100% awesome job. Interestingly, here in Montana earlier this year the only thing on the shelves was 6.8 western ammunition. I bought a 6.5 PRCN couldn’t find ammunition dies or brass for it. Again, great job. Good luck this hunting season.
Really good information 👍👍. As far as hunting out west, I've been mule deer hunting 3 times since 2014 and had no problem taking mule deer with my 30 06 and 308. In the part of New Mexico I was hunting you could see a whole lot farther than anyone could shoot. My longest shot out of 3 was 315 yds. That's a long shot for a whitetail deer hunter from Alabama who hunts heavily wooded areas.
Excellent video. The 6.8 Westerner is interesting, and I was going to buy one (I really "needed" that caliber..........Haha) But when I looked at all the details, and the ballistics, I could not justify adding a new rifle, since I already have a .270 WSM, and all the reloading tools (dies) for my .270 WSM. They are almost twins...
thank you sir for your work. it does not go unnoticed. thank you for clearing up the smoke to show the playing field. continue to cut through the hype especially for those of us who can't afford to be taken advantage of financially
ironically though, Hornady refuses to manufacture 6.8W ammo, or even components for the cartridge. It may be because they see it as competition for the 7PRC, who knows.
I had my 270 built with a 1:9 to easily handle the heavier end bullets(150-160) before finding sweet loads with the 130gr speer hot cor and 140gr sst…. The only mistake I made was not building it on a left handed action!!
Thank you for producing this video, lots of great data and information. But I have a slightly different view of the 6.8 Western Cartridge. I have both the 270 WSM (No change in SAAMI Spec) in a 7½ Twist Barrel and a 6.8 Western. They both shoot all high BC bullets (175 Sierra TGK, 170 Berger Elite and the Nosler 165 ABLR) accurate up 1000 yards. Both of my rifles like the Nosler 165 the best, less than one-inch groups at 200 yards with a muzzle velocity of just over 3000 fps and 1650 at target. The others groups are just over an inch. My barrels are both SS Brux Rem Varmint, so they are to a higher standard than a factory barrel. I shoot 600 and 1000 yards weekly, so I have experience with both. There is very little difference between the two with the same hand loads for all bullets. I do agree, why come out with a new cartridge, the 6.8 Western. Simply, Winchester and Browning could have just come out with the “270 WSM Western”, a 270 WSM with a 7½ barrel twist. Just think of the money us shooters would have saved, no need to purchase new rifles. With that said, I will say (which will distress some), the 270 with a 7½ twist or the 6.8 Western will clearly out shoot the 270 Winchester or 270 WSM at yardages 500 yards and over. Even shooting the 145 ELDs from both at 600 yards the higher twist barrels delivers a better group. So, I have totally bought in to the high twist barrels and high BC Bullets no mater what yardages I am shooting. I think the 270 Winchester is a great gun, so much history. But, if I were to rebarrel, it would be one with a 7½ to take advantage of the high BC Bullets. My barrel lengths are both 26”, I exceed by 50 fps all of the published velocity data by Winchester and Browning. It is obvious a 24” barrel will have a lower velocity. This was an error in this video. My view. The “6.8 Western” is a better cartridge than the standard barreled 270 Winchester and 270 WSM as it shoots the heavier higher BC bullets, as well as shoots amazing at 1000 yards. Don’t discount this this cartridge, it has more positive attributes than this video portrays. For an average hunter, just shooting up to 300 yards, our 270s are more than needed, but if one is pushing 500 yards the higher twist barrels are superior. I think the 6.8 Western will be with us for a long time. Should add, I have 6mm Creedmoor and 6.5 Creedmoor. These are my favorite two cartridges.
My 6.8 western is just waiting to stretch its legs. Stuck working right now, but later this spring I will be running it out to 1,000 and beyond. I’m really looking forward to working on load development with it and really seeing what it’ll do. One thing that wasn’t mentioned, but kinda goes without saying, about the comparison data between the 270wsm and the 6.8 was the wsm data was a perfected hand load, and the western is factory box ammo. Not exactly apple to apples there. I’m really looking forward to seeing what we’ll get out of the 6.8 with hand loads, and multiple bullet options. (Attention Berger) I think it’s going to be a great performer.
@@padna7946 You will enjoy the 6.8 Western. I am shooting 1000 yards tomorrow, 175 Sierra and 150 Nosler bullets. I cannot get the 170 Elites to group, don’t know why. Best is about 3” at 200 yards. All the others are an 1” groups or under. My best bullet is the Nosler 165 ABLR. Give those a try, but currently they are very hard to find.
I’ve got a LAW M704 with a PacNor barrel chambered in 270 Ackley Improved. I had PacNor put an 8” twist in it. I shoot 170 grain Berger’s out of it at 2,850 FPS at paper out to1,000 yards. I do it because it’s fun trying to shoot a light hunting rifle at distance at paper. However, when hunting, I back it down to 150’s and 130’s. I don’t take shots past 400 yards when hunting so the sectional density and retained energy is more than adequate for all game I hunt.
Thanks. Great truthful presentation. I strive for shots 300 yards or less.For me it's 30-06 for Deer, Antelope and .338 Win mag for Elk and bigger. Both in Winchester model 70s. I live in Oregon. Premium bullets on all.
I'm 69 years old and have been shooting since I was 8 years old and taught by my grandfather. Over the years hunting, bench shooting, military action and police I discovered that all of the myriad of calibers was all just marketing hype to sell more guns and new type caliber ammunition. So, you might be wondering what I like. My choices are: 22lr, 12 gauge shotgun, 22-250 w/60 grain bullet, 25-06 w/ 100 gr, 270 w/140 and 30-06 w/180 grain bullet. That's it! What next you might ask. LEARN TO SHOOT because it is not the gun, it's not the caliber, IT IS, THE NUT BEHIND THE BUTT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Great content as always. I too always take the claims made by the bullet/ammo manufactures with several grains of salt. I’ve always believed that if you want a more accurate apples to apples comparison when comparing bullets of different calibers, you should be comparing bullets of similar sectional densities or ballistic coefficients. I laugh when they just arbitrarily compare one caliber to the other with no specific metric. The result means little or nothing.
I am a Geezer, having started handloading in the early 1970's. Thousands of .270 wcf handloads, back to the war surplus powders, screw type Nosler Partitions. I now use Reloder 26 behind the 150/160 Partitions, it outperforms all the traditional powders in my experience. Another you tuber channel claims his off rack ,10 twist stabilized the 165 ablr ( not sure of the elevation) at 100 and 770 yards. If this is generally true, it is eye opening and a bit of a game changer. This Geezer, hunts to reduce distance for a secure shot. ...770 yards on Game is a probable wounding attempt and we can't afford that risk, imo. As an experiment, I will try the above. Do any others have experience with this? Cheers
The entire idea is to sell products. To create a need that may not exist. Like the series 80 firing pin block. Its a solution looking for a problem. When you look at the history of hunting. Those who hunt out west have been taking game with what was available at the time, before 2000, and have successfully taken game. The manufacturers will continue to introduce products to satisfy the perceived needs of today's hunter. I hunt with a .30-06 for years and I rarely take a shot longer than 300 yards. If the shot is further then I'll stalk my game until I am close enough to take a shot under 300 yards, preferably 200 yards or less. That's hunting. Stalking your game until you are close enough to take a humane and ethical shot. When you think about all of the available calibers on the market there is so much overlap in performance; .308/.30-06 is there much of a difference to make a difference. Only in the mind of hunters who swear that if you're not shooting a .308 you're not a real hunter. The same goes for the 6.5 CM. Hunters swear by it but how many of them have taken the time to become proficient with the equipment they currently had before they upgraded? Damn few.
This was an outstanding video and I appreciate it. I hunt northern Alberta and know very well what kind of cartridge is needed for western hunting (270, 30'06, 7mm-08, etc,) I appreciate your comments about ethical hunting distances.
I know that two years passed on... But yesterday was the first time I shot this calibre... Bought an XPR for my youngest son and both spent the afternoon shooting (zeroing the scope to the rifle and moderator) using the only ammo we could find here in Portugal... Browning BXS ammo @ outrageous high price... Tested the rifle and ammo combo and ... Accurate, pleasant even but... Uninpressed! Let's see how it performs on game when season comes... 👍👍
My 6.8 Western will be here on Tuesday. Hopefully I'll get it zeroed in and able to take it muley hunting next weekend. Also a late cow elk tag could be nice
Great video. I have a .270WSM and I love it. I have a 130 grain E-Tip load that shoots 1 hole groups at 100 yards and runs 3402FPS. Also have a 150 grain Partition load for it at 3102FPS. Shoots half MOA at 100 yards. Both have mild recoil and keep velocity and energy very well for hunting yardage. Never really saw the need for the 6.8 Western. I also have 2 308's, one is a 1957 Model 88 and the other is a Howa Carbon fiber 24 inch barrel in a Hogue stock. Just working up loads for the latter and have 2 loads for the 88 that are right around 3000FPS with 150 grain monolithic.
