The Search for the Best Groovebox
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 28 ก.ย. 2024
- I recount my journey to find the best groovebox ever while becoming a part of the TH-cam synth nerd community. I talk about my experiences with the Novation Circuit, the OP-1, the Korg Electribe 2, the Roland MC-101, the PO-33 KO, and the Model:Cycles, as well as exciting future of the groovebox and standalone music production station world.
Check out the Novation Circuit: www.zzounds.co...
Check out the Korg Electribe 2: www.zzounds.co...
Check out the Roland MC-101: www.zzounds.co...
Edited by Coastland Creative: www.coastlandc...
I am aware that the title is pretty similar to the Knobs video about grooveboxes... I hadn't come across it until this video was already finished, and the focus is pretty different. His video is well worth a watch: • A Playdate with Percus...
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I know that the title is pretty similar to part of the title of the video by Knobs, which I hadn't seen until after finishing this video. I double checked, and his video goes in a pretty different direction, and is well worth a watch: th-cam.com/video/BgdwEZ3J2lg/w-d-xo.html
Would love to see Gabe and others rank their grooveboxes in categories like, sound quality, workflow, what styles they work best for etc.
Lol , go away with you toys and try a radikal tech. spectralis
LOL at op-1 ...It haa the crappiest dsp algoritms ever ..
@@WARDISWARD go home you're drunk
I don’t think the Cycles sounds dinky. I think the bass sounds huge for me. I actually have a hard time dialing it back to make room for synths in the mix. My only gripe with it is not really being able to control the amplitude envelopes super well. I think the metallic drum timbres sound really natural and have lots of nice texture, especially if you use the LFOs wisely. I just wish the sound design went a little deeper, but then you’d probably lose a lot of the immediacy of it, which makes it so brilliant, and it’d probably be more expensive. It’s really dirt cheap for what it does. You can always get a Digitone if you want to dive deeper. But I think FM is actually really amazing for bass. The fundamental really comes through. I think a lot of analog wave forms have a hard time holding up in a mix with heavy synthesizer sounds compared to FM.
Hi Gabe, my opinion ... you speak really well but I miss to listen at least for some seconds the devices when you are speaking about them. Honestly, sometimes I don’t understand what you mean exactilly but it would change if I can listen it. Thank you, good luck.
Honestly GarageBand is super innovative and way underrated and I really hope they make something like a GarageBand groovebox with the ability to load new synth and drum sounds on top of its large library in the future.
Check out the Polyend Tracker. I love it and it just got a major update.
He's a real good communicator. I like his vibe, easy going young man. He's obviously very knowledgeable in the creation of music through grooveboxes and beat machines. I'm also impressed by the quality of these videos, they are very professional. Merry Christmas
🎅.
let's see, maybe Novation will finally launch newer & greater Circuit ))
heh
this aged well
my favorite box is 707.
little self-contained machines are cool, but sometimes you need a bigger one to pair with some analog synth(s).
Fair enough. The 707 does look really awesome.
Same. The MC-707 is awesome.
@@GabeMillerMusic Agreed The MC707 it is Awesome And The Closest Akai Force Competition IMO - But Also Lacking The HUGE Lot Of Force Functionality!!!! 😍
Great presentation. I have the old MC-303, while the sounds are pretty dated the actual workflow and processes are real deep. I bought the MC-303 in1997 and never read the manual ( big mistake ) until recently, after reading the manual you can do so much with it, the arpeggiator and sequencer is amazing, I plugged in my Blofeld and my mind was blown. There are so many features in the MC-303 that I wish to see in contemporary grooveboxes, it seems some basic functions have been forgotten. I recently bought a MC-101 and love it, it would have been so good to have the same recording functions as the MC-303, in particular, the loop/rest at the end of the sequencer recording so you know when the recording bars have finished which is then blended seamlessly into a loop.
I'm on the quest now, I have an EMX-1, an MPC One, Pocket Operators, Model:Cycles. I'm digging my model cycles and I love my EMX-1, i'm definitely getting an ESX-1 eventually but they are kind of big. MPC Im still figuring out but i use it a lot from drums and now i'm figuring out how to use it sequence other gear, but the cycles has been a lot of fun and i'm considering more elektron. Maybe a digitakt.
you should try the MPC One tho, its got a ton of synth engines you can use it with. I use it for dance music and occasional hip hop.
