The real reason to change that pdf was to erase the 205s of Tumelo and mthoko since one of them called the Meyiwa family that Longwe has shot Senzo🤞🤞🤞simple
They are not discrepancies. It was a deliberate manipulation of data to implicate the accused. What a pity. It is a public court where we are all hearing the case. We will know if justice has been miscarried.
i think MaMshololo should have laid a bases on the issue of "separating a cellphone as gadget from a person as human being" e.g Mr Ntuli accused 5 will come and tell the court that he has never left or leave his cellphone, wherever he was, his gadget is with him. The only time he was separated from his gadget was during his arrest and incarceration " after that she should proceed with her question or fact put across to the witness.
The device is owned by the accused why now when it reflect and proves that the accused was at a different place at the time of the murder,now it has to be separated from the owner?but the state itself has relied its case on the device to prove its case.
Sibanda took about 2 months only leading evidence of telephone data to try to place the accused on the scene of crime,now when the defence has to punch holes regarding the whole evidence of cellephone data,its been objected left right centre,and even went as far as to a question of two people sharing the same number,which that possibility has never came to the mind of the state before,and when they led such evidence. when is our defence actually submitted application for sec:174?dont you think it's time?
I'm totally convinced that this case has been cooked, if is not cooked why the state didn't not call Kelly's mother coz she is an eye witness i think she can assist the state
No one ever testified to seeing Longwe with a gun, instead earlier witnesses claimed to have seen a guy with dreads fleeing the house......Longwe had no dreads at the time .....as to who those guys were, hope we find out.
She is not even close to being detailed. She sounds like she is but its 0% of a defense. So far none of them have had a strong case to weigh up the defense. But i understand, media hype and lack of understanding will succeed.
how can a judge who is neutral say "even if there are discrepancies in the state document, it does not matter"??????? it seems the judge has forgotten the role of the court in cross examining is to prove if the evidence is true or not...now if there is forgery and as a judge u say 'it does not matter'....that is just stupidity at its worst!!!!!!!!
The judge was right on that... adv mshololo already made a point known that there's wrong doing, that the number doesn't belong to accused 5 and proven it
Hear for judge ratha , not persons but the device were there,,, but how could the devices came to that particular places if it weren't with the person?
I wish Mshololo would take the time to understand the impact and meaning of words and terms. Her misunderstandings put her at odds with the judge. She uses accusatory and presumptive language without providing a basis or substantiation. Terms like "tampering," "wrong data," and "it confirms" are used inappropriately. She conflates ownership of a device with its usage without justification and expects the court to accept that!
Judge wishes to dictate how Adv should conduct her cross examination just to instill a misconception of inexperienced or rather poor examination just district her to give the witness a room of support and confidence but I'm impressed her not to lose her cool and still insist on her request. Proud of you Adv Mshololo keep that strategy
Adjourned til Monday😡and he aint barking as always coz they are partners in crime what a biased creature,what happened to their million witnesses thats disguisting kgaaaaaa🤮steyn SURRENDER
The state is left with 2 witnesses, Mangena and Gininda to close/rest their case. They can't call Gininda 1st, Mangena must come 1st, then Brigadier Gininda. Then your defence will call their witnesses. They have already lost, Baloyi and Sibanda have won this hands down. If Ntanzi did not do this, where was he on that fateful night? Why can't he give an alibi?
@Tayma11June I am not on trial for the murder of SM, I did not provide a wrong alibi that I was at work when I was not, I did not deny knowing the other accused when telephone records says others. And yes I know where I was, I was at home on that fateful evening and can provide a solid alibi to that. Anyone on trial for a murder that has the potential to send them to life in prison will provide a solid alibi to where they were that night
He is not annoyed but infact dissapointed that:it's now coming out crystal clear to the extend that even a blind man could see that the accused are not part of the murder.
