The Rise and Fall of Minoan Civilization
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 31 ก.ค. 2024
- The Minoan Civilization: Excellent Presentation
2000 - 1450 BCE - Our first European civilisation takes us to the island of Crete in the Mediterranean where we learn of bare breasted ladies, bull-leaping, huge palaces and the ferocious Minotaur in the labyrinth.
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Attribution for video footage throughout this presentation can be found below! Check out their channels for excellent travel footage!
Above the Crete, Greece | 4K Drone video
/ @viacheslav.brovko
GREECE CRETE (KRETA) Phaistos or Festos (hd-video)
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Ancient city of Phaistos (Crete)
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Crete 2019 | Itanos Ancient Ruins
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Santorini: Volcano History | Σαντορίνη: Ιστορία του Ηφαιστείου
/ @nikoskorakakis
A wonderful presentation with novelties that are important. It s an important update for Minoan Studies. No wonder the watching of the Channel already generated a lot of commentaries so far & will do so in the future! I m sending the link to many friends and I hope it will be viewed by Greek high school students to spread this important and well balanced collection of facts to the widest segment of viewers.
Our pleasure! And many, many thanks! I really appreciate your time and support!
Pleasant and interesting videos. A tidbit; All of the architectural spaces and structures at Knossos are false, created a century ago. The fact of this is casually not mentioned. Even deceiving the nice and bright creator of this video. Also, the Phaistos Disk HAS been solved. This is detailed at my channel.
Just came across this series. A real treasure. I'm hooked and will be taking them all up.
So grateful for your channel and the material you offer. 👍☺
Thankyou for taking the time to make this. I look forward to future similar presentations
What are your thoughts on this awesome episode by The History of the World Podcast? Check out the video description for links to his podcast! Check out our new store! teespring.com/stores/the-history-shop
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This guy is great.
@Herbal Shaman I don't think I've overlooked anything here. You have submitted part of one article demonstrating a point of view which is suggestive at best. There is clear evidence of a relationship with the Cyclades through archaeological evidence dating before the second millennium BCE, and there is archaeological evidence of a trade link with the Greek mainland and beyond as discovered by artefacts of material not native to Crete. To suggest that European mainlanders had no contact with Cretans appears to fly in the face of archaeological evidence and simple Bronze Age society logic. How influential or integrated these societies were with one another is a different subject for debate and I can quite accept that a significant wave of migration did occur in the early second millennium BCE as you have stated, however we cannot assume that this wave was based on the Greek mainland, or whether the Greek mainland was actually itself the subject of a mass migration from elsewhere in Europe. I also avoid talking about skin colour because we simply don't have much of an agreeable map and it only serves to confuse matters. As for the frescoes, I think that we can assume that Sir Arthur Evans with all his expertise may have aided a good restoration of them and I haven't discussed skin colour during the podcast in relation to the Ladies in Blue as I believe that it brings nothing of value to the argument until we can agree on the skin colours of societies of the wider world. There are many theories about the migrations into Crete and when they happened and who were the migrants. I do not know the truth and I'm not going to pretend that I do.
why support you when you are just stealing and uploading someone elses podcast and hard work?
jerbear- mane I don’t steal anything. I work with some awesome history podcasts like The History of the World above, and I provide a visual experience to go with their awesome audio recordings. It’s a win/win for everyone and I love it!
sure, but do they know you 'work' with them?@@studyofantiquityandthemidd4449
Knossos is a archaeological " Disneyland ". For example the fresco in a "throne room" is the imagination of Mr. Evans and the painter he employed.
Considering the way that Schliemann did archeology, Arthur Evans practiced cutting edge responsible archeology.
@@andywomack3414 Unfortunately true, if they both acted under the convention of modern archeology, we would have much more knowledge today.
