@11:04 becoming the governorship request for Achaia has only a 42% chance of success, while the Theme of Krete and Cyprus both had a 100% chance of success. Should have gone for either of these 2.
Yeah, but those are really far away from Khazars and Kerch. I felt they were a bit random and would have taken us in a completely different direction. I doubt Michael would have just given up Kerch that easily given the history of the last 50 years.
@@immersioneer It's important when playing the admin Governmemt to play the government. If you don't try to make your position better you will fade away. Taking a governorship that is in reach is better than fading to obscurity.
@immersioneer as Huntanor said, these are not end goals, but rather spring boards to better things. And taking a governorship in, say, Krete does not stop you from pursuing your old county back. After all, you would still have a strong claim on Kerch that your children will inherit.
Cyrus may have secluded himself because of a murder plot? Seclusion is one of the ways you can stop a murder plot if you go to the scheme tab and look at the scheme defense options.
Yeah, possible. He does have low legitimacy, so that's quite possible... Secluding himself only serves to exacerbate that, however... Better than being dead, on the other hand...
To find out if you are marshal or not, or just who is on the liege's council. Open the council tab from the far left, then select the sub tab for Liege's council at the top. That will show you who is on your liege's council, and at which positions they are. You can tell that you are not on the council because of the outfit you are wearing. Teh game will adjust your outfit to fit whatever role you have on a council if you have one. The marshal will automatically be dressed in armor. Since you are not, you can tell that you are not on your liege's council.
Thank you! Yup, I noticed the costume change as well, but the one we currently have is really weird... Could be military, could be anything else... What is that hat?..
@immersioneer Use your influence to place yourself or your (preferred) heir first in line for any governorship. Pick the best you can afford. It's not as fast as being granted one, but you can eventually force the governor to resign.
The head of a Dynasty is determined by which House Head has the biggest army. House Head is usually determined by succession, going to the primary heir. As far as I am aware, you cannot lose house head, but it is likely that the House Head also has to be landed, and that is likely why you lost the house head. If you can recover the save, once you get landed, you should be able to form a cadet branch, and then you would become the head of the cadet branch. And once your Cadet branch gets the largest army of the House heads, then it would become the Dynasty head. I wonder, with the addition of Roads to Power, if they made it possible for Adventurers to create a cadet branch, or if you still have to be landed for that?
@immersioneer I don't think you can get it back outside of becoming the person who currently has its primary heir and then inheriting it from them when they die. Unlanded people can not be Head of House, so it went to the next in line, which would be your father's 2nd heir. Which is why Cyrus didn't get it despite having the highest tier title in the family. He was 3rd or 4th in line.
The no player heir thing I believe is a holdover from the pre-Roads to Power DLC when you could not play as an unlanded character. Now, you should be able to choose between a couple of different characters on death to play as. You have several brothers so possible one of them? either that, or get one of your kids to be a governor, then they would be your heir automatically since they are landed. It could also be that since you have no land, and your children have no land, that it is still a game over unless you declare yourself an Adventurer, since that didn't seem to happen automatically. Then you would have a title one of your children could inherit.
Yeah, but don't we automatically get a Duchy title if we are not landed? Especially if we are a "powerful family"? And how do I "declare myself an adventurer"? I don't see a button / decision for that anywhere. I was thinking the same and looked around, but didn't see it...