So if state goes with that idea on 4:06, how will they prove who used those numbers if they are not rica’d under their names?? I’m trying to understand the state’s version of how they will prove such a matter…
But if someone gives you their number, do you ask them if it's registered in their name. 🙊You can't know who registered the sim, if someone gives you a number as theirs you assume as such. Ratha likes to say common sense but it's not common sometimes waits.
Mshololo argues that her client was never part of the communication between the two numbers. Thus, even if the state could prove there was communication between those numbers, it would be irrelevant. She then insisted on continuing to examine the communications, but instead of revealing anything significant, it turned out to be inconsequential; dololo!
The minute the state begins to assist the witness it shows that they have accepted already Unfortunately the Judge is live on tv he's pressured to remain and being seen to be doing justice
I don't know what was the state doing by introducing cell-phone evidence. This evidence is rubbishing the case . I don't know how they gone come back 😮
😂😂😂its chaos they say phones belongs to the accused but wen the evidence says otherwise they say the device😂😂😂 kubi . They have lost the case 🤞🤞🤞 The accused will get money from the state
If the towers were showing that phones were next to khumaloz House then what do you think they were going to say? 😂😂😂Mara state why now that's what Teffo called monkey tricks
Obviously you're not aware how many grandmother's the same age as yours died from stress after your so-called fraud murder comparison. In a civilised country the charge should be murder ... And one more thing, if you happen to live in South Africa, you must have heard if the Life Esidimeni case where people are charged with murder. If you owned a car you would face murder charges after an accident you know, maybe you overrate yourself in the cognitive realm.
Mshololo done with ratha's ex sibanda and Baloyi couldn't even appear on camera because he doesn't want to be embarrassed as ratha and his ex boyfriend
I'm a Scorpio by the way. And for the dreamers and sleepers who sleep and dream that some people are sleeping ... Here's free education for you. Scorpios never sleep, let alone dream. We are too important for that. While sleepers are dreaming, Scorpios are busy making money, studying for their second or third degree and enjoying life.
4:07:33 Baloyi Junior looking and sounding all confident. "and if I was wrong, I believe they would have stood up and objected". By extension of this logic, the state tampered with the call logs because they never stood up to object when it was brought to the attention of the court that the numbers from Voda differ with that from the police.
starts arresting police officers who failed to close, secure the murder scene, deviated, tampered with evidence, again adv baloyi for misleading, hiding 375, gininda. then justice will be served for senzo.
The state wanted Steyn to rectify his mistakes, even using illness as a sympathy card to buy time. Mnsisi and Mshololo defended by insisting on a formal procedural application. Well played by these two defence advocates. The other two defence persons were caught sleeping!
How can she be advocate gosh how do you cross examine a statement where your client denied he ever used that nr the issue is not 1 or 44 calls only 1 call will link him
Sorry to say the Judge has made a decision long ago, state has alot to loose in this case so whatever the outcome, it has to be on state favor.. Allegedly
It seems the State is running out of witnesses that can put meat to the bones coz with respect to Accused Numbers 3, 4 & 5 there are only bomes no meat...but guys you can differ with me and criticism is welcomed. ...in any event it was my opinion...29/7/2024
RSA have a jake as judge in Ratha Mokgoatlheng, he doesn't even know that 128 seconds is only 2 minutes 8 seconds 😂😂 the only part left out by the defence "they should have asked Pinky girl to be specific as how to read those hundred seconds in normal time or duration" maybe it would have been more clear
Lol this case guys haikhona something fishy., only so bored when the judge is side very negative torwards defence and positive towards the state its seems like he already make decision to this matter allegedly.it is clear to evidence that accused placed in one place but now its different.how can you placed accused in one place but cell phone data place them in different place and how wer they communicate if the state said it doesn't mean the accused they wer with their phone with them but do they communicate hy.
Why request late for section 205...the state has no case against these 5accused,they are trying to build it now..NPA has alot to answe for,who moved this case to high court and why cause clearly there is no evidence against these 5guys😂😂
The real reason to change that pdf was to erase the 205s of Tumelo and mthoko since one of them called the Meyiwa family that Longwe has shot Senzo🤞🤞🤞simple
True
very true
Uyabheda wena, why would police frame wrong people for the case they did not do, stop making baseless accusations here.