I use a Roland MC808 for about 10 years now still happy with it. 20 years ago I took my first steps with the MC303 and used it til it got worn out completely. The MC303 is a toy compared with theMC808. But perfect for beginners
Deluge is amazing. You'll love it
I said it before, but we gotta find a way to get you a Synthstrom Deluge man. As a Circuit-lover, I think you'd dig it (although it doesn't have velocity sensitive pads). Otherwise I think you could do some real damage with it.
Agree 100%. The Deluge is an amazing groove box
A lot of the tutorials compare Deluge workflow with a DAW (Gabe's "DAW in a box" idea). It tries to put DAW concepts into a 16x8 light grid with good results. I've had mine for only about a week, I'm not anywhere near Gabe or most of your levels, but I'm impressed, much more so than I was with Circuit. The thing about Deluge is when so many functions are mapped to all the different pads and knobs, it gets overwhelming pretty quickly. No individual task is that difficult (an exception might be adjusting velocity, the most criticized missing feature), but putting it all together is going to take quite a bit of time.
@@geraldclark5812 adjusting a notes velocity is as easy as holding the note down and turning the knob (if I’m not mistaken]
@@bartjanc you're right, but it would be much more efficient if velocity-sensitive pads could have been implemented to capture that data at time of entry. Having to change velocity after the fact on potentially dozens of individual notes is daunting to me, especially since a lot of groove boxes have that feature already. Again I'm a newbie to Deluge and by no means an expert on any of this, I'm sure every question I have has a simple answer, it's just that I have like 10,000 questions...
@@geraldclark5812 agreed. I only have had mine for 6 weeks as well and haven’t tried any of the sampling or using the synthesizer to make new sounds, I’m still slowly going through the manual... and having lots of fun with the presets!
In regards to the velocity, I simply use a midi controller. But I’m used to a piano anyways, thus that’s easier for me either way.
Even without velocity keys it’s still the best groovebox 🙂
Synthstrom Deluge. Absolutely changed my life. Think you'd enjoy it.
Right!?! I can’t take a groovebox video seriously that doesn’t mention Deluge. It’s the box to judge all other boxes by in my opinion.
Gabe - I love your videos. You are very thorough but also quite a natural at spinning all this tech into a story. It makes it very enjoyable to learn about gear. Keep up the great work!
I gotta say the Korg ESX is still my favorite. Such a versatile machine.
What U think about the Akai Force ? Would Love to see u making a Video about the Akai Force.
Have you ever thought about the Polyend Tracker? I don't know if trackers are something you'd be interested in. I've been eyeing one and kind of find the workflow interesting.
This is the first comment I've ever made on a youtube video and I'm 47 and have been on here for 15 years. My favorites at this time #1 Korg Volca Sample, #2 Akai MPC 1000 and #3 Korg Electribe Sampler Black.
I cant believe this hasn't been metoned, but I believe, by far, the best "groovebox" currently available new, is the ROLAND JD-Xi. It gives you the feeling of stepping into a music store in 2002, and just getting into every groove box on display, along with the JP8000 that was usually sitting there next to them. I use mine with an MPC500, and a microkorg s on the side. No DAW about it! I highly recommend checking it out, if only it didnt come with the keyboard....haha!
Sure glad they were able to revive the groovebox movement 20yrs after the first generation. Roland (in my opinion) won that battle -Korg has always had rough parameters with their gear. Looking forward to future developments
You should check out the Polyend Tracker, I think this might kick all the others out of the park.
gonna say it too
I still need to look more into it, although what I've seen of the workflow in videos seems like I'd find it frustrating. I know a lot of people swear by it tho
@@GabeMillerMusic After 20 min of using it, you will for sure get used to it. You get fast with it really quickly. It might even make you a tracker convert. The level of control you have is really great.
Love my Tracker!
Just got the new circuit tracks!!! I LOVE IT!!! this IS my perfect groove box. i would like to thank you and bo beats for helping me decide.
for years and years as i was learning music production, i stuck to pc and software.
I know that has basically unlimited possibilities... but I also rarely feel inspired. I don't even enjoy launching my DAW anymore.
something you can get your hands on and is immediately accessible, something that is fun to use, that is where it's at!
The MC 707 seems like the most appealing to me, looks like a bank of polished sounds, enough FX, enough channels, the workflow looks well layered out where things can either be accessible or dived into the smallest detail.
I don't own one, I don't own any groove boxes and only had experience with some PO 12. But It's the only one that's currently got my eye.
