The Lord of the Rings: The Rings of Power is back this time with cast interviews and the latest news of season 2. With Ismael Cruz Cordova giving an interview about the on set arrangements that had to be made to enable the cast to cope with the people Hollywood dislikes the most, THE FANS! You would think after Season 1, they would have taken stock of the marketing, learnt from the mistakes, and come back with a new plan. NOPE. Instead we double down, repeat the same points and see if doing the same things, leads to the same results every time. It's a brave plan, lets see if it pays off. I thought for this round up, I'd go back to one of my favourite introductions that I've made, but with a different "story" in the clips, alongside new clips from the cast interviews. But do you think Amazon can save Rings of Power with sufficient changes, or will it just be more of the same? Let me know your thoughts below and as always, thanks for watching :)
I think having more women behind the camera will definitely save RoP - only a group of bitter middle-aged feminists could fully bring out the emotional depths of faux-Galadriel’s constipation!
I could not give a shit tbh, Lord of The Rings isnt the most important thing in my life. Just like Superman and Spiderman and whatever my fav TH-camrs are obsessed with. Im out I dont fucking care anymore.
Ohhhh dearie dearie dearie. There is so much going on behind the scenes… Ever hear of Tikkun Olam? Ever hear if Qabbalah?? Madonna? Zohar, esoteric mysticism? And soooo much more that can’t be said, written, etc. everything those fools say is rooted to the aforementioned. Do your homework people!!
Btw, the ‘double down’ tactic is right out of BHO ‘Barry’s’ playbook. Not that he wrote but was handed a book in a little living room in an affluent Chicago burb ( pop. 28k+ due west). Dearheart, these creatures are involved in stuff the normal human cannot imagine much less engage. That’s why they need ‘therapy’- pure ‘live’ see mirror. The opposite of living. Their souls have already descended. Sadly this is no joke.
Agreed! These activists have the audacity to tell the true fans what's wrong with Tolkien's masterpiece!! If you don't like the story, go find another one - you don't change the lore!!
Martin’s premise is fundamentally disingenuous. People aren’t fans of brands, but of artists and writers. How popular would Hamlet 2 be without Shakespeare? He should know this himself since game of thrones tv show went downhill when it diverged from the books.
Yeah george, like imagine if I said "handjob fans hate getting punched in the balls. I don't understand it." Just cause they both involve hands and nads don't mean they're the same.
Yeah, I'm sure George would deny that if you like something then that means you would enjoy every single piece of fanfic about it... but that's exactly what he was saying we should do for RoP.
This is another problem with the west... See, you guys bring innovations to the world, but the rubbish you bring along, the lack of culture and the bad reeducation that comes along is making your technology counterproductive, like you guys are more harm than good... What the hell do you mean you can't date your friend's daughter??? Are you saying if you befriend your stepdad, you have to get a divorce or are you saying the only time you can date your friend's daughter is if you met her before you befriended him??? I think they're mistaken in what is creepy about dating your friend's daughter because they don't have friends or daughters or families or brains so they can't figure it out... The only time we would see that as creepy is if our friends are the same age as us so their daughters are way way younger than us, young enough to be your own daughter, not because she's the daughter of your friend, this is so freaking obvious... Galadriel is thousands of years old and elrond should be barely 500 years old considering they're just forging the ring... What the hell are they talking about... It's their own fault for not making elrond look way younger than that and celebrien already born... They made elrond look the same age if not older than galadriel because they're not well read enough on Tolkien's lore that they don't even know there's an age difference and a considerable one at that... When elrond becomes 550, celebrien would look more than old enough to be his age mate because they grow normally but stop aging when they reach their peak, we know this because of elrond and elros in the lore with elros helping us see how a human would grow beside an elf, elrond and they're twins so you can easily compare the age... Elros and elrond grew the same way until elrond stopped aging at the peak of youth and since elros died a very wrinkled old man at the age of five hundred, 50-70 years should be when elves stop aging when we compare them to numenorians the second longest living race in middle earth so what the hell is creepy there in it... Galadriel should be way older celeborn I think, I can't recall... That's not considered creepy...
@@johnnycrown5097 Elrond would have already been over a thousand years old when they started forging rings. Annatar first appeared around Year 1200 of the Second Age
I think the point is, fans don't hate what they once loved, I love the LOTR and always will. What fans disdain is the shoddy, disrespectful, boring swill that we are told is even better than the original. Can't fool me, I can read and watch far better portrayals, I can even see interviews with JRR Tolkein himself. So some Hollywoke, narcissistic child is not going to convince me they know Middle Earth better than the man himself.
Certainly doesn’t seem like something the guy who wrote a phone book of fantasy would say, but perhaps he’s not that same guy anymore. Would certainly explain why he can’t finish his book series.
He asked “Why aren’t people who call themselves fans watching the show?” Then followed that up with “If you don’t like the show don’t watch it.” Whiplash 101
Not an actual quote from Tolkien. Kind of a poorly worded version of something he did point out a lot, though. "The Shadow that bred them can only mock, it cannot make: not real new things of its own." and other statements he *did* actually put out.
@@marcelzocker947 While it is true that the core of the sentence stays the same, the use of quotation marks would imply this is word for word what J.R.R Tolkien stated. A better way at presenting the quote if they themselves did not remember the exact thing he said would be: J.R.R Tolkien once mentioned that evil Cannot Create Anything new, they can only corrupt and ruin good forces have invented or made. I hope this comment helped you in some manner and taught you some new. If not, then I am sorry that I wasted your time, have a wonderful day 😊
I managed about 10 minutes of it before falling asleep. And that was after I already got annoyed by the little Galadriel, her pseudo-philosophic brother, and Morfydd Clark's terrible narration.
The whole Amazon messing with the reviews was hugely entertaining. Didn't watch, but loved the comedy of 2 hacks who never sold a script being put in charge modernizing Tolkien.
Indeed. Never watched the actual series, but I looked forward every week to the reviews of it. Gary/Nerdrotic always did a review stream right after each new episode finished, and I was there waiting for each one
This is another problem with the west... See, you guys bring innovations to the world, but the rubbish you bring along, the lack of culture and the bad reeducation that comes along is making your technology counterproductive, like you guys are more harm than good... What the hell do you mean you can't date your friend's daughter??? Are you saying if you befriend your stepdad, you have to get a divorce or are you saying the only time you can date your friend's daughter is if you met her before you befriended him??? I think they're mistaken in what is creepy about dating your friend's daughter because they don't have friends or daughters or families or brains so they can't figure it out... The only time we would see that as creepy is if our friends are the same age as us so their daughters are way way younger than us, young enough to be your own daughter, not because she's the daughter of your friend, this is so freaking obvious... Galadriel is thousands of years old and elrond should be barely 500 years old considering they're just forging the ring... What the hell are they talking about... It's their own fault for not making elrond look way younger than that and celebrien already born... They made elrond look the same age if not older than galadriel because they're not well read enough on Tolkien's lore that they don't even know there's an age difference and a considerable one at that... When elrond becomes 550, celebrien would look more than old enough to be his age mate because they grow normally but stop aging when they reach their peak, we know this because of elrond and elros in the lore with elros helping us see how a human would grow beside an elf, elrond and they're twins so you can easily compare the age... Elros and elrond grew the same way until elrond stopped aging at the peak of youth and since elros died a very wrinkled old man at the age of five hundred, 50-70 years should be when elves stop aging when we compare them to numenorians the second longest living race in middle earth so what the hell is creepy there in it... Galadriel should be way older celeborn I think, I can't recall... That's not considered creepy...
"The opposite of love isn't hate, it's apathy." You'd think he'd understand, given how many people loved Game of Thrones, and how so many of them were furious about the lackluster ending to that series.
That old man is George R.R. Martin author of the Game of Thrones series. But you're 100 percent right. We don't watch this stuff anymore because its been gang raped by wokeness.
“Even if it’s a failure, the outside world may never know.” I actually laughed out loud. What a ridiculous statement. As if we didn’t see how bad it was. The Emperor has no clothes.
'Maybe no one will see or hear that this thing we made was really bad.' What you mean whis TV show? The type of thing that you see and hear and that's all it is?
@@sayLeotardbutsayitChinese it’s like they think, if no one tells us it’s bad, we won’t know. Though, to be fair, no one watched it, so maybe they’re right. Lol
@Michael Talpas they think that everyone else needs to be told what to do like them... I mean they hired dozens of people to tell them how to ruin a classic when a random fan online would direct the whole show for free and actually make money
0:20 - Mr. Martin, the problem is not that the the fans do not like Star Trek anymore, the problem is that the people who make Star Trek nowadays don´t like Star Trek. Same goes for series like The Witcher, Dr. Who etc.
I bet he would have understood if they made Ned Stark out to be some ahole then had his wife be a person of color who then is the one who unites the 7 kingdoms and kills the lead white walker. All the while she spouts how she's the only one who suffers and is strong enough to do so.
"As filmmakers, as writers, we had no interest whatsoever in putting our junk our baggage into these movies. We just thought we should take what Tolkien cared about clearly, we should take those and put them into the film. This should ultimately be Tolkien's film; it shouldn't be ours" -- Peter Jackson about Lord of the Rings
And then we have the modern version - "As talentless narcissistic hacks, we wanted to pervert... oops... subvert what other people loved, by making it all about us, instead."
Can’t believe George Martin is speaking in good faith! Hey, George, the reason Star Trek fans hate today’s Star Trek is that the cretins making today’s Star Trek hate Star Trek (and Star Trek fans)! Mystery solved, George!
Everytime I hear Ms. Potato repeat "First female dwarf of color." I wish someone would ask her "But what are her character traits? What is she like? What immersed you into the role?" I would love to see her confused face as she repeats "Female. Brown."
And it’s not even true either… other stuff done decades ago still exists. Just coz THEY chose to ignore older films and shows doesn’t mean they invented the wheel
In fact, there are black or in this terms PoC dwarven in the Germanic mythology: Svartalf, or German: Schwarzelben/-elfen. Because to understand Middle Earth more, we should recognise that Elven in the Germanic mythology are in fact a certain type of dwarven people.
And fat. Which shows the hypocrisy, because if they really wanted to subvert it all, and represent invisible demographics of society, they should have cast a fat, plain Galadriel. Now that would show those pesky, racist, sexist, fatist fans that they so love to hate. Wouldn't surprise me if they hadn't actually thought about, given the level of contempt they've shown to Tolkien, his work and those who love it.
This reminds me of Viggo Mortensen when he repeatedly got injured on set (broken tooth during Helm's Deep, the broken toe when he kicked the orc helm), yet he carried on, stayed in character and never let the audience know something was wrong with him as a person. Now we have "actors" who apparently struggle to perform because there's too many voices criticizing them.
I can promise you, none of these actors would break a tooth and just keep going. They'd cause a two week set break because they needed to get flown across the world to a specialist.
While we can all agree on how legendary is Viggo Mortensen, he never faced the type of pressure the actors of the rings of power had to face... Back in '97, the main pressure was on Peter Jackson being a young director spending 300M$ in 2 years to make 3 movies... That was the only thing people would judge beforehand. Nowadays, with vloggers, youtube, social media... We start b*itching about movies that aren't even made yet. Actors, if they pay attention to the media (and it's extremely hard not to), are under much more pressure and critics than before. That's a fact... But that's also why, at that level, they're paid extremely well...
@@dragonballistheway Those snowflakes do not feel any pressure cause they think they are alphas and omegas. They think they know everything the best and everything they do is perfect.
I don't consider people who need themselves to be seen "Actors".... Actors are supposed to hide themselves and become the character, not the other way around.
Actors playing the characters they’re suppose to act as what is this nonsense. Don’t you know that if you don’t have diversity even if it doesn’t make sense a brakes the lore your film is racist. People have to see themselves in every film/franchise or they can’t understand what said character is going through and how they feel. Cause you know it’s not about making characters that are relatable or characters that are easily recognizable to their book counter parts. Now it’s all about making sure we hit the diversity quota so that people can see themselves in movies even if the character doesn’t fit. You just gotta think about it as us fixing the mistakes of the past and a grand redressing of things. Who needs good relatable characters when you have the power of DIVERSITY!!!! (Opens a bottle of bleach and drinks the whole thing because of how dumb “modern” storytelling is)
they really moved away from what an actor is and expected everyone to like it if i want to watch how the actor actually is i'll just watch a documentary
And even if it makes it through, a lot of prestablished characters would get the George R.R. Treatment and get get out of the script. Since none of those characters are Tolkien’s, even those with names from Tolkien’s work, it could do no harm for they stopped showing up.
I don't understand why this idea is so foreign to so many people. I've lost track of the restaurants I used to love until they changed owners. New recipes, cheaper ingredients, smaller portions, and higher prices. And usually closed within a year of the ownership change. Nobody blamed the patrons for the failure just because the name didn't change.
Great analogy. We see it all the time, if you don't supply what the customers want they will go elsewhere. Strangely insulting the customers is not an effective way of winning their trust and custom who knew??
“How could people come to hate something they liked?” Bold words from the man who had a show based on his own books that went belly up in the last season 😂
Yes true but he finally finished the last got book so soon we will be able to read HIS ending of this epic story and then we can all forget this insultingly disapointing end the producers of the show threw at us🙌🏻🙌🏻
@@clemenskuhn4943 Finished the last book? He still writing Winds of Winter, no? It's not finished. And then there is A Dream of Spring, which would be the last one.
@@clemenskuhn4943the last got book? You mean the ONE BOOK that's called game of thrones in the series a song of ice and fire? Man you don't even know what you're talking about and you call yourself a fan lmao
He doesn't understand how people come to hate something they once loved? Well, imagine you really love Oranges, and then you get presented with a Lemon with the word 'Orange' written on it with Magic Marker. And the person who gave it to you get all pissy because you make a face as you bite into it.
Now it's pretty much become: Every time you ask for an orange you get one of these lemons. They keep telling you they are the most delicious oranges they've ever tasted, but you remember the taste of true oranges and this isn't it. Then they tell you that you must've never appreciated oranges in the first place or that you have bad taste.
…and… I’ve been going to this place for a long time, because they had great oranges, and now they do not. Down the lane, there is another place that has great oranges. It’s ok to go there instead, right?
Remember, the behind-the-scenes footage from LOTR? How there was such camaraderie and fun between the cast, including the stunt people and the crew and the designers and everything? 🥰Now imagine what it's like on ROP's set with this bunch of "I'm the most important being on earth" no-name actors and actresses. 🥴
Rings of Prime have therapists instead of fun and friendship. Because it was never a joint project to put up the writers vision. It was all about me and my representation.
@@slimbombur7922 you are exactly right! It’s really interesting how none of them have achieved fame in their careers, but their egos are gigantic for some reason. “ I got the job because of my skin color“ is not something I would really brag about. I would feel ashamed in the same way I felt when in my late teens, my team won a participation trophy for finishing last in the tournament. It was a fresh new concept back then. I threw the trophy in the trash because they were not recyclable and also, I never wanted to see that thing again. 😂 Even she-hulk resented being hired by her new law firm only because she was a superhero.
How can one sit there and tell me I no longer love Lord of the Rings? I was in the damn theatre when the films ended. I have watched them every year since 2003 with my family. It is eternally etched onto my memory and the characters, words, moments and journeys have shaped me into the person I am today. The impact that the films have had on me is an understatement. The love I have for the characters and world of Middle Earth will be with me forever. Unlike this piece of shit tv show.
This is another problem with the west... See, you guys bring innovations to the world, but the rubbish you bring along, the lack of culture and the bad reeducation that comes along is making your technology counterproductive, like you guys are more harm than good... What the hell do you mean you can't date your friend's daughter??? Are you saying if you befriend your stepdad, you have to get a divorce or are you saying the only time you can date your friend's daughter is if you met her before you befriended him??? I think they're mistaken in what is creepy about dating your friend's daughter because they don't have friends or daughters or families or brains so they can't figure it out... The only time we would see that as creepy is if our friends are the same age as us so their daughters are way way younger than us, young enough to be your own daughter, not because she's the daughter of your friend, this is so freaking obvious... Galadriel is thousands of years old and elrond should be barely 500 years old considering they're just forging the ring... What the hell are they talking about... It's their own fault for not making elrond look way younger than that and celebrien already born... They made elrond look the same age if not older than galadriel because they're not well read enough on Tolkien's lore that they don't even know there's an age difference and a considerable one at that... When elrond becomes 550, celebrien would look more than old enough to be his age mate because they grow normally but stop aging when they reach their peak, we know this because of elrond and elros in the lore with elros helping us see how a human would grow beside an elf, elrond and they're twins so you can easily compare the age... Elros and elrond grew the same way until elrond stopped aging at the peak of youth and since elros died a very wrinkled old man at the age of five hundred, 50-70 years should be when elves stop aging when we compare them to numenorians the second longest living race in middle earth so what the hell is creepy there in it... Galadriel should be way older celeborn I think, I can't recall... That's not considered creepy...
Yes! Just because i'm fed a bad piece of pie doesn't mean i suddenly hate all pies. It just means i hate these exact pies from this exact bakery. I still love pies in general. Disney's SW was the biggest let down for me, but i still went and got a Star Wars tattoo. Because i love Star Wars, and everything that does make it great enough to ink it into my skin permanently. It's ridiculous hearing JRRM say that.
The LOTR trilogy was lightning in a bottle. I cant imagine we will see anything as good as those for a long time. For me, as a person who saw the original SW in the cinema and has a very very large place in my heart for those 3 films the LOTR trilogy has surpassed them to my number 1 spot. Its not just because i love Tolkiens books so much, its much more than that. The love, the sweat, the talent, the effort etc... that went into them is apparent on every single frame of all three films. I dont even consider "Rings of Power" to be Tolkien tbh. Its just trash. What they did to all the characters (especially Galadriel) is unforgivable. They turned her from a strong, kind, wise, beautiful, amazing character with wonderful back story to a hateful, insane, dumb, just awful woman. Its a shame that so many people who watched that show will come away thinking thats what Galadriel was like in the books. Far from it. She was played and portrayed IMPECCABLY by Blanchet the original LOTR trilogy.
Bro I'm a hardcore star wars fan but it shouldn't even be a point of discussion. LOTR trilogy is LEAGUES better that Star Wars. I don't think that there's even one trilogy that comes close to LOTR, either I haven't watched it or I don't know it exists
@@giuseppesagona7522The original Star Wars were great while the prequels had their place. It's the sequels that turned people sour to the story and could have been skipped.
It should say something that when a show doesn’t have an effect on fans, I watched rings of power through only once and thankfully it didn’t stick with me enough to change and negatively impact how I see the true characters tolkien made
Massive loss of respect for G.R.R Martin. How can he not understand that fundamentally changing the thing we love, turns it into something we dont love? He seems to genuinely believe fans are supposed to be blindly loyal, rather than fan loyalty being something you have to maintain by giving them more of and expanding what they love.