@@gudamwandla go and ask them msunu
Manje usungithukelani wena uhamba uthuka abantu ongabazi uzoyimela lento oyenzayo na?
🎉🎉🎉 Mshololo,Gininda and Gouws must come back and explain
Gininda is coming back.
I like that@@katlegophetwe6710
They are not discrepancies. It was a deliberate manipulation of data to implicate the accused. What a pity. It is a public court where we are all hearing the case. We will know if justice has been miscarried.
Atleast the case now has direction.
Why it is now an issue if Mshololo is cross-examining the witness while Sibanda held us for the 2 months repeating thr the same thing.
Funny hey l see that as well
No matter how they do it the five accused never killed Senzo . Longwe did
True
Yeah
A 100 yeses to that
😂😂😂
Were you at the house?
Give vuilpop boy sibanda a taste of his own medicine Ms Mshololo
Mgabadeli😂😂😂😂....29/7/2024
i think MaMshololo should have laid a bases on the issue of "separating a cellphone as gadget from a person as human being" e.g Mr Ntuli accused 5 will come and tell the court that he has never left or leave his cellphone, wherever he was, his gadget is with him. The only time he was separated from his gadget was during his arrest and incarceration " after that she should proceed with her question or fact put across to the witness.
The device is owned by the accused why now when it reflect and proves that the accused was at a different place at the time of the murder,now it has to be separated from the owner?but the state itself has relied its case on the device to prove its case.
Proper double-standard, if you ask me.
😂😂😂 But they want some one to be pinned in a cell jail with cellphone, someone who was heavily guarded.
Exactly
Sibanda took about 2 months only leading evidence of telephone data to try to place the accused on the scene of crime,now when the defence has to punch holes regarding the whole evidence of cellephone data,its been objected left right centre,and even went as far as to a question of two people sharing the same number,which that possibility has never came to the mind of the state before,and when they led such evidence.
when is our defence actually submitted application for sec:174?dont you think it's time?
EVIL DISGUSTING SHAMELESS BIASED CORRUPTED JUDGE 😮😮😮
I'm totally convinced that this case has been cooked, if is not cooked why the state didn't not call Kelly's mother coz she is an eye witness i think she can assist the state
The person who killed senzo is Chico,s son
Yes yes yes n now it seems like the towers n phone nos killed Senzo
No one ever testified to seeing Longwe with a gun, instead earlier witnesses claimed to have seen a guy with dreads fleeing the house......Longwe had no dreads at the time .....as to who those guys were, hope we find out.
Who doesn't see The Judge is bias😢
The calmness in miss Mshololo 👌 👏
This judge is a joke
😂😂😂😂
Even NPA and Justice system they are rotten to let things like Ratha, sibanda and baloyi to be above of law they took us as joke🤮
Mshololo is too detailed, and this annoys the Ratha. It is hot, like really hot now...😂😂
She is not even close to being detailed. She sounds like she is but its 0% of a defense. So far none of them have had a strong case to weigh up the defense. But i understand, media hype and lack of understanding will succeed.
Why are they wasting time😢. Call Gouws to explain not Pinky😮😮😮
Look at this old man and how relieved he is at the prospect of ndwandwe, he mustn't forget that they omitted crucial information
the state and judge are trying by all means to make it hard for the defense to prove its case..this is pathetic!!!!
how can a judge who is neutral say "even if there are discrepancies in the state document, it does not matter"??????? it seems the judge has forgotten the role of the court in cross examining is to prove if the evidence is true or not...now if there is forgery and as a judge u say 'it does not matter'....that is just stupidity at its worst!!!!!!!!