I want to love the MC 101, but it just doesn't look convenient enough :/
I stumbled on the ultimate groovebox that went under the radar and goes for dirt cheap these days because people have no idea what’s lurking under its’ tiny frame, the Akai Miniak paired with the Patchbase editor on an iPad is actually a full-fledged synthesizer that grants you a groovebox with a flexible polyphonic sequencer you can compose and assign entire multi-bar phrases to a single key on, the only limitation is an 8-voice polyphony. I haven't tried writing an entire song on it yet (I'm a stickler with saving patches and you need to save patches to call them up in multi mode), but the potential is there. That compulsive urgency to get more gear was tempered for me because of how feature-laden it is and how much ground it can cover sonically, serious game-changer with ludicrous sound-design capabilities.
I love my Electribe 2. I've had a MPC One now for about 2 weeks. Wow! It is literally a DAW in a box. Fantastic bit of kit.
Polyend Tracker
I have the MPC one and it is a complete dawless, with dirt adding, sound shaping, plug-in effects, all. If you don’t care about some limitations on the audio track numbers, it will satisfy your search.
No er-1, no ELECTRIBE sx? Ouch!
the emx1 is pretty cheap, while the drum samples are quite retro and a bit limited the raunchy synth is unrivalled as is the ease of use, the new emx is shite though, only one useful param per synth and the overdrive is the wrong side of the volume limiter, and the menu diving...
Hey Gabe, as always, great video. It provides a really nice overview of some of the more modern grooveboxes today. I would say I have about 15years on you, but we are similar in preferring hardware based setups. I’ve used the previous generations Electribes (with the tubes) for everything. What stopped me from getting the newer models was the lack of a song mode. Now the thought is that when I pick one up, I know that luck will have it that Korg releases a new one. Lol. However, about a month ago I did pick up a Circuit. This purchase was largely inspired by your videos. There actually was a pretty big learning curve for me because the Electribes were all I knew. Upon getting over the curve I have to say that I’m absolutely in love with the Circuit. It’s just immediate, it makes sense, mistakes can be rewarding, the amount Novation has put and continues to put into it is unbelievable (session chain PLEASE!), but most of all it has broken my routine for creating music and re-inspired me again. So if I had to pick just one groovebox right now, It would definitively have to be the Circuit. (But yes, everything about the Deluge makes me drool uncontrollably. Lol)
the new features on the MC-101 with upgrade 1.6 are amazing. Love it.
As an MPC One owner NOT producing hip hop...I gotta say it's SO much more than that. Just saying!
Totally! That's just the first thing I think of in terms of the history of the MPC line and the sample flipping ability
Loads of people producing full pop and electronica albums on the MPC and/or force
DAW in a box? They used to call those multitrack workstations. Still do. :)
As a huge groove box fan I enjoyed this video and will now be subscribing. In my journey over the last almost 15 years I have come to the conclusion there will never be a "best" groove box. I think it's more about the interaction between the user and the gear. Prime exaple is the Roland SP404 (sampler?) A seemingly limited device with an almost non defined work flow. Once you escape the limitations you can do some fairly complicated and unique tricks. I think limitations in groove boxes are important, if you wanted a DAW in a box, you would get a laptop. The idea of an all inclusive production box is alluring but maybe un-realistic. I'm sure you don't keep all the factory sounds on the Circuit. So if you are sampling or loading sounds you now have to use a second something and therefore your all in one box kind of goes out the window. All this said my personal favorite is the electribe2 for all in one because it has just enough limitations and you can synthesize your own original sounds from waveforms.
Now my personal favorite would be the electribe2Sampler because I'm not dedicated enough to create a library of original sounds on the electribe. Also when used with other gear the electribe2Sampler is soooo powerful and useable. Runner up would be the Deluge, it's a DAW in a box, has a powerfull synthesis engine and a SP404 anti DAW workflow. All around though the creative flow from thought in my mind to audio the Korg Electribe2 is my go to. I will be the first to say it is not the best groove box, not even the best groove box I own, but it's my favorite.
Yeah I made a whole video about how groovebox limitations have made me a better producer. And personally, I don't mind the ebb and flow of loading sounds onto a device, making a bunch of music, then loading entirely new stuff and repeating the cycle. It often feels like getting a new device and keeps me creative.
@@GabeMillerMusicYES! Electribe2Sampler load your own waveforms and watch how the synthesis engine, filter, and FX twist it up. Super cool the interaction between raw sound and machine.
I suspect the electribe2 has some rather cold DAC / ADC (nerd talk for converters or sound card) because it might be the only sampler i have ever used where my favorite drums go in and come out sounding dull, and drums I don't care for come out sounding good. Truly that 'what's this going to sound like' exploration vibe.