I’ve been watching a lot of 6.8 videos lately based on the fact that in my town there’s probably 40-50 boxes of 20 rounds between sportsman’s and a few local it had me thinking well might be fun to see what it could do. I have a bolt gun similar to proofs switch rifle so switching barrels is easy, so i could shoot the ammo for brass and develop a load then I hit myself upside the head to remind myself I have a 7 rem mag that legitimately shoots 1/4 moa, absolutely no need for it but it had me thinking. Great breakdown of this cartridge I really liked how you broke it down you brought more data to the table than just and opinion
Excellent no BS assessment with facts and ballistics to back it up. I was one of those people that asked you about this one about a week ago. It's a real insult to our intelligence how stupid marketing people think that we are. I really enjoy your approach to your videos you really cover a wide range on whatever subject you're approaching. After watching your previous videos it's my conclusion that if I wanted to hunt anything in North America with two rifles the 25-06 and the 30-06 would be the perfect Duo . Thank you greatly appreciated 👍
😱WoW, thanks for your “thoughts” of this caliber. You really went out of your way to please your viewers to put to together this 30+ minutes video review. I’ve been watching to see if this would fit my need for a setup to take up north to Alaska, and judging by your thoughtful analysis I also do not see that this will fill the slot between my go to 270Win and my backup 375 H&H that both shoots really well. I’ll be focusing on getting a really well fit and finished used custom FN or Swedish Mauser in 30-06 or 338-06 (I will be reloading this round) since I want to stay away from magnum cartridges other than what I already have. 🙏🏼
These newfangled supermags have no place in my deer and hog hunting inventory because the plain, ordinary, slow, old 308 Winchester firing the dreaded 165 gr. Hornady SST bullets at non Magnum velocities is an absolute Hammer of Thor on the Largest, Meanest inhabitants of any forest. God help any Giant Hogs over 300 lbs and this is the gospel according to the Man that invented the 300 Hammer, he was duplicating the killing efficiency of the 308 win. Firing the dreaded 165 gr. SST at 2650. Bill Wilson of Wilson Combat Co. hunts hogs more than anyone I have ever heard of and this is the best advice I have ever put to use myself. Even if I don't get to cross paths with a Bigfoot, I ain't undergunned if I do.
Excellent video, lots of useful information. I've been killing deer and deer sized game for over 30 years with my poor old obsolete .270 Winchester and I've yet to see any 130 to 150 grain bullet bounce off any animals hide. I don't believe that I will be making the switch to a 6.8 Western any time soon.
Lol you're going to be eating your words because the 6.8 Western is hitting harder then the 7mm rem mag at long range IN A SHORT ACTION!! Its a beast of a round, updated 270 WSM
@Mike Tyson 1. No one cares about short action 2. Only outshines other calibers st like 4-500 yards. 3. Ammo costs 100$ here in Canada for 6.8W Only benefit is reduced recoil
It’s crazy that people are so sucked in by “newness”. The 6.8 Western is only getting 2900 fps, and it’s impossible to find. My hunting load is a 7mm-08 pushing a 140gr accubond using Sta-ball 6.5, and I get 2850 fps with no pressure signs. Why do hunters feel like the things that have been working for decades suddenly become inferior as soon as something new comes out? My uncle shot some of the biggest bucks I’ve ever seen in my life using 00 buckshot out of an old 16 gauge single shot while smoking a pipe and wearing a red flannel jacket and work pants!
Great video. I considered this cartridge and went with a 280 AI instead. I reload and didn't want to deal with the belt on the 7mm Rem Mag. In the 270 bullet size, I think the 277 Fury will kill it off - demand and supply as military cartridge.
@ronbeckybeasley3566 overated sure but still quite high quality. I dont have any of the American weatherby guns but i have a vanguard and its very nice
Good information to separate out some of the hype. I’ve been hunting successfully for 50 years, mainly with a 270, while I own many different calibers I really enjoy shooting that old Remington 700! I look forward to actually seeing if the 6.8 will take hold, only time will tell but I’m certainly intrigued with the potential of the new combination of bullet weight and factory twist rate. I don’t own a short mag so it’s logical to lean toward the next generation engineering even if it basically does almost the same thing as the short mag. My thinking is that because of the military’s decision to utilize the 6.8 it very possibly could end up being produced by many manufacturers creating the competition to benefit the everyday hunter. I guess I’m Still on the wait and see fence.
When you compare Winchester's 7mm mag 168 grain load to their 6.8 Western 165 gr. load, the 6.8 actually has a higher muzzle velocity, a greater ballistic coefficiency, and a higher sectional density. So it does outperform the 7mm mag comparatively.via Winchester box stats. For me, I'll stay with my 270 Winchester for most game. I am thinking about upgrading my barrel to a 1 in 8 twist.
Sorry to burst your bubble, but the 7mm RM pushes those bullets faster. Since BC doesn't matter at ethical hunting distances (MPBR), the 7mm shoots flatter. Sectional density means nothing these days; almost any mid-weight monolithic or bonded bullet will get complete pass-throughs.
The case design of the 6.5 creedmoor compared to the 260, is basically the same as the 6.8 Western compared to the 270 WSM. The 260 case is shortened a little, case tapered a little less and the shoulder angle changed a little, to form the 6.5 creedmoor. The 270 wsm case was shortened a little, case tapered left basically the same and the shoulder angle left the same, to form the 6.8 Western, but then the 270 wsm shoulder angle is steeper than the 260 remington shoulder angle in the first place. To say that the case design of the 6.5 creedmoor is anything like "revolutionary ", or all that much different, compared to the 260, than the 6.8 Western is, compared to the 270 WSM, is an exaggeration.
@@desertdogoutdoors1113 which is the 308 case shortened a little, steeper shoulder angle, and case taper lessened a bit. You do the same thing to the 260 Remington case and get the exact same results. The 6.5 case is nothing revolutionary.
I agree with you wholeheartedly. Why would want to spend the extra money if you can even find the 6.8 Western. Just doesn’t make sense when we have the 30-06 and .270 Win to do the job just fine at ethical shooting distances. The gain the 6.8 shows is pretty much insignificant at out to 300 yards Thanks for the video.
DD Thanks for another great video. I was initially intrigued by the 6.8 Western but then reality hit and I realized much of what you point out - no real stats, reloading data, ammo availability, rifle availability. Then I realized it is just another collaboration by Browning and Winchester just like the WSM of years ago. Of course these companies are now owned by the same larger corporation. Too much marketing and unreliable data. I'm sticking with the 7mm Rem Mag. And to me the most important stat you point out is the MPBR - all had about 300 yards with 3 inch target.
MPBR is something lost on this new generation. They all want to spin turrets and consult calculators and charts. If you have time to do all that, you're either too far away or you're going to miss your shot opportunity.
MPBR is certainly becoming a lost technique. I just can’t make sense of a hundred yard zero for hunting. I do wonder how many opportunities are lost due to spinning knobs. Many, I suspect, both to wasting time instead of shooting and spinning to the wrong setting. I see it all the time on the TH-cam hunting channels.
I bought a kimber 8400 270 wsm back in 2008 for $750.00 after my 7mm m70 was stolen. Not because of the caliber but the wood was just beautiful. After hunting with it I realized how much meat damage it was causing on shots within 150 yrds. My question is I'm having it rebarrel done to a 1 in 8 twist for heavier bullets since I bought a regular 270 for the lighter bullets I was wondering about the 175gr sierra game changers for elk at max range of 400 yrds. It's the only heavy bullet I can find at a good price. Bought 400 just because I was afraid of availability. Trying to go heavy for less meat damage if shots are close but still want good expansion or should I just stick with my old standby of 140gr interlocks?
Switch to a monolithic bullet like the TTSX or GMX. Out of the magnums, they do less meat damage than a 308 with cup-n-core lead bullets. Of course, stop taking high shoulder shots if you care about meat.
I have a 6.8 western I know this is a year ago but I have a cpr and I would recommend it. Shoots great and there is plenty of ammo now. It's an extremely accurate rifle and it hits hard. Compared to a 270 there almost identical except bullet wight that's all.