As for, “Where does it take the case”.😳
Ratha you will never know whether he's a satan or a devil he's so evil
Useless judge
I fully agree with you
The judge was right on that... adv mshololo already made a point known that there's wrong doing, that the number doesn't belong to accused 5 and proven it
Hear for judge ratha , not persons but the device were there,,, but how could the devices came to that particular places if it weren't with the person?
Right?😂
And what was the state reason to produce cellphones 205 then?
I wish Mshololo would take the time to understand the impact and meaning of words and terms. Her misunderstandings put her at odds with the judge. She uses accusatory and presumptive language without providing a basis or substantiation. Terms like "tampering," "wrong data," and "it confirms" are used inappropriately. She conflates ownership of a device with its usage without justification and expects the court to accept that!
Judge wishes to dictate how Adv should conduct her cross examination just to instill a misconception of inexperienced or rather poor examination just district her to give the witness a room of support and confidence but I'm impressed her not to lose her cool and still insist on her request. Proud of you Adv Mshololo keep that strategy
Adjourned til Monday😡and he aint barking as always coz they are partners in crime what a biased creature,what happened to their million witnesses thats disguisting kgaaaaaa🤮steyn SURRENDER
The state is left with 2 witnesses, Mangena and Gininda to close/rest their case. They can't call Gininda 1st, Mangena must come 1st, then Brigadier Gininda. Then your defence will call their witnesses. They have already lost, Baloyi and Sibanda have won this hands down. If Ntanzi did not do this, where was he on that fateful night? Why can't he give an alibi?
@kennethhobyani1848 if he didn't do this. What is " this "? I also don't know where I was that evening , does that make me a suspect? Where were you?
@Tayma11June I am not on trial for the murder of SM, I did not provide a wrong alibi that I was at work when I was not, I did not deny knowing the other accused when telephone records says others. And yes I know where I was, I was at home on that fateful evening and can provide a solid alibi to that. Anyone on trial for a murder that has the potential to send them to life in prison will provide a solid alibi to where they were that night
@@kennethhobyani1848 😂😂😂😂😂a wish
Sibande is a waste of time
Ratha looks annoyed bandla, he doesn't have energy, he is defeated🤣🤣🤣🤣
He is not annoyed but infact dissapointed that:it's now coming out crystal clear to the extend that even a blind man could see that the accused are not part of the murder.
😂😂😂
Yeah
he knows that time is been waisted nje bcos at last the 5 accused will be sentenced
😅maam ratha
So if state goes with that idea on 4:06, how will they prove who used those numbers if they are not rica’d under their names?? I’m trying to understand the state’s version of how they will prove such a matter…
Yaz ngabe usena10 years manje Longwe esejele,baze bambambezela oGininda....
My big sister Miss Mshololo phezukwabo ❤❤
All these movements were around Johannesburg CBD, mnot Voslorus.
Im a layman, but this is clear. Zungu lied
What is that one of Sibanda trying to achieve with this, shem ?
But if someone gives you their number, do you ask them if it's registered in their name. 🙊You can't know who registered the sim, if someone gives you a number as theirs you assume as such. Ratha likes to say common sense but it's not common sometimes waits.
😂ratha uphelelwe amandla nkosi yam amanga amangaka civil lawyers are ready to to help those guys sue the state
Mshoslolo❤I love you keep doing your job 🎉❤
Mshololo argues that her client was never part of the communication between the two numbers. Thus, even if the state could prove there was communication between those numbers, it would be irrelevant. She then insisted on continuing to examine the communications, but instead of revealing anything significant, it turned out to be inconsequential; dololo!