Great video. imo, the only real shortcoming of the Novation Circuit is the absence of onboard sound design. If/when Novation bring out a Circuit 2/Pro, a sound design mode for the synth and an onboard drum synth would make it perfect. I got a Model Cycles during lockdown but there's a little too much menu diving for me. I've just received my Liven 8Bit Warps chiptune groovebox from Sonicware's kickstarter campaign so am about to read the manual for that. Hopefully the Liven 8bit will pair well with my Volca Drum (currently my favourite drum machine/groovebox).
Yeah I had the trial by fire of MC-101 menu diving so the Cycles didn't seem so bad in comparison.
One thing worth checking out would be the iPad sound design app someone built for the Circuit. I haven't tried it myself yet but it could open up some cool possibilities.
How about Liven 8Bit Warps, I am going to buy，Too few reviews
@@iooz7097 I'm still reading the manual and figuring out how The Liven 8bit warps works. But based on going through some of the preset patterns and patches, it's got a lot of potential. It's gonna take me a while to memorise all the button combos but I reckon once I do, it'll be great.It doesn't have USB so I'm guessing data transfer/backup is either via MIDI or sync (haven't got to that page in the manual yet).
@@dinogoldie9716 thank you for your reply
"Daw in a Box" 100% get a MPC one
Good video, Gabe! 👍 I don't know about you, but I'd have to say
The best groovebox is really the tracks we made along the way. 😇
(I debated whether to put "tracks" or "friends" in that spot, but music production won out. 😂)
Also, if I had to pick one device, I have a positive association with The Circuit and Gabe Miller,
And the Maschine+ is German, so one of those two would probably be what I'd pick out. 😁
That being said, I don't know if a groovebox is really my thing, so I'm just fine with whatever.
Thanks! They're not for everyone, but I'm obsessed.
I was using my friends blackbox and allowed him to sample all my basses and guitars for it one day and showed him my circuit. We kind of traded for a second and I felt the blackbox is the closest thing I ever personally used that felt like a daw in a box. It's pretty rad.
great video man
I love 'DAW-in-a-box'. In my case, I'm focused on building powerful semi-pro field recording / live production equipment that can fit in a few backpacks along with the USB/12V battery bricks that power them (TalentCell makes some great musician bricks, with USB power out, 12VDC in/out, and 9VDC out (use a simple polarity flip cable to power even weirdo reverse-9V instrument connections). I just built a field-case/platform and battery-brick powered PA system for my full-size midi controller keyboard, and I'm looking for the best midi sound module for the keys, that runs on 12V DC barrel-connector power or USB power from not necessarily from a host, but from a USB battery-brick. The Zoom R16 is pretty outstanding for phantom mic inputs and 8 recording and 16 playback/playthrough channels, all on batteries or a (only slightly hard to source) USB-from-12V battery-brick
Thanks for sharing! You mentioned if you were starting from scratch you'd get an Electribe 2 along w/Novation Circuit (now Tracks, NCT). Now that the Novation Circuit Rhythm is out, would you pick E2 plus NCR, or, stick to the E2 w/NCT? I already have an E2, trying to decide between the other two. Thanks!
These days, I'd probably get a Circuit Rhythm and an MPC One if I could only have two.
@@GabeMillerMusic Thank you very quick response, much appreciated! Certainly makes sense. (Been also looking at the Maschine Plus, longer term)
Mpc live II and OP-1 perfect combo.
I just picked up the Live mk1 and have an OP-1. How are you connecting them, and using them together? (if you have time to answer!)
@@pianoyan There's two ways to use them together that both work amazingly well.
First way is to run the OP-1 as a performance piece with the MPC Live. Plug in the OP-1 via USB and a 3.5mm to Dual TS (or whatever you may have) and set the clock out on of the MPC and under tempo on OP-1 set the tempo to sync. I haven't tried phono input, but assume it may send too much signal being that it is a line input. Set the tempo with MPC and then create your loop points on the OP-1 (they will have to be locked to tempo for this). Then if you go to another project with a different tempo the bar marks on the OP-1 will adjust so go to the next available clear loop point and create your next loop points. When you switch sequence and tempo changes the bars adjust, so you have to plan ahead with the OP-1. I usually stop the OP-1 (or fade out) to let the loop points reset the shift + cursor over to the corresponding loop points.
