5 videos into this series and getting up to speed on Daniel's slang. "A tenth" or "two tenths" here and there comes down to a tenth or two tenths of a thousandth: down to this decimal place: .0001 or .0002. That Upstate drawl keeps the words coming out slowly, making it easier to understand as he explains. The cam bearing clearance portion was the first time I had heard that explanation. Fascinating to see he and other master machinists that can take a 4' long flexing line hone and finish a hole down to that tenth or two tenths: the blown up 454 in one of his other videos is the reference for that. Precision in my former profession was 1,500' down a runway that was 150' wide and 10,000' feet long. My pleasure to watch a professional working and teaching simultaneously. DGBryan
The thrust would be larger to have more oil flow due to oil needed on the sides of the bearing for thrust surface lubrication. Pete would Mic the bearings all of them on thickness because sometimes bearing sets would come in mixed with over or under size bearings in the set. Thanks for the video.
I will mark the cam bearing hole position on the edge of the bearing facing towards me, with a black marker, and also the block cam housing hole location just to help me make sure that I'm real close to centering the cam bearing in the bore hole. It's more critical on a SBC Gen 1 which I put @ 4 o'clock for better oiling.. Really enjoy your videos! They are very informative!
I will drive in 3, 4, 5 cam bearing from the front, and 1, & 2, from the rear. I also lubricate the entire OD of the new bearing, and the bearing bore, before driving in new bearings. I hear a lot of people say to put them in dry, but even in this video he is spraying them with silicone. I prefer to have them completely dripping with assembly lube. In regards to the 2nd hole in the bearing-I always install all of my bearings with that 2nd (non-used) hole to be at the 12 O' Clock position. You figure the cam is being pressed down towards 6 O' Clock by the valve springs through the rockers and lifters so you do not want that extra hole to be where the load from the cam is being exerted. If you find cam bearing clearance is excessive-depending on how far out you are you can have the bearings coated to bring the tolerance in spec. If it's out .004" like his 1 and 5 are... I would start with another set of bearings and replace just 1 and 5 and test again. Also, on the main bearings, and rod bearings... I have found that on a non-turned crank (factory specs) and using standard bearings, that the measurements are usually on the large side as far as clearance is concerned. Why it works out this way, I don't know... but I can mic the crank @ 2.559, then put standard replacement bearings into the mains and my clearance will fall somewhere in the .0034" range... I *almost* always have to go to .001" undersize bearings on both rods and mains to get correct clearances. Is this because the after market bearings are being machined under size? I don't know why, but this is very common, and why when you call around asking for .001" undersize rods and mains almost no one has them in stock because they are used MORE OFTEN than standard size bearings. For those of you who are NOT checking your bearing clearances and just putting standard size bearings in on a "standard" crank.. Don't be surprised when you don't have good oil pressure. Using the .001" undersize bearings you will usually see somewhere between .002 and .0025" clearance. With those clearances, 10W-30 engine oil, my motors usually hold 40+ at a hot idle with the 10295 Melling oil pump (no spring mods), and will jump up to just under 60 PSI at cruise RPM (1200-1600 rpm). The only way to get tighter clearances would be to turn the crank 10/10 and then hope that your machinist hits the mark because there are no +/- .001" bearings available once you are 10/10 or more under size. Great video as it emphasizes the necessity to NEVER trust new bearings.. You MUST check every bearing clearance, on every journal, every time. At least I do.. if ever I skip one-that's the one that winds up biting me in the rear.. as I learned the hard way in my youth. I'm not as fast as I was back then, but I have far fewer problems these days. The quality goes UP when the time to check every clearance increases. Sometimes you don't like what you find... as it takes work to fix it.. but to not find it until the engine is in the vehicle.. will cost you significantly more time and money to fix at that point.
38:12 Engine builders and engine assemblers, are two different things. Sir, you know your LS engines! Always, nice to learn something! Keep posting, I'll keep watching! That's, gonna be one sweet running engine, when you're done!
Just found you. I just want to say thank you for the details and information. Not a lot of folk doing that on TH-cam. I am a knowledge freak. I enjoy knowing every single detail about what i am working on. You know what they say. The more you know, the more you realize what you don't know. ; P IMO that is when you know you are learning, when you finally know enough to realize the vast amounts of information you don't know. Thank you for making me smarter. Have a good one.
Great content , back in the 80's I was a Buick Tech and we replaced a ton of #1 cam bearings on 3.8 carb engines typically with a large socket & freehand with no guide . I don't recommend doing this . I do want to express cam bearing installation can be daunting the first time , just do it and take your time . Soon you will be a pro at it .
