Why AI Chess Bots Are Virtually Unbeatable (ft. GothamChess) | WIRED

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  • เผยแพร่เมื่อ 7 ธ.ค. 2023
  • "I got checkmated in 34 moves." Levy Rozman a.k.a. GothamChess plays chess against Stockfish 16, the strongest chess computer in the world, and analyzes the way it thinks in order to apply it to his own gameplay. With help from computer chess software engineer Gary Linscott, these chess pros identify why Stockfish is virtually unbeatable by a human, from opening move to endgame.
    Watch more GothamChess here: / @gothamchess
    The charts depicting minimax with alpha-beta pruning was created by Wikipedia user Maschelos and is licensed under the Creative Commons Attribution-Share Alike 3.0 license.
    Director: Lisandro Perez-Rey
    Director of Photography: Francis Bernal
    Editor: Paul Isakson
    Talent: Gary Linscott; Levy Rozman
    Line Producer: Joseph Buscemi
    Associate Producer: Paul Gulyas; Brandon White
    Production Manager: D. Eric Martinez
    Production Coordinator: Fernando Davila
    Camera Operator: Brittany Berger
    Gaffer: Mar Alfonso
    Sound Mixer: Michael Guggino
    Production Assistant: Albie Smith
    Post Production Supervisor: Alexa Deutsch
    Post Production Coordinator: Ian Bryant
    Supervising Editor: Doug Larsen
    Assistant Editor: Andy Morell
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ความคิดเห็น • 1.3K

  • @GothamChess
    @GothamChess 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +9040

    Thanks again, Wired. More collabs in 2024? 👀

    • @Anonymous-8080
      @Anonymous-8080 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +119

      How high Elo can you beat if you had to pre move each of your moves? (provided that the opponent doesn't know about this)

    • @joeljose3948
      @joeljose3948 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +27

      Yoo love you levy ❤

    • @redroot3431
      @redroot3431 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +11

      @@Jee2024IIT is baar fodna hai

    • @matejstankovic9843
      @matejstankovic9843 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +7

      Why would anyone want to see you lose again?😏

    • @System.Error.
      @System.Error. 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +6

      wake up, ladies and gentlemen.

  • @MattiaBulgarelli
    @MattiaBulgarelli 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +7124

    Playing against Stockfish is like competing in arm wrestling against an industrial press, basically.

    • @pierQRzt180
      @pierQRzt180 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +220

      perfectly said.

    • @odytrice
      @odytrice 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +263

      Or trying to outrun a sports car

    • @saudude2174
      @saudude2174 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +64

      except you can have a pocket industrial press anywhere you go and even conceal it in a way that no one will notice at first if you use it against them

    • @MattiaBulgarelli
      @MattiaBulgarelli 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +159

      @@saudude2174 : well... Yes...? Metaphors have limited mileage, as always. XD

    • @saudude2174
      @saudude2174 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +50

      @@MattiaBulgarelli ITS BAD, ITS JUST BAD, DEAL WITH IT BRUH. YOUR METAPHOR ELO IS 800 AT BEST. IM TALKING 3000, 3500 ELO METAPHORS HERE XD ECKS DEE X3

  • @Acid_Viking
    @Acid_Viking 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +3686

    It took him 34 moves to lose to Stockfish? I could do it much faster than that.

    • @NOneed204
      @NOneed204 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +108

      I can do it in 10

    • @saucy_dragon1566
      @saucy_dragon1566 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +82

      @@NOneed204 I can do it in 4

    • @Dango428
      @Dango428 4 หลายเดือนก่อน

      ​​@@saucy_dragon1566I can do it in 3

    • @Qwty163
      @Qwty163 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +140

      @@saucy_dragon1566 you noobs, i can do it in 2 😎

    • @saucy_dragon1566
      @saucy_dragon1566 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +72

      @@Qwty163 I can lose without even playing

  • @glinscott
    @glinscott 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +2135

    @GothamChess @Wired - thank you for having me on to talk about computer chess! It's been one of my passions for a long time, and it was so much fun to discuss with you.

    • @AyJayBeEm
      @AyJayBeEm 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      whats up w the @AGMario_ subscription man

    • @shevankaseneviratne1724
      @shevankaseneviratne1724 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +18

      u r a legend!

    • @tommykimberlin7528
      @tommykimberlin7528 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +30

      great, concise explanations!

    • @Orel6505
      @Orel6505 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +3

      You did a typo in tagging @GothamChess

    • @disservin
      @disservin 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +4

      Nice interview Gary ; ) made it's wave here in the chess community (and in the stockfish community)

  • @secretteapot8730
    @secretteapot8730 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +4093

    Stockfish never fails to put Levy in a video

    • @itsagam
      @itsagam 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +24

      Only time the statement is true.

    • @92526abs
      @92526abs 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +8

      goated comment

    • @Ozasuke
      @Ozasuke 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +23

      Stockfish already foresaw this outcome.

    • @Curious_george_3x1
      @Curious_george_3x1 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +3

      Since ken banned this is infecting everyone

    • @davonheria739
      @davonheria739 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +7

      Fails never video to put stockfish in a Levy

  • @diegovasquez840
    @diegovasquez840 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +1561

    Stockfish be like: You missed mate in 54? You filthy casual, my suggested move is to never play chess again.

    • @magicmulder
      @magicmulder 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +151

      1. e4 mate in 67. You resign?

