody wants to come out with factory ammo (which I do not shoot in anything other than 17 cal and 22LR) go for it... why is that such a bad thing? It’s been fantastic for the industry and helped sooo many more people get into shooting sports which has helped bring costs down and keep our rights. There’s a lot of “purists” that have such a problem with Hornady and others and I’m over it. Let’s live and let live. They’re great for the industry as far as turn key systems if you want to go that route... and I’ve seen plenty of their (and many other) plastic tip factory bullets shoot that same 1/2 MOA groups you said your shop was putting out... as well as some 1/4 MOA in factory rifles that are ready to ship or already on the shelf in something that is so much less money than a custom rifle would cost.. whether we like it or not the industry is changing again... there will still be markets for smiths in the future but with the prefit and shouldered options on precision rifle barrels (spec’d to 1/10 of 1/000”) who wants to deal with someone that has bad customer service, over promised delivery times and no better accuracy and additional cost? These plastic tipped bullets have also performed flawlessly for me on every animal I’ve shot as I’m hitting them where I’m aiming/dialing. I have custom rifles that shoot. I have smiths that I love working with that have good communication skills... I also have a $189 savage that shoots better than a $4,000 rifle... but I love them both. I’m happy to shoot 28 Nos, 284 Win, 7 Rem Mag, 243, 6CM, 6.5 SAUM, 6BR, and love them each for what they are. The fact is that these days somebody can spend $400 on a factory gun, a few hundred more on a scope and a couple boxes of off the shelf ammo and be shooting a mile... and grow our sport which I’m fine if it grows... if it shrinks we’ll be finding our 2nd amendment rights taken away which none of us want. I appreciate hearing your opinions and your stories are great. Thanks for what you’ve done for the industry over your decades of experience!
Now this is what I call a respectable comment, your opinion and his opinion , this is how a Video and comment should be Respect to both of you !
This is just the talk I needed to keep me from buying another gun. Bad Aaron! You already own a .300 RUM....
Randy speaking the truth! I’ve been hunting with the 300 Weatherby since I was 13! Now 15 years later I still hunt with it! Would never trade that cartridge for any of these newer gimmick cartridges!
How about the old saying ? To each his own ? Live and learn ? Let people spend money , its not yours
J I’d like to see if the 300 prc will be here 70 years from now! 300 wby has proven itself weather you like it or not
Thank you for your experience with the cartridge. I am happy with my 30-06 but I have been curious about the newest and greatest 30 magnum.. I think I’m good with what I have. Thank you and yours. Be blessed.
I very much enjoy hearing your views and insight on anything you care to share about firearms, cartridges, hunting, and the history of it all. Thank you!
I think the difference is, they did more than design a cartridge. They designed a chamber and barrel that are designed to be optimal with certain bullets. Hornady A-Tip bullets in 250 gr in a 1:8 twist barrel. It's a very long bullet designed for long to extreme long range target shooting.
Thank goodness for Hornady, otherwise Randy would have nothing to drone on and on about. I have two factory 6.5C rifles that manage to shoot factory Hornady 140ELD Match ammo sub .5 MOA. They also shoot the American Gunner 140 BTHP ammo sub MOA. So Bergara and Seekins managed to get their rifles to shoot well with the 6.5C specked chamber. I can also attest that 270 145ELD-X "plastic tipped" ammo holds up great and kills deer.
I'll kindly keep using my 257 Roberts and 7x57 M70's for the distances in which I routinely hunt.
If I ever venture westward, I'll invest in a 270Win or maybe an established magnum that's been around for a few decades.
I love hearing Randy and Gun Blue calling out the manufacturing hype that gets shoveled out on a monthly basis. I love this channel for the brutal honesty and common sense explanations of the truth. Randy isn't selling bottles of magic elixirs, cures for the common cold, nor the latest ammo hype!
Thanks for sharing your insights!
Andy doesn't seem to realise that the 300 PRC was , as its' name suggests, designed for long range, short action competition rifles & tournaments.
The 300 PRC fills a most necessary gap in the prescission shooting disciplines, as can be plainly proven by its' undoubted popularity in those realms.
Randy has to recognise that, he's not the only gunsmith &, certainly not the only guy that knows what he's doing in the rifle building industry.