Fifth generation Harding County South Dakota hunter here.I think there is such a thing as Western cartridges. I mean, you ever see what a 130 grain .270 does to a deer at 30 yards? But it's money on deer at 300 yards. You would take your 30-30 all day long for the Eastern woods, and I'd use mine here on the prairie if it's all I had. But, it sure wouldn't be my first choice. If I need to slow the .270 down for closer range shooting, I can simply buy a box of 150 grains off the shelf. I can shoot groups like that with my pre 64 Model 70. Ya. It has iron sights. This gun is a one trick pony. What do you get over the .270 Win for all your money? You get to buy $100 boxes off Gunbroker. Meanwhile, the .270 Win, which is a true Western cartridge,(300 plus yard PBR) is just putting deer in the truck. As you mentioned, ethical Western hunters seldom shoot at game over about 350 yards, so why reinvent the wheel?
The 30.06 is the ( Old Timers) Soldiers round. Ammo was cheap after the War and We love the round. I wouldn’t change my M1G. The 7mm round is the sweet spot, whether it’s a STD .284 or the magnum loadings. All shooters know this, well maybe they don’t. Love your channel.
Glad you did this video, I was curious with the Western myself, but it appears it's more trouble than it's worth, with all the data and component issues. And the main one for me,it doesn't offer anything, that is not already on the market.
26:30 This is the entire point of the 6.8 Western, it can handle, from factory, heavier bullets with higher BCs. It's not a gimmick, and it does have some advantages over the 270 WSM. I think the biggest problem is the marketing claiming that it beats the 7mm remmag, that was a bad idea for them to go in that direction. They should've framed it as an improved 270 WSM.
They cherry pick loads but if you compare the 7mm rem mag to the 6.8 western they are pretty damn simular with the heavier weight bullets. It's actually pretty damn efficient and bad ass to be able to match the 7mm mag out of a short action with a 24" barrel. Go check the weight of the rifles straight off the browning website. 7mm mag power in a rifle almost a pound lighter and a few inches shorter is a big advantage in my eyes. I personally like more choices and believe this one is a good cartridge. Being realistic everything since the 30-06 wasn't needed so if your gonna say that about the 6.8 western say it about the 270 280 7mm rem mag and 300 win mag. None of them really perform any better than the 06 at hunting ranges and the magnums require heavier longer rifles burning much more powder with 25% less ammo capacity. Atleast the short actions do have a advantage in weight and length. 6.8 western will be an ideal mountain rifle for people who hike miles in the backcountry where weight and length matter.
You can go up to max pressure in the 6.8 Western, but it will never match the ballistics of a max pressure load in 7mm Rem Mag. That thought is a complete fantasy created by Winchester. On your other point, would not a 270 Win be just as much "mountain rifle" (BTW, I hate that term just as much as I hate "western cartridge"). The long action weighs only 2-3 ounces more, which isn't even noticeable. In fact, on Winchester's website ( www.winchesterguns.com/products/rifles/xpr/current/sporter.html ), they list the 6.8W and 270WIN, both at the exact same weight with 24" barrels. The 270 WIN would easily kill the same "mountain animals", but so it with far less recoil in a lightweight "mountain rifle".
@@desertdogoutdoors1113 6.8 has way better ballistic coefficient and sectional density than 270 win. Obviously there's not much reloading data for the 6.8 yet but the factory loads are pretty much equal to the 7mm mag ballistics in a rifle the same weight as the 270 winchester as you said. And yes the 270 can kill the same animals does that mean the other cartridges are not useful? Good thing about America is you have choices if you like something buy it if you don't then don't. I don't understand why anyone that likes guns would be against the 6.8 western it's pretty good for its purpose.
You are spot on in this video, however the only real difference between the 6.8 and the 270 WSM is the twist rates on factory guns and the length of the throat in the chamber. If you customize a 270 WSM and put a faster twist rate barrel, and lengthen the throat your basically doing what Winchester did. It really is nothing more then marketing something new, it keeps the wheels of free enterprise rolling. For those that buy into hype they’ll probably run out and buy one (can’t not have the latest and greatest), however I am noticing that the only cartridges that were left on shelves a while back when things were really lean were 6.8 western and it’s the only rifle brass my local retailer has any stock of, both indicators that people are not buying it.
Well the point of the 6.8 western is that it can take the high bc bullets and correct twist rate. Rem mags have a hard time loading high bc bullets and have them fit in traditional chamber dimensions. Case is slightly different than 270 wsm, similar to 300tc and 6.5cm.
Its like the 6.5 Creedmoor v 260Rem all over again. The advantages only come in the tighter chamber spec, fast twist and the headheight in SAAMI spec and the availability of factory ammo with high BC bullets! With the price & scarcity of reloading components there is a conspiracy against us reloaders!😁
"Western" is just a trademark of winchester used for decades. Growing up in the 60s and 70's in Pennsylvania, I always liked the winchester western thing. It was just a slogan for promotion no more than that. Never had a problem with it. They used it on shotgun ammo as well. Looks to me the 6.8 western is a good addition to this class of cartridges. As far as factory ammo goes in all brands, it is not what it used to be.
many of this "new calibers" do not add anything to the 30'06, 270, 9,3x62, 7x57 and other traditional calibers. In many countries, Argentina in particular,. though some of us have traditional long range calibers like 300 Wby, 300 Win, or 45/70 or _European 8x57 and many others we, almost 100% have a .308 because it is our Armed Forces standard caliber and we can obtain officially sold ammo at affordable prices. Bullets, gunpowder, brass are scarce and under importations rulings . So our policy is "stick to traditional calibers and buy the best available bullet.
I‘m going to state an unpopular opinion: the .25 cal and .27cal are technically superfluous. They only exist because of parallel development in America and Europe at the end of the 19th century/early 20th century and have lost to their metric counterparts. While they may work just fine and we can argue all day about which is better, there is no denying that the difference in performance is marginal but there will never be as many .25 and .27 cal bullets available as there are 6.5 and 7mm options.
While it’s true there are less bullets offered in .277” than there are in 6.5mm, every single great hunting bullet is available in .277”. The variety was more limited do to twist rate, than caliber. I’d also like to add that no one using the French metric system has ever made it to the moon 😀 I do love a good 7x64 Brennecke.
I don’t know about it being unpopular, but it’s 100% correct. Anyone with any understanding of ballistics could see that if they look at any real data. The first thing I thought of when I saw the Western is-why bother with a .277? Why not just reregister a new chamber design using the 7saum case and an 8 twist at longer oal? You can literally buy prefits and assemble one yourself instead of buying a fad cartridge. ADG brass has you covered.
Thanks for seeking and sharing the truth. I do, however, dispute your claim that you can always get a shot opportunity within 300 yards. As an elk hunter in Colorado for 5 years now, I've encountered numerous situations that required a 400 ish yard shot.
I never go with all these designer cartridges, I stick to the classics which always have readily purchasable ammunition like .30-06 and 7mm REM Mag and .308 Win. Just my opinion
Personally I like the idea of a high to very high SD bullet at a relatively moderate velocity. Larger calibers will high SD's tend to recoil much harder. Be well!
I hope anyone looking into this cartridge doesn’t stop at this video for all the information they get.. there is plenty of truth in here but there is a lot of information that doesn’t jive with what I’ve seen. For instance, throughout the entire pandemic I have seen dozens of boxes of the ammo at any of the retailers around me. Less popular means more ammo when people panic buy. I get the marketing is annoying but this truly is a modernized 270 and it is a solid option for anyone that doesn’t already own one.
Honestly, a 270 Win pushing a 150gr bonded bullet at 2800 - 2900fps will kill everything in lower 48 just fine. I don't see the need 500+ yard hunting.
Nice review. I myself purchased a new X bolt chambered in 6.8 western. Hard to find a rifle lately in 270wsm, I've been looking for years. I figured this would get me pretty close to what I was looking for, sounds like I was right. Great stuff, thanks for your intel.
Been waiting for a new video. Interesting topic. Your review was pretty much exactly what I thought it would be and I agree with you. It’s fine but nothin special. I don’t understand why if the rifle manufactures are pushing it. Especially Winchester, why arnt they flooding the market with quality ammo? Ammo availability is one of my top 3 questions when selecting a new rifle. This is off topic I think the 350 legend is a joke but I did see ball ammo for it at Walmart for $15 today. I still would never buy one. I have no use for “rifle” with that ballistic performance
The Winchester 6.8 Westerner is an answer for a question that was never asked... This round was doomed from the release because the pandemic has crippled the firearms supply chain. If we'd seen the 6.8 Westerner released in "normal" times, I'd suspect it would have followed the 20 year old 270 WSM's limited success. However, the pandemic, plus questionable claims, may have killed this round before it even got any amount of sales success to speak of. If I wanted to buy a 270, I think I'd stick with the venerable 270Win, with close to a century of proven performance. I remember when Winchester released the various WSM calibers and now only the 270WSM and 300WSM are still around. Gotta wonder if the 6.8 Westerner will even be here in a few decades???