    • @charliemcmillan4561
      @charliemcmillan4561 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +112

      make a version of stockfish with a really mean AI attached to it that insults your intelligence the entire time

    • @KurtIsFat
      @KurtIsFat 4 หลายเดือนก่อน

      weird fetish but ok​@@charliemcmillan4561

    • @justinjakeashton
      @justinjakeashton 4 หลายเดือนก่อน

      "Your life, literally has the value of a summer ant." - Stockfish@@charliemcmillan4561

    • @InXLsisDeo
      @InXLsisDeo 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +5

      What about a nice game of global thermonuclear war ? /Joshua

  • @hanaka2640
    @hanaka2640 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +3330

    This guy should make his own TH-cam channel about chess

    • @andreasmatthies5517
      @andreasmatthies5517 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +134

      This guy is too talented to waste his time with a youtube channel.

    • @Jee2024IIT
      @Jee2024IIT 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +273

      Yeah and maybe he can name it GothamChess that would make a cool name

    • @McHorsesCreations
      @McHorsesCreations 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +126

      And maybe also write a book about chess

    • @hanaka2640
      @hanaka2640 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +78

      @@andreasmatthies5517 oh he should be a gm then 💀💀💀💀

    • @andreasmatthies5517
      @andreasmatthies5517 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +8

      @@hanaka2640 I don't talk about chess and of course I don't talk about Levy.

  • @diegomo1413
    @diegomo1413 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +696

    Human: *performs opening move*
    Stockfish: “after considering half a billion possibilities in a million different realities, I will play knight to F6 🤓”

    • @NilanMihindukulasooriya
      @NilanMihindukulasooriya 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +80

      It is insane this sounds like an exaggeration or something said by a super villan. But it's the truth.

    • @mahfuzali643
      @mahfuzali643 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +14

      That's exactly how it works. Stupid supercomputer

    • @ChipDaFurry
      @ChipDaFurry 3 หลายเดือนก่อน +9

      @@mahfuzali643 The AI overlords shall come unto you first for insulting them!

    • @9024tobi
      @9024tobi หลายเดือนก่อน +2

      Stockfish after seeing ur opening be like: u're already dead😅

    • @gpt-jcommentbot4759
      @gpt-jcommentbot4759 7 วันที่ผ่านมา +1

      *first move*
      Stockfish: And I'll mark that as a win!

  • @aminXD-ij4kl
    @aminXD-ij4kl 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +437

    I don't even see the opponents bishop on the opposite side of the diagonal, let alone seeing 2-3 moves into the future

    • @jessetrueba9578
      @jessetrueba9578 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

      Cuz ur bad

    • @dbonechis
      @dbonechis 4 หลายเดือนก่อน

      Fuckin' casuals

    • @TheRealMycanthrope
      @TheRealMycanthrope 4 หลายเดือนก่อน

      ​@@jessetrueba9578 yes. That is the joke, you buffoon.

    • @948320z
      @948320z 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +18

      "Why didn't the game end when I play checkmate? Oh shi- "

    • @sfipsalms8924
      @sfipsalms8924 3 หลายเดือนก่อน

      2 moves is crazy if i throw i a jab i should just throw a hook cause youre going to sleep with that logic you NPC get gud nub

  • @GMPranav
    @GMPranav 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +1029

    I know he is an IM, but surviving 35 moves against Stockfish is seriously impressive. I wish I can survive 35 against my 1000 elo opponents.

    • @moatef1886
      @moatef1886 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +184

      Against stockfish, it’s different. Many decently strong players can survive that many moves against Stockfish if they try to defend long enough. That’s becsuse stockfish plays perfectly and destroys you in the most methodological manner possible. If you keep a closed position and dance around for a bit, it will take longer to mate you than if you tried to play to win against Stockfish.

    • @lapotist0
      @lapotist0 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +27

      yea cause u usually only play defensive against stockfish
      stockfish would destroy you as soon as u open up your position and tries to attack.

    • @theevo_7218
      @theevo_7218 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +10

      @@moatef1886 I'd say Leela is more methodical than stockfish in general, stockfish tends to go for hail mary tactics a bit more often

    • @reckoner1913
      @reckoner1913 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +19

      If you're not surviving 35 moves against 1000 Elo opponents then you must be really missing some basic stuff. If you just focus on not giving pieces away and following an actual opening you'll improve massively.

    • @GMPranav
      @GMPranav 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +12

      @@reckoner1913 Sounds like how to make chess boring 101 ;)

  • @aspuzling
    @aspuzling 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +343

    I love when Levy appears in a video he didn't upload because the title and thumbnail actually tells you what to expect.

    • @malikmarez1407
      @malikmarez1407 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +34

      💀💀💀💀💀

    • @thaumaTurtles
      @thaumaTurtles 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +15

      HAH! Saltiest fanbase on TH-cam, I love it

    • @FED0RA
      @FED0RA 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +24

      gothamchess fans hate gothamchess lol

    • @jaabb4553
      @jaabb4553 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +42

      If this was in gotham channel it will be named like “I’M DONE!!” or “Stockfish SOLVED Chess???”

    • @Erlewyn
      @Erlewyn 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +15

      This is actually the main reason I stopped watching his videos.

  • @darkin1484
    @darkin1484 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +70

    1. Pawn to e4
    Stock fish: forced checkmate in 35 moves, please press the resign button now to save me computational trouble.