There's no doubt he builds excellent rifles for their intended purpose however, the days of the wood stocked rifles are numbered &, for good reason. I would much rather have fibreglass, carbon fibre or aluminum chassis stock.
Randy really has to stop whining & complaining about things he does't appear at least, to have any knowledge about himself.
I think it’s more about twist rate With these new cartridges. The older calibers can be all over the charts regarding bullet size and stability.
Mr Shelby i have all ready learned a lot lot from your Videos you are the only one that i have watched that is telling the truth you have set me right on a lot of things a bout hunting that i did not know Keep The Good Work Up my friend your videos are great and i will watch ever one of them thanks
According to the people at Hornady, the 300 PRC was designed to use 200 grn plus bullets (very long bullets).
And VLD's to add to that, not like you're loading PRC with 200 RNs etc
No belt, minimal taper, with a sharp, flat shoulder, enough throat to seat bullets out long and magazine length to accommodate the long cartridges. Those are the attributes people are looking for and why there is a market for this round. Yes you can reach the same velocities with the Win Mag, Norma Mag, etc. but you will have to deal with the belt and encroaching on the powder column with the base of the bullet that can affect the extreme spread of the velocity. The Weatherby Mag would be the worst offender of the bunch because it also has the double radius "venturi" shoulder and unless recently changed, too much free bore. All are fine hunting cartridges, and if you already have one there isn't much reason to need the others. However, to dismiss the PRC out of hand shows your lack of engagement with the industry, shooting sports, and potential customers. I am typically an old soul and conservative thinker, but sometimes innovations are just that. Just because you don't have a use for it doesn't mean it is not a useful design for others.
Well said. In my experience The .300 PRC takes all the best attributes of the .300 WM and brings them into the 21'st Century, was there alot of hype surrounding it? Sure, But that's true of all new cartridges. The .300 PRC absolutely delivers, I have shot both side by side and can say that my groups are tighter my wind deflection is less, and velocity is more consistent with Handloads.
Poppycock!!! LOL!! No, I agree with you completely. The only thing I don't like about the .300 prc, is the price and availability of ammo.
Effen A, Bubba! Took the words right outta my mouth.
Great summary. The PRC also has a well thought out throat design to accommodate those long bullets. In order to get bullets out that far with the 300 Win mag you have to get a custom throat. With the PRC there doesn’t seem to be as much need to test 50 different seating depths to get great accuracy. If somebody already has a 30 cal magnum that shoots great there’s probably no need to change, but if you are getting a new 30 cal magnum rifle I think the PRC is the clear choice.
I’m glad there’s somebody else that doesn’t agree with this old fud, I haven’t seen a single video I agree with. But my favorite is where he claimed he invented the 6gt.
Another thing Hornady likes to do is intentionally run light loads in anything that’s not a Hornady cartridge, the 300 win mag and 300 Norma mag are prime examples of this where in the case of the 300 Norma for instance, hornadys loading for the 225 eld in a 300 Norma is right around 2800 fps when this cartridge was designed to push 230gr bullets to 3000fps but they don’t want it to over shadow on the prc so they do everything they can to make the prc push the 225 to 2900 safely including running a lot of jump as you mentioned to help reduce pressure which works but also degrades accuracy. In my Norma I’ve pushed the 225 to 3070fps and the same bullet from my 300 win mag has hit 2970. Mark and Sam in Australia have seen where the prc can’t hit the same speeds as the 300win mag with the heaviest 30cal bullets. The prc will pass and the win mag and Norma will remain. I’ve never once had an issue with a cartridge that had a belt so don’t understand why that’s an issue for everyone else, have to wonder if it’s the arrow or the Indian in that instance.
Keeping it 💯..... subscribed. I'm sticking with my 300win.
Randy, you need to write a book.
I’d buy it.
P.S. great shirt
Thanks for the lecture, but you may want to answer the phone its Hornady calling...
CAexile haha. Yes! They would have him schooled up quick. He’s set in his ways and just rejects any new progress.
Now That's Funny !!!
Hell be making custom rifles for them in a week
@@seanmetzger4780 LOL!!
@@robertbrantley1449 except for that whole "explaining" thing he does.
