The next video will be a look through item passive and actives, and should be much easier for me to make than this one. This vid was on item systems, and I hope you still enjoyed it.
Based on experience, it is all about what you need. I played both games. And dota items compared to league is very flexible and multipurpose. Atk spd + farm = mjolnir If there's NP or hoodwink enemy and you're meelee, You'll probably need tree cut. But you can't just waste gold in quelling so why not proceed with battlefury? You're squishy, needs escape item, and Mana, then go for force staff. League also has that features. But items on lol focus on strengthening what you currently have. While dota on the other hand, focus on real time adjustments considering what items the enemy has. That's why comebacks is common in dota that league.. due to correct "itemization" or counter items. That's why in pro scene, if you have bkb, you want to surprise them. Coz if they are prepared, enemy will then build disable items before you can even use BKB. Also I would like to offer my opinion in regards with ironwood vs scadi. Yes the price, in exchange for stats is a huge loss, however, we need to consider what the item does. Let's out bracer for example. Braces vs iron wood. Ironwood can give 1 stat point per attribute for 50 gold. Now bracer 550- ish. Sorry don't know exact price but somewhere along those lines. Can give plus to all attribute + extra stat to strength. Also gives a decent amount of magic resist. And by 25 min mark doubles the stat provided. How about this for dota: Damage, survivability, assist items. Do you need more damage? - what type of damage?(DPS, burst, magic, physical) Do need to survive longer? - what type of survivability? - magic immunity, armor, dispel, HP Do you need to assist?(buff and debuff) - sustain, slow, disable
I think you should probably put another box for dota2 items as in teamfight items that mainly provide auras. Shiva's Guard probably falls under that category since the main reason people buy it is for its passive heal reduction aura. And there are items like Crimson Guard, Pipe of Insight, Wraith Pact, Greaves, Dominator (both versions), Drums, etc. Those items by themselves don't really do much but they provide game changing teamfight auras when used.
Holy shit dude, what praise ah my ego!! This, right after I read a comment shitting on my video topics and saying i am weird, cringe, with a superiority complex. Well... I appreciate you
Another crucial difference with items from League and Dota2 - as League champions abilities synergize with certain damage types that than synergize with items, items in league are used almost exclusively used to *_accentuate and emphasize a certain playstyle_* which is confined by their characteristics - so apart from certain set of champions, AP champion has absolutely no reason nor gains any benefit from building AD items and vice versa, there a certain amount of splashing and pliability between items like situational-specific counter items and situational purchases based on optimization and lane assignments, for example like whether you play the champion in the middle or solo top, or play them in a lane versus the jungle - but especially in the modern days of League champions build paths are very much streamlined - In Dota 2 with the variety of active items and their effects, *_you can craft yourself a playstyle_* and *_take on a certain role with your item choices_* - you can build carry items or supportive items and your hero simply applies their damage and spells to the situation at hand in accordance to your item choices
one cool thing about dota is u can drop items / share with allies / backpack or stash them if u dont have space in main inventory , also shared unit control / help disable from allies
I'm surprised at how low the views are - items are the biggest point of confusion for me that has stopped me from getting into Dota. Something as simple as the Courier adds so much to my mental stack that it's hard to justify going away from what i already know. Thanks for the clarity!
@@TZAR_POTATO hey, it's good to be critical of oneself and knowing when you have underperformed, either way, I still like the editing on this one. Keep it up chief.
Of course I do, I have no sense for creativity! I'm using a janky free program to edit, it crashes on me from time to time, and I have both unreliable frames when recording, and a sluggish voice with a reading speed of a duck. These vids take sooo long to do!
You dont buy Items in dota so much for your own hero. End game items usually are to counter a specific enemy hero ability ( Eg. Nullifier for Windranger )
same for league but it’s less significant, league items are just stat items with passives to enhance your champion, while dota has flexible ones that basically counts for how you want to approach the whole match.
It's would be neat to see how League handled Dota item. Instead of jusy simply numbers, we basically could give a champion 1-2 more skills then what they already have.
i dont completely understand the point about item progression. are u saying that in LoL, almost every early game item progresses into a more useful item? so you don't have to sell items as often?
Exactly, and not only that they rush the most expensive item in their build BEFORE BOOTS! Imagine if in dota, every single hero rushed things like str blink, dagon 5, bloodthorn, shivas, skadi, butterfly, abyssal. The closest comparisons would be a radiance rush or butterfly rush, but even then you probably want boots of speed at LEAST, or maybe even power treads and a wraith band first.