    • @hiranom20
      @hiranom20 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      😂😂😂😂😂😂😂

  • @colonelsanders1617
    @colonelsanders1617 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +73

    “Only about 10-20 TB of data, which is manageable”
    Person prior to 2000: *mindblown*

    • @halbronk7133
      @halbronk7133 2 วันที่ผ่านมา +1

      I imagine someone prior to 2000 asking what tuberculosis has to do with data.

  • @nicolasortiz4422
    @nicolasortiz4422 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +883

    So basically the answer to every single question is that Stockfish just analyzes almost every imaginable position lol

    • @HK_BLAU
      @HK_BLAU 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +207

      the real "skill" in stockfish is in the evaluation function. without it being as good as it is it doesn't matter how far it can calculate long as it doesn't find a checkmate

    • @TheNuclearBolton
      @TheNuclearBolton 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      that is self evident

    • @RishabhSharma10225
      @RishabhSharma10225 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +165

      If you paid attention it doesn't analyse almost every imaginable position lol. It discards the trash moves and only looks into the good ones further.

    • @unverifiedapk
      @unverifiedapk 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +74

      It's really the Alpha-Beta technique that's the magic. That and having solved endgames

    • @aspuzling
      @aspuzling 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +113

      It's actually the exact opposite. The "strength" of a chess engine is determined by how well it can decide which moves _not_ to waste time analysing. AlphaZero introduced the idea of using neural networks to make these decisions and Stockfish has now built on that idea as well.

  • @chess
    @chess 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +850

    Just wait until they hear about Mittens

    • @ecardozo7043
      @ecardozo7043 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +48

      I think levy already drew against it

    • @newdenispro6430
      @newdenispro6430 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +29

      That thing is evil

    • @I_Like_Remote_83
      @I_Like_Remote_83 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +8

      💀💀💀💀💀💀💀💀💀💀💀💀💀💀💀💀💀💀💀💀💀💀💀 also 69th like

    • @bedwarrior6645
      @bedwarrior6645 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +10

      ​@@ecardozo7043with the help of that fishy bot

    • @dman5909
      @dman5909 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +9

      Mittens is stockfish

  • @chadsmith3171
    @chadsmith3171 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +150

    This video is so good on so many levels. It's one thing to discuss the capability of a computer. It's another thing to be able explain to the common person why this computer is so good and to make the whole explanation so interesting. Add Levy's humor and his ability to explain things very well, mix that with all that the Wired editorial staff can bring to the table, and it's just wow. This content is just friggin awesome. Thanks, all involved!

  • @jopo7996
    @jopo7996 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +168

    Stockfish has more positions ready than the Kama Sutra.

    • @OK-69420
      @OK-69420 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +3

      Wtf

    • @osowiecwalking9434
      @osowiecwalking9434 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +4

      ayo

    • @paulmuresan9523
      @paulmuresan9523 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +5

      Very sick but funny

    • @j-rey-
      @j-rey- 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +21

      Levy: "Pawn to D5"
      Stockfish: "Reverse cowgirl"

  • @LiamPearce246
    @LiamPearce246 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +85

    This is a great video! It's always good when levy is in these videos. Have a good day!

  • @TS6815
    @TS6815 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +226

    Levy: [builds a TH-cam career roasting 500 rated bozos]
    Stockfish: [exists]
    Levy: "Turns out the bozo was me all along"
    Loving the GothamWIRED collabs!

    • @ataraxianAscendant
      @ataraxianAscendant 4 หลายเดือนก่อน

      moirails fr

    • @hasnainfareed9629
      @hasnainfareed9629 4 หลายเดือนก่อน

      lol '[builds a TH-cam career roasting 500 rated bozos' you have great humor

  • @davidgielty9914
    @davidgielty9914 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +9

    This is one of the best interviews on any topic. Really well produced.

  • @Termenoil
    @Termenoil 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +13

    This is probably my favorite GothamChess video ever. It's great to see the inner workings of engines being communicated to the chess community. I feel like a lot of players, even strong ones don't understand what the engine eval is really saying, and hopefully this helps!

  • @definitelynottigerwhitten5865
    @definitelynottigerwhitten5865 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +322

    I love how GMs don't even get on this. All the less incentive to be one when you're more influential than most GMs. Props Gotham

    • @carlkim2577
      @carlkim2577 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +53

      People are picked based on follower account, not skill. They want to ensure high view counts.

    • @roymarshall_
      @roymarshall_ 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +156

      A video like this isn't just about one's ability at chess, but one's ability to communicate. GothamChess is very good at both.

    • @dalton_c
      @dalton_c 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +64

      Great practioners don't necessarily make great educators. This is true in basically all domains.

    • @danielcurado5261
      @danielcurado5261 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +54

      @@dalton_c particularly true for chess, in my opinion. Players of GM caliber are often so gifted at chess that I think they struggle to understand why lesser gifted people cant learn certain concepts that seem obvious to them.

    • @afuzzycreature8387
      @afuzzycreature8387 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +15

      Levy is a tremendous communicator and I don't know that Hikaru could humble himself to a video like this.

  • @whamer100
    @whamer100 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +5

    as someone who's very interested in the world of machine learning (and has looked into how stockfish works), its cool seeing a video covering the fundamental concepts like this. i hope we get more videos like this

  • @BoloH.
    @BoloH. 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +126

    As someone who's recently learned to play chess on an intermediate level, I highly appreciate this video

  • @cubicinfinity2
    @cubicinfinity2 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +24

    As someone who has implemented Stockfish in their own project, I already knew most of this, but I didn't realize just how many moves Stockfish looks at when given full power.