@@desertdogoutdoors1113 Thanks! I nodded my head as you spoke. The M70 is my favorite rifle design and Winchester has developed a number of great rounds for it over the years. But, every now and then, their R&D ammo guys try to scam the system with smoke-and-mirrors stats and innovative number manipulations. Enjoyed your video! Take care and be well!
No one has answered my question yet. What does it do the 7 mm Remington Magnum does not do? Less recoil, less muzzle flash? This video answered all my questions about this cartridge. Thank you
Before I would go with a magnum 270 I would go with a 7mm mag. Much easier and less expensive to stick with 270 win. Thanks for clearing up the BS. How about a factory 6.5 -06 instead of all the short fake Magnums. Keep it simple and affordable.
A cartridge has already been invented in the past that can accomplish anything you'd ever need to do with a rifle. But these ammo companies need to let great older designs die so they can market new designs. It's all a sham. The grandaddy of all modern cartridges, the 7X57 Mauser, was a perfect cartridge and will accomplish anything that 99.9% of what rifle hunters need to do.
I am pretty sure that the barrel twist alone was the reason for bringing this cartridge to market. With everybody wanting to shoot long distance, the one in 10 twist specified by SAAMI would not allow it. A 270 WSM with a faster twist would serve the same purpose. But factory rifles can only be produced within Sammy specs. Great job.
Not necessarily. Manufactures can do whatever they want. In fact, many chamber/throats/mags in factory rifles are out of SAAMI specs. Ruger is now making commercial 7mm-08 rifles with 1:8 twists and longer throats to shoot heavier bullets. Straight from the SAAMI website: "SAAMI's standards are voluntary compliance standards".
Winchester brought the 6.8 Western to market because they got sued over the 270 WSM. They ended up settling the law suit with having to pay royalty to the guy for every rifle chambered in 270 WSM and for every cartridge made. The simple solution was to shorten the cartridge and "creedmoor" the chamber design to optimize it for heavy for caliber bullets. Voila, 6.8 Western. Amazing that no mention of the law suit was mentioned, which is the entire reason this cartridge was developed.
If your comparing apples to apples the the 270 wsm should have been a factory rifle. Oh that's right you needed a custom fast twist rifle throated to to shoot the heavy for caliber bullets. From what I understand Win. Came out with the 6.8 western to compete with the 27 Nosler ect. They couldn't just use a faster twist barrel and throat for the longer bullets on their WSM as that would put it out of SAMI specs. So they had to devise another cartridge. I have no dog in this fight other than loving the .277 caliber and have hunted with a .270 Win. For over 35 years. I personally wouldn't get a 6.8 western as I don't think it will do anything any better than my .270 or 300 Win. Mag. would do.
Manufacturers do not have to follow SAAMI specs for rifles, and often don't. SAAMI specs are VOLUNTARY. Rifle manufacturers change twist rates, magazine length, and throat dimensions all the time. Ruger is now making their 7mm-08 rifles with 1:8 twists and longer throats. You can buy .223REM guns in 1:12 to 1:7 twists. The issue is that changing the twist rate on the 270WSM won't convert 270win and 7mm shooters over (which is the goal)- because they are happy with what they have. They were hoping that hyping up a "new cartridge" would convince the guys with their 30 year-old 270s and 7mmRM's to buy a new rifle. It doesn't appear to be working.
I think it’s great that Winchester was trying to design something new, but I think they need to do a better job, why would anyone buy a 6.8 if they already own a .270 wsm, I think the only thing new about the 6.8 western is it’s name.
I agree. These numbers are always listed to make their product look good. I looked at doing this cartridge. Plenty of ammo where I am. No rifles though. Reloading tools are not around. Honestly I would have to really want this cartridge to go with it. If I add long range target shooting then it may make sense in the right rifle. But I have a 300 PRC for that. Ammo is expensive too. Over $60 a box of 20 runs is insane. If they want this round to succeed the price needs to come down. I feel the creedmore succeed because not only was there good marketing. But Hornady got out the reloading tools and component, ammo made by multiple companies and the price was a few bucks more than 308. Affordable to get into. I keep my trust 308. But the creedmore looked good if I am looking for target shooting.
Great video Desert Dog! Funny as I was about to email you a question about the Berger bullet stability app, that rated most of my 150gn 270 bullets with marginal stability if shot from my 24 inch 270Win (except for their VLD of course :) but my big disappointment came for my new pet load 130 Nosler e-tip rated (very) marginal. I often heard here and there that the 270 really should have a 9 in 10 rate of twist, like its brother the 280....to keep up with more modern copper bullets. What is your take on that Desert Dog?
Winchester should have upgraded the 270 with a 1:9 or 1:8.5 twist many decades ago. 99% of all custom barrels have those twist rates. I also think Berger is blowing smoke up our ass. Weight has nothing to do with it, stability is based on a ratio of twist rate to bullet length; longer bullets need faster twists. Copper bullets are long for caliber, but a 130gr E-tip should easily stabilize in a 1:10 barrel.
@@desertdogoutdoors1113 Thank you Desert Dog, I'm always waiting for your videos with great anticipation ! Yep Berger app rates the 150 IB/SST as no good... At some point you start wondering if you are taken for a ride by Berger or Hornady Nosler...etc are just incompetent...
Excellent, in-depth, we’ll-researched video. Thank you.
Congrats on Ruger’s hunting skills. I was planning a trip to Africa with my son as well, but the Sino plague ruined our plans last year.
Thank you for the compliment. By the way, your channel is one of the few that I enjoy and watch on a regular basis.
@@desertdogoutdoors1113 have you tried out simplemindedfella channel. He test hunting bullets and different velocities. I found it interesting.
This is my favorite all things guns and hunting channel. Thank you for what you do, and what you share with us.
Thank you DD for your time, money and knowledge on this cartridge. Gettin a little tired of the advertisements.
100% awesome job. Interestingly, here in Montana earlier this year the only thing on the shelves was 6.8 western ammunition. I bought a 6.5 PRCN couldn’t find ammunition dies or brass for it. Again, great job. Good luck this hunting season.
Really good information 👍👍. As far as hunting out west, I've been mule deer hunting 3 times since 2014 and had no problem taking mule deer with my 30 06 and 308. In the part of New Mexico I was hunting you could see a whole lot farther than anyone could shoot. My longest shot out of 3 was 315 yds. That's a long shot for a whitetail deer hunter from Alabama who hunts heavily wooded areas.
Excellent video. The 6.8 Westerner is interesting, and I was going to buy one (I really "needed" that caliber..........Haha) But when I looked at all the details, and the ballistics, I could not justify adding a new rifle, since I already have a .270 WSM, and all the reloading tools (dies) for my .270 WSM. They are almost twins...
thank you sir for your work. it does not go unnoticed. thank you for clearing up the smoke to show the playing field. continue to cut through the hype especially for those of us who can't afford to be taken advantage of financially
It seems as if Hornady's team of genius marketers are moonlighting over at Winchester. Great vid, DD!
ironically though, Hornady refuses to manufacture 6.8W ammo, or even components for the cartridge. It may be because they see it as competition for the 7PRC, who knows.
@@mikemelina7395 could be. 🤷♂️
I had my 270 built with a 1:9 to easily handle the heavier end bullets(150-160) before finding sweet loads with the 130gr speer hot cor and 140gr sst…. The only mistake I made was not building it on a left handed action!!
ppppppp I'll k I'll k0 I'm 7ip0 I
I can't say much, I've always been a fan of the 264 win mag
This was very helpful and interesting
I especially liked that you broke down the ammo and gave us some education on bulk ball powder. Thank you.
Thank you for producing this video, lots of great data and information. But I have a slightly different view of the 6.8 Western Cartridge.
I have both the 270 WSM (No change in SAAMI Spec) in a 7½ Twist Barrel and a 6.8 Western. They both shoot all high BC bullets (175 Sierra TGK, 170 Berger Elite and the Nosler 165 ABLR) accurate up 1000 yards. Both of my rifles like the Nosler 165 the best, less than one-inch groups at 200 yards with a muzzle velocity of just over 3000 fps and 1650 at target. The others groups are just over an inch. My barrels are both SS Brux Rem Varmint, so they are to a higher standard than a factory barrel. I shoot 600 and 1000 yards weekly, so I have experience with both. There is very little difference between the two with the same hand loads for all bullets.