Thanks for the historical podcast on Crete. We Enjoyed it. Comfortable pace of narration and interesting videos and images.
th-cam.com/video/IVC_8ZrvSMo/w-d-xo.html&ab_channel=Argonaut
EXCELLENT JOB! Keep up the great work & I'm really looking forward to your Trojan War episode :)
100k+ years ago coast lines looked very different from what they do today. The distance from the continental coast to Crete would have been much shorter than it is currently
Spot on, there's much proof to what you say, there's evidence of a road that linked Malta to the mainland underwater, not deep in some places..
Thanks for another great video. I love watching your channel, but there is one odd thing about the fall/decline of the Minoan: how can historians, and archaeologists say, that their fleet was just no more? As we know from modern times, tsunami, like the one after Thera's eruption can destroy ships only in harbours and in only very specific areas, not everywhere around the aegean. So either the destruction of fleet by a single eruption/tsunami is just bullshit, or the fleet must have been gathered somewhere in one location and be destroyed there. If we allow the possibility of a single destruction and since we know that Thera was evacuated and settlers came back to rebuild after the initial minor eruptions, I would suggest to look around the island for shipwrecks (if we have a technology to do that).
Thank you for this. I watched partially two other lectures on Minoan culture before this and turned them off. They were not clear. You speak very well and explain things very well and I am finding this very informative. Thank you
th-cam.com/video/IVC_8ZrvSMo/w-d-xo.html&ab_channel=Argonaut
Really enjoying this series only wish that all of Chris's series was done like these. :)
The second writing system Linear B was the result of the Myceanean take over.
Linear A . th-cam.com/video/PiLyN9T2stY/w-d-xo.html
History of the World Podcast is one of the best. Loved the sledgehammer flute in this episode.
Thankyou very interesting and thorough and serious.
Very glad that this piece of history is available. Thank you!
Interesting stuff. I am waiting for more
Unlike Pompeii, very few bodies or treasure have been found from the Thera eruption, so it's possible the island was largely evacuated prior.
Indeed, scholars seem to generally agree that many of the island's inhabitants probably fled the island prior to the major eruption. But also, and unlike Pompei, a significant part of the island literally sank into the sea from the eruption (or perhaps from successive eruptions.) Excavations over the last several decades at Akrotiri, the major archaeological site on the island, have found quite a few artifacts.
@@galanis38 Not sure that "sank into the sea" is right lol. A large part of the original island is missing, blown up in the intense eruption.
Very exiting! Thank you!🙏
Thank you for this wonderful and informative video 😊
really enjoy the podcasts
Excellent series!
Great topic! Thank you indeed.
I want to thank you, for your work on this channel. After 9 months of watching it before bed, you came to inspire me that good stuff still exist on youtube, nevermind one true student of history, sharing what he think is true truth.
Hats down, mate. Your channel is simply excellent history.
I've read a lot about the Minoans and been to Crete and I agree that trade with Egypt was very important and they were more trade orientated than one united kingdom. I does seem that they eventually all went their own way, some to Egypt, some to Cyprus and some to the Greek mainland, mainly for economic and security reasons and eventually integrated in to those cultures with their own culture simply fading away.
Minos was only a few (maybe 4-6) generations before the Troian war...
Minos had nothing to do with pre-Mycenaean Cretian civilization, and especially not the pre-eruption Cretian civilization, and we really shouldn't be calling them that! (Another of Arthur Evans' mistakes)
Minos was in the latter part of a wave of 'Norman-style' 'conquerors' washing westward from Anatolia in the 14th century, after the decline of the Cretians became more evident, and also, arguably, you can see they would view the Agean as a significant barrier to Hittite hegemony.
Fairly small numbers of ambitious people were able to travel west, and maneuver their way into positions of influence, and power, resulting in changes of leadership, and culture, although, this was not the most durable change, as, it would appear, that, when things 'got tough', the general populations were what remained, sometimes a mixture of older population mixed with numbers of slaves that had been imported imported from Asia Minor, or relatively consistent populations...and, of course, some people emigrated, without the best of plans.