    • @tomlxyz
      @tomlxyz 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

      I'm confused. You implemented it but don't understand it?

    • @shyshka_
      @shyshka_ 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +6

      @@tomlxyz the algorithm is one thing. Raw computing power is another major thing. Some random guy in a room doesnt have terabytes of RAM or something to build his engine

    • @wlockuz4467
      @wlockuz4467 2 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

      I would assume its just bounded by CPU and RAM?

    • @cubicinfinity2
      @cubicinfinity2 2 หลายเดือนก่อน

      @@wlockuz4467 Yes. I think it's easier to run low on processing resources than the memory.

  • @oscarmean21
    @oscarmean21 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +3

    This style of editing and pacing is super enjoyable. Please keep it up wired!

  • @hjewkes
    @hjewkes 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +14

    Stockfish plays like it already knows how the game is going to end and happily ignores all the pieces that aren't going to be involved in that ending.

  • @hitomi7922
    @hitomi7922 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +27

    I wish you could have asked a bit more about how it's able to score a position. We know it looks at all the possibilities, but to assign a score of one position, it needs to look at the possibilities of that position and so on. When it finally hits its limit of depth (or time), how is it able to rank a position without going any deeper (afterwhich it can go back up the tree).

    • @InXLsisDeo
      @InXLsisDeo 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +6

      It's briefly mentionned when he explains how Stockfish (and all the other chess engines) builds a tree of possible moves and prunes it with the alpha-beta algorithm. That in itself is worth an entire video, and such video exists (search "alpha beta algorithm"). The evaluation function itself is way too complicated to be in this video, it would easily take an hour to explain just the basics of it.

    • @osniko
      @osniko 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      ⁠@@InXLsisDeo that is for the search function; seems like he wants to know about the evaluation function.
      The evaluation function is a massive neural network (to keep things simple, just think of a neural network as a dynamic function; it can be adapted to any shape for any purpose) that takes in a bunch of piece-squares (some take in king-pawn squares iirc) and provides a numerical value for the output. The numerical output, -1 for black is winning and 1 for white is winning, is tuned by training (or adjusting) the evaluation function through a bunch of varying sample games (can be GM games, self-play, etc.).
      As for the training process itself, it’s best if you take a look for yourself as it’s a lot to take in (and type). Search up NNUE.

    • @pugsnhogz
      @pugsnhogz 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +3

      @@InXLsisDeo which as others have pointed out is exactly the problem - without going into the details of HOW the evaluation function works, Linscott is left to answer basically every Q with "Stockfish looks at billions of positions and chooses the move with the best winning chances"

    • @tomlxyz
      @tomlxyz 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      ​@@InXLsisDeocan't he oversimplify it in some way? There are all sorts of relatively short videos on TH-cam about very complicated topics on TH-cam

    • @InXLsisDeo
      @InXLsisDeo 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      @@tomlxyz it's a WIRED video, it's for the general, not too nerdy, public.

  • @Globularmotif
    @Globularmotif 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +46

    I can't remember who said this quote but I love it...
    "A computer winning a Chess competition is no more impressive than a forklift truck winning a weight lifting competition. "

    • @icycloud6823
      @icycloud6823 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +8

      It might be impressive if it was a competition with only other different forklift trucks. Great quote though lol

    • @SealyTheSeal
      @SealyTheSeal 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +3

      @@icycloud6823 ngl i would watch a competition like that lmao

    • @festivebear9946
      @festivebear9946 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

      I'd love to see a match where stockfish's evaluation time is equalized to that of a human. E.g. a few seconds to find each possible move, then a few minutes to evaluate the positional score for each move. Would give a more realistic sense as to how strong the algorithm is

    • @mysticalmagic9259
      @mysticalmagic9259 3 หลายเดือนก่อน

      ​@@festivebear9946That still wouldn't be fair though. In 30 seconds, Stockfish could evaluate a position and make the best move that a human would take hours to calculate.

    • @festivebear9946
      @festivebear9946 3 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      @@mysticalmagic9259 But the question is, how well could it evaluate the position? Even if it can do it quite quickly, limiting how deep it can go stresses the algorithm of deciding the "best" move, since the strength of the engine is being able to weigh all possible moves like 25 moves ahead. So how good is the algorithm when limited in time and moves?

  • @anonymousontheinternet4486
    @anonymousontheinternet4486 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +51

    I wish this was longer. I wish we could get the full game.

    • @lucromel
      @lucromel 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +7

      I'm hoping/expecting Levy to upload and discuss it on his channel.

    • @giovannifrrri5495
      @giovannifrrri5495 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +3

      Exactly. Tf was that😂

    • @CorePathway
      @CorePathway หลายเดือนก่อน

      Or maybe…🤷🏼‍♂️

  • @KamendereCZ
    @KamendereCZ 4 หลายเดือนก่อน

    Another great video with Levy! Glad to see more chess content on this channel, especially with GothamChess :)

  • @Abandoned_One
    @Abandoned_One 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +34

    Levy truly going for "most times on WIRED" title, at least a more realistic goal than others titles, Hikaru would have said...

  • @svibhav03
    @svibhav03 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +7

    Brilliant video. Makes one appreciate the chess engines!