@@immersioneerNo, the house head gets it. Your not the house head because on title lose the qualifications were checked and someone else was more qualified I think. Your in an odd spot, you need to get any title fast and fight for house head, or try and make a cadet branch and get a theme Long enough for your cadet branch to form a new noble house. There are weird outcomes that only happen when you hold admin counties that I haven't tested much. Like it seems that getting unlanded should not have changed house head status and tgat might be a bug, or it just a really rare outcome. I don't know if you ever where house head after the previous character died because I would expect it to be the Emperor. You should check your brothers to see if one of them has the familly title. One was definitely formed at one point because you qualified for being a powerful familly which require a familly title
@Huntanor House Head is inherited by primary heir. So you can't lose the Head of House while alive, so now that you lost it, you can't ever get it back. Normally, you can't lose Head of House while allive, but I think being landed is a requirement to be Head of House so that is gone forever, even getting landed again since the only way for the other branch of the family to lose it is to get unlanded themselves. If, however you get landed again, you could form a Cadet branch, and would thus become the Head of House of the Cadet branch. The Dynasty Head is whichever Head of House has the biggest army. So, while you can't ever get the Head of House (of the original Household) back, you could get the Dynasty Head back. As to why Cyrus didn't get the Head of House despite being the emperor and having the highest tier title (and thus also biggest army) I believe he is the younger brother of the man who got the Head of House. Since Head of House is an inherited title, it went to the person next in line. I am speculating, of course. You could open the game up and pause it and then look at them and see if the Head of House is indeed an older brother of Cyrus to be sure.
@immersioneer only Adventurers get a Dutchy tier title. Unlanded people who are not adventurers are just unlanded (otherwise, every courtier would be a Duke!). From what I understand, to become an Adventurer, you need to be Duke tier or less title, and your culture must have the appropriate culture trait? I would guess that Greek culture does not have the correct trait for the decision? I have read that if you designate a child who will not inherit any titles, when you die, you can choose to play as that character as an adventurer upon death.
@@spamfilter32I basically bug tested this after as I mentioned in another post. His character was never house head. It was one of his brothers Philippos. You can see the title in his frame by pausing anytime when Philippis is in focous, it a duchy title with the hous heraldry as the flag. You cannot be the holder of a noble house's special title without being the head of the house the code treats them as the same and the title is generated when two things are true. One youhave a character with a duchy title or higher. Two the house has a house head to hold the title. I do not know why Philippis was tge primary heir. This is strange because I don't know why the game set Philippos as primary heir. I can say absolutely that happened. A playable character has a save flag called playable set to yes normally. This is any character you can pick by switching in the main menu. It never includes characters without titles. Both types of characters you can play as unlanded are flagged as playable and this is why camps and house have titles in the code. The code prunes all character flagged as yes to flagged as no if they have no titles. It also excludes a list of special titles republic theocratic and barony title as well as a few other cannot be flagged as playable This character had not titles and was still playable meaning he was flagged as playable falsely. When he lost his title he should have either game overed or had a chance to generate a title, specifically an Adventures Camp. When this happens, the game throws a full sized splash, like you get when you enter a struggle. This never happened. So I tested it. Currently a character is not thrown the event to generate a camp if they are unlanded due to a war they did not lead. I reproduced this in Greece and then I use The war against Northumbria to prove it happens to all characters. Before you would game over if you lost your last title. Now if you lose your own war you get to make a camp or quit event. But characters who lose their titles due to their liege losing a war no longer get the game over screen, but do to either a serious oversight or a bad bug they also do not get a form a camp event. This throws them into a sort void were they are flagged as playable but they can only take limited actions, they don't have a court, they lose their house marker (it goes black) and the can't take any action related to a title. If your not on Ironman you can just switch off to any other character at the loss of achievement qualification. Doing so corrects the flag of the other character making them a proper unlanded and unplayable courtier. On iron man the game seems to eventually prune you, removing your playable flag and throwing you a black screen crash. A playable character in the current methodology does require a title. Either a landless title or a qualified landed title. You can set a character flag to playable as a save edit without titles and you get the same effect. You can load them up they have limited options and eventually you get pruned. The only way to fix this is to remove tge Ironman encryption (which remove achievement status) and editing the character to have a title. This will allow them to persist if it was my save I force him to be housebhead and change the title to held by him. Otherwise this is a permanent crash state in Ironman because you can switch out and you can roll back to get a title earlier
Yeah, I have. Let’s see if they fix it. Such a shame though, I think this was going great. Do you have any good ideas for a new playthrough? I can start it while waiting for a patch and continue this one later if / when it gets fixed. I was toying around with the idea of a Steppe Warrior adventurer? I’ve never played in this region and I haven’t seen a lot of landless gameplay there. We can also try something middle eastern / muslim? Maybe also jewish / holy land / Jerusalem? Should we start landless or landed?