Clearly, there were people who remained, and there were some places with new leaders, some effective, some not (as today), and other places like Crete, where highly organized society regressed back into family/clan groups living in rocky highland refuges, as they herded goats and sheep up/down every day, and worked smaller plats of land...sadly, this likely kept them much too busy and/or incapable of continuing with a nascent writing system, as we really haven't found anything, and call it the dark age...
I Love Learning About Ancient History ❤❤❤
Great Segment❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤
Timely. This has been on my mind lately.
Congratulations !! This was a thoughtful and balanced presentation - impressive and very interesting. Although I still don’t like self-promotion by titling “excellent”
The video was made by a man called Chris Hasler (historyoftheworldpodcast.com/about-me/).
This TH-cam channel is operated by a man called Nick Barksdale.
I think the attribution is a little too understated and it is easy for people to think Nick made the video.
Thank you!
Excellent presentation with a quality and clarity much needed in a debated history that needs attention on details rather than continuing and provoking debate and argument. "We simply CANNOT know everything about ourselves: 'The Human Race'. Drop the colors and see the person." jerryVG2
Tremendously kind. Thank you.
Very ancient humans, such as neanderthals and their relatives could get to crete much easier due to lower sea levels during the height of the ice age, which explains the hand axes
The Mediterranean actually dried up at some point too
If you can shape stone, you can shape wood and make a canoe.
lower sea levels would also explain how the mentioned hippos and elephants made it to the island.
Omg looking at how that art has survived over 3000 years is freaking crazy. I almost thought they just went over it after discovering it. Like that’s amazing.
Most, if not all, are reconstructions. They date to the period that Evans owned the site. Both Émile Gilliérons and others had hands in what were sometimes questionable work.
,more than 3000 years...
Interesting that the eruption of the volcano coincides with the Younger Dryas theory of cataclysm that impacted the world.
Fascinating 🖖🏼
It’s an incredibly clear picture... another adda boy nick. Great pic
Very well presented, produced. So refreshing in light of the utterly embarrassing Pseudo...not even, Archeology, that has permeates the web, cable, airways. Thanks!
Wow, that first sentence concerning 5000, 7000 years and ancestors was like way deep dude!
Lol....
Herbal Shampoo
Great! Very interesting.
Thank you for this very interesting video.
I was there a few months ago. I am very impressed, especially the Heraklion Museum. There is a huge exhibition with thousands of artifacts, also from the Palace of Minos. I was there too. I saw the ruins and there I learned the most disappointing information. The reconstruction is not based on the original plans for the Palace, but on what Arthur Evans, who began excavations in the 19th century, thought. The palace was completely destroyed by the earthquake and nothing remained but piles of stones covered with earth. If the Palace looked like a wooden model in a museum, it was a truly magnificent building. The same can be said about the frescoes, the restored ones look better than the originals, which were less refined.
Thank you for the video. Much better than the heavily opinionated and subjectively dramatized videos about this subject that I have seen before.
My personal favorite ancient civilization ❤
Loved it
Lovely deep dive!
Has anyone ever told you your accent sounds like Eliza's from My Fair Lady?
A pleasant documentary. My friend you forgot to mention that back then the ocean was full of delicacies and totally unpolluted. The best seafood in the world would jump into your boat. The agricultural land would likely be used for spices and booze (beer and wine) and beef. They would feast from the sea. 16.49. I might add, what is occurring in the 'bull leaping fresco' is not leaping. The figure on the right is the master of ceremonies, the guy on the left is keeping the animal perfectly still. The person on the bull is not leaping but doing the gymnastic move where they lay on their chest and point their feet directly upward. We must view these ancient athletes totally differently than the abominations committed using bulls in the modern day. Your series is great.