Second way is more production based. I use OP-1 to sketch out songs, usually only 4 tracks with no overdubs with conflicting timbres. Then I put it in Comp mode and use it as a drive more of less. Set up your program and bar lengths on MPC Live and put audio in the MPC's memory in the audio section (Main Screen at the bottom says midi or audio). Edit the samples to get perfect looping on MPC and layer or chop what I have from OP-1. If you or anyone would be interested in a video I'm considering making some videos for gear and could link it here when finished. Like if you would be interested in the process.
@@aaronhostutler Your second method is what I've been considering. I find I come up with ideas on the OP-1 I'd never come up with on any other instrument. It's an inspirational bit of kit. Thanks for your reply, and I'd certainly watch any video featuring the MPC and the OP-1.
I think the basic idea is to never ever produce the „perfect“ self contained groovebox. So we keep on searching and spending ;)
More like the standard for perfect changes as technology gets better. Hence software updates.
@@anupjsebastian Sorry, disagree. I am here for a while and we had really great instruments, RS7000 for example. With the Korg Volcas, limitation is deliberate: Sampler (without third party hacked OS): no chromatic play. (Even Akai S01 und Remix16 have this, polyphonically!). FM (without 3rd party hacked OS): no verlocity via midi (what? DX7 compatible device and no velocity That is THE method of expression), almost no memory slots compared to the hundreds of past groove boxes. I believe, even the "missed" capacitor (makes the stock Volca beats snare unusable) is deliberate. For instant access looping have a look at the SU-700. The samplers could do less and less from generation to generation. The EPS (one of the first affordable samplers) had zones, multisamples, filters, elektron-like startpoint modulation and microtuning)... And Ableton seems to be capable of everything - but does not have that simple but efficient step input method (like old style cubase). Could go on for a while. One great thing about our times is that Behringer uses its wealth now to mass produce the iconic instruments of the past. And that many features that had been standard find their way back into the devices. Etc. That's definitely no linear progress :)
Same with audio interfaces and most things for making music really just find out that my focusrite saffire software will not work after the next mac update so options are either not updating or getting a new interface. cheeky bastards :D
@@elekktrikk_home_video the
Great breakdown. My mouth dropped almost permanently open when I first saw the OP-1. Had to have it. Got it-but for this Logic Pro X head, it was a weird workflow. Then a chance download of the iMaschine OS app and the sound packs that came with that thing 🤯 ...made me buy a Maschine Mikro. I’ve barely touched Logic since. Never been more creatively prolific or produced better sounding stuff. Toyed around with the Circuit, eventually sold it. Wasn’t a live jammer per-se.
So coming from using an 8-track Ensoniq ESQ-1 and all those limitations in the late 80s, now at 53, I don’t know if I’d have the same life if I had these tools back then. You young lucky bastards😂😂😂😂😂😂👍🏽
I share your fascination with the perfect groove box, and the circuit is also my favorite. The Elektron and MC-101 both lack song mode, which is an issue if you play other instruments along with it. The Elektron boxes also really struggle with music that changes keys frequently - no way to easily transpose, like with the circuit. Overall, dig your channel.
Deluge kicks everything else in it’s field in the kisser
You should try the first Electribe EMX-1 with bulbes. New sub by the way!
Hi Gabe.
I am looking in your channel ... i don't find akai force and Roland sp404mk2. I would like to buy and learn to use one of these machines for producing music and for DJ performance (maybe) too.
I have a question for you. Wich one could be the easyier?
I never used any DAW and i only used a jurassic (as i am) a QY700 by Yamaha wich is a gorgeus midi sequencer that i own since 1996 (maybe you was not born yet :-D ).
My answer unfortunately isn't going to be super helpful, because I haven't had the chance to try either yet. I'll get there eventually, but in the meantime, I'd watch some tutorials/demonstrations by others to get an idea of which workflow fits what you're familiar with better. The Force is a bit more DAWlike in general though.
thoughts on apps like gr-16, electrics wave, and drambo
If you wanna get serious about being minimalist with gear, owning multiple groove boxes feels kind of redundant. It sounds like you've written off being able to afford the higher end models but if you sold off and consolidated your rig, I bet you could make it happen.
Something like the MPC X or Maschine+ can do everything those boxes can do, all in one. I know its a huge investment but the muscle memory you build focusing on only one piece of gear is priceless. The value of learning how to really master something is whats been missing in todays GAS filled youtube gear space.
Not that it matters much but I spent 5 years with just the rolland MC-505(back when it was expensive), 6 years with just the DSI Tempest (yes its actually a groovebox trust me) and have recently switched once more. Just saying that I speak as a musician who has performed live exclusively with only 1 premium grovebox at a time for awhile now. Its very rewarding and not as costly as you might think, so as long as your not constantly shifting gear.