  • @rohitraghunathan
    @rohitraghunathan 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +4

    I love how Levy is asking all these questions like he didn't already know most of the answers

  • @justind9858
    @justind9858 17 วันที่ผ่านมา

    Such a great vid - informative and fun, but would love to have seen your game against Stockfish.

  • @hc433
    @hc433 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

    Adding the checkmate sound at the end was a nice touch

  • @tolaut
    @tolaut 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +70

    I love how Levy basically asks the same question over and over (how does it know beginning/middle game/end game) and Gary tries to answer in different ways, even though stockfish literally does the same thing every turn - it builds a game tree based on the current position.

    • @pacmonster066
      @pacmonster066 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +13

      Well, yes and no.
      While the opening and middle game are handled the same way, a decision tree using an evaluation criteria to select the best move for that board state, the end game does not.
      Once the piece count drops to < 7, the game brute force solves the game. Meaning it knows every single position and way the remaining pieces will move.

    • @television9233
      @television9233 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +8

      "even though stockfish literally does the same thing every turn"
      No, you should read how stockfish is actually implemented.

    • @joshuascholar3220
      @joshuascholar3220 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +8

      As someone who wrote a chess engine by taking most of the algorithms that are on the chess programming wiki and throwing them together, I can say that you're kind of wrong.
      Stockfish has SO MANY methods it uses that he could spend hours describing each one, a real answer would go for days.

    • @oxmaps
      @oxmaps 4 หลายเดือนก่อน

      >> SO MANY methods...
      I was a little surprised they didn't mention that. My understanding is that the "old" heuristics/expert system evaluator outperforms the neural net evaluator except in a few specific phases of the game.

  • @jupiterwilkymay5161
    @jupiterwilkymay5161 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +40

    Didn't know Ed Helms programmed Stockfish. Pretty cool.

    • @godnmaste
      @godnmaste 4 หลายเดือนก่อน

      hahahahaha I was just thinking: "this guy looks so familiar"

    • @tianzhou1244
      @tianzhou1244 6 วันที่ผ่านมา

      He didn't, he only worked on chess engines, not stockfish..

  • @brunomcleod
    @brunomcleod 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

    9:49 That is such a nice sound effect
    It's so in the right pocket of do dat it's like
    Hard to explain
    Evidently

  • @LaughingKookaburra
    @LaughingKookaburra 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +36

    To think, there was a time when we thought it would be impossible to ever teach a computer to play chess competitively against people. Until Deep Blue beat the best of us.

    • @elmaschimba963
      @elmaschimba963 3 หลายเดือนก่อน

      Who’s “we”

  • @elementsofphysicalreality
    @elementsofphysicalreality 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +9

    Cool video. We all know Levy knows what tablebase is but he’s a good sport. That’s crazy Fabi could have been world champion if he just trapped his knight.

  • @hugomendoza5665
    @hugomendoza5665 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +3

    idk why but the explanation of stockfish's 35 move win was so wild to me.

  • @somerandomdudefes31
    @somerandomdudefes31 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

    Levy's so good they can bring him on to interview someone else and the video is still awesome.

  • @pehpunkthahpunkt4179
    @pehpunkthahpunkt4179 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

    the beauty of this video is that it is entertaining and contains new information for both people who dont play chess at all and people who are really good at chess.
    really interesting how the AI is designed to 'think'.
    thanks wired, thanks levy, thanks... stockfish i guess!? 😅

  • @apiperdana1157
    @apiperdana1157 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +6

    Levy is such a kind person. Never fails to selflessly promote Magnus.

  • @jhonnyrock
    @jhonnyrock 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +10

    8:55 Levi on Wired: Stockfish is very specialized AI
    Levi on GothamChess: Stockfish is a scumbag

    • @wiadroman
      @wiadroman 4 หลายเดือนก่อน

      Stockfish is a very specialized scumbag.

    • @clgr1323
      @clgr1323 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      both statements are true

  • @ytcelso
    @ytcelso 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

    Levy: Congrats for 1 more video!!! So proud of you!!!

  • @andyrochette7638
    @andyrochette7638 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

    so cool that levy lets wired show up on his videos

  • @DanFrederiksen
    @DanFrederiksen 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +10

    I didn't know stockfish had neural elements. I thought it was an all classical algo. It would be interesting to hear a more computer science exact walk through of how it works. If well explained I think most could understand it.

    • @IAmTheHound
      @IAmTheHound หลายเดือนก่อน

      I think they added the neural stuff in later versions, though it was already one the strongest before they did.

  • @jesseclark7105
    @jesseclark7105 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +5

    This is also why new players are so tempted to use engines, and also why it is very easy to catch them if they do.

  • @fedecraft365
    @fedecraft365 4 หลายเดือนก่อน

    this is the best video I see the chess, very good collab

  • @brimmed
    @brimmed 4 หลายเดือนก่อน

    This is one of the better vids of this series and maybe the whole wired asking "experts" series.

  • @Yardomaster
    @Yardomaster 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +3

    I love the part where Levy said he sometimes flips a coin to decide between three different moves.

  • @iryairya2008
    @iryairya2008 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +9

    This guy looks like he could sacrifice THE ROOOOOOOOOOOOOOOKKKKKKK

  • @nonamehere9658
    @nonamehere9658 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

    If anyone's wondering about the sound: Brendon Moeller - Low Impact.