Randy, not sure if this video is in response to one of my last questions to you about necking down my 300 win mag, but GREAT VIDEO. Thank you !
Thank you for taking the time to educate and explain things in a way of weeding out misinformation. Great video. Side note: 4AW-MarkandSam AfterWork channel has a video shooting 300 PRC and 300 WM with the same style rifle where as bullet and barrel relationship is mimicked and the results are stunning at 3k yards or so… (hint)… you are right on the money, sir!
Edit: I wanted to add to the same notion the entire hype of the 6.5 CM and 6.5 PRC… would not the old .264 win mag with a proper throated and rifled barrel with action length to boot be the exact same thing or better? The new iphone 13 or 31 or 82 is only a slightly tweaked $1k+ phone with nothing new really. But it does SELL so yes, what you are saying must be said. People with your skilled trade who have been perfecting these guns over the years and to have someone put a bow and ribbons on the same gun and call it a laser beam light saber is an insult. Id guess to say that with your experience, you have probably made or thought up of most possible normal sized caliber/wildcat combos that are feasible and with today’s technology im guess you have the means to create them so in reality its still just multi-centuries old case,powder and bullet down a barrel that has the same limitations due to physics and chemistry boundaries that you have been and still are working with as you have your whole life. Ill admit i bought into the hype with the creedmoor and PRC. Now studying the ballistic capabilities i see what you are explaining is fair. It comes down to the same rules and limitations that are nothing close to new. But i will end in saying that the 300 PRC DOES have a damn near perfect combination of traits of the 30 caliber rifles. Its like breeding them all together and finally getting a show worthy specimen. Nothing new, not really, BUT a bad ass .30 cal with top notch ballics, yes. Thanks again.
Hmmm.... my aics mags fit a 140eldm
.015" off the lands just fine? Even plastic magpul mags fit great?
The 30 PRC was purpose built with considerations not only to the case but to the projectile that it utilizes. It is built using precise ballistic models and is designed to optimize the ELD series projectiles in the maximum way. It's not simply stuffing a 30 cal (xxx grain) bullet into a different case. This is a new age of cartridge development. Embrace it or be left behind!
Got my first 300wm in 1969. Shot my first deer with it in 1970 all these new cartridges are for the younger kids so they can say they have the best cartridge ever still shooting my old 300wm will be 80 next year when I go out to Wyoming for elk and deer
Thanks for sharing and you do have a great rifle/caliber. Just an FYI on Wyoming hunt. Not sure where you are planning to hunt. Many areas of the state are still reeling with extreme snow and are estimating, in some places [not where we live, it's been mild here] up to 80% or more winter kill for antelope, and close to that high for mule deer and elk [but they are holding out hope that the elk winter kill may be a bit lower]. There may be great tag reductions for some areas of the state, so stay tuned to the Wyoming Game & Fish site for any update. Cowboy State Daily News, on line news service, you can find by typing that altogether followed by .com has had a few articles on this just in the last week, and tells which areas are of most concerns at this time.
There is another major storm hitting those areas again today and tomorrow. It is very, very sad!
Thanks for watching.
I always liked the 30-378 Weatherby. I had a Mark V for my 1000 yard rifle. I really never shot a lot of rounds at one time to make the recoil a problem. My dad was old school and shot his M40 to 1000 yards. I'm happy with the 7.62x51 and the 30-06 and .30 carbine. I can do almost anything with those rounds.
My local gun shop gunsmith went to a long range school in west Texas, put the 300prc on steel at 2200 yards repeatedly with a ruger precision 1700$ off the shelf rifle, go get your 300wetherby mag and show up and get showed out, 300prc is doing 338 lapua work at 2$ a round instead of 5$ to 6$ a round
So does my 300 weatherby with 210 grain bullets, read a reloading manual or look at ballistic charts.
For long range shooting (1000m+) the .300PRC is one of the top .30cal magnums
Nolan Randolph well the .300PRC can go up to 250gr bullets which will suck out of the weatherby
@@borkwoof696 and a 300 weatherby can't go up to 250 grain bullets why? Enlighten me please.
Go buy one and put it on steel at 2200 yards. You ain't your local gunsmith who's shot thousands of rounds I'd bet. It ain't the caliber, it's the shooter stupid.