The minute the state begins to assist the witness it shows that they have accepted already
Unfortunately the Judge is live on tv he's pressured to remain and being seen to be doing justice
😂
I don't know what was the state doing by introducing cell-phone evidence. This evidence is rubbishing the case . I don't know how they gone come back 😮
@MabuthoSoetland think you are dreaming
😂😂😂its chaos they say phones belongs to the accused but wen the evidence says otherwise they say the device😂😂😂 kubi . They have lost the case 🤞🤞🤞 The accused will get money from the state
If the towers were showing that phones were next to khumaloz House then what do you think they were going to say? 😂😂😂Mara state why now that's what Teffo called monkey tricks
Obviously you're not aware how many grandmother's the same age as yours died from stress after your so-called fraud murder comparison. In a civilised country the charge should be murder ... And one more thing, if you happen to live in South Africa, you must have heard if the Life Esidimeni case where people are charged with murder. If you owned a car you would face murder charges after an accident you know, maybe you overrate yourself in the cognitive realm.
Jonas uyatolika ngiyavuma Zulu pure
205 is not a given. It is intelligence and evidence driven.
MShololo is the best of the best
Yes she is
Heeee Gininda you are in .... i say. Why request 205's for 2018 kwaaaaa to 2021
Gindida want to close the gaps as a last witness.
Hope Kelly arrested already and no bail
arrested for what exactly?
Let me guess Steyn not able to make it but gininda will be happy to oblige with control damage
Mshololo done with ratha's ex sibanda and Baloyi couldn't even appear on camera because he doesn't want to be embarrassed as ratha and his ex boyfriend
Shame on you 😂😂😂
@@MunyaradziMugadzaweta-ob5dzI think you don't follow the case
“Before Mandela died”, this dude is a joke!!!!!not cool!
I'm a Scorpio by the way. And for the dreamers and sleepers who sleep and dream that some people are sleeping ... Here's free education for you. Scorpios never sleep, let alone dream. We are too important for that. While sleepers are dreaming, Scorpios are busy making money, studying for their second or third degree and enjoying life.
Haybo kanti is still attending the cooked case😂😂😂
Sibanda pure excellence,Lungisani number
A witness from correctional services? The state is a joke
4:07:33 Baloyi Junior looking and sounding all confident. "and if I was wrong, I believe they would have stood up and objected". By extension of this logic, the state tampered with the call logs because they never stood up to object when it was brought to the attention of the court that the numbers from Voda differ with that from the police.
state has a case
Manufactured case
Which one though 375 right 😅 we can all see the cooking
starts arresting police officers who failed to close, secure the murder scene, deviated, tampered with evidence, again adv baloyi for misleading, hiding 375, gininda. then justice will be served for senzo.
The state wanted Steyn to rectify his mistakes, even using illness as a sympathy card to buy time. Mnsisi and Mshololo defended by insisting on a formal procedural application. Well played by these two defence advocates. The other two defence persons were caught sleeping!
When are they goner call Mrs Steenkamp bakithi .She is the one who goner tell the truth about the 38 special that has been used to kill Senzo.
How can she be advocate gosh how do you cross examine a statement where your client denied he ever used that nr the issue is not 1 or 44 calls only 1 call will link him
but she is "an advocate"🤷♀️
Ask the adv I'm pretty sure there is a reason why she does that, anyway this evidence needs to be proven against the other
Haibooo Chicco
Why all the defense are saying the number belonged to the same Lungisani. From accused no 1 to 5
What happened to trial yestarday nothing and today?
A job well done to the state for presenting such a strong case against against the accused.
implication was there were still a few to call for state. One month break and now we on break again?
After lunch Baloyi will assist Mangena to deny the open seal bag
Let’s say the tower is overloaded 😂😂😂. Sibanda is killing me
Sorry to say the Judge has made a decision long ago, state has alot to loose in this case so whatever the outcome, it has to be on state favor.. Allegedly
Mabayonya bonke,kudlalwangathila
Advocate Mashololo, dang girl I like u for ignoring Sibanda
It seems the State is running out of witnesses that can put meat to the bones coz with respect to Accused Numbers 3, 4 & 5 there are only bomes no meat...but guys you can differ with me and criticism is welcomed. ...in any event it was my opinion...29/7/2024
The camera guy knows how to move its camera va especially when it comes to Judge Ratha 😂😂😂 akadikwe akazazi noba azithini
Chief justice Maya is having a case
Pinky is now starting to get tired
The device was in JHB CBD but the accused was in Vosloo
And how is that possible though 😂😂😂😂 Ratha
RSA have a jake as judge in Ratha Mokgoatlheng, he doesn't even know that 128 seconds is only 2 minutes 8 seconds 😂😂 the only part left out by the defence "they should have asked Pinky girl to be specific as how to read those hundred seconds in normal time or duration" maybe it would have been more clear
all defence adv are from nguni nation so ratha must expect tough time.