An iron branch in dota, gives 1 of all three stats for 50 gold suggesting 50g/triple stat. Ultimate orb gives 10 of each stat for 2050 gold, becoming 205g/triple stat. As items get more expensive in dota, the more you pay for the stats they provide. In League, amplifying tome gives 20 AP for 425g at 21.25g/AP, blasting wand gives 40 ap for 850g at also 21.25g/AP. In league, as items get more expensive you pay the same amount for each stat. The difference this would make IMO is that in the early game in dota you would prefer to fill your inventory with cheaper gold efficient stat items rather than rush a single inefficient item like ultimate orb, whereas in league its ok to have 1 expensive stat item because you're not losing any bang for your buck.
@@TZAR_POTATO thats very interesting. i think this intersects with the fact that the lanes are more static in LoL, with no tp scroll and a designated jungler. its hard to leave, and hard to get ganked. you can kind of encouraged to stay in your lane and farm to get your big item. i might be wrong but thats my interpretation
@@MilkJugA_ I don't think so. Both games are very gank prone, and the herald and dragon basically demand early game team fights. I think it's a philosophy difference that stems from trying to keep league predictable. If you incentivize players to buy their most expensive item first, opponents can see it and more quickly adapt to it/counter it in a way. In dota, a sudden aeon disk or scythe in the lategame can be really brutal and hard to counter, especially if you are running out of slots.
The fact that the rpg stats in dota dont inherently effect what you buy on any given hero is super interesting coming from league. Really think league could learn a lot from that kind of a system tbh... Items are kinda stale atm :(
To be fair they do affect what you buy, but only if you are the adc. But even then, you could buy something with strength on an agility hero because strength gives hit points. Or, buy agility on a strength hero for that attack speed and armor!
There was a dev podcast some time ago where they talked about why they dont create more unique items to help with hard matchups etc. and their response was pretty interesting and reasonable. Philosophy of items in league is that they should not be the primary play mechanic just an enabler and enhancer. Sure you have some counteritems that you would buy just for their utility (like sometimes you buy zhonya on champion that either doesnt need armor or doesnt scale with AP well) but most of the time they just enhance your kit. And the champion kit should be the primary source of your interactions with the game. Now if you look at item design from this point of view it actually makes sense why they seem so straightforward and why you dont often see champions building outside of their main stats. And I actually like it quite a lot. Even if its simple in terms of what you go for, you still have lots of options for your specific needs. And its very easy to explain to new player. Since the main thing is your champion kit, you can safely just follow recommended build every game, and be more or less pretty well setup and focus on your champion. Which is not the case in dota. I like dota item diversity, its fun experience, but its harder to pickup because of it. Not only you have to spend a lot of time understanding your favorite hero and his matchups but also all various items that you can combo with him.
@@geekobgaming5647 Except you would also never ever buy zhonya's if you didn't scale with AP. Even if you only have one AP ratio in your kit you wouldn't buy the item even if it would fit the situation or help. There are very few options to opt for a tradeoff in league without either essentially totally trolling your build, getting yelled at for it, or losing substantially more than you would have with something riot has deemed "reasonable" for you to build. To this end they try and have versions of certain items for different "classes" but they also end up totally ignoring the possibility of tradeoffs as a result. Oh you're an ADC and want to trade out raw damage for survivability? Sorry, say goodbye to full crit and hello to missed kills thanks to that chance to do substantially less damage through no fault of your own. Meanwhile every other class in the game never has to worry about luck based stuff with their damage and can itemize defensively if they wish without losing their consistency. Riot also loves making literally everyone in the game scale and likes making them scale with one stat that translates into damage for the champion, and now we're in a scenario where damage is unbelievably rampant in the game, DPS basically doesn't exist and burst damage is at an all-time-high and there just aren't items that actually allow someone to maybe claw back some agency. Sure you have qss, but that's basically the only example, some adcs like Kaisa can go zhonya's in a specific build, but Kaisa also does this while having tons of crazy strong outplay tools on top of that too and ends up overbearingly strong with the item as a result. It isn't fun to fight basically anyone in this game because systemic counters basically don't exist and champion design is getting power crept into absurdity with little way for slightly older champions to actually keep up or even optionally trade off something to try and stay relevant. Imo, the game should either embrace the absurdity of dota and actually implement the mechanics that balance out ideas they've already cribbed from it for league, or remove the existing cribbed dota mechanics in favor of being less crazy and more unique in its own way.
So cute a potato... I get now the differences btw lol and dota thx to your videos. What comes to my mind as a league player is that dota looks way more teamplay oriented.