The 300 prc has been shot for quite a few years as various wildcats. Standardizing it was a good move by Hornady, they were able to dictate coal for the bullets they have currently available while using a case that may possibly reduce brass flow. While I agree that performance with other 30 cal magnums is equal or better there are definitely some advantages to using this cartridge for a person that does not want to use a wildcat.
Well said Randy!! I’m 46 years old. Been shooting the 300 win mag since I was a kid. Shot my first deer with a 308 Norma mag that my dad bought me. Don’t even remember what the make was. Wish I still had that rifle!!
If your going to compare it to a 300 Weatherby then that’s a good place to start. Weatherby ammo is $110 a box and Hornady is $44 a box. 300 WIN runs around 2850fps w a 180 gr bullet, 300 PRC runs 3000 fps w a 225 gr bullet. Military chose the PRC over the Norma due to the Norma cartridge did not maintain a consistent burn rate at different degrees of angle where the PRC was very consistent in mountain terrain. New designed bullets, new powders new ideas.
The truth is 95% of the shots I have made with my 300 win mag on game my 30-30 would have cleanly killed...
Trevor Froese exactly. Matter of want not need.
Trevor Froese....exactly !!
Yep
I think if Randy had gotten his own car trade certified by SAAMI, he would’ve called it the 30 wind bag. Truthfully, look and see how many 300 H&H magnums have won Wimbleton in the last 20 years. It’s been discovered that a short that column of powder is much more consistent and it’s burning then a long narrow one. I think that hornet he is bringing out different rounds to give people options. We use Apple phones to talk to each other now, not a cable laid across the Atlantic Ocean. The old cartridges do work but not as well and is sufficiently is the new cartridges. Technology in time marches on. Arrogance and ignorance are not a good combination.
blindboyjonny, you don't hunt much do you?
Here's a question:
If you were to design a .30cal do-all cartridge from scratch, what would it look like? What kind of performance? Would it be nearly identical to the .308? Would it be like something more powerful, like a 7mm Rem Mag?
Because I haven't heard of any really new cartridges that weren't merely necked down or ... necked up? ... from a parent cartridge, and there's so many different cartridges that have been designed at this point...is there any point to designing brand new?
Pretty much
I just stick to my 30-06. It’s dropped everything I’ve shot at and it’s wonderful to reload and to shoot. It’s my perfect all around caliber.
If you handload, 30-06. If you don't, .308. They will do any reasonable job asked of them.
Luke Donnan…..the late Col. Cooper use to say, "not much can't be fixed with $700 and a 30-06.
@@Cool-hand-hunting I have a 30.06 BSA bolt one, the other is a REM 740 & for shots past 300 yards top shooting a .300 rum //
I have enjoyed your lessons on rifles and ammo. I understand better the relationship between the two. Thanks
Thanks for your knowledge its been a true help to me.
I love your channel. You have a lot of insight as well as experience.Keep up the work.
I agree 100% for accuracy he hit on every factor that will give the shooter the best results.. Excellent video..
Thanks for showing your gear!
Yes Sir you are correct. Most people don’t have the aptitude, knowledge, or experience to understand what you are explaining. So companies use smoke n’ mirrors and hype to excite human behavior. Guns are exciting and energizing, they just market to those emotions. I will always plan, setup, and load for accuracy first over velocity.
Mr Randy i don't know enough about guns to carry your water but i had come to the same conclusion that you have just stated . Nice to have you verify my opinion on the Hornady plastic tips too . Merry Christmas !
This man's knowledge is intoxicating! Thank you so much for sharing it with us.
Love these videos.
Watch what mark and Sam after work have to say about these cartridges. Unique finding isn't so much the powder used but bullet weight. Shorter fatter through bullets of lighter weights like a
.300 PRC (215 to 220) grain shoots more accurate then with heavier bullets. But the opposite is true for a .300 Win mag .250 grain in this longer skinny cartridges are more accurate. Now this being said, we are talking 2700 yards... go watch the videos. I have always noticed my .30-06 shoots better heavier and that's not including having to shoot ultra long.