Remember Crete from early primary school in India where we had a chapter from Jawaharlal Nehru's "Letters from a father to his daughter" . .. "Early Civilizations began in Mesopotamia and Egypt and the little island of Crete in the Mediterranean Sea"! Crete is the cradle of the beginning of civilization in Europe!
No that would be the shores of the black sea.
Check out how old the Vinca, Varna, and Cucuteni-Trypilia cultures are.
Thanks!
Well done
aMAZING VIDEO
What about graves of the Minions where there any?
Perfect I'm studying Minion's, amazing love your work.
Kevin, Stuart, and Bob
@Herbal Shaman
I love how there is always one "black, afro-centrist!"
Get over that crap. Stop trying to be a modern WEBD.
@Herbal Shaman
Sure buddy. Keep pushing your agenda.
@Herbal Shaman
I don't care what race these people were. I see this crap from black, white, Asian, Indian centric people on youtube all the time. This is the same stuff that has been pushed forever. Who cares. WEBD has tons of material on this.
@Herbal Shaman
If you were being euro or asiacentric I would say it's nonsense too. Who cares what race they were. It is an immutable characteristic.
I have never once asked myself what skin pigment an homo erectus had while reading about them. It doesn't matter.
King Minos and the Minotaur sounds kinda similar to King Gilgamesh and the Bull of Heaven
@Herbal Shaman - Overly simplistic: they were probably part of what I call the Pelasgo-Tyrsenian complex, which surely arrived to the Anatolian-Balcanic region c. 5000 BCE, conquering the previous Vasconic or main Europan Neolithic layer that preceded them. This Pelasgo-Tyrsenian group was originally represented in Syria by Halafian culture, in Anatolia by Can Hassan and in the Balcans by Dimini-Vinca, as best known cultures, later, in the late Bronze Age crisis, some of them migrated to Italy, where they formed the Etruscan nation (and to Palestine where they formed the Philistean nation as well). The pertaining of Minoans, or Trojans or other obscure ancient populations to this macro-ethnicity is of course not absolutely certain, some obscure complexity we cannot hope to understand may be involved, but it's the most plausible or simplest scenario.
I don't think Afroasiatics expanded across the sea ever before the Phoenicians. The Semites in particular were at first almost certainly just one among many Neolithic West Asian nations and only seem to have expanded from the Circum-Arabian Pastoralist Complex since around 4000 BCE but only in the Fertile Crescent and Peninsular Arabian region (and from there into Eritrea-Ethiopia later on).
Talking about "pale" or "dark" skinned people is making assumptions we don't know enough about. As my grandpa said: "there are no races but ethnicities", i.e. people relate to each other by shared language and culture not by skin color.
@@LuisAldamiz Absolutly not, this Minoans were North Afrikan or East Afrikan people who colonized the greek lslands. Their cuIture, tradition and arcitecture is exaclty similar to those Afrikan people, it is literaIly the same even to this day. It's also not surprising since most modern day greek carry the highest concentration of E haplogroup among europeans.
no talkingheads visible! Bravo!
It says excellent so what else I need to know?
Dear sir, it is difficult to thank you enough. To see so many channels without content or quality, dealing from futility to hatred, with millions of subscribers, becomes more absurd and shameful. Let’s spread this channel.
I truly appreciate your support!
Great podcast! Comparing Pompeii's volcanic casualties w Thera's it's quite interesting to note that 0 casualties found from Theras eruption. Be it cyclopean monolithic structures or preparedness for disaster seems the more ancient Humanity, the better prepared and more skilled they were
The bull almost assuredly represents the constellation of Taurus.Taurus was (and remains) important because of the Taurid meteor showers, and possibly other reasons as well. Meteor showers are dangerous and have been the cause of multiple disasters down through the ages. Practically all peoples thought of meteors and comets as bad omens because of the potential for disaster should one penetrate deep into earth's atmosphere. Halloween is the holiday at the peak of the danger, and not coincidentally is dedicated to the dead and giving the devil his due. Similarly, bull baiting, bull fighting, and bull leaping are all expressions of the idea of looking danger in the face with the intent of staring it into submission by demonstrating unflinching courage.