Loyalty has to be earned. I don't get this writers' audacity to expect unconditional loyalty. Why? Something you love has a reason it's being loved. If that reason disappears, so does the love. Especially if it turns into the opposite.
This is another problem with the west... See, you guys bring innovations to the world, but the rubbish you bring along, the lack of culture and the bad reeducation that comes along is making your technology counterproductive, like you guys are more harm than good... What the hell do you mean you can't date your friend's daughter??? Are you saying if you befriend your stepdad, you have to get a divorce or are you saying the only time you can date your friend's daughter is if you met her before you befriended him??? I think they're mistaken in what is creepy about dating your friend's daughter because they don't have friends or daughters or families or brains so they can't figure it out... The only time we would see that as creepy is if our friends are the same age as us so their daughters are way way younger than us, young enough to be your own daughter, not because she's the daughter of your friend, this is so freaking obvious... Galadriel is thousands of years old and elrond should be barely 500 years old considering they're just forging the ring... What the hell are they talking about... It's their own fault for not making elrond look way younger than that and celebrien already born... They made elrond look the same age if not older than galadriel because they're not well read enough on Tolkien's lore that they don't even know there's an age difference and a considerable one at that... When elrond becomes 550, celebrien would look more than old enough to be his age mate because they grow normally but stop aging when they reach their peak, we know this because of elrond and elros in the lore with elros helping us see how a human would grow beside an elf, elrond and they're twins so you can easily compare the age... Elros and elrond grew the same way until elrond stopped aging at the peak of youth and since elros died a very wrinkled old man at the age of five hundred, 50-70 years should be when elves stop aging when we compare them to numenorians the second longest living race in middle earth so what the hell is creepy there in it... Galadriel should be way older celeborn I think, I can't recall... That's not considered creepy...
He is a decent writer when it comes to GoT, but that's it. His other work is average, his personality is average and his ideology lies with the left and libtards. GRRM is the Trump of literature lol he does good work, but he is a shitty person.
I am PuertoRican, raised in the mountains, and I never wished to change anything about something I DID NOT CREATE. Oh yeah, I am also a Tolkien fan. Did I imagine myself playing a dwarf working the mines and ending the day shift to go home and inhaled 6 pints? Sure, but that's my fan fiction😂.
This is another problem with the west... See, you guys bring innovations to the world, but the rubbish you bring along, the lack of culture and the bad reeducation that comes along is making your technology counterproductive, like you guys are more harm than good... What the hell do you mean you can't date your friend's daughter??? Are you saying if you befriend your stepdad, you have to get a divorce or are you saying the only time you can date your friend's daughter is if you met her before you befriended him??? I think they're mistaken in what is creepy about dating your friend's daughter because they don't have friends or daughters or families or brains so they can't figure it out... The only time we would see that as creepy is if our friends are the same age as us so their daughters are way way younger than us, young enough to be your own daughter, not because she's the daughter of your friend, this is so freaking obvious... Galadriel is thousands of years old and elrond should be barely 500 years old considering they're just forging the ring... What the hell are they talking about... It's their own fault for not making elrond look way younger than that and celebrien already born... They made elrond look the same age if not older than galadriel because they're not well read enough on Tolkien's lore that they don't even know there's an age difference and a considerable one at that... When elrond becomes 550, celebrien would look more than old enough to be his age mate because they grow normally but stop aging when they reach their peak, we know this because of elrond and elros in the lore with elros helping us see how a human would grow beside an elf, elrond and they're twins so you can easily compare the age... Elros and elrond grew the same way until elrond stopped aging at the peak of youth and since elros died a very wrinkled old man at the age of five hundred, 50-70 years should be when elves stop aging when we compare them to numenorians the second longest living race in middle earth so what the hell is creepy there in it... Galadriel should be way older celeborn I think, I can't recall... That's not considered creepy...
>>A lot of people who watched the LoTR movies didn't actually read the books, but they were enamoured by them and bought the books. That's a sign of how good these movies were. >>Viggo Mortensen who played Aragorn back then was brought at the last minute after the previous actor was out. He was older than the previous actor and didn't have the same prep, but he did his due diligence to get in character, and he was brilliant. Compared to someone like that black elf actor from *_"Dungs of Pawah"_* who just talks about himself and how it affects him, you see yet another reason why Jackson's LoTR won the hearts of many. >>Peter Jackson himself knew he took some creative libeties with the story to fit them into movies, but he stayed true to the Tolkien spirit, and that's another reason the movies were good. An adaptation can differ from the source material, but they can still be good and respectful. Rings of Power changes without any respect, with only the intention of parading idenity politics and satisfying egoes and personal agendas. There's no spirit or spark in this series; it's just Dung.
That's what I love about Peter Jackson's work. He genuinely cared about the source material and did as much as he could be faithful to it while also making a good movie (more like the best trilogy ever produced). People are willing to excuse omissions and tweaks in the story because we know why and respect the why. The same cannot nor ever will be said about the RoP.
Peter Jackson was very clear when he started making the movies that he would leave politics out of it. And thats one of the biggest decissions that made the trilogy so succesfull. It dropped of with the hobbit series and crashed and burned with the ROP series. Funny how that works. A fantasy world where we want to got to to escape normal life turned into just having normal life politics and gender idiology trown into our faces and peopel wonder why it failed or GRR martin not understanding why we dont love what we used to love anymore. And he saying dont watch it is axactly what we are doing.
Viggo Mortensen was brilliant as Aragorn. I'll admit I only knew him as Masterchief from GI Jane at the time and didn't know he was brought in last minute but I can't think of any actor who could play that role better
Furthermore, PJ made sure that everyone who worked with him were also appreciative and respectful to the material. I think nearly all the key personnel have read the books at least once and many of them had the books on hand whilst on set.
As a huge fan of wheel of time, I grew up reading the books on the 90s and reread each book as they came out. So when the show came out it was so horrific. It hurt. I can’t explain.
It's always amazing when they say they've never seen a mythological creature that looks like them. Maybe they should separate reality from fantasy and stop trying to insert themselves into something they didn't create.
Every culture and race has fairy tales, myths, and legends. Instead of saying I'm not represented in the ones already out there why not find the ones you are and bring them to the big or small screen. Audiences would love to see new content
Fk'n Monkeys that think *what* they are is *who* they are. Because that's how un-evolved they are. Wisdom: "Luminous beings are we, not this crude matter." Ignorance: "I just wanna see someone who looks like me!" So you only deem a story worthy if the characters ethnically resemble you? Well, gee, who's the fk'n racist now?!
@@justinm2697no They're saying they haven't seen a black mythological creature. Like fairies and fawns, they look white and have been represented as such, right? Well they haven't seen a creature that can and has been represented as black. They're proud African Americans, but are not willing to look up on some African mythos, instead they want to insert into European ones.
I never understood self insert. I never looked at disney princesses (for example) and think, ah that looks like me so i can relate. As a little girl my favourite character was Pocahontas and guess what i am not native to america yet i found her very inspiring. Hiw can we relate to any of the toys from Toys Story? None of us are a plastic dinasour and yet it’s a timeless classic. Almost as if (most) people relate to emotions and not necessarily looks.
This is another problem with the west... See, you guys bring innovations to the world, but the rubbish you bring along, the lack of culture and the bad reeducation that comes along is making your technology counterproductive, like you guys are more harm than good... What the hell do you mean you can't date your friend's daughter??? Are you saying if you befriend your stepdad, you have to get a divorce or are you saying the only time you can date your friend's daughter is if you met her before you befriended him??? I think they're mistaken in what is creepy about dating your friend's daughter because they don't have friends or daughters or families or brains so they can't figure it out... The only time we would see that as creepy is if our friends are the same age as us so their daughters are way way younger than us, young enough to be your own daughter, not because she's the daughter of your friend, this is so freaking obvious... Galadriel is thousands of years old and elrond should be barely 500 years old considering they're just forging the ring... What the hell are they talking about... It's their own fault for not making elrond look way younger than that and celebrien already born... They made elrond look the same age if not older than galadriel because they're not well read enough on Tolkien's lore that they don't even know there's an age difference and a considerable one at that... When elrond becomes 550, celebrien would look more than old enough to be his age mate because they grow normally but stop aging when they reach their peak, we know this because of elrond and elros in the lore with elros helping us see how a human would grow beside an elf, elrond and they're twins so you can easily compare the age... Elros and elrond grew the same way until elrond stopped aging at the peak of youth and since elros died a very wrinkled old man at the age of five hundred, 50-70 years should be when elves stop aging when we compare them to numenorians the second longest living race in middle earth so what the hell is creepy there in it... Galadriel should be way older celeborn I think, I can't recall... That's not considered creepy...
Martin nailed the problem if it weren't for a complete lack of self awareness: "They loved it, we changed it and now they hate it.. how can you hate what you once loved, I mean, what the hell?!"
Because they twisted it to the point not only it requires reconstructive surgery. They also broke it's soul. For the sake of a "modern audience" that didn't watch it.
also wasnt it Martin himselve shitting on the GOT series when he did not finished his books fast enough they took liberty with the story and then complain they ended GOT in a way he would never write it and now he still has not finished the last book out of spite? Such hypocrite. So GOT makers should have stayed true to his story, but the rest can alter everything and everything without fans allowed to complain everything they once loved is changed? What gives him the sole right to complain about showrunners liberal changes in established stories?
@@ronniebots9225 Clear case of "rules for thee, not for me" entitlement. It's the financial success, embracing commercial exploitation of one's creativity and the back patting inside the Hollywood bubble I suppose. Of course it must be hard to stomach that your best work is behind you, especially with the pressure of the industry to repeat it, let alone top it.
@Hansy I ment to say nothing bad, I hardly know the man and he seems a legit creative mind. It's probably more the industry that feeds ego's to milk their output.
@@ronniebots9225 yep, I love that shit bag like I love crabs. What an asshat, let's do games and shows instead of finishing your story that people are going to die before they can finish it.
@@fleetstreet11 no. It’s the problem of the producers of this series wondering why it’s not being watched and won’t be. Galadriel in the second age had cooled her passions that led to participating in the kin slaying. By the second she was wiser and not a rash by Tolkiens description. The one in Rings of Power took no council with anyone and was simply a hot head.
The backlash this show continues to ignore and shift blame will always be laughable. Any other show with this much negativity and lack of viewership would have been cancelled. They can't let this show fail, but instead make it worse. This bonfire is getting better and better.
@@Sombre____ English write you not this do well. Did you pass that comment through a paper shredder before mangling it with google translate, or is your brain really that badly wired?!?
This is another problem with the west... See, you guys bring innovations to the world, but the rubbish you bring along, the lack of culture and the bad reeducation that comes along is making your technology counterproductive, like you guys are more harm than good... What the hell do you mean you can't date your friend's daughter??? Are you saying if you befriend your stepdad, you have to get a divorce or are you saying the only time you can date your friend's daughter is if you met her before you befriended him??? I think they're mistaken in what is creepy about dating your friend's daughter because they don't have friends or daughters or families or brains so they can't figure it out... The only time we would see that as creepy is if our friends are the same age as us so their daughters are way way younger than us, young enough to be your own daughter, not because she's the daughter of your friend, this is so freaking obvious... Galadriel is thousands of years old and elrond should be barely 500 years old considering they're just forging the ring... What the hell are they talking about... It's their own fault for not making elrond look way younger than that and celebrien already born... They made elrond look the same age if not older than galadriel because they're not well read enough on Tolkien's lore that they don't even know there's an age difference and a considerable one at that... When elrond becomes 550, celebrien would look more than old enough to be his age mate because they grow normally but stop aging when they reach their peak, we know this because of elrond and elros in the lore with elros helping us see how a human would grow beside an elf, elrond and they're twins so you can easily compare the age... Elros and elrond grew the same way until elrond stopped aging at the peak of youth and since elros died a very wrinkled old man at the age of five hundred, 50-70 years should be when elves stop aging when we compare them to numenorians the second longest living race in middle earth so what the hell is creepy there in it... Galadriel should be way older celeborn I think, I can't recall... That's not considered creepy...
We are not amazon fans we are not the writers fans we are tolkien fans we love the man and His works you having the name cause you payed cash dosn't entile you to our repsect for that is earned and never bought.
I don't understand how George R.R Martin can be so blissfully unaware of how audiences can grow to hate shows or franchises they loved. There's a difference between change and contradiction especially when the series you're producing for no longer has the original writer or producer. Rings of power, the Star Wars sequels and many more have multiple issues but they also both no longer have the people who created them in the first place so it's beyond easy for new writers to completely contradict parts of the lore and stems from wanting to change things that the original writer clearly established.
I wonder if GRRM would understand Star Trek, Star Wars and Tolkien better if you explained to him how Song of Fire and Ice fans loved Game of Thrones when it was closely based on his work, but hated seasons 7 and 8, where the connection to his work had gotten extremely loose and the quality of the writing that filled in the gaps was extremely poor. Surely he HAS watched seasons 7 and 8, no? How could he not understand?
It's odd cuz George actually seemed to be genuinely disappointed in season 8. He said that he was too busy to even watch the show during season 8. I think he defended ROP to get some social points or something.
I actually think GRRM is so freaked out because the ending of GoT was close to the way he was going to end ASOIAF. He saw how poorly the fans reacted to season 8, with Dany doing a heel turn and Bran becoming King, while Jon becomes a background player so the women can take out the Night King and rule Winterfell. He saw all of that and now he's frozen, unable to complete his series (even though he had 2 years of Covid to sit indoors and work) so he's lashing out at ALL fans, because it can't be creators' faults. It's the fans.
@@mmclaurin8035 What happened in season 8 made perfect sense. The execution was horrible. Rewatch the series and you see that Bran is meant to be the King and that Dany never, ever showed mercy. Never. But they should've built up Dany being the "Mad Queen" more.
@@Paulafan5 But Bran is a terrible king candidate, what self respecting medieval society would tolerate a crippled king who doesn't even follow the country state religioun? As someone who wroked with history I just can't tolerate something so outlandish then this.
Galadriel didn't make any rings of any significance. The three elven rings were made by Celebrimbor without the knowledge of Anatar (Sauron). When Sauron found out he immediately attacked the whole region & killed Celebrimbor.
@@svrkl15stnbld17the fact that I can’t see halbrand being bothered at all is just one example of the massive casting issues. Sauron the biggest evil EVER short of morgoth and dude just wanted to chill making swords all day and would have had Galadriel just left him on his post villain phase vacation.
Christopher Tolkien once said that in all his research of his father's work he only ever found one instance of sn uncorrobotated reference in the entire csnon. In other words, there was an almost miraculous absence of contradictions..
Yeah if ROP was a generic fantasy series I'd happily watch it. Fantasy doesn't need to make sense. But Tolkien does. And there's so many things with ROP that's just stupid. I lost interest when Galadriel swam across an ocean. And bumped into another main character at that. It's just too stupid to take seriously. And I did hate Peter Jacksons movies as well for changing nearly everything in one way or another, but those were at least well made movies with good practical effects. It's silly that they made ROP the most expensive show ever and have people look like traveling to Moria/Khazad-Dûm is a five minute stroll.
@@ViktorSarge If ROP had been a generic fantasy series I don't think I would've made it through the second episode. I think (I don't actually remember) I got about halfway through the 5th and that was only because of the Lord of The Rings name. I would have given up earlier because it's just so unreasonably boring and the 5th episode was as far as I could get with all my determination. Playing through the vanilla intro to Skyrim for the 25th time is still more interesting than ROP ever got for me.
@@luckybynn5788 Yeah fair enough. I got Prime because I wanted to give it a chance. But I ended up watching (and absolutely loving) American Gods instead. I only ever finished the first 2,5 episodes of ROP I think before I just got plain bored. Can't recommend American Gods enough though. It's a great book and the adaptation is well made. And instead of smug corporate representation it's unforgiving furious confrontation with the history of slavery, with race issues, gender, sex, oppression, colonization/genocide, religion, worship of violence and entertaining as heck meanwhile. Only gripe is that we miss out on the book ending. Being Swedish I think Gaiman did a good job with Norse mythology.
@@ViktorSarge "Fantasy doesn't need to make sense" Thats not true. Fantasy still needs to be internally consistent within the confines of its own rules. It should also speak to timeless archetypes because thats what makes any work of fiction relatable and enjoyable. It should also not be propaganda. "Its fantasy" does not excuse the fact that they made a single mom a military leader, for example. Thats just nonsense that would never happen. Even if its fantasy, if it has humans, they should still act like humans.
@@Likexner Absolutely! In the fantasy genre, you are writing outside the constraints of the real world, but that doesn't mean "oh it's fantasy, we can do whatever we want", it means that you have to build an entire world... and not just the world, but the peoples, cultures, history... and all of that had better make sense. Writing good fantasy is *hard*; only a small handful of people can pull it off.
"The elves have been historically portrayed as white and Aryan." - Ismael Cruz Cordova Wow! First of all, _historically,_ the elves are part of North European mythology going back as far as (written) history goes, for that part of the World. Since the Germanic tribes were Indo-European, and other Indo-European tribes migrated to India, shared mythology shows up in both European and Indian religions and folklore. There are no elves in Indian mythology and folklore, which means that the idea of elves in North Europe probably predates the Germanic tribes, and comes from a pre-Indo-European culture. That puts the origin of elves far into prehistory, all the way back to the Late Stone Age (more than 5,000 ago). Neolithic North Europeans still make up a large portion of North European genetic heritage, and they were white. In surviving descriptions from the Iron Age, elves were described as white. Almost certainly, the elves of mythology were always white. That's not really important, though. A writer could very well develop a fantasy world where that part of history was ignored, and the elves were black. However, _that's not what Tolkien did._ He kept that traditional aspect of elves. As anyone who has read Tolkien knows, his use of history and mythology was very deliberate and carefully considered; it's not something you can change, without clearly breaking with the world he created. Doing so is disrespectful of Tolkien. It's not only disrespectful against Tolkien, though. It's also disrespectful of North European culture. Again, not because elves can't be black, in a fantasy world explicitly created that way. It's disrespectful because it's portrayed as if elves are part of a shared, ancestral culture, with no particular connection to any specific people or place. The line is that elves can _of course_ be black. That there's nothing new or remarkable about that. That the only reason why black elves aren't traditional, is that "Aryans" excluded black people. That it has nothing to do with the fact that the nations who believed in elves were white. This was the original meaning of cultural appropriation; when one culture adopted elements from another, and then pretended they hadn't, that this element had no particular connection to that other culture. If I was to put on a traditional Xhosa head dress, and then claim that it was as much a part of Norwegian culture (I'm Norwegian) as of any other culture, that would be appropriation in the original meaning. The real insult is in the latter part: in denying the origin. Elves haven't just "been historically _portrayed_ as white"; they have historically _been_ white; they're an idea, and whatever that idea was, is what elves were. Elves have never been Aryan, though. The Aryans were the Indo-European tribes that migrated to India. They have nothing to do with elves. The only possible motive for dragging in the term 'Aryan', is to connect traditional elves to Nazi terminology. That's about as offensive as anything can get. Certainly, it's not something Tolkien will have been confused about, and the professor would probably have been profoundly insulted. P.S.: Yes, I noticed that he acknowledged "folklore", with the phrase "there's folklore", before immediately moving on. Even this minuscule acknowledgement of the existence of original mythology is entirely new, from him, and from anyone connected with the show. Edit: I made an erroneous reference to the Celts, which was pointed out. I've edited out the reference to avoid misinforming people, as not all will read the entire thread.