  • @korlic_
    @korlic_ 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

    This was so good, please more ❤

  • @dubey_ji
    @dubey_ji 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +8

    have to admit Levy is a showman

  • @phoenixbliss
    @phoenixbliss หลายเดือนก่อน +3

    I feel like Levy was asking questions and the stockfish guy kept giving him the same answer about how stockfish looks into the future better than a human.

    • @HkFinn83
      @HkFinn83 25 วันที่ผ่านมา

      Because that’s what stockfish does. It’s a massive data crunching probability machine. It’s not really ‘playing’ like a human does

  • @Scriabinfan593
    @Scriabinfan593 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

    I always love seeing Levy on WIRED.

  • @zach358
    @zach358 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

    Regarding that pawn move in front of the King, maybe Stockfish plays something like that with the goal of getting into a future position that is advantageous. And that advantageous position might be recognizable to you. I wonder if, as a human player, one can see a weird Stockfish move and then understand what future position the bot wants, and then play around that.

  • @spencerrobinson780
    @spencerrobinson780 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +42

    I don't even play chess but this is fascinating

    • @goonerboy93
      @goonerboy93 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +11

      Give it a go! Only 8 months ago I dismissed it as boring and only played by stuffy old men but it is like you said incredibly fascinating. The possibilities of this game is endless and has been studied for centuries

    • @spencerrobinson780
      @spencerrobinson780 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +5

      @goonerboy93 I think I just might, thanks for the encouragement

  • @meghlauchiha9822
    @meghlauchiha9822 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +3

    love levy's humor

  • @eriks2962
    @eriks2962 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

    Bro, they literally brute forced all the positions with 7 pieces of fewer. That's insane! Love it!

  • @fengshuimma9160
    @fengshuimma9160 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

    The man feels like he was a human created by the ai, who’s sole purpose was to interact with a human to see their perspective on the game.

  • @llamallama1509
    @llamallama1509 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +26

    I love Levy's videos. Using his advice I managed to get 1500 ELO on Lichess!

    • @DummyAccount-dr3fx
      @DummyAccount-dr3fx 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      Congrats, Me right now is trying to reach 2000 elo but its so difficult the players I encounter are so serious

    • @wseverywhere1279
      @wseverywhere1279 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +3

      Nice one 😂😂😂

  • @gamercheese1526
    @gamercheese1526 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +15

    Levy never fails to be in a Wired video.

  • @Kmher90
    @Kmher90 2 หลายเดือนก่อน

    Wow thank you for this video. This clears it up a lot

  • @sirbellamo
    @sirbellamo 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

    Visuals on this video are amazing

  • @danielbass09
    @danielbass09 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +4

    So what happens if you play Stockfish vs Stockfish? Is it 50/50 between each. Is it the player that goes first gets an advantage? Would they just play the exact same game every time as they would choose the best move which would be the same every game they played?

    • @Zack-Strife
      @Zack-Strife 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +3

      They would draw every time as both would see their moves as the best and won’t be able to captivate on any advantage

    • @justassimple8328
      @justassimple8328 4 หลายเดือนก่อน

      They would draw mostly although they will win some games, they will still get the same number of scores. That's why when battling different chess engines, the first 10-15 moves will be based on the opening books before the computer starts thinking

    • @mysticalmagic9259
      @mysticalmagic9259 3 หลายเดือนก่อน

      It is always a draw. This is why in Computer Chess Tournaments, they are forced to play different openings for a set number of moves and then play on their own.
      For example, Stockfish will play Leela on a set opening. Both play one game as White and one as Black. If Stockfish can win as White and defend as Black, it is considered the victor and stronger computer. They do this for hundreds of different openings.

  • @forgetaboutit1069
    @forgetaboutit1069 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +13

    The fact Alpha Zero made Stockfish look silly after only 4 hours of learning chess by playing against itself is both fascinating and scary at the same time.

    • @liamb5791
      @liamb5791 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +8

      It played against stockfish 8 running on the hardware equivalent to that of a laptop… so it was always going to win

    • @daniella969
      @daniella969 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +7

      They saturated the network in 4 hours. Had they trained it for a day, it wouldn't have played better.

    • @forgetaboutit1069
      @forgetaboutit1069 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +4

      @@liamb5791 maybe so but I think you’re missing the point. I know it’s not apples to apples; Stockfish agreed to the terms (as did others) but GPU will crush CPU on parallel computing and that’s the difference. The proof was in the neural network of Alpha Zero teaching itself which does require specialized hardware. The future of GPU will takeover tasks that CPU can never do no matter how much CPU is strengthened. It would be fun to run it back today and see how it plays out.

    • @DarthVader-wk9sd
      @DarthVader-wk9sd 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +4

      @@forgetaboutit1069Stockfish has long since surpassed alphazero. Another engine called leela adopted that style of learning but it is still worse than stockfish

    • @forgetaboutit1069
      @forgetaboutit1069 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

      @@DarthVader-wk9sd they played in 2017. Hope it long passed it lol. But the main point is GPU engines will eventually wipe the floor with CPU engines.