Anyways sorry for the long comment. I really enjoyed the video!
Nice video ... I used to have A Groovebox back in the 90’s that is worth checking out if you are able to find one ... the Roland MC303 ... From what I remember it’s the one that started it all ... there was also a Groovesynth range (JX-305 & EG-101)
Currently I still have a MC-808 and a Electribe EM-1 (might be worth looking in to those classics as well)
The Electribe’s from the past were made to all work together since they were similar but different (synth EA-1/ER-1/ES-1)
The closest Groovebox to a full Daw would in my opinion Be the MC-909 but it’s not that portable as units are nowadays
Hey Gabe try the 1010 blackbox i got one its dope
Had them all as well, except for the mc101. My searched stopped when I got an mpc live. 1010 blackbox is close 2nd. 3rd to the opz for extreme portability. Sold my op1 but don't regret it
well, Gabe I’ve watched ~10 of your videos trying to decide between the Circuit, MC101 or Electribe blue, I just want smooth workflow, the ability to make ambient deep drone and low end groove tunes and some more ‘Underworld’ type EDM stuff. I want the world really but NO Daw! Thanks man you’re helping. Cheers from England
Boss/Roland has released something with a clunky workflow? Color me not surprised. Again. Also; great video.
Think of one good sampler sequencer if its your weapon of choice + external effects like the electro harmonix shit.
They make it strong serious.
Great video. The circuit is great but i like your openness to try other instruments. I’m a keys player not previously a drum guy- DX7 (from birth), Motif, MODX, Virus TI, Kronos X, JD Xi, Mininova, Kharma)... So not a drum guy... However, I had a circuit...use launchpad app on the iPad, Reason etc. I have Ableton live 10, Reason 11... But I bought the Akai Force ..updated to OS 3.05. This is a gamechanger. It is now my standalone production hub. I am going to buy an MPC One now too. But I really think give Force a try. You wont regret it. Great workflow but TH-cam helped. Thank you for your videos. Superb.
nice review - the better Electribe was the EMX and for sampling the ESX or SP-404 as a companion
for now the true DAW in a box is the Akai Force with Ableton features (and some cool new update features), 8 tracks of audio (samples/loops/tracks), internal VSTs, full MIDI and CV/gate modular connectivity, 128 MIDI tracks, etc. - lots of stuff - it's big but with a decent case, a 19.6V bpwerbank, and a few accessories it's a true mobile studio
Machine+ and MPC Live or One are close, but the force is pretty impressive
I'm an original Circuit guy too (and Circuit analog companion) so I appreciate your tips and demos - thanks
Elektron Digitakt and Digitone are a perfect combo if you want to get more of that type of stuff - I got one used pristine for cheap and one new with a coupon so the prices weren't bad :-)
my OP-1 finally needs some servicing after 8 years o so but it's great - the OP-Z can be even more fun once you grasp the flow and it's smaller and IMHO more powerful than the OP-1 but I like them both - check out my demos on YT under SynthAddict
have you considered trying out the elektron octotrack ?
If you have a chance than try a used Yamaha RM1x or her bigger sister RS-7000. It is a different workflow which I really like. You can , but it is not a must , have complete songparts as an arrangements which you togggle , sculp and form with mutes , lifeplaying and soundscrewing. really fun. I still have the Rm1x, beside the Circuit, the MonoStation, The model Cycles and Samples and the Electribe. What I really like is NI Maschine because of ebdless Sound and Sample capacities beside of the grafik workflow. Go ahead with your Channel and your really informativ and entertaining videos. I really like it.
Can I connect a MIDI keyboard to the Novation Circuit? I am interested in the Circuit, but I want to be able to expand and use an actual keyboard in my music production.
I only have a Roland MC-101 (and a couple of pocket operators) I don't see a huge issue with the workflow of it. Perhaps it's all the menu diving, it's less organic for playing a live jam?
I think I'd love the Novation Circuit, it just always seemed a bit more limited than the 101. Although I am a complete novice and nowhere near your level.
Great video, as always, Gabe
Great video as always Gabe!
If you are looking for a DAW in a box, try the Maschine+ and let us know your findings 😊
Yeah I'd love to give it a go, hopefully sooner rather than later
Have you tried the original Godfather 'Groovebox' the Roland MC-303?! Cheap as chips and much criticized but where it all started back in 1996.