I agree with you. Just wanted to add to "That's about as offensive as anything can get. Certainly, it's not something Tolkien will have been confused about, and the professor would probably have been profoundly insulted". Tolkien wrote a lovely letter on exactly that in 1938. It comes up pretty easily if you google Tolkien aryan letter. well worth a read.
Ismael Cordova Cruz is just the face of the Blackwashing of Norwegian, Germanic, British and Indo-European traditions, mythology and folklore. Dem Rangz o’ Cultural Appropriation. They’re trying to erase the ‘Olds.’ They’re all Maoist zealots and propagandist wh0res, ‘They’ are trying to erase ‘us’ again and steal our heritage and try to use this to set up a ‘in-group/out-group’ dynamic.
But why is everyone getting upset about a dark skinned elf, while nobody is saying anything about the harfoots’ complexion? Why doesn’t anyone want to base the elves off of Tolkien’s sketch of Beleg finding Gwindor? And why can’t we accept that changing some of Tolkien’s work to make sure that we include minorities in the talent pool for their portrayal might be more important than staying true to the parts of the lore that have literally nothing to say for the story?
@@Ekcyboo I'm not sure what your issue with the Harfoots' complexion is. Perhaps I would know, if I'd actually seen the show, rather than just summations of it. I'll accept ignorance on the point, rather than suffer watching this drivel. Yes, I can know that it's drivel, based on summations from trusted sources. However, generally speaking, there's a lot of freedom when writing about the Hobbits' past, because Tolkien never really did. There's a description of Sméagol's people, who are supposed to be closely related, but it's fairly fuzzy, and that's all there is. With the elves, there's no such flexibility. Even with the above being the case, I've noticed no shortage of criticism of the portrayal of the Harfoots... The lore is more important than the type of racial diversity you find at Starbucks for more reasons than I could possibly fit into a TH-cam comment. I believe I've already mentioned some, but, for your benefit, I'll mention some more: - Middle-earth isn't Starbucks. It's not even modern day North America. What's more, the entirety of the rest of the real World is also not Starbucks or North America. Turning all social commentary into a matter of New York City Starbucks type "diversity" is disrespectful to very nearly everyone on the planet. - Tolkien didn't do social commentary. His commentary was on profound issues of ethics, history, emotion, communication, meaning and purpose, the nature of reality, and other topics of similar weight. Dragging social commentary into it is to drag everything down. - The books establish clearly and exactly the World in which they take place, and nothing about it is random. People who read and reread the books always discover new things, and new levels to old things. There's no way that anyone can confidently say that "this particular bit of lore isn't very important", because the next rereading may prove them wrong. That you feel confident that there are parts of the lore that have "literally nothing to say for the story" only tells me that you're not a Tolkien fan, and never will be. - Tolkien's work was never about making people feel included. They work both on a much deeper level than that, and on a much higher level. If you need to be the same skin color as an elf, in order to appreciate the story of Númenor, then you'll never grasp the story of Númenor. If you don't need it, the change isn't necessary. I have faith in people's ability to grasp things. They've always had it, until now; if it has suddenly been lost, the last thing we should do is accommodate this new ignorance. - The concept of 'race' in Tolkien is a very old one, and refers to a shared history and ancestry, rather than external traits. However, shared external traits are inevitable consequences of shared history and ancestry; more so than the modern concept of race, which simply divide by skin color. In Tolkien, appearance is an expression of the history of a people, and history is very important on Middle-earth. It's what drives all events. - It's primitive pandering, which disgraces Tolkien's legacy. It's precisely the sort of shallow nonsense that Tolkien made every effort to avoid. He thought metaphorical storytelling was primitive; "representation" is even more simplistic. - It's unnecessary. If they wanted black representation, it could've been easily accomplished _within the lore._ Parts of their story takes place in Harad, anyway, and the Haradrim are black, according to lore. Rather than take advantage of that, and populate the continent with strong and exciting cultures, they went ahead and turned many Haradrim white. - It short-changes Africans and African-Americans, both, though many of the latter may be too confused to realize it. Rather than shoe-horn in some black elves and dwarves, Amazon could've made a show based on an African fantasy novel, or directly on African mythology and/or history. Wouldn't that have been something? I could go on, but I'm sure we both think this will do, for now. I'll just add one, last thing:
@@erikjrn4080 I have no issues with the complexion of the harfoots, much the same way that I have no issues with the complexions of any of the characters. But I find it telling that no one has critized them for being too light skinned, seeing as Tolkien specifically noted that they are shorter and browner than hobbits. As for some of your other points: I started reading Lord of the Rings in my own language for the first time at age 7, and didn’t do much else than read that book over and over again during my childhood. I don’t remember ever having read a passage where skin tone was a critical issue for the story. I also am fully aware that inclusion wasn’t Tolkien’s goal, and not something he wanted to accomplish in his world. My point is that it *is* a goal that we want to accomplish in the real world, the one that matters, and one of the ways to do that is through representation and exposure. Using «That’s not what iron age Norwegians said» as an argument against diverse casting for elven characters is quite frankly ridiculous.
"If you don't like a show don't watch it" -George RR Martin If you don't like your own story, never finish it and sell the rights? Great legacy, George. It's not that hard to understand how fans who've been invested in a fandom for years don't like overproduced fanfic from obvious non-fans.
I've kept up with his ASOIAF books since 2009. Buy the copy the day of release and read it in 2 or 3 days. I'm no longer waiting on Winds of Winter. I've moved on
Dude. You've got it backwards. Ever since the parrot media debacle got exposed... I've been thinking. The more you cry against their stuff, even if you don't watch the show, they still perceive it as positive, since your spending time and effort watching content about the show or engaging with it. So... The more we do this, the more they feel they're doing the right thing
@@hombreg1 I'll go with Occam's razor: ineptitude, incompetence, delusion. They lose profit on this stuff short-term and long-term. You'd have to assume they're even capable of 5D Chess.
My husband and I were super excited for this…We lost interest mid-way 1st episode. We tried 3 times to watch it again and it was so hard. We watched maybe two more and just gave up. Just now we said maybe we weren’t in the right mind, we literally thought it was us and not them so maybe we’ll try it again but now we know everyone felt the same way!
I went round my parents once & they were watching it… I was bored to tears… as far as I know they never finished the series & it was never spoken of again
@@Edruezzi Whats the highest achieved by you? because going off your sub list you're either a typical modern day magical fat black woman or a soft black man..either way it's safe to assume you're unseasonably tanned trash with no education yourself x) Did Royce's comment offend you because they didn't enjoy this woke rubbish that only caters to white women with 9 cats & ugly black women that love Lizzo?
It is hollywood, they are all a bunch of narcissistic fucks. THey all think they are god sends, the next big thing after sliced bread. They are physically incapable of recognizing they could be wrong, taking responsability
This is another problem with the west... See, you guys bring innovations to the world, but the rubbish you bring along, the lack of culture and the bad reeducation that comes along is making your technology counterproductive, like you guys are more harm than good... What the hell do you mean you can't date your friend's daughter??? Are you saying if you befriend your stepdad, you have to get a divorce or are you saying the only time you can date your friend's daughter is if you met her before you befriended him??? I think they're mistaken in what is creepy about dating your friend's daughter because they don't have friends or daughters or families or brains so they can't figure it out... The only time we would see that as creepy is if our friends are the same age as us so their daughters are way way younger than us, young enough to be your own daughter, not because she's the daughter of your friend, this is so freaking obvious... Galadriel is thousands of years old and elrond should be barely 500 years old considering they're just forging the ring... What the hell are they talking about... It's their own fault for not making elrond look way younger than that and celebrien already born... They made elrond look the same age if not older than galadriel because they're not well read enough on Tolkien's lore that they don't even know there's an age difference and a considerable one at that... When elrond becomes 550, celebrien would look more than old enough to be his age mate because they grow normally but stop aging when they reach their peak, we know this because of elrond and elros in the lore with elros helping us see how a human would grow beside an elf, elrond and they're twins so you can easily compare the age... Elros and elrond grew the same way until elrond stopped aging at the peak of youth and since elros died a very wrinkled old man at the age of five hundred, 50-70 years should be when elves stop aging when we compare them to numenorians the second longest living race in middle earth so what the hell is creepy there in it... Galadriel should be way older celeborn I think, I can't recall... That's not considered creepy...
So wait, you're telling me the Galadriel actress has more than one facial expression?!?! she can actually smile and laugh?!?! where was this in the show? Granted it probably wouldn't have made much difference, but it would've been a massive improvement.
Th actress is lovely and has the ethereal looks needed for a younger Galadriel. She was the only character playing an elf who actually had the appearance and carriage of an elf. Too bad she was written and directly so abominably.
@@kimberlyoldschool She's lovely? She's a delusional narcissist like the rest of the cast (and pretty much the rest of Hollywood). I agree not even a good actor could have pulled off that abomination of a script, but she can't even smile without giving everybody nightmares lol
“The quality of writing is inversely proportional to how smug you are as you write it.” Brilliant! That would certainly explain the galloping narcissism in today’s Hollywood!
Peter Jackson also changed and cut some "minor" things in the LOTR movies but it works somehow - but he didn't have to do much because the story was already there. Like you trust enough what you have in your hands.
The fact that people don't get that fans aren't "toxic" but are actually just really passionate when it comes to one of their favorite IPs ever really just shows their own inability to create something new of their and also shows their delusion that if fans hate something then they're toxic! No, they're the one who are toxic! Not us! They keep on calling us that and attack us when we criticize something that they're doing if it seems a little and then blame us when it fails because they attacked us so we didn't support it! What a pathetic joke! Until Hollywood realizes that their fans are their customer base and stop attacking them in the marketing campaigns for their upcoming projects, then they'll continue to fail! Get woke, go broke!
@Tae Jasper Ikr. I still remember when one of Aquaman movie producer, Peter Safran calling out DC fans as toxic for hating on Amber Heard, aka Amber Turd or the "Husband Beater" and wanting her out of Aquaman 2. His words, I quote, "I do not think that we are ever going to react to, honestly, to just pure fan pressure".
@@aaronlimeuchin7352 Yeah, that wasn't the best that he could've made! But you have to remember that he and James Gunn were under a lot pressure to try and market these films without controversy and that was going to be hard to do! So I get it at least, what they were trying to do!
Well fans can indeed be very toxic. Back in the days of the Star Wars prequels fans threw so much hate at Hayden Christensen that he quit acting for decades. Yes he returned to acting recently, but that degree of hate was scary. But I do agree with everything else you said. The majority of fans are just very passionate.
@@xolitaire Yes, well, I don't think that Hayden deserves any hate at all because he did nothing wrong really! And yes, I was right about most fans just being passionate and not wanting their favorites IPs and franchises ruined for the sake of being "more modern" and trying "to reflect the world we live in today", when literally entertainment is called that for a reason, not everything has to be real and it means it can be fictional! That's what Hollywood writers and producers need to learn!
Really? You need to scroll up only 2 comments to see a toxic comment made about the actors and the show literally name calling and actor just for being excited that she gets to represet people of color in one of the biggest franchise ever? I understas fans not liking the writong or the plot or how they literally time skipped alot unoficially in the show. But fans are attacking the show beacause "dWaRfS aNd eLvEs cAN't Be bLaCk!" In this fictional world which was written 1937.
You've hit the nail, I think.... multiple actors are voicing the same attitudes: Cordova : "I wanted to be an elf.... it would change things..." Nomvete : "A redress of balance in this world...." Dylan Mulvaney : "LOOK AT ME ME ME ME ME MEEEEEEEEEEE" It's an epidemic of selfishness and self centredness. And those who should be pushing back, those who should be keeping the greed in check, no longer have common sense or morals. Instead they have a list of "woke" goals. Here is how it works: Actor : "I want to be the first XXX in this role because I'm proud of being me." Producer : "Well, Diversity is a good thing because it says so on this checklist. And you certainly Diverge from the character in the original text." And THEN they declare that it's all for the good because little girls with fish tails are now "represented" on the screen. Well, you know who's NOT represented on the screen any more? Tolkein, Andersen, and the other writers who MADE THIS POSSIBLE.
Completely agree, although we should stop calling this slop "Diversity" because it isn't (plus that's what the filthy SJW wants you to call it) it's actually just straight up Tokenism. Rich people in Hollywood profiting off of people's appearance.
@@clogs4956 That is what happens when you replace god with the self. America has turned away from the foundation that our country was built upon, christian values. I wasn't raised religious but all the vile debauchery & narcissism raging in modern times, I am glad I found our lord. He led me to him. Woke marxism is the new religion.
I have ZERO problems with the casting of Ariel - that actress looks perfect except for her skin (ie should quite possibly be pale GREEN). & she has a gorgeous voice. My problem with ROP - the writing & the destruction of the lore. Not the skin color of a few characters (although they could have done this so much smarter)
"In order for our evil to triumph, we really need the good fans to sit out, shut up, not watch or contest our defilements of their beloved stories and characters." Cultural Marxists and Amazon Showrunners.
Lmao and they didn't. No one is watching these things. a small pool of reviewers and critics watched it, because that's their job, and that was it. Nobody is "hate watching" this stuff. It's not happening. Why do people keep having to pretend otherwise?
If the fans hate it so much, then its fairly obvious that the producers are NOT making the programme for those fans, but for THEMSELVES. And that is a GUARANTED FAILURE.
Sad part is, is that it can still work if you make a show like it for yourself, but the actual content needs to be good. People are willing to deal with this kind of shit if the stories are there, and the franchise is regarded well within the stories told. Neither of those things are true for Rings of Power.
The casting wasn’t the problem with rings of power, it was the complete disregard for established canon, small changes for flow and pacing are fine, but complete event rewrites start to bother people, and when there is a huge lore shift every episode…it starts to look like they think they could have written it better than the original author…
"I don't understand how people come to hate things that they once loved" I know why - they hate that beloved literature is disrespected to such an extent the original creator would not recognize it, and despise the politicization and skin color cast mandates that dictate every aspect of what should be just good storytelling. Everyone is sick of it, minorities know you're using them, original fans aren't served with legitimate iterations of the story, and instead have to classify this as a redux.
I on the other hand, classify most of it as: shit I won't knowingly shell out good money for ditto, so I guess I'm doomed to rewatching stuff in the past that actually WAS good...do you know there were 15 seasons of Supernatural, and they are all of uniformly high quality? I didn't, not until I quit waiting for a decent Star Wars or GRR Martin's mysterious book "WINDS OF WINTER" (that's been unpublished for so long it seems like a myth at this point) . And now that I realize how much good stuff from the past I missed out on, I just concentrate on finding that instead.
i love watching hollywood as a whole fumble after fumble, i honestly hope it opens a market for more domesticated smaller budget movies tht actually have soul, not just token characters and situations
@@Bhoddisatva I dont want to replace Hollywood with CCP propaganda. I'd rather have small domestic studios take off in place of hollyweird, not look to the CCP. Every piece of media that comes out of china is approved by the CCP.
The issue with modern media is they are no longer making films for the public they are making films for "themselves" ...Games are slowly going that way as well.
I'm playing 20 and 30 year old games because they are of higher basic quality than modern games. I'm watching movies from the 80s and 90s, because the movies are better. By better I mean things such as production quality, story cohesiveness, acting and the like. Hell, completeness is a major part of the problem as well. With so many games being released incomplete or just messed up, and movies being released incomplete and missing key aspects of the story.
@@nobodyshome6792 True. I tend to watch movies from the 80s and 90s (some early 20s as well) As for games I still play AOE 2 and dungeon keeper...just dont make them like they used to. kinda sad right?
To hate Rings of Power is NOT to hate Tolkien; it is to hate a bad TV show based on a world Tolkien crafted. It is to hate a bad TV show that takes massive liberties with Tolkien's stories, it's slow pacing, awful characterizations, identity politics,, but not to hate Tolkien. I still love Tolkien.
Same people who came up with the idea of 'white fragility' are saying they felt comforted and safe by having a therapist on set... these people wouldn't survive a day in the woods.
@@M-S_4321 Honestly, I have no interest in watching it - I’m not a critic, so I don’t have to! I will watch a few people’s videos about each episode, though - and I’m definitely looking forward to that!
“I knew someone was there seeing me completely.” Well, that’s a relief, because not even a third of the people who started your show saw it completely.
I was so happy hearing literally everything you said... Facts are simply facts and hearing the sweet voice of reason and truth is wholeheartedly a breath of Fresh Air and that is actually sad!
He dosent understand why people have started hating what they once loved? So its nothing to do with the fact tht it has been butchered and changed beyond recognition. Usually with a crap tone of lore breaking also. Reminds me of that meme "dont question anything just buy product, and then get excited for next product."
Celebrían should already be well over 1000 years old at this point. She was born about SA 300, whereas the Elven rings were made about SA 1590. Anyway, Celeborn isn't dead, he just left because Galadriel was so insufferable.
"It was here that Elrond first saw Celebrian and loved her, though he said nothing of it" - Unfinished Tales. This is shortly after the founding of Imladris, meaning Celebrian was very much a grown adult by this point, and she had been raised by her parents outside of Lindon, where Elrond had been living up until very recently.
There was never a moment in this series that it really captivated me. I watched the whole thing, there was nothing that drew you in and made you want to see the next episode. It was visually stunning, but had nothing to offer story wise.
@@cr9281 Everyone has different tastes I guess, the costumes and practical effects were awesome. Nori was cute, incredible actor. They didnt feel out of place and they were unique. At first I thought there. was no need for halflings in second age story but it grew on me immediately. And yes, some lines were a bit cringy but this is Rings of Power so... I will take what I can
@@svrkl15stnbld17 This whole comment proves you know nothing about the books / Tolkiens work. Nori cute and a good actress? They didnt feel out of place?? You liked the stranger (not-gandalf)? Lmao are you one of the cast? The whole harfoot story line with the stranger was the cringiest story line of the series. And thats an accomplishment as the other story lines were cringe as well .