@@immersioneerSomeone suggested to me doing a landless Jewish game with the idea of making an enclave in Iberia. Seemed like something fun though historically unlikely. Steppe Mercinary would be awesome it is as you say highly underplayed.
@@Huntanor Hmm... I don't want to settle in Iberia though, I want to settle in the Holy Land. I'll test it out if I have time this week. Steppe Lord would be cool as well... which one, which one...
@immersioneer if you are not going to be in an Administrative Realm, then I would suggest landless. Landless in the Iranian Intermezzo could be interesting. Or Step as you suggested. Just because aware, it is harder to find spouses as a landless.
Unfortunately, Cyrus was sieging down the wrong parts of Kazaria. He should have sieged down Or Qapi. That was the capital of the enemy war leader. He could have possibly gotten an important hostage that could have helped with the war score issues. The Alan territories were only allies, and therefore sieging them provided no war score or important hostages.
Okay, so, watching very carefully since you haven't shown it explicitly. The house title is held by Philippos. You need it, or you need a cadet branch and a theme to form a new one. Not holding hat title means you only have power through Admin action and schemes. It looks like he took itbwhen your father died because his Governorship gave him more raw power than you county gave you.
Looking at the end of last episode you did not get a new house head toast when you lost your title which implies you already did not have it, which makes sense, if you had it then you'd have it now as it's an unlanded title you can hold after being ousted. Likely your brother was more qualified than you at your father's death. Admin is a strange and specific play style you might want to try and focus a bit more pragmatically on what you can do for a time. All people sometimes fall to a point when getting stable is more important than bigger dreams. You character might have to accept tgat for now he needs to grab what ever power he can so he doesn't fall to obscurity.
Okay, so those crashes are likely critical errors. I don't think your character should have been able to continue. Landless characters need to be titled, and you had no titles, you were not house head, and had no county. I think you kept playing because your position of regent prevent the game from pushing you to landless adventurer, normally losing your last title generates a camp and you go on unless you have a noble house which serves the same purpose. As a regent you did not qualify for a camp and got put in a suspended state. The game favors allowing a character to exsist, so you were suspended, allowed to exsist as regent since it prevented you from getting pruned and down graded to non-playable. Once you lost regency you got pruned and down graded on the next check tick. Since you play Ironman this is likely a critical bug. If it was a normal save you could roll back to the point were you could as for a theme and take one of the 100% chance one to get titled before you were pruned.
This bug is worse that I thought. All county level characters who don't qualify for an estate just get dumped into the void on being unlanded. I did your start, forced tge empire to lose my war and I ruined into a landless uncontrolled character who I could still play. Accept I was a courtier of the Khan and got thrown to his capital. I can't even take actions at all. I have no heir because I gave no titles. Being regent seems to have just given you a few options I don't have. I'm going to write a through bug report as this I'd an un payable state that's pretty easy to reproduce
This is an enormous over sight. Because forming a noble familly requires being a Duke or higher and Greeks don't naturally make adventure camps, all characters under duch level become semi-playable wanderers on losing their last title. They dont form camps and they can't form houses. This means any character that isn't house head being played that is unlanded doesn't game over, they just exsist landless and without actions to take
This is an very big over sight I'm surprised isn't getting more attention but it is pretty rare I guess. Apparently this happens to every character that losses their title due to a liege's war. It's most common in the empire but I reproduced it by taking a Northumbrian count and letting the Norse win. I was again shunted to the void. But if I played as the liege lord, I got the option to continue in a camp. This is clearly an oversight. Even if they were trying to limit camp formation, it should be a game over at least.
@11:04 becoming the governorship request for Achaia has only a 42% chance of success, while the Theme of Krete and Cyprus both had a 100% chance of success. Should have gone for either of these 2.
Yeah, but those are really far away from Khazars and Kerch. I felt they were a bit random and would have taken us in a completely different direction. I doubt Michael would have just given up Kerch that easily given the history of the last 50 years.