Ratha mara you are a Joke really why why did Mpumalanga Taxi Voilence case shoot Senzo aiii man
I wonder why is the judge so bias
35 million that's why
D
Not having ur fone in the scene doesn't mean you were not there
So you mean the cell phone can fly somewhere without the owner😂
So why do they need their 205?
So now why they led that evidence if it's useless?
True.
@bonganidube429 because in most cases it's an indication of where the owner is, but unfortunately criminals are aware of that too.
Who played a game called 'Fihlabhande'....ai kyashisa ke manje...balekan otherwise khonozofa isbhaxu la😂😂😂
Loku i helele hi timaka i ya tlela ... Loku i helele hi birongo i ya huwa na swin'wana swihlangi wa switwa.
Gininda is coming back 💃🏻💃🏻💃🏻
With his English oh gosh 🙈
Pension fund gone in 1 2 3 4 5 boom
Iningi imali ekhokhiwe la,hhey ngiwahambile amacala mina
So you're same what's app group with those in the dock?
Lesedi it's a shopping center in Vosloorus. Stop confusing us, next time you must get advocates who knows Gauteng plse. 4:06:52 4:07:27 4:08:14
Muzikawkhethi Khumalo is he the relative of Kelly Khumalo?
I think it's her uncle Muzikawkhethi
@@buyisiwemasondo2079 thank you for the right spelling of the name....
My sentiments exactly
I wonder!
Mmmmm
we are waiting for a white judge ratha to determine,
Ngivumelana nawe prof
Kubi ke manje 😢 azikhale mzansi
😢😢azishube 14:16
Viva mshololo ❤❤❤❤
Kanti u Ratha unjani vele lomkhulu
Everybody knows that you can use the number Ricard with someone else's name there's a lot of people who gives us free SIM cards on the street
😢😢azishube
Lol this case guys haikhona something fishy., only so bored when the judge is side very negative torwards defence and positive towards the state its seems like he already make decision to this matter allegedly.it is clear to evidence that accused placed in one place but now its different.how can you placed accused in one place but cell phone data place them in different place and how wer they communicate if the state said it doesn't mean the accused they wer with their phone with them but do they communicate hy.
But to Ntanzi it's a different story 😭😭😭
Ubashaye nge game yabo sibanda mfana wasemzini
😂😂😂Engathi LA ngajabula after
😂😂😂😂 shame
#rathamustfall😢
Eish sibanda is very incompetent
Ku reff this time
Why request late for section 205...the state has no case against these 5accused,they are trying to build it now..NPA has alot to answe for,who moved this case to high court and why cause clearly there is no evidence against these 5guys😂😂
@nobuhlemathenjwa. Uyaphupha wake up from a dream my sister these inkabis killed our goalkeeper
@@Wele1012but dololo proof😂😂
@@Wele1012how so?cause the evidence doesn't tell that
KuphuphA wena and uphupha emhlaben wakho wedwa@@Wele1012
Uyafisa everything Ikhona bona
Call other witnesses in the meantime you got thousands witnesses stop cooking cause you expose yourselfs state even more
Ziyakhala manje . Gininda umqolo uphandle kuye mshololo
#Rathamustfall😮
Mampara judge
Nsibande with Baloyi are trying to run away to the fact that this case was cooked if he eximine this weekness such questions
@mavelazungu9136 your reasoning capacity tells that you are one of those who got 30% in matric