@@cr9281 Oh shut up, you are one of those "you have to like the same thing as me or you are wrong." I have read the main books multiple times, plus silmarillion, children of Hurin, Beren and Luthien. It doesnt exactly clarify how pre-hobbits were in the second age, so showrunners had freedom there. And I think they did a pretty good job. Stranger was interesting too, as an original character; until it became clear that they want him to be Gandalf, who arrives at ME in the third age. Sauron, Celebrimbor, Eregion, Gil galad etc which are quite explored in the books. Lore is clear about that, the show deviated from it and somehow made the worst choices. I understand you are a hater of the show and will try to hate everything about it, I didnt. I liked some aspects while being disappointed mostly.
For the issue of Elrond marrying Galadriel's daughter, it really isn't an issue when you consider that Galadriel is SIGNIFICANTLY older than Elrond. She was born in Valinor where the count of years is different than the Years of the Sun. This is one of the many continuity problems that RoP has with their condensed timeline
The problem is they made the elves act like humans instead of making them the more regal, wise, and higher race that they are supposed to be. And they don't respect the actual timeline at all, so everything just doesn't work. But regardless of all that, the writing and storyline is so empty and pointless and shallow that it wouldn't even work if it had nothing to do with Lord of the Rings. It isn't a good show. The characters mostly suck. The dialogue is horrible. It's just rubbish.
@@stephenlaing2152 No they definitely see the difference in age. With galadriel being the oldest and wisest named elf aside from Cirdan. Though she is probably seen as wiser.
@@imaloser5689 Yeah, Galadriel is an elf old enough to have seen the great trees of Valinor and basked in their light. NONE of the other elves in this part of the story can say that.
George Martin is right, imagine if you had something you deeply loved, even if it eventually got mistreated and completely ruined the experience, making people totally shun it when they were supposed to be fans! ... Oh wait...
I think Martin's criticism goes both ways and, like most things, It's gone straight over "Disparu's" head. When Martin says at the end, "if you don't like a show, don't watch it," I believe he's commenting directly on the kind of hyperbolic hysteria "Disparu's" expressing in this video. I didn't like the last season of "Lost". It greatly disappointed me. I never took it personal. I never "shunned" the show. I took as: "well, the creators went a certain way that I personally didn't care for. None of these writers 'owe' me anything so I won't get mad about it." Meanwhile, look how mad people get about "Rings of Power". The brutal truth is: "Rings of Power" owes you nothing. Literally nothing. Have to say, I did not like "Rings of Power", I think it's an astonishingly badly written show with 2 or 3 cast members who are so bad they nearly sink the entire ship on their own (namely Galadriel.) But these are creative issues. "Disparu's" issues are....a little more troubling. Personally, I don't care that a Puerto Rican guy is playing an elf, which "Disparu" spends _a lot of time_ complaining about here. That's weird. Is "Disparu" racist? Hard to say. I don't know enough about him. _He is_ culturally ignorant though, that's fairly self-evident.
@@mcnultyssobercompanion6372 "If you don't like a show, don't watch it" applies very easily when you're not a fan, it's much harder when you care for the core material. Of course, it's stupid in its own right: in order to know that you don't like the show, you need to watch it first. But you've completely missed the point GRR Martin was making there. He's calling ANY criticism unjustified. What he's really saying is: if you don't like a show, shut up about it. GRR Martin doesn't like criticism, he likes money. The man takes every opportunity he gets to defecate on his own fanbase, who has the GALL of not being satisfied with the poor quality of the last two ASOIAF books and his unwillingness to finish the series at all. His actual reaction is to show them the middle finger (literally). As for Disparu, calling him a racist says much more about yourself than about him. Anyone who's interested in Tolkien's works will take exception with anything that doesn't make any sense and is decided for reasons that have nothing to do with the universe. You don't care about the black elf or the nonsensically cosmopolitan Harfoot population because you're not interested in the lore, you don't care whether it makes sense or not. That's fine, but it doesn't give you the right to throw accusations of racism around.
@@Paulafan5 Yes, and Star Wars fans still love Star Wars. The Original Trilogy is still great and even the Prequels are interesting and mostly entertaining. But Disney.....
@@Paulafan5 Oh, more than that - Strange New Worlds is the closest the franchise has come to TOS for decades! I love it ! BTW I’m an original fan from when TOS aired - I wrote a letter to save it when I was in HS. I am loving Strange New Worlds & hope they don’t ruin it.
"I don't hate what I once loved. I hate what idiots calling themselves writers, directors, and producers, have changed what I love beyond recognition." That what donavandwelch said. Fits perfect.
New subscriber here. Having seen all these clips of the actors, writers and directors, I now know why all these franchises are crashing and burning. Unbelievable.
They have blamed and attacked fans/audiences for too long, it is long overdue that they be tazed, smashed and locked up in an insane-asylum with a straight jacket. They need a reality check last decade.
Sales of Tolkien increased by 1000% after LOTR. Jackson's formula - honor Tolkien, follow the lore, and don't insert your own politics - clearly worked. Amazon's formula - contradict the lore, insert modern identity politics as the DNA of the show, and delete all negative reviews - clearly failed.
George has a perfect example for him to understand it’s called the last season of game of thrones. Which he publicly burned the script for. I love game of thrones, up to season 7. Even that got to be a mixed bag. People still love the the old stories just not the new ones. Especially comparing he new to old. There is a saying in Texas: “ya dance with the girl who brought ya”, and thats what most people are choosing not the hideous new creatures being made today.
In my opinion, season 7 felt rushed (I didn't like the storyline of Littlefinger pitching Arya and Sansa against each other, for instance), but I loved season 8. My only real complaint with season 8 is The Battle of Winterfell, which had several problematic beats (though several amazing ones as well.) Otherwise, I loved it. I worry it's turned into another "Star Wars"-prequel type situation where criticism has instead become a pigpile, and an entire generation will have to pass until season 8 is allowed to be judged on its own terms. But who knows.
Disapru, as refreshing and appreciable as your film/show analyses are, I feel they miss one small detail. Granted, you're spot-on about the point of actors being narcissistic and self-centered. The missing detail is that entertainment personalities have always, for the most part, kept their narcissism concealed. The deliberate public display (and even showcasing) of this self-centered narcissism in Hollywood is a new trend. The change was semi-gradual in some cases and sudden in others, but what's certain is that this kind of shameless arrogance in entertainment was nowhere to be found 10-15 years ago, at least not in the ubiquitous way as it is now. "What changed and why?" is what I'm wondering.
What changed? The iPad generation became part of their target audience demographic, that’s what changed. It’s infiltrated everything. Look up the anime recruitment ad for the US army and tell me you didn’t sit back and say, “We’re fucked.” Because it was shockingly narcissistic which the opposite attitude needed in the military.
I think it may have something to do with the quality of agents/talent managers these days - they used to be able to wrangle their clients in the past...It's a bit like with newspaper editors - once those guys were cut of out the picture "news" became the review gallore of whatever John, Dick and Harry randomly shat out on their twatter
Honestly though, I can't wait to see where this is going. The most expensive disaster of all time ended with only 30% of viewers finishing it, so it's going to be insane to watch them START a new season with those numbers.
Season 2 was already bought and paid for before season 1 even aired, I believe. There is no way there will be a season 3. The show is dismally bad, even for people who aren't Tolkien fans. The show is bad by itself without even getting into canon issues.
The thing is, Disparu, therapy on set, or more specifically mental illness (in this case mental weakness) is not an excuse for poor performances. Michael O'Hare, who played Jeffrey Sinclair in the 1st season of B5 was having hallucinations on set because of genuine mental illness and still managed to put in a stella performance. ROPs problem is that it hired activist writers and spent so much money on the acquisition of the rights that it had nothing left in the pot for talented actors. When you pay peanuts you hire monkeys, and frankly you're average Chimpanzee tea party is more entertaining than anything being released by Amazon studios.
@Danica DeVries I don’t know about that argument. But genuine mental illness and being a toddler in an adult’s body (wanting the attention and status of being a public figure, but throwing temper tantrums whenever there is any criticism), are two very different things! If they are all actually mentally ill, they should go get help … quietly, like regular people do. But otherwise, just stop with the crocodile tears - no one’s buying it, and no one cares! And if they were severely mentally ill, but chose to continue anyway (which, at least in the case of the showrunners, would actually explain a lot), then still no one owes it to them to pretend that their crappy product is any good!
Great observation, that when you change the canon once, it has a cascading effect. ROP has the same problem liars have, once you tell one lie you'll need to tell bigger & bigger lies until the whole story ultimately falls apart.
My family and I are in that 37% that completed Rings of Power 😂 (Amazon is so happy). And honestly, I was critical of the show but my family didn’t care. It just became something we watched on Sunday’s after House of the Dragon. For me, the departure from the source material was sad. And they tried to create moments for these “motivational” monologues that had no resonance at all. It just felt disjointed. Meanwhile Peter Jackson was able to bring me completely to tears with the words “I’m no man” (followed by the iconic stab to the face)! Not a surprise but the original movie trilogy had better female moments of power than all of rings the power 🤷🏼 Great video 👍
I finished it too. I can’t remember which episodes, but there were a few in the middle that I actually liked. The biggest problem , other than departure from Tolkienian thought was the in show logic. Theo hides in the well and leaves at night… when Orcs can freely roam and not be injured by the sun…. After Doom explodes and Galadriel and a hand-full of others survive hot ash while horses are combusting…. Galadriel and theo NOT following the same path everyone else took to return to Numenor’s base camp… there were two ways out of the town and they went the opposite way‽‽
I watched 5 episodes and gave up after the silly mithril origin story. I did come back for the last episode as part of a watch party to laugh at it so I don't know if I'm part of that 37% or not as I never watched 6&7.
People like George R.R Martin asking fans why they don't like their wokified franchises is like an abusive spouse asking you "Why don't you love me anymore?"
I don not think you have understood his point... He is stating the situation without directly telling the reason, which is obvious, he is jus throwing the question, and I guess that after how GoT ended, he knows the topic of discussion xD
Wow, they even hired a therapist to remind the cast that they're victims, the cast that all had their dreams come true by getting cast in a major TV show, BTW.
I stayed away from show spoilers for a very long time while RoP was in production. Then I braced myself, winced preemptively, and opened Google. Within about three minutes, I knew that I would loathe every single second of the show and would regret watching any of it. I was correct. It's so bad that it makes The Hobbit look good, and I could never have imagined that. I still can't imagine it. But Amazon has made a show that is "too big to fail". It has to succeed. They have to alter our reality in order to make the show a success. They will do anything to being this about because God himself couldn't sink this show. And they will be playing their fiddles all the way down.
It’s weird that needing a therapist at your disposal at any time is so acutely celebrated. Nobody’s perfect, and we all have room for self improvement, but like…shouldn’t the goal be to NOT need a therapist, to have the wherewithal to handle life with some independence? Idk man, people in show biz have to make a show of everything they do, whether it’s capitalizing on personal problems, or pantomiming some contrived display of progressive thinking.
To me, it almost sounds like they can dish out insults etc to the fans. But when it becomes apparent that what we the fans have said all along was true, they can’t handle it. 🤔🤷🏻♀️ But I could be entirely wrong.
My father is one of the best people I’ve ever known. Besides being a wonderful father a and husband, ever since I was a child he’s been involved with multiple charities, doing all sorts of volunteer work to help many different types of people and families in our community. Not only does he not wish to be acknowledged for his efforts, he’s never once referred to himself as an activist or philanthropist like these vapid, attention thirsty idiots. Their activism probably consists of posting something online anyway.
Sorry , did I miss something ? did house of dragon have therapists on hand or did they not need them because they had writers who knew what they were doing ?
The Lord of the Rings: The Rings of Power is back this time with cast interviews and the latest news of season 2. With Ismael Cruz Cordova giving an interview about the on set arrangements that had to be made to enable the cast to cope with the people Hollywood dislikes the most, THE FANS! You would think after Season 1, they would have taken stock of the marketing, learnt from the mistakes, and come back with a new plan. NOPE. Instead we double down, repeat the same points and see if doing the same things, leads to the same results every time. It's a brave plan, lets see if it pays off. I thought for this round up, I'd go back to one of my favourite introductions that I've made, but with a different "story" in the clips, alongside new clips from the cast interviews.
But do you think Amazon can save Rings of Power with sufficient changes, or will it just be more of the same? Let me know your thoughts below and as always, thanks for watching :)
Nope. They went woke, they can go broke. And I'll help.
I think having more women behind the camera will definitely save RoP - only a group of bitter middle-aged feminists could fully bring out the emotional depths of faux-Galadriel’s constipation!
I could not give a shit tbh, Lord of The Rings isnt the most important thing in my life.
Just like Superman and Spiderman and whatever my fav TH-camrs are obsessed with.
Im out I dont fucking care anymore.
Ohhhh dearie dearie dearie. There is so much going on behind the scenes… Ever hear of Tikkun Olam? Ever hear if Qabbalah?? Madonna? Zohar, esoteric mysticism? And soooo much more that can’t be said, written, etc. everything those fools say is rooted to the aforementioned. Do your homework people!!
Btw, the ‘double down’ tactic is right out of BHO ‘Barry’s’ playbook. Not that he wrote but was handed a book in a little living room in an affluent Chicago burb ( pop. 28k+ due west).
Dearheart, these creatures are involved in stuff the normal human cannot imagine much less engage. That’s why they need ‘therapy’- pure ‘live’ see mirror. The opposite of living. Their souls have already descended.
Sadly this is no joke.
I don't hate what I once loved. I hate what idiots calling themselves writers, directors, and producers, have changed what I love beyond recognition.
Bingo!
Agreed, that is sensible.
Agreed! These activists have the audacity to tell the true fans what's wrong with Tolkien's masterpiece!! If you don't like the story, go find another one - you don't change the lore!!
Pretenders riding on the shoulders of giants and pile driving it into the ground is what I hate. Still love the og.
Martin’s premise is fundamentally disingenuous. People aren’t fans of brands, but of artists and writers. How popular would Hamlet 2 be without Shakespeare? He should know this himself since game of thrones tv show went downhill when it diverged from the books.
Jeez, George. Tolkien fans hate "Rings of power" because it's *not* Tolkien, it's an *insult* to Tolkien.
Yeah george, like imagine if I said "handjob fans hate getting punched in the balls. I don't understand it."
Just cause they both involve hands and nads don't mean they're the same.
His statements would only make sense if he said writers instead of fans.
Yeah, I'm sure George would deny that if you like something then that means you would enjoy every single piece of fanfic about it... but that's exactly what he was saying we should do for RoP.
This is another problem with the west... See, you guys bring innovations to the world, but the rubbish you bring along, the lack of culture and the bad reeducation that comes along is making your technology counterproductive, like you guys are more harm than good...
What the hell do you mean you can't date your friend's daughter??? Are you saying if you befriend your stepdad, you have to get a divorce or are you saying the only time you can date your friend's daughter is if you met her before you befriended him???
I think they're mistaken in what is creepy about dating your friend's daughter because they don't have friends or daughters or families or brains so they can't figure it out...
The only time we would see that as creepy is if our friends are the same age as us so their daughters are way way younger than us, young enough to be your own daughter, not because she's the daughter of your friend, this is so freaking obvious...
Galadriel is thousands of years old and elrond should be barely 500 years old considering they're just forging the ring... What the hell are they talking about... It's their own fault for not making elrond look way younger than that and celebrien already born... They made elrond look the same age if not older than galadriel because they're not well read enough on Tolkien's lore that they don't even know there's an age difference and a considerable one at that... When elrond becomes 550, celebrien would look more than old enough to be his age mate because they grow normally but stop aging when they reach their peak, we know this because of elrond and elros in the lore with elros helping us see how a human would grow beside an elf, elrond and they're twins so you can easily compare the age... Elros and elrond grew the same way until elrond stopped aging at the peak of youth and since elros died a very wrinkled old man at the age of five hundred, 50-70 years should be when elves stop aging when we compare them to numenorians the second longest living race in middle earth so what the hell is creepy there in it... Galadriel should be way older celeborn I think, I can't recall... That's not considered creepy...
@@johnnycrown5097 Elrond would have already been over a thousand years old when they started forging rings. Annatar first appeared around Year 1200 of the Second Age
"I don't understand how someone can come to hate something they once loved."
This line came from a writer's mouth. Insane.
Moreover, it came from a writer's mouth who got the chance to witness firsthand how this happens. He has really lost the plot.
He must never heard of abuse.
I think the point is, fans don't hate what they once loved, I love the LOTR and always will. What fans disdain is the shoddy, disrespectful, boring swill that we are told is even better than the original. Can't fool me, I can read and watch far better portrayals, I can even see interviews with JRR Tolkein himself. So some Hollywoke, narcissistic child is not going to convince me they know Middle Earth better than the man himself.
Certainly doesn’t seem like something the guy who wrote a phone book of fantasy would say, but perhaps he’s not that same guy anymore. Would certainly explain why he can’t finish his book series.
He asked “Why aren’t people who call themselves fans watching the show?” Then followed that up with “If you don’t like the show don’t watch it.” Whiplash 101
"Evil cannot create anything new, they can only corrupt and ruin good forces have invented or made"
J.R.R. Tolkien
Oof good point lmao.
Not an actual quote from Tolkien. Kind of a poorly worded version of something he did point out a lot, though. "The Shadow that bred them can only mock, it cannot make: not real new things of its own." and other statements he *did* actually put out.
@@ImminDragon well, in the core its the same sentence and thats what count. 😉
@@marcelzocker947 While it is true that the core of the sentence stays the same, the use of quotation marks would imply this is word for word what J.R.R Tolkien stated. A better way at presenting the quote if they themselves did not remember the exact thing he said would be: J.R.R Tolkien once mentioned that evil Cannot Create Anything new, they can only corrupt and ruin good forces have invented or made. I hope this comment helped you in some manner and taught you some new. If not, then I am sorry that I wasted your time, have a wonderful day 😊
evil always ends up biting its own tail (tracy hickman & margaret weis)
My favorite part about ROP is not watching it. The only entertainment is hearing how bad things are for Amazon and this series.
Same here. I didn't watch a minute of it on Amazon, but was highly entertained by Disparu's reviews of it.
I managed about 10 minutes of it before falling asleep. And that was after I already got annoyed by the little Galadriel, her pseudo-philosophic brother, and Morfydd Clark's terrible narration.