My wife just said to me , I don’t get it , I heard you puttin in cam bearings tonite ( our shop is attached to the house ). , and then you come in here and watch some guy on TH-cam put in cam bearings .. hahaha , well honey I just can’t get enough engine stuff . I do warranty work for local dealerships and when the LS first came out in the SUV with the aluminum block and the thin bearings you were talkin about , they would spin in position 3 and 4 , the replacements were the wide ones . We could only replace the ones that spun , if the housing bore was too big , replace the block , all others jamm them in and take a chance . Hahaha good ‘ol warranty work ….. love yer vids
@@powellmachineinc3179 Yessir, important rules apply different for each engine. A lot of "rebuilt" engines I've tore down were so tight on mains you could barely turn the crank. And people wonder why some are faster than others.
I learned something about keeping the cam bearing out of the way of the lifter, thanks for making that point. Watching you install the crank bearings, I have to ask if installing them without lube on the back side is your standard procedure ? If it is, then you and I are in the same club.
I was going give you crap, but I thought I'd tell you something you might find funny instead, my buddy's wife got him some new jeans, he Ware them to work,we did Masonry, we we got home, she said, Marvin" you got motor all over yo paints, he said I've not been working on cars, I've been at work all day! 😂
Thanks for the great info. When I was in automotive school in the 1970s, we were taught to check rod and main bearing clearances with plastic gage. What is your opinion of that stuff?
When I was doing automotive machine work I had a discussion with the owner about installing cam bearings and he agreed even after many decades of doing the work, I found it much easier and safer to the babbit material when it comes to installing cam bearings. If you stand the engine up but have it on a stand that's only a foot off the ground, we made one it wasn't building a rocket, you are using gravity as your friend when driving bearings in and it definitely helps with keeping centering cone in place instead of holding bar while simultaneously pushing cone into cam bearing bore, with every strike it's a pain in the butt, and you're fully aware that the slightest ding, dent, scratch or whatever to the babbit material will cause high spots around the damage causing a hot spot, and I personally didn't like scraping off a ding and reinstalling and removal and over because that can cause more damage, then installing cam with rear cam plug installed is safer on bearings too because once again gravity is your friend when installing cam from a vertical position in one motion down through cam tunnel til it comes in contact with rear plug, then I used a bolt and a piece of small flat stock as a stop to keep cam in cam tunnel. I hope that my unrequested advice may help you.
@@powellmachineinc3179 I forgot to mention that we glued a square piece of rubber about 1/4 of an inch thick on top of stand because block would bounce a little when rod was struck and I had to part off a bit of the rod in a lathe and drill and retap hole because I'm a bit short and it was too long anyway.
Lets re-visit solid lifter cams. I have not put a motor together in 35 years. But when I did my motors I never had a failed cam or lifter. I used Crane cams back then and GM cams and lifters. On GM cams back it the day GM had a ring below the bottom of the lifter which look liked they pressed in something in the bottom of the lifter. I still have like 5 new cams from 35 years ago. Also have a couple of new lifter boxes of 16 each lifters from crane cams and 1 set from GM. The finish on the bottom of the lifters 35 years ago did not look like the new ones today. They were much more smother 35 years ago. Seems like all these new cams and lifter must be made from a different material today. Could you put a solid roller lifter on a flat tappet cam? We use to put solid lifter on a hydraulic cam and set the lash at .020 and they ran real good. Hydraulic cam just didn't seem to work right on a BBC with 70 pounds of oil pressure. They would pump up and would not rev past 4,500 rpm sometimes. Rather than try and take the cam out we just installed solid lifters and 7,000 rpm all day long. SBC never had that problem. I figured out that the BBC pushrods running on a angle made the Hydraulic cam float. If you looked at what GM put BBC Hydraulic cam in they never went pass a 40 pound oil pump. You put a 60 or 70 pound oil pump in then you had problems with Hydraulic cams. Its sad cause to make a roller cam work today cost a lot of money to do it right.
isn't there a way to calculate what bearing you need by measuring the main or rod bore and measuring the journal diameter with using the oil clearance you want? anyone know what that calculation would be?
The owners of this engine needs to sue the engine builders. You never weld the heavy metal for balancing who ever balanced the crank did not now what they were doing you always press in the heavy metal for crank balancing horizontal in the counter weights
Surprised you run that much clearance on the mains with aluminum blocks. I usually do .0015 main clearance on these aluminum blocks, and .0018 on the thrust if I can. On the cam bearings, sometimes I turn down the OD of a larger bearing to fit the bore if it's too large. When the bearing bore is too small I might open up the bore, or turn down a bearing to fit. Cam bearings are deceptively complex, many people don't realize how important it is to get them right. BTW, I made a madrel to hold these cam bearings that let's me turn them down on the crank grinder, or a tool and cutter grinder. Works nicely.