I do agree, why come out with a new cartridge, the 6.8 Western. Simply, Winchester and Browning could have just come out with the “270 WSM Western”, a 270 WSM with a 7½ barrel twist. Just think of the money us shooters would have saved, no need to purchase new rifles.
With that said, I will say (which will distress some), the 270 with a 7½ twist or the 6.8 Western will clearly out shoot the 270 Winchester or 270 WSM at yardages 500 yards and over. Even shooting the 145 ELDs from both at 600 yards the higher twist barrels delivers a better group. So, I have totally bought in to the high twist barrels and high BC Bullets no mater what yardages I am shooting.
I think the 270 Winchester is a great gun, so much history. But, if I were to rebarrel, it would be one with a 7½ to take advantage of the high BC Bullets. My barrel lengths are both 26”, I exceed by 50 fps all of the published velocity data by Winchester and Browning. It is obvious a 24” barrel will have a lower velocity. This was an error in this video.
My view. The “6.8 Western” is a better cartridge than the standard barreled 270 Winchester and 270 WSM as it shoots the heavier higher BC bullets, as well as shoots amazing at 1000 yards. Don’t discount this this cartridge, it has more positive attributes than this video portrays. For an average hunter, just shooting up to 300 yards, our 270s are more than needed, but if one is pushing 500 yards the higher twist barrels are superior. I think the 6.8 Western will be with us for a long time. Should add, I have 6mm Creedmoor and 6.5 Creedmoor. These are my favorite two cartridges.
Any thoughts on the 6.5PRC, 300 WSM and 280 Ackley Improved for hunting?
>ⁿ
My 6.8 western is just waiting to stretch its legs. Stuck working right now, but later this spring I will be running it out to 1,000 and beyond. I’m really looking forward to working on load development with it and really seeing what it’ll do. One thing that wasn’t mentioned, but kinda goes without saying, about the comparison data between the 270wsm and the 6.8 was the wsm data was a perfected hand load, and the western is factory box ammo. Not exactly apple to apples there. I’m really looking forward to seeing what we’ll get out of the 6.8 with hand loads, and multiple bullet options. (Attention Berger) I think it’s going to be a great performer.
@@padna7946 You will enjoy the 6.8 Western. I am shooting 1000 yards tomorrow, 175 Sierra and 150 Nosler bullets. I cannot get the 170 Elites to group, don’t know why. Best is about 3” at 200 yards. All the others are an 1” groups or under. My best bullet is the Nosler 165 ABLR. Give those a try, but currently they are very hard to find.
Well said , I just posted a similar comment then read this.
Another awesome video as usual. Thank you DD
Great video - thank you. Sound, sincere and sober review 👍🏻
Love your videos and I’ve learned so much. You are such a perfectionist.
I’ve got a LAW M704 with a PacNor barrel chambered in 270 Ackley Improved. I had PacNor put an 8” twist in it. I shoot 170 grain Berger’s out of it at 2,850 FPS at paper out to1,000 yards. I do it because it’s fun trying to shoot a light hunting rifle at distance at paper. However, when hunting, I back it down to 150’s and 130’s. I don’t take shots past 400 yards when hunting so the sectional density and retained energy is more than adequate for all game I hunt.
Thank you! You seem to be the only one that talks about the pros & cons. That I am impressed by.. Not just the good stuff.
I love the statement "Fluff Reviews" I am tired of reviews that Cherry Pick data!
Thanks. Great truthful presentation. I strive for shots 300 yards or less.For me it's 30-06 for Deer, Antelope and .338 Win mag for Elk and bigger. Both in Winchester model 70s. I live in Oregon. Premium bullets on all.
30 06 is all u need for elk
@@58harwood same to you sissy
@@58harwood you make no sense go down the comments everyone said a opinion even you but your is stupid and what grown man uses a emoji
Right on Brother i there with you 👍
Thank you for a no bullshit review ! 👍 🦌
And I LOVE the 30.06 also !
Well stated. Thank you for an intelligently made and honest video.
I'm 69 years old and have been shooting since I was 8 years old and taught by my grandfather.
Over the years hunting, bench shooting, military action and police I discovered that all of the myriad of calibers was all just marketing hype to sell more guns and new type caliber ammunition. So, you might be wondering what I like. My choices are: 22lr, 12 gauge shotgun, 22-250 w/60 grain bullet, 25-06 w/ 100 gr, 270 w/140 and 30-06 w/180 grain bullet. That's it! What next you might ask. LEARN TO SHOOT because it is not the gun, it's not the caliber, IT IS, THE NUT BEHIND THE BUTT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Great content as always. I too always take the claims made by the bullet/ammo manufactures with several grains of salt. I’ve always believed that if you want a more accurate apples to apples comparison when comparing bullets of different calibers, you should be comparing bullets of similar sectional densities or ballistic coefficients. I laugh when they just arbitrarily compare one caliber to the other with no specific metric. The result means little or nothing.
Hi from Aus, love the honesty, we can all can the corporate BS, keep the vids commin' 👍🍻😊♥
The classics are only getting better with time & perform just as well with modern components 👍🍻😊♥
Thanks for your review and breakdown!
Great as always, wheel well and truly reinvented 😂.
I am a Geezer, having started handloading in the early 1970's.
Thousands of .270 wcf handloads, back to the war surplus powders, screw type Nosler Partitions.
I now use Reloder 26 behind the 150/160 Partitions, it outperforms all the traditional powders in my experience.
Another you tuber channel claims his off rack ,10 twist stabilized the 165 ablr ( not sure of the elevation) at 100 and 770 yards.
If this is generally true, it is eye opening and a bit of a game changer.
This Geezer, hunts to reduce distance for a secure shot. ...770 yards on Game is a probable wounding attempt and we can't afford that risk, imo.
As an experiment, I will try the above. Do any others have experience with this? Cheers
The entire idea is to sell products. To create a need that may not exist. Like the series 80 firing pin block. Its a solution looking for a problem.
When you look at the history of hunting. Those who hunt out west have been taking game with what was available at the time, before 2000, and have successfully taken game.
The manufacturers will continue to introduce products to satisfy the perceived needs of today's hunter.
I hunt with a .30-06 for years and I rarely take a shot longer than 300 yards. If the shot is further then I'll stalk my game until I am close enough to take a shot under 300 yards, preferably 200 yards or less. That's hunting. Stalking your game until you are close enough to take a humane and ethical shot.
When you think about all of the available calibers on the market there is so much overlap in performance; .308/.30-06 is there much of a difference to make a difference. Only in the mind of hunters who swear that if you're not shooting a .308 you're not a real hunter.
The same goes for the 6.5 CM. Hunters swear by it but how many of them have taken the time to become proficient with the equipment they currently had before they upgraded? Damn few.
This was an outstanding video and I appreciate it. I hunt northern Alberta and know very well what kind of cartridge is needed for western hunting (270, 30'06, 7mm-08, etc,) I appreciate your comments about ethical hunting distances.
Yep...when the Marketing firms on the east coast deem something "Western", It's usually just the opposite.
Dog of the Desert: Here's where it's at: .30-06 via my M-1 Garand. Or, the .375 H&H from my M-70. I really enjoy your postings. You are the real deal.
I know that two years passed on... But yesterday was the first time I shot this calibre... Bought an XPR for my youngest son and both spent the afternoon shooting (zeroing the scope to the rifle and moderator) using the only ammo we could find here in Portugal... Browning BXS ammo @ outrageous high price... Tested the rifle and ammo combo and ... Accurate, pleasant even but... Uninpressed! Let's see how it performs on game when season comes... 👍👍
This is a well researched and honest video. Thank you.
My 6.8 Western will be here on Tuesday. Hopefully I'll get it zeroed in and able to take it muley hunting next weekend. Also a late cow elk tag could be nice
Did you get one?
Great video. I have a .270WSM and I love it. I have a 130 grain E-Tip load that shoots 1 hole groups at 100 yards and runs 3402FPS. Also have a 150 grain Partition load for it at 3102FPS. Shoots half MOA at 100 yards. Both have mild recoil and keep velocity and energy very well for hunting yardage. Never really saw the need for the 6.8 Western. I also have 2 308's, one is a 1957 Model 88 and the other is a Howa Carbon fiber 24 inch barrel in a Hogue stock. Just working up loads for the latter and have 2 loads for the 88 that are right around 3000FPS with 150 grain monolithic.