The whole Amazon messing with the reviews was hugely entertaining. Didn't watch, but loved the comedy of 2 hacks who never sold a script being put in charge modernizing Tolkien.
Indeed. Never watched the actual series, but I looked forward every week to the reviews of it. Gary/Nerdrotic always did a review stream right after each new episode finished, and I was there waiting for each one
This is another problem with the west... See, you guys bring innovations to the world, but the rubbish you bring along, the lack of culture and the bad reeducation that comes along is making your technology counterproductive, like you guys are more harm than good...
What the hell do you mean you can't date your friend's daughter??? Are you saying if you befriend your stepdad, you have to get a divorce or are you saying the only time you can date your friend's daughter is if you met her before you befriended him???
I think they're mistaken in what is creepy about dating your friend's daughter because they don't have friends or daughters or families or brains so they can't figure it out...
The only time we would see that as creepy is if our friends are the same age as us so their daughters are way way younger than us, young enough to be your own daughter, not because she's the daughter of your friend, this is so freaking obvious...
Galadriel is thousands of years old and elrond should be barely 500 years old considering they're just forging the ring... What the hell are they talking about... It's their own fault for not making elrond look way younger than that and celebrien already born... They made elrond look the same age if not older than galadriel because they're not well read enough on Tolkien's lore that they don't even know there's an age difference and a considerable one at that... When elrond becomes 550, celebrien would look more than old enough to be his age mate because they grow normally but stop aging when they reach their peak, we know this because of elrond and elros in the lore with elros helping us see how a human would grow beside an elf, elrond and they're twins so you can easily compare the age... Elros and elrond grew the same way until elrond stopped aging at the peak of youth and since elros died a very wrinkled old man at the age of five hundred, 50-70 years should be when elves stop aging when we compare them to numenorians the second longest living race in middle earth so what the hell is creepy there in it... Galadriel should be way older celeborn I think, I can't recall... That's not considered creepy...
The old man is so clueless,the reason we dont watch the new Disney Star Wars and Rings of Power is because it is not Star Wars and LotR.
What Disney did to Star Wars should be a crime!
"The opposite of love isn't hate, it's apathy."
You'd think he'd understand, given how many people loved Game of Thrones, and how so many of them were furious about the lackluster ending to that series.
That old man is George R.R. Martin author of the Game of Thrones series. But you're 100 percent right. We don't watch this stuff anymore because its been gang raped by wokeness.
I believe the old man is George R Martin writer of the first 5 books of Game of Thrones
@@RCDW Because thats the majority
“Even if it’s a failure, the outside world may never know.”
I actually laughed out loud. What a ridiculous statement. As if we didn’t see how bad it was.
The Emperor has no clothes.
...👀and a small package
Pepperidge Farms remembers, and so does the internet. 😂😂😂
'Maybe no one will see or hear that this thing we made was really bad.'
What you mean whis TV show? The type of thing that you see and hear and that's all it is?
@@sayLeotardbutsayitChinese it’s like they think, if no one tells us it’s bad, we won’t know.
Though, to be fair, no one watched it, so maybe they’re right. Lol
@Michael Talpas they think that everyone else needs to be told what to do like them... I mean they hired dozens of people to tell them how to ruin a classic when a random fan online would direct the whole show for free and actually make money
0:20 - Mr. Martin, the problem is not that the the fans do not like Star Trek anymore, the problem is that the people who make Star Trek nowadays don´t like Star Trek. Same goes for series like The Witcher, Dr. Who etc.
Preach Brother!!🙌
he knows he doesn't really want to understand because of money
I bet he would have understood if they made Ned Stark out to be some ahole then had his wife be a person of color who then is the one who unites the 7 kingdoms and kills the lead white walker. All the while she spouts how she's the only one who suffers and is strong enough to do so.
"As filmmakers, as writers, we had no interest whatsoever in putting our junk our baggage into these movies. We just thought we should take what Tolkien cared about clearly, we should take those and put them into the film. This should ultimately be Tolkien's film; it shouldn't be ours" -- Peter Jackson about Lord of the Rings
And then we have the modern version -
"As talentless narcissistic hacks, we wanted to pervert... oops... subvert what other people loved, by making it all about us, instead."
@@Nyet-Zdyes Imagine being so full of yourself that you think you can outdo Tolkien, a once-in-a-century genius.
@@faselfasel2864 It's hard to imagine, in spite of the circumstances.
The shocking contrast to Jackson's humility and decency is a really sad indictment of the present moment.
Too bad he wouldn't/couldn't apply the same spirit to the Hobbit
Can’t believe George Martin is speaking in good faith! Hey, George, the reason Star Trek fans hate today’s Star Trek is that the cretins making today’s Star Trek hate Star Trek (and Star Trek fans)! Mystery solved, George!
He's clueless. He and reality won't ever meet again.
Yes, Star Trek: Picard season 3 was a crazy surprise and reminded me in a comforting way why other new stuff just sucks.
Yeah I get the feeling he is either delusional or just saying something to get the interviewer lady to smile at him. Pitiful.
He obviously knows what is going on, but needs to dance around the topic because he doesn't need to get f'ckd for saying the wrong thing
Exactly. When showrunners hate the franchise and want to turn it into something else, how are fans supposed to react?
Everytime I hear Ms. Potato repeat "First female dwarf of color." I wish someone would ask her "But what are her character traits? What is she like? What immersed you into the role?"
I would love to see her confused face as she repeats "Female. Brown."
And it’s not even true either… other stuff done decades ago still exists. Just coz THEY chose to ignore older films and shows doesn’t mean they invented the wheel
Commies cant leave anything white be. LOTR is white culture, so of course they had to corrupt and/or destroy it.
Potato is a really, really great description of that self-important ugly, tubby fool. No personality, no flavor of her own.
In fact, there are black or in this terms PoC dwarven in the Germanic mythology: Svartalf, or German: Schwarzelben/-elfen.
Because to understand Middle Earth more, we should recognise that Elven in the Germanic mythology are in fact a certain type of dwarven people.
And fat. Which shows the hypocrisy, because if they really wanted to subvert it all, and represent invisible demographics of society, they should have cast a fat, plain Galadriel. Now that would show those pesky, racist, sexist, fatist fans that they so love to hate. Wouldn't surprise me if they hadn't actually thought about, given the level of contempt they've shown to Tolkien, his work and those who love it.
This reminds me of Viggo Mortensen when he repeatedly got injured on set (broken tooth during Helm's Deep, the broken toe when he kicked the orc helm), yet he carried on, stayed in character and never let the audience know something was wrong with him as a person. Now we have "actors" who apparently struggle to perform because there's too many voices criticizing them.
I can promise you, none of these actors would break a tooth and just keep going. They'd cause a two week set break because they needed to get flown across the world to a specialist.
While we can all agree on how legendary is Viggo Mortensen, he never faced the type of pressure the actors of the rings of power had to face... Back in '97, the main pressure was on Peter Jackson being a young director spending 300M$ in 2 years to make 3 movies... That was the only thing people would judge beforehand. Nowadays, with vloggers, youtube, social media... We start b*itching about movies that aren't even made yet. Actors, if they pay attention to the media (and it's extremely hard not to), are under much more pressure and critics than before. That's a fact... But that's also why, at that level, they're paid extremely well...
@@dragonballistheway Those snowflakes do not feel any pressure cause they think they are alphas and omegas. They think they know everything the best and everything they do is perfect.
@@maksymalnybul6145yerp. But as long as you cry victim nothing can ever be your fault.
Amen
I don't consider people who need themselves to be seen "Actors".... Actors are supposed to hide themselves and become the character, not the other way around.
Actors playing the characters they’re suppose to act as what is this nonsense. Don’t you know that if you don’t have diversity even if it doesn’t make sense a brakes the lore your film is racist. People have to see themselves in every film/franchise or they can’t understand what said character is going through and how they feel. Cause you know it’s not about making characters that are relatable or characters that are easily recognizable to their book counter parts.
Now it’s all about making sure we hit the diversity quota so that people can see themselves in movies even if the character doesn’t fit. You just gotta think about it as us fixing the mistakes of the past and a grand redressing of things. Who needs good relatable characters when you have the power of DIVERSITY!!!! (Opens a bottle of bleach and drinks the whole thing because of how dumb “modern” storytelling is)
@@DarkSide_Gaming21338 in the wise words of one American Football player: "They had us in the first half, not gonna lie!."
they really moved away from what an actor is and expected everyone to like it
if i want to watch how the actor actually is i'll just watch a documentary
This is so epically true. You win the Internet.
this.
Hopefully George R.R. Martin is writing ROP season two, that way it'll never get finished.
that way it will have a lot better dialogues at the least :D
BURN!! Nice comment
And even if it makes it through, a lot of prestablished characters would get the George R.R. Treatment and get get out of the script. Since none of those characters are Tolkien’s, even those with names from Tolkien’s work, it could do no harm for they stopped showing up.
Give this man a like
It would be the best it could happen. I'm sure that RR Martin loved Got S8.
I don't understand why this idea is so foreign to so many people. I've lost track of the restaurants I used to love until they changed owners. New recipes, cheaper ingredients, smaller portions, and higher prices. And usually closed within a year of the ownership change. Nobody blamed the patrons for the failure just because the name didn't change.
Great analogy.
We see it all the time, if you don't supply what the customers want they will go elsewhere. Strangely insulting the customers is not an effective way of winning their trust and custom who knew??
Unironically, a great analogy.
Stolen, post-haste.
Little Caesar’s did this. 90s Caesar’s was my favorite chain pizza there was. Now you couldn’t pay me to eat it. So brutal.
Ohhhh, I like that!! ( I'll be using THIS example from now on! ) Thanks!
Absolutely spot on.
“How could people come to hate something they liked?”
Bold words from the man who had a show based on his own books that went belly up in the last season 😂
last 3 seasons tbh.
Yes true but he finally finished the last got book so soon we will be able to read HIS ending of this epic story and then we can all forget this insultingly disapointing end the producers of the show threw at us🙌🏻🙌🏻
@@clemenskuhn4943 Finished the last book? He still writing Winds of Winter, no? It's not finished. And then there is A Dream of Spring, which would be the last one.
@@clemenskuhn4943the last got book? You mean the ONE BOOK that's called game of thrones in the series a song of ice and fire? Man you don't even know what you're talking about and you call yourself a fan lmao
Can't forget the rewrite that he did because people online guessed the direction that he went.
He doesn't understand how people come to hate something they once loved? Well, imagine you really love Oranges, and then you get presented with a Lemon with the word 'Orange' written on it with Magic Marker. And the person who gave it to you get all pissy because you make a face as you bite into it.
Now it's pretty much become: Every time you ask for an orange you get one of these lemons. They keep telling you they are the most delicious oranges they've ever tasted, but you remember the taste of true oranges and this isn't it. Then they tell you that you must've never appreciated oranges in the first place or that you have bad taste.
And that you just don't like the lemon because it is yellow which means you are racist.
…and… I’ve been going to this place for a long time, because they had great oranges, and now they do not. Down the lane, there is another place that has great oranges. It’s ok to go there instead, right?
Remember, the behind-the-scenes footage from LOTR? How there was such camaraderie and fun between the cast, including the stunt people and the crew and the designers and everything? 🥰Now imagine what it's like on ROP's set with this bunch of "I'm the most important being on earth" no-name actors and actresses. 🥴
Rings of Prime have therapists instead of fun and friendship. Because it was never a joint project to put up the writers vision. It was all about me and my representation.
@@slimbombur7922 you are exactly right! It’s really interesting how none of them have achieved fame in their careers, but their egos are gigantic for some reason. “ I got the job because of my skin color“ is not something I would really brag about. I would feel ashamed in the same way I felt when in my late teens, my team won a participation trophy for finishing last in the tournament. It was a fresh new concept back then. I threw the trophy in the trash because they were not recyclable and also, I never wanted to see that thing again. 😂
Even she-hulk resented being hired by her new law firm only because she was a superhero.
@@slimbombur7922 Its about division. They aren't unifying or building a better future.
Good lord, I work in the industry and these people are the most insufferable egoists you can imagine.
How can one sit there and tell me I no longer love Lord of the Rings? I was in the damn theatre when the films ended. I have watched them every year since 2003 with my family. It is eternally etched onto my memory and the characters, words, moments and journeys have shaped me into the person I am today. The impact that the films have had on me is an understatement. The love I have for the characters and world of Middle Earth will be with me forever.
Unlike this piece of shit tv show.
When I got out of the theater after watching The Two Towers I was so pumped up that I walked straight into another showing and watched it again.
This is another problem with the west... See, you guys bring innovations to the world, but the rubbish you bring along, the lack of culture and the bad reeducation that comes along is making your technology counterproductive, like you guys are more harm than good...
What the hell do you mean you can't date your friend's daughter??? Are you saying if you befriend your stepdad, you have to get a divorce or are you saying the only time you can date your friend's daughter is if you met her before you befriended him???
I think they're mistaken in what is creepy about dating your friend's daughter because they don't have friends or daughters or families or brains so they can't figure it out...
The only time we would see that as creepy is if our friends are the same age as us so their daughters are way way younger than us, young enough to be your own daughter, not because she's the daughter of your friend, this is so freaking obvious...
Galadriel is thousands of years old and elrond should be barely 500 years old considering they're just forging the ring... What the hell are they talking about... It's their own fault for not making elrond look way younger than that and celebrien already born... They made elrond look the same age if not older than galadriel because they're not well read enough on Tolkien's lore that they don't even know there's an age difference and a considerable one at that... When elrond becomes 550, celebrien would look more than old enough to be his age mate because they grow normally but stop aging when they reach their peak, we know this because of elrond and elros in the lore with elros helping us see how a human would grow beside an elf, elrond and they're twins so you can easily compare the age... Elros and elrond grew the same way until elrond stopped aging at the peak of youth and since elros died a very wrinkled old man at the age of five hundred, 50-70 years should be when elves stop aging when we compare them to numenorians the second longest living race in middle earth so what the hell is creepy there in it... Galadriel should be way older celeborn I think, I can't recall... That's not considered creepy...
Amazon’s bullshit has nothing to do with LOTR !
Yes! Just because i'm fed a bad piece of pie doesn't mean i suddenly hate all pies. It just means i hate these exact pies from this exact bakery. I still love pies in general.
Disney's SW was the biggest let down for me, but i still went and got a Star Wars tattoo. Because i love Star Wars, and everything that does make it great enough to ink it into my skin permanently. It's ridiculous hearing JRRM say that.
The LOTR trilogy was lightning in a bottle. I cant imagine we will see anything as good as those for a long time. For me, as a person who saw the original SW in the cinema and has a very very large place in my heart for those 3 films the LOTR trilogy has surpassed them to my number 1 spot. Its not just because i love Tolkiens books so much, its much more than that. The love, the sweat, the talent, the effort etc... that went into them is apparent on every single frame of all three films.
I dont even consider "Rings of Power" to be Tolkien tbh. Its just trash. What they did to all the characters (especially Galadriel) is unforgivable. They turned her from a strong, kind, wise, beautiful, amazing character with wonderful back story to a hateful, insane, dumb, just awful woman. Its a shame that so many people who watched that show will come away thinking thats what Galadriel was like in the books. Far from it.
She was played and portrayed IMPECCABLY by Blanchet the original LOTR trilogy.
Bro I'm a hardcore star wars fan but it shouldn't even be a point of discussion. LOTR trilogy is LEAGUES better that Star Wars. I don't think that there's even one trilogy that comes close to LOTR, either I haven't watched it or I don't know it exists
@@giuseppesagona7522The original Star Wars were great while the prequels had their place. It's the sequels that turned people sour to the story and could have been skipped.
It should say something that when a show doesn’t have an effect on fans, I watched rings of power through only once and thankfully it didn’t stick with me enough to change and negatively impact how I see the true characters tolkien made
Massive loss of respect for G.R.R Martin. How can he not understand that fundamentally changing the thing we love, turns it into something we dont love?
He seems to genuinely believe fans are supposed to be blindly loyal, rather than fan loyalty being something you have to maintain by giving them more of and expanding what they love.
Loyalty has to be earned.
I don't get this writers' audacity to expect unconditional loyalty. Why? Something you love has a reason it's being loved. If that reason disappears, so does the love. Especially if it turns into the opposite.
This is another problem with the west... See, you guys bring innovations to the world, but the rubbish you bring along, the lack of culture and the bad reeducation that comes along is making your technology counterproductive, like you guys are more harm than good...
What the hell do you mean you can't date your friend's daughter??? Are you saying if you befriend your stepdad, you have to get a divorce or are you saying the only time you can date your friend's daughter is if you met her before you befriended him???
I think they're mistaken in what is creepy about dating your friend's daughter because they don't have friends or daughters or families or brains so they can't figure it out...
The only time we would see that as creepy is if our friends are the same age as us so their daughters are way way younger than us, young enough to be your own daughter, not because she's the daughter of your friend, this is so freaking obvious...
Galadriel is thousands of years old and elrond should be barely 500 years old considering they're just forging the ring... What the hell are they talking about... It's their own fault for not making elrond look way younger than that and celebrien already born... They made elrond look the same age if not older than galadriel because they're not well read enough on Tolkien's lore that they don't even know there's an age difference and a considerable one at that... When elrond becomes 550, celebrien would look more than old enough to be his age mate because they grow normally but stop aging when they reach their peak, we know this because of elrond and elros in the lore with elros helping us see how a human would grow beside an elf, elrond and they're twins so you can easily compare the age... Elros and elrond grew the same way until elrond stopped aging at the peak of youth and since elros died a very wrinkled old man at the age of five hundred, 50-70 years should be when elves stop aging when we compare them to numenorians the second longest living race in middle earth so what the hell is creepy there in it... Galadriel should be way older celeborn I think, I can't recall... That's not considered creepy...
Yes, he does believe fans should be blindly loyal, he's been stringing his fans along with completing the Winds of Winter for years now
He is a decent writer when it comes to GoT, but that's it. His other work is average, his personality is average and his ideology lies with the left and libtards. GRRM is the Trump of literature lol he does good work, but he is a shitty person.
GRR Martin is a perverted weirdo who made a career of trying to be the antiTolkein. He's not a decent person.
I am PuertoRican, raised in the mountains, and I never wished to change anything about something I DID NOT CREATE. Oh yeah, I am also a Tolkien fan. Did I imagine myself playing a dwarf working the mines and ending the day shift to go home and inhaled 6 pints? Sure, but that's my fan fiction😂.
Another puertorrican here, raised in the mountains as well. 🇵🇷
I agree 100% with you.
This is another problem with the west... See, you guys bring innovations to the world, but the rubbish you bring along, the lack of culture and the bad reeducation that comes along is making your technology counterproductive, like you guys are more harm than good...