It really is. League is a 1v5+allies, dota is an ally focused game. In league, champions are made to be self sufficient, you play well with your team to support. In dota, a lot of the heroes are made with intentional flaws and massive drawbacks. You need your team, you just can't win alone most of the time! Even a 10 - 0 assassin still can't hit buildings...
as a pepega warrior 🪖.. i like your opinion about these kinds of things. not gonna argue about right / wrong. we get chat champ/hero n item already. and plan about making a video about the game mechanic? for exm dota has roshan as map objective, lol has drag / baron, dota has ward which is can be buy / stacked on 1 person only for vision duty.
![⭐ฮิตในTikTok!! ( มะมะมะหมูเด้ง MooDeng ) Ver. แดนซ์ ReMix BY [ ดีเจกิต รีมิกซ์ ]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/4noyAoMa7bQ/mqdefault.jpg)
Finally, a video on items. Can't wait for the nuances between the 2 games in terms of the item's passive and active effects.
The next video will be a look through item passive and actives, and should be much easier for me to make than this one. This vid was on item systems, and I hope you still enjoyed it.
Based on experience, it is all about what you need. I played both games. And dota items compared to league is very flexible and multipurpose.
Atk spd + farm = mjolnir
If there's NP or hoodwink enemy and you're meelee,
You'll probably need tree cut. But you can't just waste gold in quelling so why not proceed with battlefury?
You're squishy, needs escape item, and Mana, then go for force staff.
League also has that features. But items on lol focus on strengthening what you currently have.
While dota on the other hand, focus on real time adjustments considering what items the enemy has. That's why comebacks is common in dota that league.. due to correct "itemization" or counter items.
That's why in pro scene, if you have bkb, you want to surprise them. Coz if they are prepared, enemy will then build disable items before you can even use BKB.
Also I would like to offer my opinion in regards with ironwood vs scadi.
Yes the price, in exchange for stats is a huge loss, however, we need to consider what the item does.
Let's out bracer for example.
Braces vs iron wood. Ironwood can give 1 stat point per attribute for 50 gold.
Now bracer 550- ish. Sorry don't know exact price but somewhere along those lines. Can give plus to all attribute + extra stat to strength.
Also gives a decent amount of magic resist. And by 25 min mark doubles the stat provided.
How about this for dota:
Damage, survivability, assist items.
Do you need more damage?
- what type of damage?(DPS, burst, magic, physical)
Do need to survive longer?
- what type of survivability?
- magic immunity, armor, dispel, HP
Do you need to assist?(buff and debuff)
- sustain, slow, disable
I think you should probably put another box for dota2 items as in teamfight items that mainly provide auras. Shiva's Guard probably falls under that category since the main reason people buy it is for its passive heal reduction aura. And there are items like Crimson Guard, Pipe of Insight, Wraith Pact, Greaves, Dominator (both versions), Drums, etc. Those items by themselves don't really do much but they provide game changing teamfight auras when used.
True, auras could have been their own category.
I think auras falls into unique effects part
oh finally! have been waiting for this comparison since the beginning
SINCE THE BEGINNING?! but I only teased it like 2 vids ago :D
I’ve been looking for a video like this for a week and this just came through thanks
You have been? Well, you're welcome! Check my other stuff out too you might like it!
@@TZAR_POTATO already have actually
YOU ARE BY FAR THE BEST TH-camR I HAVE EVER WATCHED. KEEP IT UP! I WILL SUPPORT YOU NO MATTER WHAT YOUR CONTENT IS
Holy shit dude, what praise ah my ego!! This, right after I read a comment shitting on my video topics and saying i am weird, cringe, with a superiority complex. Well... I appreciate you
babe wake up new tzar potato video just dropped
I am honored. But not humbled! MY Ego! YES!
Another crucial difference with items from League and Dota2 - as League champions abilities synergize with certain damage types that than synergize with items, items in league are used almost exclusively used to *_accentuate and emphasize a certain playstyle_* which is confined by their characteristics - so apart from certain set of champions, AP champion has absolutely no reason nor gains any benefit from building AD items and vice versa, there a certain amount of splashing and pliability between items like situational-specific counter items and situational purchases based on optimization and lane assignments, for example like whether you play the champion in the middle or solo top, or play them in a lane versus the jungle - but especially in the modern days of League champions build paths are very much streamlined - In Dota 2 with the variety of active items and their effects, *_you can craft yourself a playstyle_* and *_take on a certain role with your item choices_* - you can build carry items or supportive items and your hero simply applies their damage and spells to the situation at hand in accordance to your item choices
I love that comparison concept!
Pls more like this video!
Have you seen all my comparison vids on the channel then?