Elektron Analog Rytm Is the best!!! add the analog 4 and holy wow! I had the op-1 for 6 months and made 4 albums with it. I found it tedious and super limiting, and the effects are way too simplistic. I also didn't like the digital synths on it, so I mostly used samples. The moment I got my Elektron A4 and made 2 songs with it I never wanted to use my op1 ever again, so I sold it and got the Analog rytm, which is even more amazing!!! Now I've made 6 more albums with those 2. Octatrack is next for me...
Polyend Tracker.
Roland Mc 505 was my first groove box. The novation circuit is just ok I guess. It’s kind of a toy like the op1 in my opinion. I find they all have their uses, but the Roland Mc 707 is my personal favorite. Never used the electribe, might have to check it out sometime. Don’t care for DAW’s either, but you kind of need them for the end product I guess. Everyone’s different with what setup works for them. My advise is go with setting up your gear as ergonomic as possible, and try out a bunch of different Riggs. Connecting a midi keyboard to a groove box is a great way to get the most out of it.
Yeah it's definitely subjective, and different people like different setups. Personally I'm still very attached to the Circuit's interface and the MC-101's feature set, so I reach for them often, and I typically prefer stuff that's entirely self contained. I will say, I have no problem with DAWs and use them all the time, but at this point, I'm pretty attached to the hands on stuff. It's fun.
EMX 1 I miss it dearly.
I have emx1 and esx1 with rotten buttons and there are no replacement and im really sad about as they Still my favorite toys
I also started with the Circuit. But although it's indeed a design wonder a tons of fun, I never finished a track with it. Then I got the Electribe Sampler, and everything changed. It is clunky and crappy and too linear and none of its parts/functions is particularly special, but somehow it all works together in a super flexible and useful way and it I spires me so much more than the otherwise immediate circuit. But I agree that there is no perfect groovebox, they are all limited. But that makes them wonderful, I a way.
Yeah I did a whole video on how groovebox limitations helped me improve as a producer. And I definitely agree that while the Electribe can seem clunky, it's actually pretty damn fluid. I still make the most full songs on the Circuit though.
Sounds like you need to try the roland 707! From what I've seen it looks very "daw in a box".
Machine mk 3? Not completely stand alone but you can use it without touching your mouse/keyboard, except for adding plugins and samples... I think? I have the circuit tracks and still have not gotten the whole scenes or making more than one sequence on each instrument. Been thinking about the machine mk3 but I love singing so I might actually order the Roland vt-4 soon.
Oh, have you ever looked at the kaos pads? The 2 devices seem pretty cool, especially the mini 2s with an sd card, sampler and effects.
I haven't looked in to Kaos Pads, but I've done a few videos with the Maschine Mikro super recently (and some stuff with the Maschine+ before that).
I also did a video on advanced Circuit Tracks tips if you want to learn scenes and more specific stuff.
Oh, I thought you said you didn't have maschine plus cause they're too much money. I follow all the tracks videos, just haven't gotten into the hardware enough to fully get it I guess. Just ordered vt-4 so I plan using tracks for drums at least.
I had the Maschine+ on loan, and I could afford to buy it at this point, but it's hard to justify or recommend because it's a bit underpowered for how much it costs. It's some of the most fun I've had making music recently though, so I might pull the trigger on one at some point.
Hey
There’s a few oldskool groove boxes that hold there weight.
Yamaha dx200s or An200s. Rolands Mc series, 303, 909’s. Just to name a few.
at the moment it seems they're all quite well but none of them tick all the boxes for me. Meanwhile I like the circuit's workflow and quick response time best, but I'm also frustrated with the lack of channels for instruments on it. The way things stand at the moment, It's kind of a "make due with several grooveboxes" situation and that kind of sucks.
There will be new Novation Circuits coming. And behringer is also making their own groovebox they said.
For me, it's the Novation Circuit, Deluge 3, and OP-1. I love making music with these machines. I wish Electron would come out with an Octatrack MK3 because that would tie everything together (including my effect pedals) with its 4 inputs and cue output.
I dont have a groovebox and the closest thing would be my Yamaha QY700 sequencer...I have standalone samplers as well,like the Roland MV8800,etc...If I had to try a groovebox style,it would probably be the Polyend Tracker,Iridium,or something open ended like those..I like to go into unchartered areas with gear.
The problem with DAWs is keyboard and mouse or IPad. DAWless means sliders and knobs. The representation of some movements on computers and iPads is just not natural enough. So I get it that there are TH-cam channels for making music without a DAW.
what about digitakt?
Hm! Polyend Tracker?