What the hell do you mean you can't date your friend's daughter??? Are you saying if you befriend your stepdad, you have to get a divorce or are you saying the only time you can date your friend's daughter is if you met her before you befriended him???
I think they're mistaken in what is creepy about dating your friend's daughter because they don't have friends or daughters or families or brains so they can't figure it out...
The only time we would see that as creepy is if our friends are the same age as us so their daughters are way way younger than us, young enough to be your own daughter, not because she's the daughter of your friend, this is so freaking obvious...
Galadriel is thousands of years old and elrond should be barely 500 years old considering they're just forging the ring... What the hell are they talking about... It's their own fault for not making elrond look way younger than that and celebrien already born... They made elrond look the same age if not older than galadriel because they're not well read enough on Tolkien's lore that they don't even know there's an age difference and a considerable one at that... When elrond becomes 550, celebrien would look more than old enough to be his age mate because they grow normally but stop aging when they reach their peak, we know this because of elrond and elros in the lore with elros helping us see how a human would grow beside an elf, elrond and they're twins so you can easily compare the age... Elros and elrond grew the same way until elrond stopped aging at the peak of youth and since elros died a very wrinkled old man at the age of five hundred, 50-70 years should be when elves stop aging when we compare them to numenorians the second longest living race in middle earth so what the hell is creepy there in it... Galadriel should be way older celeborn I think, I can't recall... That's not considered creepy...
Another Puerto Rican, Agree with you too.
@@johnnycrown5097 Will you stop copy and pasting this comment everywhere, half of it isn't even relevant.
Boricua as well, and I second that.
>>A lot of people who watched the LoTR movies didn't actually read the books, but they were enamoured by them and bought the books. That's a sign of how good these movies were.
>>Viggo Mortensen who played Aragorn back then was brought at the last minute after the previous actor was out. He was older than the previous actor and didn't have the same prep, but he did his due diligence to get in character, and he was brilliant. Compared to someone like that black elf actor from *_"Dungs of Pawah"_* who just talks about himself and how it affects him, you see yet another reason why Jackson's LoTR won the hearts of many.
>>Peter Jackson himself knew he took some creative libeties with the story to fit them into movies, but he stayed true to the Tolkien spirit, and that's another reason the movies were good.
An adaptation can differ from the source material, but they can still be good and respectful. Rings of Power changes without any respect, with only the intention of parading idenity politics and satisfying egoes and personal agendas. There's no spirit or spark in this series; it's just Dung.
True. But it can only differ so much. Differ as much as say, ROP, and you get an abomination of a show, simply because it isn't what it is adapting.
That's what I love about Peter Jackson's work. He genuinely cared about the source material and did as much as he could be faithful to it while also making a good movie (more like the best trilogy ever produced).
People are willing to excuse omissions and tweaks in the story because we know why and respect the why. The same cannot nor ever will be said about the RoP.
Peter Jackson was very clear when he started making the movies that he would leave politics out of it. And thats one of the biggest decissions that made the trilogy so succesfull. It dropped of with the hobbit series and crashed and burned with the ROP series. Funny how that works. A fantasy world where we want to got to to escape normal life turned into just having normal life politics and gender idiology trown into our faces and peopel wonder why it failed or GRR martin not understanding why we dont love what we used to love anymore. And he saying dont watch it is axactly what we are doing.
Viggo Mortensen was brilliant as Aragorn. I'll admit I only knew him as Masterchief from GI Jane at the time and didn't know he was brought in last minute but I can't think of any actor who could play that role better
Furthermore, PJ made sure that everyone who worked with him were also appreciative and respectful to the material. I think nearly all the key personnel have read the books at least once and many of them had the books on hand whilst on set.
As a huge fan of wheel of time, I grew up reading the books on the 90s and reread each book as they came out. So when the show came out it was so horrific. It hurt. I can’t explain.
I know its incredibly disrespectful to the author you the fans everything
It's always amazing when they say they've never seen a mythological creature that looks like them. Maybe they should separate reality from fantasy and stop trying to insert themselves into something they didn't create.
Every culture and race has fairy tales, myths, and legends. Instead of saying I'm not represented in the ones already out there why not find the ones you are and bring them to the big or small screen. Audiences would love to see new content
Fk'n Monkeys that think *what* they are is *who* they are. Because that's how un-evolved they are.
Wisdom: "Luminous beings are we, not this crude matter."
Ignorance: "I just wanna see someone who looks like me!"
So you only deem a story worthy if the characters ethnically resemble you?
Well, gee, who's the fk'n racist now?!
A creature that looks like them. The creature only looks like the actor playing the part. Are they saying that all black people look the same?
@@justinm2697no
They're saying they haven't seen a black mythological creature. Like fairies and fawns, they look white and have been represented as such, right? Well they haven't seen a creature that can and has been represented as black.
They're proud African Americans, but are not willing to look up on some African mythos, instead they want to insert into European ones.
I never understood self insert. I never looked at disney princesses (for example) and think, ah that looks like me so i can relate. As a little girl my favourite character was Pocahontas and guess what i am not native to america yet i found her very inspiring. Hiw can we relate to any of the toys from Toys Story? None of us are a plastic dinasour and yet it’s a timeless classic. Almost as if (most) people relate to emotions and not necessarily looks.
Yes, it is our fault as the viewers who have full control over how the show is produced!!! Come on guys! How could we!
This is another problem with the west... See, you guys bring innovations to the world, but the rubbish you bring along, the lack of culture and the bad reeducation that comes along is making your technology counterproductive, like you guys are more harm than good...
What the hell do you mean you can't date your friend's daughter??? Are you saying if you befriend your stepdad, you have to get a divorce or are you saying the only time you can date your friend's daughter is if you met her before you befriended him???
I think they're mistaken in what is creepy about dating your friend's daughter because they don't have friends or daughters or families or brains so they can't figure it out...
The only time we would see that as creepy is if our friends are the same age as us so their daughters are way way younger than us, young enough to be your own daughter, not because she's the daughter of your friend, this is so freaking obvious...
Galadriel is thousands of years old and elrond should be barely 500 years old considering they're just forging the ring... What the hell are they talking about... It's their own fault for not making elrond look way younger than that and celebrien already born... They made elrond look the same age if not older than galadriel because they're not well read enough on Tolkien's lore that they don't even know there's an age difference and a considerable one at that... When elrond becomes 550, celebrien would look more than old enough to be his age mate because they grow normally but stop aging when they reach their peak, we know this because of elrond and elros in the lore with elros helping us see how a human would grow beside an elf, elrond and they're twins so you can easily compare the age... Elros and elrond grew the same way until elrond stopped aging at the peak of youth and since elros died a very wrinkled old man at the age of five hundred, 50-70 years should be when elves stop aging when we compare them to numenorians the second longest living race in middle earth so what the hell is creepy there in it... Galadriel should be way older celeborn I think, I can't recall... That's not considered creepy...
They expect us to love whatever turd they drop on our plate and if we don’t like it it’s our fault we don’t like crap.
Martin nailed the problem if it weren't for a complete lack of self awareness:
"They loved it, we changed it and now they hate it.. how can you hate what you once loved, I mean, what the hell?!"
Because they twisted it to the point not only it requires reconstructive surgery. They also broke it's soul. For the sake of a "modern audience" that didn't watch it.
also wasnt it Martin himselve shitting on the GOT series when he did not finished his books fast enough they took liberty with the story and then complain they ended GOT in a way he would never write it and now he still has not finished the last book out of spite? Such hypocrite. So GOT makers should have stayed true to his story, but the rest can alter everything and everything without fans allowed to complain everything they once loved is changed? What gives him the sole right to complain about showrunners liberal changes in established stories?
@@ronniebots9225 Clear case of "rules for thee, not for me" entitlement.
It's the financial success, embracing commercial exploitation of one's creativity and the back patting inside the Hollywood bubble I suppose.
Of course it must be hard to stomach that your best work is behind you, especially with the pressure of the industry to repeat it, let alone top it.
@Hansy I ment to say nothing bad, I hardly know the man and he seems a legit creative mind.
It's probably more the industry that feeds ego's to milk their output.
@@ronniebots9225 yep, I love that shit bag like I love crabs. What an asshat, let's do games and shows instead of finishing your story that people are going to die before they can finish it.
I can just never forgive them for the destruction of Galadriel, one of the most beautiful characters that Tolkien ever wrote.
Whatever you say, drama queen. In no way has she been "destroyed" at all. Control your fear.
@@fleetstreet11the Galadriel character in Rings of Power has nothing to do with the one in Tolkien’s writing
@@chrissmith7669 That's your problem.
@@fleetstreet11 no. It’s the problem of the producers of this series wondering why it’s not being watched and won’t be. Galadriel in the second age had cooled her passions that led to participating in the kin slaying. By the second she was wiser and not a rash by Tolkiens description. The one in Rings of Power took no council with anyone and was simply a hot head.
@@chrissmith7669 Again, that is your problem. Just accept that the two are different.
The backlash this show continues to ignore and shift blame will always be laughable. Any other show with this much negativity and lack of viewership would have been cancelled. They can't let this show fail, but instead make it worse.
This bonfire is getting better and better.
You will enjoy progress.
RoP: "Have we started the fire?"
Amazon: "Yes! The fire rises!"
It's me or Cordova put the words elves, white and aryan in the same sentence ? Is he trying to associate Tolkien with Nazi ?
@@Sombre____ English write you not this do well.
Did you pass that comment through a paper shredder before mangling it with google translate, or is your brain really that badly wired?!?
This is another problem with the west... See, you guys bring innovations to the world, but the rubbish you bring along, the lack of culture and the bad reeducation that comes along is making your technology counterproductive, like you guys are more harm than good...
What the hell do you mean you can't date your friend's daughter??? Are you saying if you befriend your stepdad, you have to get a divorce or are you saying the only time you can date your friend's daughter is if you met her before you befriended him???
I think they're mistaken in what is creepy about dating your friend's daughter because they don't have friends or daughters or families or brains so they can't figure it out...
The only time we would see that as creepy is if our friends are the same age as us so their daughters are way way younger than us, young enough to be your own daughter, not because she's the daughter of your friend, this is so freaking obvious...
Galadriel is thousands of years old and elrond should be barely 500 years old considering they're just forging the ring... What the hell are they talking about... It's their own fault for not making elrond look way younger than that and celebrien already born... They made elrond look the same age if not older than galadriel because they're not well read enough on Tolkien's lore that they don't even know there's an age difference and a considerable one at that... When elrond becomes 550, celebrien would look more than old enough to be his age mate because they grow normally but stop aging when they reach their peak, we know this because of elrond and elros in the lore with elros helping us see how a human would grow beside an elf, elrond and they're twins so you can easily compare the age... Elros and elrond grew the same way until elrond stopped aging at the peak of youth and since elros died a very wrinkled old man at the age of five hundred, 50-70 years should be when elves stop aging when we compare them to numenorians the second longest living race in middle earth so what the hell is creepy there in it... Galadriel should be way older celeborn I think, I can't recall... That's not considered creepy...
In my 40 years on this Earth one quote rings true more and more in all facets of life... "you give an inch, they take a mile".
Exactly. In my language we say something along the lines “You give them a finger they’ll bite off a whole arm/they’ll bite off up to the elbow.”
Who’s ‘they’ is this situation?
@@idkman6496 generally speakjng the term is referring to anyone in your life that you concede something to.
@@idkman6496 the "we just want to get married" group I would guess.
The devil makes work for idle hands,is probably closer to the truth.
We are not amazon fans we are not the writers fans we are tolkien fans we love the man and His works you having the name cause you payed cash dosn't entile you to our repsect for that is earned and never bought.
More like Tolkien fans don't like Amazon's fanfiction
@@kaimanthelizardwizard1248hate fiction you have to be a fan to write fan fiction
@@PALACIO254 or 'wokefiction'
I don't understand how George R.R Martin can be so blissfully unaware of how audiences can grow to hate shows or franchises they loved. There's a difference between change and contradiction especially when the series you're producing for no longer has the original writer or producer. Rings of power, the Star Wars sequels and many more have multiple issues but they also both no longer have the people who created them in the first place so it's beyond easy for new writers to completely contradict parts of the lore and stems from wanting to change things that the original writer clearly established.
Thank you peter Jackson you gave us what we wanted before these sycophants defiled it.
Exactly, but he did fuckup hobit
@@dogghammer hobbit was better than lotr
@@addy1294 haha🤣🤣
@@addy1294 lol good joke 🤣
@@dogghammer he didint... the studio did.. I like the hobbit movies but nothing can top the LoTR
I wonder if GRRM would understand Star Trek, Star Wars and Tolkien better if you explained to him how Song of Fire and Ice fans loved Game of Thrones when it was closely based on his work, but hated seasons 7 and 8, where the connection to his work had gotten extremely loose and the quality of the writing that filled in the gaps was extremely poor. Surely he HAS watched seasons 7 and 8, no? How could he not understand?
It's odd cuz George actually seemed to be genuinely disappointed in season 8. He said that he was too busy to even watch the show during season 8. I think he defended ROP to get some social points or something.
I actually think GRRM is so freaked out because the ending of GoT was close to the way he was going to end ASOIAF. He saw how poorly the fans reacted to season 8, with Dany doing a heel turn and Bran becoming King, while Jon becomes a background player so the women can take out the Night King and rule Winterfell. He saw all of that and now he's frozen, unable to complete his series (even though he had 2 years of Covid to sit indoors and work) so he's lashing out at ALL fans, because it can't be creators' faults. It's the fans.
He's being intentionally ignorant. He can't not know.
@@mmclaurin8035 What happened in season 8 made perfect sense. The execution was horrible. Rewatch the series and you see that Bran is meant to be the King and that Dany never, ever showed mercy. Never. But they should've built up Dany being the "Mad Queen" more.
@@Paulafan5 But Bran is a terrible king candidate, what self respecting medieval society would tolerate a crippled king who doesn't even follow the country state religioun? As someone who wroked with history I just can't tolerate something so outlandish then this.
If you dont like it dont watch…we didn’t
Agree.
Though I do love watching people destroy it on utube
@@ericvulgate same
And then they yelled at us for it, after specifically telling us as supposed 'racists' not to watch. You can never satisfy people.
Exactly, we didn't either
Galadriel didn't make any rings of any significance. The three elven rings were made by Celebrimbor without the knowledge of Anatar (Sauron). When Sauron found out he immediately attacked the whole region & killed Celebrimbor.
Tbh he first tortured Celebrimbor, taking his sweet time lol
@@svrkl15stnbld17the fact that I can’t see halbrand being bothered at all is just one example of the massive casting issues. Sauron the biggest evil EVER short of morgoth and dude just wanted to chill making swords all day and would have had Galadriel just left him on his post villain phase vacation.
Christopher Tolkien once said that in all his research of his father's work he only ever found one instance of sn uncorrobotated reference in the entire csnon. In other words, there was an almost miraculous absence of contradictions..
Yeah if ROP was a generic fantasy series I'd happily watch it. Fantasy doesn't need to make sense. But Tolkien does. And there's so many things with ROP that's just stupid. I lost interest when Galadriel swam across an ocean. And bumped into another main character at that. It's just too stupid to take seriously. And I did hate Peter Jacksons movies as well for changing nearly everything in one way or another, but those were at least well made movies with good practical effects. It's silly that they made ROP the most expensive show ever and have people look like traveling to Moria/Khazad-Dûm is a five minute stroll.
@@ViktorSarge If ROP had been a generic fantasy series I don't think I would've made it through the second episode. I think (I don't actually remember) I got about halfway through the 5th and that was only because of the Lord of The Rings name. I would have given up earlier because it's just so unreasonably boring and the 5th episode was as far as I could get with all my determination. Playing through the vanilla intro to Skyrim for the 25th time is still more interesting than ROP ever got for me.
@@luckybynn5788 Yeah fair enough. I got Prime because I wanted to give it a chance. But I ended up watching (and absolutely loving) American Gods instead. I only ever finished the first 2,5 episodes of ROP I think before I just got plain bored.
Can't recommend American Gods enough though. It's a great book and the adaptation is well made. And instead of smug corporate representation it's unforgiving furious confrontation with the history of slavery, with race issues, gender, sex, oppression, colonization/genocide, religion, worship of violence and entertaining as heck meanwhile. Only gripe is that we miss out on the book ending. Being Swedish I think Gaiman did a good job with Norse mythology.
@@ViktorSarge "Fantasy doesn't need to make sense"
Thats not true. Fantasy still needs to be internally consistent within the confines of its own rules. It should also speak to timeless archetypes because thats what makes any work of fiction relatable and enjoyable. It should also not be propaganda.
"Its fantasy" does not excuse the fact that they made a single mom a military leader, for example. Thats just nonsense that would never happen. Even if its fantasy, if it has humans, they should still act like humans.
@@Likexner Absolutely! In the fantasy genre, you are writing outside the constraints of the real world, but that doesn't mean "oh it's fantasy, we can do whatever we want", it means that you have to build an entire world... and not just the world, but the peoples, cultures, history... and all of that had better make sense. Writing good fantasy is *hard*; only a small handful of people can pull it off.
"The elves have been historically portrayed as white and Aryan." - Ismael Cruz Cordova
Wow! First of all, _historically,_ the elves are part of North European mythology going back as far as (written) history goes, for that part of the World. Since the Germanic tribes were Indo-European, and other Indo-European tribes migrated to India, shared mythology shows up in both European and Indian religions and folklore. There are no elves in Indian mythology and folklore, which means that the idea of elves in North Europe probably predates the Germanic tribes, and comes from a pre-Indo-European culture. That puts the origin of elves far into prehistory, all the way back to the Late Stone Age (more than 5,000 ago). Neolithic North Europeans still make up a large portion of North European genetic heritage, and they were white. In surviving descriptions from the Iron Age, elves were described as white. Almost certainly, the elves of mythology were always white.
That's not really important, though. A writer could very well develop a fantasy world where that part of history was ignored, and the elves were black. However, _that's not what Tolkien did._ He kept that traditional aspect of elves. As anyone who has read Tolkien knows, his use of history and mythology was very deliberate and carefully considered; it's not something you can change, without clearly breaking with the world he created. Doing so is disrespectful of Tolkien.
It's not only disrespectful against Tolkien, though. It's also disrespectful of North European culture. Again, not because elves can't be black, in a fantasy world explicitly created that way. It's disrespectful because it's portrayed as if elves are part of a shared, ancestral culture, with no particular connection to any specific people or place. The line is that elves can _of course_ be black. That there's nothing new or remarkable about that. That the only reason why black elves aren't traditional, is that "Aryans" excluded black people. That it has nothing to do with the fact that the nations who believed in elves were white. This was the original meaning of cultural appropriation; when one culture adopted elements from another, and then pretended they hadn't, that this element had no particular connection to that other culture. If I was to put on a traditional Xhosa head dress, and then claim that it was as much a part of Norwegian culture (I'm Norwegian) as of any other culture, that would be appropriation in the original meaning. The real insult is in the latter part: in denying the origin.