СПАСИБО!!!
th-cam.com/video/PiLyN9T2stY/w-d-xo.html
love your east end accent
What if during the last iceage when the sarhara was a grassland it had lots of cereal grains. Now fast forward and climate change hits and the former breadbasket starts desertification so this pressures humans to try and save thier food sources and collect thier seeds to be planted elsewhere thus by accident starting the Neolithic age
5:00 I always wanted a house Hippo...
(Look at up)
The only issue is that the actual dwarf hippos are nowhere near as small or adorable as the house hippo.
Also, Zefrank should totally do his magic on the house hippo :P
I had heard that the Minoan Crete civilization was in fact matriarchal rather than equalitarian....Any thoughts on this?
4 science and technology development of minoan civilization?
I am grateful for growing up there.
Airforce base there.
Now I'm wondering if Santorini is a hotspot like Hawaii and Yellowstone, or the surfacing of magma from the other side of a subduction zone?
I asked Professor Internet, and the answer is that it's subduction not a hotspot.
I caught a video from a german or dutch academic who deciphered linear a. It's in my liked videos on my page somewhere. Have a look see
th-cam.com/video/PiLyN9T2stY/w-d-xo.html
It was an Afro-Asiatic language.
Strange that Evans could make a picture of so few piieces
What is your take about te Minoans being warlike.... I mean actually waging organized, intended war?
Which is larger? crete or cuba
Cuba of course. Crete is probably smaller than Puerto Rico. Let me check...
Yeah, slightly smaller by area than Puerto Rico.
Why do you make a connection between the bull of the Minoans and Greek Mythology when the Minoans existed long before greek mythology ?
You're only supposed to blow the bloody doors off!!
Wouldn't the ubiquity of the bull be explained by the Astrological age of Taurus which coincides?
Paleolithic from North Africa without sails is certainly a hypothesis.
Not sure why that's the logic rather than a migration through the Aegean from Anatolia and mainland Greece, but sure.
Absolute gold… not bronze! I have it on great authority that Micky Flanagan did not narrate this video.. I have pushed this beyond the realms of credibility..so I relied on archeological evidence…I dug and found Festos…..
So a site at its peak was 2.5ha with 1300 rooms has an estimated population of 'tens of thousands'. Mmmmmm
Whenever I hear, "history of the world" I automatically hear Mel Brooks say, "See, Hitler on ice."
It's good to be dah king.
"Put it in the car"
"Genomic history of the Aegean palatial civilizations"
"Despite their distinct cultures, the EBA Helladic, Cycladic, and Minoan genomes resemble one another in all analyses."
"In summary, these genomes from the Cycladic, Minoan, and Helladic (Mycenaean) BA civilizations suggest that these culturally different populations were genetically homogeneous across the Aegean and western Anatolia at the beginning of the BA."
sciencedirect/science/article/pii/S0092867421003706
Island dwarfism should be discussed. It can be just a small species. Or did they find a lot, every century smaller? No, it is like in Malta one or a few, is it?
At 13:40 why are the lazy tourists sitting on the ruins? Great video.
They are uncultured swine, we all know it. Haha! JK. Thanks for the compliment!
Lets not sound too uppity over There. Besides, i hope they dont mess up some of those 5000 year old rocks. I wonder why they call them ruins?
Первые жители Крита,были дравидийского происхождения!♥️🌹👑
You don need a boat...people already on the land since the begining...
Is there evidence the locals were ethnically related to any of the neighbors such as Egypt, Near East, Anatolia or Europe?
Having palaces burned was probably the sign of a civil war or rival "kingdoms" trying to destroy each other. The Mycenaeans were simply taking advantage of the chaos to takeover the island. The locals may have been forced to adopt the new culture but they may even welcome the new rulers who brought an end to the fighting and allowed them to resume their lives peacefully.