![[TH] VCT Masters Shanghai Playoffs DAY 3 // FNC vs FUT | EDG vs PRX](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/pw2T5v0ogDI/mqdefault.jpg)
5 videos into this series and getting up to speed on Daniel's slang. "A tenth" or "two tenths" here and there comes down to a tenth or two tenths of a thousandth: down to this decimal place: .0001 or .0002.
That Upstate drawl keeps the words coming out slowly, making it easier to understand as he explains. The cam bearing clearance portion was the first time I had heard that explanation.
Fascinating to see he and other master machinists that can take a 4' long flexing line hone and finish a hole down to that tenth or two tenths: the blown up 454 in one of his other videos is the reference for that.
Precision in my former profession was 1,500' down a runway that was 150' wide and 10,000' feet long.
My pleasure to watch a professional working and teaching simultaneously. DGBryan
Ty sir!, I really appreciate you!
I'm smarter than I was 40 minutes ago. Thank you for your time.
Ty
This series is great!!! I’m doing my first ever rebuild and it’s a gen 3 LS. Super helpful information. Subscribed!!
Welcome aboard!
You can learn priceless detailed
information by watching your videos. Thanks alot sir. 💯
It's my pleasure
The thrust would be larger to have more oil flow due to oil needed on the sides of the bearing for thrust surface lubrication. Pete would Mic the bearings all of them on thickness because sometimes bearing sets would come in mixed with over or under size bearings in the set. Thanks for the video.
I love your videos. You’re so calm and knowledgeable you explain things so well, subscribed and enjoying the content. Keep it up!!!
Welcome aboard!
Another great video. It's extremely satisfying seeing a freshly cleaned and machined LS block being mic'd and assembled. Love this stuff!
I bet that phone call was someone asking about a flat tappet cam😊
This is a great series Daniel.
Joe
Lol, probably
I will mark the cam bearing hole position on the edge of the bearing facing towards me, with a black marker, and also the block cam housing hole location just to help me make sure that I'm real close to centering the cam bearing in the bore hole. It's more critical on a SBC Gen 1 which I put @ 4 o'clock for better oiling.. Really enjoy your videos! They are very informative!
TYVM!
I will drive in 3, 4, 5 cam bearing from the front, and 1, & 2, from the rear. I also lubricate the entire OD of the new bearing, and the bearing bore, before driving in new bearings. I hear a lot of people say to put them in dry, but even in this video he is spraying them with silicone. I prefer to have them completely dripping with assembly lube. In regards to the 2nd hole in the bearing-I always install all of my bearings with that 2nd (non-used) hole to be at the 12 O' Clock position. You figure the cam is being pressed down towards 6 O' Clock by the valve springs through the rockers and lifters so you do not want that extra hole to be where the load from the cam is being exerted. If you find cam bearing clearance is excessive-depending on how far out you are you can have the bearings coated to bring the tolerance in spec. If it's out .004" like his 1 and 5 are... I would start with another set of bearings and replace just 1 and 5 and test again.
Also, on the main bearings, and rod bearings... I have found that on a non-turned crank (factory specs) and using standard bearings, that the measurements are usually on the large side as far as clearance is concerned. Why it works out this way, I don't know... but I can mic the crank @ 2.559, then put standard replacement bearings into the mains and my clearance will fall somewhere in the .0034" range... I *almost* always have to go to .001" undersize bearings on both rods and mains to get correct clearances. Is this because the after market bearings are being machined under size? I don't know why, but this is very common, and why when you call around asking for .001" undersize rods and mains almost no one has them in stock because they are used MORE OFTEN than standard size bearings. For those of you who are NOT checking your bearing clearances and just putting standard size bearings in on a "standard" crank.. Don't be surprised when you don't have good oil pressure. Using the .001" undersize bearings you will usually see somewhere between .002 and .0025" clearance. With those clearances, 10W-30 engine oil, my motors usually hold 40+ at a hot idle with the 10295 Melling oil pump (no spring mods), and will jump up to just under 60 PSI at cruise RPM (1200-1600 rpm). The only way to get tighter clearances would be to turn the crank 10/10 and then hope that your machinist hits the mark because there are no +/- .001" bearings available once you are 10/10 or more under size. Great video as it emphasizes the necessity to NEVER trust new bearings.. You MUST check every bearing clearance, on every journal, every time. At least I do.. if ever I skip one-that's the one that winds up biting me in the rear.. as I learned the hard way in my youth. I'm not as fast as I was back then, but I have far fewer problems these days. The quality goes UP when the time to check every clearance increases. Sometimes you don't like what you find... as it takes work to fix it.. but to not find it until the engine is in the vehicle.. will cost you significantly more time and money to fix at that point.