@@TZAR_POTATO A lot of them, maybe i missed one or two, but I saw most of them ☺️
Love ur speaking style, edit, and charisma bro. KEEEEEEEEEP UP
one cool thing about dota is u can drop items / share with allies / backpack or stash them if u dont have space in main inventory , also shared unit control / help disable from allies
I'm surprised at how low the views are - items are the biggest point of confusion for me that has stopped me from getting into Dota. Something as simple as the Courier adds so much to my mental stack that it's hard to justify going away from what i already know. Thanks for the clarity!
Um, thanks, I think? I'm not sure how to react to this one.
I'm quite proud of the views on this one, anything over 3k is amazing!
Really cool video and nice editing 👍
Thank you! I don't think I did as well on this one as my earlier works, but it was so hard to do because of the topic. I'm happy you enjoyed it!
@@TZAR_POTATO hey, it's good to be critical of oneself and knowing when you have underperformed, either way, I still like the editing on this one.
Keep it up chief.
@@mauriciohablutzel
Incredibly informative work. Really like your videos.
Thanks!
Nice Video. Looking forward on the next part
Ty, it's on the way... I predict a week.. this one took so very long because of the script, it was hard to write. The next one , the script is done!
took me thousands of hours of dota 2 to learn that blink daggers range is reduced if you click outside of its available range
Me too. I don't really use that knowledge though...
Don't beat yourself up too much. Pro player Cr1t basically just learned about it a few months ago.
What? Really?
Pretty Cool, Keep making these.
ty! halfway through making part 2 already
@@TZAR_POTATO GGWP
Man you your channel is growing quickly now!
this channel is fire! loving all this content
tho it looks like you struggle with editing a little bit.
Of course I do, I have no sense for creativity! I'm using a janky free program to edit, it crashes on me from time to time, and I have both unreliable frames when recording, and a sluggish voice with a reading speed of a duck. These vids take sooo long to do!
You dont buy Items in dota so much for your own hero.
End game items usually are to counter a specific enemy hero ability ( Eg. Nullifier for Windranger )
windrun is undispellable
same for league but it’s less significant, league items are just stat items with passives to enhance your champion, while dota has flexible ones that basically counts for how you want to approach the whole match.
Giga chad content
GIGACHAD comment!
It's would be neat to see how League handled Dota item.
Instead of jusy simply numbers, we basically could give a champion 1-2 more skills then what they already have.
what i get from play both for years is leauge item more focus on champion role when dota item more focus on situational.
Great video, greater vibes on the comments
i dont completely understand the point about item progression. are u saying that in LoL, almost every early game item progresses into a more useful item? so you don't have to sell items as often?
Exactly, and not only that they rush the most expensive item in their build BEFORE BOOTS! Imagine if in dota, every single hero rushed things like str blink, dagon 5, bloodthorn, shivas, skadi, butterfly, abyssal.
The closest comparisons would be a radiance rush or butterfly rush, but even then you probably want boots of speed at LEAST, or maybe even power treads and a wraith band first.
An iron branch in dota, gives 1 of all three stats for 50 gold suggesting 50g/triple stat. Ultimate orb gives 10 of each stat for 2050 gold, becoming 205g/triple stat. As items get more expensive in dota, the more you pay for the stats they provide. In League, amplifying tome gives 20 AP for 425g at 21.25g/AP, blasting wand gives 40 ap for 850g at also 21.25g/AP. In league, as items get more expensive you pay the same amount for each stat. The difference this would make IMO is that in the early game in dota you would prefer to fill your inventory with cheaper gold efficient stat items rather than rush a single inefficient item like ultimate orb, whereas in league its ok to have 1 expensive stat item because you're not losing any bang for your buck.
@@TZAR_POTATO thats very interesting. i think this intersects with the fact that the lanes are more static in LoL, with no tp scroll and a designated jungler. its hard to leave, and hard to get ganked. you can kind of encouraged to stay in your lane and farm to get your big item. i might be wrong but thats my interpretation
@@MilkJugA_ I don't think so. Both games are very gank prone, and the herald and dragon basically demand early game team fights. I think it's a philosophy difference that stems from trying to keep league predictable. If you incentivize players to buy their most expensive item first, opponents can see it and more quickly adapt to it/counter it in a way. In dota, a sudden aeon disk or scythe in the lategame can be really brutal and hard to counter, especially if you are running out of slots.
@@TZAR_POTATO hmm i would think the average low kill score in pro LoL games would support my claim
The fact that the rpg stats in dota dont inherently effect what you buy on any given hero is super interesting coming from league.
Really think league could learn a lot from that kind of a system tbh... Items are kinda stale atm :(
To be fair they do affect what you buy, but only if you are the adc. But even then, you could buy something with strength on an agility hero because strength gives hit points. Or, buy agility on a strength hero for that attack speed and armor!