Elves haven't just "been historically _portrayed_ as white"; they have historically _been_ white; they're an idea, and whatever that idea was, is what elves were.
Elves have never been Aryan, though. The Aryans were the Indo-European tribes that migrated to India. They have nothing to do with elves. The only possible motive for dragging in the term 'Aryan', is to connect traditional elves to Nazi terminology. That's about as offensive as anything can get. Certainly, it's not something Tolkien will have been confused about, and the professor would probably have been profoundly insulted.
P.S.: Yes, I noticed that he acknowledged "folklore", with the phrase "there's folklore", before immediately moving on. Even this minuscule acknowledgement of the existence of original mythology is entirely new, from him, and from anyone connected with the show.
Edit: I made an erroneous reference to the Celts, which was pointed out. I've edited out the reference to avoid misinforming people, as not all will read the entire thread.
I agree with you. Just wanted to add to "That's about as offensive as anything can get. Certainly, it's not something Tolkien will have been confused about, and the professor would probably have been profoundly insulted".
Tolkien wrote a lovely letter on exactly that in 1938. It comes up pretty easily if you google Tolkien aryan letter. well worth a read.
Ismael Cordova Cruz is just the face of the Blackwashing of Norwegian, Germanic, British and Indo-European traditions, mythology and folklore. Dem Rangz o’ Cultural Appropriation. They’re trying to erase the ‘Olds.’ They’re all Maoist zealots and propagandist wh0res, ‘They’ are trying to erase ‘us’ again and steal our heritage and try to use this to set up a ‘in-group/out-group’ dynamic.
But why is everyone getting upset about a dark skinned elf, while nobody is saying anything about the harfoots’ complexion? Why doesn’t anyone want to base the elves off of Tolkien’s sketch of Beleg finding Gwindor? And why can’t we accept that changing some of Tolkien’s work to make sure that we include minorities in the talent pool for their portrayal might be more important than staying true to the parts of the lore that have literally nothing to say for the story?
@@Ekcyboo I'm not sure what your issue with the Harfoots' complexion is. Perhaps I would know, if I'd actually seen the show, rather than just summations of it. I'll accept ignorance on the point, rather than suffer watching this drivel. Yes, I can know that it's drivel, based on summations from trusted sources.
However, generally speaking, there's a lot of freedom when writing about the Hobbits' past, because Tolkien never really did. There's a description of Sméagol's people, who are supposed to be closely related, but it's fairly fuzzy, and that's all there is. With the elves, there's no such flexibility.
Even with the above being the case, I've noticed no shortage of criticism of the portrayal of the Harfoots...
The lore is more important than the type of racial diversity you find at Starbucks for more reasons than I could possibly fit into a TH-cam comment. I believe I've already mentioned some, but, for your benefit, I'll mention some more:
- Middle-earth isn't Starbucks. It's not even modern day North America. What's more, the entirety of the rest of the real World is also not Starbucks or North America. Turning all social commentary into a matter of New York City Starbucks type "diversity" is disrespectful to very nearly everyone on the planet.
- Tolkien didn't do social commentary. His commentary was on profound issues of ethics, history, emotion, communication, meaning and purpose, the nature of reality, and other topics of similar weight. Dragging social commentary into it is to drag everything down.
- The books establish clearly and exactly the World in which they take place, and nothing about it is random. People who read and reread the books always discover new things, and new levels to old things. There's no way that anyone can confidently say that "this particular bit of lore isn't very important", because the next rereading may prove them wrong. That you feel confident that there are parts of the lore that have "literally nothing to say for the story" only tells me that you're not a Tolkien fan, and never will be.
- Tolkien's work was never about making people feel included. They work both on a much deeper level than that, and on a much higher level. If you need to be the same skin color as an elf, in order to appreciate the story of Númenor, then you'll never grasp the story of Númenor. If you don't need it, the change isn't necessary. I have faith in people's ability to grasp things. They've always had it, until now; if it has suddenly been lost, the last thing we should do is accommodate this new ignorance.
- The concept of 'race' in Tolkien is a very old one, and refers to a shared history and ancestry, rather than external traits. However, shared external traits are inevitable consequences of shared history and ancestry; more so than the modern concept of race, which simply divide by skin color. In Tolkien, appearance is an expression of the history of a people, and history is very important on Middle-earth. It's what drives all events.
- It's primitive pandering, which disgraces Tolkien's legacy. It's precisely the sort of shallow nonsense that Tolkien made every effort to avoid. He thought metaphorical storytelling was primitive; "representation" is even more simplistic.
- It's unnecessary. If they wanted black representation, it could've been easily accomplished _within the lore._ Parts of their story takes place in Harad, anyway, and the Haradrim are black, according to lore. Rather than take advantage of that, and populate the continent with strong and exciting cultures, they went ahead and turned many Haradrim white.
- It short-changes Africans and African-Americans, both, though many of the latter may be too confused to realize it. Rather than shoe-horn in some black elves and dwarves, Amazon could've made a show based on an African fantasy novel, or directly on African mythology and/or history. Wouldn't that have been something?
I could go on, but I'm sure we both think this will do, for now. I'll just add one, last thing:
@@erikjrn4080 I have no issues with the complexion of the harfoots, much the same way that I have no issues with the complexions of any of the characters. But I find it telling that no one has critized them for being too light skinned, seeing as Tolkien specifically noted that they are shorter and browner than hobbits.
As for some of your other points: I started reading Lord of the Rings in my own language for the first time at age 7, and didn’t do much else than read that book over and over again during my childhood. I don’t remember ever having read a passage where skin tone was a critical issue for the story.
I also am fully aware that inclusion wasn’t Tolkien’s goal, and not something he wanted to accomplish in his world. My point is that it *is* a goal that we want to accomplish in the real world, the one that matters, and one of the ways to do that is through representation and exposure. Using «That’s not what iron age Norwegians said» as an argument against diverse casting for elven characters is quite frankly ridiculous.
"If you don't like a show don't watch it" -George RR Martin
If you don't like your own story, never finish it and sell the rights? Great legacy, George.
It's not that hard to understand how fans who've been invested in a fandom for years don't like overproduced fanfic from obvious non-fans.
I've kept up with his ASOIAF books since 2009. Buy the copy the day of release and read it in 2 or 3 days. I'm no longer waiting on Winds of Winter. I've moved on
@@ringofasho7721you'll probably die of old age before it comes out anyway... 😂
I mean not watching it means they don't get the views, low views help in killing the new abomination.
Dude. You've got it backwards. Ever since the parrot media debacle got exposed... I've been thinking. The more you cry against their stuff, even if you don't watch the show, they still perceive it as positive, since your spending time and effort watching content about the show or engaging with it. So... The more we do this, the more they feel they're doing the right thing
@@hombreg1 I'll go with Occam's razor: ineptitude, incompetence, delusion. They lose profit on this stuff short-term and long-term. You'd have to assume they're even capable of 5D Chess.
My husband and I were super excited for this…We lost interest mid-way 1st episode. We tried 3 times to watch it again and it was so hard. We watched maybe two more and just gave up. Just now we said maybe we weren’t in the right mind, we literally thought it was us and not them so maybe we’ll try it again but now we know everyone felt the same way!
Yeah Ditto ditto ditto but on ep 2
I went round my parents once & they were watching it… I was bored to tears… as far as I know they never finished the series & it was never spoken of again
What are the highest levels of education achieved by you and your husband?
@@Edruezzi Whats the highest achieved by you? because going off your sub list you're either a typical modern day magical fat black woman or a soft black man..either way it's safe to assume you're unseasonably tanned trash with no education yourself x) Did Royce's comment offend you because they didn't enjoy this woke rubbish that only caters to white women with 9 cats & ugly black women that love Lizzo?
Why whenever a show fails the creators of the show act so immature and blame others for their failure?
because we're living in clown world and western society is about to collapse
It is hollywood, they are all a bunch of narcissistic fucks. THey all think they are god sends, the next big thing after sliced bread. They are physically incapable of recognizing they could be wrong, taking responsability
This is another problem with the west... See, you guys bring innovations to the world, but the rubbish you bring along, the lack of culture and the bad reeducation that comes along is making your technology counterproductive, like you guys are more harm than good...
What the hell do you mean you can't date your friend's daughter??? Are you saying if you befriend your stepdad, you have to get a divorce or are you saying the only time you can date your friend's daughter is if you met her before you befriended him???
I think they're mistaken in what is creepy about dating your friend's daughter because they don't have friends or daughters or families or brains so they can't figure it out...
The only time we would see that as creepy is if our friends are the same age as us so their daughters are way way younger than us, young enough to be your own daughter, not because she's the daughter of your friend, this is so freaking obvious...
Galadriel is thousands of years old and elrond should be barely 500 years old considering they're just forging the ring... What the hell are they talking about... It's their own fault for not making elrond look way younger than that and celebrien already born... They made elrond look the same age if not older than galadriel because they're not well read enough on Tolkien's lore that they don't even know there's an age difference and a considerable one at that... When elrond becomes 550, celebrien would look more than old enough to be his age mate because they grow normally but stop aging when they reach their peak, we know this because of elrond and elros in the lore with elros helping us see how a human would grow beside an elf, elrond and they're twins so you can easily compare the age... Elros and elrond grew the same way until elrond stopped aging at the peak of youth and since elros died a very wrinkled old man at the age of five hundred, 50-70 years should be when elves stop aging when we compare them to numenorians the second longest living race in middle earth so what the hell is creepy there in it... Galadriel should be way older celeborn I think, I can't recall... That's not considered creepy...
Left@rds.
You named it. Immature..
So wait, you're telling me the Galadriel actress has more than one facial expression?!?! she can actually smile and laugh?!?! where was this in the show? Granted it probably wouldn't have made much difference, but it would've been a massive improvement.
Th actress is lovely and has the ethereal looks needed for a younger Galadriel. She was the only character playing an elf who actually had the appearance and carriage of an elf. Too bad she was written and directly so abominably.
She only has 2 expressions: RBF and constipated.
@@kimberlyoldschool I agree completely
@@kimberlyoldschool If Elves were Hobbits maybe.
@@kimberlyoldschool She's lovely? She's a delusional narcissist like the rest of the cast (and pretty much the rest of Hollywood). I agree not even a good actor could have pulled off that abomination of a script, but she can't even smile without giving everybody nightmares lol
“The quality of writing is inversely proportional to how smug you are as you write it.”
Brilliant! That would certainly explain the galloping narcissism in today’s Hollywood!
Peter Jackson also changed and cut some "minor" things in the LOTR movies but it works somehow - but he didn't have to do much because the story was already there. Like you trust enough what you have in your hands.
I recenlty re-read LOTR, and it was very different, but Jackson did not changed the tolkien's message...
@@elendilnix Yeah, it is. But for a film it did the job well. It's always a thing between Books and Screen.
So Tolkien created a masterpiece and lived threw the trenches of ww1 . And modern actors need therapists?
Yeah well, did JRR ever fight in the Great Battle of Gamergate? 😂
@@crazyralph6386 oh no not the Gamergate!!!! 🤣🤣🤣🤣
Don't forget the pair of mithril he had to tell the Germans to bugger off when they were still at full power.
The fact that people don't get that fans aren't "toxic" but are actually just really passionate when it comes to one of their favorite IPs ever really just shows their own inability to create something new of their and also shows their delusion that if fans hate something then they're toxic! No, they're the one who are toxic! Not us! They keep on calling us that and attack us when we criticize something that they're doing if it seems a little and then blame us when it fails because they attacked us so we didn't support it! What a pathetic joke! Until Hollywood realizes that their fans are their customer base and stop attacking them in the marketing campaigns for their upcoming projects, then they'll continue to fail! Get woke, go broke!
@Tae Jasper Ikr. I still remember when one of Aquaman movie producer, Peter Safran calling out DC fans as toxic for hating on Amber Heard, aka Amber Turd or the "Husband Beater" and wanting her out of Aquaman 2. His words, I quote, "I do not think that we are ever going to react to, honestly, to just pure fan pressure".
@@aaronlimeuchin7352 Yeah, that wasn't the best that he could've made! But you have to remember that he and James Gunn were under a lot pressure to try and market these films without controversy and that was going to be hard to do! So I get it at least, what they were trying to do!
Well fans can indeed be very toxic. Back in the days of the Star Wars prequels fans threw so much hate at Hayden Christensen that he quit acting for decades. Yes he returned to acting recently, but that degree of hate was scary.
But I do agree with everything else you said. The majority of fans are just very passionate.
@@xolitaire Yes, well, I don't think that Hayden deserves any hate at all because he did nothing wrong really! And yes, I was right about most fans just being passionate and not wanting their favorites IPs and franchises ruined for the sake of being "more modern" and trying "to reflect the world we live in today", when literally entertainment is called that for a reason, not everything has to be real and it means it can be fictional! That's what Hollywood writers and producers need to learn!
Really? You need to scroll up only 2 comments to see a toxic comment made about the actors and the show literally name calling and actor just for being excited that she gets to represet people of color in one of the biggest franchise ever? I understas fans not liking the writong or the plot or how they literally time skipped alot unoficially in the show. But fans are attacking the show beacause "dWaRfS aNd eLvEs cAN't Be bLaCk!" In this fictional world which was written 1937.
You've hit the nail, I think.... multiple actors are voicing the same attitudes:
Cordova : "I wanted to be an elf.... it would change things..."
Nomvete : "A redress of balance in this world...."
Dylan Mulvaney : "LOOK AT ME ME ME ME ME MEEEEEEEEEEE"
It's an epidemic of selfishness and self centredness. And those who should be pushing back, those who should be keeping the greed in check, no longer have common sense or morals. Instead they have a list of "woke" goals. Here is how it works:
Actor : "I want to be the first XXX in this role because I'm proud of being me."
Producer : "Well, Diversity is a good thing because it says so on this checklist. And you certainly Diverge from the character in the original text."
And THEN they declare that it's all for the good because little girls with fish tails are now "represented" on the screen. Well, you know who's NOT represented on the screen any more? Tolkein, Andersen, and the other writers who MADE THIS POSSIBLE.
Completely agree, although we should stop calling this slop "Diversity" because it isn't (plus that's what the filthy SJW wants you to call it) it's actually just straight up Tokenism.
Rich people in Hollywood profiting off of people's appearance.
It's narcissism (poorly) disguised a "social justice"
I recommend Dr Ramani's 2019 book 'Don't You Know Who I Am?' in which she examines the growth and power of Narcissism in modern culture.
@@clogs4956 That is what happens when you replace god with the self. America has turned away from the foundation that our country was built upon, christian values. I wasn't raised religious but all the vile debauchery & narcissism raging in modern times, I am glad I found our lord. He led me to him.
Woke marxism is the new religion.
I have ZERO problems with the casting of Ariel - that actress looks perfect except for her skin (ie should quite possibly be pale GREEN). & she has a gorgeous voice.
My problem with ROP - the writing & the destruction of the lore. Not the skin color of a few characters (although they could have done this so much smarter)
"I don't understand how someone can come to hate something they once loved."
when something you loved turns to shit, of course you'll hate it
“If you don’t like a show then don’t watch it”
- George R.R. Martin
Truth laid out for the masses
"In order for our evil to triumph, we really need the good fans to sit out, shut up, not watch or contest our defilements of their beloved stories and characters."
Cultural Marxists and Amazon Showrunners.
Can do, George! See you next time I rewatch GoT, probably right after you get that book done (i.e. never)
I didn't, yet still I am being blamed as a reason for many different show's failures.
Lmao and they didn't. No one is watching these things. a small pool of reviewers and critics watched it, because that's their job, and that was it. Nobody is "hate watching" this stuff. It's not happening. Why do people keep having to pretend otherwise?
“If you don’t like a show then don’t watch it”
- George R.R. Martin
"Challenge accepted"
-The People
"Wait...revenue...hold on..."
-The Accountants
If the fans hate it so much, then its fairly obvious that the producers are NOT making the programme for those fans, but for THEMSELVES. And that is a GUARANTED FAILURE.
Sad part is, is that it can still work if you make a show like it for yourself, but the actual content needs to be good. People are willing to deal with this kind of shit if the stories are there, and the franchise is regarded well within the stories told. Neither of those things are true for Rings of Power.
Shocker they attacked fans who could’ve seen that coming 👀
The casting wasn’t the problem with rings of power, it was the complete disregard for established canon, small changes for flow and pacing are fine, but complete event rewrites start to bother people, and when there is a huge lore shift every episode…it starts to look like they think they could have written it better than the original author…
"I don't understand how people come to hate things that they once loved"
I know why - they hate that beloved literature is disrespected to such an extent the original creator would not recognize it, and despise the politicization and skin color cast mandates that dictate every aspect of what should be just good storytelling.
Everyone is sick of it, minorities know you're using them, original fans aren't served with legitimate iterations of the story, and instead have to classify this as a redux.
I'm guessing he's defending the hate towards GOT's final season, not defending ROP.
I on the other hand, classify most of it as: shit I won't knowingly shell out good money for ditto, so I guess I'm doomed to rewatching stuff in the past that actually WAS good...do you know there were 15 seasons of Supernatural, and they are all of uniformly high quality? I didn't, not until I quit waiting for a decent Star Wars or GRR Martin's mysterious book "WINDS OF WINTER" (that's been unpublished for so long it seems like a myth at this point) . And now that I realize how much good stuff from the past I missed out on, I just concentrate on finding that instead.
i love watching hollywood as a whole fumble after fumble, i honestly hope it opens a market for more domesticated smaller budget movies tht actually have soul, not just token characters and situations
Tolkien* 😁
Hollywood screwing up is opening a niche for foreign studios like China or Korea to make their mark. I watch a lot of that these days.
@@paulnolan4971 I see what you did there lol
@@Bhoddisatva I dont want to replace Hollywood with CCP propaganda. I'd rather have small domestic studios take off in place of hollyweird, not look to the CCP. Every piece of media that comes out of china is approved by the CCP.
The issue with modern media is they are no longer making films for the public they are making films for "themselves" ...Games are slowly going that way as well.
At least indie games can still be made and get attention. Indie movies are basically never in theaters.
I'm playing 20 and 30 year old games because they are of higher basic quality than modern games.
I'm watching movies from the 80s and 90s, because the movies are better.
By better I mean things such as production quality, story cohesiveness, acting and the like.