Ah, wisdom. Very good assessment.
I’ve been watching a lot of 6.8 videos lately based on the fact that in my town there’s probably 40-50 boxes of 20 rounds between sportsman’s and a few local it had me thinking well might be fun to see what it could do. I have a bolt gun similar to proofs switch rifle so switching barrels is easy, so i could shoot the ammo for brass and develop a load then I hit myself upside the head to remind myself I have a 7 rem mag that legitimately shoots 1/4 moa, absolutely no need for it but it had me thinking. Great breakdown of this cartridge I really liked how you broke it down you brought more data to the table than just and opinion
Excellent no BS assessment with facts and ballistics to back it up. I was one of those people that asked you about this one about a week ago. It's a real insult to our intelligence how stupid marketing people think that we are. I really enjoy your approach to your videos you really cover a wide range on whatever subject you're approaching. After watching your previous videos it's my conclusion that if I wanted to hunt anything in North America with two rifles the 25-06 and the 30-06 would be the perfect Duo . Thank you greatly appreciated 👍
Was curious about the round. Thanks for info!
Thank you for finally someone coming up with straight talk and straight truth about a bunch of BS that's fed to us by all these gun rags
You've made some good points and comparisons. Thumb up for the info.
😱WoW, thanks for your “thoughts” of this caliber.
You really went out of your way to please your viewers to put to together this 30+ minutes video review.
I’ve been watching to see if this would fit my need for a setup to take up north to Alaska, and judging by your thoughtful analysis I also do not see that this will fill the slot between my go to 270Win and my backup 375 H&H that both shoots really well.
I’ll be focusing on getting a really well fit and finished used custom FN or Swedish Mauser in 30-06 or 338-06 (I will be reloading this round) since I want to stay away from magnum cartridges other than what I already have. 🙏🏼
Take a look at .35 Whelen, Ive shot plenty of very large bear with it. Its a hell of a round.
These newfangled supermags have no place in my deer and hog hunting inventory because the plain, ordinary, slow, old 308 Winchester firing the dreaded 165 gr. Hornady SST bullets at non Magnum velocities is an absolute Hammer of Thor on the Largest, Meanest inhabitants of any forest. God help any Giant Hogs over 300 lbs and this is the gospel according to the Man that invented the 300 Hammer, he was duplicating the killing efficiency of the 308 win. Firing the dreaded 165 gr. SST at 2650. Bill Wilson of Wilson Combat Co. hunts hogs more than anyone I have ever heard of and this is the best advice I have ever put to use myself. Even if I don't get to cross paths with a Bigfoot, I ain't undergunned if I do.
Excellent video, lots of useful information. I've been killing deer and deer sized game for over 30 years with my poor old obsolete .270 Winchester and I've yet to see any 130 to 150 grain bullet bounce off any animals hide. I don't believe that I will be making the switch to a 6.8 Western any time soon.
Lol you're going to be eating your words because the 6.8 Western is hitting harder then the 7mm rem mag at long range IN A SHORT ACTION!! Its a beast of a round, updated 270 WSM
@Mike Tyson
1. No one cares about short action
2. Only outshines other calibers st like 4-500 yards.
3. Ammo costs 100$ here in Canada for 6.8W
Only benefit is reduced recoil
It’s crazy that people are so sucked in by “newness”. The 6.8 Western is only getting 2900 fps, and it’s impossible to find. My hunting load is a 7mm-08 pushing a 140gr accubond using Sta-ball 6.5, and I get 2850 fps with no pressure signs. Why do hunters feel like the things that have been working for decades suddenly become inferior as soon as something new comes out? My uncle shot some of the biggest bucks I’ve ever seen in my life using 00 buckshot out of an old 16 gauge single shot while smoking a pipe and wearing a red flannel jacket and work pants!
Great video. I considered this cartridge and went with a 280 AI instead. I reload and didn't want to deal with the belt on the 7mm Rem Mag. In the 270 bullet size, I think the 277 Fury will kill it off - demand and supply as military cartridge.
Where is the 270 Weatherby Magnum in this debate, review?.? My favorite rifle caliber right behind my 308 Winchester and 3006 Springfield………..
I have one too , the second flattests shooting cartridge available
Maybe because Weatherby guns are overrated
@ronbeckybeasley3566 overated sure but still quite high quality. I dont have any of the American weatherby guns but i have a vanguard and its very nice
@@awsomedude12345678 so you own a pos Howa.
@@ronbeckybeasley3566 clearly you know nothing about guns
Good information to separate out some of the hype. I’ve been hunting successfully for 50 years, mainly with a 270, while I own many different calibers I really enjoy shooting that old Remington 700! I look forward to actually seeing if the 6.8 will take hold, only time will tell but I’m certainly intrigued with the potential of the new combination of bullet weight and factory twist rate. I don’t own a short mag so it’s logical to lean toward the next generation engineering even if it basically does almost the same thing as the short mag. My thinking is that because of the military’s decision to utilize the 6.8 it very possibly could end up being produced by many manufacturers creating the competition to benefit the everyday hunter. I guess I’m Still on the wait and see fence.
When you compare Winchester's 7mm mag 168 grain load to their 6.8 Western 165 gr. load, the 6.8 actually has a higher muzzle velocity, a greater ballistic coefficiency, and a higher sectional density. So it does outperform the 7mm mag comparatively.via Winchester box stats. For me, I'll stay with my 270 Winchester for most game. I am thinking about upgrading my barrel to a 1 in 8 twist.
Sorry to burst your bubble, but the 7mm RM pushes those bullets faster. Since BC doesn't matter at ethical hunting distances (MPBR), the 7mm shoots flatter. Sectional density means nothing these days; almost any mid-weight monolithic or bonded bullet will get complete pass-throughs.
The case design of the 6.5 creedmoor compared to the 260, is basically the same as the 6.8 Western compared to the 270 WSM. The 260 case is shortened a little, case tapered a little less and the shoulder angle changed a little, to form the 6.5 creedmoor. The 270 wsm case was shortened a little, case tapered left basically the same and the shoulder angle left the same, to form the 6.8 Western, but then the 270 wsm shoulder angle is steeper than the 260 remington shoulder angle in the first place. To say that the case design of the 6.5 creedmoor is anything like "revolutionary ", or all that much different, compared to the 260, than the 6.8 Western is, compared to the 270 WSM, is an exaggeration.
The Creedmoor case is based of the 30TC.
@@desertdogoutdoors1113 which is the 308 case shortened a little, steeper shoulder angle, and case taper lessened a bit. You do the same thing to the 260 Remington case and get the exact same results. The 6.5 case is nothing revolutionary.
I agree with you wholeheartedly. Why would want to spend the extra money if you can even find the 6.8 Western. Just doesn’t make sense when we have the 30-06 and .270 Win to do the job just fine at ethical shooting distances. The gain the 6.8 shows is pretty much insignificant at out to 300 yards
Thanks for the video.
Let's give it some time, hell the valkyrie had a rough start, and now is a reliable Lazer that will slay yoties and put together groups around..5 moa!
DD Thanks for another great video. I was initially intrigued by the 6.8 Western but then reality hit and I realized much of what you point out - no real stats, reloading data, ammo availability, rifle availability. Then I realized it is just another collaboration by Browning and Winchester just like the WSM of years ago. Of course these companies are now owned by the same larger corporation. Too much marketing and unreliable data. I'm sticking with the 7mm Rem Mag. And to me the most important stat you point out is the MPBR - all had about 300 yards with 3 inch target.
MPBR is something lost on this new generation. They all want to spin turrets and consult calculators and charts. If you have time to do all that, you're either too far away or you're going to miss your shot opportunity.
MPBR is certainly becoming a lost technique. I just can’t make sense of a hundred yard zero for hunting. I do wonder how many opportunities are lost due to spinning knobs. Many, I suspect, both to wasting time instead of shooting and spinning to the wrong setting. I see it all the time on the TH-cam hunting channels.
@@phild9813 What’s the ideal zero range?
I bought a kimber 8400 270 wsm back in 2008 for $750.00 after my 7mm m70 was stolen. Not because of the caliber but the wood was just beautiful. After hunting with it I realized how much meat damage it was causing on shots within 150 yrds. My question is I'm having it rebarrel done to a 1 in 8 twist for heavier bullets since I bought a regular 270 for the lighter bullets I was wondering about the 175gr sierra game changers for elk at max range of 400 yrds. It's the only heavy bullet I can find at a good price. Bought 400 just because I was afraid of availability. Trying to go heavy for less meat damage if shots are close but still want good expansion or should I just stick with my old standby of 140gr interlocks?