Translating the language? So far nobody made any breakthroughs unless a Rosetta Stone with 2 or more languages on the same text is found for comparison. Can we assume the language is Indo-European like the Hittite?
The latest research discounts the volcanic explosion of Thera as the chief event ending Minoan civilization....it seems now academics believe Mycenaen type invaders from mainland Greece invaded and overthrew the Cretans who had dominated them for centuries....so answer me ...isn't this like doing a book review based on 1 page of the book?
If being human is to be religious, I must be an alien. No religious idea has stuck with me, ever.
atheism is a religion so youre no exception
@@milossimic5946, I've watched videos by that world-famous atheist guy, but I can agree to none of his rantings. Live and let other people have their religious ideas is my idea. God(s) is(are) something that may exist or may not, I just don't know. Peace to you all.
so you dont believe in the big bang theory, yet you have a literal alien on your avatar ..
@@milossimic5946, of course I don't *believe* in a scientific theory. As it is a theory, it will be proven correct or wrong. As of now, it's a theory. It's not anything to believe in, beliefs are religious stuff.
And the "alien" face is cute.
Someone Else How are you about climate change? If you believe the hoax, you are a religionist. You have a mythology, a priesthood, an apocalypse, a heaven and hell (on earth), a sin and guilt theology, and an inert god that demands sacrifice (CO2).
The idea that the Minoan civilisation was terminated by the eruption of the volcano on the island of Thera(Santorini) has now been challenged.
I think there is a general acceptance that Minoan society continued, but that it was subjugated to some degree by the Mycenaeans. We do not really have any strict evidence of the impact of Thera on the Minoans. Thera was considerable and would have surely had some consequences on nearby societies, but quite what impact it had on the Minoans is a subject for debate.
People fishing from a raft, blown off course, perhaps
You sounded like an Irish-Scott’s with an Australian accent
I might agree if I'd ever met such a person!
He’s clearly from Surrey
I noticed that you never suggested that the bare breasted women may have been temple prostitutes.
Well, wait a minut. What the heck were these animals (pygmy hippos, pygmy elephants) doing on Crete (and Cyprus) at all? Their presence suggests, to me, that whatever brought them to Crete also brought the humans. So the question is whether or not there was, at one time, a land bridge or its equivalent to this Island. I think the sea levels of the Mediterranean need to be determined for times going back at least a couple of hundred thousand years. Perhaps that could reveal whether or not animals (and humans) could have walked there.
Regarding the dwarf animals. I think that the argument that dwarfism was caused by competition for resouces is problematic. The smaller an animal, the greater its surface area to body mass ratio. In other words, a pygmy animal can burn more energy (relative to a non pygmy version of it) requiring it to consume more food. Human babies suffer from this problem. They give off a tremendous amount of heat compared to their adult counterparts. That is why we cover babies in heavy clothing and/or heavy blankets even when the ambient temperature is warm.
In any case, I feel I must ask: "Were the animals present because of human habitation on the island or in spite of it? Either way, it doesn't rule out humans being responsible for the extinction of the Neolithic Cretan fauna.
By the way, you seem to have missed the possible link between the Cretan double headed axe (Labyrs) and the word Labyrinth. The double headed axe appears in Linear B script. Arthur Evans and other archaeologists of his day believed that Labyr ==> Labyrinth may have meant something like 'house of the double axe."
Regarding Crete being influenced by immigrating Egyptians: I don't think so. At the very least we should find Egyptian hieroglyphs, pottery and even temples. So far we haven't. I suspect that trade with Egypt may have affected the Cretans to some extent but that influence was very limited.
Anyway, really good video. Thanks for creating it.
I think we have to be careful to remember that the pygmy species likely evolved on the islands whereas the humans did not.