@@immersioneer It's important when playing the admin Governmemt to play the government. If you don't try to make your position better you will fade away. Taking a governorship that is in reach is better than fading to obscurity.
@immersioneer as Huntanor said, these are not end goals, but rather spring boards to better things. And taking a governorship in, say, Krete does not stop you from pursuing your old county back. After all, you would still have a strong claim on Kerch that your children will inherit.
Cyrus may have secluded himself because of a murder plot? Seclusion is one of the ways you can stop a murder plot if you go to the scheme tab and look at the scheme defense options.
Yeah, possible. He does have low legitimacy, so that's quite possible... Secluding himself only serves to exacerbate that, however... Better than being dead, on the other hand...
To find out if you are marshal or not, or just who is on the liege's council. Open the council tab from the far left, then select the sub tab for Liege's council at the top. That will show you who is on your liege's council, and at which positions they are. You can tell that you are not on the council because of the outfit you are wearing. Teh game will adjust your outfit to fit whatever role you have on a council if you have one. The marshal will automatically be dressed in armor. Since you are not, you can tell that you are not on your liege's council.
Thank you! Yup, I noticed the costume change as well, but the one we currently have is really weird... Could be military, could be anything else... What is that hat?..
@@immersioneer i don't know, but I think a trip to the barber is necessary for an outfit change.
Promote yourself, or your eldest son to Theme of the House Heir.
What do you mean? Not sure I’m following that…
@immersioneer Use your influence to place yourself or your (preferred) heir first in line for any governorship. Pick the best you can afford. It's not as fast as being granted one, but you can eventually force the governor to resign.
The head of a Dynasty is determined by which House Head has the biggest army. House Head is usually determined by succession, going to the primary heir. As far as I am aware, you cannot lose house head, but it is likely that the House Head also has to be landed, and that is likely why you lost the house head. If you can recover the save, once you get landed, you should be able to form a cadet branch, and then you would become the head of the cadet branch. And once your Cadet branch gets the largest army of the House heads, then it would become the Dynasty head.
I wonder, with the addition of Roads to Power, if they made it possible for Adventurers to create a cadet branch, or if you still have to be landed for that?
I see, then as soon as I get a governorship, I should be able to come back to being a dynasty head… no idea about landless gameplay, tbh…
@immersioneer I don't think you can get it back outside of becoming the person who currently has its primary heir and then inheriting it from them when they die.
Unlanded people can not be Head of House, so it went to the next in line, which would be your father's 2nd heir. Which is why Cyrus didn't get it despite having the highest tier title in the family. He was 3rd or 4th in line.
The no player heir thing I believe is a holdover from the pre-Roads to Power DLC when you could not play as an unlanded character. Now, you should be able to choose between a couple of different characters on death to play as. You have several brothers so possible one of them? either that, or get one of your kids to be a governor, then they would be your heir automatically since they are landed. It could also be that since you have no land, and your children have no land, that it is still a game over unless you declare yourself an Adventurer, since that didn't seem to happen automatically. Then you would have a title one of your children could inherit.
Yeah, but don't we automatically get a Duchy title if we are not landed? Especially if we are a "powerful family"? And how do I "declare myself an adventurer"? I don't see a button / decision for that anywhere. I was thinking the same and looked around, but didn't see it...
@@immersioneerNo, the house head gets it. Your not the house head because on title lose the qualifications were checked and someone else was more qualified I think. Your in an odd spot, you need to get any title fast and fight for house head, or try and make a cadet branch and get a theme Long enough for your cadet branch to form a new noble house. There are weird outcomes that only happen when you hold admin counties that I haven't tested much. Like it seems that getting unlanded should not have changed house head status and tgat might be a bug, or it just a really rare outcome. I don't know if you ever where house head after the previous character died because I would expect it to be the Emperor.