The cam bearing with two holes always goes in the front , number 1 💪🏻😎👍🏻 great info
All 5 have 2 holes, and each bearing has a location
38:12 Engine builders and engine assemblers, are two different things. Sir, you know your LS engines! Always, nice to learn something! Keep posting, I'll keep watching! That's, gonna be one sweet running engine, when you're done!
We know assemblers and builders are not the same, but they don't, unfortunately
Good tip on the cam bearing clearance!
Just found you. I just want to say thank you for the details and information. Not a lot of folk doing that on TH-cam. I am a knowledge freak. I enjoy knowing every single detail about what i am working on. You know what they say. The more you know, the more you realize what you don't know. ; P IMO that is when you know you are learning, when you finally know enough to realize the vast amounts of information you don't know. Thank you for making me smarter. Have a good one.
You are so welcome!
Definitely a master craftsman in your trade...
Just average, but thank you very much
Awesome, thanks for sharing 😊
Great content , back in the 80's I was a Buick Tech and we replaced a ton of #1 cam bearings on 3.8 carb engines typically with a large socket & freehand with no guide . I don't recommend doing this . I do want to express cam bearing installation can be daunting the first time , just do it and take your time . Soon you will be a pro at it .
Damn, that would take one huge socket!😂😂
My wife just said to me , I don’t get it , I heard you puttin in cam bearings tonite ( our shop is attached to the house ). , and then you come in here and watch some guy on TH-cam put in cam bearings .. hahaha , well honey I just can’t get enough engine stuff .
I do warranty work for local dealerships and when the LS first came out in the SUV with the aluminum block and the thin bearings you were talkin about , they would spin in position 3 and 4 , the replacements were the wide ones . We could only replace the ones that spun , if the housing bore was too big , replace the block , all others jamm them in and take a chance . Hahaha good ‘ol warranty work ….. love yer vids
Lol, my wife says the exact same, 💯
Who are you getting your undersize cam bearings from? I would like to keep some on hand for this situation. Thanks for all of the great info!
I always wondered if putting the cam bearings in the freezer for awhile would aid in installation.
Great info, could you do a video on setting up the bore gauges/t gauge and understanding the measurements?
Great suggestion!
Thank you, USA 🇺🇸 USA 🇺🇸 USA 🇺🇸
Your welcome
0.001 X inch of journal size
2.559 LS mains
0.0025 for bearing clearance
Always works
Just a "rule of thumb " oil viscosity, block material, application, ect are how we determine what clearance we use
@@powellmachineinc3179
Yessir, important rules apply different for each engine. A lot of "rebuilt" engines I've tore down were so tight on mains you could barely turn the crank. And people wonder why some are faster than others.
I learned something about keeping the cam bearing out of the way of the lifter, thanks for making that point. Watching you install the crank bearings, I have to ask if installing them without lube on the back side is your standard procedure ? If it is, then you and I are in the same club.
Never put anything on tje back of a main or rod bearing
I love how good you are but can you say ENGINE rather than MOTOR thank you have a good and God bless you.
I was going give you crap, but I thought I'd tell you something you might find funny instead, my buddy's wife got him some new jeans, he Ware them to work,we did Masonry, we we got home, she said, Marvin" you got motor all over yo paints, he said I've not been working on cars, I've been at work all day! 😂
Thanks for the great info. When I was in automotive school in the 1970s, we were taught to check rod and main bearing clearances with plastic gage. What is your opinion of that stuff?
We don't use it, it's not very accurate
@@powellmachineinc3179 thanks for the reply. Love your channel!!!
Just a question do you pin the cam bearings or use green loctite on them ive done both. Im a diesel mechanic and play with ls motors
When I was doing automotive machine work I had a discussion with the owner about installing cam bearings and he agreed even after many decades of doing the work, I found it much easier and safer to the babbit material when it comes to installing cam bearings. If you stand the engine up but have it on a stand that's only a foot off the ground, we made one it wasn't building a rocket, you are using gravity as your friend when driving bearings in and it definitely helps with keeping centering cone in place instead of holding bar while simultaneously pushing cone into cam bearing bore, with every strike it's a pain in the butt, and you're fully aware that the slightest ding, dent, scratch or whatever to the babbit material will cause high spots around the damage causing a hot spot, and I personally didn't like scraping off a ding and reinstalling and removal and over because that can cause more damage, then installing cam with rear cam plug installed is safer on bearings too because once again gravity is your friend when installing cam from a vertical position in one motion down through cam tunnel til it comes in contact with rear plug, then I used a bolt and a piece of small flat stock as a stop to keep cam in cam tunnel. I hope that my unrequested advice may help you.