Switch to a monolithic bullet like the TTSX or GMX. Out of the magnums, they do less meat damage than a 308 with cup-n-core lead bullets. Of course, stop taking high shoulder shots if you care about meat.
I have a 6.8 western I know this is a year ago but I have a cpr and I would recommend it. Shoots great and there is plenty of ammo now. It's an extremely accurate rifle and it hits hard. Compared to a 270 there almost identical except bullet wight that's all.
Fifth generation Harding County South Dakota hunter here.I think there is such a thing as Western cartridges. I mean, you ever see what a 130 grain .270 does to a deer at 30 yards? But it's money on deer at 300 yards. You would take your 30-30 all day long for the Eastern woods, and I'd use mine here on the prairie if it's all I had. But, it sure wouldn't be my first choice. If I need to slow the .270 down for closer range shooting, I can simply buy a box of 150 grains off the shelf.
I can shoot groups like that with my pre 64 Model 70. Ya. It has iron sights. This gun is a one trick pony. What do you get over the .270 Win for all your money? You get to buy $100 boxes off Gunbroker. Meanwhile, the .270 Win, which is a true Western cartridge,(300 plus yard PBR) is just putting deer in the truck. As you mentioned, ethical Western hunters seldom shoot at game over about 350 yards, so why reinvent the wheel?
The 30.06 is the ( Old Timers) Soldiers round. Ammo was cheap after the War and We love the round. I wouldn’t change my M1G. The 7mm round is the sweet spot, whether it’s a STD .284 or the magnum loadings. All shooters know this, well maybe they don’t. Love your channel.
270 wsm owner,,,,great cartridge, better results! Wife took her moose with it,,,can't give a better review than that!
Great show.
Glad you did this video, I was curious with the Western myself, but it appears it's more trouble than it's worth, with all the data and component issues. And the main one for me,it doesn't offer anything, that is not already on the market.
it offers a short action cartridge in 270 capable of matching the 7mm mag with high bc bullets at a reasonable price. times are changing boomer.
@@joshlower1 Hasn't changed that much for me to want and buy one.
26:30 This is the entire point of the 6.8 Western, it can handle, from factory, heavier bullets with higher BCs. It's not a gimmick, and it does have some advantages over the 270 WSM. I think the biggest problem is the marketing claiming that it beats the 7mm remmag, that was a bad idea for them to go in that direction. They should've framed it as an improved 270 WSM.
They cherry pick loads but if you compare the 7mm rem mag to the 6.8 western they are pretty damn simular with the heavier weight bullets. It's actually pretty damn efficient and bad ass to be able to match the 7mm mag out of a short action with a 24" barrel. Go check the weight of the rifles straight off the browning website. 7mm mag power in a rifle almost a pound lighter and a few inches shorter is a big advantage in my eyes. I personally like more choices and believe this one is a good cartridge. Being realistic everything since the 30-06 wasn't needed so if your gonna say that about the 6.8 western say it about the 270 280 7mm rem mag and 300 win mag. None of them really perform any better than the 06 at hunting ranges and the magnums require heavier longer rifles burning much more powder with 25% less ammo capacity. Atleast the short actions do have a advantage in weight and length. 6.8 western will be an ideal mountain rifle for people who hike miles in the backcountry where weight and length matter.
You can go up to max pressure in the 6.8 Western, but it will never match the ballistics of a max pressure load in 7mm Rem Mag. That thought is a complete fantasy created by Winchester. On your other point, would not a 270 Win be just as much "mountain rifle" (BTW, I hate that term just as much as I hate "western cartridge"). The long action weighs only 2-3 ounces more, which isn't even noticeable. In fact, on Winchester's website ( www.winchesterguns.com/products/rifles/xpr/current/sporter.html ), they list the 6.8W and 270WIN, both at the exact same weight with 24" barrels. The 270 WIN would easily kill the same "mountain animals", but so it with far less recoil in a lightweight "mountain rifle".
@@desertdogoutdoors1113 6.8 has way better ballistic coefficient and sectional density than 270 win. Obviously there's not much reloading data for the 6.8 yet but the factory loads are pretty much equal to the 7mm mag ballistics in a rifle the same weight as the 270 winchester as you said. And yes the 270 can kill the same animals does that mean the other cartridges are not useful? Good thing about America is you have choices if you like something buy it if you don't then don't. I don't understand why anyone that likes guns would be against the 6.8 western it's pretty good for its purpose.
6.8 Western was only ammo on the shelf not too long ago. I’m not interested in the 6.8 but learn something new every time I watch one of your videos.
Does that mean that supply is high or demand is low?🤔
@@borkwoof696 Could be. Didn’t notice if there was any 6.8 on the shelf last time at SW, but there was no 7mm-08 or 30-06.
You are spot on in this video, however the only real difference between the 6.8 and the 270 WSM is the twist rates on factory guns and the length of the throat in the chamber. If you customize a 270 WSM and put a faster twist rate barrel, and lengthen the throat your basically doing what Winchester did. It really is nothing more then marketing something new, it keeps the wheels of free enterprise rolling. For those that buy into hype they’ll probably run out and buy one (can’t not have the latest and greatest), however I am noticing that the only cartridges that were left on shelves a while back when things were really lean were 6.8 western and it’s the only rifle brass my local retailer has any stock of, both indicators that people are not buying it.
Well the point of the 6.8 western is that it can take the high bc bullets and correct twist rate. Rem mags have a hard time loading high bc bullets and have them fit in traditional chamber dimensions. Case is slightly different than 270 wsm, similar to 300tc and 6.5cm.
Meant to say 6.5cm and 300 relationship.
This is exactly the point of the 6.8 Western. You can fire a heavy for caliber projectile than the previous .277 caliber
Good info!! Just subscribed
Thank you for the sub!
AWESOME VIDEO MAN! Can you please do a video on the. 220 swift or the 22-250
Great video man I've been looking at the cartridge. And that does look like winchester 760 powder or maybe winchester staball 6.5 powder 🤔
Its like the 6.5 Creedmoor v 260Rem all over again. The advantages only come in the tighter chamber spec, fast twist and the headheight in SAAMI spec and the availability of factory ammo with high BC bullets! With the price & scarcity of reloading components there is a conspiracy against us reloaders!😁
"Western" is just a trademark of winchester used for decades. Growing up in the 60s and 70's in Pennsylvania, I always liked the winchester western thing. It was just a slogan for promotion no more than that. Never had a problem with it. They used it on shotgun ammo as well. Looks to me the 6.8 western is a good addition to this class of cartridges. As far as factory ammo goes in all brands, it is not what it used to be.
many of this "new calibers" do not add anything to the 30'06, 270, 9,3x62, 7x57 and other traditional calibers. In many countries, Argentina in particular,. though some of us have traditional long range calibers like 300 Wby, 300 Win, or 45/70 or _European 8x57 and many others we, almost 100% have a .308 because it is our Armed Forces standard caliber and we can obtain officially sold ammo at affordable prices. Bullets, gunpowder, brass are scarce and under importations rulings . So our policy is "stick to traditional calibers and buy the best available bullet.
I‘m going to state an unpopular opinion: the .25 cal and .27cal are technically superfluous. They only exist because of parallel development in America and Europe at the end of the 19th century/early 20th century and have lost to their metric counterparts. While they may work just fine and we can argue all day about which is better, there is no denying that the difference in performance is marginal but there will never be as many .25 and .27 cal bullets available as there are 6.5 and 7mm options.
While it’s true there are less bullets offered in .277” than there are in 6.5mm, every single great hunting bullet is available in .277”. The variety was more limited do to twist rate, than caliber.
I’d also like to add that no one using the French metric system has ever made it to the moon 😀
I do love a good 7x64 Brennecke.
Yeah, you may get some sand kicked in your face, but I think your point is absolutely correct.
I don’t know about it being unpopular, but it’s 100% correct. Anyone with any understanding of ballistics could see that if they look at any real data. The first thing I thought of when I saw the Western is-why bother with a .277? Why not just reregister a new chamber design using the 7saum case and an 8 twist at longer oal? You can literally buy prefits and assemble one yourself instead of buying a fad cartridge. ADG brass has you covered.
Thanks for seeking and sharing the truth. I do, however, dispute your claim that you can always get a shot opportunity within 300 yards. As an elk hunter in Colorado for 5 years now, I've encountered numerous situations that required a 400 ish yard shot.