You should check your brothers to see if one of them has the familly title. One was definitely formed at one point because you qualified for being a powerful familly which require a familly title
@Huntanor House Head is inherited by primary heir. So you can't lose the Head of House while alive, so now that you lost it, you can't ever get it back. Normally, you can't lose Head of House while allive, but I think being landed is a requirement to be Head of House so that is gone forever, even getting landed again since the only way for the other branch of the family to lose it is to get unlanded themselves. If, however you get landed again, you could form a Cadet branch, and would thus become the Head of House of the Cadet branch. The Dynasty Head is whichever Head of House has the biggest army.
So, while you can't ever get the Head of House (of the original Household) back, you could get the Dynasty Head back.
As to why Cyrus didn't get the Head of House despite being the emperor and having the highest tier title (and thus also biggest army) I believe he is the younger brother of the man who got the Head of House. Since Head of House is an inherited title, it went to the person next in line. I am speculating, of course. You could open the game up and pause it and then look at them and see if the Head of House is indeed an older brother of Cyrus to be sure.
@immersioneer only Adventurers get a Dutchy tier title. Unlanded people who are not adventurers are just unlanded (otherwise, every courtier would be a Duke!).
From what I understand, to become an Adventurer, you need to be Duke tier or less title, and your culture must have the appropriate culture trait? I would guess that Greek culture does not have the correct trait for the decision?
I have read that if you designate a child who will not inherit any titles, when you die, you can choose to play as that character as an adventurer upon death.
@@spamfilter32I basically bug tested this after as I mentioned in another post. His character was never house head. It was one of his brothers Philippos. You can see the title in his frame by pausing anytime when Philippis is in focous, it a duchy title with the hous heraldry as the flag. You cannot be the holder of a noble house's special title without being the head of the house the code treats them as the same and the title is generated when two things are true. One youhave a character with a duchy title or higher. Two the house has a house head to hold the title. I do not know why Philippis was tge primary heir. This is strange because I don't know why the game set Philippos as primary heir. I can say absolutely that happened.
A playable character has a save flag called playable set to yes normally. This is any character you can pick by switching in the main menu. It never includes characters without titles. Both types of characters you can play as unlanded are flagged as playable and this is why camps and house have titles in the code. The code prunes all character flagged as yes to flagged as no if they have no titles. It also excludes a list of special titles republic theocratic and barony title as well as a few other cannot be flagged as playable
This character had not titles and was still playable meaning he was flagged as playable falsely. When he lost his title he should have either game overed or had a chance to generate a title, specifically an Adventures Camp. When this happens, the game throws a full sized splash, like you get when you enter a struggle. This never happened.
So I tested it. Currently a character is not thrown the event to generate a camp if they are unlanded due to a war they did not lead. I reproduced this in Greece and then I use The war against Northumbria to prove it happens to all characters. Before you would game over if you lost your last title. Now if you lose your own war you get to make a camp or quit event. But characters who lose their titles due to their liege losing a war no longer get the game over screen, but do to either a serious oversight or a bad bug they also do not get a form a camp event. This throws them into a sort void were they are flagged as playable but they can only take limited actions, they don't have a court, they lose their house marker (it goes black) and the can't take any action related to a title. If your not on Ironman you can just switch off to any other character at the loss of achievement qualification. Doing so corrects the flag of the other character making them a proper unlanded and unplayable courtier. On iron man the game seems to eventually prune you, removing your playable flag and throwing you a black screen crash.
A playable character in the current methodology does require a title. Either a landless title or a qualified landed title. You can set a character flag to playable as a save edit without titles and you get the same effect. You can load them up they have limited options and eventually you get pruned.
The only way to fix this is to remove tge Ironman encryption (which remove achievement status) and editing the character to have a title. This will allow them to persist if it was my save I force him to be housebhead and change the title to held by him. Otherwise this is a permanent crash state in Ironman because you can switch out and you can roll back to get a title earlier
I hope you submitted a bug report for the crash. If you can't get past this, I would be ok with you doing a restart of some sort.