Yep, good suggestions
@@powellmachineinc3179 I forgot to mention that we glued a square piece of rubber about 1/4 of an inch thick on top of stand because block would bounce a little when rod was struck and I had to part off a bit of the rod in a lathe and drill and retap hole because I'm a bit short and it was too long anyway.
Very informative as always. Kudos to Andrew for the video artistry.
Are the coated bearings worth the price?
We use them in performance stuff either higher spring pressures
Lets re-visit solid lifter cams. I have not put a motor together in 35 years. But when I did my motors I never had a failed cam or lifter. I used Crane cams back then and GM cams and lifters. On GM cams back it the day GM had a ring below the bottom of the lifter which look liked they pressed in something in the bottom of the lifter. I still have like 5 new cams from 35 years ago. Also have a couple of new lifter boxes of 16 each lifters from crane cams and 1 set from GM. The finish on the bottom of the lifters 35 years ago did not look like the new ones today. They were much more smother 35 years ago. Seems like all these new cams and lifter must be made from a different material today. Could you put a solid roller lifter on a flat tappet cam? We use to put solid lifter on a hydraulic cam and set the lash at .020 and they ran real good. Hydraulic cam just didn't seem to work right on a BBC with 70 pounds of oil pressure. They would pump up and would not rev past 4,500 rpm sometimes. Rather than try and take the cam out we just installed solid lifters and 7,000 rpm all day long. SBC never had that problem. I figured out that the BBC pushrods running on a angle made the Hydraulic cam float. If you looked at what GM put BBC Hydraulic cam in they never went pass a 40 pound oil pump. You put a 60 or 70 pound oil pump in then you had problems with Hydraulic cams. Its sad cause to make a roller cam work today cost a lot of money to do it right.
Do you prefer the king bearings for most LS builds..Na and low boost set ups..Thanks for sharing your knowledge…
Mostly we use king brand, which Series depends on application, Si for stock crank, xp for steel cranks
@@powellmachineinc3179 thanks for responding…I appreciate all your videos…Thanks again…!
Very informative as always, any tips or hints on how remove and readjust in case you bugger one up? I know don't bugger it up, but ya never know lol.
If we hurt a bearing we just knock it out, grab another and reinstall.
Do those cam bearings fit other applications? If so maybe that's the reason for more than one hole.
No, ls only
isn't there a way to calculate what bearing you need by measuring the main or rod bore and measuring the journal diameter with using the oil clearance you want? anyone know what that calculation would be?
Unfortunately there are just to many variables to do it like that
Whats the purpose of the torque to yeld bolts? Why can't they just give you a torque number?
It's not tty, it's torque + angle, it's more accurate clamping load.
greetings, are you using the old main rod bolts to check bearing clearance?
Yes, we will use them in the engine when 8ts finished also
What's the part number on the undersized cam bearings?
Do you get torque wrenches calibrated?
Yes, every year
How far that alloy block open the mains in service?
We don't "know " we can assume probably. 0005" or so
I spin around for one and two.
The side bolts missing for the mains going to change that main bearing clearance measurement. Great video otherwise.
No, it doesn't affect it at all
The owners of this engine needs to sue the engine builders. You never weld the heavy metal for balancing who ever balanced the crank did not now what they were doing you always press in the heavy metal for crank balancing horizontal in the counter weights
Yep, radial installation is a disaster waiting to happen
👍👍👍
Surprised you run that much clearance on the mains with aluminum blocks. I usually do .0015 main clearance on these aluminum blocks, and .0018 on the thrust if I can.
On the cam bearings, sometimes I turn down the OD of a larger bearing to fit the bore if it's too large. When the bearing bore is too small I might open up the bore, or turn down a bearing to fit. Cam bearings are deceptively complex, many people don't realize how important it is to get them right.
BTW, I made a madrel to hold these cam bearings that let's me turn them down on the crank grinder, or a tool and cutter grinder. Works nicely.
I was surprised when I went to your channel and you have zero videos. Yet you feel qualified (and the need) to try to correct a legit expert.
@@eriklarson9137 What makes you qualified to make assumptions about me, and my conversation with Daniel? Do you actually have something useful to add?