I use factory hunting rifles with factory ammo. Much of it Hornady, with those "poor plastic tips" and I make ethical, fast, and clean kills on several animals each year, without losing them. I don't buy into hype, but to speak as if I must have a custom rifle, with hand loaded ammo, and a tried and true "insert grandpappy's favorite bullet", to kill animals ethically at distance, is illogical at best.
Not illogical at all for this reason. You get more consistent velocity, tighter groups and your choice of bullets when you Handload than you can buy, 99% of the time.
@@MrHyde-dt1sx your average shooter at 400 yards and under will never notice the difference between hand loads and factory ammo.
@@matthewkyle6939 if that's the case, why does every one of the people that I let shoot my factory rifles with my handloads produce better groups than they do with factory ammo?
@@MrHyde-dt1sx yes most of the time properly made hand loads will be more accurate. I'm saying that at under 400 yards with quality match grade ammo, the average shooter notice that big of a difference. You can disagree. I don't care. This is America.
@@matthewkyle6939 I do disagree. You're dense as a rock
Randy.... 300 PRC was developed for the ELR game. Will shoot right with the 338 Lapua, and the 300 Norma with factory available ammo. Custom smiths should benefit from this new cartridge.....Hornady R&D has this dialed in and GunWerks folks seemed to be pretty impressed with the round...... you sound kind of bitter, or upset...... I hope the round takes off like the 6.5 CM......many smiths are putting out race guns in that caliber and enjoying success.
Outdoor writing influencers make a living baking confidence cookies for shooters. Appetizing hype can satisfy cravings more than taste buds with skillful presentation.
Great analogy!
Thanks for watching!
I believe your right on again my 300 Wsm is equal to the 338 other then short action. I myself am a full time hunting guide of 35 years for mostly big game i have seen almost every Wild Cat, WSM all calibers what I have learned is the old timers simply had an have it figured out anything new can be compared equal to anything old except bullets. Sense you talked plastic tip bullets well This year do to circumstances 7 of the deer where shot with my rifle do to long range from poor prep on the clients gun work. 7 of the deer where shot with 143 grain ELD-X after not doing my home work shame on me but do to the hype how can so many people be wrong I found out the hard way not one deer had a pass through fact the bullet only made it through the first shoulder then blew apart on all 7 so I thought well a varmint load maybe well yesterday 175 yards I called a coyote in the shot hit lower neck just above the shoulder an below the jaw line no pass through again the ELD-X blew up. Not the guns or calibers to some degree I have never had issues with Barnes an also Berger bullets I believe the Hornady ELD-X should be best shot by bench shooters where it shines not on game. Only a opinion one hunter to another.
you are right, i used eld-x bullets this year in 25-06 and 30-06 on deer and elk,, both caliber bullets blew up on rib shots, very poor performance,, required several shots on both deer and elk to finish the job,,,,, animals acted like i might have used a 22-250 with varmint bullets,,,,,no more for me,,,,,
Same results here with the 200 gr eldx on deer and elk. No exits. Back to accubond and Barnes for me.
Factory loaded ammo has to be able to fit and work in all factory made rifles. If they lengthened the bullets out longer then the ammo might not work in a certain firearm or cause bad accuracy. The 300 prc was designed to shoot heavy long low drag bullets. Yeah all the other 30 Cal Magnums will shoot them to but it's just bullet manufacturers trying to be innovative. So if company just produced the same cartridges with the same bullets with the same ammo nobody would even be having this conversation. It's just about trying to offer a new product if you don't like it don't buy it. Instead of bashing the bullet manufacturers or rifle manufacturers how bout showing them some gratitude for at least trying to put out some new products. You can't please everyone and someone that makes custom rifles will always be able to fix manufacturers defects or pick up on their short comings.
I respectfully think you missed a key point in the video
"Do we really need another 30 caliber?"
@@mr.nobody68 If you don't need one doesn't mean someone else doesn't want one. The more options the better
Fact is it is at the top. In velocity,wind deflection,std dev, and retained down range energy.
Sir thank you I sincerely appreciate and value cherish your honesty
How bout the 30-378 weatherby mag!! Now that is the boss 30 cal magnum for sure!