@Herbal Shaman I'm not quite sure what point you are trying to make. I already pointed out that they weren't indigenous by asking what they were doing on Crete in the first place. My point about the land bridge is if it DIDN'T exist then these animals were most likely brought there. Hippos can swim as can elephants but it is unlikely they would have been able to swim from North Africa on their own. [There would have to be enough of them swimming to Crete to provide a viable breeding population. Not a likely scenario in my estimation.] If these animals couldn't walk there and couldn't swim there the only solution is they were brought there (ferried there). That would be quite a feat for humans 120,000 year ago.
@Herbal Shaman Nope. There are 'double headed axes' from Pre-Columbian Mesoamerica but they are by no means a labrys. They are, at best, similar to a modern day lumberjack's double-headed axe. Labyrs have a specific design form and the MesoAmerican axes do not conform to it. I couldn't even find an example of a West African double-headed axe, let alone a labyrs, on the Internet. Did you read my comment on the word Labyr. That was an ancient word [possibly from western Asia] that may have been applied to the axe used by the Minoans. From Labyrs may have come the world Labyrinth which the ancient Greeks used to describe the home of the Minotaur. In all likelihood the maze that housed the Minotaur was just a Greek remembrance of the huge palace of Knossos with its 1300 rooms.
Eumelanate? You sound like one of the Afrocentric crackpots. I thought Mary Lefkowitz, in her book "Not Out of Africa" had put an end to this pseudo-academic nonsense. Apparently not. By the way, Michael Ventris, an architect and classicist deciphered the Linear B script in the early 1950s. It turned out to be a very archaic version of Greek NOT something that came from Africa as you may be suggesting. The Middle East could not have been a source for the population of the Minoans as Greek was not spoken in this region during the early bronze age. Some parts of Asia Minor could have been. The western coast of Asia minor (south of the Troad) which included Aeolia, Ionia, and Doria were Greek speaking in the Bronze Age. Whether anyone from this area settled in Crete is unknown.
One other thing, Arthur Evans made similar claims to yours about neolithic settlers arriving by boat. I can't remember from which side of the Mediterranean Sea they came. I do remember he was unequivocal that Linear B could not be Greek (based on the neolithic backstory) He turned out to be dead wrong on this assertion. If the Linear A script ever gets deciphered we may lean more about the early origins of Crete. You may be proved right if that text turns out to be based on an African language. That would give strong evidence that the Greeks came later supplanting the original inhabitants. Right now, as far as I can determine, there is no strong evidence for this to be the case.
@Herbal Shaman Hi Herbal Shaman. I'm still a bit unclear what your point is. Zeus with a Labyrs would be no surprise. He is a Greek God and the father of Minos as this documentary already brought out. I did a bit of research on Shango and the Yoruban people. I did find examples of double-headed axes that are definitely examples of a Labyrs. Problem is, ALL of them are dated to the 19th century and I am referring to museum pieces. Not one of the museums appears to have an example prior to that period. There are other examples of Labyrs but they are 21st century arts and crafts items available for purchase over the Internet. So far, I haven't found any description of a Yoruban double-headed axe that references a time prior to the 19th century. More importantly, it looks like the origins of Shango are fairly recent, historically speaking. For instance, one online reference says the following about him:
Shango was the fourth king of the ancient Oyo Empire, the West African center of culture and politics for the Yoruba people. The Oyo Empire thrived from the fifteenth century until 1835." ( www.windows2universe.org/mythology/shango_storm.html ).
You should note that the stone carving of Shango at the link above does NOT depict him with a Labyrs which likely suggests that implement may be a later addition to his legend.
So, I have to ask: can you provide me with a link to anything that shows a Yoruban 'Labyrs' from 2000 BCE? You would have to go back at least that far if your position is that the Labrys came to Crete through Africa. I have spent a fair amount of time doing research (worthwhile) on this topic; but, I have yet to come up with anything that would be pertinent to the Labyrs ==> Labryrinth issue.