MC-707 is the answer
Hey! Love these. Totally different type of device, but have you looked at Polyend's tracker hardware? It's tooootally different and supremely exciting to me.
Thanks! The Tracker is on my long list of stuff to try out, although I'll admit what I've seen of the interface is kinda intimidating
@@GabeMillerMusic Gosh it seems that way at first but honestly I started with trackers before moving to a visual DAW and part of me misses the decidedly nonvisual simplicity. What I mean is that you begin to focus more on what *sounds* right instead of what *looks* right. Granted, I love colorful buttons and the sheer raw aesthetic of modern music production, but I wonder if this little box might make it easier for me - and maybe you? - to make music that's crafted purely for an aural, nonvisual experience. Plus, as a sequencer engine and live tool it seems pretty amazingly powerful for the dollars.
I've went through so many grooveboxes. Starting with the MC-808.Then Electribe 2, Circuit, MC101, Digitakt, OP-Z, MCP Live, Deluge. I'm currently settled on the Akai force. It does everything the others do, plus much more. Unfortunately the Akai devices are always considered as the "hip hop producer's" groovebox. I liked the MPC live, but i was missing direct controls (more buttons) and a modern "clip" based workflow rather than a linear sequence1,2,3...x type of workflow. So i can recommend that, it's big, but solid, has great workflow, you can do songs but also perform them and configure your performance in insane detail.
From the grooveboxes i tested i would say the Circuit is possibly the best for a beginner, the workflow is just genius. For a pocketable powerhouse i would probably go with the OP-Z. The sequencer with step components is insane.
Good luck on your quest! Cheers.
The Akai force over the deluge?!? That’s blasphemous sir! Deluge has clip based and linear sequencing. Is there a gas leak in this comment section?!?
@@modularmountain3910 Same reason why people drive different cars... There's no perfect car and there's no perfect groovebox. The Force just fits me better. For some it's the Deluge, for other the mc707, mpc live or even an old rs7000.
@@Maochan81 can’t argue with that explanation. I guess it just depends on your preferences. I have seen people write amazing sets on an MC303 or even using a dozen cassette players to play samples. I just thought I’d state my opinion since the title of the video is “The Search For The Best Groovebox” and I felt one of the best wasn’t represented. For me grooveboxes have always been my go-to box to grab for writing electronic music, even though the term groovebox seems pretty ambiguous.
should have tried the electribe emx1. or just done all elektron. digitone/octatrack/cycles. elektron has the best sequencer of any of these. and usually most innovative, fun, and nice sounding engines and workflows
You should try Jomox Alpha Base
I have been checking the mc 101 since a couple of days. Should I get it?
Analog Rytm, bout to make a track right now. Also Akai is making some crazy boxes right now. They might as well be DAWs
Yeah I'm hoping to give some Akai stuff a go eventually!
Thanks Gabe ,,,, being a guitar player we always for me need inspiration to get THE groooove going,, bought a wk-7600 casio thinking it had a lot of whistles and bells, next came the korg volcano drum , microfreak and lastly as of today ,,, I went with the model samples. Where's the music ? Learning cure verses inspiration can become a culdashac,,, SP. Good luck in your quest ,,, it for me has taken the bite out of quarantine . I don't mind to much. Ha ! Keep your work flow Rolling Thanks. SLEEPY BLIND IRRESPONSIBLE HOUND DOG SHADDIX
Op-1 is the ting
You must look at Dualo….. It's a innovative french product. Very powerful
How about mpc one?
It looks great, it's definitely one I want to try at some point in the future
Elektron Digitakt... 🔥
isnt the new maschine a DAW in a box?
Yeah, it's next on my list of things to try!
I'd like the Octatrack mk2
mpc live ?
Roland mc707
Deluge is by far one of the best boxes out there!
emx1 dude all day long
Nice groovedog.
My advice is avoid boxes that try to be a groovebox with a sequencer + sounds + fx. You will buy 3 of them anyway and end up menu diving with 3 mediocre sequencers which you cannot remember how to operate, and 3 redundant and mediocre fx. Buy a dedicated sequencer, dedicated sound sources, dedicated fx. Now you have 3 things that are less confusing and really good at what they do and you can try to create a song instead of pattern.
Any advice for cheap beginner setup?
@@StaryFanRocka mobile apps there’s some free ones
You need an AKAI Force.
Literal DAW in a box too much to ask? MPC just entered the chat.
Yeah since I made this video, I tried a bunch more stuff, and the MPC One has become one of my favorites.