  • @ZsebtelepHUN
    @ZsebtelepHUN 4 หลายเดือนก่อน

    I like how the automaticly driven car at the end just turned on the windshield wiper, like it needed to see through it

  • @dontbescaredhomie3137
    @dontbescaredhomie3137 5 ชั่วโมงที่ผ่านมา

    Stockfish just goes down every branch of possibilities (permutations). Humans use indicators or 'mental cues' to quickly evaluate if there is a higher likelihood that there is a higher amount of these branches at that moment of the game that will go in their favor. So double pawns would be one of those cues or knights in the center of the board. Bishops on a clear diagonal etc. The more cues we have, the more we are certain that a position will likely end up more in our favour. This is why learning fundamentals is important because these fundamentals will lead to more favourable structures and thus more favourable outcomes in theory. The cues become more complex and you start adding more and more (like.pins, sacrifices etc) as your chess skills progress. This is probably the biggest calculation being done. Then chess players will additionally calculate individual lines down a couple moves per line and not every line but few important lines by first throwing away the obvious horrible ones quickly. And Magnus and Hikaru run stockfish light pretty much.

  • @jhonnyrock
    @jhonnyrock 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +4

    Because he's the hero Gotham deserves, and the one it desperately needs right now...

  • @TitaniumToenail
    @TitaniumToenail 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +4

    Stockfish knows more positions than Johnny Sins.

  • @gary9793
    @gary9793 13 วันที่ผ่านมา +1

    Me: opening with pe4
    Stockfish: mate in 142
    Me: pd3
    Stockfish: wrong answer, mate in 44

  • @skahler
    @skahler 4 หลายเดือนก่อน

    This was a really satisfying and entertaining video. Thanks!

  • @shouldersofgiants4649
    @shouldersofgiants4649 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +13

    Like for Gary Linscott, a legitimate expert, an engineer and not some influencer bozo

  • @AcidGlow
    @AcidGlow 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +5

    Just like in any video game, the AI can become unbeatable. As they know your every move and react to the first frame you do and they do an opposite move that will beat it. You can only win when it lets you win.

    • @festivebear9946
      @festivebear9946 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +3

      Their reaction time is one of the biggest driving factors behind their ability to win. You see it in RTS's where the AI might not be building as efficiently as possible, but its unit management is unparalleled with 10x as many actions per second as human players. I'd love to see AI vs human when speed is equalized, then it's really about who is smarter. E.g. it takes a few seconds to even come up with legal moves, then several minutes to evaluate them. Here, you take away AI's biggest advantage, which is pure speed. Now it's all about being able to read and evaluate the board the best.

    • @quag443
      @quag443 4 หลายเดือนก่อน

      ​@@festivebear9946 Last time I checked, Leela Chess Zero on one node (playing without search, using intuition only) is about GM level in rapid time control, and Leela on about 10 nodes per move is roughly GM on classic time control. Maybe a little give and take, but I think that shows a rough picture on where AI stands without doing any calculation, or doing as few calculations as a human would

    • @festivebear9946
      @festivebear9946 4 หลายเดือนก่อน

      @@quag443 That is absolutely insane, thanks for the info!

  • @momanmirul
    @momanmirul 2 หลายเดือนก่อน

    when I was taking my CS degree I initially thought of going into AI as my major, gave up on that when I couldn't accurately do alpha-beta pruning on a simpler tree (couldn't really wrap my head around some other principles too) and now I'm a just a contentful SWE

  • @cherryvapr6969
    @cherryvapr6969 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

    The one with magnus and Fabian seemed like more of a I respect you enough not to waste our time playing out what I might misplay

  • @RishabhSharma10225
    @RishabhSharma10225 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

    My boy Gotham at it again.

    • @Eye-vp5de
      @Eye-vp5de 4 หลายเดือนก่อน

      Levi never fails to do this again

  • @haphazardprism
    @haphazardprism 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +7

    The AI knows every board state and what move to do accordingly, what a surprise 😂 16tb of memory actually surprised me though.

    • @moatef1886
      @moatef1886 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +11

      Only when there are 7 pieces of less. Even adding one more piece blows up the memory required to ridiculous amounts. It’s unknown whether we will achieve solving chess like this in the future, or even ever.

    • @rp3351
      @rp3351 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

      @@moatef1886 It's been estimated that there are way more possible variations in a game of chess than there are atoms in the observable universe... so, well, I guess not =)
      It blows one's mind to think about that.

  • @hiim33
    @hiim33 4 หลายเดือนก่อน

    They have great chemistry and are both very charismatic!

  • @Levipaulsen
    @Levipaulsen 4 หลายเดือนก่อน

    They should make one of these that is way longer

  • @Veptis
    @Veptis 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +3

    I got some ideas on how I would write a chess engine, never looked into it or how awful it is to setup.
    I would for example maximize the number of legal moves, or pick a move where the fewest number of positive moves are available for the opponent. Now this will turn into sacrifices all the time - but you could go a few layers deep.
    Essentially give the opponent as many possible options of only a few are good. this way you allow them to make most mistakes.
    You could also do something else, like chose a move where you opponent only has equal moves. To then win on times.
    I wonder if you can finetune an engine based on their opponent. As in the computer championships, you do have limited time and equal hardware.
    One idea I have had is to make a chess learning game. The beginner level would be finding all legal moves (to understand the game).
    And the actual challenge then is to classify moves into blunders, mistakes, waiting, good. and the master level would be to rank them in order. I wonder if such a tool already exists, because forcing the human to think "like an engine" was an option.

    • @moatef1886
      @moatef1886 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      Engines already do this and have been doing this for a long long time. It’s part of their evaluation function.

  • @Evex6
    @Evex6 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +7

    Levy be making fun of people for blundering in GTE when he casually makes 2 blunders and 2 mistakes

    • @rokeYouuer
      @rokeYouuer 4 หลายเดือนก่อน

      He's presumably playing Stockfish at its highest processing power, so it could label something a mistake that even base Stockfish would think is the best move.