I think you are right concerning the female link to the Labyrs. If I recall this properly, Sir Arthur Evans concluded that the religion of Crete may have been centred around a female godess. I think he also associated the Labrys with this cult. In other words, the Labrys was a religious implement not a weapon of war. By the way, the female connection to the story of Crete was discussed fairly well by this video including the Snake Godess.
It's strange when speaking about Minoans you don't say the word Greek, according to Illiad cretans and king Minos was asked to send army in the side of Agamemnon and he only sent a small amount of army. Especially we know about Minoan archers. Does that mean that they were not Greeks? If so, why Agamemnon didn't go to Egypt or some other Middle East civilization?
How do you know this and mostly everyone else indicates that the Minoans were indeed Greek
If their language isn't Indo-European or even semitic or ancient egyptian - why haven't linguists tried other AfroAsiatic languages such as those found in north africa and horn of africa? Haplogroup T is dominant among Somalis and exists around the globe at lower levels including this island - wouldn't be surprised if it's deciphered using a Cushitic language
I just want a herd of cow sized elephants
Why have super computers not been able to translate Cretan alphabet?
King Minos is only two generations before Menalaus and Agamemnon; Minos is not of the classic 'Minoan' culture; Mycenaean influence through a wave of immigration of ruling, or leadership figures had already occurred.
You make an assumption that ppl needed boats to get to Crete 130k yrs ago. Maybe they walked there.
@Herbal Shaman , because people dont simply step on a boat and risk their lives without seeing Land on the horizon. Its a silly theory.
What
Minoans did not come from North Africa they came from Anatolia (Modern Turkey).
phys.org/news/2017-08-civilizations-greece-revealing-stories-science.html
Neolithic peoples would have - probably due to proximity. There were two waves of migrations - the second bringing agriculture.
I am not totally convinced that the Minoans were one wave of people from one particular origin.
@@historyoftheworldpodcast5234 No possible way they stayed the same ethnicity if they had interstate trade established - they were trading wives and possibly slaves and captured enemies the same way they were trading any other good.
And agriculture didn't just happen to evolve separate from the rest of the world. A traveler or settler taught them.
Null valley!
Australian aboriginals and other hunter gatherers,had and still have bark and dug out canoes. On a fairly peaceful sea like the Aegean, it's quite likely people had superior vessels and ventured on offshore voyages. Rafts, no,lol. What an understatement of human ingenuity. An insult really.
Homework would help before putting these things on line. 2015 DNA of 5000 year old Minion skeletons showed they were of Western European decent. Why would you think they have anything to do with Egypt?
If you read that very study it includes an acknowledgement of cultural exchange between the Minoans and the Egyptians.
TRADE
I understand your point, but the question to me was why did I think that Minoans had anything to do with Egypt. Archaeological artefacts and the texts of the stated study of 2015 are the reason why I think so. I find it difficult to believe that such advanced society emerged completely independently by indigenous peoples of Crete, and that there had to be Cycladic and Egyptian influence. I'm not saying I'm right, but that seems logical to me based on the geography, archaeology and technology of all said cultures. What are your thoughts?
@Etruscans civilization My only issue with that is the presence of differing skin colours among the figures depicted in Minoan frescoes suggests to me an amalgamation of cultures, which would make more sense considering the closeness of Minoan trade links with Europe. I can't believe that Europeans had no close association with ancient Cretans at all as you have suggested. There are too many cultural links, and the Cycladic peoples seem far to active to have bypassed Crete altogether in the centuries preceding Minoan peak. I'd be more inclined to consider a fusion of cultures.
Действительно,сколько,не смотришь_не находишь никаких аналогов ни в одной известной культуре!Вроде бы,мелькнет иногда что-то похожее на "индийское",или"шумерское"!И,ни каких геометрически острых углов_одни волнистые,плавные линии в декоре и,изделиях!Что-то,"цыганское"есть во всем этом!Это,да!🌺🌻🌼🌷💐💮🌹