Darrin Hodgkiss that's a boss out of a 28" barrel. So so much powder to burn 26" is just too short. I load a 300 RUM with 180 Accubonds and Reloader 25 powder and my magneto-speed agrees with my ancient Chrony that it averages just over 3350 fps out of a 26" barrel. A hunting buddy has a beautiful Weatherby 30-378 Accumark with the factory 28" barrel and handloads too and our velocities are very close usually with in +/- 50 fps. I actually have a real 378 Weatherby left hand Mark V with its' 26" barrel and the recoil! But that bigger bore lets the burning powder and gases out of the case neck into a bigger 'pipe' therefore larger volume of flow so 26" works. Necked down to .308" and to get that powder and gases out takes more internal volume to get it to burn completely for max velocity. If you know hydraulics it'll make more sense because just substitute the gases for the hyd fluid.
Like I said before on your website.....I've been shooting a 6.5 Creedmoor for many many years only it was called a 6.5x55 Swede. It's all hype. Not as bad as the golf industry but dang near it. I understand they have to stay in business and keeps sales moving along, but the hype is so typical of today's culture for younger folks. I don't fall for it. I, like many of your readers, knows what works and that's what we stick to.
I told some guys at the gun store the exact same thing a few days ago. Here's the reply I got, "Bbbbbut, muh short action"
Like they're going to be shooting PRS style with time limits while hunting.
marcogram….exactly. I just don't get all the rage about short action rifle actions. Cycle the damn bolt like you got a pair is my answer. I like to refer to Craig Boddington article one time when he likes to say, "the .308 is inherently more accurate than a 30-06." Technically it probably is due to case length/powder burn but who gives a shit if it shoots 1/4" smaller groups than a 06 to a guy sitting in a deer stand? Young shooters really don't understand or care about things like that. They just want to one-up their buddies and the firearms/ammo industry thrives on that.
I won't buy a creedmore because of the hype. The sweede is my choice too.
.
@@marcogram1216 Realistically they're very similar, there are many more factory loadings for 6.5 creedmoor than the swede. Plus, most aftermarket accessories are geared towards short actions. If you reload just for hunting (or even recreational long range shooting), there's not a ton of difference.
The PRC isn't a 375 just necked down. The throat has been tightened up just like you said you do with custom reamers. The straighter you start a bullet the better the gun will shoot and it was designed by Joe Thielen a 1000 yard Benchrest shooter.
The 300 Weatherby or 300 Ackley which is just the Weatherby in an improved form won a ton of matches but they aren't using 0.330 free bore and loose throats.
Randy you are the wise man at the top of the mountain! You are the hunting AND gunsmithing OBI WON KENOBI! I appreciate your time, humility, and sharing your wisdom with us!!!
Humility??
The real question is how much rifle can most people shoot! From what I've seen a large percentage of shooters can't handle a 30-06 well, and virtually nobody that I know shoots but a few rounds through thier 308 Magnum hunting rifles, even with a muzzle break. People should stick to the calibers they're not afraid of, shoot them enough to become proficient, so that thier shot placement matters, and then they won't want a rifle that destroys so much meat, on say a whitetail deer. I'm personally unsatisfied with the damage that a .243 Win. does on the front shoulder of a large deer, many use twice as much gun. That doesn't make them a better hunter, just someone who has fallen for the Magnum cartridge hype. Hey I was guilty of it myself some time ago, but I learned. I learned that a properly placed bullet from even a revolver, from a reasonable distance, depending on the skill of the shooter will put a large deer down in it's track's, "not that I think everyone should use a handgun", they shouldn't, but if you do, a .357 has the power to cleanly kill a whitetail deer to at least 50yrds. The point being it's the skilled shooter that makes the kill, not the cartridge! JMOFWIW
We have a winner. My Dad recently gave me his 300 WM Ruger 77. It belts me right in the chin and hated shooting it as a kid. Now that I have a lot more time running a bolt gun, I know It needs a recoil pad and lower mounts. But hell I don't need anymore than that.
I've been shooting deer in the neck and they drop on the spot ,not much meat wasted at all thx...