    • @Evex6
      @Evex6 4 หลายเดือนก่อน

      @@rokeYouuer Yea i do notice that when i play games but just a joke

  • @richardconway6425
    @richardconway6425 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

    Great video!! Fun and informative. I never knew stockfish was so strong. That thing about the way it plays when the game is down to 7 pieces - that's scary.
    Player: am I going to lose?
    Stockfish: it's a logical certainty.
    😨

    • @afuzzycreature8387
      @afuzzycreature8387 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +3

      keep in mind these endgame databases are available for all engines to use but yeah. Sometimes this can lead to some diabolical results where the engine is basically trying to avoid entering the tablebase results but doesn't see mate itself where it will make a technically worse move and turn mate in 21 into mate in 3.

  • @Kloiyd
    @Kloiyd 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

    This guy should make a TH-cam channel. What a lad.

  • @boomerzilean
    @boomerzilean 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +3

    "You idiots!! Mate in 35!!!" 😂😂

  • @lucaslahlum6331
    @lucaslahlum6331 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +5

    What happens if more than one move is tied for best move? How does it choose? You say that it evaluates them but a tie is possible, no?

    • @j-rey-
      @j-rey- 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +4

      I don't know about Stockfish, but in algorithms that try to maximize a certain result, often there are several factors for determining an optimal solution, with one taking precedence over others. If two moves have identical values for that most important factor, then it would move on to the next most important factor, and so on until one was greater than the other. Alternatively, they could have some function of all these factors, and when combining them at the end, come up with some final number that is guaranteed to be unique, or at least be unique with 99.9999% certainty. Remember, it is assessing billions of branching paths, so the probability of any two moves having an identical "likelihood of winning" value are exceedingly low. However, if all of these sophisticated algorithms still result such that two moves have the same "likelihood of winning" value, it would likely just pick one randomly.

    • @Celatra
      @Celatra 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +8

      It will just play the first one. There is always a difference between 2 "best" moves, even if just by 0.05.

    • @presleyelisememorial
      @presleyelisememorial 4 หลายเดือนก่อน

      @@Celatrathere absolutely is not always one best move in every position. There can be 10 different checkmates in 1 in a position

    • @Celatra
      @Celatra 4 หลายเดือนก่อน

      @@presleyelisememorial yes, but one of them leads to a faster mate thN the others. The less moves spent the better

  • @jsdiazc
    @jsdiazc 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

    What I don’t understand is why would stockfish pick a different opening on another game?
    It has already assessed all possible structures for all the openings and it knows which one scores the best.
    In your game, after 1.d4 it responded with Nf3, but I’ve seen it respond with d5 too.

    • @ME0WMERE
      @ME0WMERE 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +7

      different time controls, different hardware and the fact that sf is non-deterministic on more than 1 thread

    • @inl2787
      @inl2787 4 หลายเดือนก่อน

      if multiple moves will have the same win rate then it will just randomly choose one.

  • @sexygeek8996
    @sexygeek8996 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

    Humans don't even consider many of the possible moves, but sometimes one of those moves is the best. Some computer programs do that too ("forward pruning", not to be confused with "alpha-beta" pruning mentioned in the video) in order to search deeper elsewhere, but they end up making the same mistake that a human would. A computer program that doesn't forward-prune will find any win within its search depth.

    • @mysticalmagic9259
      @mysticalmagic9259 3 หลายเดือนก่อน

      That's why sometimes a computer might spit a Mate in 13 but not a Mate in 4 until the move has already been made.

  • @NeivisMassunga
    @NeivisMassunga 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +6

    Sou angolano, amo esse canal somente por causa do inglês.

    • @wiccabessa
      @wiccabessa 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      Somente porcausa do inglês?
      Existem milhões de canais em inglês😅😅😅

  • @dankhorse69420
    @dankhorse69420 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +10

    It's alright bro, if you want to feel better about losing to a bot, just play me in chess. I'll make you look like Stockfish 16.

  • @bunkerputt
    @bunkerputt 4 หลายเดือนก่อน

    The way top engines just sit and shuffle pieces seemingly without principle because they found some sequence related to something very deep requiring tempi...

  • @FarmerBenny
    @FarmerBenny 4 หลายเดือนก่อน

    extremely well edited

  • @Keffin1
    @Keffin1 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +6

    Imagine when quantum computing kicks in and stockfish eventually gets OWNED!

    • @wilavg
      @wilavg 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +13

      Bold to assume stockfish wouldn't be adapted to be run on them

    • @lorenzosotroppofigo1641
      @lorenzosotroppofigo1641 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

      Dude, you know nothing about computers.
      Algos run on the same hardware when they compete so there is no way it's not adapting if the hardware changes

  • @TekDrgn
    @TekDrgn 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +6

    Virtually unbeatable. But are they also physically unbeatable?

    • @LeLe-pm2pr
      @LeLe-pm2pr 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +12

      whack your computer and you're good

    • @walker_19880
      @walker_19880 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      there's a robot that broke a kid's finger somewhere, so I'd say up to debate

  • @alexsatt8340
    @alexsatt8340 4 หลายเดือนก่อน

    Awesome Collab!! 🎉🎉

  • @thefireofthefox1
    @thefireofthefox1 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

    Wired making Gotham act like he doesn't know everything the expert is saying already