Hell, completeness is a major part of the problem as well. With so many games being released incomplete or just messed up, and movies being released incomplete and missing key aspects of the story.
@@nobodyshome6792 True. I tend to watch movies from the 80s and 90s (some early 20s as well) As for games I still play AOE 2 and dungeon keeper...just dont make them like they used to. kinda sad right?
@@starburst98 Fair point, cinemas are losing money sticking on some indi films might make people go more
Games are not made for your enjoyment but to get as much of your money as possible.
Evil cannot create anything new, they can only corrupt and ruin what good forces have invented or made.
“When presenting a quote, it is only just to present the original credit” -Mr Beadle
To hate Rings of Power is NOT to hate Tolkien; it is to hate a bad TV show based on a world Tolkien crafted. It is to hate a bad TV show that takes massive liberties with Tolkien's stories, it's slow pacing, awful characterizations, identity politics,, but not to hate Tolkien. I still love Tolkien.
Same people who came up with the idea of 'white fragility' are saying they felt comforted and safe by having a therapist on set... these people wouldn't survive a day in the woods.
Exactly, projection. They are the fragile ones.
they constantly accuse others of what they're doing themselves. fragile ego and low iq are quite deadly mix.
I’m willing to bet that these actors did not, in fact, come up with the idea of white fragility. What are you on about?
@@Enoch610 Or moral bankruptcy.
Cant wait to hate season two
I’m not waiting - I hate it already! 😂
@@alexfriedman918 Pre-Hating is good game theory? That's the plan i$n't it?
I can't wait to not watch it
@@M-S_4321 Honestly, I have no interest in watching it - I’m not a critic, so I don’t have to! I will watch a few people’s videos about each episode, though - and I’m definitely looking forward to that!
@@M-S_4321 A GAAAAME THEORY
“Evil cannot create anything new, they can only corrupt and ruin what good forces have invented or made.” this quote seems to fit in perfectly
More garbage being spoken by a muppet.
Evil can't create?? How DUMB are you
@@jimibhoy8935 you just proved their point.
@@awesomeFrost Meaning? .... What? Explain your comment please if you are able.
“I knew someone was there seeing me completely.”
Well, that’s a relief, because not even a third of the people who started your show saw it completely.
What man even says something like that? He has the mind of a bytch.
I agree with your point, but your math is wrong. 33.3% or less would be the number you need and its 37% so you should say barely 1/3
The solution is "don't suck", but the people working on the project can't seem to accept that.
We still love the same things we loved, George.
The people making these shit shows aren't part of that.
Ya know like season 8?
I was so happy hearing literally everything you said... Facts are simply facts and hearing the sweet voice of reason and truth is wholeheartedly a breath of Fresh Air and that is actually sad!
He dosent understand why people have started hating what they once loved? So its nothing to do with the fact tht it has been butchered and changed beyond recognition. Usually with a crap tone of lore breaking also.
Reminds me of that meme "dont question anything just buy product, and then get excited for next product."
Celebrían should already be well over 1000 years old at this point. She was born about SA 300, whereas the Elven rings were made about SA 1590. Anyway, Celeborn isn't dead, he just left because Galadriel was so insufferable.
And at the point of Dingdongs of Dour, weren't Celebrain married to Elrond???
@@melrobertson2743 No, that was nearly 2000 years later in TA 109.
The elven rings shouldnt have been the first to ve created either.
"It was here that Elrond first saw Celebrian and loved her, though he said nothing of it" - Unfinished Tales.
This is shortly after the founding of Imladris, meaning Celebrian was very much a grown adult by this point, and she had been raised by her parents outside of Lindon, where Elrond had been living up until very recently.
There was never a moment in this series that it really captivated me. I watched the whole thing, there was nothing that drew you in and made you want to see the next episode. It was visually stunning, but had nothing to offer story wise.
Idk, I loved Adar, harfoot and stranger plotlines. Also Elendil. The rest not so much.
@@svrkl15stnbld17 the harfoots (not-nobbits) were the cringiest story line in this already cringe series lmao
@@cr9281 Everyone has different tastes I guess, the costumes and practical effects were awesome. Nori was cute, incredible actor. They didnt feel out of place and they were unique. At first I thought there. was no need for halflings in second age story but it grew on me immediately. And yes, some lines were a bit cringy but this is Rings of Power so... I will take what I can
@@svrkl15stnbld17 This whole comment proves you know nothing about the books / Tolkiens work. Nori cute and a good actress? They didnt feel out of place?? You liked the stranger (not-gandalf)? Lmao are you one of the cast?
The whole harfoot story line with the stranger was the cringiest story line of the series. And thats an accomplishment as the other story lines were cringe as well .
@@cr9281 Oh shut up, you are one of those "you have to like the same thing as me or you are wrong." I have read the main books multiple times, plus silmarillion, children of Hurin, Beren and Luthien. It doesnt exactly clarify how pre-hobbits were in the second age, so showrunners had freedom there. And I think they did a pretty good job. Stranger was interesting too, as an original character; until it became clear that they want him to be Gandalf, who arrives at ME in the third age.
Sauron, Celebrimbor, Eregion, Gil galad etc which are quite explored in the books. Lore is clear about that, the show deviated from it and somehow made the worst choices.
I understand you are a hater of the show and will try to hate everything about it, I didnt. I liked some aspects while being disappointed mostly.
For the issue of Elrond marrying Galadriel's daughter, it really isn't an issue when you consider that Galadriel is SIGNIFICANTLY older than Elrond. She was born in Valinor where the count of years is different than the Years of the Sun. This is one of the many continuity problems that RoP has with their condensed timeline
@@stephenlaing2152 isn't there "obvious child" and "normal elf"
The problem is they made the elves act like humans instead of making them the more regal, wise, and higher race that they are supposed to be. And they don't respect the actual timeline at all, so everything just doesn't work.
But regardless of all that, the writing and storyline is so empty and pointless and shallow that it wouldn't even work if it had nothing to do with Lord of the Rings. It isn't a good show. The characters mostly suck. The dialogue is horrible. It's just rubbish.
@@crosion5 They don't respect the source material at all, actually...
@@stephenlaing2152 No they definitely see the difference in age. With galadriel being the oldest and wisest named elf aside from Cirdan. Though she is probably seen as wiser.
@@imaloser5689 Yeah, Galadriel is an elf old enough to have seen the great trees of Valinor and basked in their light. NONE of the other elves in this part of the story can say that.
George Martin is right, imagine if you had something you deeply loved, even if it eventually got mistreated and completely ruined the experience, making people totally shun it when they were supposed to be fans! ... Oh wait...
Apparently, among a great many other things, GRRM has never heard of... divorce.
@@Nyet-Zdyes I pretend that the new additions don't exist. I take what I like and leave the franchise.
@@kimihirowatanuki3888 Sounds a lot like a (sort of ) divorce.😁
I think Martin's criticism goes both ways and, like most things, It's gone straight over "Disparu's" head.
When Martin says at the end, "if you don't like a show, don't watch it," I believe he's commenting directly on the kind of hyperbolic hysteria "Disparu's" expressing in this video.
I didn't like the last season of "Lost". It greatly disappointed me. I never took it personal. I never "shunned" the show. I took as: "well, the creators went a certain way that I personally didn't care for. None of these writers 'owe' me anything so I won't get mad about it."
Meanwhile, look how mad people get about "Rings of Power". The brutal truth is:
"Rings of Power" owes you nothing. Literally nothing.
Have to say, I did not like "Rings of Power", I think it's an astonishingly badly written show with 2 or 3 cast members who are so bad they nearly sink the entire ship on their own (namely Galadriel.) But these are creative issues. "Disparu's" issues are....a little more troubling.
Personally, I don't care that a Puerto Rican guy is playing an elf, which "Disparu" spends _a lot of time_ complaining about here. That's weird.
Is "Disparu" racist? Hard to say. I don't know enough about him. _He is_ culturally ignorant though, that's fairly self-evident.
@@mcnultyssobercompanion6372 "If you don't like a show, don't watch it" applies very easily when you're not a fan, it's much harder when you care for the core material. Of course, it's stupid in its own right: in order to know that you don't like the show, you need to watch it first.
But you've completely missed the point GRR Martin was making there. He's calling ANY criticism unjustified. What he's really saying is: if you don't like a show, shut up about it. GRR Martin doesn't like criticism, he likes money. The man takes every opportunity he gets to defecate on his own fanbase, who has the GALL of not being satisfied with the poor quality of the last two ASOIAF books and his unwillingness to finish the series at all. His actual reaction is to show them the middle finger (literally).
As for Disparu, calling him a racist says much more about yourself than about him. Anyone who's interested in Tolkien's works will take exception with anything that doesn't make any sense and is decided for reasons that have nothing to do with the universe. You don't care about the black elf or the nonsensically cosmopolitan Harfoot population because you're not interested in the lore, you don't care whether it makes sense or not. That's fine, but it doesn't give you the right to throw accusations of racism around.
"There's a lot of orcs running around, they gotta pay the orcs" is such an amazing line lmao.
"I must exist in this piece for you to be moral" sums their whole attitude up perfectly.
We do not hate the things we once loved. These are not those things. Simple as.
GRR inability to grasp what is happening just further convinces me that he used a ghost writer who died years ago
True
Would explain lack of new material
That beginning was brutal to sit through. 😢
I love how even her costar was fed up with her bullshit in the interview 😂😂
"Star Trek fans hate Star Trek; Star Wars fans hate Star Wars; Tolkien fans hate Rings of Power." I see what you did there 😉
Star Trek fans love Star Trek; they just don't care for NuTrek. SNW is alright, but ONLY because Anson Mount as Pike is fantastic.
@@Paulafan5 Yes, and Star Wars fans still love Star Wars. The Original Trilogy is still great and even the Prequels are interesting and mostly entertaining. But Disney.....
@@Paulafan5 Oh, more than that - Strange New Worlds is the closest the franchise has come to TOS for decades! I love it ! BTW I’m an original fan from when TOS aired - I wrote a letter to save it when I was in HS. I am loving Strange New Worlds & hope they don’t ruin it.
Who said it failed? Season 1 was a HUGE SUCCESS for Disparu!
Haha. Have me a good chuckle here have a like
"I don't hate what I once loved. I hate what idiots calling themselves writers, directors, and producers, have changed what I love beyond recognition."
That what donavandwelch said. Fits perfect.
New subscriber here. Having seen all these clips of the actors, writers and directors, I now know why all these franchises are crashing and burning. Unbelievable.
They have blamed and attacked fans/audiences for too long, it is long overdue that they be tazed, smashed and locked up in an insane-asylum with a straight jacket. They need a reality check last decade.
Sales of Tolkien increased by 1000% after LOTR.
Jackson's formula - honor Tolkien, follow the lore, and don't insert your own politics - clearly worked.
Amazon's formula - contradict the lore, insert modern identity politics as the DNA of the show, and delete all negative reviews - clearly failed.
'As an activist..' = not a fan and/or hasn't even read or watched any of the original material.😜
What Elrond said: " Destroy it".
George has a perfect example for him to understand it’s called the last season of game of thrones. Which he publicly burned the script for. I love game of thrones, up to season 7. Even that got to be a mixed bag. People still love the the old stories just not the new ones. Especially comparing he new to old. There is a saying in Texas: “ya dance with the girl who brought ya”, and thats what most people are choosing not the hideous new creatures being made today.
In my opinion, season 7 felt rushed (I didn't like the storyline of Littlefinger pitching Arya and Sansa against each other, for instance), but I loved season 8.
My only real complaint with season 8 is The Battle of Winterfell, which had several problematic beats (though several amazing ones as well.) Otherwise, I loved it. I worry it's turned into another "Star Wars"-prequel type situation where criticism has instead become a pigpile, and an entire generation will have to pass until season 8 is allowed to be judged on its own terms.
But who knows.
Disapru, as refreshing and appreciable as your film/show analyses are, I feel they miss one small detail. Granted, you're spot-on about the point of actors being narcissistic and self-centered. The missing detail is that entertainment personalities have always, for the most part, kept their narcissism concealed. The deliberate public display (and even showcasing) of this self-centered narcissism in Hollywood is a new trend. The change was semi-gradual in some cases and sudden in others, but what's certain is that this kind of shameless arrogance in entertainment was nowhere to be found 10-15 years ago, at least not in the ubiquitous way as it is now. "What changed and why?" is what I'm wondering.
As critical drinker has put it, it is because of social media
What changed? The iPad generation became part of their target audience demographic, that’s what changed.
It’s infiltrated everything. Look up the anime recruitment ad for the US army and tell me you didn’t sit back and say, “We’re fucked.” Because it was shockingly narcissistic which the opposite attitude needed in the military.
There was a couple of them but they where either blacklisted or told to shut up.
I think it may have something to do with the quality of agents/talent managers these days - they used to be able to wrangle their clients in the past...It's a bit like with newspaper editors - once those guys were cut of out the picture "news" became the review gallore of whatever John, Dick and Harry randomly shat out on their twatter
@@albel8607 so in your book self worth equals narcissism? lol, feel free to go back to not commenting, dude...
Honestly though, I can't wait to see where this is going. The most expensive disaster of all time ended with only 30% of viewers finishing it, so it's going to be insane to watch them START a new season with those numbers.
LOL Amazon have the money for it and they will go with it to say "It was a success and we are following up on it!" That's what these people do.
Season 2 was already bought and paid for before season 1 even aired, I believe. There is no way there will be a season 3. The show is dismally bad, even for people who aren't Tolkien fans. The show is bad by itself without even getting into canon issues.
If you're not interested in making something the fans love, then you can't be surprised when they don't love it George
The thing is, Disparu, therapy on set, or more specifically mental illness (in this case mental weakness) is not an excuse for poor performances. Michael O'Hare, who played Jeffrey Sinclair in the 1st season of B5 was having hallucinations on set because of genuine mental illness and still managed to put in a stella performance. ROPs problem is that it hired activist writers and spent so much money on the acquisition of the rights that it had nothing left in the pot for talented actors. When you pay peanuts you hire monkeys, and frankly you're average Chimpanzee tea party is more entertaining than anything being released by Amazon studios.
@Danica DeVries I don’t know about that argument. But genuine mental illness and being a toddler in an adult’s body (wanting the attention and status of being a public figure, but throwing temper tantrums whenever there is any criticism), are two very different things! If they are all actually mentally ill, they should go get help … quietly, like regular people do. But otherwise, just stop with the crocodile tears - no one’s buying it, and no one cares! And if they were severely mentally ill, but chose to continue anyway (which, at least in the case of the showrunners, would actually explain a lot), then still no one owes it to them to pretend that their crappy product is any good!
Great observation, that when you change the canon once, it has a cascading effect. ROP has the same problem liars have, once you tell one lie you'll need to tell bigger & bigger lies until the whole story ultimately falls apart.
Fair analogy.
My family and I are in that 37% that completed Rings of Power 😂 (Amazon is so happy). And honestly, I was critical of the show but my family didn’t care. It just became something we watched on Sunday’s after House of the Dragon.
For me, the departure from the source material was sad. And they tried to create moments for these “motivational” monologues that had no resonance at all. It just felt disjointed.
Meanwhile Peter Jackson was able to bring me completely to tears with the words “I’m no man” (followed by the iconic stab to the face)!
Not a surprise but the original movie trilogy had better female moments of power than all of rings the power 🤷🏼
Great video 👍
Play board games or ttrpgs or read aloud.
I finished it too. I can’t remember which episodes, but there were a few in the middle that I actually liked.
The biggest problem , other than departure from Tolkienian thought was the in show logic. Theo hides in the well and leaves at night… when Orcs can freely roam and not be injured by the sun…. After Doom explodes and Galadriel and a hand-full of others survive hot ash while horses are combusting…. Galadriel and theo NOT following the same path everyone else took to return to Numenor’s base camp… there were two ways out of the town and they went the opposite way‽‽
@@mikegillettify I remember thinking that as well when the ash was falling 😂
Hubby and I hate watched it lol. We knew we shouldn't but we got addicted to the anger and disbelief at what they had done to Tolkien.
I watched 5 episodes and gave up after the silly mithril origin story. I did come back for the last episode as part of a watch party to laugh at it so I don't know if I'm part of that 37% or not as I never watched 6&7.
Best video on this topic yet; Explains the situation concisely. Thank you sir.
People like George R.R Martin asking fans why they don't like their wokified franchises is like an abusive spouse asking you "Why don't you love me anymore?"
dramatic much?
😂👌 on point
@@sigzil1985 he might be out of line, but hes right
@@sigzil1985 he might be out of line, but hes right
I don not think you have understood his point... He is stating the situation without directly telling the reason, which is obvious, he is jus throwing the question, and I guess that after how GoT ended, he knows the topic of discussion xD
Wow, they even hired a therapist to remind the cast that they're victims, the cast that all had their dreams come true by getting cast in a major TV show, BTW.
The cast being treated like divas. That's why their ego inflated and became self centred. As a result they only think of "me, me, me and me"
"Your 'Boos' mean nothing! I've seen what makes you cheer." -Rick Sanchez
I stayed away from show spoilers for a very long time while RoP was in production. Then I braced myself, winced preemptively, and opened Google. Within about three minutes, I knew that I would loathe every single second of the show and would regret watching any of it. I was correct. It's so bad that it makes The Hobbit look good, and I could never have imagined that. I still can't imagine it. But Amazon has made a show that is "too big to fail". It has to succeed. They have to alter our reality in order to make the show a success. They will do anything to being this about because God himself couldn't sink this show. And they will be playing their fiddles all the way down.
It’s weird that needing a therapist at your disposal at any time is so acutely celebrated. Nobody’s perfect, and we all have room for self improvement, but like…shouldn’t the goal be to NOT need a therapist, to have the wherewithal to handle life with some independence? Idk man, people in show biz have to make a show of everything they do, whether it’s capitalizing on personal problems, or pantomiming some contrived display of progressive thinking.
To me, it almost sounds like they can dish out insults etc to the fans. But when it becomes apparent that what we the fans have said all along was true, they can’t handle it. 🤔🤷🏻♀️ But I could be entirely wrong.
It's a business. Straight up. There is no end goal. The goal is to continue in perpetuity
My father is one of the best people I’ve ever known. Besides being a wonderful father a and husband, ever since I was a child he’s been involved with multiple charities, doing all sorts of volunteer work to help many different types of people and families in our community. Not only does he not wish to be acknowledged for his efforts, he’s never once referred to himself as an activist or philanthropist like these vapid, attention thirsty idiots. Their activism probably consists of posting something online anyway.
Sorry , did I miss something ? did house of dragon have therapists on hand or did they not need them because they had writers who knew what they were doing ?