I’ll stick with my 30-06 and 270 can kill every thing in North America and a bunch elsewhere. Now if I go to long range shooting I’d go 7 practical.
scott stutzman same here but I also use my 264 win mag , 270 win , 30-06 and 300 weatherby that’s why these cals been around for a long time because they work , my hunting buddy usually uses a 300 rum and 7 mm stw and 270 win
What about the weatherby ,the bullet has to jump to the lanse correct? If I try seating the bullet to the lanse it won.t cycle in my clip if I'm not mistaken weatherby did this on purpose so it improves velocity and stabilizes pressures.Your thoughts please.I could never touch the lanse in my weatherbys and they are accurate half inch submoa.
I think you’re missing the point. Obviously there’s nothing wrong with any other 30 cal magnums. I think 300 win mag will do it all but they designed the 300 prc like the 6.5 Creedmoor and that round is plain accurate out of any factory rifle with factory ammunition regardless of distance or jump to the lands. The design of the cartridge makes it inherently accurate
Always a pleasure to hear from you Randy! Yes, Hornady keeps hyping up anything they can to keep the "wanna-be snipers" happy and spending their money and they have that formula down pretty good! When one of their "Darling new wonder cartridges" begins to slow down in the market place, up pops another "new wonder cartridge" to replace and amaze the crowd... The "300prc" will replace ALL cartridges that even remotely fit into a rifle or anything that looks like a rifle, for the next 1,000 years and we all know that! All the relevant and highly skilled professional "precision shooters" who DEMAND HORNADY ACCURACY (which is beyond worldly physics) must have the new and fictionally improved (paper proofed) products from what was, until the the wonders of internet marketing, a mediocre company in the firearms industry at best... The majority of Hornady products do not live up to the hype that their marketing department creates.
Well, your rant sure doesn’t help your perspective. 300 PRC will become popular with hand loafers because no belt, longer heavier BC bullets, and it doesn’t cost what a 300 Weatherby ammo cost.
@@Thamac15 Have you priced out both brands of ammos with comparable bullets? Are you going to compare Hornady brass and bullets with Norma brass and better premium bullets that Weatherby offers?
The US Military just contracted with Barret for a large number of sniper rifles chambered in 300 PRC. The 300 PRC does for 30 caliber what the 6.5 Creedmoor did for 6.5 mm.
MMPS
What he is saying is , it is nothing new it's just another cartridge made up that does the same thing that we already have. Yet the marketing hype on it makes people believe it's the best and greatest thing since sliced bread. It's kind of like archery equipment now every year it gets better and better and better supposedly. Yet my 2014 bow still shoots as good as any of the new things. I think his point is sometimes change it's just to get change out of your pocket!
@@southerntriplej8061 Technology improvements are mostly evolutionary ... i.e. incremental (minor). Evolutionary change is incremental and takes place gradually, over time. Revolutionary advancements are rare. Of course - gun companies can make money selling new cartridge designs... but why would they improve the technology without the incentive of making a profit? The USA is not a Communist country (yet)... private industry needs money to perform R&D.
P.S. I'm not into archery - but I suspect your 2014 bow performs better than a bow made in 1914.
@MMPS agree... the 300 PRC looks like an improvement over the classic 300 Winchester, but it is more compatible than the 300 Norma.
MMPS and Alberta Vila, I understand burn powder rate completely, and I have for decades. I've stated this in my videos.
@MMPS You're just a typical loud mouth know nothing punk.
Good job! Regards from Skandinavia👍
Jumping bullets works, and it works very well you should try it.
Dang. A real gunsmith, lifelong hand-loader, and a hunter giving a lifetime of knowledge for free!! Hell yes I am going to listen. Then, I see comments bashing him like the get off my yard guy. He gives a lifetime of wisdom of what works and what doesn’t work.
He knows most people don’t live where big game is hunted. Maybe never seen a real live elk or moose. He just wants the average Joe to buy what is a proven cartridge for the game hunted. He also wants the people to go with proven bullets like the partition, A-Frames, Siciroco, Accubond’s.
He ultimately wants to see our majestic wildlife taken quick and humanly.
As always if this new cartridge floats your boat then please get it. If punching paper at 2,000 yards off the bench is what does it for you then get the new wonder zapper. He just wants you to take everything in consideration when buying a new round.
WELL said!
It's interesting that people wouldn't consider that a company might push a product that has little to no real advantage over an existing cartridge just to make a whole bunch of money from people who think there gaining an advantage.