There was a dev podcast some time ago where they talked about why they dont create more unique items to help with hard matchups etc. and their response was pretty interesting and reasonable. Philosophy of items in league is that they should not be the primary play mechanic just an enabler and enhancer. Sure you have some counteritems that you would buy just for their utility (like sometimes you buy zhonya on champion that either doesnt need armor or doesnt scale with AP well) but most of the time they just enhance your kit. And the champion kit should be the primary source of your interactions with the game.
Now if you look at item design from this point of view it actually makes sense why they seem so straightforward and why you dont often see champions building outside of their main stats. And I actually like it quite a lot. Even if its simple in terms of what you go for, you still have lots of options for your specific needs. And its very easy to explain to new player. Since the main thing is your champion kit, you can safely just follow recommended build every game, and be more or less pretty well setup and focus on your champion. Which is not the case in dota. I like dota item diversity, its fun experience, but its harder to pickup because of it. Not only you have to spend a lot of time understanding your favorite hero and his matchups but also all various items that you can combo with him.
@@geekobgaming5647 Except you would also never ever buy zhonya's if you didn't scale with AP. Even if you only have one AP ratio in your kit you wouldn't buy the item even if it would fit the situation or help. There are very few options to opt for a tradeoff in league without either essentially totally trolling your build, getting yelled at for it, or losing substantially more than you would have with something riot has deemed "reasonable" for you to build.
To this end they try and have versions of certain items for different "classes" but they also end up totally ignoring the possibility of tradeoffs as a result. Oh you're an ADC and want to trade out raw damage for survivability? Sorry, say goodbye to full crit and hello to missed kills thanks to that chance to do substantially less damage through no fault of your own. Meanwhile every other class in the game never has to worry about luck based stuff with their damage and can itemize defensively if they wish without losing their consistency.
Riot also loves making literally everyone in the game scale and likes making them scale with one stat that translates into damage for the champion, and now we're in a scenario where damage is unbelievably rampant in the game, DPS basically doesn't exist and burst damage is at an all-time-high and there just aren't items that actually allow someone to maybe claw back some agency. Sure you have qss, but that's basically the only example, some adcs like Kaisa can go zhonya's in a specific build, but Kaisa also does this while having tons of crazy strong outplay tools on top of that too and ends up overbearingly strong with the item as a result.
It isn't fun to fight basically anyone in this game because systemic counters basically don't exist and champion design is getting power crept into absurdity with little way for slightly older champions to actually keep up or even optionally trade off something to try and stay relevant.
Imo, the game should either embrace the absurdity of dota and actually implement the mechanics that balance out ideas they've already cribbed from it for league, or remove the existing cribbed dota mechanics in favor of being less crazy and more unique in its own way.
So cute a potato... I get now the differences btw lol and dota thx to your videos. What comes to my mind as a league player is that dota looks way more teamplay oriented.
It really is. League is a 1v5+allies, dota is an ally focused game. In league, champions are made to be self sufficient, you play well with your team to support. In dota, a lot of the heroes are made with intentional flaws and massive drawbacks. You need your team, you just can't win alone most of the time! Even a 10 - 0 assassin still can't hit buildings...
also we can dismantle item in dota
I wonder if I should add that in the part 2. I hadn't thought of including it, but you're right it is a useful mechanic.
i have played both games alot and items are so different.
amazing
Thank you!
dota's stats actually matter in the hole game.
hey tzar have you used or encounter a player that used the starting item 'cull' in league?
Maybe, idk? I don't check people's inventory a lot.
Keep make these video thank you
Great video, but you got to use a pop-filter or something. Every time you say the 's' sound it slices my soul.
Sorry, it's the microphone's 15 years of age you are hearing. I got a filter :(
We need A dota Vs Legue Cross Over game.... Settle this on a battlfield.
Check Meeponegeroi's dota 2 mod
In dota items have stronger actives and the opposite is in league
Yup
what is the name of the music ?
dota MF when they realize items can have both good stats and effects: 🤯🤯🤯
Sad thing that dota2 has death gold penalty
as a pepega warrior 🪖..
i like your opinion about these kinds of things.
not gonna argue about right / wrong.
we get chat champ/hero n item already.
and plan about making a video about the game mechanic?
for exm dota has roshan as map objective, lol has drag / baron, dota has ward which is can be buy / stacked on 1 person only for vision duty.
lol has every champ has ward slot on the bags by default.
and many more...
done!
4:59 bro WTF! lol
?
@@TZAR_POTATO the tank comparison