Thank you it's about time somebody's honest when Ron's Spoomer showed how it didn't performance as well as the 270 short magnum people discounted that
I never go with all these designer cartridges, I stick to the classics which always have readily purchasable ammunition like .30-06 and 7mm REM Mag and .308 Win. Just my opinion
Personally I like the idea of a high to very high SD bullet at a relatively moderate velocity. Larger calibers will high SD's tend to recoil much harder. Be well!
DD, you have to admit it's a sexy-looking cartridge.
I hope anyone looking into this cartridge doesn’t stop at this video for all the information they get.. there is plenty of truth in here but there is a lot of information that doesn’t jive with what I’ve seen. For instance, throughout the entire pandemic I have seen dozens of boxes of the ammo at any of the retailers around me. Less popular means more ammo when people panic buy. I get the marketing is annoying but this truly is a modernized 270 and it is a solid option for anyone that doesn’t already own one.
Honestly, a 270 Win pushing a 150gr bonded bullet at 2800 - 2900fps will kill everything in lower 48 just fine. I don't see the need 500+ yard hunting.
Nice review. I myself purchased a new X bolt chambered in 6.8 western. Hard to find a rifle lately in 270wsm, I've been looking for years. I figured this would get me pretty close to what I was looking for, sounds like I was right. Great stuff, thanks for your intel.
Great video
Skeptical indeed, when they introduced this cartridge and it's external ballistics!
Been waiting for a new video. Interesting topic. Your review was pretty much exactly what I thought it would be and I agree with you. It’s fine but nothin special. I don’t understand why if the rifle manufactures are pushing it. Especially Winchester, why arnt they flooding the market with quality ammo? Ammo availability is one of my top 3 questions when selecting a new rifle.
This is off topic
I think the 350 legend is a joke but I did see ball ammo for it at Walmart for $15 today. I still would never buy one. I have no use for “rifle” with that ballistic performance
The Winchester 6.8 Westerner is an answer for a question that was never asked...
This round was doomed from the release because the pandemic has crippled the firearms supply chain. If we'd seen the 6.8 Westerner released in "normal" times, I'd suspect it would have followed the 20 year old 270 WSM's limited success. However, the pandemic, plus questionable claims, may have killed this round before it even got any amount of sales success to speak of.
If I wanted to buy a 270, I think I'd stick with the venerable 270Win, with close to a century of proven performance.
I remember when Winchester released the various WSM calibers and now only the 270WSM and 300WSM are still around. Gotta wonder if the 6.8 Westerner will even be here in a few decades???
Great assessment of the situation.
@@desertdogoutdoors1113 Thanks! I nodded my head as you spoke.
The M70 is my favorite rifle design and Winchester has developed a number of great rounds for it over the years. But, every now and then, their R&D ammo guys try to scam the system with smoke-and-mirrors stats and innovative number manipulations. Enjoyed your video!
Take care and be well!
What knife is the stag handled, sheathed knife on the 3rd from bottom shelf on your right, in the video?
“Stupid Hype” ... yep, that’s my vote. Thank you for this.
I would like to hear your thoughts on the 7mm PRC.
No one has answered my question yet. What does it do the 7 mm Remington Magnum does not do? Less recoil, less muzzle flash?
This video answered all my questions about this cartridge. Thank you
Before I would go with a magnum 270 I would go with a 7mm mag. Much easier and less expensive to stick with 270 win. Thanks for clearing up the BS. How about a factory 6.5 -06 instead of all the short fake Magnums. Keep it simple and affordable.
the 6.8 western is cheaper then 7 mag and its no fake gimmick.
@@joshlower1 can't see where is offers anything more than existing cartridges. We will see how sales go.
A cartridge has already been invented in the past that can accomplish anything you'd ever need to do with a rifle. But these ammo companies need to let great older designs die so they can market new designs. It's all a sham. The grandaddy of all modern cartridges, the 7X57 Mauser, was a perfect cartridge and will accomplish anything that 99.9% of what rifle hunters need to do.
I am pretty sure that the barrel twist alone was the reason for bringing this cartridge to market. With everybody wanting to shoot long distance, the one in 10 twist specified by SAAMI would not allow it. A 270 WSM with a faster twist would serve the same purpose. But factory rifles can only be produced within Sammy specs. Great job.
Not necessarily. Manufactures can do whatever they want. In fact, many chamber/throats/mags in factory rifles are out of SAAMI specs. Ruger is now making commercial 7mm-08 rifles with 1:8 twists and longer throats to shoot heavier bullets. Straight from the SAAMI website: "SAAMI's standards are voluntary compliance standards".
Winchester brought the 6.8 Western to market because they got sued over the 270 WSM. They ended up settling the law suit with having to pay royalty to the guy for every rifle chambered in 270 WSM and for every cartridge made. The simple solution was to shorten the cartridge and "creedmoor" the chamber design to optimize it for heavy for caliber bullets. Voila, 6.8 Western. Amazing that no mention of the law suit was mentioned, which is the entire reason this cartridge was developed.
I think it’s a good cartridge but all newer calibre rifles are grossly overhyped that’s the norm! Like the 7mm PRC and the Hornady data BS
If your comparing apples to apples the the 270 wsm should have been a factory rifle. Oh that's right you needed a custom fast twist rifle throated to to shoot the heavy for caliber bullets. From what I understand Win. Came out with the 6.8 western to compete with the 27 Nosler ect. They couldn't just use a faster twist barrel and throat for the longer bullets on their WSM as that would put it out of SAMI specs. So they had to devise another cartridge. I have no dog in this fight other than loving the .277 caliber and have hunted with a .270 Win. For over 35 years. I personally wouldn't get a 6.8 western as I don't think it will do anything any better than my .270 or 300 Win. Mag. would do.
Manufacturers do not have to follow SAAMI specs for rifles, and often don't. SAAMI specs are VOLUNTARY. Rifle manufacturers change twist rates, magazine length, and throat dimensions all the time. Ruger is now making their 7mm-08 rifles with 1:8 twists and longer throats. You can buy .223REM guns in 1:12 to 1:7 twists. The issue is that changing the twist rate on the 270WSM won't convert 270win and 7mm shooters over (which is the goal)- because they are happy with what they have. They were hoping that hyping up a "new cartridge" would convince the guys with their 30 year-old 270s and 7mmRM's to buy a new rifle. It doesn't appear to be working.
I think it’s great that Winchester was trying to design something new, but I think they need to do a better job, why would anyone buy a 6.8 if they already own a .270 wsm, I think the only thing new about the 6.8 western is it’s name.
Higher twist rate and designed to run heavy for caliber bullets. Something the 270 wsm can't do
@@69yenko65 The gun not the caliber
🎯, again!
I have a 7rem mag, why on earth would I need a 6.8 western? A traditional calibre like the 30 06 is easier find everything for at a cheaper price.
I agree. These numbers are always listed to make their product look good. I looked at doing this cartridge. Plenty of ammo where I am. No rifles though. Reloading tools are not around. Honestly I would have to really want this cartridge to go with it. If I add long range target shooting then it may make sense in the right rifle. But I have a 300 PRC for that. Ammo is expensive too. Over $60 a box of 20 runs is insane. If they want this round to succeed the price needs to come down. I feel the creedmore succeed because not only was there good marketing. But Hornady got out the reloading tools and component, ammo made by multiple companies and the price was a few bucks more than 308. Affordable to get into. I keep my trust 308. But the creedmore looked good if I am looking for target shooting.
Great video Desert Dog!
Funny as I was about to email you a question about the Berger bullet stability app, that rated most of my 150gn 270 bullets with marginal stability if shot from my 24 inch 270Win (except for their VLD of course :) but my big disappointment came for my new pet load 130 Nosler e-tip rated (very) marginal.
I often heard here and there that the 270 really should have a 9 in 10 rate of twist, like its brother the 280....to keep up with more modern copper bullets.
What is your take on that Desert Dog?
Winchester should have upgraded the 270 with a 1:9 or 1:8.5 twist many decades ago. 99% of all custom barrels have those twist rates. I also think Berger is blowing smoke up our ass. Weight has nothing to do with it, stability is based on a ratio of twist rate to bullet length; longer bullets need faster twists. Copper bullets are long for caliber, but a 130gr E-tip should easily stabilize in a 1:10 barrel.
@@desertdogoutdoors1113 Thank you Desert Dog, I'm always waiting for your videos with great anticipation !
Yep Berger app rates the 150 IB/SST as no good... At some point you start wondering if you are taken for a ride by Berger or Hornady Nosler...etc are just incompetent...
All good things to consider..... Thanks
Right on, this thing doesn't do anything for real hunters that the old standards like 30-06 and 270 Win won't do.