Yeah, I have. Let’s see if they fix it. Such a shame though, I think this was going great. Do you have any good ideas for a new playthrough? I can start it while waiting for a patch and continue this one later if / when it gets fixed. I was toying around with the idea of a Steppe Warrior adventurer? I’ve never played in this region and I haven’t seen a lot of landless gameplay there. We can also try something middle eastern / muslim? Maybe also jewish / holy land / Jerusalem? Should we start landless or landed?
@@immersioneerSomeone suggested to me doing a landless Jewish game with the idea of making an enclave in Iberia. Seemed like something fun though historically unlikely. Steppe Mercinary would be awesome it is as you say highly underplayed.
@@Huntanor Hmm... I don't want to settle in Iberia though, I want to settle in the Holy Land. I'll test it out if I have time this week. Steppe Lord would be cool as well... which one, which one...
@immersioneer if you are not going to be in an Administrative Realm, then I would suggest landless. Landless in the Iranian Intermezzo could be interesting. Or Step as you suggested. Just because aware, it is harder to find spouses as a landless.
Unfortunately, Cyrus was sieging down the wrong parts of Kazaria. He should have sieged down Or Qapi. That was the capital of the enemy war leader. He could have possibly gotten an important hostage that could have helped with the war score issues. The Alan territories were only allies, and therefore sieging them provided no war score or important hostages.
Yeah, he was too busy bean counting instead of listening to strategy lessons at the Kerch court, clearly…
Okay, so, watching very carefully since you haven't shown it explicitly. The house title is held by Philippos. You need it, or you need a cadet branch and a theme to form a new one. Not holding hat title means you only have power through Admin action and schemes. It looks like he took itbwhen your father died because his Governorship gave him more raw power than you county gave you.
Looking at the end of last episode you did not get a new house head toast when you lost your title which implies you already did not have it, which makes sense, if you had it then you'd have it now as it's an unlanded title you can hold after being ousted. Likely your brother was more qualified than you at your father's death. Admin is a strange and specific play style you might want to try and focus a bit more pragmatically on what you can do for a time. All people sometimes fall to a point when getting stable is more important than bigger dreams. You character might have to accept tgat for now he needs to grab what ever power he can so he doesn't fall to obscurity.
Okay, so those crashes are likely critical errors. I don't think your character should have been able to continue. Landless characters need to be titled, and you had no titles, you were not house head, and had no county. I think you kept playing because your position of regent prevent the game from pushing you to landless adventurer, normally losing your last title generates a camp and you go on unless you have a noble house which serves the same purpose. As a regent you did not qualify for a camp and got put in a suspended state. The game favors allowing a character to exsist, so you were suspended, allowed to exsist as regent since it prevented you from getting pruned and down graded to non-playable. Once you lost regency you got pruned and down graded on the next check tick. Since you play Ironman this is likely a critical bug. If it was a normal save you could roll back to the point were you could as for a theme and take one of the 100% chance one to get titled before you were pruned.
This bug is worse that I thought. All county level characters who don't qualify for an estate just get dumped into the void on being unlanded. I did your start, forced tge empire to lose my war and I ruined into a landless uncontrolled character who I could still play. Accept I was a courtier of the Khan and got thrown to his capital. I can't even take actions at all. I have no heir because I gave no titles. Being regent seems to have just given you a few options I don't have. I'm going to write a through bug report as this I'd an un payable state that's pretty easy to reproduce
This is an enormous over sight. Because forming a noble familly requires being a Duke or higher and Greeks don't naturally make adventure camps, all characters under duch level become semi-playable wanderers on losing their last title. They dont form camps and they can't form houses. This means any character that isn't house head being played that is unlanded doesn't game over, they just exsist landless and without actions to take
This is an very big over sight I'm surprised isn't getting more attention but it is pretty rare I guess. Apparently this happens to every character that losses their title due to a liege's war. It's most common in the empire but I reproduced it by taking a Northumbrian count and letting the Norse win. I was again shunted to the void. But if I played as the liege lord, I got the option to continue in a camp. This is clearly an oversight. Even if they were trying to limit camp formation, it should be a game over at least.